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  1. #1

    Diana Ross and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

    Months ago, the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame announced that Dionne Warwick, Tina Turner [[post-Ike), multiple nominee Chaka Khan and Carole King [[post-Gerry Goffin) were nominated for an induction into the musical hall for this year.

    I feel of the four ladies, Tina [[and likely Carole King) could be shoo-ins [[unless Dionne gets in as well; MJB would have to wait).

    But knowing how Diana Ross' solo career has went, do any of you think they'll recommend her solo efforts in the future or continually dismiss it?

    She's often referred to as a snub and people probably thought it was impossible but after Whitney Houston's [[well deserved) induction last year, it's likely that the possibilities of a post-Supremes Diana Ross being honored for her solo work seems to be in the cards again.

    So do you think it's possible for her to get in or do you not think her solo career grants it?

    Take away the Supremes, Diana has a good resume: 6 number ones, 12 top ten singles and 22 top 40 singles, Billboard giving her the Female Entertainer of the Century [[though I don't know how prestigious that honor is NOWADAYS). Of course, the Central Park 83 performance in the rain was a historic moment, as well as her Super Bowl half-time show in 96. But it seems unlike Tina or Whitney or Donna Summer or Aretha, she doesn't have any "standout" moments.

    She's an icon but she has no iconic performances like Whitney's Star-Spangled Banner or her I Will Always Love You, or Donna's "I Feel Love" [[though "Love Hangover" was no small accomplishment), or Tina's huge comeback from adversity [[abusive marriage, racism, sexism, ageism) or Aretha's civil-rights era of revolutionary landmarks.

    Most of her barrier-breaking years are as the lead singer of the Supremes, an achievement she shared with Florence Ballard, Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong but do you think she deserves to get in or should the Supremes' induction be enough?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Months ago, the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame announced that Dionne Warwick, Tina Turner [[post-Ike), multiple nominee Chaka Khan and Carole King [[post-Gerry Goffin) were nominated for an induction into the musical hall for this year.

    I feel of the four ladies, Tina [[and likely Carole King) could be shoo-ins [[unless Dionne gets in as well; MJB would have to wait).

    But knowing how Diana Ross' solo career has went, do any of you think they'll recommend her solo efforts in the future or continually dismiss it?

    She's often referred to as a snub and people probably thought it was impossible but after Whitney Houston's [[well deserved) induction last year, it's likely that the possibilities of a post-Supremes Diana Ross being honored for her solo work seems to be in the cards again.

    So do you think it's possible for her to get in or do you not think her solo career grants it?

    Take away the Supremes, Diana has a good resume: 6 number ones, 12 top ten singles and 22 top 40 singles, Billboard giving her the Female Entertainer of the Century [[though I don't know how prestigious that honor is NOWADAYS). Of course, the Central Park 83 performance in the rain was a historic moment, as well as her Super Bowl half-time show in 96. But it seems unlike Tina or Whitney or Donna Summer or Aretha, she doesn't have any "standout" moments.

    She's an icon but she has no iconic performances like Whitney's Star-Spangled Banner or her I Will Always Love You, or Donna's "I Feel Love" [[though "Love Hangover" was no small accomplishment), or Tina's huge comeback from adversity [[abusive marriage, racism, sexism, ageism) or Aretha's civil-rights era of revolutionary landmarks.

    Most of her barrier-breaking years are as the lead singer of the Supremes, an achievement she shared with Florence Ballard, Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong but do you think she deserves to get in or should the Supremes' induction be enough?
    Diana Ross’ had many solo standout moments. IMO
    The biggest was “Lady Sings the Blues” the movie as well as the double album going #1. Also her spectacular TV specials.

  3. #3
    I think Ross has several moments of achievement but my issue is with RRhall of fame has become a bit of a joke.
    So many talents haven't made it in

  4. #4
    Chic were first nominated in 2003 and have been on the induction ballot a further 10 times since and STILL haven't made it..

  5. #5
    If people choose to remember Diana Ross as a founder members of a group that became World Class superstars, who broke records and barriers, for 6 successful years, that is from 1964 first number one to 1970 last performance that is proof that her contributions to Rock and Roll history is founded. But as a Solo Artist for over 50 years Number one hits, Oscar Nomination, worldwide concert tours, royal command performance, hit duets, part of We Are the World, the Central Park concert, Why would her solo career less of contribution in the eyes of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame . There are a lot in the Hall of Fame who have contributed a lot less .

