Diana Ross Has Earned Every Single Penny She’s Made!

[milven]

JUN 4, 2020 3:26 PM·
BY JOYANN JEFFREY


Not many artists have seen the type of success Diana Ross has had in her career. After rising to fame with The Supremes in the 1960s, Diana, 76, has accumulated a very impressive net worth of $250 million

As the lead singer of the group, Diana helped The Supremes become Motown’s most successful act. By the time they disbanded in 1977, the group already had 12 No. 1 hit singles on the U.S Billboard Hot 100 chart and were labeled one of the best-selling girl groups of all time.

Once Diana embarked on her solo music career, she made a couple of hit singles on her own like “Ain’t No Mountain High Enough,” which was originally recorded by Marvin Gaye and Tammi Terrell, and “Touch Me in the Morning.” Although she has never won a Grammy, the performer has been nominated for one 12 times, and in 1973, she won her first Golden Globe award for playing Billie Holiday in Lady Sings the Blues.

While recalling her amazing career, the “Baby Love” musician told the Bay State Banner in September 2015 that singing has always been something she enjoyed doing. “I love to sing. I love performing before an audience and entertaining, it makes me feel good, and I do hope that the audience shares in that feel-good feeling,” the mom of five to kids — Tracee, Rhonda, Chudney, Evan, and Ross — gushed. “I have a wonderful backing band, rhythm section, horns and singers and we just have a good time on stage we really have fun.”

Even though Diana hasn’t released a studio album since 2006, she hasn’t stopped performing. The Wiz star sang a few of her greatest hits at the 2019 Grammys for her 75th birthday and she said the secret to longevity in the entertainment industry is to “love what you do” and “keep your life balanced.”

“I’m always balancing my travels and my family. My family is the most important priority to me. I have always felt it’s important to stay present, to stay in the moment,” Diana explained. “I never try to think about longevity or legacy. For me, if I could live a good life now, if I can do the things that bring me joy, if I can enjoy my children and grandchildren and enjoy performing … that is love and that is my life.”




https://www.closerweekly.com/posts/d...e-singer-made/

[Circa 1824]

I disagree. She wrote a sh*t book for which she got much money, and made sh*t music which RCA paid her $17 million. She tried to make another fortune with a fake Supremes reunion tour. She also does decades-old low cost tours and concerts, but charges top dollar. She also sticks decades-old pictures on new album covers. The lady often tries to take more than she gives, but it usually ends up biting her in the ass.

[Ollie9]

It’s interesting the article refers to her as “the Wiz star”. I guess this has become her most well known movie. I would sooner it was the LSTB star lol.

[TheMotownManiac]

I disagree. She wrote a sh*t book for which she got much money, and made sh*t music which RCA paid her $17 million. She tried to make another fortune with a fake Supremes reunion tour. She also does decades-old low cost tours and concerts, but charges top dollar. She also sticks decades-old pictures on new album covers. The lady often tries to take more than she gives, but it usually ends up biting her in the ass.

i disagree. She worked like a dog for an abusive Svengali - worked so hard that even her detractors gave her props - and was robbed blind. She earned every nickel of the rca deal because they paid it. If it was a bad investment, that’s show biz. They wouldn’t have paid her 20 million if she hadn’t earned that signing bonus. If they didn’t like the music she gave them, they should have stipulated what kind of music whose productions and etc. they wanted or had some sort of creative control. That’s on them not on her. It’s on her that she left Motown with a fraction of the money She earned, I don’t blame Barry Gordy for that nor do I blame him for what Flo wound up with because that’s what they agreed to do. The money she made on her book was earned because whatever signing bonus she got and whatever royalties if any she might’ve made were because there was enough interest in her to read a book even though it got the worst reviews in the history of the written word. She earns every penny she makes on stage. No one is holding a gun to anybody’s head to go see her shows and she gets rave reviews, many many many repeat customers, at her audiences leave her shows on a cloud. She earns that money. If you don’t like her books or her music or her shows then don’t go to them, No one will be missed. There will be someone else to take your seat or my seat or anybody’s seat that doesn’t buy a ticket. And that money is earned because she has created and generated the interest to induce people to want to buy a ticket. She makes no promises about her show… It’s not like she’s indicating it’s going to be a full production with changing sets and dancers and fireworks and scantily clad young people hanging from trapezes. Her show is her show and she charges a certain amount of money to leave her house and travel somewhere and put herself out there and she’s worth that money because people pay it. As anyone who bought a ticket to the wiz can attest, it may have been a shitty movie, but they wanted to see it.

