[REMOVE ADS]




Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 98
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85

    Diana Ross, 5th Dimension and song "stealing"

    Hi guys

    A few months ago I posted a thread on here about the 5th Dimension's cover of Love Hangover and I was surprised at how many fans here felt like they "stole Diana's song." Since then, I've learned that Diana Ross and/or the Supremes have "stolen" a bunch of the 5th Dimension's songs including Stoned Soul Picnic, Aquarius, and Dont'cha Hear Me Calling to You. On top of that, both entities [[for lack of a better term) recorded the same songs over the years, including but not limited to, Time and Love, I Thought it Took a Little Time [[but today I Fell in Love), Surrender, Love's Lines Angles and Rhymes, Up Up and Away, Leave a Little Room, etc. Back then nobody accused anybody of stealing anything. Seems like DR and/or Supremes covered more 5th songs than the other way around so why is Love Hangover considered stolen property but not the others? Neither DR nor the 5th wrote their own material, so add that to the mix. To my way of thinking, the writers/publishers owned these songs, not the performers. Am I wrong?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    11,248
    Rep Power
    291
    Well Love Hangover as far as I know was written for Diana, was a single release and did the 5th release [[rush)their version first? I can understand her/Motown not liking that although did Motown do the same thing with Thelma and Dont Leave Me This way?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    4,000
    Rep Power
    262
    I don't think so.... Don't leave me this way was given to Thelma Houston because Moton or Berry didn't want Diana to be cast as a disco artist. In fact I don't think Diana even did a recording of it.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    11,248
    Rep Power
    291
    I was comparing the release of Love Hangover with Don’t leave me this way by Harold Melvin first.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Luke many of the songs I listed were singles and I don't know if Love Hangover was written specifically for anybody. If it was, it's news to me. I guess when I started this thread I was just wondering why some fans think this song or that one was the property of a single artist while others seem to get re-recorded over and over and nobody cares. Look at Aquarius. That's been recorded by every artist currently living and nobody raised an eyebrow. I could kind of see this attitude if the objecting artist wrote the song but in the case of Love Hangover none of the singers involved wrote a word or note of it. I'm just trying to figure out why people think the way they do.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    11,248
    Rep Power
    291
    Well Berry rushed out Cone see about me because A singer rushed out hers first. I don’t think album cuts Have mattered the way intended singles have

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    3,646
    Rep Power
    317
    Some of the example songs mentioned in this thread [[Aquarius, etc) are cover songs of hit records.

    Love Hangover was an album cut on Diana's album which was probably not intended to be a single since Berry was leery of disco. But club DJ's discovered the album cut, liked it and started playing it. Diana's version was getting popular in clubs.

    Then The 5th Dimension recorded the song and released it while "I Thought It Took A Little Time" was climbing the charts. So in that sense, they "stole" Diana's song

    The popularity of Diana's version in discos and seeing the Dimensions' version starting to rise on the charts got Berry's attention and he quickly put out Diana's version of "Love Hangover" as a single. So in that sense, Diana may have stolen a potential hit from the Dimension

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    809
    Rep Power
    165
    Show business is cut throat.

    Covering a track some time after it has first appeared is totally different from covering a new song from an album although there's nothing "illegal" about it.

    Anyway in the long run the American public en masse showed whose version they thought was better.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    3,942
    Rep Power
    436
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Hi guys

    A few months ago I posted a thread on here about the 5th Dimension's cover of Love Hangover and I was surprised at how many fans here felt like they "stole Diana's song." Since then, I've learned that Diana Ross and/or the Supremes have "stolen" a bunch of the 5th Dimension's songs including Stoned Soul Picnic, Aquarius, and Dont'cha Hear Me Calling to You. On top of that, both entities [[for lack of a better term) recorded the same songs over the years, including but not limited to, Time and Love, I Thought it Took a Little Time [[but today I Fell in Love), Surrender, Love's Lines Angles and Rhymes, Up Up and Away, Leave a Little Room, etc. Back then nobody accused anybody of stealing anything. Seems like DR and/or Supremes covered more 5th songs than the other way around so why is Love Hangover considered stolen property but not the others? Neither DR nor the 5th wrote their own material, so add that to the mix. To my way of thinking, the writers/publishers owned these songs, not the performers. Am I wrong?
    No you're not wrong. Diana Ross didn't "steal" "Love Hangover" from The 5th Dimension any more than Aretha Franklin "stole" "Respect" from Otis Redding. Some songs just are meant to be done by certain performers to get the reaction from the public that makes them hit songs.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    8,754
    Rep Power
    391
    if a songwriter pens a song and then offers it to multiple labels, producers and/or artists, then you have a situation where multiple artists might record it, sometimes in very different styles.

