The Brexit Votes Have it: The U.K. Is Leaving The E.U.

[heikki]

Hi!

My main concern is the failure in communication, in giving correct information. That enables all those populist parties to spread disinformation and for some reason the press and media are not able - or in many cases - not even willing to correct it.

E.G. in legislation EU only has a limited authority. It can give directives in customs union matters, but as a rule not in such fields as national health care, industry, culture, tourism, education etc. And all those directives are not made up in Brussels. They're initiated in a correspondent ministry of a member country, statements are asked from every other member country and finally they hold a vote on that suggestion in each parliament. It's only a very limited part of legislation concerning members of the EU that is passed in Brussels.

Also, the amount of money and personnel [[so called bureaucrats) are vastly exaggerated. The EU budget is about 1 % of the total GNP of all EU countries.

During these past 20 years Finland has benefitted a lot from EU and Euro. As a country dependent to a degree on export free trade is important for us. True, we've have economic difficulties lately due to our internal problems but mostly to sanctions against Russia [[which is our neighboring country and a big partner in trade - this has affected us most) - but now there are positive signs and according to the latest information the rise could be anything from 1-2 %. Not much, but it's plus, not minus.

I also wonder where do all those "Fixit" rumors come from. According to the recent poll, only about 25 % of our population wants a Fixit referendum. The rest are satisfied with the EU at the moment.

As I said, I see that the main problem lies in disinformation and failure of all the EU offices in correcting all the untrue information, which feeds populists, who are in it only for personal power - not common well-being.

I'm sorry for all the mistakes and non-fluent language. I'm in a bit of a hurry at this precise moment, but I'm one happy EU citizen.

Best regards
Heikki

[StuBass1]

Hi!

My main concern is the failure in communication, in giving correct information. That enables all those populist parties to spread disinformation and for some reason the press and media are not able - or in many cases - not even willing to correct it.

E.G. in legislation EU only has a limited authority. It can give directives in customs union matters, but as a rule not in such fields as national health care, industry, culture, tourism, education etc. And all those directives are not made up in Brussels. They're initiated in a correspondent ministry of a member country, statements are asked from every other member country and finally they hold a vote on that suggestion in each parliament. It's only a very limited part of legislation concerning members of the EU that is passed in Brussels.

Also, the amount of money and personnel [[so called bureaucrats) are vastly exaggerated. The EU budget is about 1 % of the total GNP of all EU countries.

During these past 20 years Finland has benefitted a lot from EU and Euro. As a country dependent to a degree on export free trade is important for us. True, we've have economic difficulties lately due to our internal problems but mostly to sanctions against Russia [[which is our neighboring country and a big partner in trade - this has affected us most) - but now there are positive signs and according to the latest information the rise could be anything from 1-2 %. Not much, but it's plus, not minus.

I also wonder where do all those "Fixit" rumors come from. According to the recent poll, only about 25 % of our population wants a Fixit referendum. The rest are satisfied with the EU at the moment.

As I said, I see that the main problem lies in disinformation and failure of all the EU offices in correcting all the untrue information, which feeds populists, who are in it only for personal power - not common well-being.

I'm sorry for all the mistakes and non-fluent language. I'm in a bit of a hurry at this precise moment, but I'm one happy EU citizen.

