This bothers me in the same way having "fake" singers falsely representing the artists on their records bothers me. There's a dishonesty that Motown seems fine with. I don't mean artists have to be in love to sing duets , but for crying out loud , if they can't even stand to be in the studio together why try to pass them off in this manner? What if this had really taken off ...[[ENDLESS LOVE status) and two more albums followed...it might have totally rerouted the projectory of both artists . What if Marvin and Diana had to then spend the rest of their careers sharing the stage together !! Oh the irony, as they make goo goo eyes at each other on stage then go to separate dressing rooms on opposite ends of the stage immediately after! lol! Would've served them right ! This dishonest hoax deserved to fail!
Diana and Marvin were not enemies.
hee hee good answer...for some reason I get a kick out of that imagery . BTW I like that you like the album. I'm not as invested as you , and believe me I am very defensive of my most beloved music, and happily nothing anyone can say can deter that.
If you thought that comparison was elephants and prunes , I also hear some of this in it [[ especially from Marvin):
which I'm glad I looked up because I've never seen it performed before.
Confessions : I actually bought this 45 as a teenager. Yes I was a tender soul!!
and could the intro to PLEDGE also almost go into ........I WILL SURVIVE .....
.Diana to her credit refused to be in the same recording booth as Marvin as she happened to be heavily pregnant and he insisted on smoking something a wee bit stronger then your average cigee.
Other then that I have never heard of the two not getting on
that issue could have been resolved so much easier than, " I'll never set foot in the studio with him again!!" Good grief what a pain that made this project. As soon as it became that , they should've said "this ain't gonna work." Why force it?? Contrived. Not saying they were enenies , but obviously not chums either.
Berry Gordy should've called Marvin and said ."Hey Marv smoke your reefer out in the car and then go into the studio ." Problem solved . IF that was all there was to it.
Last edited by Boogiedown; 02-21-2021 at 01:36 PM.
Funnily enough i have always thought of you as a tender soul boogie. As for this song ......erm......yea.
Can’t quite hear it myself, but that’s not to say the similarity isn’t there. You believe it my love and sometimes that’s the most important thing.
They were seen together to often, for some to say they weren’t friends. They were indeed friends. Sometimes friends can’t work together, just like sometimes family can’t work together.
Let’s keep it real. It’s not that they couldn’t work together. Marvin by his own admission said he acted like an asshole. His own insecurities led to problems in the studio. His immature behavior resulted in Diana requesting separate studio time. What kind of man does drugs/smokes around a pregnant woman? That is reprehensible. Outside of this working issue they had, they still remained friends. Lastly, I don’t get the big deal about them recording separately. So many songs are recorded this way. Yet this is always brought up like it’s something rare.
Khansperac, it was you who said they couldn't work together, and now you're explaining why they couldn't work together while at the same time saying its not that they couldn't work together. ???
Is there a list of songs recorded this way ?? Much less entire albums?? I can only think of one, YOU DON'T BRING ME FLOWERS , which a dj combined the two recordings after the fact. Babs and Neil never tried to pass off a phony project as being between the two of them.
Be most interesting to hear of others.
I can name one and I am sure there are a lot more. No one hardly ever mentions Patti Labelle and Michael McDonald's duet “On my own” was recorded separately. I actually read they didn’t even know each other yet. But people like to make a fuss because it’s Diana Ross. Duets have been recorded separately in the industry many times. Just nobody says anything.
No chemistry?!? I guess people hear something else that I do. I think their voices work wonderfully together on most of the songs, particularly "You Are Everything," "Love Twins," and "Just Say, Just Say." As far as the recording separately is concerned, that was and still is the common practice in the industry. Most Marvin and Tammi duets were recorded separately; Patti LaBelle and Michael McDonald had never even met until after their song "On My Own" became a hit -- also the music video was shot separately. Diana & Marvin is far from a perfect album, but that has less to do to "lack of chemistry" or recording it separately, but of -- as some already stated -- the selection of songs. And I do wish they had recorded more original material together, either composed/produced by Ashford & Simpson, or by Marvin himself. But the love is there, at least to my ears.
I'll also go on record agreeing about the album. I love most of the songs and vocal performances by both superstars. My least favorite is ironically the one they recorded together in the studio. On my Diana Ross favorites playlist [[and on my Marvin Gaye favorites playlist) are Just Say Just Say, Love Twins, You Are Everything, I've Come To Love You So Much, My Mistake, Stop Look & Listen and Include Me In Your Life. I think the first three could possibly have been hits in the U.S., given a chance.
