They were two powerhouses:
They were two powerhouses:
I like their harmony
The times the three of them harmonize together, you knew they were made for each other.
They're the founding mothers of the Supremes. Period. Anyone that came after them had big shoes to fill and they couldn't fill them, sorry.
Etta James, who knew all three Supremes said that she could not understand why they were "singing like that" , like here in this video. She knew they all had great, powerful voices and thought that they should have been doing more Soulful material, but that is not what Motown wanted out of them.
The first time I heard The Supremes really harmonize was when I hear the singing some of those standards. I was blown away to say the least. Listening to a great deal of their hit recordings, you'd NEVER know these ladies could do some serious damage vocally. Especially with the "There's A Place For Us" CD, there are tunes where Flo, Mary and Diana are just tearing the house down with their strong vocal blend. Then I'd hear "My World Is Empty Without You" and it was almost like 2 different groups.
Listen to this:
and this one.......
This is why I would put the Original Supremes up against ANY female singing group and they would still come out on top in my opinion. All three of them were great singers:
"Especially with the "There's A Place For Us" CD, there are tunes where Flo, Mary and Diana are just tearing the house down with their strong vocal blend. Then I'd hear "My World Is Empty Without You" and it was almost like 2 different groups."[/QUOTE]
You’re right "Waiting...”
I’m convinced that “My World...” stalled at #5 on the [[pop) charts because of the poor mix of Mary and Flo on the backing vocals. Just listen to the 2012 remix on the expanded “I Hear A Symphony” album. That’s how the single should have been issued.
You’re right "Waiting...”
I’m convinced that “My World...” stalled at #5 on the [[pop) charts because of the poor mix of Mary and Flo on the backing vocals. Just listen to the 2012 remix on the expanded “I Hear A Symphony” album. That’s how the single should have been issued.[/QUOTE]
I totally agree with that!
Here is the 2012 mix :
I still remember the day I bought the "Where" album and got it home. Couldn't stop staring at the cover, especially Flo. I TORE UP THIS SONG! I still love this song. Maybe it wasn't the right song at the right time for radio or the general public, but for me, it was/is as good as any of their other hits. Hearing Flo and Mary doing their parts was fantastic!
You thief Marv!
I've said it before, and I'll say it now. All of the examples given above [[except My World) demonstrate the beautiful harmonies which these three ladies provided. Florence and Mary were excellent background singers; I love their voices and their roles. The song, "My World is Empty Without You", although I love it, is a composition that does not lend to having background vocals [[with the exception of some light oooo's). In hindsight, I believe it should have been shelved or even assigned to another artist because it doesn't work as a Supremes release if one is looking to hear all three adequately [[a lead singer and background vocals). There was no way at that time that it would be released as a 'Diana Ross' single. The background voices, very low in the released editions) are placed there to say that it is a Supremes [[group) recording. The background parts, not to the fault of Mary and Florence, are more of a distraction than an enhancement to the song. Every live performance I have ever heard of this song by the Supremes heightened the distracting background vocal lines. Again, it's not that Mary and Florence are not good singers; it's just that their contribution [[via the arrangers and producers) was needed.
Should the background vocals level been moved up in the mix? NO!
Last edited by jobucats; 12-09-2019 at 12:53 PM.
I love the released version also; but in response to some others' opinions, I don't believe the background vocals should have been any higher in the mix; and I don't believe 'it's shame' one doesn't hear Mary and Florence more distinctively on this particular output. This one worked for what it was.
My world is empty without you is my favorite Supremes single. I just love it the way it is. It is perfect to my ears.I agree with both above. I love the recording as it is and for what it was and is. One of the best Supremes and Motown singles ever. Diana Ross is superb on it and HDH production is amazing.I love the released version also.This one worked for what it was.
I can't argue with history, I say keep it the way it was released. PERFECTION
I think part of the reason the harmonies were skipped was the speed with which they were doing things. if you read the liner notes and the recording dates, M and F would come in and record many songs all in one day. In the effort to crank out as much content as possible, i think the producers decided to forego complex background vocals just so they could complete songs faster.
