Motown putting the lead singers name out front.

[stephanie]

We all know that when the names changed to Martha Reeves and the Vandellas, Smokey Robinson and the Miracles, Diana Ross and the Supremes that we have been told it was because Motown could sell the group and a lead singer and get more money. Here is my question to the forum:

If I am a concert hall and have had these groups before when they were The Miracles, Martha and the Vandellas, and the Supremes why would I pay more because a lead singers name is upfront? Please no arguments but I have heard they did it because they were changing the Supremes name and did the other ones so it would not seem so obvious one old Motown alumni told me this. Now two Motown alumni have told me that they did do it to make more money. If this is the case did they sell them to new venues or old venues. It really makes no sense to me if I owned a concert hall I wouldnt want to pay more money just because Smokey, Diana or Martha and her last name is up front. Can someone explain how they sold this or is is true it was a cover up because of the Supremes thing. I have always been fascinated as to how he made more money doing this [[Berry).

[miss_lish]

That always sounded like a bunch of PR mumbo jumbo to me. Wasn't it always Martha and the Vandellas though?

[captainjames]

I am racking my brain trying to remember when the Miracles became Smokey Robinson and The Miracles. I think Smokey was put out front before Diana but I need to check.

[stephanie]

I woke up and checked this thread to see if there were any answers and Captain you are right according to what I have read the Smokey change did come first. So I guess that rules him out as part of the plan. However anytime Smokey and Diana address this question they do give the reason as Berry being able to get more money. Assuming this is the true version Im wondering how did Berry get more money from this business decision?

[miss_lish]

From Berry's own mouth, he said he could book them as two separate acts: the headliner, and the group. You should read Berry's book, Stephanie.

[topdiva1]

We all know that when the names changed to Martha Reeves and the Vandellas, Smokey Robinson and the Miracles, Diana Ross and the Supremes that we have been told it was because Motown could sell the group and a lead singer and get more money. Here is my question to the forum:

If I am a concert hall and have had these groups before when they were The Miracles, Martha and the Vandellas, and the Supremes why would I pay more because a lead singers name is upfront? Please no arguments but I have heard they did it because they were changing the Supremes name and did the other ones so it would not seem so obvious one old Motown alumni told me this. Now two Motown alumni have told me that they did do it to make more money. If this is the case did they sell them to new venues or old venues. It really makes no sense to me if I owned a concert hall I wouldnt want to pay more money just because Smokey, Diana or Martha and her last name is up front. Can someone explain how they sold this or is is true it was a cover up because of the Supremes thing. I have always been fascinated as to how he made more money doing this [[Berry).

Perhaps it was a little of both.

[luke]

I always thought it was just a BS reason Berry thought of to change name. The members-at least with the Supremes got paid the same. It doesnt make sense. The Supremes were the number one group in the US as the Supremes and commanded their fees as such. David Ruffin denied the billing though they could make more money?? Martha's last name was added-I doubt that increased their fees!lol

[marv2]

I always thought it was just a BS reason Berry thought of to change name. The members-at least with the Supremes got paid the same. It doesnt make sense. The Supremes were the number one group in the US as the Supremes and commanded their fees as such. David Ruffin denied the billing though they could make more money?? Martha's last name was added-I doubt that increased their fees!lol

Very good points Luke! If anything, by changing the names of already well known groups, it added cost to Motown in terms of "rebranding", printing, etc, etc.

[topdiva1]

Although it could of been a little of both - I feel the general public hardly noticed the other changes out side of The Supremes name change.

[arrr&bee]

I understand putting diana out in front because berry was gonna take her out of the group anyhow,but with the miracles and the vandellas it made no sense,because we always called them-smokey and the miracles..martha and the vandellas!

[captainjames]

Honestly, I thought it was done so Motown could focus on single projects and still remain the unit or group. An example would be television shows which didn't require a group part but maybe a skit required only one individual or if he wanted a duet on a song. This was good for marketing reasons in his eye. An example would be [[and I am just guessing) like Martha and Dusty singing a duet without the Vandellas whereas [[eventhough Dusty requested it) it would make no sense for Diana to do it without Mary and Flo.

At one time it was discussed to have single album projects and still remain the lead in the group but that never really happen.

and just because the pot was divided 3 ways [[at least in the case of the Supremes), don't think for a moment that Motown was not charging higher rates to have their stars appear. It just meant Motown may have got a little extra.

[detmotownguy]

Wow Stephanie, good question. I wonder if there was an accounting benefit for tax purposes; but if that was true, would all the of groups gone that way. Interesting the Tempts or Four Tops never did! Was it done to satiate egos of the designated lead performers or to aid in the departure of the group for thier solo careers?

[jobeterob]

There are so many myths about Motown and I thought this was one of them; I guess though if Berry said it, I should reassess my thinking and read what he said again.

What makes sense is that it singled out a member who was the "main man" and who was getting a lot of attention; it paved the way for them to leave and THEN split the two so that Motown made more money.

I suppose it is possible that the concert fee payable to Diana Ross and the Supremes would be somewhat higher than The Supremes.