Love is Here and Now You're Gone - or a different follow up to YKMHO?

[sup_fan]

we rarely seem to discuss Love Is Here. to be honest, i never listen to it and it's one of my least favorite Sup songs. certainly one of the lowest of the "hits"

still i will acknowledge that the spoken interludes do make for a very effective and totally different element to a song. i think what i don't like are the weird, almost synthesizer sounding Ahhhhs of the Andantes in the opening and during the breaks.

clearly the song charted well. and it think it sold a decent amount. not as big as songs like You Can't Hurry Love. But should they maybe have done a different follow up to You Keep Me Hangin' On? should they have done Going Down Third Time or maybe There's No Stopping?

[RanRan79]

No way. Lol

Factually, who can argue with an across the board number one? That alone keeps me from considering any other song to follow up YKMHO.

From an opinion stand point, "Love Is Here" is one of my absolute favorite Supremes songs of any category. To me it's a perfect record: Diana's heartbreaking lead, her dramatic spoken sections, Flo and Mary's soulfully sad echoes of Diana's feelings, the brilliant HDH lyrics, even the beautiful track, which I was surprised to learn was the LA musicians and not the Funks. If I have any criticism of the song it's nothing more than wondering how better it might have been with the Funks instead. But other than that, A plus record for me.

I think it also falls in line with the group's progression.

"I Hear a Symphony" is what I consider the last of the so called girl group type songs, but it has an element of sophistication that sort of previews what's to come.

"My World Is Empty" is this dark, soulful number, that's haunting and plays up the tone of the lyrics in every way: the lead, the background, the track. The Supremes hadn't been heard this way since they hit it big and it signaled their crossing over into more adult themed music.

"Itchin", despite already being several months old, still seems to keep with the feling that the Supremes have grown. The track is super funky, Diana's lead is very gutsy, Flo and Mary sound like a good time.

Thematically, "Hurry" could have been usual girl group fare, but the other elements continue the ladies full steam ahead. That track is awesome. It's a perfect combo of r&b, pop, even some gospel. Diana's lead just burst through and she really attacks the lyrics in a way that I don't think she had on any of the previous hits.

"Hangin" was different from "Hurry", but it sounds like a natural progression. It sort of builds on the forceful sound of "Hurry" with the drama and bit of darkness of "My World". I'm not sure what was going on with Diana the day of the initial recording and why she sounds so incredibly thin and needed to be double tracked. Whatever the issue, it worked in the song's favor. Again, another perfect record. And Flo and Mary were killing it too.

So "Love Is Here" drops and the girls continue their ride into adulthood while giving the public something new and fresh. There's a new sort of tone with this record that makes it apparent that 1966 is over and 1967 is going to be some brand new Supremes sounds continuing the public's way.

[TNSUN]

I think "There's No Stopping Us Now" was intended to be released as a single. TNSUN is on the Supreme s album " The Supremes Sing Holland Dozier Holland".It is on The Supremes Greatest Hits Volume 1. Maybe, the horn bleep stopped it from being released as a single- which could have been removed in latter pressings. TNSUN still sounds awesome and upbeat!

[gman]

LOVE IS HERE is different...I love it...DR is spellbinding in her singing and narrative parts...it was in the live set list continuing into Jeans era...

there is a live clip of Lynda doing a excellent lead on this with the original [[and best!) grouping of FLO'S [[w/Jean & Scherrie)

[PeaceNHarmony]

I love Love LOVE 'Love Is Here ...' . I concur with GMAN's post - Diana's singing AND narration are just amazing. One of the reasons why Diana is one of the [[very) few of her era still packing concerts.

[Motown Eddie]

we rarely seem to discuss Love Is Here. to be honest, i never listen to it and it's one of my least favorite Sup songs. certainly one of the lowest of the "hits"

still i will acknowledge that the spoken interludes do make for a very effective and totally different element to a song. i think what i don't like are the weird, almost synthesizer sounding Ahhhhs of the Andantes in the opening and during the breaks.

clearly the song charted well. and it think it sold a decent amount. not as big as songs like You Can't Hurry Love. But should they maybe have done a different follow up to You Keep Me Hangin' On? should they have done Going Down Third Time or maybe There's No Stopping?

