The Brexit Votes Have it: The U.K. Is Leaving The E.U.

[robb_k]

The £ has fallen, so I probably won't be buying many new imports. More seriously, food prices are likely to go sky high as we import so much.

I remember we used to have continual problems with our Balance of Payments, but this wasn't so important when we were in Europe. With the erosion of our manufacturing base, I can't see invisible exports being enough for us to pay our way.

I don't know how far the stock market is going to fall, but at the moment there must be a great increase in the massive deficits that there are in pension funds. Everybody's pensions could be in jeopardy.

An additional problem is that our legal system is inextricably entwined with Europe now. After 40 years of Europe, I don't know how many generations it will take to disentangle them. I suspect lawyers will do well out of this.

As far as Scotland is concerned, their independence referendum took place under the premise that the UK would remain a member of the EU. The Scots have every right to demand a new referendum, and there is little doubt in my mind that this time it would be successful, thus precipitating the breakup of the United Kingdom. England alone would have a permanent Conservative majority, and one-party rule is not good for any democracy.

So honest man, be afraid. Be very afraid.

Exactly! Scotland, Northern Ireland, Wales and The isle of Man
will all ask for referenda, and ALL vote for independence, and all summarily join The EU. UK never wanted to join, proving it, by never joining The Euro. They let Germany, The Netherlands, Belgium and France pay to incorporate the poorer countries into the money system. Sweden and Denmark did the same. How can you have an effective economic union with multiple money systems?

I work for Disney in The Netherlands, Denmark, Sweden and Germany. I live and work in The Netherlands, Germany and Denmark. I get paid in Euros in The Netherlands and Germany, and arranged it so that The Danes and Swedes also pay me in Euros, because that is more convenient. But, then I must change money when living in Denmark and working there and in Sweden. I always lose money on those exchanges. We should have one single money system. I also travel in Norway and UK, and resent having to change money in those places.

The whole point of The EU was to make a large enough economic block to compete with USA, and avoid all the tariffs and high prices, and to allow people to move more freely, and have better work opportunities. Now, I'm afraid that The Scandinavian countries may follow England's lead, fearing that their countries will be swamped with refugees sneaking in from nearby EU countries.

[roger]

Exactly! Scotland, Northern Ireland, Wales and The isle of Man
will all ask for referenda, and ALL vote for independence, and all summarily join The EU.

You can't have studied the results of the referendum in much detail Robb, and I would suggest that you do so by looking at the BBC website results page ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/e...rendum/results

You may be proved correct with Scotland, but in Northern Ireland the voting seemed to reflect the old Catholic/Nationalist versus Protestant/Unionist divide, with heavily Protestant areas voting "Leave" and heavily Catholic areas voting "Remain" ... I don't have exact figures but it looks to me like Catholics/Nationalists voted around 80/20 for "Remain" and Protestants/Unionists voted around 60/40 for "Leave".

Wales voted to Leave by about the same figure as The U.K. as a whole. The Isle of Man is not part of The UK and neither is it in The EU, exactly the same is the case for The Channel Islands [[Jersey and Guernsey), which you omitted to mention.

UK never wanted to join, proving it, by never joining The Euro. They let Germany, The Netherlands, Belgium and France pay to incorporate the poorer countries into the money system. Sweden and Denmark did the same. How can you have an effective economic union with multiple money systems?

Well, when we joined in 1973 it was sold to the British public as joining a "Trading Area" and the idea that it would turn into some kind of uniform federal super-state was kept quiet, though at the time that idea did have some appeal to me.

Your enthusiasm for a single currency throughout The EU is something that I've not heard in The UK since 2009 [[though I've not had a serious conversation with any Liberal-Democrats about the issue recently). It may all sound very noble and good-intentioned but the simple truth is that in order for it to work the currency has to be used in places with broadly similar economies and cultures, within The Eurozone this is simply not the case which has led to immense strains on The Euro. Basically Greece, Spain and Portugal are in dire-straits, Italy, France, Ireland and Cyprus are struggling and even Finland is having problems.

Also, currently The UK pays much more into The EU than it gets back, so I don't understand why you think that we have not been paying to "incorporate the poorer countries into the money system". Needless to say if/when we leave the other countries that pay more into The EU than they receive back [[notably Germany and The Netherlands) will have to pick up the bill unless they too leave.

I work for Disney in The Netherlands, Denmark, Sweden and Germany. I live and work in The Netherlands, Germany and Denmark. I get paid in Euros in The Netherlands and Germany, and arranged it so that The Danes and Swedes also pay me in Euros, because that is more convenient. But, then I must change money when living in Denmark and working there and in Sweden. I always lose money on those exchanges. We should have one single money system. I also travel in Norway and UK, and resent having to change money in those places.

This reminds me of the sort of thing we were told was a good reason to join The Euro in The UK back in the late 1990s. We were told of a hypothetical British tourist driving through Europe on his way to holiday in Italy or Greece who changed his money each time he crossed a border, changing his Pounds for French Franks as he entered France, then into Belgian Franks as he entered Belgium, then into Dutch Guilders, German Marks etc. etc. Needless to say by the time he arrived at his destination he had little left, as he would lose 5% each time on currency exchange charges. Needless to say this is an argument that I've not heard in a while.

The whole point of The EU was to make a large enough economic block to compete with USA, and avoid all the tariffs and high prices, and to allow people to move more freely, and have better work opportunities. Now, I'm afraid that The Scandinavian countries may follow England's lead, fearing that their countries will be swamped with refugees sneaking in from nearby EU countries.

Which is part of the issue, strange though it may seem a large number of people in The UK actually like The Americans and have an inherent distrust of some of our neighbours on The Continent. As a result they are very wary of anything designed to "take on The Americans". I did used to be very "Pro-Europe" in the 1970s and 1980s, but the way they have imposed The Euro on countries which were clearly unsuited to it has managed to kill off any enthusiasm I used to have.

Roger

[Spiritinthesky]

One good thing that has come out of all this is a lot of young people are now more aware of British politics and all the crap that goes with it. So that has to be a good thing. The UK needs a young voice.

[StuBass1]

One good thing that has come out of all this is a lot of young people are now more aware of British politics and all the crap that goes with it. So that has to be a good thing. The UK needs a young voice.

Wasn't it Winston Churchill who said..."Show me a young conservative, and I'll show you a person with no heart...Show me an old liberal, and I'll show you a person with no brain"... lol