    Love Hangover was written by Marilyn McLeod and Pam Sawyer, both staff writers at motown. it's part of the jobete catalog. Motown was definitely not in the habit of handing out potential hit songs to other labels and artists. Sure once a song was a hit for motown, they were thrilled to gather additional royalties from artists covering it.

    LH is a similar situation to Come See About Me. a motown song that was included on an LP and most likely intended for single release. But another song was released first and in the meantime, another artist jumps on the sleeper hit.

    5D definitely "stole" the song but who could blame them. all the power to them. but to the same point, no tears that motown responded as they did. 5D made a good try but lost. oh well

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Motown Eddie I think you misunderstood what I was saying on one point. I said fans thought the 5th stole that song from DR, not the other way around. Regardless, I agree with you--Motown artists were famous for covering other people's hits. Nobody thought there was anything wrong with it--except when it came to this one song.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Posts
    1,245
    Rep Power
    163
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Motown Eddie I think you misunderstood what I was saying on one point. I said fans thought the 5th stole that song from DR, not the other way around. Regardless, I agree with you--Motown artists were famous for covering other people's hits. Nobody thought there was anything wrong with it--except when it came to this one song.
    I think most people aware of this issue feel LH was "stolen" by 5D from DR. Motown made the right decision to rush release LH. It was too good not to be released as a single. I love I Thought It Took a Little Time but I don't think it would have been a #1 hit. It may have reached Top Twenty or even Top Ten with the right promotion, but the Fifth Dimension move made it moot.

    I don't blame the Fifth, just as I don't blame Nella Dodd about Come See About Me. Both songs had potential to be major hits. I'm so glad Motown made the right decisions in both cases.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Fair enough, Lucky. I know a couple of professional songwriters and they mostly don't care who records their songs as long as they get paid. Most barely, if ever, know all who have recorded their songs--it's not up to them who gets to do them anyway. All this being said, I really doubt Laura Nyro went around complaining that both the 5th and the Supremes recorded Stoned Soul Picnic. Ta' ching!

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    10,018
    Rep Power
    305
    According to the timeline, Diana recorded LH first in 1975 but Motown initially decided it was an "album cut". Upon hearing the song themselves, 5D decided to record it and release it as a single. Motown heard about this and rush-released an edited version of Diana's single.

    The rest is music history.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    892
    Rep Power
    146
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    According to the timeline, Diana recorded LH first in 1975 but Motown initially decided it was an "album cut". Upon hearing the song themselves, 5D decided to record it and release it as a single. Motown heard about this and rush-released an edited version of Diana's single.

    The rest is music history.
    I never believed it was just an “album cut”. Everything about it screams masterpiece. Motown had a habit of choosing the wrong lead singles in the 70’s. I think they knew they had a hit on their hands, and was going to release as a follow up single.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by milven View Post
    Some of the example songs mentioned in this thread [[Aquarius, etc) are cover songs of hit records.

    Love Hangover was an album cut on Diana's album which was probably not intended to be a single since Berry was leery of disco. But club DJ's discovered the album cut, liked it and started playing it. Diana's version was getting popular in clubs.

