"Supremes" These Boots

[RanRan79]

Okay, aside from the fact that I think Florence was a better fit for this song, I really love this cover. Again, aside from replacing Diana with Flo, the only other change I might consider making is adding backing vocals. I don't have the capabilities, but if I did, I would have a little fun attempting to pair Flo and Mary backing vocals- in whole or part- from another song and add it to "These Boots" to see how it sounds. Wish George and team had thought of it.

Anyway, thoughts on "These Boots"? Love the cover? Hate it? Better with backing vocals or without? Better with Diana or Flo? Is there a brave one among you willing to "argue" Mary as lead on this?

[marybrewster]

This was cut intentionally as a Diana solo. There was talk she would leave the group in 1966, and Motown clearly was testing the waters.

[floyjoy678]

Yes this one definitely should have went to Flo and I don't see why they didn't especially since Mary got a lead on the album.

I love the new mixed track on the expanded edition of A Go Go.

Backing vocals would have given the song an extra punch. Do you know for years I thought Mary and Flo were doing backgrounds on this song during the second verse? It took me a while to realize it just horns lol.

[reese]

It is a nice enough track but it doesn't really move me one way or the other. Diana sounds fine on it but for me, it isn't in the same class as the other remakes on the album.

[Ollie9]

Flo was robbed is all I can say on this one. To be fair, Diana does a reasonable job with the song, but her vocal is kittenish as opposed to assertive which i think the song cries out for.

[Motown Eddie]

I say that Flo would've been much better on "These Boots.." than Diana. However, this was recorded during the time that Flo & Berry were butting heads [[and she was staring to miss recording dates) so it never could've happened.

[BobbyC]

I don't mean to insult anyone's personal taste, I really don't, but when I first heard this cover I thought it was the worst cover of a pop song I ever heard. Then I heard Hang on Sloopy, which is far worse. DR's voice is just not suited to either song. Florence should have led Boots, and they should have hurled Sloopy into the nearest garbage disposal, never to be heard from again. Ugh.

[gman]

I like their version of SLOOPY! I do not like Boots or Come and Get These Memories...2 blemishes on a really good LP! I was and am a Nancy Sinatra fan [[that BOOTS Lp has been one of my fav's since I was 8!..and yes! she had other top 40 hits!) , so I can't appreciate DR's Boots, and although Mary is my fav Supreme and I love her sultry voice, CAGTM sounds like a demo.

[lucky2012]

It is a nice enough track but it doesn't really move me one way or the other. Diana sounds fine on it but for me, it isn't in the same class as the other remakes on the album.

This.

BobbyC: [QUOTE]

• when I first heard this cover I thought it was the worst cover of a pop song I ever heard. Then I heard Hang on Sloopy, which is far worse. DR's voice is just not suited to either song. Florence should have led Boots, and they should have hurled Sloopy into the nearest garbage disposal, never to be heard from again. Ugh. [QUOTE]
  
  And this.
  
  Since Mary had CAGTM, it would have been nice if Flo had Boots.

[RanRan79]

Backing vocals would have given the song an extra punch. Do you know for years I thought Mary and Flo were doing backgrounds on this song during the second verse? It took me a while to realize it just horns lol.

HA!! Me too Floy!! It took me YEARS to figure out it was horns. Way back in the Yahoo Groups [[aka Yahoo Clubs) days, someone told me that the mono version had backing vocals. I didn't get a copy of the mono A Go Go until the expanded edition came out. Imagine my disappointment to find that "These Boots" was still a Diana solo.

[RanRan79]

Flo was robbed is all I can say on this one. To be fair, Diana does a reasonable job with the song, but her vocal is kittenish as opposed to assertive which i think the song cries out for.

Agreed. Assertive and sassy seems to be the point of the song. Diana never did pull off sassy very well, which was one of Flo's strong points. Diana was certainly capable of doing assertive, so not sure why she didn't interpret the song in that way. But yeah, as much as I do love the song as is, Flo was robbed.

[RanRan79]

I like their version of SLOOPY! I do not like Boots or Come and Get These Memories...2 blemishes on a really good LP! I was and am a Nancy Sinatra fan [[that BOOTS Lp has been one of my fav's since I was 8!..and yes! she had other top 40 hits!) , so I can't appreciate DR's Boots, and although Mary is my fav Supreme and I love her sultry voice, CAGTM sounds like a demo.

Never cared for "Sloopy". For years I liked "Memories", probably because Mary was singing lead. I have since cooled off of it, mostly because Mary is singing lead. That arrangement did not suit her voice at all. I would've given the lead to either Diana or Florence, who were far more capable of bringing that arrangement to life. The only way I hand Mary that lead sheet is if I were to slow it down and turn it into a ballad, which I think Mary could've really been great on.