[RanRan79]

It’s interesting the article refers to her as “the Wiz star”. I guess this has become her most well known movie. I would sooner it was the LSTB star lol.

I'd take The Wiz over Lady, but she really did a great job with her film debut.

[RanRan79]

Diana has earned every penny, as well as her place in music history. I'd add, though, that she would be worth even more with better management in the 70s and hella better decisions in the 80s and 90s.

[thanxal]

Diana has earned every penny, as well as her place in music history. I'd add, though, that she would be worth even more with better management in the 70s and hella better decisions in the 80s and 90s.

Were she a man, this wouldn’t even be a topic of discussion.

[vgalindo]

i disagree. She worked like a dog for an abusive Svengali - worked so hard that even her detractors gave her props - and was robbed blind. She earned every nickel of the rca deal because they paid it. If it was a bad investment, that’s show biz. They wouldn’t have paid her 20 million if she hadn’t earned that signing bonus. If they didn’t like the music she gave them, they should have stipulated what kind of music whose productions and etc. they wanted or had some sort of creative control. That’s on them not on her. It’s on her that she left Motown with a fraction of the money She earned, I don’t blame Barry Gordy for that nor do I blame him for what Flo wound up with because that’s what they agreed to do. The money she made on her book was earned because whatever signing bonus she got and whatever royalties if any she might’ve made were because there was enough interest in her to read a book even though it got the worst reviews in the history of the written word. She earns every penny she makes on stage. No one is holding a gun to anybody’s head to go see her shows and she gets rave reviews, many many many repeat customers, at her audiences leave her shows on a cloud. She earns that money. If you don’t like her books or her music or her shows then don’t go to them, No one will be missed. There will be someone else to take your seat or my seat or anybody’s seat that doesn’t buy a ticket. And that money is earned because she has created and generated the interest to induce people to want to buy a ticket. She makes no promises about her show… It’s not like she’s indicating it’s going to be a full production with changing sets and dancers and fireworks and scantily clad young people hanging from trapezes. Her show is her show and she charges a certain amount of money to leave her house and travel somewhere and put herself out there and she’s worth that money because people pay it. As anyone who bought a ticket to the wiz can attest, it may have been a shitty movie, but they wanted to see it.

Exactly. Thank you for stating all of this.

[BobbyC]

Thanxal I don't see what being female has to do with anything. If I recall correctly this was the biggest signing advance ever given to any music artist, male or female. I don't see any problem here.

[Circa 1824]

Were she a man, this wouldn’t even be a topic of discussion.

This is a lame excuse for behavior. Put the gender card away, please.

[Boogiedown]

So sick of all the predictable assorted card playing these days.

Diana Ross is a perfect example of an American success story, never mind putting any other slant on it.
She most certainly has earned every penny in the process. Can you agree to the sentiment, "Well played Diana!", Circa?

[sup_fan]

Diana has earned every penny, as well as her place in music history. I'd add, though, that she would be worth even more with better management in the 70s and hella better decisions in the 80s and 90s.

here here

if nothing else, in the 60s and 70s, diana absolutely earned her pay and brand by working so damn hard. everyone always said that she was obsessed with perfection and worked herself to the bone to make sure she was herself as close to perfect as possible

yeah by the 80s things had changed. basically she was a mom now and had a ton of money. and while the music suffered a bit, as did some of her stage shows, you can't argue with the fact that she has a marvelous family of kids.

[thanxal]

Thanxal I don't see what being female has to do with anything. If I recall correctly this was the biggest signing advance ever given to any music artist, male or female. I don't see any problem here.

BobbyC. No one would be questioning her penny-making and earnings were she male.

[Boogiedown]

the article , nor this thread has said anything relating to her gender . You're bringing it in for some reason???

[captainjames]

If I remember correctly Diana has made some real clever investments with real estate and productions so I would say she definitely has earned the money.

[Ollie9]

BobbyC. No one would be questioning her penny-making and earnings were she male.

Why not???. I would.
Diana of course has worked extremely hard for everything she has achieved in life. Nobody handed it to her on a plate, so to say anything to the contrary is plain ridiculous.
She has most certainly earned the right to be taking it easy now.