    Then The 5th Dimension recorded the song and released it while "I Thought It Took A Little Time" was climbing the charts. So in that sense, they "stole" Diana's song

    The popularity of Diana's version in discos and seeing the Dimensions' version starting to rise on the charts got Berry's attention and he quickly put out Diana's version of "Love Hangover" as a single. So in that sense, Diana may have stolen a potential hit from the Dimension
    I think the use of the word "stole" is unnecessarily inflammatory for the case of "Love Hangover". What happened in the 50s to folks like Little Richard is probably the best case for the use of the term. I'm uncomfortable suggesting that's what happened here with LH. However, to your first point, it's worth pointing out that covering an already popular song widely associated with someone else is one thing. To cover and release a single of a song from a current album is quite another. Still not "theft" in my opinion, but there is some difference from a professional aspect, I would assume.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by Motown Eddie View Post
    No you're not wrong. Diana Ross didn't "steal" "Love Hangover" from The 5th Dimension any more than Aretha Franklin "stole" "Respect" from Otis Redding. Some songs just are meant to be done by certain performers to get the reaction from the public that makes them hit songs.
    What Aretha did was "theft" with a whole other meaning. "Respect" was already synonymous with Otis. He had a top 10 and top 40 hit with it almost two years before Ree's version was released. When she hit with it, the song instantly became synonymous with her. While Otis' version remains respected, that's Aretha's song forever. One can definitely say she "stole" it, although again, not in the nefarious way the word connotes.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by khansperac View Post
    I never believed it was just an “album cut”. Everything about it screams masterpiece. Motown had a habit of choosing the wrong lead singles in the 70’s. I think they knew they had a hit on their hands, and was going to release as a follow up single.
    I said the same thing in a previous thread about the song. There was too much energy put into it. If the story about Ross needing loosening up and being provided liquor to do so prior to recording "Love Hangover" is true, that tells me that Hal was preparing this song for possible single release. You don't ply Diana Ross with alcohol for an album track. That's definitely "We have a hit on our hands if she just cooperate" type of move.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Some singers aren't as fond as others of their songs being covered at all. But I imagine that most artists would be annoyed by any other artist covering their current single, and that would extend to any potential singles on said artist's album. 5D did nothing wrong or unethical. Likewise, neither did Motown, especially if it was in Motown's plan the whole time to release "Hangover" as the second single. "Love Hangover" is not the first time competing versions of a song were out at the same time. I can't think off the top of my head of any instances where both versions were a hit, but I imagine for the vast majority, one song rising and the other floundering or disappearing altogether is just the public saying they prefer one over another. Although there is an argument to be made about the promotional aspect. Not sure who was behind the 5D at the time [[not a fan), but could they match Motown's promotional efforts for Ross' version? That also makes a difference.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    337
    Rep Power
    178
    A good friend worked for King Karol records in New York and reported weekly to Motown's promotion people. He told me since "Love Hangover" was so big in clubs and getting radio play Motown hoped people would buy the whole album to own it and they were confident they could get a radio hit with "Took A Little Time" in the meantime. Once the ballad had a solid spot on the charts, top 20 or top 10 it's likely they would have released the radio edit of "Love Hangover." The 5th Dimension release forced their hand. He also told me that he was encouraged weekly to try to keep "Took A Little Time" alive. It did fine AC but they lost it on the pop charts. Too bad they didn't release it sooner right after "Mahogany" peaked. It could have preceded the album by 3 or 4 weeks and certainly would have secured a higher chart position.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Very interesting, Sol. I love behind-the-scenes stories like this.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    397
    Rep Power
    160
    Funny this thread popped up just as I started to re-listen to the 5th Dimension last week. I love the Supremes and most of their hits and other songs are top notch. But as I listened to Up up and away by the 5th Dimension I looked up the Supremes [[Diana and Andantes) version and I have to say it's weak! The 5th Dimension version is strong from intro to end,backing track to all it's member's harmonies and layers. Supremes version should have stayed in the faults "just my opinion". Diana sounds weak, the backing track is weak and the andantes, who I normally like in the background, sound weak too. Marilyn hits at the end the high note with balloon but Diana seems to not even try.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Tyk if you thought that was weak, check out DR's version of the 5th's song Dont'cha Hear Me Calling to You, then listen to the 5th original.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    4,675
    Rep Power
    308
    Quote Originally Posted by George Solomon View Post
    A good friend worked for King Karol records in New York and reported weekly to Motown's promotion people. He told me since "Love Hangover" was so big in clubs and getting radio play Motown hoped people would buy the whole album to own it and they were confident they could get a radio hit with "Took A Little Time" in the meantime. Once the ballad had a solid spot on the charts, top 20 or top 10 it's likely they would have released the radio edit of "Love Hangover." The 5th Dimension release forced their hand. He also told me that he was encouraged weekly to try to keep "Took A Little Time" alive. It did fine AC but they lost it on the pop charts. Too bad they didn't release it sooner right after "Mahogany" peaked. It could have preceded the album by 3 or 4 weeks and certainly would have secured a higher chart position.