Best regards
Heikki

Hello Heikki my good friend...I can appreciate your appreciation for the EU, in that you admit that the EU has been good for FInland...That to me is the crux of the problem...The receiving countries of course are happy with what the EU provides...but the paying countries with the highest GDP's and lowest unemployment rates [[Germany, France, the UK, and Italy alone pay 60% of all EU contributions) who contribute the most are going to be the ones who question the viability of remaining with the EU in it's current set-up...I do hesitate to throw Germany into the exit mix since I believe that Chancellor Merkel considers herself to be the "darling" of the EU, although she is becoming more and more unpopular within her borders, but Germany does exert undue influence in all EU decisions leaving smaller countries at a distinct disadvantage...That said...the EU wields tremendous influence into the inner workings of member countries through it's myriad of councils which pass laws and directives which may take effect automatically including significant actions to restrict and limit imports from other member states, The Maastricht Treaty which covers areas like immigration, justice, common security, is nothing but a joke as the immigration crisis of today, and even going back to the Balkan crisis of the 90's where the EU stood by impotently with events in it's own backyard while NATO had to come in to resolve the situation...I doubt RUssia has aims on Finland at this time [[other than perhaps some old WW ll Paybacks), but as other countries become inundated with refugees, you see from my previous post that Germany is now considering what had been the unconsiderable...admission of Turkey to the EU...Actually, most of the statistics I've seen clearly state that the EU is responsible for over 59% of the economic, political, and judicial affairs of it's member countries...So like anything else...this political organization works well for some...not so well for others, except also like other organizations, the ones it's not working so well for happen to be the major funders of it, and their populations and citizenry are beginnnng to stand up and ask why???...

I feel I must throw in this disclaimer at this point as to what may seem to some [[me being an American) as my excessive interest in this entire Brexit topic and it's complications...Prior to a few weeks ago, I knew that The UK was involved in some sort of action regarding it's membership in the EU [[which I new little about) and that was about it...Two and a half months ago...quite fortunately and quite by accident through a CT scan for one somewhat minor but painful problem [[torn rotator cuff), it was found that I had two growths on my right lung...Further testing done right away showed that it was most likely lung cancer and within a few weeks I was at the great cancer center, City of Hope in Duarte, California with a terrific surgeon who performed robotic surgery and tested the growths and one of them was cancerous...He proceeded to perform a surgical procedure to remove both growths and the areas around them...I had a very difficult recovery which ended me back in the hospital with a two very serious infections...so what should have bee a 5 day deal turned into three weeks, plus daily visits from a nurse upon returning home for a month of antibiotic infusions...Follwing all that, I took brief vacation for relaxation and to just clear my head...During ALL that time, and hearing of the so called Brexit issue, I found it interesting enough to spend a lot of time researching the issue, even as I lay poolside in Indian Wells and responded to some Facebook postings on the topic, mostly from anti Brexit people LOL...So I became fairly well versed in many of the issues surrounding this topic, although that does not necessarily make my conclusions or opinions right or wrong and my basic political instincts certainly play a role in this as well, although I always try to look at a topic from all sides,,,All that said...I am happy to report that as of today...two months after my surgical procedure...I am 100% cancer free from my stage 1 diagnosis, including all the lmph nodes and margins that were biopsied from the surgery. I have a bit less lung to breathe with, but it's getting pretty close to normal at this point with fortunately no further treatment needed, so I'm preparing to return to my normal activities, rather than sit around looking at Facebood, Soulful Detroit,,and all other websites as I return to civilian life...but for those who wondered about my apparent fascination and time consuming research with this topic...it just happened to be there at a time I was exposing myself to the current events of the day as my old profession of "newsman" came to the fore...LOL

[theboyfromxtown]

Hello Heikki my good friend...I can appreciate your appreciation for the EU, in that you admit that the EU has been good for FInland...That t me is the crux of the problem...The receiving countries of course are happy with what the EU provides...but the paying countries with the highest GDP's and lowest unemployment rates [[Germany, France, the UK, and Italy alone pay 60% of all EU contributions) who contribute the most are going to be the ones question the viability of remaining with the EU in it's current set-up...I do hesitate to throw Germany into the exit mix since I believe that Chancellor Merkel considers herself to be the "darling" of the EU, although she is becoming more and more unpopular within her borders, but Germany does exert undue influence in all EU decisions leaving smaller countries at a distinct disadvantage...That said...the EU wields tremendous influence into the inner workings of member countries through it's myriad of councils which pass laws and directives which may take effect automatically including significant actions to restrict and limit imports from other member states, The Maastricht Treaty which covers areas like immigration, justice, common security, is nothing but a joke as the immigration crisis of today, and even going back to the Balkan crisis of the 90's where the EY stood by impotently with events in it's own backyard while NATO had to come in to resolve the situation...I doubt RUssia has aims on Finland at this time [[other than perhaps some old WW ll Paybacks), but as other countries become inundated with refugees, you see from my previous post that Germany is now considering what had been the unconsiderable...admission of Turkey to the EU...Actually, most of the statistics I've seen clearly state that the EU is responsible for over 59% of the economic, political, and judicial affairs of it's member countries...So like anything else...this political organization works well for some...not so well for others, except also like other organizations, the ones it's not working so well for happen to be the major funders of it, and their populations and citizenry are beginnnng to stand up and ask why???...