[florence]

i disagree. She worked like a dog for an abusive Svengali - worked so hard that even her detractors gave her props - and was robbed blind. She earned every nickel of the rca deal because they paid it. If it was a bad investment, that’s show biz. They wouldn’t have paid her 20 million if she hadn’t earned that signing bonus. If they didn’t like the music she gave them, they should have stipulated what kind of music whose productions and etc. they wanted or had some sort of creative control. That’s on them not on her. It’s on her that she left Motown with a fraction of the money She earned, I don’t blame Barry Gordy for that nor do I blame him for what Flo wound up with because that’s what they agreed to do. The money she made on her book was earned because whatever signing bonus she got and whatever royalties if any she might’ve made were because there was enough interest in her to read a book even though it got the worst reviews in the history of the written word. She earns every penny she makes on stage. No one is holding a gun to anybody’s head to go see her shows and she gets rave reviews, many many many repeat customers, at her audiences leave her shows on a cloud. She earns that money. If you don’t like her books or her music or her shows then don’t go to them, No one will be missed. There will be someone else to take your seat or my seat or anybody’s seat that doesn’t buy a ticket. And that money is earned because she has created and generated the interest to induce people to want to buy a ticket. She makes no promises about her show… It’s not like she’s indicating it’s going to be a full production with changing sets and dancers and fireworks and scantily clad young people hanging from trapezes. Her show is her show and she charges a certain amount of money to leave her house and travel somewhere and put herself out there and she’s worth that money because people pay it. As anyone who bought a ticket to the wiz can attest, it may have been a shitty movie, but they wanted to see it.

Brilliantly put -100% on the button .

[Guy]

i disagree. She worked like a dog for an abusive Svengali - worked so hard that even her detractors gave her props - and was robbed blind.

Berry Gordy was an "abusive Svengali"? Even as an opinion, that is a very harsh characterization. One which Ross would likely find objectionable.

I agree with everything else you've said about Ross, her early work ethic, her star quailty and her richly deserved success. I just don't know how Berry Gordy, the man who believed in her, loved her and contributed heavily to who she has become, can be dismissed as "abusive."

[BobbyC]

Boogie--thank you! What in the hell is going on these days with these ridiculous identity politics? I don't get it at all. We should all love each other. Some of us are trying to.

[RanRan79]

Diana Ross' gender is a huge part of her story, including the fact that a lot of the grief she gets for being "difficult" or a "diva" or "controlling" or just generally "not nice" is tied to her vagina, because men in the industry are simply not judged by the same standards. Sure, there are men who get labeled as difficult when they don't show up on time or are drunk or stoned. And obviously the business is full of men who have reps for not being the nicest people. But when Diana takes charge of her career, when she says she wants it this way and not that, when she refuses to settle for what she may think of as "any old thing", she's a bitch. How dare she boss people around. And let's not talk about how highly people think of David Ruffin, Eddie Kendricks, and Marvin Gaye, even though one was a woman beater, one wasn't paying his child support, and the other was having sex with an underage girl knowingly. You could have conversations about those three for days without anyone mentioning any of that. But Diana had spats with her singing partners and various other females during her youth, not to mention she had the gall to enter into a romantic relationship with her boss, a single man. And for some folks there is no conversation about Diana Ross unless you include this negative stuff. That anybody would think none of this has to do with her gender is naive at best, and a flat out liar at worst.

We all want the world to be a better place, but it'll never get there if people pretend we don't have real time problems. Just because you aren't a racist/sexist/xenophobe/otherphobes/otherists does not mean someone else isn't.

[lucky2012]

Right On, again, RanRan!

[sansradio]

Diana Ross' gender is a huge part of her story, including the fact that a lot of the grief she gets for being "difficult" or a "diva" or "controlling" or just generally "not nice" is tied to her vagina, because men in the industry are simply not judged by the same standards. Sure, there are men who get labeled as difficult when they don't show up on time or are drunk or stoned. And obviously the business is full of men who have reps for not being the nicest people. But when Diana takes charge of her career, when she says she wants it this way and not that, when she refuses to settle for what she may think of as "any old thing", she's a bitch. How dare she boss people around. And let's not talk about how highly people think of David Ruffin, Eddie Kendricks, and Marvin Gaye, even though one was a woman beater, one wasn't paying his child support, and the other was having sex with an underage girl knowingly. You could have conversations about those three for days without anyone mentioning any of that. But Diana had spats with her singing partners and various other females during her youth, not to mention she had the gall to enter into a romantic relationship with her boss, a single man. And for some folks there is no conversation about Diana Ross unless you include this negative stuff. That anybody would think none of this has to do with her gender is naive at best, and a flat out liar at worst.

We all want the world to be a better place, but it'll never get there if people pretend we don't have real time problems. Just because you aren't a racist/sexist/xenophobe/otherphobes/otherists does not mean someone else isn't.