[BobbyC]

GMan good God. These Boots Are Made for Walking is a song about a woman talking to her boots about getting revenge on a guy. We're not talking mental health here. What's next? A song about conspiring with your bunny slippers to exact revenge on an ex?

[BobbyC]

GMan okay in fairness you did say you didn't like Boots. But why should I let facts stand in the way of an amusing post?

[TYK1986]

May I ask where the story, or rumours, come from that Florence was supposed to sing lead on These Boots? I am 100% it has been discussed before but probably never took any notice of it. Is it in Mary's book? If so shows you how much I took notice of it lol.
I don't like the song no matter who sings it, Sorry. I don't think that either Mary or Florence singing it would change my mind about it but I do agree with some that adding background vocals might work. It might even change my mind. But as it is now the song sounds too dreary for me.

[sup_fan]

May I ask where the story, or rumours, come from that Florence was supposed to sing lead on These Boots? I am 100% it has been discussed before but probably never took any notice of it. Is it in Mary's book? If so shows you how much I took notice of it lol.
I don't like the song no matter who sings it, Sorry. I don't think that either Mary or Florence singing it would change my mind about it but I do agree with some that adding background vocals might work. It might even change my mind. But as it is now the song sounds too dreary for me.

Tony Turner seems to have originated this rumor. it was in his Glitter book. no one else has, to my knowledge, ever stated Flo was slated to sing this song

agree that given the problems emerging in the group, Flo solos/leads were not very likely. She missed the early July 66 recording dates with included You Can't Hurry Love, What becomes of the broken hearted, Misery makes my heart and more. simply didn't show up. conflict on the rise between her and berry.

with her growing discontent and lack of reliability, why would they even make modest investments in her role in the group? She still had People in the show but eventually that would be dropped.

[sup_fan]

as for the recording of Boots on A Go Go, it's ok. nothing stupendous but not the worst thing on the album. it had been a MASSIVE hit that year so the idea to add a few non motown cover dance tunes makes sense. the idea to release a teen-oriented pure dance album was a great idea. especially after the MOR style of Symphony, the Copa set and previous albums.

the execution of the A Go Go set was a bit lacking - the LA tracks do lack the spirit and drive of the Detroit ones.

Also many of these tunes have the most lackadaisical, boring and square backing vocals ever waxed by motown lolol. Flo and Mary couldn't sound more bland then they do on Sloopy. they completely lack any soul or passion. their prim little parts just add nothing. Sloopy is a party song so let the girls have some fun!!!

[RanRan79]

May I ask where the story, or rumours, come from that Florence was supposed to sing lead on These Boots? I am 100% it has been discussed before but probably never took any notice of it. Is it in Mary's book? If so shows you how much I took notice of it lol.
I don't like the song no matter who sings it, Sorry. I don't think that either Mary or Florence singing it would change my mind about it but I do agree with some that adding background vocals might work. It might even change my mind. But as it is now the song sounds too dreary for me.

Tall Tales Turner seems to be the originator of the story, although eons ago, there was someone who claimed to have heard during a Supremes convention an acetate of Flo singing the song. I always hoped that person was right- since I didn't believe a word from Tall Tales- and hoped it would surface when the A Go Go EE came out. The guys put a final nail in that coffin though.

[BobbyC]

I loved Tony Turner's books--they are hilarious

[kenneth]

I never liked “Boots“ on that album until I heard the expanded CD which remastered the track and made it extremely intoxicating to listen to. I especially love the stereo version where the hand claps are even more pronounced than on the mono version. I think Diane did a great job singing the hell out of it, and I think it shows that she could shout along with the best of them when she wanted to. It didn’t have the sense of menace and foreboding that the Nancy Sinatra version had, but it was full of verve and drive. But I completely changed my opinion about the song, in fact about the whole album, after hearing the remastered versions on the expanded edition which really punched up the mixes and made them sound so urgent and immediate. But I think “boots” is definitely one of the highlights of the album.

[sup_fan]

I loved Tony Turner's books--they are hilarious

i'm actually flipping through some of Glitter now. it is pure comedy. if read as a work of fiction, there are tons of LOL moments

[BobbyC]

Hi Supsy. When I spoke to Tony on the phone a few times, he told me he's gotten death threats, particularly from Eddie Kendrick's family at his funeral. Tony pointed out that Eddie's family was angry not because his stories weren't true--they were angry for revealing certain things that were not flattering. He informed me that at that point [[mid 90's), not one Motown star had sued him, nor had anyone even said he'd made things up. And I'll be damned--nobody has! I even asked him if I was supposed to believe that David Ruffin really called him a "mutha f'ing task master diva b-tch," and he got a little offended, replying "Yes he DID!! You should have heard some of the things he called me!!!" LOL!! Tony definitely saw his books as comedy, as I do, but he definitely didn't make things up, according to him.

