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  1. #51
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    IIRC, Diana wanted to console Florence's daughters which is how she ended up sitting up front or at least that was her words of why.

    She also said she was too distraught and wanted to grieve privately which is why she didn't end up at the cemetery.

    Her and Mary definitely should have talked before the funeral and I'm very surprised they didn't. But I think it was only appropriate they stood up at the casket together. Sad to think that the three of them were only together twice after they split, including this one time.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by floyjoy678 View Post
    IIRC, Diana wanted to console Florence's daughters which is how she ended up sitting up front or at least that was her words of why.

    She also said she was too distraught and wanted to grieve privately which is why she didn't end up at the cemetery.

    Her and Mary definitely should have talked before the funeral and I'm very surprised they didn't. But I think it was only appropriate they stood up at the casket together. Sad to think that the three of them were only together twice after they split, including this one time.
    When was the other time?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by sup_fan View Post
    Ran - i agree with you on the Diana/Mary thing. Diana really should have reached out to Mary prior [[assuming that she didn't). But at the same point, both were there at the funeral and so it is, frankly, appropriate that both D and M to at least stand together by the casket. it shouldn't have been that huge a shock to mary that she would need to at least stand with diana by the coffin.

    also Diana should have gone to the grave too.
    I agree it was appropriate for the two women to speak at Flo's funeral, but I don't believe it was something either woman had to do. Like I said before, I've seen what happens when people are forced to get up in front of a church full of people unexpectedly to have words in the midst of grief. Frankly I find it disrespectful to put someone on the spot like that. I don't believe that was Diana's intention, but that was the result.

    As for Diana going to the cemetery, I know lots of people who skip that part. It can be extremely emotional to watch a casket lowered into the ground. It's also possible that Diana's schedule would only permit her to attend the service and then head back to wherever she came from.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by floyjoy678 View Post
    IIRC, Diana wanted to console Florence's daughters which is how she ended up sitting up front or at least that was her words of why.

    She also said she was too distraught and wanted to grieve privately which is why she didn't end up at the cemetery.

    Her and Mary definitely should have talked before the funeral and I'm very surprised they didn't. But I think it was only appropriate they stood up at the casket together. Sad to think that the three of them were only together twice after they split, including this one time.
    Diana and Mary had a weird relationship post Supremes. Honestly it's strange that they never spoke about Flo's death with one another. Seems like as soon as the news broke that either woman would have called the other to at least see how the other one was holding up. But communication appears to be the actual wedge that came between the two women. So much of the controversies post Supremes between them could have been avoided with woman to woman conversations.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by ejluther View Post
    When was the other time?
    About a year after Flo was fired. The three of them were at a party at Gordy's house. It didn't end well.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    About a year after Flo was fired. The three of them were at a party at Gordy's house. It didn't end well.
    Thanks - I couldn’t remember when that party fell in the timeline…

  7. #57
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    All I will say fans that if Diana had of went to that casket without Mary she would have been blasted. Diana felt it was right that the two of them went together Mary could have said no but she didn't. I really don't know what was wrong here.

  8. #58
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    Questions for anyone who may know:

    For the official funeral program, was Diana Ross scheduled to give prepared remarks?

    If not, was there a portion of the funeral set aside that was open for anyone who wanted to get up to speak to those attending about Florence?

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spreadinglove21 View Post
    Questions for anyone who may know:

    For the official funeral program, was Diana Ross scheduled to give prepared remarks?

    If not, was there a portion of the funeral set aside that was open for anyone who wanted to get up to speak to those attending about Florence?
    Currently, there is a Flo funeral program on Ebay. I have no idea whether or not it is legitimate as I've seen programs with two different cover photos. In any event, this one doesn't list Diana in the program and doesn't seem to have a slot for personal remembrances.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    I can understand Mary being perturbed that Diana called her up for an unplanned prayer. I'm sure Diana's heart was in the right place but grief is a personal and private thing and Mary shouldn't have been put on the spot like that. As it was, I believe Mary said they hadn't spoken in months and afterwards, never discussed Flo's passing.