#micdrop !!!!

[Boogiedown]

----Some people seem to go on automatic pilot when it comes to this stuff.

This comparison of Ross' career and life choices with her male counterparts would all be fine, even interesting, as a topic of its own , but this rant rant placed here has nothing to do with this article and this thread which are void of any identity clutter, being instead strictly about the fact that through her hard work, Diana Ross has done very well for herself.

The article is a tame , straightforward review of Diana Ross , free of controversy from any angle [[that alone is refreshing!) , and btw, written by Joyann Jeffrey , who we might conclude from the name, is female herself, although I'm sure there are those here that would be astounded that I would dare make such an assumption.

.....and as for Circa's observations of some of Ross' specific money making methods, they have nothing to do with Diana having a 'vagina', or not. They are points made that could be applied to any performer with any anatomy who does those same things. Circa's point would be , as I understand it, "OK, she "earned" it, but sometimes in a manner that was a little shady: for example ...." , which to me is also an interesting angle to consider , ...........and on topic!
To cry out , "You can't point out those things about Diana Ross , because she's a woman and that makes your comments sexist!", is the height of irony.

[BobbyC]

No kidding. The card playing is so tedious. All it does is shut down conversation. Plus who in the hell thinks Diana Ross didn't earn her money? I've never heard that, not even once. I think this is one of those "made up" problems so popular online these days.

[BobbyC]

Oh yeah, one last thing. DR is extremely wealthy whereas most of her fellow Motown stars are flat broke. Even HDH are having trouble these days. So what is the gender problem here, again? I'm sure a lot of them wish they had DR's "problem."

[Guy]

The article is a tame , straightforward review of Diana Ross , free of controversy from any angle [[that alone is refreshing!) , and btw, written by Joyann Jeffrey , who we might conclude from the name, is female herself, although I'm sure there are those here that would be astounded that I would dare make such an assumption.

Well...certainly not without controversy. The article opens with a declaration that her net worth is $250 million. That number, and the source from which it is derived, has been the subject of much controversy here.

I don't quite understand your objection to anyone reacting to an assessment of Ross' life and career through the lens of gender. She is a woman, after all. However, you don't have to explain anything to me because we are all entitled to our opinions. For that reason, it is best not to condemn or judge anyone else's.

[RanRan79]

I don't quite understand your objection to anyone reacting to an assessment of Ross' life and career through the lens of gender. She is a woman, after all.

That's the million dollar question. Lets sit back and see if it's answered or addressed in any sensical way. The subject of Diana's gender and the role that it has played in her lifetime by no means insults any reader of Soulful Detroit, or rather it shouldn't. I could understand the backlash better if any of us who commented on the gender aspect leveled any accusations at specific readers, or specific kinds of readers, but that didn't happen. It's like to point out Diana's gender and have an opinion about the role that it plays when discussing her life, somehow really upset some folks. I could draw some conclusions to that...well let's keep it real: I have drawn conclusions. It's just a shame that this thread was derailed by personal attacks like "card playing" rather than either stating whether one agrees or disagrees or perhaps just ignoring the topic altogether. This was a really strange twist that the thread took. My finger is on the ignore button. Time will tell if it gets pushed or not, and the clock is ticking...loudly.

[thanxal]

That's the million dollar question. Lets sit back and see if it's answered or addressed in any sensical way. The subject of Diana's gender and the role that it has played in her lifetime by no means insults any reader of Soulful Detroit, or rather it shouldn't. I could understand the backlash better if any of us who commented on the gender aspect leveled any accusations at specific readers, or specific kinds of readers, but that didn't happen. It's like to point out Diana's gender and have an opinion about the role that it plays when discussing her life, somehow really upset some folks. I could draw some conclusions to that...well let's keep it real: I have drawn conclusions. It's just a shame that this thread was derailed by personal attacks like "card playing" rather than either stating whether one agrees or disagrees or perhaps just ignoring the topic altogether. This was a really strange twist that the thread took. My finger is on the ignore button. Time will tell if it gets pushed or not, and the clock is ticking...loudly.

Some people get upset at the slightest challenge to their perceptions of the world.

[jobeterob]

Oh yeah, one last thing. DR is extremely wealthy whereas most of her fellow Motown stars are flat broke. Even HDH are having trouble these days. So what is the gender problem here, again? I'm sure a lot of them wish they had DR's "problem."

That really pisses off some colleagues and a few n'er do wells

[RanRan79]

Some people get upset at the slightest challenge to their perceptions of the world.

