Supremes At The Copa.

[davidh]

the Supremes certainly had many hits but they did have great harmony and there are some wonderful cover show tunes by these ladies. i also like the ROGERS AND HART album. the COPA album grew on me over the years now that i am older and wiser and i enjoy some of these songs much better. the THERES A PLACE FOR US cd also has some wonderful tracks and shows why these ladies reigned supreme amd still are.

[LadySingsBlues]

Well this thread has been a great, interesting read. For the record, I do enjoy the covers... just for the fact that they are a good demonstration of their versatility at the time.

[redlabs]

i thought they did really good with THE BOY FROM INPANEMA., SOMEWHERE, MAKE SOMEONE HAPPY,MORE.

[Jimi LaLumia]

The Supremes were true ground breakers, in the areas of crossing to white pop[[what other black artists had 12 Pop #1's in the 60's?...no one, that's who)...and in the area of pop culture and it's impact on civil rights...and "At The Copa" is a major milestone in both regards..

[robbert]

[Laughing] It took a while, but there is was: the word 'white'.
How was it put in the sixties? Because of the increasing number of standards The Supremes were not 'black' enough, remember? Back then people didn't realize they never were THAT black, to begin with. No, don't even think about going there again, discussing what 'black' or 'white' music exactly is or should be.

I'm going on topic again. What I hear in the few clips that float around of the Copa '67 show, the hits were rushed over the top, there was no place, let alone breath, to harmonize.
And the content of that 1967 show, is it not that some 80% of it is the same material as their show in 1968/'69? In short: their Talk Of The Town live album?
Listen to You Can't Hurry Love from the Copa 1967 and you can hear the hick ups of the lead singer growing in number, slowly but surely. They were not there in the Copa 1965.
On Talk Of The Town the show had become Diana Ross' [[& The Supremes).

[smark21]

I think the Copa album is intersting as a piece of show business history. The show itself hasn't aged well. Just think, The Supremes have had 5 #1 hits in a row and for their live show, they do mostly covers and show tunes. One of the hits is not performed, and two of the others are performed as a medley using a big band arrangement. Imagine if Adele were to go on tour singing mostly covers and Broadway songs while relegating her hits to a rearranged medley and leaving out her first hit Chasing Pavements? Just would not be done today.

Oddly enough though, when they do segue into Baby Love [[after that corny intro song written for the show), the crowd goes wild. Perhaps Gordy underestimated the Copa audience's ability to appreciate The Supremes when they did their own songs? Still, from a business standpoint, going the Copa route was a lucrative decision for Motown. And within the socio cultural politics of 1965, it was viewed as an achievement, a breakthrough. Yet a few years later, The Supremes were being criticized for not "being black enough". What was an achievement in 65 looked like selling out a few years later.

But I do think of all the Motown acts, The Supremes were the best fit for this kind of show. However of their 3 Nightclub live albums, I like Farewell the best because the set list has more of their own material. And the cover songs and show tunes are much better quality. Rodgers and Hart and Cole Porter are far superior to hoaky, if entertaining, vaudeville songs like Rock a Bye Your Baby with a Dixie Melody and You're Nobody til Somebody Loves You.

[Jimi LaLumia]

those songs were not hokey in 1965, they were show biz standards, 'musts' in a room like The Copa at that time...and the people in that audience were not primarily buyers of Supremes 45's, but they most likely started buying albums with standards on them like I Hear a Symphony shortly thereafter...
Adele ,if she was around in 1965, would be Dusty Springfield or Petula Clark, and she would, indeed, be doing standards in her act..how you can culturally compare 2012 to 1965 as the same circumstances is beyond me.
as to 'not black enough', this was the era of black power, 65-69, and The Supremes bravely swam upstream, resisting the stereo types that black power was actually re enforcing...
jump ahead to not black enough in the 2000's when black stars magically start turning white, literally, and go tell them that they're not 'black enough'...lol