    ^^^ This makes the most sense.
    Motown thought they had all the time in the world to work LOVE HANGOVER after IT TOOK A LITTLE TIME ran its due course. They likely figured LH would gather steam through the exposure of the discos playing it, and that would take a few weeks for it to crossover as was typical for disco. Let the clubs do the initial grunt work. I don't think they were ready for it to catch on with the magnitude that it did , nor did they realize just how potent disco play had the potential to be. Thus far their disco releases hadn't bonfired to that magnitude the way LOVE HANGOVER did, DOWN TO LOVE TOWN a tragically good example of a club favorite that got ignored otherwise.

    Most importantly , they certainly didn't expect some other act to intentionally steal the song off a new album and rush release it as a single ahead of Diana. I don't think that has ever happened with any other record .........ever ......??

    DON"T LEAVE ME THIS WAY was fare game as it wasn't released by Thelma for a two full years after Harold Melvin's version, which INCREDIBLY , PI failed to release as a single in the first place.

    Once Thelma's version took off I wonder how tempted Gamble and Huff were to release their own version . That could've been great fun!
    They did do so in England , although I don't know if the two versions were literally charting hand in hand. Anyone recall that ??

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    9,279
    Rep Power
    519
    Quote Originally Posted by Boogiedown View Post

    Most importantly , they certainly didn't expect some other act to intentionally steal the song off a new album and rush release it as a single ahead of Diana. I don't think that has ever happened with any other record .........ever ......??
    It happened with the Supremes' COME SEE ABOUT ME. At the time, it was an album track that Nella Dodds heard, liked, and recorded her own version of. Scepter released it as a single, prompting Motown to rush-release the Supremes' version, even though BABY LOVE had only been out for a month.

    And according to Florence LaRue of the Fifth Dimension, it is not like Motown was unaware of the Fifth's plans for LOVE HANGOVER. In an interview with Black Stars magazine, Florence said their manager asked Motown if they were going to release Diana's version as a single and they said no. So the Fifth recorded and released theirs.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    10,018
    Rep Power
    305
    Quote Originally Posted by George Solomon View Post
    A good friend worked for King Karol records in New York and reported weekly to Motown's promotion people. He told me since "Love Hangover" was so big in clubs and getting radio play Motown hoped people would buy the whole album to own it and they were confident they could get a radio hit with "Took A Little Time" in the meantime. Once the ballad had a solid spot on the charts, top 20 or top 10 it's likely they would have released the radio edit of "Love Hangover." The 5th Dimension release forced their hand. He also told me that he was encouraged weekly to try to keep "Took A Little Time" alive. It did fine AC but they lost it on the pop charts. Too bad they didn't release it sooner right after "Mahogany" peaked. It could have preceded the album by 3 or 4 weeks and certainly would have secured a higher chart position.
    Motown should've released Love Hangover FIRST and then "Took a Little Time" after that. They screwed up her career. If Berry hadn't given up control of the music department to Ewart Abner and Smokey, maybe her solo career would've been even bigger than it was.

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    10,018
    Rep Power
    305
    Quote Originally Posted by khansperac View Post
    I never believed it was just an “album cut”. Everything about it screams masterpiece. Motown had a habit of choosing the wrong lead singles in the 70’s. I think they knew they had a hit on their hands, and was going to release as a follow up single.
    Motown nearly missed on Love Hangover then, if that was the case. 'Cause, like you said, everything about the song was a masterpiece. It was also a good re-introduction to Diana for the DISCO audience, who probably tuned her out after she left the Supremes or were too young to experience her in that era.

