Another reason why the temps are the best ever!!

[arr&bee]

I was thinking about the classic temptations, and thought about how although[ eddie, david, dennis]went on to have some success as solo artist melvin and otis could've done the same and had some success with the right producers and writers..what i'm saying is that they were so good that each could've been a success as a solo act...what a group!!

[copley]

From the famous five David, Eddie & Paul were the sound of the Temptations. Melvin's contribution did not go unnoticed. However IMHO Otis was there just to make up numbers as he added very little to their sound. Sadly neither David or Eddie managed to achieve any lasting solo success post Temptations. Dennis was a great replacement for David but again solo success did not happen! Motown were flogging a dead horse sales wise.

[Philles/Motown Gary]

Motown had the best lead vocalists in the business. David, Eddie, and Paul were shining examples. We rarely got a chance to hear Melvin on his own, but his lead vocal performance on "I Truly, Truly Believe" could have easily been an A-side single release [[at least, for me). Otis rarely got a chance at lead vocal chores, although what little I've heard of his lead vocal voice, I wasn't that impressed. BUT -- and it's a huge but -- as everyone seems to agree, David, Eddie, Paul, Otis, and Melvin were the core members of The Tempts' sound. Their mid-to-late '60s Motown harmony blend was the best ever. You can bet your sweet bippy that if you took Otis' voice out of the mix, the Tempt's perfect blend would change -- and not necessarily for the better. Because of that, Otis is/was as important to the group as David, Eddie, Paul, and Melvin.

[Roger Polhill]

For me Paul was the the most soulful.

[copley]

For me Paul was the the most soulful.

Yep, Paul was a brilliant singer sadly now kind of forgotten in the mix!

[rod_rick]

Motown had the best lead vocalists in the business. David, Eddie, and Paul were shining examples. We rarely got a chance to hear Melvin on his own, but his lead vocal performance on "I Truly, Truly Believe" could have easily been an A-side single release [[at least, for me). Otis rarely got a chance at lead vocal chores, although what little I've heard of his lead vocal voice, I wasn't that impressed. BUT -- and it's a huge but -- as everyone seems to agree, David, Eddie, Paul, Otis, and Melvin were the core members of The Tempts' sound. Their mid-to-late '60s Motown harmony blend was the best ever. You can bet your sweet bippy that if you took Otis' voice out of the mix, the Tempt's perfect blend would change -- and not necessarily for the better. Because of that, Otis is/was as important to the group as David, Eddie, Paul, and Melvin.

Where was Otis voice placed in the harmony?

[Philles/Motown Gary]

Where was Otis voice placed in the harmony?

Rod_Rick, Eddie was the high, falsetto voice, so I'm thinking Otis' voice would be a notch down from Eddie's -- between Eddie and whoever was the next voice down [[either Paul or David). I recognize The Tempts' heavenly Motown blend when I hear it, but I'm not good at identifying who is singing alto, who is considered baritone, etc. Falsetto and bass, at opposite ends of the vocal spectrum, yes; but other than that, no.

Here's an example of Otis' lead vocal. See what you think:

"Don't Send Me Away"
https://youtu.be/nJLmoRsAC3o?si=qsca29BBt4DxYlMj

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

I think that, roughly ,this was the Temptations vocal lineup: Eddie Kendricks- high tenor, or first tenor; Otis Williams- second tenor/baritone; Paul Williams- baritone; David Ruffin- baritone; Melvin Franklin- bass [[like, yeah, of course!) It seems Otis was able to do a bit of "roaming" vocally, able to sing tenor or baritone. I'll hear songs where it sounds like "two" Eddie Kendricks are singing in the background [["No Man Can Love Her Like I Do" is a good example) so maybe that was Otis doubling with Eddie on the high tenor part.

