[REMOVE ADS]




Results 1 to 32 of 32
  1. #1

    problems with album track lineup

    which albums suffered from an odd or questionable lineup of the songs? where there was some sort of uneven pacing or where one song doesn't really properly follow the other?

    for instance:

    Diana Ross 76 - some fans have commented that Kiss Me Now was completely out of place to follow up Love Hangover

    High Energy - having side 2 be pretty much all non-stop ballads

  2. #2
    High Energy features a familiar device of the time used to exhibit the versatility of 1970s soul groups: one side features up-tempo cuts and the other side focuses on ballads.

  3. #3
    I'm a bit annoyed that the multiple hits included on WDOLG, More Hits, A Go Go, and Sing HDH are all on the same side. Spreading them throughout the album, especially the three from WDOLG and MH, just seems to make more sense to me. They did this with the Symphony album, with the title cut on one side and "My World" on the other, and I think it works best that way than putting them both on the same side.

    "Time And Love" coming in between "Have I Lost You" and "Touch" sucks. We've discussed at length the lack of wisdom of including the song on the album in the first place, however, if it had to be on the album, I could stomach it more as the last track on side one or the first track on side two. Of course if the last track on side one, I'm presented with the problem of what to do with "Johnny Raven", which is an excellent closing track for that side. I do think JR works so well as a closing track, as opposed to an opening one or being sequestered between two other tracks. So maybe the best bet would've been opening side two with Time. As is, opening side two with the beautifully underrated "Have I Lost You" and then going into "Time", which seems so out of place on the entire set, followed by the beautiful "Touch", mars what is otherwise an excellent album's worth of songs. Of course the most ideal situation would be sending "Time And Love" to New Ways and replacing it on Touch with something more appropriate, but that's not the point of this thread.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by blackguy69 View Post
    High Energy features a familiar device of the time used to exhibit the versatility of 1970s soul groups: one side features up-tempo cuts and the other side focuses on ballads.
    Which would've been great on another album, like Supremes 75, but not one titled High Energy. If ballads or mellow tunes had to be included at all, I think it would've worked best being interspersed with the faster ones. But honestly, the ballads should've been held off for the next album. High Energy had the potential to be a very good dance album, since that was the direction the group was hellbent on going in. Keep "Missing", which actually does make for a nice closing number; not too fast, not too slow. Send "Teardrops" (such an excellent cut) and "Boat" to the follow up album.

  5. #5
    I recently came across a "Classic Albums Revisited" article about Diana Ross (1976), which explicitly discusses the problems of the sequencing:
    << It’s a reminder that a great album is more than simply a random selection of great songs; it needs to be sequenced with skill and build up. Ideally, Love Hangover might have been the album’s closing track, a crescendo that leaves the listener on a high. Instead, this LP does feel a little like no one was really thinking of the piece as a whole, perhaps because Ross was seen more as a singles artist.>>

    Here is a link to the full article:
    https://reprobatepress.com/2020/11/0...ed-diana-ross/

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    Which would've been great on another album, like Supremes 75, but not one titled High Energy. If ballads or mellow tunes had to be included at all, I think it would've worked best being interspersed with the faster ones. But honestly, the ballads should've been held off for the next album. High Energy had the potential to be a very good dance album, since that was the direction the group was hellbent on going in. Keep "Missing", which actually does make for a nice closing number; not too fast, not too slow. Send "Teardrops" (such an excellent cut) and "Boat" to the follow up album.
    i agree although according to the Hollands and Beatty, they were very influenced by classical symphonic orchestra and that's why we had the songs and sounds we did. like on I Don't Want to Lose You you have english horns, bassoons, strings, harps, everything. And while strings and brass had long been added to pop records, having a full 50-piece orchestra was a bit different. So i do find that an interesting concept. but yeah, the title is totally incongruous with this. And at the time the girls were struggling so "the supremes do symphony hall" would not really be a great title lolol.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I'm a bit annoyed that the multiple hits included on WDOLG, More Hits, A Go Go, and Sing HDH are all on the same side. Spreading them throughout the album, especially the three from WDOLG and MH, just seems to make more sense to me. They did this with the Symphony album, with the title cut on one side and "My World" on the other, and I think it works best that way than putting them both on the same side.
    Totally agree with you, especially in terms of WDOLG. As usual, I've made my own playlist. I love most of the tracks, but not how it was laid out.