I say that "Love Is Here And Now You're Gone" was the perfect follow up to "You Keep Me Hanging On". However, if there was a song that could've been replaced as an A-side for The Supremes in 1967 it would be "In And Out Of Love" [IMHO it would've be a great B-Side to "There's No Stopping Us Now"].

[daviddh]

Perfect follow up for YKMHO
My fav two songs

[Boogiedown]

daviddh


Perfect follow up for YKMHO

My fav two songs

first she laments that the guy won't get lost , then she laments that he's now gone

such is life .....

[Ollie9]

Diana’s spoken parts are what makes the song special for me. She always had that very sexy speaking voice that sounded great on record.

[thanxal]

I still don’t know how she avoided the hiccups when singing that live!

[jobucats]

I still don’t know how she avoided the hiccups when singing that live!

Speaking of hiccups, I recall wondering what is that coughing sound I am hearing after Diana does her narration, especially after the first spoken passage? As a young kid, I tried to figure it out...did she indeed cough? ...did she hit her head on the microphone in the vocal booth?... Oh, the things that got our attention when we were kids!!! Now, am I understanding it was her part of her famous/infamous 'hiccups' phase? She continued that for quite some time, didn't she?

[RanRan79]

Now, am I understanding it was her part of her famous/infamous 'hiccups' phase? She continued that for quite some time, didn't she?

Unfortunately.

[RanRan79]

My favorite part of "Love Is Here" is when Diana sings "look at my face" and Flo and Mary repeat it but on "face" they really play up the pain of the lyric. They do the same with "left me all alone".

It sucks that in such a short time both Flo and HDH would be gone. I realize that the name change- and thus the structure of the group- would likely have changed whether Flo stayed or not, whether HDH stayed or not. But musically the group was just going up, up, up, pushing themselves forward, remaining relevant among many of the changing sounds. "Love Is Here", "The Happening", "Reflections" there was a progression of sound. [[I'm not sure I would categorize "The Happening" as more progressive than "Love Is Here", but I also really dislike the song, so...but, I wouldn't call it a regression in sound either.) "In and Out of Love" really disrupted that momentum and if it's true that it was released because there was little left in the HDH bag already to go, we have to wonder what the next release might have been if HDH hadn't been involved in a battle with the label and then finally exiting and how much more progressive the sound would have been from "Reflections".

[sup_fan]

My favorite part of "Love Is Here" is when Diana sings "look at my face" and Flo and Mary repeat it but on "face" they really play up the pain of the lyric. They do the same with "left me all alone".

It sucks that in such a short time both Flo and HDH would be gone. I realize that the name change- and thus the structure of the group- would likely have changed whether Flo stayed or not, whether HDH stayed or not. But musically the group was just going up, up, up, pushing themselves forward, remaining relevant among many of the changing sounds. "Love Is Here", "The Happening", "Reflections" there was a progression of sound. [[I'm not sure I would categorize "The Happening" as more progressive than "Love Is Here", but I also really dislike the song, so...but, I wouldn't call it a regression in sound either.) "In and Out of Love" really disrupted that momentum and if it's true that it was released because there was little left in the HDH bag already to go, we have to wonder what the next release might have been if HDH hadn't been involved in a battle with the label and then finally exiting and how much more progressive the sound would have been from "Reflections".

i've so wondered that too - what MIGHT have occurred had they stayed with motown. i'm not hugely familiar with all of their work at Invictus - some of Freda's things and some Honey Cone. mostly just the hits. but as much as i like the hits, i don't know that they're anywhere near as inventive as Reach out I'll Be There or Reflections or You Kepp Me Hanging On. IMO HDH decided to go with tried and true formulas, probably because the label just needed to get off the ground and get some money. they didn't really have the luxury of experimenting. So if they'd stayed with the security of motown, perhaps they would have really done some interesting things. or perhaps they were sort of tapped out.