    As for Diana going to the grave, again, IMO, there are no should haves in such a situation. Some people don't like to see the actual lowering of the body into the ground. I certainly understand it, having attended at least one burial where that moment resulted in emotional moaning and groaning that I wish I didn't witness.
    all very valid points. and i do completely agree with you. it's a very complicated chapter in the overall Supremes story.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I agree it was appropriate for the two women to speak at Flo's funeral, but I don't believe it was something either woman had to do. Like I said before, I've seen what happens when people are forced to get up in front of a church full of people unexpectedly to have words in the midst of grief. Frankly I find it disrespectful to put someone on the spot like that. I don't believe that was Diana's intention, but that was the result.

    As for Diana going to the cemetery, I know lots of people who skip that part. It can be extremely emotional to watch a casket lowered into the ground. It's also possible that Diana's schedule would only permit her to attend the service and then head back to wherever she came from.
    yeah i don't think mary was obligated to speak, sing or give a prayer. But just like Mary said she felt Diana was obligated to be at the gravesite since the 3 of them had shared some of the most important aspects of Flo's life, i feel mary was obligated to at least join Diana at the casket in the front of the church so the 3 of them were together one last time. she could have not made any statement but i do think they both needed to be there, just the two of them, with Flo at the end.

    but again. i completely get it that grief is a highly personal emotion

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I agree it was appropriate for the two women to speak at Flo's funeral, but I don't believe it was something either woman had to do. Like I said before, I've seen what happens when people are forced to get up in front of a church full of people unexpectedly to have words in the midst of grief. Frankly I find it disrespectful to put someone on the spot like that. I don't believe that was Diana's intention, but that was the result.

    As for Diana going to the cemetery, I know lots of people who skip that part. It can be extremely emotional to watch a casket lowered into the ground. It's also possible that Diana's schedule would only permit her to attend the service and then head back to wherever she came from.
    My sister always goes to the church but will never attend the graveside burial even at our Grandma Ruth's funeral.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I can agree with this. There's talk that once inside the church Diana became very emotional in a dramatic fashion. If true, I've never faulted her for that. I've been to enough funerals to expect audible gasps, fainting, screams, someone having to be escorted to a seat, etc. Diana is human after all, and subject to human moments like the rest of us. I never thought that her having that reaction was her attempting to get attention, as has been alleged.

    However, I do think it weird that she didn't wait in line with her mother and sister and sit with them, or at least, considering it might have been safer for her to go directly inside, that she should have been seated with her own family, instead of up front with Flo's family. It looked like she was trying to get attention. Whether that's what she was doing or not, it was the optics of the thing.

    I do not fault her for getting up to say something. I do fault her for pulling Mary into it without asking her. A few years ago after the death of a loved one, a family member took it upon herself to put people on the program without asking them if they would like to speak or sing. So folks arrived at the funeral, in no frame of mind to do anything other than grieve, only to find out they were to speak or sing. It pissed folks off, and rightfully so. Diana crossed a line and Mary should've checked her for it [[later).

    Ultimately, I do believe that if Flo could've had a say, she would've wanted both Diana and Mary there. The three of them shared such an extraordinary experience together. They made history together. For decades to come, any three females, especially any three Black females, would forever be compared to the Supremes. Seemed only right that the two remaining ladies be there for Flo's final send off.
    Preach RanRan Preach.

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by captainjames View Post
    All I will say fans that if Diana had of went to that casket without Mary she would have been blasted. Diana felt it was right that the two of them went together Mary could have said no but she didn't. I really don't know what was wrong here.
    What's wrong is a thing called boundaries and respect. You don't put people on the spot. If you'd like further thoughts on the subject, I have several family members that will recall for you their horror of being placed on a program at the funeral of a beloved relative without their permission. Imagine yourself, seated in a church, your heart broken in the worst way, and then discover that in the midst of how you're feeling somebody expects you to get up and talk about your feelings. You have no time to prepare, not your words, not your state of mind. Some did decline not to speak because they were too overwrought. Others, while pissed and horrified, went ahead and spoke in order to keep the drama to a minimum. Since the person who crossed the line was an elder, that was the only thing that kept the entire ordeal free of an ass whooping. Personally had she been dumb enough to put my name on there without permission, she would've gotten cussed out [[later on, of course, not at the church).

