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  1. #1

    Love Hangover According to LaMonte McLemore of the 5th Dimension

    Hi Guys,
    I read tons of show biz memoirs, even when the star isn't somebody I'm all that interested in. I just love hearing their stories. Over the next few days I am going to start posting stories related to Motown artists that might come from odd places, stories you might have missed. Today is LaMonte Mclemore's version of events surrounding the 5th's version of Love Hangover. Hopefully this will clear up some of the confusion around who recorded what, when.
    LaMonte says that in 1976 he was desperately looking for a tight, danceable song for the post Marilyn and Billy group. He felt strongly that the group needed a funky dance hit to return the 5th to their hit making glory days. The 5th's last danceable recording was No Love in the Room in 1974--but LaMonte didn't like it and didn't feel that people would dance to it. He was right and NLITR tanked. Anyway when Marilyn and Billy left the 5th, LaMonte knew they had to get a hit fast. Somehow or another LaMonte came across Diana Ross's album that contained Love Hangover as (at the time) an album cut. Motown released I Thought it Took a Little Time as the lead single, while L brought the song Love Hangover to their manager Marc Gordon. Everybody concerned agreed this would be the record to be their big hit.

    Florence sang lead in a darkened studio, and the rest of the group added their flavors to the mix, and the song was released. LH started up the charts, including in the over seas markets and dance markets. Things looked great! Right then, LaMonte got an odd call from Gil Askey, who was on tour with Diana Ross in London. He said, with "shy if not sly amusement," that DR had heard their version of Love Hangover. When DR first heard LH on the radio, she thought it was her version. In fact, she told Gil "Good. I told Berry we should release that song as a single." She was all pleased with herself, until she realized "now wait a minute, that's not my F'ing SONG!!!" Diana got on the phone to Berry, demanded that I Thought It Took Time to Learn get yanked as a single, and demanded LH be issued instead. She said, according to LaMonte, "Whatever it takes, squash the 5th's version of Love Hangover!!"
    After that, the 5th's version of LH stopped getting played altogether, and DR's version stormed the charts!

  2. #2
    Next: DR confronts the 5th Dimension!

  3. #3
    Great tidbit! Thanks.

  4. #4
    No offense meant to a jr member, but we've heard many versions of this story many times before. Even if true it's really no different than countless other stories about competing versions of the same song. As Ralph has stated here before ... 'It's the record business, get over it'.

  5. #5
    Guy--sure thing. Anyway, DR was victorious. A short time later, LaMonte and Florence LaRue went to see Diana Ross' one woman show An Evening with Diana Ross. LaMonte said DR looked down, saw them in the audience, and stopped dead in her tracks!!! She made her lighting guy put a spotlight on Florence and laMonte, "as if we were in a police lineup" according to LaMonte, and then DR bellowed "THAT'S THE ENEMY!!!"

  6. #6
    This was normal protocol in the industry then. IIRC, Berry reacted similarly when another version of Come See About Me was out. Berry made a deal for radio deejays to drop the version played for the Supremes' and since they were now hot stuff, they yanked the version they had been playing and played the Supremes'. The rest is music history. The same happened with Love Hangover.

    Diana didn't wanna record disco music initially and only did so to please Hal Davis and Berry. We know the story how after a few drinks, she threw in adlibs and made impressions, first of a male blues singer and then of Billie Holiday. So she took part of the title seriously.

    Today, you can't hear Love Hangover and not think of Miss Ross' version.

  7. #7
    Midnight--I don't think most people even knew the 5th made a version of LH. Hey have you guys ever noticed how often the 5th, or various solo former members, have recorded Diana Ross songs? Songs shared by both DR and 5th Dimension members include Time and Love, Love Hangover, Surrender,I Thought It Took Some Time to Learn About Loving, etc. What's up with that? I know, back in the 80's and 90's, that Florence LaRue got a lot of flack for supposedly "trying to be Diana Ross." I know Florence was very annoyed by these comparisons way back when, but she did record several DR songs.