  28. #28
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    397
    Rep Power
    160
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Tyk if you thought that was weak, check out DR's version of the 5th's song Dont'cha Hear Me Calling to You, then listen to the 5th original.
    Never heard Diana's version. Just listened and must say it sounds pretty bad indeed. A lot of the 5th dimension songs sound good because of a group effort. The male/female thing just worked for them and when some of their songs are recorded by solo artist they don't sound good to me.

    Back to the stealing thing. I love it when several artists record the same song. Gives us listeners an option. As long as all the people involved get some credit for it, which they do anyway I guess. If I were a writer I'd be honoured if multiple artists would want to record my song. Was there a licence or rule in the 70's concerning the covering of each others songs? Stealing just seems a bit of a harsh word. If Florence said that that their manager more of less asked for permission then you can't call it stealing.

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    13,337
    Rep Power
    100
    When artists start "stealing" songs, the songwriters start popping Champaign bottles.

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    4,955
    Rep Power
    378
    Quote Originally Posted by ralpht View Post
    When artists start "stealing" songs, the songwriters start popping Champaign bottles.
    Makes sense Ralpht. I rather suspect they do.

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    4,955
    Rep Power
    378
    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I think the use of the word "stole" is unnecessarily inflammatory for the case of "Love Hangover". What happened in the 50s to folks like Little Richard is probably the best case for the use of the term. I'm uncomfortable suggesting that's what happened here with LH. However, to your first point, it's worth pointing out that covering an already popular song widely associated with someone else is one thing. To cover and release a single of a song from a current album is quite another. Still not "theft" in my opinion, but there is some difference from a professional aspect, I would assume.
    Agree. The same situation happened with “It’s My House”, when a group named Storm released their own version of the song prior to Diana’s The only difference being that “House” did not go on to become the mega hit LH did.. Although imo it should have.

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,411
    Rep Power
    182
    artists generally 'cover' [[do a version of)a song after the original artist gets to enjoy their day in the sun... the Supremes covered many songs AFTER the song's initial success had come and gone.. in the case of "Hangover" which was a brand new track on a new Ross album,. the 5th-ers turned into grifters, tried to take a new song as their own, and they failed.. the original was a thousand times superior to their rush job, and the Ross fans [[including yours truly) were not havin it!

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    9,279
    Rep Power
    519
    I thought performers had to request a mechanical license from a publisher before recording a song but I don't know if that is true. I'm sure that in most cases, publishers are happy to see their compositions recorded.

    But in the case of Jobete, being that they were Motown's publishing arm, I would think there would be more communication between the two. I mean, why would Jobete give Nella Dodds permission to record COME SEE ABOUT ME when it most likely was going to end up being another Supremes release? I could ask the same about giving the 5D permission to record LOVE HANGOVER.

    In the end I guess it is the publisher's job to work their catalog and get the songs recorded by whomever. For instance, Millie Jackson recorded and released the Jobete composition YOU CAN'T TURN ME OFF on her LOVINGLY YOURS album in 1976. But it didn't become a hit until High Inergy recorded it for Motown the next year.

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,411
    Rep Power
    182
    you don't need permission to cover a song as long as you credit the publisher and composers and make sure the royalty payments show up.. you can even screw around with the lyrics as long as you label the release a 'parody' as per Weird Al etc [[ although I understand he always asks first)

  35. #35
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,411
    Rep Power
    182
    Jobete did not give Nella Dodds permission that was a sneak attack as it was an obvious hit song.. Dodds label just had to credit Jobete and H D H and pay the royalties

  36. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Tyke--it sounds like Diana is singing backing vocals, not lead--but the producers pumped up her vocals to make them seem like lead vocals. They were wise to keep Dont'cha Hear Me in the can.