  6. #6
    For someone who was named entertainer of the century by Billboard it has to be a huge and resounding ​yes.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    For someone who was named entertainer of the century by Billboard it has to be a huge and resounding ​yes.
    Diana Ross, solo career and as a member of The Supremes, was the first black woman to become a pop megastar worldwide. She was the blueprint for Whitney, Madonna, Janet, Beyoncé, and the list goes on. It can't get much better than this. She was truly a pioneer.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    But knowing how Diana Ross' solo career has went, do any of you think they'll recommend her solo efforts in the future or continually dismiss it?

    So do you think it's possible for her to get in or do you not think her solo career grants it?

    Of course, the Central Park 83 performance in the rain was a historic moment, as well as her Super Bowl half-time show in 96. But it seems unlike Tina or Whitney or Donna Summer or Aretha, she doesn't have any "standout" moments.

    She's an icon but she has no iconic performances like Whitney's Star-Spangled Banner or her I Will Always Love You, or Donna's "I Feel Love" [[though "Love Hangover" was no small accomplishment), or Tina's huge comeback from adversity [[abusive marriage, racism, sexism, ageism) or Aretha's civil-rights era of revolutionary landmarks.

    Most of her barrier-breaking years are as the lead singer of the Supremes, an achievement she shared with Florence Ballard, Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong but do you think she deserves to get in or should the Supremes' induction be enough?
    Diana Ross' solo career is peppered with iconic moments: LSTB, "Aint No Mountain High Enough", "Love Hangover", Central Park. The Central Park rain out was voted TV's Greatest Music Moment at the TV Land Awards. She was voted Entertainer Of the Century by Billboard. Her impact on the industry, if only being judged by music, is still one of the highest icon measures. She was very likely the first Black superstar of the modern age. All of that holds it own next to every woman you mention in your post.

    Will she get in on her own? Maybe. All of the HOF's have these weird arbitrary voting ways, and I'm okay with that. There are so many greats who deserved to be honored, but they can't all be honored at the same time. Hopefully she gets the honor in her lifetime. I'm sure if she doesn't, somewhere down the line, it will come.

    But she is already honored with the Supremes. Based on the fact that there are multiple people honored with group and solo, this shouldn't keep her out. Apparently there is only one female with two inductions and that's Stevie Nicks. This could be a sexist issue and a racial issue rolled into one. The Hall would go a long way into erasing that image by inducting Diana as the second woman to hold two inductions.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro2015 View Post
    Diana Ross, solo career and as a member of The Supremes, was the first black woman to become a pop megastar worldwide. She was the blueprint for Whitney, Madonna, Janet, Beyoncé, and the list goes on. It can't get much better than this. She was truly a pioneer.
    Amen!

    First, from daviddh:
    I think Ross has several moments of achievement but my issue is with RRhall of fame has become a bit of a joke.
    So many talents haven't made it in
    RRHall lost its credibility with me a long time ago. For me, its pinnacle was in 1988, with the induction of the Beatles, Supremes, Berry Gordy, Beach Boys, Bob Dylan, Drifters, Woody Guthrie, Les Paul & Lead Belly. What a class!!

    The Supremes induction was as foreordained as the Beatles, but I thought the RRHall would resist Diana Ross' solo career because she became a Pop superstar diva. Then last year, Whitney Houston was inducted. This year, Dionne Warwick is nominated. Diana's "RR" credentials are as solid as Dionne's & Whitney's.

    I totally understood Stevie Nicks being the first woman inducted twice. She's a Rock Queen. Aretha's induction [[the first woman inductee!) is unquestionable. But I am surprised that Tina Turner solo hasn't been nominated until this year. She's also been hailed as Rock Queen.

    [[I think Carole King and Chaka Khan are also worthy of induction.)

  10. #10
    They are a white rock hall of fame first and foremost - and they nominate some pretty vague artists that did not change anything culturally.

    But I think they are coming around and for all the reasons many of you listed, I think Diana has a chance eventually.

