Frankie Valli

**brother_love** · 08-31-2015, 08:15 PM

I was wondering if anyone knows who's on background vocals on the Frankie Valli MoWest tracks "Love Isn't Here [[Like It Use To Be)" and "Poor Fool"? These were recorded in 1972 at same time that the Blackberries and Sisters Love were signed to the same label. I wonder if it was either of these groups?

**brother_love** · 08-31-2015, 08:16 PM

**StuBass1** · 08-31-2015, 08:23 PM

I do know that as great a performer as Frankie was, and as great a company as Motown was, the pairing of those two was a huge mistake for both parties...

**soulster** · 08-31-2015, 08:58 PM

Just for accuracy, his last name does not have an "e" on the end.

**Bluebrock** · 09-01-2015, 07:12 AM

Originally Posted by soulster

Just for accuracy, his last name does not have an "e" on the end.

With or without the "e" the man is a living legend.

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-01-2015, 09:21 AM

Brother_love, to answer your question about the back-up vocals, I've always assumed it was The Blackberries, since they were Motown's West-Coast version of The Andantes.

StuBass1, pairing Motown with Frankie Valli may have proven a commercial failure, but I've always thought it was an artistic success. Between The Four Seasons' "Chameleon" album and Frankie's solo "Inside You" album, I thought they recorded a number of high quality tracks. My favorite will always be "Love Isn't Here Like It Used To Be". Beautiful song, outstanding performance. Should have been a huge commercial hit. I think it was a mistake for Motown to release "Walk On [[Don't Look Back)" as the first single. It sounded too old, like they were doing just what the record's title said NOT to do -- DON'T look back! They were relying upon their sound from nearly 10 years earlier to recapture their fame. The single was a dud -- dead on arrival. Something newer and fresher sounding might very well have changed Frankie Valli and The Four Seasons' merger with Motown into a rousing commercial success.

**Bluebrock** · 09-01-2015, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

Brother_love, to answer your question about the back-up vocals, I've always assumed it was The Blackberries, since they were Motown's West-Coast version of The Andantes.

StuBass1, pairing Motown with Frankie Valli may have proven a commercial failure, but I've always thought it was an artistic success. Between The Four Seasons' "Chameleon" album and Frankie's solo "Inside You" album, I thought they recorded a number of high quality tracks. My favorite will always be "Love Isn't Here Like It Used To Be". Beautiful song, outstanding performance. Should have been a huge commercial hit. I think it was a mistake for Motown to release "Walk On [[Don't Look Back)" as the first single. It sounded too old, like they were doing just what the record's title said NOT to do -- DON'T look back! They were relying upon their sound from nearly 10 years earlier to recapture their fame. The single was a dud -- dead on arrival. Something newer and fresher sounding might very well have changed Frankie Valli and The Four Seasons' merger with Motown into a rousing commercial success.

I agree that these albums were hugely underrated and in "love isn't here like it used to be" there was a hit single waiting to happen that somehow didn't. "the night" hit big here in the UK but nowhere else that I recall. Now excuse whilst whilst I listen to the music again....

**mysterysinger** · 09-01-2015, 01:44 PM

My vote would go to The Blackberries. I did read somewhere that Diana Ross could have been on backing vocals [[probably on the sleeve notes for a Motown The History CD). That was a whole separate discussion though in which the general consensus found it unlikely....http://soulfuldetroit.com/archive/in...p/t-10982.html

Frankie et al have given us some incredibly good music over the years and, personally, I would rank "Love Isn't Here" up there among the very best of their recordings.

**StuBass1** · 09-01-2015, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

Brother_love, to answer your question about the back-up vocals, I've always assumed it was The Blackberries, since they were Motown's West-Coast version of The Andantes.

StuBass1, pairing Motown with Frankie Valli may have proven a commercial failure, but I've always thought it was an artistic success. Between The Four Seasons' "Chameleon" album and Frankie's solo "Inside You" album, I thought they recorded a number of high quality tracks. My favorite will always be "Love Isn't Here Like It Used To Be". Beautiful song, outstanding performance. Should have been a huge commercial hit. I think it was a mistake for Motown to release "Walk On [[Don't Look Back)" as the first single. It sounded too old, like they were doing just what the record's title said NOT to do -- DON'T look back! They were relying upon their sound from nearly 10 years earlier to recapture their fame. The single was a dud -- dead on arrival. Something newer and fresher sounding might very well have changed Frankie Valli and The Four Seasons' merger with Motown into a rousing commercial success.