  8. #8
    Don't forget the other way :




    The LOVE HANGOVER saga is a most interesting story. Marc Gordon and Hal Davis go way back.
    That song was sort of a 'hail mary' attempt for survival at ABC for a fractured and lingering 5th D. No further recording project developed from it , and the song never made it onto an album.

  9. #9
    Hey Boogie--actually the "new" 5th recorded an album for ABC called Home Cookin'--it had the next single If That's The Way That You Want it on it as well as Love Hangover--but when LH sank, ABC gave up on the record and the group. They moved to Motown in search of a funkier, "blacker" sound in hopes they'd attract a bigger black audience. It didn't work. Pretty sad because Star Dancing was a great record.
    Anyway back to Home Cookin'. The tracks to that unreleased album eventually turned up on the mysterious 5th Dimension Live album that came out in the 90's. Nobody, including the 5th Dimension themselves, knew where this record came from or who was behind it--but it is HORRIBLE. The group wanted to stop it from being released but it cost too much money to track the details of who put it out. The CD was actually two albums in one, the Home Cookin' tracks, plus bizarre, mediocre live performances from the original group. You have never heard anything as painful as Marilyn McCoo trying to sing Aretha's Respect and Billy couldn't make Monday Monday work to save his life. Florence did a stellar version of How Insensitive, however, and Ron Townson did a fine job on Sundown. Other than that, the record is dismal beyond words. The material on Home Cookin' was mediocre as hell too.

  10. #10
    I hadn't heard of that unreleased LP Bobby! Isn't it odd how labels will sometimes decide an LP is less an expenditure if remained unreleased....you'd think it would be practically over the finish line by that point. ( what have you got to lose?)

    So here's what I find interesting ........if the Fifth Dimension 'stole' the song from a furious Diana Ross ..... how/why was it that Motown decided their response would then be to reward the thieves (the 'enemies') with a recording contract?
    Last edited by Boogiedown; 02-26-2020 at 02:57 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    I hadn't heard of that unreleased LP Bobby! Isn't it odd how labels will sometimes decide an LP is less an expenditure if remained unreleased....you'd think it would be practically over the finish line by that point. ( what have you got to lose?)

    So here's what I find interesting ........if the Fifth Dimension 'stole' the song from a furious Diana Ross ..... how/why was it that Motown decided their response would then be to reward the thieves (the 'enemies') with a recording contract?
    Good question. LOL!!!

  12. #12
    Yeah I have never gotten that whole not releasing a record if it's already been recorded, either. I know that sometimes it's for legal reasons, but that wasn't the case here as far as I know. Now Re:Motown and the 5th. There have been rumors. I'm not saying I believe them, but it's kind of interesting to speculate. The 5th's Manager, Marc Gordon, was old Motown and he knew the people there, including Berry. One rumor was that Marc helped Berry squash the 5th's version of LH in return for a recording deal. Is this far fetched? Yeah but it's possible. And by the way, the 5th didn't "steal" LH. The song was written by third parties so anybody could record it. The 5th liked what they heard, put their own spin on it, and released it. I don't even think there were any plans of releasing it on DR until the 5th recorded it. Fair game. IMO

  13. #13
    Oh dear, I think about 99% of Diana Ross fans know this story of the two 'Love Hangerover's' as it can be found on the internet, books, CD inserts etc. Motown only had themselves to blame as LH should have always been the lead single but Ross & Gordy had other ideas. Nobody 'stole' anything! It's first come first served in the music industry. I like both versions.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    And by the way, the 5th didn't "steal" LH. The song was written by third parties so anybody could record it. The 5th liked what they heard, put their own spin on it, and released it. I don't even think there were any plans of releasing it on DR until the 5th recorded it. Fair game. IMO
    I'm confused....Third parties???....
    Pam Sawyer & Marilyn McLeod were Motown song-writers and the song is a Jobete Music Publication;

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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by copley View Post
    Nobody 'stole' anything! .
    If it were all on the up and up , why did Diana consider them 'the enemy'?

    And the 5D sure rushed out their LOVEHANGOVER version ..... they knew they were up to something , I suspect!!