I've heard often that Otis didn't really add much to the group, but my dad used to sing with different groups and he'd run down a lot of stuff about harmony singing and how sometimes even when you didn't think you were hearing someone in the blend, each voice was playing a part. I get the feeling that even though Otis didn't have as distinctive a lead voice as the others, his being versatile was crucial to the Temptations' blend, like their unsung hero of sorts.

[Philles/Motown Gary]

I think that, roughly ,this was the Temptations vocal lineup: Eddie Kendricks- high tenor, or first tenor; Otis Williams- second tenor/baritone; Paul Williams- baritone; David Ruffin- baritone; Melvin Franklin- bass [[like, yeah, of course!) It seems Otis was able to do a bit of "roaming" vocally, able to sing tenor or baritone. I'll hear songs where it sounds like "two" Eddie Kendricks are singing in the background [["No Man Can Love Her Like I Do" is a good example) so maybe that was Otis doubling with Eddie on the high tenor part.

I've heard often that Otis didn't really add much to the group, but my dad used to sing with different groups and he'd run down a lot of stuff about harmony singing and how sometimes even when you didn't think you were hearing someone in the blend, each voice was playing a part. I get the feeling that even though Otis didn't have as distinctive a lead voice as the others, his being versatile was crucial to the Temptations' blend, like their unsung hero of sorts.

Exactly, Waiting. That's why I'm sure that if they were to take Otis' vocals out of the mix, the harmonic blend would change, just as it would if they were to replace Otis with another vocalist. [[The only exception I've ever heard is the Three Degrees. I don't know how they've been able to do it, but their blend has remained the same since the early '70s whether the group lineup was Sheila, Valerie & Fayette, or Cynthia, or Helen. Just one note of harmony and you knew it was the Three Degrees.)

So your Dad was a singer, Waiting? How cool is that! Did any of his vocal talent rub off onto you? And did he teach you any musical tricks of the trade to help you get into the record business?

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

Hi Gary! That's pretty unusual for a group to maintain essentially the same sound while changing out members. I'm wondering if the Three Degrees would specifically look for singers who sounded very close to whomever was being replaced in the group at a given time. Kudos to them for being able to maintain their sound!

As for my Dad, looking back, it's amazing how much he knew about music. And he was really amazing with indulging me in my Motown Fandom. He sang and he played guitar. As he noticed my Motown fixation growing in epic proportions, he would sometimes note that so-and-so was singing tenor here or someone was singing baritone there. He taught me about how harmony groups had the vocal parts and how each contributed to the sound. He'd bring his guitar in my room and play along with my Motown records and tell me how they were using 2 or 3 guitar players to get their sound. It was a real education without being an educational bore! His singing did rub off on me as well as his musicianship; he got me my bass, taught me how to play music when you can't read it. Got me a set of drums when I wanted to learn those. I did learn how to play my own music, record it and sing it. I wanted to be a Motown artist so much lol! I actually tried to get to Motown [[I think I told the story a few times here on Soulful D) but it was probably a blessing that it didn't pan out. A blessing for Motown, me, you, and the whole wide world!

[mysterysinger]

Melvin's bass made the sound for me.

[arr&bee]

Otis voice is very important to the backing vocals, i've sung in a few groups and the second tenor is very important[don't ever sell otis short]and another thing, yes otis vocally was perhaps the least as far as range but he can sing...check out his leads on[i ain't got nothing- don't send me away- read between the lines].

[Philles/Motown Gary]

Hi Gary! That's pretty unusual for a group to maintain essentially the same sound while changing out members. I'm wondering if the Three Degrees would specifically look for singers who sounded very close to whomever was being replaced in the group at a given time. Kudos to them for being able to maintain their sound!