You've stated every reason in your post giving credence to my analysis MG [[lol)...The projects were a commercial failure, whether the wrong songs were cut, released, or were just out of date...at the discretion of the artist, the company, or both. Artistic success???...That's strictly in the eyes of the beholder and not enough "beholders" agreed with you on that. And it's not like Motown didn't have the money, staff, or industry contacts to expose the material to their audience...if they ever even figured out just who that audience was supposed to be...

**kenneth** · 09-01-2015, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Artistic success???...That's strictly in the eyes of the beholder and not enough "beholders" agreed with you on that.

Yes, I think that's what he means when he says "I've always thought [it was an artistic success]." And whether or not other "beholders" agree with him is not the point. It's an opinion.

**StuBass1** · 09-01-2015, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by kenneth

Yes, I think that's what he means when he says "I've always thought [it was an artistic success]." And whether or not other "beholders" agree with him is not the point. It's an opinion.

Once you use the word "success", you must have some standard or point of reference to base that on...The tracks were" artistically pleasing to my ear" would be an opinion...The tracks were an artistic "success" ???...Based on what???...What sort of new artistic ground was broken? Did Frankie hit notes never hit before? Is that "opinion" based on the fact that more than the usual amount of high fives were passed around after the producers first listened to the finished product with Mr Gordy???Must have some standard other than someone counted off 1-2-3-4, Frankie sang accompanied by some musicians, and the song faded out does not measure success, artistically or otherwise...BTW...several years ago, Frankie would come to my job through a mutual friend fairly often and I would speak with him on those visits. He knew that I was involved with promoting some projects I was doing for The Funk Brothers. He never once even mentioned or brought up the fact that he had recorded with Motown. Johnny Rivers on the other hand touted his Motown affiliation [[through Motown songs he had recorded) the one and only time I met and spent some time with him...And in the film Jersey Boys, I don't recall even one reference to Frankie's Motown affiliation...and Frankie was responsible for everything that appeared on the screen...Apparently, Frankie didn't see the "artistic success" in his Motown work that others might have...All that said...Gary is certainly entitled to his opinion on the material, regardless if some others like it as much or not..

**kenneth** · 09-01-2015, 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Once you use the word "success", you must have some standard or point of reference to base that on...The tracks were" artistically pleasing to my ear" would be an opinion...The tracks were an artistic "success" ???...Based on what???...What sort of new artistic ground was broken? Did Frankie hit notes never hit before? Is that "opinion" based on the fact that more than the usual amount of high fives were passed around after the producers first listened to the finished product with Mr Gordy???Must have some standard other than someone counted off 1-2-3-4, Frankie sang accompanied by some musicians, and the song faded out does not measure success, artistically or otherwise...BTW...several years ago, Frankie would come to my job through a mutual friend fairly often and I would speak with him on those visits. He knew that I was involved with promoting some projects I was doing for The Funk Brothers. He never once even mentioned or brought up the fact that he had recorded with Motown. Johnny Rivers on the other hand touted his Motown affiliation [[through Motown songs he had recorded) the one and only time I met and spent some time with him...And in the film Jersey Boys, I don't recall even one reference to Frankie's Motown affiliation...and Frankie was responsible for everything that appeared on the screen...Apparently, Frankie didn't see the "artistic success" in his Motown work that others might have...All that said...Gary is certainly entitled to his opinion on the material, regardless if some others like it as much or not..

How fortunate that you can tell us what we should like and what we shouldn't! Not sure how I got along all this time without you!

Or maybe the whole point was just to boast about your association with Valli so we'd all be suitably impressed. I'd be more impressed if you were respectful of others' opinions.