[jobucats]

i've so wondered that too - what MIGHT have occurred had they stayed with motown. i'm not hugely familiar with all of their work at Invictus - some of Freda's things and some Honey Cone. mostly just the hits. but as much as i like the hits, i don't know that they're anywhere near as inventive as Reach out I'll Be There or Reflections or You Kepp Me Hanging On. IMO HDH decided to go with tried and true formulas, probably because the label just needed to get off the ground and get some money. they didn't really have the luxury of experimenting. So if they'd stayed with the security of motown, perhaps they would have really done some interesting things. or perhaps they were sort of tapped out.

To me, HDH's Invictus output sounded too much like a lot of the other music of the same genre that was being put out at the time. Even their personal productions, in my opinion, lacked any creativeness that was so evident during their Motown tenure especially during their last 2 years. Yes, they might have taken the safer route of reigning in their creativity by choosing to go with the popular standards of the day. To me, most of their label's music sounded dull in comparison with the vibrancy of the majority of the Motown recordings that were continuing to be released.

I wonder, I wonder, I wonder what they would have come up with if they had stayed with Motown.

[RanRan79]

I definitely hold a different opinion about some of that Invictus material than you all do. I don't think much of it sounds like everything else out at the time. The guys sound like they were still putting their stamp on things. I imagine though that there would be some differences between what they could do at Motown [[with a hefty budget) vs what they could do with their own much smaller label. Yet still, stuff like Chairmen of the Board's Skin I'm In album, Freda's "Road We Didn't Take" and "Mother Misery's", Honey Cone's "Who's It Gonna Be" and "Ooh Baby Baby" was as good and innovative as anything else being put out at the time, IMO.

That being said, the creative arts can be a very fragile thing. HDH were out at Motown by at least February 1968. I think- think- the first Invictus stuff were at least a year and a half later. That's a lot of down time when you're used to writing a song and then getting in the studio to lay the tracks, and then get with the singers to arrange the vocals, and record. The lay off could have messed with the creativity a bit.

[sup_fan]

I definitely hold a different opinion about some of that Invictus material than you all do. I don't think much of it sounds like everything else out at the time. The guys sound like they were still putting their stamp on things. I imagine though that there would be some differences between what they could do at Motown [[with a hefty budget) vs what they could do with their own much smaller label. Yet still, stuff like Chairmen of the Board's Skin I'm In album, Freda's "Road We Didn't Take" and "Mother Misery's", Honey Cone's "Who's It Gonna Be" and "Ooh Baby Baby" was as good and innovative as anything else being put out at the time, IMO.

That being said, the creative arts can be a very fragile thing. HDH were out at Motown by at least February 1968. I think- think- the first Invictus stuff were at least a year and a half later. That's a lot of down time when you're used to writing a song and then getting in the studio to lay the tracks, and then get with the singers to arrange the vocals, and record. The lay off could have messed with the creativity a bit.

i'll be the first to admit that i've not researched the invictus label. I'm just familiar with the mega hits. Band of Gold, Want Ads, one monkey, etc. They are excellent records. I don't know if i'd label them as "groundbreaking" though. but i could be persuaded. at least the Honey Cone stuff was a much more assertive, feminist girl group sound. they had no problem telling that dog to take a flying leap.

but so were the Sups with Nathan Jones. and while i think Frank was a little too restrained with the synthesizer on that tune and could have done more with it, i'd say it was more innovative than Want Ads. Want Ads is catchier though and just an awesome song.

[RanRan79]

Sup you should really check out more of the Invictus stuff. IMO all of Freda's albums on the label were fantastic.

[RanRan79]

"In and Out" was such a misstep IMO. I love the song but I think it only did as well as it did because the Supremes were still riding high. Great album track, or b-side, if I had been in charge.

Looking at the HDH recordings we know of from 1967, only two come across to me as having a foundation for following "Reflections": "Forever Came Today" and "I Can't Make It Alone". [[I know "Forever" was completed in 1968, but my suspicion is that a lot of the work- including maybe vocals- were completed in 1967.)

With "Forever", I think all the elements are there that move the group forward from "Reflections". The track is exciting, Diana's vocal is great, the lyrics are great. The problems might be [[a) the backing vocals are nearly unintelligible, [[b) there might be some missing element that could have taken the song to the next level, [[c) it's not a ballad, so no slow dancing to it, but even though it's up tempo, it sounds like it would be difficult to dance to. Bottom line is something was off, I just can't quite put my finger on it. But I don't think there's any denying that "Forever" sounds like HDH was still trying to move the group forward, not backward.

