Mary Wilson Interview on Downtown aka 20/20

[carlo]

Someone here had asked me to upload this interview onto Youtube, so here it is:

[marv2]

Thanks CARLOOOOO!!!!!

[luke]

It's about time! Thanks Carlo!

[ejluther]

Thanks, Carlo!

[jillfoster]

"How degrading... how degrading", exactly. It must be degrading to be asked to come back to your old partnership [[By someone who hadn't had a hit record in 15 years) and then be told... "By the way, you used to make 33 percent, and now your'e only gonna get 10 percent." Mary had been used many times in her life, so this time she said NO.

[marv2]

"How degrading... how degrading", exactly. It must be degrading to be asked to come back to your old partnership [[By someone who hadn't had a hit record in 15 years) and then be told... "By the way, you used to make 33 percent, and now your'e only gonna get 10 percent." Mary had been used many times in her life, so this time she said NO.

You summed the situation up very nicely Jill. There seemed to be this undercurrent of "take it or leave it......" during the "negotiations" with Mary and Cindy.

[stephanie]

I feel sorry for Mary Wilson! When I saw this clip again after all of these years I didnt even think about RTL I thought about the way she must have felt. Whether the numbers bandied about were wrong or not, and whether Mary kept the Supremes going after Diana left out of financial necessity or not she was right when she said it was her legacy. It has been the legacy of Diana, Mary and Flo so there is no getting around that. When I was in the 7th grade [[i remember this vividly) I sang with 2 other girls and we had a singer Vivian who was the lead ....her voice was very unique and she was the lead. When we were singing I remember our so called manager [[pretend manager we thought we were going to play big shows, well we can dream cant we) used to tell me Stephanie keep your voice down you know Vivian is the lead singer....LOL. This manager and Vivian would make all of the decisions and we were a group and that is how I felt! Maybe that is why growing up Flo was my favorite Supreme because when all of these stories about Motown and the Supremes started coming out I could identify. Anyway I say all of this to say that when I saw the Diana Ross and Barbara Walters interview and Ross said "All Mary had to do was show up" it was like Im making more money than she is and she should look at this like it is an opportunity for her. Much more than that it was their legacy! Ms Wilson should have been included. If anyone has seen the RTL clips [[they are on youtube) Scherrie and Lynda are waaaay off to the side. In defense of Diana maybe it was that way because it was not Mary and Cindy but in the back of my mind I think it would have been done the same way and these are the things Mary Wilson is speaking of. Granted both Scherrie and Lynda did have solos in the show so I cant say the same would not have been done for Mary and Cindy.

No matter who you are its hard living in the shadow of a lead singer who has not had the ups and downs financially that you have, especially when you have kept the name going, kept the gowns going, and had the responsibility of raising a family with the woes of domestic violence. Whether you like her or not Mary Wilson has seen some hard times so its only natural she would want to be included in the planning its not like they were a group that was put together by an ad in the paper like the Monkees or other groups. Same neighborhood, same friends, Motown family [[Hi Smokey), black president of a company who tells you he has your best interest at heart [[and is sleeping with the lead singer who was appointed by him). With all of these factors, I can see why Mary was upset. Even if she did take the offer and had 4 million given to her [[no matter what Diana Ross would get) to not be considered in the planning of the show was degrading on a personal level.

[johnjeb]

Even if she did take the offer and had 4 million given to her [[no matter what Diana Ross would get) to not be considered in the planning of the show was degrading on a personal level.

I've always said the same thing, stephanie. Mary should have been contacted very early in the planning stages so she could enjoy the excitement [[and frustrations) of planning an event that celebrates her and her girlfriends' legend and iconic status. She should have been given the opportunity to be consulted on wardrobe, song selection, staging, merchandising and, of course, expenses.

I've always felt the money issue, although important, would have been less of an issue if Mary had felt more included in the planning. That should not have been denied her. Asking her to show-up like hired-help is certainly degrading and humiliating.

[marv2]

I feel sorry for Mary Wilson! When I saw this clip again after all of these years I didnt even think about RTL I thought about the way she must have felt. Whether the numbers bandied about were wrong or not, and whether Mary kept the Supremes going after Diana left out of financial necessity or not she was right when she said it was her legacy. It has been the legacy of Diana, Mary and Flo so there is no getting around that. When I was in the 7th grade [[i remember this vividly) I sang with 2 other girls and we had a singer Vivian who was the lead ....her voice was very unique and she was the lead. When we were singing I remember our so called manager [[pretend manager we thought we were going to play big shows, well we can dream cant we) used to tell me Stephanie keep your voice down you know Vivian is the lead singer....LOL. This manager and Vivian would make all of the decisions and we were a group and that is how I felt! Maybe that is why growing up Flo was my favorite Supreme because when all of these stories about Motown and the Supremes started coming out I could identify. Anyway I say all of this to say that when I saw the Diana Ross and Barbara Walters interview and Ross said "All Mary had to do was show up" it was like Im making more money than she is and she should look at this like it is an opportunity for her. Much more than that it was their legacy! Ms Wilson should have been included. If anyone has seen the RTL clips [[they are on youtube) Scherrie and Lynda are waaaay off to the side. In defense of Diana maybe it was that way because it was not Mary and Cindy but in the back of my mind I think it would have been done the same way and these are the things Mary Wilson is speaking of. Granted both Scherrie and Lynda did have solos in the show so I cant say the same would not have been done for Mary and Cindy.