**StuBass1** · 09-02-2015, 12:06 AM

Well now you've got ME wondering how you got along all this time without me...LOL...at least so far as reading comprehension is concerned

...Where was I not respectful of anyone's opinion other than in your diluted imagination???...As I clearly stated...Gary, who's opinion I admittedly respect is certainly entitled to HIS opinion, and if he believes that Frankie's Motown recordings are the greatest projects to ever come out of Motown...that's his opinion which I certainly can't question his right to hold that belief...What I questioned was his [[and perhaps your) statement that Frankie Valli's Motown work was an "ARTISTIC SUCCESS"...and asked, by what measure? Once again...Did it lead to a long and critically acclaimed association with Motown? Did it receive critical acclaim from an artistic perspective from recognized music critics? Despite Frankie's unmitigated success as a result of the whole Jersey Boys phenomenon, is there any significant demand for his Motown era recordings? Did Frankie himself ever refer to his Motown work as an artistic success???...The Answer to all those questions is NO...So Gary's appreciation of that material is his OPINION, and as I stated, he is certainly entitled to it, and his taste in music or musical productions is no more or less valid than my own...You just need to take a refresher course in "objectivity 101", and if that fails...just take a chill pill...

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 12:23 AM

To StuBass1 And Your First Batch Of Comments:

You've stated every reason in your post giving credence to my analysis MG [[lol)...

Congratulations, SB! You've managed to twist everything I said out of proportion to fit your agenda -- whatever that may be. [[LOL!)

The projects were a commercial failure, whether the wrong songs were cut, released, or were just out of date...at the discretion of the artist, the company, or both.

And I agreed with that. They WERE a commercial failure.

Artistic success???...That's strictly in the eyes of the beholder

With the exception of the first single released [[which wasn't bad; it just seemed a poor choice to me), Frankie and Motown's music together WAS an artistic success in the eyes [[ears) of THIS particular beholder -- ME! As I stated, "I've always thought" that they recorded a number of high quality Motown tracks. That's my opinon and I'm stickin' to it.

and not enough "beholders" agreed with you on that.

How do you know how many "beholders" agreed or disagreed with me on that? I happen to know a lot of Motown fans who still enjoy the music of Frankie and Motown. [[Just take a look at the other posters in this thread alone.) You're the only one who, without stating that it was your personal opinion, made a general statement about it being an overall "mistake" as though what you said is gospel and and that's all that matters, regardless of the rest of us who may or may NOT agree with you. I wasn't attacking you anyway; I was merely defending the music of Frankie and Motown.

And it's not like Motown didn't have the money, staff, or industry contacts to expose the material to their audience...if they ever even figured out just who that audience was supposed to be...

I shouldn't have to point this out as it's common Motown knowledge, but.... Motown was so wrapped up in its move to Detroit and making Diana's "Lady Sings The Blues" a hit movie, nearly all of the releases on the MoWest label suffered due to lack of proper promotion and exposure, regardless of the quality of the recorded material. If not enough "beholders" in John Q. Public agreed with me, it was probably because, other than the Motown fans, no one was aware that Frankie's Motown recordings even existed. I never heard any of it getting any airplay, although I thought it rightly deserved to be heard.

**StuBass1** · 09-02-2015, 12:48 AM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

To StuBass1 And Your First Batch Of Comments:

You've stated every reason in your post giving credence to my analysis MG [[lol)...

Congratulations, SB! You've managed to twist everything I said out of proportion to fit your agenda -- whatever that may be. [[LOL!)

The projects were a commercial failure, whether the wrong songs were cut, released, or were just out of date...at the discretion of the artist, the company, or both.

And I agreed with that. They WERE a commercial failure.

Artistic success???...That's strictly in the eyes of the beholder

With the exception of the first single released [[which wasn't bad; it just seemed a poor choice to me), Frankie and Motown's music together WAS an artistic success in the eyes [[ears) of THIS particular beholder -- ME! As I stated, "I've always thought" that they recorded a number of high quality Motown tracks. That's my opinon and I'm stickin' to it.

and not enough "beholders" agreed with you on that.

How do you know how many "beholders" agreed or disagreed with me on that? I happen to know a lot of Motown fans who enjoy the music of Frankie and Motown. [[Just take a look at the other posters in this thread alone.) You're the only one who made an overall negative and general statement about it being an overall "mistake" as though what you said is gospel and and that's all that matters, regardless of the rest of us who may or may NOT agree with you.

And it's not like Motown didn't have the money, staff, or industry contacts to expose the material to their audience...if they ever even figured out just who that audience was supposed to be...

I shouldn't have to point this out as it's common Motown knowledge, but.... Motown was so wrapped up in its move to Detroit and making Diana's "Lady Sings The Blues" a hit movie, nearly all of the releases on the MoWest label suffered due to lack of proper promotion and exposure, regardless of the quality of the recorded material. If not enough "beholders" in John Q. Public agreed with me, it was probably because, other than the Motown fans, no one was aware that Frankie's Motown recordings even existed. I never heard any of it getting any airplay, although I thought it rightly deserved to be heard.