Apparently. And just like I thought...crickets. When you can't rationalize your irrational behavior, you shut the fuck up. Gotta at least love the quiet.

[Boogiedown]

Apparently. And just like I thought...crickets. When you can't rationalize your irrational behavior, you shut the fuck up. Gotta at least love the quiet.

I'm suddenly thinking of a Barry White song ... how does that go , "your sweetness: --- is my weakness..." ....

[Roberta75]

----Some people seem to go on automatic pilot when it comes to this stuff.

This comparison of Ross' career and life choices with her male counterparts would all be fine, even interesting, as a topic of its own , but this rant rant placed here has nothing to do with this article and this thread which are void of any identity clutter, being instead strictly about the fact that through her hard work, Diana Ross has done very well for herself.

The article is a tame , straightforward review of Diana Ross , free of controversy from any angle [[that alone is refreshing!) , and btw, written by Joyann Jeffrey , who we might conclude from the name, is female herself, although I'm sure there are those here that would be astounded that I would dare make such an assumption.

.....and as for Circa's observations of some of Ross' specific money making methods, they have nothing to do with Diana having a 'vagina', or not. They are points made that could be applied to any performer with any anatomy who does those same things. Circa's point would be , as I understand it, "OK, she "earned" it, but sometimes in a manner that was a little shady: for example ...." , which to me is also an interesting angle to consider , ...........and on topic!
To cry out , "You can't point out those things about Diana Ross , because she's a woman and that makes your comments sexist!", is the height of irony.

Well especially when you support a man whos never made a sexist comment in his life. LMFAO

[Boogiedown]

Well...certainly not without controversy. The article opens with a declaration that her net worth is $250 million. That number, and the source from which it is derived, has been the subject of much controversy here.

I don't quite understand your objection to anyone reacting to an assessment of Ross' life and career through the lens of gender. She is a woman, after all. However, you don't have to explain anything to me because we are all entitled to our opinions. For that reason, it is best not to condemn or judge anyone else's.

Guy I'm happy to have an exchange of ideas with you. Thank you for opening the door in a hospitable way.
As to whether or not the 250 million amount is accurate , I hope it is, ... if not better ! I'm in the camp that says she's earned every penny of it ! [[ I don't know what monetary amounts were accrued through divorces, although it could be argued that even those amounts have been "earned").

Guy , I'm not objecting to looking at her career through such a lens, and I think I already said that looking at her career experiences as a woman could make for an interesting thread topic , hopefully one of the members who seem to want to discuss it will start one. I simply found going there now , for no reason , created a distraction from the topic as presented here ,"Diana Ross is worth a ton of money ...for one simple reason : she went out and earned it." Period. Can't we permit that notion to have value in of itself without all the distracting noise.

One lengthy and rather excited rant here was way off and had absolutely nothing to do with the subject , which makes the point of how off keel this topic got once someone brought gender into it, which the article in discussion was not at all about.
That's all. No big deal.

And yep Diana Ross is a woman , one of my very favorites in fact.

[Boogiedown]

Well especially when you support a man whos never made a sexist comment in his life. LMFAO

there's that Barry White song coming back to me again ! lol!!

[TheMotownManiac]

Berry Gordy was an "abusive Svengali"? Even as an opinion, that is a very harsh characterization. One which Ross would likely find objectionable.

I agree with everything else you've said about Ross, her early work ethic, her star quailty and her richly deserved success. I just don't know how Berry Gordy, the man who believed in her, loved her and contributed heavily to who she has become, can be dismissed as "abusive."

I didn’t mean to be dismissive of him so I apologize for that inference. By many accounts, he was very very rough on her. She says as much in her own book and even at the Motown musical opening when he was talking about how wonderful she was and how she made Motown possible and all those things she said something to the effect, “if you felt that way, You could have been nicer! “And that really came out of left field so I believe there’s still a little part of her that is smarting. There are instances in call her Miss Ross where Barry Gordy is clearly being an asshole to her and doesn’t care. There’s a reference in all that glittered, Mary didn’t mention anything like that because it would’ve made Diana seem a victim more vulnerable and she wasn’t going to have that when Diana was the villain in her book. There are many people that feel he was extra controlling of her because of Mary Wells leaving Motown so he kept her very very very tight reins on her.

[midnightman]

Berry always had a complicated relationship with Diana, I think. He's pretty doggone rough on her at times.

[RanRan79]

Because I don't let things go unaddressed...