I didn't know that about Labelle and McDonald and I'm disapppointed.
Personally , I don't say anything "because it's Diana Ross" one way or another, but I suppose some do .
OK so there's what, two songs that were recorded apart.
Other's???
I just gave myself a chuckle, when they were singing "on my own " I didn't realize they meant literally !!lol! [[well at least they were admitting it !)
I'm finding this most odd ....the defending of recording duets apart !! Is it really as common as claimed ?
And in this case , its the reason Marv and Diana didn't record together that makes it less palatable [[imo). They pulled it off to a degree, but I'm wondering how much BETTER the results could have been if they were in the studio working off of each other. That's [[perhaps) the tragedy of it.
I'm not particularly interested in hearing love songs between two people who can't even connect enough to record together [[it don't make no sense).
Tammi and Marvin: Not sure why initially they recorded apart? , but later
isn't the Tammi situation another shameful example of deceit? Someone so sick , and yet releases are put out on behalf of her as if .....
Last edited by Boogiedown; 02-21-2021 at 04:58 PM.
AIN'T NO MOUNTAIN HIGH ENOUGH was originally a Tammi solo recording to which Marvin later added his vocals. Ditto for their recordings HOLD ME OH MY DARLING, TWO CAN HAVE A PARTY, GIVE IN, YOU JUST CAN'T WIN, WHEN LOVES COMES KNOCKING AT MY HEART, MEMORY CHEST, and others. Some of these were turned into duets when Tammi became ill. But others, like some on their first duet album, UNITED, were done before.
Some of the Supremes/Tempts duets were recorded separately.
Aretha and George Michael's I KNEW YOU WERE WAITING was done mostly sepately, George recorded his vocal on one day, Aretha did her the next, then they got together on the third day to finish it up.
Aretha and James Brown's GIMME YOUR LOVE was totally done separately. According to the producer, Narada Michael Walden, James was rather disappointed when he showed up at the studio and found Aretha not present.
Wow that is so loaded, Ollie. Couldn't we say the same thing about religion or heroin!! lol!!
I now know that Donna Summer didn't relish being the queen of disco and especially wanted to distance herself from the gay aspect. I still love listening to her music , although there's a bit of tarnish there. The music itself overcomes it. Music is such a powerful part of our lives .....
In answer to the original question. It's not just this album that should have charted better. Poor management and marketing - especially in the US - meant most Motown releases of the 70s underperformed. UK successes compared to US failures show what can happen when the releases are better managed and promoted.
Back then plenty of pregnant women would have done their own smoking, let alone inhaling any from others.
Diana herself only gave up smoking cigarettes in 1977 though she may have cut back/given up during her pregnancies.
Last edited by Levi Stubbs Tears; 02-21-2021 at 05:40 PM.
Indeed it is Boog. Unlike heroin, music being a much simpler, more innocent pleasure far less detrimental to ones health.
I’m glad you still enjoy Donna’s music, regardless of her personal politics. She did of course go on to deny such homophobic claims saying it was blown out of all proportion. Funnily enough I was listening to her just the other day.
Last edited by Ollie9; 02-21-2021 at 05:51 PM.
Oh dear . I really don't want to be so contrarian, Bluebrock . But here's what's in songfacts:
I see nothing said either way in wiki.Getting the singers together to record this song was a challenge. They ended up meeting at a recording studio in Reno, Nevada in the early morning of May 8, 1981 following Ross' concert in nearby Lake Tahoe [[Richie came in from Los Angeles). The session began around 3:30 a.m. Less than two hours later, they had their vocals on tape.
https://www.songfacts.com/facts/dian...e/endless-love
Let me choose another one: Dolly and Kenny's ISLANDS IN THE STREAM , they BETTER have sung that one together, I call that duet perfection... or I'm going to go out in the surf at high tide !! lol!!
Last edited by Boogiedown; 02-21-2021 at 05:56 PM.
I heard a different story. Diana Ross was doing an engagement at Caesars Tahoe in Lake Tahoe Nevada. After her show she was driven to Reno Nevada to meet Lionel Ritchie where they recorded the song past midnight early in the morning. My memory is a little foggy right now but I believe it was an interview by Lionel Ritchie. Don’t know if it’s true or not but that is what was said.
This is sort of the creme de la creme of this whole separate studios fiasco !!