    Side A:
    1. Come See About Me
    2. Your Kiss Of Fire
    3. Where Did Our Love Go
    4. You're Gonna Come To Me
    5. Baby Love
    6. Long Gone Lover
    Side B:
    7. When The Lovelight Starts Shining Through His Eyes
    8. I'm Giving You Your Freedom
    9. A Breath Taking Guy
    10. Standing At The Crossroads Of Love
    11. Run, Run, Run
    12. Ask Any Girl

  8. #8
    For me it was A Go Go.
    Half recorded with the Funk Brothers and half recorded with LA session musicians. Some tracks seem watered down do on my play list I combined Go Go and Sing HDH .it seems to flow better to me

  9. #9
    High energy.
    Side two just to low key for me
    reflections..side two uneven also

  10. #10
    here's one i've struggled a bit with

    Sup 75. i'm not going to go into the fact that they opted to can some stronger tracks that what was released on the lp. for this discussion, let's leave the lp tracks. But Side 2 ends with You Turn Me Around. it's a lovely ballad and excellent performance from Mary. but it ends the lp on too quiet of a note. perhaps end with Give Out or maybe Where Do I Go

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaap View Post
    I recently came across a "Classic Albums Revisited" article about Diana Ross (1976), which explicitly discusses the problems of the sequencing:
    << It’s a reminder that a great album is more than simply a random selection of great songs; it needs to be sequenced with skill and build up. Ideally, Love Hangover might have been the album’s closing track, a crescendo that leaves the listener on a high. Instead, this LP does feel a little like no one was really thinking of the piece as a whole, perhaps because Ross was seen more as a singles artist.>>

    Here is a link to the full article:
    https://reprobatepress.com/2020/11/0...ed-diana-ross/
    I totally disagree with the article in that the black album feels thrown together. Considering the various producers used, the album has a nice cohesive flow to it.
    I also disagree that “Love Hangover” should have been the final track. I generally prefer albums to close on a relatively calm note.
    For me Diana Ross 76 remains the perfect Ross album with the sequencing of the songs spot on. There really is nothing I would change on this classic album.

  12. #12
    I love the Diana ross 76 album.
    My first Ross lp and still a favorite

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    I totally disagree with the article in that the black album feels thrown together. Considering the various producers used, the album has a nice cohesive flow to it.
    I also disagree that “Love Hangover” should have been the final track. I generally prefer albums to close on a relatively calm note.
    For me Diana Ross 76 remains the perfect Ross album with the sequencing of the songs spot on. There really is nothing I would change on this classic album.
    The only song i didn't totally love at the time is Kiss me now. It has grown on me over the years, but i could manage without it. Not sure what i would replace it with though.
    I agree it is a very consistent and cohesive album which is a remarkable achievement considering all the producers involved.
    I recall Diana telling me she wanted to record Why do fools for this album. Berry insisted on a standard being included. She wanted Fools. He wanted Smile. Berry won of course, and i reckon he was right, but it has got me thinking that Fools could have possibly replaced Kiss me now on the album? I am of course assuming a 1976 version would have a more professional production than the 1981 version. Would it have worked? I don't think it would have been a suitable album closer, but perhaps it could have opened side 2?
    She was determined to record it , and a 1976 version would have saved us the heartache of the 1981 version.
    Thoughts?