[thisoldheart]

no, i think the adele comparison is fair. gordy did not trust his own motown sound to win over this audience and thereby gave that audience a show that was not representative of the group's strength. the showtune songs they spent a large part singing were not compulsory for this venue, at least not in the way they were presented.

if gordy had used real sense, he would have made sure that the snake pit crew were at least present on the nights this show was recorded to augment and give authority to the recording and had h/d/h arrange any non supreme material. then the show would have had an authentic motown edge to it. think of what h/d/h did with "the happening" which is basically a show tune [[that they did not write), or their work with the four tops covers of "if i were a carpenter" or "walk away renee". that can give you an insight into how this show could really have made record history.

dusty springfield would never have done a show like the copa album. yes, she would have included work outside of her own hits, but being the perfectionist that she was, much like aretha, later, she would have turned those songs into her own. the supremes basically backtracked and performed a dated sounding set, when they were considered at this time to be quite hip and chic. the audience would have eaten up this fresh approach and the result would be written about today as being a landmark live recording rather than a record that only completists purchase.

[Jimi LaLumia]

and I contend that, by 1965 standards, this did not sound dated;
and releasing an album with the snake pit crew would insinuate to people buying the album that this is what they'd get when they went to see The Supremes'live', which would have been false advertising..the "Motown Sound" never came across 'live' as it did in the studio,
and they generally left The Andantes home..
I'd like you to mention one edgy, 1965 'live' album that meets your criteria by any pop artist...you can't, cos it didn't exist yet..it was still early days in this phase of pop culture

[honest man]

Hello, i wonder if the songs recorded onTHERES A PLACE FOR US were dubbed onto the later Copa album,seem to remember Diana recorded alt vocals for the live....... Album,just a thought . cheers

[RossHolloway]

no, i think the adele comparison is fair. gordy did not trust his own motown sound to win over this audience and thereby gave that audience a show that was not representative of the group's strength. the showtune songs they spent a large part singing were not compulsory for this venue, at least not in the way they were presented.

if gordy had used real sense, he would have made sure that the snake pit crew were at least present on the nights this show was recorded to augment and give authority to the recording and had h/d/h arrange any non supreme material. then the show would have had an authentic motown edge to it. think of what h/d/h did with "the happening" which is basically a show tune [[that they did not write), or their work with the four tops covers of "if i were a carpenter" or "walk away renee". that can give you an insight into how this show could really have made record history.

dusty springfield would never have done a show like the copa album. yes, she would have included work outside of her own hits, but being the perfectionist that she was, much like aretha, later, she would have turned those songs into her own. the supremes basically backtracked and performed a dated sounding set, when they were considered at this time to be quite hip and chic. the audience would have eaten up this fresh approach and the result would be written about today as being a landmark live recording rather than a record that only completists purchase.

Well it's a good think Berry Gordy didn't have someone like you around to give him advise. The very fact that you're talking about one album that was recorded almost 47 years ago really proves who was right on the direction of the Supreme's and Motown as a whole and it's not you. LMFAO. You cannot be serious with your analysis. The Supreme's are icons and in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, now who are you again?

[davidh]

just a quick point,, the Supremes did perform WHERE DID OUR LOVE GO and NOTHING BUT HEARTACHES along with a few other numbers but they were edited out of the final album. not sure why but i suppose they just wanted to showcase the standards and not release the THERES A PLACE FOR US album. although i ,as a teenager would have preferred more of the hits.
maybe those songs may have not recorded well and they this may be why they were delletted. i suppose we will find out in a few months.wonder if they will release this in july to coincide with the original release date of the performance?

[reese]

just a quick point,, the Supremes did perform WHERE DID OUR LOVE GO and NOTHING BUT HEARTACHES along with a few other numbers but they were edited out of the final album. not sure why but i suppose they just wanted to showcase the standards and not release the THERES A PLACE FOR US album. although i ,as a teenager would have preferred more of the hits.
maybe those songs may have not recorded well and they this may be why they were delletted. i suppose we will find out in a few months.wonder if they will release this in july to coincide with the original release date of the performance?