    None of the ones who were called on thought it was no big deal. You just don't do that to people, especially people who are grieving. Mary could've declined, but as she explained, she was in shock. Diana had every right to speak at Flo's funeral. She had no right to pull Mary or anyone else into whatever she was trying to do.

    Over the last few years I've become amazed at the lack of compassion and understanding for those in mourning.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spreadinglove21 View Post
    Questions for anyone who may know:

    For the official funeral program, was Diana Ross scheduled to give prepared remarks?

    If not, was there a portion of the funeral set aside that was open for anyone who wanted to get up to speak to those attending about Florence?
    If I recall correctly, Diana said she spoke in order to bring some calm to the service, which had gotten out of hand, thanks to the presence of people who were more interested in star gazing than paying their respects to the deceased. I don't think she was an official part of the program.

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by sup_fan View Post
    yeah i don't think mary was obligated to speak, sing or give a prayer. But just like Mary said she felt Diana was obligated to be at the gravesite since the 3 of them had shared some of the most important aspects of Flo's life, i feel mary was obligated to at least join Diana at the casket in the front of the church so the 3 of them were together one last time. she could have not made any statement but i do think they both needed to be there, just the two of them, with Flo at the end.

    but again. i completely get it that grief is a highly personal emotion
    The difference between the two is that Mary felt Diana should've been there. She didn't force her to go or put her on the spot. Diana did that to Mary. Diana could've spoken and felt within herself that Mary should be up there too, but she didn't have to put Mary on the spot. But lets keep it real, Diana wasn't always known as someone who thought about how her actions might affect someone else. I imagine to Mary this was more of the same "Diana being Diana" that would sometimes cause resentment. I have to wonder if everyone who felt some type of way about Diana's "selfishness" in the early days had really gotten in her ass and in her ear about considering other people's feelings, maybe some of their relationships with her could have evolved without the resentment. If you let someone get away with something so often, they're bound to figure they can get away with it whenever they feel like it. I believe this was some of the negative side of Diana Ross. She didn't get checked enough back in the day.

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    My sister always goes to the church but will never attend the graveside burial even at our Grandma Ruth's funeral.
    Yeah, I know a lot of folks who do that. I know some who just won't do funerals at all. Had a great uncle who didn't go to his mother's- my great grandma- funeral. He said after my great grandfather's funeral that he'd never go to another one, and he didn't, not even his own mama's.

    I'll skip the graveyard too unless it's someone I'm really close to. While the scene can be very emotional, I just feel like I have to be at that last thing that happens on earth. A closure thing, I guess.

  18. #68
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    I have never blamed Diana for not being at the graveside. I think her attending the service was more then enough.
    Her actions inside the church though were extremely ill advised. She probably called upon Mary for moral support, problem being Mary had not been informed and was rightly outraged. It is possible it was a spur of the moment decision, but still makes for appalling etiquette. Shades of Motown 25.
    I wonder what would have happened had it been Mary who had asked Diana to join her in a private prayer. Would the media have reacted the way they did?. Would Diana have played the diva and refused?.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    I have never blamed Diana for not being at the graveside. I think her attending the service was more then enough.
    Her actions inside the church though were extremely ill advised. She probably called upon Mary for moral support, problem being Mary had not been informed and was rightly outraged. It is possible it was a spur of the moment decision, but still makes for appalling etiquette. Shades of Motown 25.
    I wonder what would have happened had it been Mary who had asked Diana to join her in a private prayer. Would the media have reacted the way they did?. Would Diana have played the diva and refused?.
    Did the media react badly to Diana's action? I don't recall reading any specifics about the service at the time. If I'm not mistaken, it wasn't until Mary wrote about the funeral in her first book that most of us even knew what happened that day. I suspect if it had been Mary who had done this instead, Diana would have just gotten up, joined Mary, and we never would have known about it being unplanned.