Also a key component of HDH productions was it's simplicity. catchy lyrics, extremely "singable" melodies for lead and backgrounds.
So i don't think it was meant as a slight to M or F. Especially given that producers did a lot of 3 part work for them on Sam Cooke, Country, Liverpool, There's a Place, R&H.
You’re right "Waiting...”
I’m convinced that “My World...” stalled at #5 on the [[pop) charts because of the poor mix of Mary and Flo on the backing vocals. Just listen to the 2012 remix on the expanded “I Hear A Symphony” album. That’s how the single should have been issued.[/QUOTE]
Same can be said about Reflections. I thought that song should've at least been #1 and if Mary and Marlene's voices were brought to the forefront in the version that was released, it would've been their 11th number one [[before Love Child and Someday).
Same can be said about Reflections. I thought that song should've at least been #1 and if Mary and Marlene's voices were brought to the forefront in the version that was released, it would've been their 11th number one [[before Love Child and Someday).[/QUOTE]
in regards to Reflections, Ode To Bille was such a huge sensation at the time that Reflections just couldn't quite break through. i wonder if 1) the group name wasn't changed for that single and 2) they had done some TV spots during the summer to promote it. That could have been enough to break through.
My World stayed at #5 for 2 weeks in Feb 66. the first week the Top 5 was:
Lightnin' Strikes - Lou Christie
These Boots were made - Nancy Sinatra
Up Tight - stevie Wonder
My Love - Petula Clark
My World - Supremes
then the Top 5 changed to:
These Boots - N Sinatra
Lightnin' Strikes - Christie
Ballad of the Green Berets - Sgt Barry Sadler
Uptight - Stevie Wonder
My world - Sups
the following week Green Berets went to #1 and was there for 5 weeks. also entering the Top 5 were Listen People by Herman's Hermits and California Dreamin' by Mamas and Papas
one more thought
if low background vocals were to blame for a song not going #1, then how do you explain You Can't Hurry Love? the single version is very hard to hear. they come up a little more at the first part of the chorus when all 3 girls are singing together. but then drop way down again. Yet it not only went #1 but was one of the biggest singles
in regards to Reflections, Ode To Bille was such a huge sensation at the time that Reflections just couldn't quite break through. i wonder if 1) the group name wasn't changed for that single and 2) they had done some TV spots during the summer to promote it. That could have been enough to break through.
My World stayed at #5 for 2 weeks in Feb 66. the first week the Top 5 was:
Lightnin' Strikes - Lou Christie
These Boots were made - Nancy Sinatra
Up Tight - stevie Wonder
My Love - Petula Clark
My World - Supremes
then the Top 5 changed to:
These Boots - N Sinatra
Lightnin' Strikes - Christie
Ballad of the Green Berets - Sgt Barry Sadler
Uptight - Stevie Wonder
My world - Sups
the following week Green Berets went to #1 and was there for 5 weeks. also entering the Top 5 were Listen People by Herman's Hermits and California Dreamin' by Mamas and Papas[/QUOTE]
That Top 5 is a testament to how great music was in those days. Every one of them is now considered a classic and is still being played somewhere. It is also proof of just how competitive things were in the 60s. You can go half a year now and not get that many high-quality songs in the 10 at the same time.
I love the vocals on the newer mix. Stronger “I need you babe “ emphasizes the whole theme of the song.
Because Diana's voice was the one that mattered. Next?
I still hated that they destroyed that, those great, great harmonies. I receive more listening pleasure when the harmonies are present. Take for instance "Nothing But Heartaches" the backing vocals are almost being shouted. They sound good but not as good as their harmonies on their earlier recordings.