I think WHERE DID OUR LOVE GO, NOTHING BUT HEARTACHES, and ENJOY YOURSELF were recorded during the first Copa engagement, but didn't make the album. They were held back for another live album to be released in 1966, but that one never came out.

[thisoldheart]

I'd like you to mention one edgy, 1965 'live' album that meets your criteria by any pop artist...you can't, cos it didn't exist yet..it was still early days in this phase of pop culture

well, james brown's "live at the apollo" from, i believe, 1963 is considered to be one of the greatest live albums recorded in the rock&soul world, and has never been out of print. sam cooke's "live at the copa" from 1964 sounds somewhat dated, but retains cooke's essence without taking the soul out of him. it is also in print today.

[marv2]

well, james brown's "live at the apollo" from, i believe, 1963 is considered to be one of the greatest live albums recorded in the rock&soul world, and has never been out of print. sam cooke's "live at the copa" from 1964 sounds somewhat dated, but retains cooke's essence without taking the soul out of him. it is also in print today.

Great point thisoldheart, although I believe James' live album was recorded and released in 1962.

[Jimi LaLumia]

The brown album hardly qualifies as a mainstream pop crossover, and he never was a major pop album chart seller in the 60's..it just didn't happen..
and the Sam Cooke album is just as dated and 'corny' as you percieve The Copa album to be

[marv2]

You know, I've been to the original Copa, the one the Supremes performed in. That was a bit before my time and the night I was first there, Chico DeBarge was debutting his new single "Talk to Me Baby" LOL! But what really struck was how small that place was! I was just bigger than my parents living room it seemed. It still have same paintings on the was as when the Supremes opened there in 1965.

[ejluther]

In addition to Gordy's "we've got the kids, now I want their parents" approach, I always thought the nightclub act was different also because teenagers/kids weren't admitted - it would have been adults only, yes? And, no, stars of today could never get away with having two acts - one for teenagers and one for adults - but can that only be seen as a good thing? If you like both sides of The Supremes [[as I do), then having both their studio recordings and live records like AT THE COPA is like having your cake and eating it, too...

[Jimi LaLumia]

rock nroll/teenage music in 65 was still considered a 'passing fad'..I used to hear that said all the time back then...'it won't last...this was planning for 'the future'..

[smark21]

I think WHERE DID OUR LOVE GO, NOTHING BUT HEARTACHES, and ENJOY YOURSELF were recorded during the first Copa engagement, but didn't make the album. They were held back for another live album to be released in 1966, but that one never came out.

Well hopefully these songs will be included on the re-issue. Though Enjoy Yourself doesn't sound very promising. The concert already has too many "Happy, Smile," type songs, not to mention that schmalzy love monologue in the middle of Somewhere. Just so much schmalz in the set. I get why this is not regarded outside of die hard Ross/Supremes fan circles as a classic. Too much pandering to the perceived tastes of of adult night club customers. But they had to start somewhere with their nightclub act and by January 1970, they had a very slick act with a much better set list.

[smark21]

those songs were not hokey in 1965, they were show biz standards, 'musts' in a room like The Copa at that time...and the people in that audience were not primarily buyers of Supremes 45's, but they most likely started buying albums with standards on them like I Hear a Symphony shortly thereafter...
Adele ,if she was around in 1965, would be Dusty Springfield or Petula Clark, and she would, indeed, be doing standards in her act..how you can culturally compare 2012 to 1965 as the same circumstances is beyond me.
as to 'not black enough', this was the era of black power, 65-69, and The Supremes bravely swam upstream, resisting the stereo types that black power was actually re enforcing...
jump ahead to not black enough in the 2000's when black stars magically start turning white, literally, and go tell them that they're not 'black enough'...lol

What objections do you have to the Black Power movement of the 60's?

[thisoldheart]

this was the era of black power, 65-69, and The Supremes bravely swam upstream, resisting the stereo types that black power was actually re enforcing..

obviously some people need to read a few history books around here!