  11. #11
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    Ross absolutely deserves to be inducted as a solo artist. Her not showing up when the Supremes were inducted is not forgotten and will forever prevent her solo induction.

    Sad .....

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Circa 1824 View Post
    Ross absolutely deserves to be inducted as a solo artist. Her not showing up when the Supremes were inducted is not forgotten and will forever prevent her solo induction.

    Sad .....
    I am of the opinion that Diana did not show up at some of the events honoring the Supremes, such as the R&R Hall of Fame, so as to not take the spotlight away from Mary Wilson, who loved these events and the spotlight and Mary used these events to help keep the legacy of the Supremes alive.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by milven View Post
    I am of the opinion that Diana did not show up at some of the events honoring the Supremes, such as the R&R Hall of Fame, so as to not take the spotlight away from Mary Wilson, who loved these events and the spotlight and Mary used these events to help keep the legacy of the Supremes alive.
    That is probably the biggest reason why Diana didn't show up to future Supremes events. But make no mistake about it, she skipped the RR induction because Dreamgirl was still a very relevant book and fresh in the minds of everybody, including Diana. She was not about to share the evening with Mary Wilson. Plus I think Diana had just had the second of two kids less than a year apart and I don't think she was doing much of anything at the time except focusing on that. But I wouldn't bet a dollar that Diana skipping the RR induction was about her being gracious. The star on the walk of fame, yes. Some other subsequent awards, uh huh. But not that one. Not so soon after Dreamgirl.

    As for her being "punished" for not showing up, doubtful. She's been invited back a couple times, including to induct the J5.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by milven View Post
    I am of the opinion that Diana did not show up at some of the events honoring the Supremes, such as the R&R Hall of Fame, so as to not take the spotlight away from Mary Wilson, who loved these events and the spotlight and Mary used these events to help keep the legacy of the Supremes alive.
    Would explain a lot since the Motown 25 fiasco...

  15. #15
    I could probably see Diana getting in just off from her singing for Billie at the 2000 induction. Remains to be seen. We'll see what happens with this year.

    Thanks for the replies.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    That is probably the biggest reason why Diana didn't show up to future Supremes events. But make no mistake about it, she skipped the RR induction because Dreamgirl was still a very relevant book and fresh in the minds of everybody, including Diana. She was not about to share the evening with Mary Wilson. Plus I think Diana had just had the second of two kids less than a year apart and I don't think she was doing much of anything at the time except focusing on that. But I wouldn't bet a dollar that Diana skipping the RR induction was about her being gracious. The star on the walk of fame, yes. Some other subsequent awards, uh huh. But not that one. Not so soon after Dreamgirl.

    As for her being "punished" for not showing up, doubtful. She's been invited back a couple times, including to induct the J5.
    not only "Dream Girl" - her image was also tarnished by "Call Her Miss Ross" & "All That Glittered" her quote on not attending The Supremes induction was - "What ? im just supposed to stand there and get slapped in the face ??" she didnt believe the depiction of events in the three books matched her memory of how things played out

  17. #17
    ...........and to all the Supremes especially Mary Wilson, I want to send my love. "2007 BET Lifetime Achievement awards"... I think Diana moved pass all the drama and none of us really know how these ladies truly loved each other.

  18. #18
    All that Glittered was pure fiction. That "story" didnt hurt Miss Ross or Miss Wilson. The fact that Tony Turner didnt have one photo of him and Flo in his book just prove to me that it was all fiction. Diana Ross didnt loose no sleep over Tony Turner.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    All that Glittered was pure fiction. That "story" didnt hurt Miss Ross or Miss Wilson. The fact that Tony Turner didnt have one photo of him and Flo in his book just prove to me that it was all fiction. Diana Ross didnt loose no sleep over Tony Turner.
    Roberta - many of us on this forum know the inaccuracies in turners writing I for one have challenged him in the past on factual errors..but sadly most people take what they read as gospel diana may have not been losing sleep over his book but she was upset over the damage to her brand all the mud slinging caused

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by nomis View Post
    not only "Dream Girl" - her image was also tarnished by "Call Her Miss Ross" & "All That Glittered" her quote on not attending The Supremes induction was - "What ? im just supposed to stand there and get slapped in the face ??" she didnt believe the depiction of events in the three books matched her memory of how things played out
    While CHMR was, apparently, not a PR picnic, it wasn't released until the year after the induction ceremony. Glittered was fan fiction and it didn't come out until 1990, I think. "Dreamgirl" was the book that caused what appeared to be irreparable damage to Diana and Mary's relationship and there was just no way Diana was going to play nice with Mary so soon after the release. I think it was the following year when Mary showed up to Diana's concert with Turkessa and a bunch of drama ensued. This thing was ugly for awhile there.