  16. #16
    Lucky all I meant was that Diana didn't write the song and neither did the 5th so it was fair game.

  17. #17
    Boogie--DR was always fiercely protective of her spot in the Motown Hierarchy, which was always #1. I would imagine she blamed Berry for "allowing" the 5th to record "her" song. Regardless, she considered pretty much everybody else as the competition which is why she didn't have any friends in the biz, besides Mary and Florence and Cindy.

  18. #18
    Does anyone know what date Jr Walker's version was recorded?

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    No offense meant to a jr member, but we've heard many versions of this story many times before. Even if true it's really no different than countless other stories about competing versions of the same song. As Ralph has stated here before ... 'It's the record business, get over it'.
    oh come on now. let the guy make a post about a topic he's interested in. no need for snarky comments

    and if we all held to the idea of not rehashing topics "many times before" the board would be totally silent.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Hi Guys,
    I read tons of show biz memoirs, even when the star isn't somebody I'm all that interested in. I just love hearing their stories. Over the next few days I am going to start posting stories related to Motown artists that might come from odd places, stories you might have missed. Today is LaMonte Mclemore's version of events surrounding the 5th's version of Love Hangover. Hopefully this will clear up some of the confusion around who recorded what, when.
    LaMonte says that in 1976 he was desperately looking for a tight, danceable song for the post Marilyn and Billy group. He felt strongly that the group needed a funky dance hit to return the 5th to their hit making glory days. The 5th's last danceable recording was No Love in the Room in 1974--but LaMonte didn't like it and didn't feel that people would dance to it. He was right and NLITR tanked. Anyway when Marilyn and Billy left the 5th, LaMonte knew they had to get a hit fast. Somehow or another LaMonte came across Diana Ross's album that contained Love Hangover as (at the time) an album cut. Motown released I Thought it Took a Little Time as the lead single, while L brought the song Love Hangover to their manager Marc Gordon. Everybody concerned agreed this would be the record to be their big hit.

    Florence sang lead in a darkened studio, and the rest of the group added their flavors to the mix, and the song was released. LH started up the charts, including in the over seas markets and dance markets. Things looked great! Right then, LaMonte got an odd call from Gil Askey, who was on tour with Diana Ross in London. He said, with "shy if not sly amusement," that DR had heard their version of Love Hangover. When DR first heard LH on the radio, she thought it was her version. In fact, she told Gil "Good. I told Berry we should release that song as a single." She was all pleased with herself, until she realized "now wait a minute, that's not my F'ing SONG!!!" Diana got on the phone to Berry, demanded that I Thought It Took Time to Learn get yanked as a single, and demanded LH be issued instead. She said, according to LaMonte, "Whatever it takes, squash the 5th's version of Love Hangover!!"
    After that, the 5th's version of LH stopped getting played altogether, and DR's version stormed the charts!
    this is the first i've heard about the Diana role in this and very interesting! always fun to compare these subtle differences in stories and history.

  21. #21
    Thanks for the backup, Sup. I have seen many threads on Love Hangover but never saw anything directly from a member of the 5th Dimension! From the horse's mouth, as they say. I was also trying to explain the 5th's reason for recording it in the first place. I don't see the problem. I don't know why people even open a thread if they aren't interested in the topic.

  22. #22
    To me they stole the song from Diana Ross. I know Diana Ross didnít write the song. But she did record it first for her brand new album. The 5th Dimension knew nothing of this song until they heard it on the new Diana Ross album. Seems shady to me.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    To me they stole the song from Diana Ross. I know Diana Ross didn’t write the song. But she did record it first for her brand new album. The 5th Dimension knew nothing of this song until they heard it on the new Diana Ross album. Seems shady to me.
    She may have recorded it first, but no one heard it but you and her. She had no legal rights to that song.