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddh View Post
    I love the Diana ross 76 album.
    My first Ross lp and still a favorite
    Totally agree David. Love the front and back cover too.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    The only song i didn't totally love at the time is Kiss me now. It has grown on me over the years, but i could manage without it. Not sure what i would replace it with though.
    I agree it is a very consistent and cohesive album which is a remarkable achievement considering all the producers involved.
    I recall Diana telling me she wanted to record Why do fools for this album. Berry insisted on a standard being included. She wanted Fools. He wanted Smile. Berry won of course, and i reckon he was right, but it has got me thinking that Fools could have possibly replaced Kiss me now on the album? I am of course assuming a 1976 version would have a more professional production than the 1981 version. Would it have worked? I don't think it would have been a suitable album closer, but perhaps it could have opened side 2?
    She was determined to record it , and a 1976 version would have saved us the heartache of the 1981 version.
    Thoughts?
    Interesting thought. I think Fools might have provided the light tongue-in-cheek touch following Hangover that Kiss Me Now was attempting. Fools is a more Pop sound than is KMN and closer in uptempo style to LH. The Satchmo-style vocalizing on KMN makes the song sound older and from a different genre than the songs that precede it. KMN is decent but killed the mood on Side 1, imo. It's too bad BG didn't have Diana record WDFFIL anyway. I bet he was kicking himself when it became a hit for her on RCA.
    Last edited by johnjeb; 01-17-2021 at 02:58 PM.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by johnjeb View Post
    Interesting thought. I think Fools might have provided the light tongue-in-cheek touch following Hangover that Kiss Me Now was attempting. Fools is a more Pop sound than is KMN and closer in uptempo style to LH. The Satchmo-style vocalizing on KMN makes the song sound older and from a different genre than the songs that precede it. KMN is decent but killed the mood on Side 1, imo. It's too bad BG didn't have Diana record WDFFIL anyway. I bet he was kicking himself when it became a hit for her on RCA.
    I really like “Kiss Me Now”. It’s a fun little jazzy sounding song that brings a welcome change of pace to the album I always enjoy Diana singing in a lower key anyway.
    “WDFFIL” is just to pop. It would totally have spoilt the whole feel of the album. In this instance Berry knew what he was doing.
    I have always assumed Diana loved “Smile”. She was singing it in concert and was also featured in her tv special.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    I really like “Kiss Me Now”. It’s a fun little jazzy sounding song that brings a welcome change of pace to the album I always enjoy Diana singing in a lower key anyway.
    “WDFFIL” is just to pop. It would totally have spoilt the whole feel of the album. In this instance Berry knew what he was doing.
    I have always assumed Diana loved “Smile”. She was singing it in concert and was also featured in her tv special.
    Id


    Yes she did like Smile. What's not to like about it, but she also loved Fools.

  18. #18
    I think the other track was To Love Again.....but they went with Kiss Me Now.
    KMN may have worked better on Last Time I Saw Him ..but it s all good for me
    It's a fun song .

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddh View Post
    I think the other track was To Love Again.....but they went with Kiss Me Now.
    KMN may have worked better on Last Time I Saw Him ..but it s all good for me
    It's a fun song .
    Smile is the song that, for me, didnít fit the album. Even before I discovered it was recorded in 1972, I felt it didnít belong. I assume Smile was included on the LP because it was featured in Dianaís current stage show, but I would have preferred To Love Again as it complements the other ballads...

  20. #20
    on Diana Ross 76, i see side one as building in passion like sex:

    Do you know - the first glances
    I thought it took - the music is building
    Hangover part 1 - the foreplay
    Hangover part 2 - the passion
    Kiss me now - the playful afterglow

    after such a huge peak of Love Hangover, what on earth do you follow it up with??? another dance track would simply have paled. a full ballad would have been totally inappropriate. Something like You're Good My child would have been lost here. so you need something innocuous and totally different. KMN is just that