[sup_fan]

i tend to view his book as more fantasy. but of course i wasn't there.

basically i find it odd that an 11 year old kid was so involved in the entire supremes entourage. that he spent endless nights in Flo's suites drinking and talking, that Flo commandeered a limo on the interstate and drove to the airport. that he took multiple trips as a kid and young adult to detroit to stay with flo and her family. and it is odd that he doesn't have 1 pic of him with her or any of her family. some of the pics he did include are obvious personal pics - which is great. not fancy studio images but ones he or a "regular" person took. that lends authenticity even if they're not the most perfectly in focus or the best angles. so out of 12 years of time he spent with Flo, there isn't 1 instance of a photo? what - when they're together are they unable to appear on film? is this Supremes meets Twilight?!?!

but it is hilarious to read.

also i did hear he got himself in hot water. supposedly the draft of the book he provided Scherrie and others who wrote accolades on the back jacket of Glitter was NOT the same as what was published. and as such they've all rescinded their approval of the book. It also was said that Deliver Us got him in much more trouble than Glitter. and i think he was looking to write another that was gonna include some wild story about Berry making a pass or somethign really bad. and the threat of lawsuit prevented him from moving forward

and the lack of lawsuits doesn't make something accurate. stars are used to trash being written in tabloids all the time and usually just ignore it. cheaper and easier to do so

[BobbyC]

Well I doubt anybody sees Tony Turner as the go-to Motown historian. I saw the whole thing as comedy. I have no idea if that stuff is true, I hope it is, but frankly I don't really care. The book made me laugh for twenty odd years.

[sup_fan]

Well I doubt anybody sees Tony Turner as the go-to Motown historian. I saw the whole thing as comedy. I have no idea if that stuff is true, I hope it is, but frankly I don't really care. The book made me laugh for twenty odd years.

oh i agree with that! i still laugh out loud at the scene he describes in Deliver Us where Martha was supposedly bailing on a tour with Eddie, David and Mary. she was basically taking the money from that show and leaving and David flips out lolol. he's quoted as saying:

horse-throated tramp

tambourine thumping project whore


lololololol

[BobbyC]

LOL!! That whole scene is classic--and to think it supposedly happened here in my hometown of Austin!! "I see Martha has managed to squeeze her wide behind into those filthy sweatpants!" CLASSIC!! Great trash. Almost as great as the National Enquirer story from the 80's that was entitled "Liz Taylor at 267 lbs--That's a Lotta LIZ!!"

[sup_fan]

LOL!! That whole scene is classic--and to think it supposedly happened here in my hometown of Austin!! "I see Martha has managed to squeeze her wide behind into those filthy sweatpants!" CLASSIC!! Great trash. Almost as great as the National Enquirer story from the 80's that was entitled "Liz Taylor at 267 lbs--That's a Lotta LIZ!!"

LOLOLOL i have that whole story dog-earred to that i can quickly jump to it.

also the story of the Temps playing Aretha's house party is right up there too lololol

[BobbyC]

You mean when Aretha let her mink coat fall to the floor, revealing a nude and randy Queen of Soul underneath? Hee hee! God I hope that is true! I also loved how Miss Martha told off Mary, Eddie and David! "How come you got to sing every song the Temptations ever sung and suddenly you don't know how to come off a stage!!" I can just see Martha sitting in the front row, staring at her watch, timing how many minutes over their scheduled time David and Eddie went! God I love great trash!

[sup_fan]

You mean when Aretha let her mink coat fall to the floor, revealing a nude and randy Queen of Soul underneath? Hee hee! God I hope that is true! I also loved how Miss Martha told off Mary, Eddie and David! "How come you got to sing every song the Temptations ever sung and suddenly you don't know how to come off a stage!!" I can just see Martha sitting in the front row, staring at her watch, timing how many minutes over their scheduled time David and Eddie went! God I love great trash!

what about the private dinner with Flo and Tony's family, where Flo redecorated their house lol

or some of those Flo quotes:

i was going to agree with you. but you're so damn short, i won't even consider it

if you reach your hand back to slap me, you're gonna pull back a bloody stump

don't you ever walk out on me, i'll cut you too short to shit!

lololol

[marybrewster]

Tony Tina Turner did give us some dish. My favorite comes from his side kick Delcina: JEAN! YOU'RE A BIG GIRL!