No matter who you are its hard living in the shadow of a lead singer who has not had the ups and downs financially that you have, especially when you have kept the name going, kept the gowns going, and had the responsibility of raising a family with the woes of domestic violence. Whether you like her or not Mary Wilson has seen some hard times so its only natural she would want to be included in the planning its not like they were a group that was put together by an ad in the paper like the Monkees or other groups. Same neighborhood, same friends, Motown family [[Hi Smokey), black president of a company who tells you he has your best interest at heart [[and is sleeping with the lead singer who was appointed by him). With all of these factors, I can see why Mary was upset. Even if she did take the offer and had 4 million given to her [[no matter what Diana Ross would get) to not be considered in the planning of the show was degrading on a personal level.

One of the most disgusting and dishonest things occurred during the Oprah Winfrey Show when Diana Ross after introducing Scherrie and Lynda. She announced to a national viewing audience that it was they [[Scherrie & Lynda) that have kept the Supremes Legacy alive all of these years...... It was like Mary Wilson had nothing to do with it. That had to make Mary feel bad. There she was all those years working hard to keep the Supremes legacy alive in the minds of the public.

[BobC]

I think she meant that they'd all been singing Supremes songs over the years.

I used to be friends with a guy who knew all the Supremes, and I will never forget the day I called him when rumors started flying that the Supremes were getting back together. I wasn't believing the rumors at all--I knew about all the bad blood between the members and thought there was no way in hell this would happen. When I called my friend and asked him if it could POSSIBLY be true, he said "Bob --it's TRUE." I couldn't believe it! He told me Cindy had put on a lot of weight and was going to a "fat farm" to get in shape for the tour. This was, I think, the summer or early spring of 2000. I was shocked! Unfortunately, within a few weeks, everything was falling apart and my original cynicism was proved right. Really sad when you think about it. Mary should have been there. I've seen Mary several times in concert and she has gotten standing ovations every time. When she's not being lazy in her singing, she can really blow the audience away.

I also recall talking to Tony Turner on the phone one day, this was way before the reunion fiasco, and I asked him if he thought Mary was a good singer. To my surprise, after reading his books, he told me "Bob, I have seen that girl bring the house down." He really had nothing bad at all to say about her. He did say Mary didn't sound good on lead on all the Supremes hits, but that was because she didn't have that kind of high, cute voice. On other material, she was dynamite. I agreed!

[captainjames]

If you view this 20/20 interview you will hear Mary say that she never wanted Diana to leave the Supremes. I remember this time in the group with Cindy, Diana and Mary and they were not even talking at this time to her. I understand now better than I did then and that is it was all about MONEY.

[luke]

My sister was very ill at the time all this was happening so I missed a lot and was totally shocked when I picked up a newspaper and read they were re-uniting. The paper said they were going to tour and if it went well were going into the studio to record!

[BobC]

I think it was about money AND respect. People want to make a complicated situation simple by picking "bad guys,"--but not me. I believe Mary was scared of DR leaving because on some level she and Cindy knew what it would mean to their careers, no matter how optimistic she tried to sound at the time. I also believe both M and C were relieved that DR was leaving, just because the tension was so high. To me it's like a marriage ending--you hate the fact that it's ending but you also know it has to happen

[luke]

My best friend in college and I had a falling out and pretty much stopped speaking. We were 20 years old and didnt have the personal skills to work it out. Years later we did.

[BobC]

Good point Luke. Sounds like you keep growing as a person and that is a great character trait.

Nona Hendryx wrote a killer song named Design for Living and one of the lyrics says "Now that I am barely breathing, I know all the answers."

I've always thought that meant that as we are about to leave this world, we will realize all our squabbles, problems and issues are meaningless in the grand scheme of things. All will be forgiven.

[Jimi LaLumia]

It's rather naive to equate two friends working things out between each other on a personal level vs.
two figures in the public eye dueling over large sums of money and historical legacies..
sorry, as beautiful as the 'kumbaya' concept is, the two situations are worlds apart

[bradsupremes]

Although this was a dark moment in the Supremes' history, both ladies have moved on with their lives and have overcome this. Most importantly, they both hold each other up in good light and respect.

[luke]

The last time Diana was asked about a reunion it was the only time she snapped at the interviewer and then dismissed the question.

[marv2]

The last time Diana was asked about a reunion it was the only time she snapped at the interviewer and then dismissed the question.

That is more like the reality I am accustomed to......hehehehehehehehehe......!

[luke]

Thx BobC and Amen! Thats our gal Marv--but maybe for 50 million...the interview was actually awhile ago so who knows. Ive been told by someone "in the know" they do communicate now and then...

[BobC]

I have to admit a weave-pulling catfight would have been entertaining, however. I think Mary could take Diana.

[captainjames]

I will take odds on that bet, Diana has always been a scrapper.