As for my Dad, looking back, it's amazing how much he knew about music. And he was really amazing with indulging me in my Motown Fandom. He sang and he played guitar. As he noticed my Motown fixation growing in epic proportions, he would sometimes note that so-and-so was singing tenor here or someone was singing baritone there. He taught me about how harmony groups had the vocal parts and how each contributed to the sound. He'd bring his guitar in my room and play along with my Motown records and tell me how they were using 2 or 3 guitar players to get their sound. It was a real education without being an educational bore! His singing did rub off on me as well as his musicianship; he got me my bass, taught me how to play music when you can't read it. Got me a set of drums when I wanted to learn those. I did learn how to play my own music, record it and sing it. I wanted to be a Motown artist so much lol! I actually tried to get to Motown [[I think I told the story a few times here on Soulful D) but it was probably a blessing that it didn't pan out. A blessing for Motown, me, you, and the whole wide world!

When Sheila Ferguson, Valerie Holiday, or Fayette Pinckney [[God rest her soul) left the group, they were replaced by Helen Scott or Cynthia Garrison -- both of whom were early-day members of the group. I guess that explains part of it, but still....you would think there'd be at least a slight change in their blend, but no -- not to my ears. The Three Degrees possess a permanent blend that no other girl group could touch. And, that blend is gorgeous, as are their famously stunning gowns.

SHEILA, VALERIE & FAYETTE on Ed Sulluvan [[late-'60s, Roulette Records) Sullivan performance includes a naughty routine poking fun at Diana!)
https://youtu.be/BVbeVReLaN4?si=dXquodGXmsf48egt

SHEILA, VALERIE & FAYETTE [[mid-'70s, Philly International Records)
https://youtu.be/KqbL5j6zw8M?si=uHWsDrf7hac5dzs2

SHEILA, VALERIE & HELEN SCOTT [[late-'70s, Ariola Records)
https://youtu.be/FoiIZ-suafQ?si=3fwW3boyGswQuBBH

VALERIE, HELEN & CYNTHIA GARRISON [[1998, Castle Pie Records)
https://youtu.be/rVSXflEVatc?si=8z09VhM5IFFGwHJz

Your dad sounds like a really great guy to invest such an interest in helping you reach your goal in music. Come on, Waiting -- fill us in on what happened with Motown one more time!

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

When Sheila Ferguson, Valerie Holiday, or Fayette Pinckney [[God rest her soul) left the group, they were replaced by Helen Scott or Cynthia Garrison -- both of whom were early-day members of the group. I guess that explains part of it, but still....you would think there'd be at least a slight change in their blend, but no -- not to my ears. The Three Degrees possess a permanent blend that no other girl group could touch. And, that blend is gorgeous, as are their famously stunning gowns.

SHEILA, VALERIE & FAYETTE on Ed Sulluvan [[late-'60s, Roulette Records) Sullivan performance includes a naughty routine poking fun at Diana!)
https://youtu.be/BVbeVReLaN4?si=dXquodGXmsf48egt

SHEILA, VALERIE & FAYETTE [[mid-'70s, Philly International Records)
https://youtu.be/KqbL5j6zw8M?si=uHWsDrf7hac5dzs2

SHEILA, VALERIE & HELEN SCOTT [[late-'70s, Ariola Records)
https://youtu.be/FoiIZ-suafQ?si=3fwW3boyGswQuBBH

VALERIE, HELEN & CYNTHIA GARRISON [[1998, Castle Pie Records)
https://youtu.be/rVSXflEVatc?si=8z09VhM5IFFGwHJz

Your dad sounds like a really great guy to invest such an interest in helping you reach your goal in music. Come on, Waiting -- fill us in on what happened with Motown one more time!

I'm checking out these links you very graciously provided. I don't know why, but I pretty much missed this music when I was a kid, but I'm seeing just how much I missed!

Ummmm. Wow. That first video at the 1:33 mark- how did they get away with that? I think I'm more surprised that this shows it wasn't just in the eyes of a few beholders, but VERY obvious apparently! [[and for some reason, I've always felt Valerie Holiday gave off a bit of a Wanda Rogers vibe in the looks department, at times)

I'll save the Motown debacle for another time, lol!