    As I've often said, when it comes to Diana, often she is damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. I once told a friend that Diana could stand in the middle of Times Square and hand out $50 bills and someone would complain that they weren't $100s.
    Last edited by reese; 09-24-2021 at 10:50 AM.

  20. #70
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    Diana wrote that she received bad press for it.

    And yes as someone else wrote, Mary and Diana had a weird relationship after the Supremes ended. While I think they both loved each other, I think their relationship was damaged from the tension the last few years they sang together and it just never recovered. Had they just sat down and hashed things out like normal people do, I'm sure it would have been a different story.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by floyjoy678 View Post
    Diana wrote that she received bad press for it.

    And yes as someone else wrote, Mary and Diana had a weird relationship after the Supremes ended. While I think they both loved each other, I think their relationship was damaged from the tension the last few years they sang together and it just never recovered. Had they just sat down and hashed things out like normal people do, I'm sure it would have been a different story.
    Now that you refreshed my memory, I do remember Diana writing that she got bad press for it. But at the time [1976], I don't recall reading or hearing anything about what she might have done.

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    .

    I'm not reading anything here I would call egregious. Seems like Diana was going out of her way to make sure Mary was included and so that she wasn't seen as trying to upstage her. She was trying to present the unity of The Supremes even at this time....this last time. As far as not pre-planning or speaking to each other in advance, I'm not reading that Mary tried to reach Diana but couldn't get through. So that they didn't, is as much on each of them as the other.

    Did they both attend alone or were they with someone??



    the thread's review of this event is quite interesting

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    .

    I'm not reading anything here I would call egregious. Seems like Diana was going out of her way to make sure Mary was included and so that she wasn't seen as trying to upstage her. She was trying to present the unity of The Supremes even at this time....this last time. As far as not pre-planning or speaking to each other in advance, I'm not reading that Mary tried to reach Diana but couldn't get through. So that they didn't, is as much on each of them as the other.

    Did they both attend alone or were they with someone??



    the thread's review of this event is quite interesting
    Good points, Boogiedown.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    .

    I'm not reading anything here I would call egregious. Seems like Diana was going out of her way to make sure Mary was included and so that she wasn't seen as trying to upstage her. She was trying to present the unity of The Supremes even at this time....this last time. As far as not pre-planning or speaking to each other in advance, I'm not reading that Mary tried to reach Diana but couldn't get through. So that they didn't, is as much on each of them as the other.

    Did they both attend alone or were they with someone??



    the thread's review of this event is quite interesting
    I disagree Boogie. Why would Mary contact Diana when her only intention was to stand with everyone else and pay her last respects in her own personal, private way.
    If Diana had intended a joint tribute, she should at least of had the curtesy of running it past Mary who may well have said thanks, but no thanks my love. It’s good etiquette.
    As it was, Mary was pretty much forced into it. This was not a Supremes show after all.

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    Sorry, but I have always looked at this from a positive side. if Diana went up by herself, Rev. Franklin would have ask if Mary wanted to say anything. Diana recently said very few words about Mary passing and has been criticized for that as well.

    All I know is that they loved each other especially Flo but Motown, politics, egos, and time got in their path.

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    Quote Originally Posted by captainjames View Post
    Sorry, but I have always looked at this from a positive side. if Diana went up by herself, Rev. Franklin would have ask if Mary wanted to say anything. Diana recently said very few words about Mary passing and has been criticized for that as well.