I have to admit a weave-pulling catfight would have been entertaining, however. I think Mary could take Diana.

[motony]

LOL, I think all those Detroit ladies could take care of themselves in a scrap.

[BobC]

I'm in a trashy mood today--so forgive me. Do you all believe the rumors that Florence Ballard beat the crap out of Diana after some Christmas TV program as Tony Turner said in one of his books? God that book was funny.

[bradsupremes]

I don't believe for one second that Florence attacked Diana after the Ed Sullivan Christmas appearance. Just some made up story. However, I do believe that if Florence was still alive during the RTL disaster that she would be the one who would have the say whether a reunion would happen or not. The ball would have been in her court and she would be the one to put Diana in her place if she had to. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Florence was the one calling the shots on the reunion and demanding equal pay.

[BobC]

hmmmmm--I didn't find the story that far-fetched. I mean traveling together non-stop for years, all the internal problems and then the drinking. I could see it happening. David Lee Roth and Sammy Hagar went at it so many times on one tour that they had to divide the back stage area with plywood!

[jillfoster]

Oh hell, yeah it happened. Flo could kick some ass... these were not debutante princesses, these were girls from the projects in sequined dresses. Brad, don't be fooled by pretty packages.

[floyjoy678]

I agree Brad. I actually think there probably would've been a few reunions had Flo been alive and the fights between Diana and Mary over the years I think Flo would've told the both of them to grow the hell up and get over it. It seems Flo's bitterness was fading just before died she was talking to Diana again and was ready to get back into performing, it's ashame what could've been.

[marv2]

I will take odds on that bet, Diana has always been a scrapper.

Yeah.....BUT! Mary is the type that would go to Diana Ross' dressing room and dare her to come out! LOL!

[marv2]

I'm in a trashy mood today--so forgive me. Do you all believe the rumors that Florence Ballard beat the crap out of Diana after some Christmas TV program as Tony Turner said in one of his books? God that book was funny.

Oh yes that happened! It took several individuals to pull Florence off of Diane. That was not the first or last time it happened. They don't like writing about these things.......hehehehehehe.....!

[marv2]

Oh hell, yeah it happened. Flo could kick some ass... these were not debutante princesses, these were girls from the projects in sequined dresses. Brad, don't be fooled by pretty packages.

I wished Brad and others could REALLY see how these chicks were and how they grew up. Mary was not lying when she said that she was once the girlfriend of the leader of one of Detroit's roughest street gangs back in the day! LOL!

[marv2]

I agree Brad. I actually think there probably would've been a few reunions had Flo been alive and the fights between Diana and Mary over the years I think Flo would've told the both of them to grow the hell up and get over it. It seems Flo's bitterness was fading just before died she was talking to Diana again and was ready to get back into performing, it's ashame what could've been.

She, Florence says nothing like that at all in her last interviews with Dave Dials of WXYZ - Detroit. I don't know who originated that story that Florence was talking to Diane again before she passed away. Dave Dial flat out asked her if she still spoke to Mary Wilson and Diana Ross and she responded that she received post cards from Mary Wilson-Ferrer and whenever she was in town, she would stop by to see Florence. Nothing in regards to any communication with Ross was mentioned by Flo.

[carlo]

Marv, if you read Peter Bejaminson's book, "The Lost Supreme", you will find all of this information revealed in Flo's own words. It starts on the bottom of pg. 164 to pg. 166. She mentions she had talked to Diana on the phone in 1975. She says they had a very long, nice woman-to-woman talk. She goes on to talk about Diana and Mary...I won't repeat everything. You can read it for yourself. I agree with floyjoy678, it sounds like Flo was on good terms with Diana and Mary before she passed. I think she always loved them. It was Berry that she couldn't stand.

[carlo]

Page 305 in J. Randy's updated bio on Miss Ross also includes a transcription of a note that he received in the mail from Flo, one month before she passed. It reads:

"Tell Mary I love her. And Diane, too. [[She's not so bad! Ha Ha Ha.) I'm very sure I will be back on my feet one day. I have some exciting plans and will write soon to give you the good news --- I hope! Until then, always remember -- we really were SUPREME!!!
Love,
Flo"



If anything, I think fans need to live by these words. Before she passed, Flo loved Diana and Mary. If anyone was wronged over the years, it was not the fans, it was Flo...and she managed to let go and forgive. Why can't we? We need to remember that they were supreme and celebrate that in unity...not spread hate and craziness. That's part of the reason why Flo has always been my favourite. She always kept it real and didn't put up with BS.

[marv2]

Marv, if you read Peter Bejaminson's book, "The Lost Supreme", you will find all of this information revealed in Flo's own words. It starts on the bottom of pg. 164 to pg. 166. She mentions she had talked to Diana on the phone in 1975. She says they had a very long, nice woman-to-woman talk. She goes on to talk about Diana and Mary...I won't repeat everything. You can read it for yourself. I agree with floyjoy678, it sounds like Flo was on good terms with Diana and Mary before she passed. I think she always loved them. It was Berry that she couldn't stand.

Ok Carlo, I will have to check it out. Maybe she spoke to Peter after she spoke with Dave Dials. Yes, she "disliked Berry Gordy very much..."