I read the screenname Boogiedown's response to my last post, as well as his response to Guy, despite having him on "permanent" ignore because I let curiosity get the better of me. It's not that I hoped or thought that either post would explain how this thread derailed. After all, there's a reason he's on ignore: history. And of course I got exactly what I knew I would get. When you can't respond with sound logic, post song lyrics. The term "identity politics" was used, despite politics having nothing to do with the thread. That's why it's always good to read actual definitions of something and not just repeat what you hear the "smart" folks on TV saying.

i·den·ti·ty pol·i·tics a tendency for people of a particular religion, race, social background, etc., to form exclusive political alliances, moving away from traditional broad-based party politics.

politics in which groups of people having a particular racial, religious, ethnic, social, or cultural identity tend to promote their own specific interests or concerns without regard to the interests or concerns of any larger political group

political activity or movements based on or catering to the cultural, ethnic, gender, racial, religious, or social interests that characterize a group identity.

Will someone point out to me where any of this went on either mine or Thanxal's posts? Our thoughts about the subject...scratch that...I can only speak for myself...My thoughts about this subject were not meant to offend anyone or cause the thread to go off topic. Thanxal said what he said and when Bobby responded, I responded to Bobby, not knowing that my response offended people, which I find weird. I really think it's a snowflake response to be offended by the discussion of the role of gender in Diana Ross' life and/or career. As I said before, it's not that everyone or anyone had to agree with what I said. I don't live for the approval of my thoughts. But when the conversation goes from people talking about an area of Diana's life to accusations of card playing and identity politics when that's an irrational way of viewing what had transpired, I will not let that stand without a sane response.

No lyrics needed.

These threads would function so much better if people stated their opinions and others responded with theirs respectfully or ignored the issue altogether. This thread went left when people leveled insulting accusations. Neither Thanxal, nor I did that.

[thanxal]

These threads would function so much better if people stated their opinions and others responded with theirs respectfully or ignored the issue altogether. This thread went left when people leveled insulting accusations. Neither Thanxal, nor I did that.

I neither attacked the OP, the linked article, nor anyone's responses. I just stated what I thought was a very mild observation that the topic "Diana Ross Has Earned Every Single Penny She's Made" would not even be questioned were she male. To state it that way implies that there is some question about the money she has made, which women, especially black women, are subjected to far more than men, especially white men. I can't imagine how tired successful black women must be with all the extra scrutiny put on how they act, how they interact with others, their decisions, etc. etc. That was my only point, but clearly, it touched a sensitive spot.

[Boogiedown]

Wow this is going round and round.
Wish I had the time to respond completely maybe later.

Thanxal I thought maybe I'd misunderstood your original point but now you've clarified it, and my understanding of it was apparently correct . [[?)

You made your original comments because you found the wording in the title of the article to appear to be defending Diana Ross [[ is in "she sure did earn her money , right down to the last penny!") as if there had been some questioning of her money making accomplishments. [[and nobody would be questioning them were she a man )
Do I have that right ??

I didn't read it that way . I read it as "Diana Ross is reaping her rewards , a cool 250 million, and , because of a lifetime of working hard , she's earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny! "
And then the article chronicled that hard work.
I read it as a positive piece as in "bravo, well done " with nothing more weighting it.

I think that's the disconnect of thoughts here , if I have it right .

And
[[RR thanks for the totorial on identity politics , if it was for me, can't tell because you seem to be dutifully ignoring me , ....yet , while not ignoring me, so can't tell.
So to be clear , I never used the term 'identity politics' , but still thanks for your efforts just the same, if for me )

Anyway back to work.

[BobbyC]

Well to clarify my own take on this non-story about DR not having earned her money, let me say a few things. To my bafflement in the past few years, I've noticed a clear divide in how people, even my close friends, view this world we live in. The first group seems to view most everything in life as a power struggle, good vs mean, and predator vs victim. I am not in that group. The second group never gave a damn about identity politics, in fact it annoys us. Back before I became a full adult I used to fret over people maybe turning on me when they learned I was gay. One day I told my friend Joyce about this fear and she told me something I never forgot and I took it to heart over the years. She said "Honey, let me explain something to you. If certain people look down on you for being gay-- they'd find something else to look down on, even if you weren't." I never thought of that before and it changed my entire mindset. People will find something "defective " in you and even if they couldn't find anything they'd probably make something up. My problems were NOT SPECIAL. I would succeed on my merits and F anybody who didn't like this thing or that thing about me. You have to be strong in this life.
Being female HELPED Diana Ross. Berry chose her as "his" star because he felt in those days audiences, especially white audiences, would accept a female as a major star whereas they might feel threatened by a male. Now I wasn't around back then so I'll assume he was right, at least for that era, but over the years, all of Berry's male groups far surpassed his female groups, with the exception of the Supremes and Diana Ross. The Jackson 5, Temptations, Tops, Marvin, Stevie, Smokey, etc all bear this out so maybe Berry was just wrong. Either way, Diana Ross didn't allow herself to be put down or psyched out by anybody or anything. I respect that.
Now DR is worth more than all the men with an exception or two. She earned it through talent, looks and hard work. For me, feeling sorry for her for being female is almost insulting to my mind. If she fell flat on her face, that would be one thing but that just never happened.