"He's smoking that crap around my baby-to-be and I won't HAVE it!! , " Ross indignantly proclaims , stomping her feet, while puffing on a Parliament. Ha Ha .....tooo much.
ok I'll be quiet now
agreed. frankly it's almost like coworkers in totally separate departments in a company. sure you might have a few projects or meetings together but essentially 99% of your time and work is totally separate. there isn't necessarily ill-will but there's no need to assume that just because they knew each other, they were friends.
they just worked for the same company
"All of You", the beautiful duet with Diana Ross and Julio Iglesias ,was it recorded together in a studio? Or on different continents? Diana Ross' vocals are quite lovely in this song If this song were re-released, it would still sell. Could be the theme song of a romantic chick flick.
No offence taken Boogie! The reason why i am so sure the vocals for Endless Love were recorded in separate States is because i was told that very thing by Lionel Richie himself. I see no reason whatsoever why he would tell me that if it were not true. It was told to me in a private conversation in a relaxed environment rather than an official interview but he told it to me without any prompting. I didn't even ask him the question. Obviously Lionel was in the studio when Diana put down her vocals, but he cut his own vocals in another studio prior to this. Hope that makes sense?
As regards Island in the stream i have no idea as to how and where that was recorded so please put that surfing expedition at high tide on hold for the moment!
Last edited by Bluebrock; 02-22-2021 at 04:07 AM.
Recording separate vocal tracks isn't just a technique for duets. There must be many songs by groups where the backing track, including vocals, are finalised before the lead vocal is recorded.
Diana and Marvin works well for me, clearly for others on here too. The album's UK success was not to be sniffed at either so there are many who felt the same at the time of release too.
There clearly was affection between the two of them as you can see it in the body language in the Missing You video where Marvin joins Diana on stage. Those looks and closeness are not easily fabricated.
Marvin wanted to smoke the good sh!t in the studio while Diana was pregnant. And, the lp did just fine considering it's mid-level quality.
Production wise [[from aural point of view) the songs, while outstanding, do not immediately grab me. I think of a dimly lit room when I hear this selections as they lack any production sizzle to them. With that said, it's still a favorite go-to album that I listen to when I just want to sit back and relax. Diana's voice during this period was very rich and syrupy sounding, and I feel the back and forth singing with Marvin [[though in different recording sessions) was woven to make it believable that they could have actually been singing together.
Ha! Very good, and Bluebrock, if you find out anything, like Kenny Rogers was eating fried chicken and Dolly couldn't stand the smell so she refused to be in the same room with him ....please keep it to yourself!
It seems odd to me that Lionel would show up with a basically completed project and direct her to, "here, sing over this " , BUT what do I know, apparently that's perfectly acceptable protocol , and didn't phase Diana who had plenty of experience with the technique via the Gaye project. Maybe she even suggested it! "Just bring it up here , I'll sing on it after my show."
I can't imagine that either had any idea that when she was singing her parts at two in the morning, Diana was in the process of vocalizing Motown's biggest song ever. Probably a good thing ! "Let's get this dang movie song done, however we have to."
I love 'You are everything', mainly because of Diana's performance. her glossy sophistication and clear enunciation does not detract from her sincerity and ingenuity.It goes the same for 'All of you'.
Alongside her, Marvin Gay seems to be redoubling his efforts to exist.
ON MY OWN [[ not a big fan, same line over and over and over, but no hate ) is genius on behalf of Patti Labelle. Reading about it , she gets full credit....she felt the song lacked something , she felt a duet might make it work , she picked Michael McDonald.
Good move Patti!!
meanwhile, poor Dionne Warwick who first recorded it, it was written for her !!! But apparently so lackluster, they left it off her FRIENDS lp. "dam, I wish I'd thought of that!!"
would like to hear it, still in the vaults? Not on youtube.... Dionne still performed in person as if ....
Here is a video of Lionel discussing the recording of Endless Love.
https://abcnews.go.com/2020/video/li...dless-53058991
how about the irony of it....Burt Bacharach writes the song for her, Burt Bacharach!, but she interprets it so poorly it doesn't even make it onto to her new album. Deemed not usable. A Burt Bacharach composition ....written, for her! . She, Dionne Warwick can't deliver.
How traumatic for her that the same discarded song with a different twist is actually a #1 song waiting to happen....
I've heard Lionel Ritchie talk about Endless Love....He did it as a solo, thought it needed a female vocal part...flew to Vegas, where Diana Ross was performing and she sang her part after her show.
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