  24. #24
    Maybe Gloria Gaynor should attend every one of Diana's shows and 'bellow' "That's the enemy" every time she closes with 'I Will Survive'.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Yeah I have never gotten that whole not releasing a record if it's already been recorded, either. I know that sometimes it's for legal reasons, but that wasn't the case here as far as I know. Now Re:Motown and the 5th. There have been rumors. I'm not saying I believe them, but it's kind of interesting to speculate. The 5th's Manager, Marc Gordon, was old Motown and he knew the people there, including Berry. One rumor was that Marc helped Berry squash the 5th's version of LH in return for a recording deal. Is this far fetched? Yeah but it's possible. And by the way, the 5th didn't "steal" LH. The song was written by third parties so anybody could record it. The 5th liked what they heard, put their own spin on it, and released it. I don't even think there were any plans of releasing it on DR until the 5th recorded it. Fair game. IMO
    That is a rumor about Marc Gordon helping to squash the 5ths version of Love Hangover. His wife was the gorgeous Florence LaRue who was singing lead on the 5th's version. So I doubt it.

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Levi Stubbs Tears View Post
    Maybe Gloria Gaynor should attend every one of Diana's shows and 'bellow' "That's the enemy" every time she closes with 'I Will Survive'.
    BAM! Exactly!

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    She may have recorded it first, but no one heard it but you and her. She had no legal rights to that song.
    Well apparently they heard it too! Please read before you comment. I said I know she didnít write the song. My point is donít go complaining about something when it doesnít work out. They clearly knew this was a song on the new Diana Ross album.
    Last edited by vgalindo; 02-26-2020 at 07:42 PM.

  28. #28
    The Fifth Dimension ~ Love Hangover 1976 Disco Purrfection Version


  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Levi Stubbs Tears View Post
    Maybe Gloria Gaynor should attend every one of Diana's shows and 'bellow' "That's the enemy" every time she closes with 'I Will Survive'.
    Why? Diana Ross never stole this song from Gloria. She did a cover of it after Gloria had the big hit. Big difference!
    By the way they seem to not have a problem!

    https://youtu.be/huwEcfXuzRI
    Last edited by vgalindo; 02-26-2020 at 07:33 PM.

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    To me they stole the song from Diana Ross. I know Diana Ross didn’t write the song. But she did record it first for her brand new album. The 5th Dimension knew nothing of this song until they heard it on the new Diana Ross album. Seems shady to me.
    For this, I thank you. Common sense, right?? And, if one really chooses to make a value judgement these many decades later, should we not celebrate once again the foresight and determinism of one Diana Ross for her career acumen in releasing her superior version of LH at this critical point in time? MUST I lecture here about Sun Tzu and The Art of War? I think not.

  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    For this, I thank you. Common sense, right?? And, if one really chooses to make a value judgement these many decades later, should we not celebrate once again the foresight and determinism of one Diana Ross for her career acumen in releasing her superior version of LH at this critical point in time? MUST I lecture here about Sun Tzu and The Art of War? I think not.
    Exactly. I was at my local record shop at the time of the release of both versions. At this shop they would actually play the records for you. And people were choosing to buy the Diana Ross version over the 5th Dimensions.

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    Well apparently they heard it too! Please read before you comment. I said I know she didn’t write the song. My point is don’t go complaining about something when it doesn’t work out. You clearly knew this was a song on the new Diana Ross album.
    Please bite me! Look nobody cares that Diana Ross was mad. She's still mad that no one but Mr. Gordy ever cared. That record was not a masterpiece. She only got paid based on a small percentage of units sold. The songwriters are the ones that made the real money. I didn't clearly know shit at the time. I was in high school and not buying "Diana Ross" albums.
    Last edited by marv2; 02-26-2020 at 09:42 PM.

  33. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Please bite me! Look nobody cares that Diana Ross was mad. She's still made that no one but Mr. Gordy ever cared. That record was not a masterpiece. She only got paid based on a small percentage of units sold. The songwriters are the ones that made the real money.I didn't clearly know shit at the time. I was in high school and not buying "Diana Ross" albums.
    Well this was a #1 solo record that superstar Diana Ross had. Iím sorry your idol Mary Wilson has never had that honor. Donít take it out on Diana Ross.
    And by the way. I didnít mean you knew of the song. I meant they clearly knew of the song on the new Diana Ross album. So they shouldnít be complaining that they didnít get the hit.
    Last edited by vgalindo; 02-26-2020 at 07:40 PM.