    I don't think the Supremes received another official honor until the Walk Of Fame star, which was months after Mary had lost her son. Diana bowed out in deference to Mary, which I think was mostly a gracious act, though it's possible that, while she may no longer have had much of an issue with Mary, Diana was still in a mind set of leaving the Supremes in the past. The group was Mary's baby at that point. Diana's baby was her own legendary career. Hard to fault her on that, though I still believe that any future main events that happen for the Supremes [[if ever again) that Diana step up.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by captainjames View Post
    ...........and to all the Supremes especially Mary Wilson, I want to send my love. "2007 BET Lifetime Achievement awards"... I think Diana moved pass all the drama and none of us really know how these ladies truly loved each other.
    That was 2007, not 1988. Time had passed and I'm assuming some wounds had healed. Plus, keeping it real, Diana was at the BET Awards. The Supremes are still revered trailblazers in the African American community, and Mary and Florence were as beloved as Diana, contrary to some beliefs. I definitely believe Diana was being sincere with her sentiment, but I don't believe for one moment she would've made the same speech at any other award ceremony. She's been honored a couple times since then and I don't recall any more declarations of love to her sister Supremes.

    That being said, I was so glad when someone [[can't remember who) in the wake of Mary's passing spoke about how he/she told Mary that they had tickets to see Diana that night but wanted to go backstage to see her. Mary texted Diana and the person was indeed gifted with the chance to meet Diana that night. So it shows they were in contact. That was comforting to me. I hated to have the lasting image of Mary telling everyone that she planned to go see Diana in concert and hopefully have a conversation with her, and then at that same event have Diana announce to an audience that she never stays in touch with Mary Wilson and that she could be in the audience for all she knew. I much prefer to think that they were at least exchanging texted pleasantries every now and again prior to Mary's passing.

  22. #22
    If I’m not mistaken, Diana made that comment at the BET awards because Mary had experienced a heart issue/heart attack [[can’t recall which) in the last year. So she was in her thoughts. It could have been any award show and she most likely would have said that.
    Last edited by khansperac; 03-17-2021 at 11:16 AM.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    That was 2007, not 1988. Time had passed and I'm assuming some wounds had healed. Plus, keeping it real, Diana was at the BET Awards. The Supremes are still revered trailblazers in the African American community, and Mary and Florence were as beloved as Diana, contrary to some beliefs. I definitely believe Diana was being sincere with her sentiment, but I don't believe for one moment she would've made the same speech at any other award ceremony. She's been honored a couple times since then and I don't recall any more declarations of love to her sister Supremes.

    That being said, I was so glad when someone [[can't remember who) in the wake of Mary's passing spoke about how he/she told Mary that they had tickets to see Diana that night but wanted to go backstage to see her. Mary texted Diana and the person was indeed gifted with the chance to meet Diana that night. So it shows they were in contact. That was comforting to me. I hated to have the lasting image of Mary telling everyone that she planned to go see Diana in concert and hopefully have a conversation with her, and then at that same event have Diana announce to an audience that she never stays in touch with Mary Wilson and that she could be in the audience for all she knew. I much prefer to think that they were at least exchanging texted pleasantries every now and again prior to Mary's passing.
    It's quite likely M&D kept in contact in the last years of Mary's life, much like Diana keeping in touch with Flo until her death, but we'll never truly know. Maybe after Diana passes, we'll get more insight.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by khansperac View Post
    If I’m not mistaken, Diana made that comment at the BET awards because Mary had experienced a heart issue/heart attack [[can’t recall which) in the last year. So she was in her thoughts. It could have been any award show and she most likely would have said that.
    I Agree 100%.... to be honest sometimes we as fans make more out od something that really isn't.

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