Hey Gary...I do appreciate your sincere and respectful response to my assertions...agree with me or not...For the sake of dialogue on this topic, and to continue a respectful discourse, I'd still take issue with your responses in the following way...

We both agree, as do sales figures that the projects were commercial failures...Fair enough...

Your appreciation of some of the material does not make the project an "artistic success"...only an expression of your individual taste, which I can certainly appreciate, yet based on no objective measurement in a wider appreciation which could be based only on "commercial success"...or like some projects which were deemed an "artistic success' years after their initial release, critically acclaimed in a wider sense by recognized critics at some point in history. None of this happened with these recordings, and in the context of the overwhelming success of Jersey Boys, you'd think there would have been a huge demand for ANY previous widely unheard material as has happened with Brian Wilson since the release of his film Love & Mercy and a renewed interest in any and all things Brian Wilson these days...

I can only judge the number of other "beholders" by how many others paid their money to hear those records or attended their performances during what Frankie has stated was a particularly "dry" and unproductive period for the group...and recognized ratings such as Billboard or other recognized standards of objective measurement...You suggest I look at the number of "beholders" on this thread to support your contention...I count 3...Don't let Frankie's ex-wife hear about them, or she may have to go back to court to amend her multi-million dollar divorce settlement...[[lol)

I don't believe for a New York minute that Berry Gordy signed Frankie and/or The Four Seasons on a "whim"...They were one of the hottest groups out there in the 60's, and I'm sure he considered it a coup to get them on his label...It was just a really bad match as I previously stated...Having a headlining white group [[even bigger than Rare Earth) with their reputation and cache would have greatly enhanced Motown's image in the industry...It just didn't happen...Berry didn't have the type of writers or producers to do justice to Frankie's style IMO...

And quite frankly, when you state that "other than Motown fans, nobody knew Frankie's Motown recordings ever existed...I'll go you one better and state that it's likely that the vast majority of Motown fans never knew that Frankie's Motown recordings existed either...They were that forgettable IMO...

All that said, I appreciate a respectful dialogue on this or any topic...whether we agree or disagree...We are all certainly entitled to our opinions based on whatever knowledge and insight we may have...

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 01:00 AM

More Justification To StuBass1's Remarks Regarding My Liking Frankie Valli's Motown Material:

The tracks were" artistically pleasing to my ear" would be an opinion...

If you'll take the time to go back and re-read my original comments with an open, non-paranoid mind, I said "I've always thought" it was an artistic success, and "I thought" they recorded a number of high quality tracks. Hence, "I thought" is the same as "in my opinion" and "to my ears"...

Once you use the word "success", you must have some standard or point of reference to base that on...

I do indeed have a standard AND a point of reference to base my opinion on -- and that standard is my personal musical taste! I think that Frankie Valli as well as the Four Seasons made some highly infectious music with Motown as well as some beautiful ballads.

The tracks were an artistic "success" ???...Based on what???...

Again, based on my opinion and my personal musical taste. That is allowed, is it not?

What sort of new artistic ground was broken? Did Frankie hit notes never hit before?I

I don't give a rat's ass how much new artistic ground was broken, nor do I care how many stratospheric notes Frankie was able to hit. I wasn't looking for any ground-breaking new style, nor was I expecting Frankie [[nor any Motown artist, for that matter) to reinvent the wheel -- musically nor otherwise. Their Motown music appealed to me as well as to others, and, to some of us, it was not a total "mistake". That's all I was sayin'.

Is that "opinion" based on the fact that more than the usual amount of high fives were passed around after the producers first listened to the finished product with Mr Gordy???Must have some standard other than someone counted off 1-2-3-4, Frankie sang accompanied by some musicians, and the song faded out does not measure success, artistically or otherwise.

Now you're just being obnoxious and grabbing at straws.