    All I know is that they loved each other especially Flo but Motown, politics, egos, and time got in their path.
    That’s simply not true. No reverend worth their salt would ever take it upon themselves to select a member of the congregation at a funeral to make an impromptu speech. I can’t imagine to many peeps being happy with that one. I know I most certainly wouldn’t. It’s no wonder Mary was utterly dismayed by Diana’s actions.
    I haven’t seen any criticism aimed at Diana regarding Mary’s passing. Considering the nature of their relationship, i think she probably said enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    ...I haven’t seen any criticism aimed at Diana regarding Mary’s passing. Considering the nature of their relationship, i think she probably said enough.
    I read some complaints on Facebook but I wasn't surprised.

    Diana sent out a heartfelt message when the news first broke of Mary's passing and some complained that it wasn't enough. Later in the day, she sent out a more formal message and some complained about that. I thought both responses were fine. But as I wrote earlier, sometimes Diana is damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    I read some complaints on Facebook but I wasn't surprised.

    Diana sent out a heartfelt message when the news first broke of Mary's passing and some complained that it wasn't enough. Later in the day, she sent out a more formal message and some complained about that. I thought both responses were fine. But as I wrote earlier, sometimes Diana is damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't.
    My only disagreement with your post, Reese, is that 'sometimes' should be replaced by 'always'!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    I disagree Boogie. Why would Mary contact Diana when her only intention was to stand with everyone else and pay her last respects in her own personal, private way.
    If Diana had intended a joint tribute, she should at least of had the curtesy of running it past Mary who may well have said thanks, but no thanks my love. It’s good etiquette.
    As it was, Mary was pretty much forced into it. This was not a Supremes show after all.
    I get your point Ollie, Mary felt blindsided and was forced into doing something she wasn't prepared for, and especially in such a very personal, sensitive situation. She probably thought, "She's at it again , bossy Miss Rossy!" lol!

    I'm not saying that the two should have called each other to choreograph their behavior, but good grief , if ever there was a time for them to reach out to each other .... and then while commiserating they might have segued into some thoughts about the funeral.

    I don't think you're saying Diana went out of her way to use the situation to somehow get at Mary....don't you think her intentions were good? She couldn't very well pull Mary to the side at this point for a strategy, and I suspect Diana was doing what seemed right to her in the moment. Maybe she went into "Supremes" mode and it seemed natural to her to"lead" Mary ... who in turn was well past that.

    I suspect that when Diana later read how that upset Mary, she was probably surprised and firmly decided , I'm not going to win with that woman and decided it was therefore best to stay away.
    Last edited by Boogiedown; 09-25-2021 at 12:12 PM.

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    Don't you all get it? It's Reggie Harding's fault for tearing the original trio apart! I know Flo asked, but her brother should have came to stop it, because Reggie Harding is as bad as Bluto from Popeye


    Reggie lusted for light-skinned women due to Reggie's troubled life after his own unfotuante childhood and acted as "friend" just to have Flo be his damsel.

    The Florence Ballard memorial twitter should come forward and tell about Reggie. Yes, Flo's dead, but people then will "judge" Reggie forever.
    Last edited by IMissFlo93; 09-25-2021 at 01:19 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    I get your point Ollie, Mary felt blindsided and was forced into doing something she wasn't prepared for, and especially in such a very personal, sensitive situation. She probably thought, "She's at it again , bossy Miss Rossy!" lol!
    .
    She probably did Boog lol. Let’s just say i think it would have served Diana better if in this instance, she had put aside her need to take control and let others grieve in a way they personally deemed fitting. Grief is to personal an emotion to be directed by another.

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    Wasn't Diana Ross booed and jeered by those outside the church as she made her way into the church? If so, I wonder if being on the receiving end of such a reception played a part in her decision to make remarks and bring Mary up to be with her?