[sup_fan]

Tony Tina Turner did give us some dish. My favorite comes from his side kick Delcina: JEAN! YOU'RE A BIG GIRL!

lolol there are several moments in the book where Miss Tonita criticizes Jean lack of hair lolol

like at the farewell show, he really digs into her cheap outfit and the grandma-like pixie wig someone dropped on her head lolol

[BobbyC]

Hee hee! how did we go from Nancy Sinatra to this? My favorite TT quote, amongst many, was "What are you looking at, a-hole? These ain't nuthin' my man Sammy hasn't seen before!!!" Name that quote!!! And what about David's lime ricky green Cadillac, with mink interior? LOLL!!! I'm an artist and I still don't know what lime ricky green is

[BobbyC]

Tony said Jean needed a new wig and she needed it quick!!!

[RanRan79]

Tall Tales Turner is a liar with two hilarious fan fiction publications. Even when Mary writes about Tony and Flo in her first book, she frames him as one of many fans with the ability to sneak past security, and has Flo handing him autographed photos of herself and/or the group. He obviously parlayed that fandom into eventually getting closer to Mary, who later on brought him into the team and then later she kicked him out. I knew for a fact he was on some bullshit when he did an interview around 2000 or so where he claimed Flo was a drug addict. I assume he was attempting a part 2 of All That Glittered where he rode around with Flo, dressed in her Supremes finery, pulling up to street corners, where Flo gets out and sings Supremes songs in order to get her fix. And I won't even bother with his allegations against Gordy...

[antceleb12]

All I'll say about Tony Turner is that when your books are published as "biography" or "music history," like I'm sure a good share of the public who bought them might have believed them to be, then they're not so much hilarious as they are damaging and malicious. The amount of flat-out lies and dubious deception perpetrated by Turner's Enquirer-esque rumor mill is nothing short of trashy, IMO.

As far as "Boots," I have to disagree with the opinion that Flo would have been better suited for this track. As a matter of fact, I don't think the song was suited for any of them. While I don't care for the song to begin with, I think Motown's arrangement flat out STINKS. In general, A Go Go was, in my opinion, rushed and sloppily arranged. YCHL and LILAIIMH are the two exceptions [[although I'm not a huge fan of the latter), but the rest of the album sounds ill-produced and thin. Mary and Flo's background vocals [[or Marlene, when Flo is absent, and Diana on Mary's solo) are reduced to a near whisper, the arrangements lack excitement and punch, and even many of Diana's leads sound more like rehearsals than final vocals. I imagine that the album reaching #1 rests primarily on the strength of the group's popularity and the strength of YCHL, and possibly on the album cover. That album cover is SUPERB. It's just a shame that the rest of the album didn't live up to the quality of the cover...

[RanRan79]

All I'll say about Tony Turner is that when your books are published as "biography" or "music history," like I'm sure a good share of the public who bought them might have believed them to be, then they're not so much hilarious as they are damaging and malicious. The amount of flat-out lies and dubious deception perpetrated by Turner's Enquirer-esque rumor mill is nothing short of trashy, IMO.

Good point. Like I said, I see it as good fan fiction, but your point is well taken that the books are marketed that way and I can only imagine how much pain any of his lies caused the subjects of his book. It sucks to be lied on. Has to suck even more if you feel like the fight to clear your name isn't worth it to do so. But Gordy said he wasn't having it when he heard about what Tony was going to say in his 3rd book. He squashed that shit real quick.

I once asked Flo's sister Maxine what she thought of "Glittered" and she said it was greatly exaggerated.

[RanRan79]

Mary and Flo's background vocals [[or Marlene, when Flo is absent, and Diana on Mary's solo)

Diana isn't on "Memories", but Florence is.

[antceleb12]

Diana isn't on "Memories", but Florence is.

Really?? So is it Florence and Marlene? I'll have to go back and give it another listen. I had no idea!

[antceleb12]

Diana isn't on "Memories", but Florence is.

You know what, I just played it again and you're right. I can clearly hear both Florence and Marlene. Good catch.

[RanRan79]

You know what, I just played it again and you're right. I can clearly hear both Florence and Marlene. Good catch.