  37. #37
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    10,018
    Rep Power
    305
    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    I thought performers had to request a mechanical license from a publisher before recording a song but I don't know if that is true. I'm sure that in most cases, publishers are happy to see their compositions recorded.

    But in the case of Jobete, being that they were Motown's publishing arm, I would think there would be more communication between the two. I mean, why would Jobete give Nella Dodds permission to record COME SEE ABOUT ME when it most likely was going to end up being another Supremes release? I could ask the same about giving the 5D permission to record LOVE HANGOVER.

    In the end I guess it is the publisher's job to work their catalog and get the songs recorded by whomever. For instance, Millie Jackson recorded and released the Jobete composition YOU CAN'T TURN ME OFF on her LOVINGLY YOURS album in 1976. But it didn't become a hit until High Inergy recorded it for Motown the next year.
    I was confused by that. I remember reading the credits page of Anita Baker's Rapture album and "Same Ole Love [[365 Days a Year)" was licensed under Jobete!

  38. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    9,279
    Rep Power
    519
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    I was confused by that. I remember reading the credits page of Anita Baker's Rapture album and "Same Ole Love [[365 Days a Year)" was licensed under Jobete!
    From the same album, SWEET LOVE was published by Gwen Gordy's company Old Brompton Road and administered by Jobete. In his book, Berry mentioned that Gwen made a lot of money from that song and the family called a meeting to reign in her spending.

  39. #39
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    10,018
    Rep Power
    305
    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    From the same album, SWEET LOVE was published by Gwen Gordy's company Old Brompton Road and administered by Jobete. In his book, Berry mentioned that Gwen made a lot of money from that song and the family called a meeting to reign in her spending.
    Forgot about that one. Wow.

  40. #40
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    4,675
    Rep Power
    308
    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    It happened with the Supremes' COME SEE ABOUT ME. At the time, it was an album track that Nella Dodds heard, liked, and recorded her own version of. Scepter released it as a single, prompting Motown to rush-release the Supremes' version, even though BABY LOVE had only been out for a month.
    You are rich with information Reese. Imagine releasing a second single four weeks after the prior one . That's unheard of! I wonder if Motown even learned something from the successful results of that, don't waste a single second to get that next single out. Keep the act on the charts continuously when possible, maintain the inertia.

    reese:


    And according to Florence LaRue of the Fifth Dimension, it is not like Motown was unaware of the Fifth's plans for LOVE HANGOVER. In an interview with Black Stars magazine, Florence said their manager asked Motown if they were going to release Diana's version as a single and they said no. So the Fifth recorded and released theirs.
    Well it stands to reason that Florence would put a favorable spin on this since the manager she is referring to, Marc Gordon, was also her husband at the time. I find it believable, probable, that a discussion happened.
    Who does Florence mean when she says there was a discussion with Motown? My guess would be the conversation was with Hal Davis the mastermind behind LOVE HANGOVER. After all he and Marc were good friends resulting from their close working relationship in the 60s at Motown.
    Last edited by Boogiedown; 07-08-2020 at 03:06 PM.

  41. #41
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Boogie--are you talking about the Black Stars interview called something like What Went Wrong and Why? Co-starring the Temptations. I remember that, if so. It was 1976 or something like that.

  42. #42
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    4,675
    Rep Power
    308
    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyC View Post
    Boogie--are you talking about the Black Stars interview called something like What Went Wrong and Why? Co-starring the Temptations. I remember that, if so. It was 1976 or something like that.
    Bobby , I don't know. I'm quoting reese on that one. I divided his post but didn't credit him on the second part , I see the confusion. I'll fix it!

    Sounds like an interesting article!

  43. #43
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    I remember that article--or pieces of it. Basically it was about the downfall of the 5th Dimension and the Temptations. Florence claimed she had "no clue, no inkling" that Billy and Marilyn were leaving, which i found hard to believe. How do you work that closely with two people, for a decade, and not even think they might leave the group? Florence also admitted that she was envious of Marilyn getting most of the leads. It was a very good interview overall as I recall. Pretty honest for the most part. I don't remember much of what Otis said on the Temptations side.