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    I remember reading the outside crowd went berserk when Flo's coffin was brought out of the church and they had to throw out souvenirs to the crowd to keep them away. I shudder to think what they were trying to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by floyjoy678 View Post
    I remember reading the outside crowd went berserk when Flo's coffin was brought out of the church and they had to throw out souvenirs to the crowd to keep them away. I shudder to think what they were trying to do.
    That is true. I lived in Detroit at the time and scenes from the funeral were broadcast on the Friday evening news. I was a new fan, terrified of funerals and too young to fully grasp the chaos, but I do remember the coverage.

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    A very valid point was brought up regarding communication between Diana, Mary and Florence. They were very good friends and loved each other but they all have said the three of them had very different personalities. Remember, they started out together as three equal members of a group and became friends. Florence was earthy and outspoken, Diana was aggressive and needed to be the center of attention and Mary was the beautiful, peacemaker who never really let anyone know how she felt[[she herself said she was a bit of a chicken). Initially, when they became successful they were like the Beatles in that the press and the public knew all three of them, they all had name recognition and the press spoke equally with all 3 of them. Diana being the lead singer and so talented and unique she garnered more and more attention-this came about also because of some of Motown's orchestrations were people were directed to only ask Diana questions or when she would make appearances solo followed by Mary and Florence later. Even though it came from her talent, clearly this also helped her become a focus even though both Florence and Mary were initially covered as a part of the group and that they were also talented and unique. Motown was shortsighted in how this was handled and it caused internal tensions between the 3 of them even if they did love each other. Florence expressed her dissatisfaction openly by missing dates and finding solace in alcohol. Mary tried to keep the group together by supporting Diana and trying to be neutral peacemaker with Florence. She never really expressed how all of this was making her feel, she was trying to keep the three of them together. By the time it became Diana Ross & The Supremes, I am sure communication between the three of them was nearly nonexistent. Diana always had the need to control and be in the spotlight, she thought her bandmates would be happy for her and really didn't take into account how everything playing out made them feel. Mary probably never confronted Diana over what had happened but it would only be natural that she would not be happy that her friend was now using the group as a launching pad for her solo career. Mary may have never discussed how she felt with Diana but it had to be tense like anyone would feel during that situation they had during 1967-9. Clearly, that drew a wedge in their friendship that never recovered. There must have been minimal communication between the two. The fact that Mary and Diana did not reach out to each other to talk about Florence's passing obviously meant there was a wedge that happened that would never be bridged again if the passing of Florence did not cause them to reach out to one another and talk. The relationship between Diana and Mary must have had an unresolved problem once Florence left and the group was simply a launching pad for Ross' solo career. They didn't talk when Flo passed, when they joined together for Motown 25 or when they were negotiating for the ill fated RTL in 2000. Mary always said it was simply negotiations and she was not part of the planning. I remember that Mary was on television and said when Diana called it was not about let's get together and talk about what the reunion tour was together, it was Diana saying they wanted to do the business first. Diana said Mary answered her call with what took you so long without considering that Mary may have made her own tour plans and that she should be grateful that Diana called about it.She was surprised Mary was upset that she finally called thinking she would be grateful to be a part of it without thinking about Mary's thoughts. So, for something like that they were still not communicating even in 2000. The 1967-9 era that caused the break in their friendship was newer in 1976 when Florence passed, so the fact that they did not communicate at all when Flo passed speaks volumes. Yet, they all still loved each other and they all publicly said so, it was just personally and privately there was a break that could never be repaired no matter what happened. And that is truly sad on all of their parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jim aka jtigre99 View Post
    A very valid point was brought up regarding communication between Diana, Mary and Florence. They were very good friends and loved each other but they all have said the three of them had very different personalities. Remember, they started out together as three equal members of a group and became friends. Florence was earthy and outspoken, Diana was aggressive and needed to be the center of attention and Mary was the beautiful, peacemaker who never really let anyone know how she felt[[she herself said she was a bit of a chicken). Initially, when they became successful they were like the Beatles in that the press and the public knew all three of them, they all had name recognition and the press spoke equally with all 3 of them. Diana being the lead singer and so talented and unique she garnered more and more attention-this came about also because of some of Motown's orchestrations were people were directed to only ask Diana questions or when she would make appearances solo followed by Mary and Florence later. Even though it came from her talent, clearly this also helped her become a focus even though both Florence and Mary were initially covered as a part of the group and that they were also talented and unique. Motown was shortsighted in how this was handled and it caused internal tensions between the 3 of them even if they did love each other. Florence expressed her dissatisfaction openly by missing dates and finding solace in alcohol. Mary tried to keep the group together by supporting Diana and trying to be neutral peacemaker with Florence. She never really expressed how all of this was making her feel, she was trying to keep the three of them together. By the time it became Diana Ross & The Supremes, I am sure communication between the three of them was nearly nonexistent. Diana always had the need to control and be in the spotlight, she thought her bandmates would be happy for her and really didn't take into account how everything playing out made them feel. Mary probably never confronted Diana over what had happened but it would only be natural that she would not be happy that her friend was now using the group as a launching pad for her solo career. Mary may have never discussed how she felt with Diana but it had to be tense like anyone would feel during that situation they had during 1967-9. Clearly, that drew a wedge in their friendship that never recovered. There must have been minimal communication between the two. The fact that Mary and Diana did not reach out to each other to talk about Florence's passing obviously meant there was a wedge that happened that would never be bridged again if the passing of Florence did not cause them to reach out to one another and talk. The relationship between Diana and Mary must have had an unresolved problem once Florence left and the group was simply a launching pad for Ross' solo career. They didn't talk when Flo passed, when they joined together for Motown 25 or when they were negotiating for the ill fated RTL in 2000. Mary always said it was simply negotiations and she was not part of the planning. I remember that Mary was on television and said when Diana called it was not about let's get together and talk about what the reunion tour was together, it was Diana saying they wanted to do the business first. Diana said Mary answered her call with what took you so long without considering that Mary may have made her own tour plans and that she should be grateful that Diana called about it.She was surprised Mary was upset that she finally called thinking she would be grateful to be a part of it without thinking about Mary's thoughts. So, for something like that they were still not communicating even in 2000. The 1967-9 era that caused the break in their friendship was newer in 1976 when Florence passed, so the fact that they did not communicate at all when Flo passed speaks volumes. Yet, they all still loved each other and they all publicly said so, it was just personally and privately there was a break that could never be repaired no matter what happened. And that is truly sad on all of their parts.