Ant go back and listen and see if you hear what I hear: sounds to me like Flo is singing along with Mary on the "left behind so many memories", and then Flo and Mary sing the backup parts, and the Andantes are added for the "ahhs" during the chorus. If Diana is present I don't hear her, which would be strange. I imagine it has happened a time or two that any one of the girls had failed to make a session for one reason or another, so maybe Diana was left out for that reason? I think it's also possible that Flo and Mary cut their background parts first, as they often did, and maybe Diana was supposed to get the lead but instead the guys gave it to Mary, so she's doing lead and background. Maybe George will pop in and shed some light on this one.

[floyjoy678]

You're right Ranran, its Mary and Flo singing the backgrounds on that one. I was able to cut out the lead years ago on this music maker program I had on my computer and you can hear Mary pretty well with Flo. I'm pretty sure its the same with the Ballad of Davy Crockett and Can't Take My Eyes Off You. Maybe even Falling In Love With Love as well.

[George Solomon]

If you listen to the mix of Come And Get These Memories on Lost & Found you can hear it's Mary and Flo in the right channel and Andantes in the left. Mary's lead in the center.
On some Rodgers and Hart tracks it seems they all recorded together on one track then Mary and Florence added some additional back ups. This is obvious on the Deke Richards mix of Falling In Love With Love from The Rodgers & Hart Collection. The three together including Diana and Mary's leads in the center and additional Mary and Flo back ups in the right channel. Just the three Supremes on this album!

[sup_fan]

If you listen to the mix of Come And Get These Memories on Lost & Found you can hear it's Mary and Flo in the right channel and Andantes in the left. Mary's lead in the center.
On some Rodgers and Hart tracks it seems they all recorded together on one track then Mary and Florence added some additional back ups. This is obvious on the Deke Richards mix of Falling In Love With Love from The Rodgers & Hart Collection. The three together including Diana and Mary's leads in the center and additional Mary and Flo back ups in the right channel. Just the three Supremes on this album!

I've noticed that with a few other recordings. Like Going Down 3rd Time. and the Floy Joy tracks. often you can start to separate the vocals like that. especially if wearing headphones

[RanRan79]

You're right Ranran, its Mary and Flo singing the backgrounds on that one. I was able to cut out the lead years ago on this music maker program I had on my computer and you can hear Mary pretty well with Flo. I'm pretty sure its the same with the Ballad of Davy Crockett and Can't Take My Eyes Off You. Maybe even Falling In Love With Love as well.

Diana is on "Davy Crockett". I'll have to give "Eyes" a listen and pay close attention. I remember when it was first released on the 2000 box set I assumed it was Diana, until years later when I started recognizing Syreeta's voice on Motown recordings and then concluded that it was Syreeta on "Eyes" and not Diana. But I'll give it another listen to see if I hear different.

[RanRan79]

Thanks for chiming in George. The fact that you bother with us super fans at all is a real blessing. We learn so much.

[floyjoy678]

Diana is on "Davy Crockett". I'll have to give "Eyes" a listen and pay close attention. I remember when it was first released on the 2000 box set I assumed it was Diana, until years later when I started recognizing Syreeta's voice on Motown recordings and then concluded that it was Syreeta on "Eyes" and not Diana. But I'll give it another listen to see if I hear different.

I used to think it was Diana and Cindy doing backups for Can't Take My Eyes Off You with Diana taking the bottom harmony and Cindy the top. But then I started thinking it sounded more like Mary doing the bottom, although its very soft. I figured at least one of the three had to be doing backup so Diana and Cindy would know how to sing it for the live shows.

[George Solomon]

Thanks for chiming in George. The fact that you bother with us super fans at all is a real blessing. We learn so much.

That's funny. I'm a super fan who's been fortunate enough to get an inside look and listen.

[thanxal]

Thanks for chiming in George. The fact that you bother with us super fans at all is a real blessing. We learn so much.

I think you mean the fact that he's "brave" enough. LOL! Andy seems to have given up on us, quite understandably so.

[gman]

I have had time to rethink this and re-read all the comments. The Supremes are my fav group, and I am familiar with all their voices....I don't hear any of the 3 who recorded A Go Go [[DMF) doing justice to this song....Maybe perhaps Jean, or Scherrie.
It would have worked better with almost every other female lead singer at Motown..

Glady's Horton could have done it justice....even Wanda's light and whispery style may have worked.
Ditto for Mary Wells.
Martha was definitely capable of a spiteful, aggressive lyric.
and of course, Gladys Knight would have easily just shredded it....
On the list of no's...Brenda, Kim and the Velvelettes...doesn't suit them either IMHO

[144man]

^^^Remembering the number of songs recorded by or intended for Mary Wells that were recorded by Brenda and Kim, I don't see how you can say it would have worked for Mary Wells, but not for them.
And the Velvelettes can sing anything, absolutely anything.