[thisoldheart]

The brown album hardly qualifies as a mainstream pop crossover, and he never was a major pop album chart seller in the 60's..it just didn't happen..
and the Sam Cooke album is just as dated and 'corny' as you percieve The Copa album to be

so how do you account for brown's "live at the apollo" being rated #24 of the 500 greatest albums of all time by rolling stone magazine, and never being out of print?

and i have listened to sam cooke's copa album. his album predates the supremes copa gig, yet his album manages to sound like a sam cooke record even when he does the obligatory lounge act material. remember, i never said the supremes shouldn't do something to appease the rich white crowd. i said that holland, dozier, and holland should have been called in to arrange the numbers!

[jobeterob]

I do have a bit of an answer here - I would account for James Brown as part of the old Rolling Stone bias. Rolling Stone is like the RRHoF. It's got lost in the last 10 years as well. Not as many readers, not as many advertisers; fragmented audience. It doesn't know who it's audience really is. So, it panders here and there to what it thinks it needs to pander to............which is exactly what the RRHoF does.

And neither of them think it is cool enough to pander in the directions of Motown, the Supremes, Temptations, Four Tops or Diana Ross ~ but they will pander to James Brown and Aretha Franklin and Marvin Gaye, but only a little bit.

Neither of them are very impressive institutions anymore. But if RS were to go in the direction of Diana Ross or the Supremes, it definitely would not be going toward the Copa album. More likely they would go to Diana Ross 1980 or 1976 or 1970, or sing HDH or Where Did Our Love Go.

[marv2]

those songs were not hokey in 1965, they were show biz standards, 'musts' in a room like The Copa at that time...and the people in that audience were not primarily buyers of Supremes 45's, but they most likely started buying albums with standards on them like I Hear a Symphony shortly thereafter...
Adele ,if she was around in 1965, would be Dusty Springfield or Petula Clark, and she would, indeed, be doing standards in her act..how you can culturally compare 2012 to 1965 as the same circumstances is beyond me.
as to 'not black enough', this was the era of black power, 65-69, and The Supremes bravely swam upstream, resisting the stereo types that black power was actually re enforcing...
jump ahead to not black enough in the 2000's when black stars magically start turning white, literally, and go tell them that they're not 'black enough'...lol

I am sorry and with all due respect.........You do not know what you are talking about when it comes to the Black Power Movement.

"resisting the stereo types that black power was actually re enforcing..."


That comment is so out in left field. Hell it is not even the ballpark. You also have the period dates wrong. It was more like 1968-72. The Supremes and Motown were pandering. Yes in order to play white establishment places like the Copa, they were expected to sing show biz standards, broadway stuff etc,etc. But they went way overboard with the pandering until they appeared to have no soul in their music. Live performances I am speaking of. On record HDH and the Funk Brothers held it down mostly for them.

[Jimi LaLumia]

I have nothing against the black power movement..I fully supported it when it counted..
but, like the worst parts of hip hop,it played up some ultimately damaging stereotypes, and I recall reading that The Supremes, through Gordy,about 1968, were threatened into wearing afros in public by some militant voices...which they suddenly did..
a person of color being told that they can't demonstrate their abilities to record and perform show tunes because it's not black enough is akin to a male homosexual being told that they better walk around in leather or in drag, otherwise they're sell outs and they're not gay enough...
the 'one size MUST fit all' fascist approach never flew with me, and it never will..

[Jimi LaLumia]

and Marv,,,with equal due respect, regarding comments being beyond left field...well, you're an expert in that art form quite often, so I'll defer to your 'wisdom'......lol..

[jobeterob]

It's well established that Marv's comments are many, Diane focused, and often completely "off the field"; and as that renowned expert, we all defer, even Mary.