"I Can't Make It Alone" wasn't completed until two days before the new year. I think it has more of an innovative sound than "In and Out of Love". Good Diana vocal, the backing vocals are nice, the track is good. My problem is the chorus. I love those verses and the melody of it, but then comes the chorus and I'm like "wtf?" It messes the song up for me. I still listen to it, but I really do hate the chorus. Lol Had HDH done something entirely different with the chorus, it would have been interesting to see how well it might have done as a single.

[sup_fan]

i agree about I Can't Make It. it's a decent song, perfect for the album. not sure if it's a real solid single though. it would have probably scraped into the Top 20. so you almost have a repeat of history - 5 #1s in 64/65 and then the dud of Nothing. the 5 hits of 66/67 and then a dud of In and Out. I Can't Make It probably wouldn't have reached 9 like In did. at least the choruses are strong on In and Out. to me the fault lies in the bouncy, sing-song approach to the song. perhaps if it had a more direct 4/4 beat to it rather than the skipping beat. it just needs something more powerful in order to make an attempt at repeating the strength of Reflections.

with Forever, I think they missed Berry's core maxim about meaningful, sensible lyrics. even the title is vague - your "forever" came today??? what forever? And totally agree that mess going on in the background mars the overall record. their voices are so thick and heavy it bogs the whole thing down like a wet blanket.

[Sotosound]

I love LIHANYG, and the string arrangement tops it off very nicely. Perfect pop/soul in my little world.

The thing with TNSUN is that the lyrics in the verses don't really align with the rhythm and melody, and this makes it more of a B-Side also-ran for me.

As for IAOOL, I remember how sunny and optimistic the sound felt to me when I first heard it; and I still get that vibe from the single mix almost a lifetime later. For me, it was the right choice for single release. Love it!

For me, FCT sits in the sometimes slightly plodding mid-tempo bag that Motown got into around 1967-68. It is difficult to dance to. Part of that is the tempo, but another reason is because it stops and starts, which is a dance floor emptier if ever there was one. This will have made it less appealing to traditional Motown fans whilst not pulling in new psychedelic rock fans because it was still Motown through and through and less weird than "Reflections". Good track, though.

ICMIA is a good album track but the instrumental break, which is a verse's worth of the backing track with no singing, would have killed it without help from the unusual melodic changes in the choruses.

I actually think that "Then" or "Misery Makes My Heart Its Home" might have found a middling audience, but nothing was going to have an easy job trying to follow up either "Reflections" or YCHL.

I also suspect that H-D-H might have been a spent force commercially when they left Motown. Not all of the big hits on Invictus and Hot Wax were H-D-H songs by a long chalk.

[sup_fan]

Soto - you describe In And Out as "sunny" and that's exactly what it is. Sunshine Pop which was a trend coming out of LA. groups like the Beach Boys, 5th Dimension, Mamas and Papas were all part of this wave. so that sound and music was actually pretty "in" at the time. it might be that it just hasn't aged as well [[at least to my ears anyway)

in other threads i've talked about how maybe the patchwork-like Reflections album wasn't quite so patchy. i might be giving too much credit but you could sort of look at the album as a motown tribute to the sounds of CA. you have the SFO/psychedelic nod and then the LA/sunshine parts.

representing SF you have Reflections, I'm gonna make it, forever, i can't make it and bah bah

representing LA you have In and Out, Up Up and Away, What the world needs now.

i think Love, Then and Misery, while maybe not exactly Sunshine pop, fit in pretty well. the canned track of Going All The Way would have worked too. same with Stay In My Lonely Arms

Ode to BJ [[lol) is folk and gothic country. but given how timely it was, makes sense to include. although i don't really like so totally fine cutting it lol

[gman]

In and Out Of Love is the only single that benefits from the standard Supremes galloping live arrangement....On TALK OF THE TOWN it is a totally different vibe ...it was a excellent choice for the '68 Supremes concert program...after speeding thru the Stop!/Come See/My World/Baby Love medley and a few recent singles done at breakneck pace with too much brass, to hear a single that actually sounded better live is a blessing.