BTW...several years ago, Frankie would come to my job through a mutual friend fairly often and I would speak with him on those visits. He knew that I was involved with promoting some projects I was doing for The Funk Brothers. He never once even mentioned or brought up the fact that he had recorded with Motown. Johnny Rivers on the other hand touted his Motown affiliation [[through Motown songs he had recorded) the one and only time I met and spent some time with him...And in the film Jersey Boys, I don't recall even one reference to Frankie's Motown affiliation...and Frankie was responsible for everything that appeared on the screen...Apparently, Frankie didn't see the "artistic success" in his Motown work that others might have

Motown's not being mentioned in the Jersey Boys was possibly because there was no commercial success to report on, or it may have very well been edited out due to time constraints. Who knows? Frankie and the guys did wonderful performances on several of those tracks. I'm sure that he was proud of his work at the time, and was probably devastated that it went nowhere on the charts nor in sales. That doesn't mean that he considers his fine work a "mistake".

All that said...Gary is certainly entitled to his opinion on the material, regardless if some others like it as much or not..[

And you, StuBass, are certainly entitled to your opinion as well. But there's no need to attack me and get so damned bent outa shape just because my opinion didn't happen to match yours -- especially when your accusations were totally false. I was speaking for myself, and no one else.

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 01:08 AM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Hey Gary...I do appreciate your sincere and respectful response to my assertions...agree with me or not...For the sake of dialogue on this topic, and to continue a respectful discourse, I'd still take issue with your responses in the following way...

We both agree, as do sales figures that the projects were commercial failures...Fair enough...

All that said, I appreciate a respectful dialogue on this or any topic...whether we agree or disagree...We are all certainly entitled to our opinions based on whatever knowledge and insight we may have...

Yes, Sir. I'll give you that!

**StuBass1** · 09-02-2015, 01:16 AM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

Yes, Sir. I'll give you that!

Then we can let it rest there...I'm sure that upon close scrutiny...we've both made our points

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 01:20 AM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Well now you've got ME wondering how you got along all this time without me...LOL...at least so far as reading comprehension is concerned

...Where was I not respectful of anyone's opinion other than in your diluted imagination???...As I clearly stated...Gary, who's opinion I admittedly respect is certainly entitled to HIS opinion, and if he believes that Frankie's Motown recordings are the greatest projects to ever come out of Motown...that's his opinion which I certainly can't question his right to hold that belief...What I questioned was his [[and perhaps your) statement that Frankie Valli's Motown work was an "ARTISTIC SUCCESS"...and asked, by what measure? Once again...Did it lead to a long and critically acclaimed association with Motown? Did it receive critical acclaim from an artistic perspective from recognized music critics? Despite Frankie's unmitigated success as a result of the whole Jersey Boys phenomenon, is there any significant demand for his Motown era recordings? Did Frankie himself ever refer to his Motown work as an artistic success???...The Answer to all those questions is NO...So Gary's appreciation of that material is his OPINION, and as I stated, he is certainly entitled to it, and his taste in music or musical productions is no more or less valid than my own...You just need to take a refresher course in "objectivity 101", and if that fails...just take a chill pill...

StuBass, leave Kenny alone. He was just defending me because of the way you were attacking me. And there you go again....I never said that Frankie's Motown projects were the best thing to ever come out of Motown. You're jumping to conclusions and putting words in my mouth again!

**StuBass1** · 09-02-2015, 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Then we can let it rest there...I'm sure that upon close scrutiny...we've both made our points

I thought we were letting this rest???...That said...I fail to understand how a simple disagreement with your assertion claiming some sort of "artistic success" on the recordings in question was in any way, shape, or form, ATTTACKING you???...Nor do I understand why you need anyone to defend you big guy...You appear able to express yourself quite well, whether it makes sense to me or not...I had long forgotten these recordings and hardly remembered them, giving me nothing to get "bent out of shape" about...You're the one who seems upset they failed to win a Grammy

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

I thought we were letting this rest???...That said...I fail to understand how a simple disagreement with your assertion claiming some sort of "artistic success" on the recordings in question was in any way, shape, or form, ATTTACKING you???...Nor do I understand why you need anyone to defend you big guy...You appear able to express yourself quite well, whether it makes sense to me or ..

No, Sir, YOU said we'd let it rest, not I. Every time I get ready to log off, there's another remark that I have to address. I didn't mind at all that you disagred with me; it was the way you went about it. [[Re-read my dissected comments if necessary. I'm not going through THAT again!) And, finally, heck, no -- I don't need anybody to defend me. But it sure is nice! Thanks, Kenny!