[thanxal]

You made your original comments because you found the wording in the title of the article to appear to be defending Diana Ross [[ is in "she sure did earn her money , right down to the last penny!") as if there had been some questioning of her money making accomplishments. [[and nobody would be questioning them were she a man )
Do I have that right ??

Yes.

I didn't read it that way . I read it as "Diana Ross is reaping her rewards , a cool 250 million, and , because of a lifetime of working hard , she's earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny! "
And then the article chronicled that hard work.
I read it as a positive piece as in "bravo, well done " with nothing more weighting it.

So let me ask you in a purely non-combative way...
"she's earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny"
Why would someone need to reaffirm this? It seems to me that they have to be so emphatic [[or even just say it at all, really) because there is some intimation that she hadn't. I rarely see anyone write that Berry Gordy "earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny", even though... well, let's not start that flame war on this thread.

Let me ask you, again, in a non-combative and learning way... how often have you read that about any one of the Beatles, Elvis, or any other man in the same popularity/earning category as Diana Ross? I see it about her ad nauseum. That's my one and only point. I believe we see this sort of thing more about Ross than we do about men because she is a woman and because she is black. People have a built in bias that black women must have cheated to earn all that money because of, for only one example, how so very often we hear about them as the notorious [[and debunked) "welfare queens".

[Boogiedown]

Yes.

So let me ask you in a purely non-combative way...
"she's earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny"
Why would someone need to reaffirm this? It seems to me that they have to be so emphatic [[or even just say it at all, really) because there is some intimation that she hadn't. I rarely see anyone write that Berry Gordy "earned it all, every bit of it, right down to the very last penny", even though... well, let's not start that flame war on this thread.

thanxal, I do see your point, the headline could certainly have been better written, and no matter how one reads it.
If read your way , I don't see any further comment in the article's text regarding any questioning of Diana's rightful earning of her fortunes to confirm that's where the author's coming from in the title. I don't see any questioning , doubts, being referenced here at all.

If read in the way I had , the article does go through a laundry list of many of her achievements , although if they were really trying to make the case that she had earned every single doggone penny , they could've listed a great deal more.

Its a shouting headline hoping to suck us in to a rather non-invested article !!

Let me ask you, again, in a non-combative and learning way... how often have you read that about any one of the Beatles, Elvis, or any other man in the same popularity/earning category as Diana Ross? I see it about her ad nauseum. That's my one and only point. I believe we see this sort of thing more about Ross than we do about men because she is a woman and because she is black. People have a built in bias that black women must have cheated to earn all that money because of, for only one example, how so very often we hear about them as the notorious [[and debunked) "welfare queens".

See now were going further into territory that I'd hoped we wouldn't in the first place. This was the very point of my original protest. I found it nice to read about Ross' bounty being attributed as a payoff for a lifetime of her work, presented on its own laurels in of itself, period, never mind any qualifying asterisks, and how nice to just leave it at that.

In reading your additional thoughts , it sounds like that's what you are also preferring? As you say they don't do it with Elvis etc...
All of a sudden I am wondering if we are each asking for the same thing !!


I don't know about these built in biases about black women that you present , I don't , so I'll take your word for it. Just as I'll have to take your word that there are continuous writings that challenge Diana's rightful "earnings" of her riches. I haven't read that. Nor, have I read articles written that way regarding Elvis or The Beatles etc...

Here's as an additional thought:
One other way to explain this headline might be , [[might) , without knowing more about the writer , she may be very young, and her thinking might be , "Diana Ross? She hasn't had a hit record in over thirty years! so one might then ask, how in the world can she be worth 250 million!? And then she breaks down the answer, concluding ...."yes she's worth 250 million and she earned every single penny of it....."



Thanxal , I hope I'm making sense ,

and I thank you for your civility.
cheers!