[bankhousedave]

In the sixties, playing standards was not nearly the act of propitiation it might seem. Music was not nearly as ghettoised as it is now. All the kids knew the standards, and they were nothing to do with black or white. They were the bread and butter of jazz acts, and they were the acid test of a musician or singer. They would have been perceived as 'grown-up' music. If you want somebody to recognise your talent, you give 'em something they can get a handle on. An actor does Shakespeare and Chekov because the public knows what it's looking at and can tell how well he's doing it. If the material is unfamiliar, their attention is more on that. When Gene Pitney came to the UK and played the Palladium, he felt obliged to tear the liver and lights out of a recognised 'standard' in an effort to win over the adults and any Royals in the house. He then lost most of his audience by saying: 'Not bad for a pop singer, huh?' But that's another story.

Everyone did standards - even humble local beat groups. We played Summertime - nearly everyone did - and we knew we would be asked for others, which we were able to make some kind of fist of. When Bob Henrit was in Adam Faith's backing band, he had to do dance routines, including lifts, and they all took part in comedy sketches as well as backing other singers, whatever their material.

Marvin ONLY wanted to do standards, and all of the Funks would be brought up on them. Even Otis did Try A Little Tenderness, although its composer would barely have recognised it when Ike and he had finished with it.

I'm just working on a book about the beat groups who played around Bradford in the 60s. They often had to back singers and one lists their act as including rock & roll, pop, 'Ray Coniff type material' - and they even did Take Five!

The big problem for me with Copa and other live albums is that the Motown numbers sounded diabolical. The showbiz rearrangements and gung-ho tempo increases played merry hell with anything of the Motor City about them. They're an interesting document to hear the singers unaugmented, but they did no favours to the songs. We cringed then and I cringe now. But I'm always prepared to cringe one more time for the ladies and give them deserved props for carrying it off.

[Jimi LaLumia]

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAcarmichael.htm
and no one needs to tell me what year everything took off; 1966/1967 is when the entire
world was exposed to Stokley and the youth movement/hippie movement conjoined around the Stokley book on Black Power;
by 1971, everything was about Viet Nam; 67/68/69 were the most potent earth shaking of the "Black Power/Black Panther years, which I supported[[except when it came to attempts to intimidate Motown,because Motown was so powerful, and the whole world was watching..)

[marv2]

and Marv,,,with equal due respect, regarding comments being beyond left field...well, you're an expert in that art form quite often, so I'll defer to your 'wisdom'......lol..

No, I just know that as a young black man growing up during those times who's parents, neighbors and others were involved in the black power/pride movement that what you said would have created a huge argument. In fact, it would have created a fight. This talk about the BLACK Supremes resisting stereotypes, that the BLACK power movement was reinforcing. WTF does that mean? What stereotypes were the Supremes trying to avoid? Their families were involved in the black power movement. Hell Mary Wilson's brother Roosevelt was a Black Panther! I stick by my earlier comment.....You do not what hell you are talking about in this instance. What you said was EXTREMELY offensive, but you do not realize that because you do not know what you talking at this moment!

Marv

[marv2]

so how do you account for brown's "live at the apollo" being rated #24 of the 500 greatest albums of all time by rolling stone magazine, and never being out of print?

and i have listened to sam cooke's copa album. his album predates the supremes copa gig, yet his album manages to sound like a sam cooke record even when he does the obligatory lounge act material. remember, i never said the supremes shouldn't do something to appease the rich white crowd. i said that holland, dozier, and holland should have been called in to arrange the numbers!

HDH should have arranged the numbers. Maurice King and Harvey Fuqua went overboard until the hits sounded like show tunes!

[marv2]

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAcarmichael.htm
and no one needs to tell me what year everything took off; 1966/1967 is when the entire
world was exposed to Stokley and the youth movement/hippie movement conjoined around the Stokley book on Black Power;
by 1971, everything was about Viet Nam; 67/68/69 were the most potent earth shaking of the "Black Power/Black Panther years, which I supported[[except when it came to attempts to intimidate Motown,because Motown was so powerful, and the whole world was watching..)

Look! Stokley aka Kwume Toure has been to my house! Has eaten lunch in my dining room! If you want to get all technical the "Black Power" movement started in 1917 with Marcus Garvey as some folk believe. You are confusing what I consider an off shoot of the civil rights movement as the same thing. Hell Angela Davis wasn't even arrested until 1970! Everything to you may have been about Viet Nam by 1971.....not in the black community!