**StuBass1** · 09-02-2015, 01:55 AM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

No, Sir, YOU said we'd let it rest, not I. Every time I get teady to log off, there's another remark that I have to address. I didn't mind at all that you disagred with me; it was the way you went about it. [[Re-read my dissected comments if necessary. I'm not going through THAT again!) And, finally, heck, no -- I don't need anybody to defend me. But it sure is nice! Thanks, Kenny!

Yeah...Thanks Kenny

**kenneth** · 09-02-2015, 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by StuBass1

Yeah...Thanks Kenny

I rarely get involved in these kinds of arguments on the SDF. I think it's your pompous tone which got to me as if you are the arbiter of good taste and must instruct everyone as to the proper way to judge whether music is artistic or not. Really?

I don't need a "chill pill." I think I just need to put you on "ignore."

**Bluebrock** · 09-02-2015, 05:30 AM

Come on guys. Let's move on. This subject has become very tedious for everyone.
It's time to change the record pardon the pun.

**kenneth** · 09-02-2015, 08:36 AM

@Bluebrock - agreed.

**luke** · 09-02-2015, 09:48 AM

I found much of the above a refreshing discussion of artistic vs commercial success. Somehow it got derailed but I appreciate a lot of what was being expressed..made me think. I have often found here a certain rubber stamping of the greatness of the music of every Motown artist. On the other hand didn't it take hundreds of years for some works of art to be deemed masterpieces?

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by Bluebrock

Come on guys. Let's move on. This subject has become very tedious for everyone.
It's time to change the record pardon the pun.

Sorry, Bluebrock, and anyone else who may have found it tedious -- I hate it, too, and I had much better ways to spend my evening, believe me. But when someone is dissecting your opinion on everything you say in an arrogant tone and turning it into a bunch of misquotes and inaccuracies, you've gotta stand up for yourself.

**mysterysinger** · 09-02-2015, 12:51 PM

This is just my opinion but I would put "Love Isn't Here" among my favourite all time Motown tracks.

Also, personally, I wouldn't class the Four Seasons time at Motown as without success. When they were "dropped" by Motown they were recording tracks for 2 albums - an offer was made that they could buy the recordings for release elsewhere but they only bought one of these - "My Eyes Adored You". When released by Private Stock it reached number 1 and was Billboard's number 5 song for the whole of 1975. That's not bad - and I'm sure Motown wouldn't have complained about the receipt of royalties since it was Jobete published.

Furthermore, "December 63 [[Oh What A Night)" was also a Jobete publication. Hardly a lack of success.

It should also be remembered that Frankie Valli had a further album released by Universal Motown in 2007. His "Romancing The 60s" album included "My Cherie Amour", "My Girl" and "What Becomes Of The Brokenhearted".

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by mysterysinger

This is just my opinion but I would put "Love Isn't Here" among my favourite all time Motown tracks.

Also, personally, I wouldn't class the Four Seasons time at Motown as without success. When they were "dropped" by Motown they were recording tracks for 2 albums - an offer was made that they could buy the recordings for release elsewhere but they only bought one of these - "My Eyes Adored You". When released by Private Stock it reached number 1 and was Billboard's number 5 song for the whole of 1975. That's not bad - and I'm sure Motown wouldn't have complained about the receipt of royalties since it was Jobete published.

Furthermore, "December 63 [[Oh What A Night)" was also a Jobete publication. Hardly a lack of success.

It should also be remembered that Frankie Valli had a further album released by Universal Motown in 2007. His "Romancing The 60s" album included "My Cherie Amour", "My Girl" and "What Becomes Of The Brokenhearted".

Yeah, me, too, mysterysinger. "Love Isn't Here......" is among my all-time favorite Motown recordings. In my ever-so-humble opinion, that record is perfect from start to finish. The arrangement and the production are top-notch, sounding current and hip yet sweet as can be. Frankie's vocals never sounded better, and the back-up girls play their parts beautifully. The strings are perfect, and the melody is gorgeous -- especially on the chorus repeated throughout. And that moment near the end where the chorus changes key STILL gives me goosebumps and fireworks after all these years! Motown's magic was in full swing. In fact, if I were making a CD compilation of "Motown's Prettiest", Frankie's "Love Isn't Here....." would be right up there with the best of them -- "You're All I Need To Get By", "What Becomes Of The Brokenhearted", "I Guess I'll Miss The Man", etc.