Last edited by marv2; 12-11-2019 at 01:03 AM.
i appreciate the variety of the backgrounds. There's actually quite a bit of the hit records with backing harmonies
Baby Love - Flo and Mary sing in harmony on the "baby, baby, baby, baby" at the end of each verse. hard to hear mary a bit but if you listen closely you'll hear it
come See about me
Back in my arms
the happening
Reflections
love is here - just a little bit, at the end of the bg vocals during the spoken sections
some that did NOT need it:
You Can't hurry love - F and M assume the role of mama, telling the girl to wait and be patient. the unison approach is appropriate here
Hangin On, Itchin, Stop - both of these benefit from the shear power of the bg vocals being in unison. harmonies would have diminished the strength a bit
My world - as i said, M and F are the haunting voice in the background. unison works best here too
where they might have best incorporated it:
I Hear a Symphony - given the majestic sound and track, 3-part harmony would have been gorgeous here.
from what we've read, IHAS was cranked out in just a matter of days. The track was cut on 9/22, strings added 9/28, lead vocals added 9/29 and then released on 10/6.
so probably in the interest of time they just did what they did
I do really like how the track modulates through keys. adds a level of sophistication. and how the instruments build in the backing track too after the bridge. that's where the addition of some harmonies would have worked great. during the verse "those tears that filled my eyes, i cry not for myself..."
That was Berry Gordy and his "assembly line" mentality. I think they were turning them out [[especially albums), too fast in the sixties. Two, maybe three albums a yearj was a little too much. I remember in the late sixties it seems as if the Temptations had a new single every 2 months!
"I Hear a Symphony" is such a great masterpiece. With the exception of the "B" section [[or bridge) near the beginning of the song [["I'm lost in a world.....", the composition is structurally monotonous. This accounts for the lyrics being difficult to memorize [[as evidenced in the Mike Douglas live performance)...the same melody is being sung over and over but with different lyrics which don't really tell a story; however, just spouts out words of affection and love. HDH did make sure that the track modulated upwards in key to add intensity and interest to the song [[as sup_fan stated). Although, I can't imagine how this classic would have been any better, it still would be interesting, as sup_fan suggested, to experience some actual harmonies in the background vocals.
it is a very interesting song, from a structure perspective, within the supremes catalog. It's essentially 3 large verses. there's a bridge between verse 1 and 2 and then the modulations during 2 leads to 3. and you're right. there really isn't a story. more of a poem
Intro
You've given me a true love and ev'ry day I thank you love
For a feeling that's so new, so inviting, so exciting
Verse 1
Whenever you are near, I hear a symphony
A tender melody pulling me closer, closer to your arms
Then suddenly, oh, your lips are touching mine
A feeling so divine 'til I leave the past behind
[[leading into bridge) I'm lost in a world made for you and me
Verse 2
Whenever you are near I hear a symphony
play sweet and tenderly
Ev'ry time your lips meet mine my baby
Baby, baby, I feel a joy within
Don't let this feeling end
Let it go on and on and on now baby
Baby, baby, those tears that fill my eyes
I care not for myself but for those
Who've never felt the joy we've felt
Verse 3
Whenever you are near
I hear a symphony each time you speak to me
I hear a tender rhapsody of love, love
Baby, baby, as you stand up holding me
Whispering how much you care
A thousand violins fill the air now
Baby, baby, don't let this moment end
Keep standing close to me
Oh so close to me, baby, baby
[[ending) Baby, baby, I hear a symphony, a tender melody
Ah it goes on and on
i'd love the hear a version of Symphony with all of the music and instrument tracks unmuted. see what they might have pulled out at different points
for instance, there are the wonderful horn flourishes in verse 1 after the say I Hear A Symphony [[0:26) and again at 0:39. but then they don't appear later in the song
during verse 2 the piano is prominent
and during the live versions [[especially on TCB) the strings do these amazing runs during version 2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmtvkBTTU2o
Same can be said about Reflections. I thought that song should've at least been #1 and if Mary and Marlene's voices were brought to the forefront in the version that was released, it would've been their 11th number one [[before Love Child and Someday).[/QUOTE]
That situation forced the listener to listen very careful to make out the background lyrics to the songs.
i agree that the backing vocals should have been higher on Reflections. especially on the chorus. the 3 part harmony is amazing on the track
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