  34. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    Well this was a #1 solo record that superstar Diana Ross had. I’m sorry your idol Mary Wilson has never had that honor. Don’t take it out on Diana Ross.
    And by the way. I didn’t mean you knew of the song. I meant they clearly knew of the song on the new Diana Ross album. So they shouldn’t be complaining that they didn’t get the hit.
    Yes, another #1 solo hit for Diana Ross, who, in the year 2020, is embarking on yet another sold-out international tour! The 5th D, though I did love them ... not so much. 'It's the record business; get over it'!

  35. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    For this, I thank you. Common sense, right?? And, if one really chooses to make a value judgement these many decades later, should we not celebrate once again the foresight and determinism of one Diana Ross for her career acumen in releasing her superior version of LH at this critical point in time? MUST I lecture here about Sun Tzu and The Art of War? I think not.
    If she is so determined, then why has her career been in the toilet for the last 20-25 years. It sounds like to me that she was never anything more than a product of Motown that Berry Gordy created and then concocted a "plausible" myth around her to try to make the public believe that she was extraordinarily talented and special when that is the furthest thing from the truth!

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    She may have recorded it first, but no one heard it but you and her. She had no legal rights to that song.
    Wow. Thank you. Sometimes patience pays off. In the original thread about this, you said that you heard a dee-jay copy of the 5th Deminsions version in the fall of 1975, months before DIana's version was completed and released. It is nice to see you finally admit that Diana recorded it first.

    https://soulfuldetroit.com/showthrea...+5th+dimension

    But you are right that Diana has no legal right to the song. . She can not stop anyone from recording it. The song is not hers

  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    Why? Diana Ross never stole this song from Gloria. She did a cover of it after Gloria had the big hit. Big difference!
    By the way they seem to not have a problem!

    https://youtu.be/huwEcfXuzRI
    I was there that night and in shock when she introduced Gloria. She is a Newark resident. Beautiful moment. Diana did a cover of Gloria's hit. She did not "steal" it. Gloria's version will never be eclipsed.


  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by milven View Post
    Wow. Thank you. Sometimes patience pays off. In the original thread about this, you said that you heard a dee-jay copy of the 5th Deminsions version in the fall of 1975, months before DIana's version was completed and released. It is nice to see you finally admit that Diana recorded it first.

    https://soulfuldetroit.com/showthrea...+5th+dimension

    But you are right that Diana has no legal right to the song. . She can not stop anyone from recording it. The song is not hers
    So true Milven. Lol. And that was the point I was trying to make. She did not write the song so she canít stop anyone from recording it. But the 5th Dimension knew what they were doing.

  39. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Midnight--I don't think most people even knew the 5th made a version of LH. Hey have you guys ever noticed how often the 5th, or various solo former members, have recorded Diana Ross songs? Songs shared by both DR and 5th Dimension members include Time and Love, Love Hangover, Surrender,I Thought It Took Some Time to Learn About Loving, etc. What's up with that? I know, back in the 80's and 90's, that Florence LaRue got a lot of flack for supposedly "trying to be Diana Ross." I know Florence was very annoyed by these comparisons way back when, but she did record several DR songs.
    I've definitely noticed. Very ironic.

  40. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by copley View Post
    Oh dear, I think about 99% of Diana Ross fans know this story of the two 'Love Hangerover's' as it can be found on the internet, books, CD inserts etc. Motown only had themselves to blame as LH should have always been the lead single but Ross & Gordy had other ideas. Nobody 'stole' anything! It's first come first served in the music industry. I like both versions.
    I don't know what Gordy had in mind but I know DIANA didn't wanna venture into disco cause she didn't wanna be part of a fad (and she was far from the only soul oriented artist to have that opinion) and yet not only did LH become a smash but it reinvented her as a disco diva and added another dimension to her career.

    Imagine if she didn't take that route to disco.

  41. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by milven View Post
    I was there that night and in shock when she introduced Gloria. She is a Newark resident. Beautiful moment. Diana did a cover of Gloria's hit. She did not "steal" it. Gloria's version will never be eclipsed.