**marybrewster** · 09-02-2015, 01:27 PM

Some may find this of interest:

http://www.seasonally.co.uk/News52pd...ogyReviews.pdf

**mysterysinger** · 09-02-2015, 01:29 PM

Unfortunately the group had a number of personnel problems at that time and Bob Crewe, as well as Frankie himself had been ill. However, things were starting to get back on track and I suspect would have brought some big success to Motown.

**kenneth** · 09-02-2015, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by marybrewster

Some may find this of interest:

http://www.seasonally.co.uk/News52pd...ogyReviews.pdf

Wow, great article! Thanks, marybrewster! Definitely should reawaken some readers to these great tracks.

**144man** · 09-02-2015, 02:34 PM

I saw Frankie Valli & the Four Seasons at the London Palladium in 1972. The advert on the back of the programme is for the new single, "You're A Song [[That I Can't Sing)" and for the forthcoming album "Chameleon". When during the course of the act Frankie Valli announced that the group were signed to Motown, much to my surprise the audience booed, so maybe the association was never meant to be.

With the exception of Tom Clay, no single by a Mowest artist was a hit, so there's a case for laying the blame fairly and squarely on the company's promotional department and choice of releases, especially as some of the tracks were in my opinion strong enough to have charted. I am particularly fond of Frankie Valli's take on Brenda Holloway's "Just Look What You've Done".

honest man · 09-02-2015, 03:53 PM

For this one song alone the joining of Frankie Valli and four seasons and motown was worth it,everything else The Night etc were extra bonus love the combination.cheers .TAKE A LISTEN Beautiful. https://youtu.be/TRPclV6X6t8

**Philles/Motown Gary** · 09-02-2015, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by 144man

I saw Frankie Valli & the Four Seasons at the London Palladium in 1972. The advert on the back of the programme is for the new single, "You're A Song [[That I Can't Sing)" and for the forthcoming album "Chameleon". When during the course of the act Frankie Valli announced that the group were signed to Motown, much to my surprise the audience booed, so maybe the association was never meant to be.

With the exception of Tom Clay, no single by a Mowest artist was a hit, so there's a case for laying the blame fairly and squarely on the company's promotional department and choice of releases, especially as some of the tracks were in my opinion strong enough to have charted. I am particularly fond of Frankie Valli's take on Brenda Holloway's "Just Look What You've Done".

Man, what a rude and inconsiderate audience! It's almost the equivalent of heckling. Musically speaking, Motown has always been highly regarded as a positive, major music force in its own right. I wonder what prompted such a negative audience response. Poor Frankie. I'm sure he was proud to announce his newfound association with Motown. How did he handle that uncomfortable moment of public humiliation? Did he say anything in response?

**Bluebrock** · 09-03-2015, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

Sorry, Bluebrock, and anyone else who may have found it tedious -- I hate it, too, and I had much better ways to spend my evening, believe me. But when someone is dissecting your opinion on everything you say in an arrogant tone and turning it into a bunch of misquotes and inaccuracies, you've gotta stand up for yourself.

No worries. Things can get somewhat heated at times. Hopefully we are all good now.

**144man** · 09-03-2015, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by Philles/Motown Gary

Man, what a rude and inconsiderate audience! It's almost the equivalent of heckling. Musically speaking, Motown has always been highly regarded as a positive, major music force in its own right. I wonder what prompted such a negative audience response. Poor Frankie. I'm sure he was proud to announce his newfound association with Motown. How did he handle that uncomfortable moment of public humiliation? Did he say anything in response?

As far as I can remember, he just ignored it and went on with the show. It was surprising as London had always been seen as a Motown stronghold.

**dvus7** · 09-04-2015, 04:04 PM

From my understanding, Bob Crewes[[The Four Seasons) was singed to Motown as a production deal!!!

**dvus7** · 09-04-2015, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by mysterysinger

Furthermore, "December 63 [[Oh What A Night)" was also a Jobete publication. Hardly a lack of success.

Please inform me as to how/why "oh, what a night" was published under JOBETE?

**carole cucumber** · 09-04-2015, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by dvus7

Please inform me as to how/why "oh, what a night" was published under JOBETE?

Perhaps he means 'The Night"

"December 63 [[Oh What a Night)" is published by EMI Music Publishing

**mysterysinger** · 09-04-2015, 08:26 PM

Erm - clearly "December 63 [[Oh What A Night)" was a Jobete published song - as were "Who Loves You", "Silver Star" etc.....the record labels prove it.
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