    Good post .... but have to say- if this is how people that 'love' each other behave and treat each other - I'm glad they weren't enemies!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post
    Good post .... but have to say- if this is how people that 'love' each other behave and treat each other - I'm glad they weren't enemies!
    Love means never having to say you’re sorry.

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    Diana had a tendency to be rude and inconsiderate of other people's feelings and when not on stage performing, not being aware of how her actions may come across to others.

    Mary had a tendency to be passive aggressive and keeping things bottled up until they burst out in unproductive ways.

    Not good traits on either end to maintain a healthy relationship.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spreadinglove21 View Post
    Diana had a tendency to be rude and inconsiderate of other people's feelings and when not on stage performing, not being aware of how her actions may come across to others.

    Mary had a tendency to be passive aggressive and keeping things bottled up until they burst out in unproductive ways.

    Not good traits on either end to maintain a healthy relationship.
    Boom! Excellent observation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    Love means never having to say you’re sorry.

    hee hee . [I wonder how many people fell for that clunker!]

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    Out of the three of them, it seems Flo was the most honest about her feelings even if it wasn't in a productive way. I often have wondered if her phone call to Diana before her death would have been a renewal in their friendship and if it would have helped Diana and Mary's damaged relationship.

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    Quote Originally Posted by floyjoy678 View Post
    Out of the three of them, it seems Flo was the most honest about her feelings even if it wasn't in a productive way. I often have wondered if her phone call to Diana before her death would have been a renewal in their friendship and if it would have helped Diana and Mary's damaged relationship.
    Apparently it renewed their friendship. It is said that Diana offered Flo use of her home if she decided to come out to LA to work on getting back into the biz. That's something you only do for friends and family that you trust. Had Flo lived and taken Diana up on that offer, one can only speculate how long that friendship would've lasted.

