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  1. #1

    Another Missing Motown Jobete 45 Otis Williams & His Charms

    "So Be It" B Side to "The First Sign Of Love"
    Fidelity Publishing "So Be It" song Writers: Gwen Gordy, Roquel Billy Davis & Berry Gordy Jr. Issued in 1960.
    Note the Interesting spelling of "Gordy"

    Link attached:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8Bp-r_Oa_k


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    Last edited by Graham Jarvis; 06-13-2021 at 03:46 AM.

  2. #2
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    Okay, I just feel like I'd really like to ask you this:

    You do know that there were 2 Otis Williams in the business, don't you?
    Otis Williams and His Charms were a totally different group and had no
    connection to Otis Williams of the Temptations. He was a true wailing ass son of a gun
    who sounded like blues singer Robert Johnson on steroids and almost nobody plays
    his music anymore today except my weekend host on my public radio station...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ym1-j8TZvQg

  3. #3
    Yes, two very different, the other Otis was with the Distants before the Primes & then onto Motown.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Jarvis View Post
    "So Be It" B Side to "The First Sign Of Love"
    Fidelity Publishing "So Be It" song Writers: Gwen Gordy, Roquel Billy Davis & Berry Gordy Jr. Issued in 1960.
    Note the Interesting spelling of "Gordy".
    Link attached:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8Bp-r_Oa_k
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    THAT Otis Williams was from New Jersey, if I remember, and I already had about 12 of his group's singles BEFORE Berry got into the record business. Otis Williams and The Charms were one of the big R&B groups starting in 1954. This song was NOT a Jobete song, but was published by Fidelity Music, which represented the partnership of Berry, his sister, Gwen, and Berry's songwriting partner [[and ex lead singer of Detroit's Five Jets), Billy Davis [[AKA Ty Carlo), who was dating Gwen at that time.

    It was a late 1959 song, soon after that trio stopped writing together, at Anna Records and Berry had finished doing his first producing with Billy's old group, who had changed their name to The Five Stars for Anna's first distributor [[before Chess), George Goldner's End/Gone/Mark-X Records[[which had pressed up, issued and distributed Berry's first 2 Miracles' records. Berry had been writing songs for their Anna Records, and leasing them some of his productions. Billy was still The Five Stars' manager, so that's why Berry had been producing them. This song was placed with King's Charms in late 1959, while the trio of writers had just stopped producing records together at Anna, because Berry had started Tamla. But, NONE of the Anna artists were as big as Otis and The Charms, so they shopped this song to King and The Charms so the national exposure of this song would get them more notoriety as songwriters and producers, and get more of that for Anna Records, and maybe Berry's fledgling Tamla Records, as well. Very soon after that, Tamla was doing very well, and so was Gwen's and Harvey Fuqua's Harvey/Tri-Phi Records, and there was no more need to place their own songs with other labels.

    In early 1961, Billy and Gwen broke up their relationship, and Harvey Fuqua [[who had been sent in 1960, by Anna's distributor, Chess Records, to help them become more successful), became her new "Boyfriend". They had to dissolve Anna, because it would have been too awkward for partner, Billy to stay with the company [[perhaps Gwen fell in love with Harvey and dumped Billy). In any case, Billy agreed with Chess to open a Chess subsidiary label in Detroit [[Check-Mate Records), and was leaving Anna. So they shut down, and Gwen and Harvey formed Hardye Record Corp., and The Harvey and Tri-Phi labels, and got married to each other. Soon, they also started 2 more subsidiary labels, Message Records [[a Gospel label) and H.P. C.Records [[Hardye Production Co.).
    Last edited by robb_k; 06-13-2021 at 09:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Jarvis View Post
    Yes, two very different, the other Otis was with the Distants before the Primes & then onto Motown.
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    Can THAT be right??? The story I always heard, since the early '60s was that The Distants were seen at a venue by Berry Gordy in mid 1960, and told them to come and see him when their contract with Johnnie Mae Matthews would run out [[in late 1960), and he'd sign them. Then, when their contract with Matthews was up, and Otis said, "Now let's go meet with Berry Gordy", Richard Street decided to quit the group, because he wanted to spend more time with his new girlfriend, and wanted to get into songwriting and record production. And James Crawford quit the group as well. So Otis decided they needed to find two more members, to take their places. Serendipity! Right around that same time, The Primes, Edie Kendricks, Paul Williams, and Kell Osborne, broke up as well, with Osborne deciding to go to California. So, a mutual friend mentioned to each group that the other needed more members, so they got together, and Otis thought Eddie and Paul would be great additions. I know, that, at first, they had a hard time coming up with a new group name. I heard that they were still trying to find a name when Berry suggested "The Temptations", and the group liked it. I also heard that they had decided on "The Elgins", but then they found out about L.A.'s Elgins group, who had recorded for Flip Records. And then Berry suggested "Temptations", and also heard that Otis or another member suggested "Temptations".

    Regardless, knowing Otis' pride, shown in wanting to let everyone know HE founded the group, and insisted on being "the boss", and making all the big decisions, he would NEVER have agreed for his group to take on The Primes' group name. So, I say he was NEVER a member of The Primes, but went from The Distants to the non-recording Elgins [[did they play any gigs as The Elgins?), to The Temptations.
    Last edited by robb_k; 06-14-2021 at 01:03 PM.

  6. #6
    Thanks Rob, also interesting that the B side of the record written by Ken Wood is also Fidelity Publishing, all of them inc Ro-Gor, Bengal etc, finally transfered and belonged to B.G. & the Motown publishing. It's great fun finding other 45's. I have a Robert Gordy 45 and another Jobete 45 written by Mickey Gentile, that I found a number of years back now. I'll have to dig them out and post them on the Forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Jarvis View Post
    Thanks Rob, also interesting that the B side of the record written by Ken Wood is also Fidelity Publishing, all of them inc Ro-Gor, Bengal etc, finally transfered and belonged to B.G. & the Motown publishing. It's great fun finding other 45's. I have a Robert Gordy 45 and another Jobete 45 written by Mickey Gentile, that I found a number of years back now. I'll have to dig them out and post them on the Forum.
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    Yes, do that. We always love to see things like that. I assume it was a Bob Kayli record, rather than listed as by Robert Gordy. Is it "Everyone was there on Carlton Records?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Jarvis View Post
    Thanks Rob, also interesting that the B side of the record written by Ken Wood is also Fidelity Publishing, all of them inc Ro-Gor, Bengal etc, finally transfered and belonged to B.G. & the Motown publishing. It's great fun finding other 45's. I have a Robert Gordy 45 and another Jobete 45 written by Mickey Gentile, that I found a number of years back now. I'll have to dig them out and post them on the Forum.
    Attachment 19129
    Bengal music was Berry's, alone. Ro-Gor, as stated above was the partnership of Gwen and Billy Davis[[Ty Carlo), and Fidelity was the partnership of Berry, Gwen, and Billy.

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