[vgalindo]

thanxal, I do see your point, the headline could certainly have been better written, and no matter how one reads it.
If read your way , I don't see any further comment in the article's text regarding any questioning of Diana's rightful earning of her fortunes to confirm that's where the author's coming from in the title. I don't see any questioning , doubts, being referenced here at all.

If read in the way I had , the article does go through a laundry list of many of her achievements , although if they were really trying to make the case that she had earned every single doggone penny , they could've listed a great deal more.

Its a shouting headline hoping to suck us in to a rather non-invested article !!





See now were going further into territory that I'd hoped we wouldn't in the first place. This was the very point of my original protest. I found it nice to read about Ross' bounty being attributed as a payoff for a lifetime of her work, presented on its own laurels in of itself, period, never mind any qualifying asterisks, and how nice to just leave it at that.

In reading your additional thoughts , it sounds like that's what you are also preferring? As you say they don't do it with Elvis etc...
All of a sudden I am wondering if we are each asking for the same thing !!


I don't know about these built in biases about black women that you present , I don't , so I'll take your word for it. Just as I'll have to take your word that there are continuous writings that challenge Diana's rightful "earnings" of her riches. I haven't read that. Nor, have I read articles written that way regarding Elvis or The Beatles etc...

Here's as an additional thought:
One other way to explain this headline might be , [[might) , without knowing more about the writer , she may be very young, and her thinking might be , "Diana Ross? She hasn't had a hit record in over thirty years! so one might then ask, how in the world can she be worth 250 million!? And then she breaks down the answer, concluding ...."yes she's worth 250 million and she earned every single penny of it....."



Thanxal , I hope I'm making sense ,

and I thank you for your civility.
cheers!

Diana Ross‘ wealth is probably more due to her concerts than hit records. At one time she was one of or was the highest paid performers in Vegas. She also has had many hits and sold a lot of records all over the world during the last 30 years. Just not here in America. In fact there was a book written about EMI records that stated Diana Ross was one of their biggest selling artists of the 90s.

[BobbyC]

Uhhh if we all agree that DR earned her money, why are we fighting? We are living in strange times, my friends.

[thanxal]

Uhhh if we all agree that DR earned her money, why are we fighting? We are living in strange times, my friends.

Who's fighting? This is called a "discussion" after someone making a "statement". No one is fighting.

[thanxal]

thanxal, I do see your point, the headline could certainly have been better written, and no matter how one reads it.
If read your way , I don't see any further comment in the article's text regarding any questioning of Diana's rightful earning of her fortunes to confirm that's where the author's coming from in the title. I don't see any questioning , doubts, being referenced here at all.

If read in the way I had , the article does go through a laundry list of many of her achievements , although if they were really trying to make the case that she had earned every single doggone penny , they could've listed a great deal more.

Its a shouting headline hoping to suck us in to a rather non-invested article !!





See now were going further into territory that I'd hoped we wouldn't in the first place. This was the very point of my original protest. I found it nice to read about Ross' bounty being attributed as a payoff for a lifetime of her work, presented on its own laurels in of itself, period, never mind any qualifying asterisks, and how nice to just leave it at that.

In reading your additional thoughts , it sounds like that's what you are also preferring? As you say they don't do it with Elvis etc...
All of a sudden I am wondering if we are each asking for the same thing !!


I don't know about these built in biases about black women that you present , I don't , so I'll take your word for it. Just as I'll have to take your word that there are continuous writings that challenge Diana's rightful "earnings" of her riches. I haven't read that. Nor, have I read articles written that way regarding Elvis or The Beatles etc...

Here's as an additional thought:
One other way to explain this headline might be , [[might) , without knowing more about the writer , she may be very young, and her thinking might be , "Diana Ross? She hasn't had a hit record in over thirty years! so one might then ask, how in the world can she be worth 250 million!? And then she breaks down the answer, concluding ...."yes she's worth 250 million and she earned every single penny of it....."



Thanxal , I hope I'm making sense ,

and I thank you for your civility.
cheers!

I see your points. I'm glad you see that my initial reaction to the headline is what prompted my first post. I do think there is more structural racism and cultural bias than we might be willing to admit, but I don't know where you live [[US/UK/Australia/Canada/etc) so can't assume you might understand the US baked-in animosity toward black women. I can tell you that black women start with two, if not more, marks against them in US society. I still don't think that headline would have ever been used for a 1)white or 2)male performer. I do concede that if the reporter were young and did not do research, it would be easy for them to fall into decades old tropes about Diana. Shame on that reporter for not doing their due diligence, if that is the case.

Glad to have a respectful and level-headed conversation. They are rare these days.