    I was there as well and it was a wonderful performance by two legendary ladies who shared a song. The sane among us understand.

  42. #42
    We should really revisit the Great Love Hangover Controversy more frequently. So what if nothing new gets said? 8-10 times a year is just not enough for such an important subject. Hehehe. I wonder if the song is popular in, say, Slovakia?

  43. #43
    Just because she didn't write the lyrics as printed on the song doesn't mean she wasn't creative. Those extra adlibs once the song went from a sultry soul/quiet storm ballad to a disco/funk vamp were not from its writers. I know that for a fact.

    Diana gave the song its definition. Even hearing it now in its alternate version, I get chills and the background singers are WORKING IT!


  44. #44
    ... and of course those of us who REALLY know a thing or two about soul/r&b will remember that Gloria Gaynor began her career by ... hehehe ... 'stealing' Never Can Say Goodbye and Reach Out (I'll Be There) hehehehe!

  45. #45
    lol! only Diana Ross would invite the true owner of a song she's hijacked up on stage to perform it some only to then leave Gloria standing there to clap her hands for three minutes while she has the back-up take over!
    Last edited by Boogiedown; 02-26-2020 at 09:31 PM.

  46. #46
    Lol well she didn't expect Miss Thing to bring her onstage.

  47. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    lol! only Diana Ross would invite the true owner of a song she's hijacked up on stage to perform it some only to then leave Gloria standing there to clap her hands for three minutes while her back up takes over!
    She is a real piece of work.

  48. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Just because she didn't write the lyrics as printed on the song doesn't mean she wasn't creative. Those extra adlibs once the song went from a sultry soul/quiet storm ballad to a disco/funk vamp were not from its writers. I know that for a fact.

    Diana gave the song its definition. Even hearing it now in its alternate version, I get chills and the background singers are WORKING IT!

    Those "creative" ad-libs came from being almost completely drunk off of Vodka!

    "Published on Apr 4, 2013
    How did this version come about? Well, Diana and Motown were not enthusiastic about disco, thinking it was a passing fad. The focus was to turn her into the black Barbra Streisand and this song did not fit into the plans. She had to be coaxed into recording it with vodka and ended up doing a damn good job! The song was added to her 1976 LP "Diana Ross" probably to give it more texture and show off her versatility. In any case, it was not considered for single release. Then the members of the Fifth Dimension who had recently lost Marilyn McCoo and Billy Davis Jr picked up on the buzz coming from the clubs got over Diana's album track. They went into the studio and recorded their version with the idea that they would fill the need for a single. Florence LaRue handled the lead vocals here. When Motown got wind of that news, they rush released Diana's song and both versions debuted the same week. Everyone knows that Diana reached #1 and the Fifth Dimension, well, it peaked at #80. They never recovered and never had another pop hit. The only way to get the disco version is on the promotional 7" single, and that took me some doing to get my paws on a clean copy on vinyl to digitize. So give it a listen. Back in da day, clubs played both versions to change it up."

    -DJDiscoCatV2

  49. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Boogie--DR was always fiercely protective of her spot in the Motown Hierarchy, which was always #1. I would imagine she blamed Berry for "allowing" the 5th to record "her" song. Regardless, she considered pretty much everybody else as the competition which is why she didn't have any friends in the biz, besides Mary and Florence and Cindy.
    Strange, because hardly anyone saw her as competition. Most artists knew Diana had the 100% of Berry Gordy, which meant Motown. Diana Ross didn't have any friends in the business because she was very nasty to people and also, very self-centered. She was even a friend to the other Supremes.

  50. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by copley View Post
    Oh dear, I think about 99% of Diana Ross fans know this story of the two 'Love Hangerover's' as it can be found on the internet, books, CD inserts etc. Motown only had themselves to blame as LH should have always been the lead single but Ross & Gordy had other ideas. Nobody 'stole' anything! It's first come first served in the music industry. I like both versions.
    I heard the 5th Dimension's version before Diane's.

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