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    I really like “Kiss Me Now”. It’s a fun little jazzy sounding song that brings a welcome change of pace to the album I always enjoy Diana singing in a lower key anyway.
    “WDFFIL” is just to pop. It would totally have spoilt the whole feel of the album. In this instance Berry knew what he was doing.
    I have always assumed Diana loved “Smile”. She was singing it in concert and was also featured in her tv special.
    "Kiss Me Now" is cool. Had Diana cut "Fools" in 1976 it would not have been too pop, unless maybe Masser was charged with producing it. In the right hands "Fools" could've been a nice piece of funky disco. Even in 1981 the song could've had a nice funk feel to it, but it wasn't in the right hands. Diana had it. She should've never had another producer credit. Ever. Never. Ever.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyB View Post
    Smile is the song that, for me, didn’t fit the album. Even before I discovered it was recorded in 1972, I felt it didn’t belong. I assume Smile was included on the LP because it was featured in Diana’s current stage show, but I would have preferred To Love Again as it complements the other ballads...
    Agreed. Horrible fit. I love the cut. She sings it so beautifully. If Gordy wanted it released so bad he should've included it on the GH album later that year. Perfectly fine with that. But on DR76 it throws off the vibe of the album for me. As it is I'm not as wowed by the album as a lot of fans are. "Smile" is the extreme, but the truth is that two of the three Masser tunes also throw off the vibe of the other tracks, making the album feel a bit uneven for my taste. Surprisingly, Diana did a great job as producer for "Aint Nothin But A Maybe". I would've liked more stuff like that one or "You're Good My Child". "Mahogany" was already on the soundtrack and "After You" (which I do love on it's own) could've been a B side. I think funkin' up the album some more would've proved a bigger success. Certainly I would play it much more than I do.

  23. #23
    not sure the true funk sound really worked with Diana. the Bowen track on the EE for this album wasn't hugely impressive. not terrible but i think it's pretty clear the genre wasn't necessarily a strong one for her

    the released DR 76 is a varied set. i think because the majority of the songs are high quality, it works. a good song is a good song. when you're using so many different approaches and producers, you can be successful with releasing an album with the premise of "a little something for everyone." but it demands that every track is very strong and perfectly produced. for DR 76 i think we have it. same with Touch me in the morning. weaker examples would be Sup 75, Silk Electric and Last Time.

    with DR 76 you have big lush ballads (theme mahogany, after you), dance tracks (LH and one love), pop (i thought it took), MOR (smile), strong r&b (you're good, ain't nothing)

    i wouldn't have been crushed if Smile had been pulled off. great idea to include on GH. in its place i think Harmony would have worked well. To Love Again is another option but that might be too many ballads and pulling the vibe down too much

  24. #24
    I love the way most of the LPS are sequenced....Reflections and Let The Sunshine In also have 3 (meaning all) singles on one side. The 3 biggest hits are also on side one of GH Vol.3

    I am not overly familiar with other acts total LP discographies....but aren't there early Marvin Gaye and Temptations LP's where 3 singles appear on the same side?...I'm wondering could this have taken into consideration that most record players in the 60's were capable of stacking 6-12 LPs for continuous play, and to get the hits folks may prefer a stack of singles over having to flip the LP???? Bigger sales if the hits were on 1 side?

    The title High Energy track is a great opener....You're What's Missing closes the LP fine, midtempo and a few beats up from a ballad.
    I've already gone on endlessly about how TOUCH is my all time fav Supremes LP and how I hate Time and Love....if it had to go anywhere...New Ways (or even Webb)
    Kiss Me Now is Fun
    I love entire side ones of Reflections, Love Child, Ross '78 and Mary Scherrie and Susaye…

  25. #25
    “To Love Again” instead of “Smile” would have been a bad idea “Smile” is an uplifting song that ensures the album ends on a positive note.
    Agree that “Kiss Me Now was the perfect song to Follow the sultry LH. A fun or lightly funky track was needed and another ballad would have been one to many.
    “Ain’t Nothing But A Maybe” has become one of my favourite songs from the album. I always thought it would have fitted well on BIM. I so wish Diana had recorded more songs in this vein. Diana sings Rufus. Now that might have made for an interesting album.