    I don't know if Flo could've helped Diana and Mary's relationship. She might have ended up finding herself caught in the middle, in much the same way Mary found herself between Flo and Diana during that last year of Flo's time as a Supreme. I think a lot of Mary's issues with Diana really ramped up during the DRATS period, of which Flo wasn't around to witness. Also, it's possible that Flo might have been focused on her own life and maintaining relationships with both Diana and Mary, but not willing to be "bothered" with helping them maintain relationships with one another.

    But I agree, Flo did seem to be the most honest and vocal about her feelings. The problem was that it seems at a certain point that she'd voice these feelings when she had reached her wit's end and thus created a combustible situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post

    None of the ones who were called on thought it was no big deal. You just don't do that to people, especially people who are grieving. Mary could've declined, but as she explained, she was in shock. Diana had every right to speak at Flo's funeral. She had no right to pull Mary or anyone else into whatever she was trying to do.

    .
    This is another "She would be damned if she did; she would be damned if she didn't" in reference in pulling in Mary. I tend to believe that Diana probably didn't go into the service intending on saying anything; however, she felt a spontaneous need to do so. Once she got up ,she, with no bad intentions, felt that Mary should be recognized and to join her in making comments. Suppose she had not mentioned Mary...you know her haters there who were already emotionally charged would have pounced on her as taking advantage of drawing attention to herself without acknowledging Mary. Suppose she had not said anything at all? She would have been blasted. As many are already stating, people deal with grief in so many different ways. From what I have gathered from Diana over the years, she doesn't feel comfortable with funerals period.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jobucats View Post
    This is another "She would be damned if she did; she would be damned if she didn't" in reference in pulling in Mary. I tend to believe that Diana probably didn't go into the service intending on saying anything; however, she felt a spontaneous need to do so. Once she got up ,she, with no bad intentions, felt that Mary should be recognized and to join her in making comments. Suppose she had not mentioned Mary...you know her haters there who were already emotionally charged would have pounced on her as taking advantage of drawing attention to herself without acknowledging Mary. Suppose she had not said anything at all? She would have been blasted. As many are already stating, people deal with grief in so many different ways. From what I have gathered from Diana over the years, she doesn't feel comfortable with funerals period.
    If that's the case, then she could've had one of the funeral attendants go back and whisper to Mary, "Diana wants to have words about Flo and would like to know if you're willing to join her." That's what you do when you want to consider someone else's feelings. The truth is that in life many of us- if not all of us- are damned if we do or damned if we don't in someway. Diana is not special in that regard. But it is up to us each to do the right thing. Diana speaking was a nice thing to do. Diana pulling Mary into it without checking with her first was the wrong thing to do. I may be in the minority here, but this isn't a gray area issue to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    About a year after Flo was fired. The three of them were at a party at Gordy's house. It didn't end well.
    "Forever Faithful" book states that Flo was in the audience for one show when Cindy took over..

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    Quote Originally Posted by nomis View Post
    "Forever Faithful" book states that Flo was in the audience for one show when Cindy took over..
    One can only guess at the thoughts running through her head.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nomis View Post
    "Forever Faithful" book states that Flo was in the audience for one show when Cindy took over..
    As I mentioned in the thread about this book about a month ago, I didn't believe it then and I don't believe it now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    As I mentioned in the thread about this book about a month ago, I didn't believe it then and I don't believe it now.
    Oops been away from the forum for a couple of months will look for the thread as I always enjoy your point of view RanRan ..hope you are well

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    Mary lived in the world of victimhood. She was the perennial victim. It was usually at the hands of Diana. I never bought into it, and that is why I never liked or respected her.

    But, it sure made her a lot of money and gathered her much needed attention and sympathy.

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    I have never seen that photo before

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