No Vandellas solos at all?

[marv2]

LOL, Motown did NOT promote the Supremes until it was factual that Mary Wells had left the company. Rock N Roll albums did not sell well [[besides Elvis, Ricky Nelson ect) until 1964 and the Beatles. 45's were KING and the backbone of the Rock/Soul Music Business. Ask anybody that worked at Motown in early 60's, Diana Ross wanted to be Mary Wells.Next to Mary, Martha was the best female singer they had. An like Mary Wells, Martha Reeves ALWAYS [[at Motown) knew how to work a stage and had great rappor & charisma all before Mrs. Powell came on board.

That is true. Martha learned from watching Della Reese. She even sounded like Della with her stage patter back in the early days of the Motortown Revue.

[midnightman]

Motown had been promoting the Supremes since they signed to the label in 1961. Mary Wells leaving or staying wasn't going to have any bearing on them reaching their destiny. The public heard "Where Did Our Love Go", loved it and the rest is history. They were destined to be stars, just like the Temptations, and Gordy knew it, that's why he kept both groups on the roster despite years worth of records that didn't knock the public out.

They were the first all female group signed to Motown so it was obvious they were trying hard to get a hit out of them before finally striking gold at the end of 1963 [[but the same can be said of ALL the acts they signed). When did Motown hire Cholly Atkins and Maxine Powell? 1964, right? By that point, the Marvelettes, Mary Wells and Martha and the Vandellas were already popular.

[marv2]

I agree here. Martha is great on record, vocally great live, but watching her perform she just didn't have the performance personality. Personally I don't think Mary Wells had it either, but vocally there was something there that Gordy thought could help him reach the other side. Diana, Brenda, Wanda, Gladys K, I think this is where he should have placed his bets.

Mary Wells would burn up a stage. My parents and aunts use to go see her:

[midnightman]

When I saw the Motown 40 documentary, they said Mary & the Marvelettes were "too rock and roll" for what they were trying to achieve [[I know a few Marvelettes talked about how when they took the stage, they used to "sweat it up" and there were photos that showed it).

But I love that clip of Mary performing Bye Bye Baby, she was one hell of a performer.

[marv2]

They were the first all female group signed to Motown so it was obvious they were trying hard to get a hit out of them before finally striking gold at the end of 1963 [[but the same can be said of ALL the acts they signed). When did Motown hire Cholly Atkins and Maxine Powell? 1964, right? By that point, the Marvelettes, Mary Wells and Martha and the Vandellas were already popular.

Also keep in mind that the revenue acts like the Miracles, Marvelette and Mary Wells allowed Motown to establish Artist Development. Those early acts like the Contours had to make up their own stage acts from scratch!

[marv2]

Mary Wells was the total package at that time. This is from after she left Motown:

[marv2]

They were singing LIVE!

[midnightman]

Also keep in mind that the revenue acts like the Miracles, Marvelette and Mary Wells allowed Motown to establish Artist Development. Those early acts like the Contours had to make up their own stage acts from scratch!

That IS true! I didn't even think of it. Marvin too. Those four were the early big stars of Motown [[funny how their names all started with "M").

The Contours were the only Motown act to do what James Brown and 'em were doing. Berry didn't want that lmao [[that used to bother James lol)

[marv2]

That IS true! I didn't even think of it. Marvin too. Those four were the early big stars of Motown [[funny how their names all started with "M").

The Contours were the only Motown act to do what James Brown and 'em were doing. Berry didn't want that lmao [[that used to bother James lol)

Those acts were the ones making money for Motown allowing to "groom" their future acts with Artist Development training,etc . The Contours did come off rough but all of them were rough [[in more ways than you could imagine LOL!). So when people compare them to acts like the Supremes later on, just know that the Supremes were also rough on stage in the beginning.

[midnightman]

Yeah, all of them were "diamonds in the rough" as Maxine called them.

[marv2]

Yeah, all of them were "diamonds in the rough" as Maxine called them.