And for that 59%....here are MP's BOTH from Cameron's Tory party, one [[Andrea in blue) is from England who voted overwhelming to LEAVE and the other [[Ruth in red) is from Scotland who voted REMAIN.

It's no wonder folk get confused when even the people from the same party give out differing information.
.

[StuBass1]

And for that 59%....here are MP's BOTH from Cameron's Tory party, one [[Andrea in blue) is from England who voted overwhelming to LEAVE and the other [[Ruth in red) is from Scotland who voted REMAIN.

It's no wonder folk get confused when even the people from the same party give out differing information.
.

It obvious the Scottish "shouter" was working under the concept that figures lie and liars figure...She used the previous ONE year where she claims that only four laws affecting the UK were passed at the EU the previous year...So freaking what? What about the HUNDREDS of laws passed in the decades past and the treaties going back over 40 years that affect the everyday lives of the citizens of EU countries...What a ridiculous and totally falsified argument this lady put forth...

[roger]

Hi!

My main concern is the failure in communication, in giving correct information. That enables all those populist parties to spread disinformation and for some reason the press and media are not able - or in many cases - not even willing to correct it.

E.G. in legislation EU only has a limited authority. It can give directives in customs union matters, but as a rule not in such fields as national health care, industry, culture, tourism, education etc. And all those directives are not made up in Brussels. They're initiated in a correspondent ministry of a member country, statements are asked from every other member country and finally they hold a vote on that suggestion in each parliament. It's only a very limited part of legislation concerning members of the EU that is passed in Brussels.

Best regards
Heikki

Hi Heikki ..

I think that our "Remain" campaign would disagree with you on your assertation that "industry" is generally unaffected by EU Directives! One of the main reasons given for "remaining" was that if we were outside of The EU and then had a relationship with our former partners similar to that currently between The EU and Norway, or The EU and Switzerland, then we would have to abide by EU regulations concerning industry but would have no say in their formulation. It seems like we had nothing to worry about after all and that all of those people who were scared into voting "Remain" could have voted "Leave" after all.

Also, the way that you describe EU directives evolving seems to be far away from my understanding of how they occur. Perhaps the best place for you to look to prevent "failure in communication giving incorrect information" is The EU's own website.

According to The EU's own website the European Commission issues binding "Directives", "Regulations" and "Decisions" and non-binding "Recommendations" and "Opinions" ....

http://europa.eu/eu-law/decision-mak...s/index_en.htm

If you delve around on The EU's website you will find out that it is The Commission alone which is responsible for drawing up proposals for new legislation ....

http://europa.eu/about-eu/institutio...n/index_en.htm

These proposals are certainly not drawn up by the corresponding ministries in the Member States, they are initiated because The European Commission itself thinks that there is a need to legislate. The European Commission is appointed every 5 years [[in a manner "simply" explained in the link I've posted above) by a President who is appointed by "The Council Of Ministers" [[in practice during a meeting involving the leaders of the member states), The members of The European Commission are chosen from nominees put forward by the member states, and will typically be retired senior politicians.

The European Parliament then looks at the various regulations and directives sent down to them by The European Commission as is explained here ....

http://europa.eu/about-eu/institutio...t/index_en.htm

Essentially [[from a British perspective) The European Parliament has a role similar to ur House of Lords in that they can debate and [[in extreme cases) refuse to pass the legislation but they have no powers to amend it.

"Regulations" go straight into law immediately within the member states. "Directives" are expected to go into law within the member states after having been scrutinised by The Parliaments of the individual member states and some degree of leeway for amendment is allowed. "Decisions" are instructions to a specific Government or other body within The EU to instigate a particular rule.

Roger