  44. #44
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by TYK1986 View Post
    Never heard Diana's version. Just listened and must say it sounds pretty bad indeed. A lot of the 5th dimension songs sound good because of a group effort. The male/female thing just worked for them and when some of their songs are recorded by solo artist they don't sound good to me.
    For the record, that's an outtake from a television show. It was never intended for anything other than that television appearance. Although, for the record, I think she sounds great.

  45. #45
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    397
    Rep Power
    160
    Yes I should read the bit under the video next time lol. Listened again and just don't like it. She sounds better to me on slightly slower past songs like Touch me in the morning or Remember me "two of my faves".

  46. #46
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by TYK1986 View Post
    Yes I should read the bit under the video next time lol. Listened again and just don't like it. She sounds better to me on slightly slower past songs like Touch me in the morning or Remember me "two of my faves".
    That's cool. I don't care for it myself, although I think she sounds great. Of course I'm unfamiliar with the version by the 5D. I am not a fan of theirs at all, aside from the gorgeous "One Less Bell To Answer". I never did care for anyone's version of "Up, Up and Away", but I have to admit that I find the Supremes' version listenable now, even if I still don't care for it.

  47. #47
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    397
    Rep Power
    160
    I'm sure a Temp/Supremes duet of Up up and away would have sounded great. The 5th Dim. version is the only one I like because of the use of both male/female voices. Going from bits where Florence and Marilyn sing soft to the strong voices of the boys and then followed by the higher notes by Florence and Marilyn. Sorry I always have to observe songs rather than liking a song because I like an artist or group.

  48. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    4,955
    Rep Power
    378
    Quote Originally Posted by TYK1986 View Post
    I'm sure a Temp/Supremes duet of Up up and away would have sounded great. The 5th Dim. version is the only one I like because of the use of both male/female voices. Going from bits where Florence and Marilyn sing soft to the strong voices of the boys and then followed by the higher notes by Florence and Marilyn. Sorry I always have to observe songs rather than liking a song because I like an artist or group.
    I really like the lower key Diana starts the song in but it has never been one of my fave Supreme recordings. I agree that it might have worked far better as a Supremes/Tempts duet. The combination of male and female voices would have added some colour and interest. As it stands, not a classic.

  49. #49
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    8,635
    Rep Power
    525
    Quote Originally Posted by TYK1986 View Post
    Sorry I always have to observe songs rather than liking a song because I like an artist or group.
    I think that's how most of us listen to music. I don't know anyone who loves every song their favorite artist has done. I don't like the 5D but I love "One Less Bell".

  50. #50
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    1,087
    Rep Power
    85
    Since you all brought up Up Up and Away--LaMonte McLemore of the 5th tried to get the group signed to Motown in 1966 but was not successful. Marc Gordon, their manager at the time, said not to worry about it because if they had signed with Motown they'd have gotten lost amidst the Supremes, Temptations etc. Marc suggested that they go instead over to Johnny Rivers' Soul City label, which they did, and the group became a priority there. This was a great move--their very first single Go Where You Wanna Go hit the top 25, paving the way for Up Up and Away which broke the top 10 and became their signature song. in 1967, after Up Up and Away hit big, LaMonte happened to run into Berry Gordy. Berry knew exactly who the 5th Dimension was and asked LaMonte if that "balloon" song was on the demo tape LaMonte supplied him with a month prior. Obviously Berry was a bit annoyed that he passed on such a huge hit--but he shouldn't have been since Up Up and Away was NOT on the demo. LaMonte decided to yank Berry's chain and told him it was. Hee hee!

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

[REMOVE ADS]

Ralph Terrana
MODERATOR

Welcome to Soulful Detroit! Kindly Consider Turning Off Your Ad BlockingX
Soulful Detroit is a free service that relies on revenue from ad display [regrettably] and donations. We notice that you are using an ad-blocking program that prevents us from earning revenue during your visit.
Ads are REMOVED for Members who donate to Soulful Detroit. [You must be logged in for ads to disappear]
DONATE HERE »
And have Ads removed.