[marv2]

It's well established that Marv's comments are many, Diane focused, and often completely "off the field"; and as that renowned expert, we all defer, even Mary.

Jobeterob, the only thing that's been established is that you are essentially a Diana Ross Zombie and nothing in the outside World matters much to you. Someone else said that it is a bit scary when you can look around the forum and see 900 threads about the same singer and we all know you have started many of them about some of the most trivia stuff borderlining on the embarassing! LOL!

[Glenpwood]

Well I for one would love to know how David Ruffin liked his Steak Cooked, Betty Kelly's favorite color of finger nail polish, or how much Aqua Net Hair Spray it took to hold Brenda Holloway's hair together but until someone starts those "trivial" threads we'll never know.

The complains its all Diana Ross and or the Supremes topics around here all the time are tired because its so easy to fix by starting a new topic about a different act. I look forward to seeing what the members of this forum come up with.

Now can we head back to the actual Copa at East 60th Street, NYC and things related to the Supremes appearances there. Things have veered so far from there I don't think some folks have realized the topic geographically is now in the wrong part of Newark, NJ.

[skooldem1]

This album, and concert are legendary. I don't care if it shows up on a top 100 list or not. This was a very popular album. Whether or not this has always been in print means absolutely nothing. It is being re-released over 40 years later- as a deluxe edition. What does that tell you? This was not a concert on the chitlin circuit or the Apollo. It was geared to a specific target audience. It is what it is. I like it because it's a slice of entertainment history. Knowing that, I wont criticize it 40 years later for what I felt it was lacking. IMO, this is just another milestone, accomplishment the Supremes had that many are trying to minimalize.

[marv2]

Well I for one would love to know how David Ruffin liked his Steak Cooked, Betty Kelly's favorite color of finger nail polish, or how much Aqua Net Hair Spray it took to hold Brenda Holloway's hair together but until someone starts those "trivial" threads we'll never know.

The complains its all Diana Ross and or the Supremes topics around here all the time are tired because its so easy to fix by starting a new topic about a different act. I look forward to seeing what the members of this forum come up with.

Now can we head back to the actual Copa at East 60th Street, NYC and things related to the Supremes appearances there. Things have veered so far from there I don't think some folks have realized the topic geographically is now in the wrong part of Newark, NJ.

Can someone explain what this guy is talking about?

[Glenpwood]

Marv, read your post then mine below and it makes sense. It's not designed to pick on you or any individual of this board, it just covers what been said in the topic about DRATS getting trivial topics compared to other acts and the fact that the topic is way off course.....

[jobeterob]

The album was a huge hit for a live album.......which of course is why it's getting the deluxe treatment; that and because Diana still has a significant following.

We know that Marv will get anxious and have Dianarheaa whenever another milestone or big event happens; it's always fun to watch. So that's when all of this will go tremendously off topic.

And then of course, Baby It's Me will follow and there will be more tour dates. I wonder if there are any more Awards she can get??

[Roberta75]

The album was a huge hit for a live album.......which of course is why it's getting the deluxe treatment; that and because Diana still has a significant following.

We know that Marv will get anxious and have Dianarheaa whenever another milestone or big event happens; it's always fun to watch. So that's will all of this will go tremendously off topic.

And then of course, Baby It's Me will follow and there will be more tour dates. I wonder if there are any more Awards she can get??

Dianarheaa. LOLOLOLOL

[marv2]

The album was a huge hit for a live album.......which of course is why it's getting the deluxe treatment; that and because Diana still has a significant following.

We know that Marv will get anxious and have Dianarheaa whenever another milestone or big event happens; it's always fun to watch. So that's will all of this will go tremendously off topic.

And then of course, Baby It's Me will follow and there will be more tour dates. I wonder if there are any more Awards she can get??

I am serious. What in the hell are you talking about? This album in 2012 is not much more than a nice novelty. It is not, nor was it ever ground breaking. Mary will get royalties and that's always good to know,but other than that it does not change anything for me personally.