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    “To Love Again” instead of “Smile” would have been a bad idea “Smile” is an uplifting song that ensures the album ends on a positive note.
    Agree that “Kiss Me Now was the perfect song to Follow the sultry LH. A fun or lightly funky track was needed and another ballad would have been one to many.
    “Ain’t Nothing But A Maybe” has become one of my favourite songs from the album. I always thought it would have fitted well on BIM. I so wish Diana had recorded more songs in this vein. Diana sings Rufus. Now that might have made for an interesting album.
    I agree, Ollie & Sup-fan. The album is a gem of an album as is. Smile and Kiss Me Now close both sides perfectly. I've always loved Ain't Nothin' But A Maybe. I forgot it was produced by Diana!

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    Agreed. Horrible fit. I love the cut. She sings it so beautifully. If Gordy wanted it released so bad he should've included it on the GH album later that year. Perfectly fine with that. But on DR76 it throws off the vibe of the album for me. As it is I'm not as wowed by the album as a lot of fans are. "Smile" is the extreme, but the truth is that two of the three Masser tunes also throw off the vibe of the other tracks, making the album feel a bit uneven for my taste. Surprisingly, Diana did a great job as producer for "Aint Nothin But A Maybe". I would've liked more stuff like that one or "You're Good My Child". "Mahogany" was already on the soundtrack and "After You" (which I do love on it's own) could've been a B side. I think funkin' up the album some more would've proved a bigger success. Certainly I would play it much more than I do.
    ”ANBAM” sounds rather good, making me sceptical of the involvement Diana really had in the production of this song.
    I think “Your Love Is So Good For Me” would have made a great opener for side 2 of DR 76. I always thought the song a little tucked away as the final track on side 1 of “Baby It’s Me”. It would have been much better placed opening up side 2 of the album in place of “Top Of The World”.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    ”ANBAM” sounds rather good, making me sceptical of the involvement Diana really had in the production of this song.
    I think “Your Love Is So Good For Me” would have made a great opener for side 2 of DR 76. I always thought the song a little tucked away as the final track on side 1 of “Baby It’s Me”. It would have been much better placed opening up side 2 of the album in place of “Top Of The World”.
    Your scepitism is not misplaced Ollie! That is all i shall say on the the subject.

  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    Your scepitism is not misplaced Ollie! That is all i shall say on the the subject.
    Intrigued Mr B. Reading through the lines, i’m guessing Diana left her producers cap hanging on the hook at home for this number. Am I getting warm?.

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    Intrigued Mr B. Reading through the lines, i’m guessing Diana left her producers cap hanging on the hook at home for this number. Am I getting warm?.
    You could be onto something here!

  31. #31
    I loved Your Love Is So Good For Me....the 12" version is much better....perhaps switching positions for the title cut, and YLISGFM would have worked better. Baby It's Me is my fav DR solo LP...I am not fond of the 2 ballards (Too Shy, Confide)...I like any of the Michael Masser stuff way better

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by gman View Post
    I loved Your Love Is So Good For Me....the 12" version is much better....perhaps switching positions for the title cut, and YLISGFM would have worked better. Baby It's Me is my fav DR solo LP...I am not fond of the 2 ballards (Too Shy, Confide)...I like any of the Michael Masser stuff way better
    Agree, the 12” version has a lot more punch and vitality. I think it should have been the first track on the album or open up side 2. It certainly needed a remix to give it more oomph. The album version is way to tame.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

[REMOVE ADS]

Ralph Terrana
MODERATOR

Welcome to Soulful Detroit! Kindly Consider Turning Off Your Ad BlockingX
Soulful Detroit is a free service that relies on revenue from ad display [regrettably] and donations. We notice that you are using an ad-blocking program that prevents us from earning revenue during your visit.
Ads are REMOVED for Members who donate to Soulful Detroit. [You must be logged in for ads to disappear]
DONATE HERE »
And have Ads removed.