She was right. I miss her and Mrs. Esther Gordy Edwards a lot! Mrs. Edwards was like a grandmother to me. The sweetest lady ever!

[reese]

How was she picked? I don't have her book so that's why I ask.

In an interview with A TOUCH OF CLASSIC SOUL, Betty said she was called to a meeting by Berry Gordy's secretary. When she arrived, Martha and Rosalind were sitting outside his office. When she spoke with Berry, it hit her that she was going to be pulled out of the Velevelettes and put into the Vandellas for a trial. She talked it over with Velvelette Cal Gill, who encouraged her to go for it. Betty went on to address the rumor that she was chosen to replace Annette because they looked alike by saying that they didn't but she thought Berry was looking for a similar skin tone and height, so that the change wouldn't be noticed too much.

In her book, Martha tells a totally different story. She wrote that the Velvelettes had broken up and Betty let her overhear her telling someone else that she was no longer in in the group. As Annette was leaving, Martha asked would she consider being a Vandella, and Betty responded that she didn't know, as she was considering going back to Kalamazoo because of her living conditions. Martha offered to let Betty stay at her house until she made enough money to get her own place. Betty thought it over and joined the group.

[RanRan79]

Mary Wells would burn up a stage. My parents and aunts use to go see her:

You're right. I haven't seen this in so long. Forgot all about it. I can definitely see why Gordy put his eggs in her basket.

[RanRan79]

They were singing LIVE!

Again, they sound great, but no surprise that Gordy didn't bet the farm on Martha.

[midnightman]

In an interview with A TOUCH OF CLASSIC SOUL, Betty said she was called to a meeting by Berry Gordy's secretary. When she arrived, Martha and Rosalind were sitting outside his office. When she spoke with Berry, it hit her that she was going to be pulled out of the Velevelettes and put into the Vandellas for a trial. She talked it over with Velvelette Cal Gill, who encouraged her to go for it. Betty went on to address the rumor that she was chosen to replace Annette because they looked alike by saying that they didn't but she thought Berry was looking for a similar skin tone and height, so that the change wouldn't be noticed too much.

In her book, Martha tells a totally different story. She wrote that the Velvelettes had broken up and Betty let her overhear her telling someone else that she was no longer in in the group. As Annette was leaving, Martha asked would she consider being a Vandella, and Betty responded that she didn't know, as she was considering going back to Kalamazoo because of her living conditions. Martha offered to let Betty stay at her house until she made enough money to get her own place. Betty thought it over and joined the group.

Thanks.

Martha & Betty have VERY different stories!

[TheMotownManiac]

LOL, Motown did NOT promote the Supremes until it was factual that Mary Wells had left the company. Rock N Roll albums did not sell well [[besides Elvis, Ricky Nelson ect) until 1964 and the Beatles. 45's were KING and the backbone of the Rock/Soul Music Business. Ask anybody that worked at Motown in early 60's, Diana Ross wanted to be Mary Wells.Next to Mary, Martha was the best female singer they had. An like Mary Wells, Martha Reeves ALWAYS [[at Motown) knew how to work a stage and had great rappor & charisma all before Mrs. Powell came on board.

I think Motown was always promoting them because he knew she had something. They had a lot of records that did nothing, but he kept on. And let’s face it, WDOLG wasn’t even #1 yet before he flew them home to record follow ups. Baby Love hadn’t hit yet and they already were doing Liverpool.

‘’Actually, Motown had two successful albums in 1963. Released in May, Stevie went to #1, released in early January, Queen Mary to #49. By fall of ‘63, I think Heat Wave should have done better and, it turns out, it was an indication of the general appeal of Marthas voice because she’d never have a hit studio album - despite hit singles on them. Watch Out! Was a big disappointment with two top tens at the height of their popularity. The following fall, their live album was a bomb, outsold even by Jr Walker.

As for Marthas stage abilities, it’s all opinion. Please send me a link to one engaging performance on tv before Mike Douglas in 69. I love Martha, and prefer her to Mary, but she didn’t have it to go big and many tried.