[marv2]

Dianarheaa. LOLOLOLOL

It's not quite as funny as dressing up, going on national television and farting on the Grammy's! LOL !!!!

[smark21]

No, I just know that as a young black man growing up during those times who's parents, neighbors and others were involved in the black power/pride movement that what you said would have created a huge argument. In fact, it would have created a fight. This talk about the BLACK Supremes resisting stereotypes, that the BLACK power movement was reinforcing. WTF does that mean? What stereotypes were the Supremes trying to avoid? Their families were involved in the black power movement. Hell Mary Wilson's brother Roosevelt was a Black Panther! I stick by my earlier comment.....You do not what hell you are talking about in this instance. What you said was EXTREMELY offensive, but you do not realize that because you do not know what you talking at this moment!

Marv

Not often it happens, but I agree with Marv. I think Motown went too far to try to make The Supremes palatable to a primarily adult white nightclub audience with that Copa act. Fortunately it got better over the years. But all those songs about "Put on a Happy Face" and "Make Someone Happy" and "Enjoy YOurself" seem to communicate a message that these ladies won't make you feel uncomfortable like a civil rights marcher. True, Somewhere is a song about a future that may provide Universal Acceptance and parts of the Sam Cooke medley have some bite, but overall, there is nothing at all daring about this show. Not to say I'm advocating that the Supremes should have come on stage and opened with a new song called "Up Against the wall you white racist motherfuckers", but between all the happy songs, the Vegas/showtune arrangments of their hits and vaudeville schmalz like Rock a Bye Your Baby with a Dixie Melody, there's a reason why Live at the Copa is not considered a landmark live album of the 60's. Yes it sold well in its time, but it's not an album for the ages, though it is an interesting socio-cultural historical artifact documenting a culture and show business establishment that is no more. For that reason, I might actually buy the reissue as such matters arouse my intellectual curiosity, lol!.

[smark21]

Marv, read your post then mine below and it makes sense. It's not designed to pick on you or any individual of this board, it just covers what been said in the topic about DRATS getting trivial topics compared to other acts and the fact that the topic is way off course.....

This thread is actually one of the more substantive Supremes related threads at this site. We've discussed history, race, the conventions of show business and concerts between 1965 and now.

[jobeterob]

That's excellent Smark. Very well reasoned and I totally agree.

I guess I'm agreeing with Marv too. And everyone agreed on the Limbaugh debacle. Jeez, soon it'll be some kind of "bed in".

Taking Smarks reasoning a little bit further, and down the road a few years, both Diana Ross and Whitney Houston were so successful at ALL the markets for a while that they got a little big headed and they got too popular and then, as always, the public tired and moved on. With Whitney, it was "Ooooh, I'm bigger than the Beatles" and with Diana, it was the chronic flip the hair back, lead all the finales and call me Miss Ross.

[nomis]

you can only be the princess for so long..you grow old..Diana had the 60s and early 70s and then came along Whitney..she took the spot and then,as history repeats Beyonce came along and took the title...I hope Jay Z is a better man than Bobby..Summer,Flack,Watley and the rest just didnt capture mass adulation the way Ross,Houston then Knowles did

[jobeterob]

That's how I see it too Nomis.

[Kamasu_Jr]

I hope the expanded Copa booklet will include some other photos from the group's run other than those dowdy blue, flower and feather oddities that looked homemade. I found one [[a picture) recently that appears to have been taken at the Copa.

[LadySingsBlues]

It's not quite as funny as dressing up, going on national television and farting on the Grammy's! LOL !!!!

That would be funny....if that actually had happened.

[jobeterob]

Hmmmmmmm! Would Limbaugh have said what Marv just said? Probably.

Would a happy, well adjusted person say either of these things? Probably not, especially when this is about the Supremes at the Copa.

As has been said, what goes around comes around.

Hmmmm, thinking more this early morning.............I guess Mary already sent a message around about that kind of talk. He won't even listen to Mary!