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  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by danman869 View Post
    Something I noticed in reading the '70s set lists [and it's definitely not some major revelation for most] is that Up The Ladder To The Roof didn't seem to get much full performance. Sure, it was included in their hit medley, but you see a full version of Everybody's Got The Right To Love included over and over again, but not Up. I don't get the reasoning behind marginalizing UTLTTR and pushing EGTRTL. The latter plods along where as the former is more of a 'get up and dance' track. Odd choices, IMO.
    i agree. I think Ladder was added to the "Hits Medley" early on so that it would cover both the 60s and 70s. and it made an exciting ending to that medley.

    And i wonder if maybe Jean liked Everybody? maybe it was a fav? just guessing here. But they did also include those breakout lines for M and C [[later L).

    Ladder definitely should have remained a standalone song. it's just too damn good and too powerful of a song. Jean really could SANG that one. And it doesn't suffer the problem of trying to replicate a unique sound or style like Nathan. any orchestra could do Ladder justice.

  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by marybrewster View Post
    Truth is, the Supremes should have focused less on the US and more on the UK. Mary herself said the UK fans embraced the Supremes in the 70s tenfold than in the US.

    The Three Degrees JUMPED on that bandwagon; had hits throughout the 70's overseas and are still to this day HUMONGOUS in Japan. They LOVE their ooohs and aaahs!
    You have a point. As the Supremes floundered the Three Degrees stepped up and basically replaced the Supremes in the charts and in our hearts. I saw the MSC and MSS line up's in concert and they were basically blown away by the Three Degrees who put on a slick and professional show whilst the Supremes were literally all over the place.
    Years later i became friends with both Sheila Ferguson and the lovely sweet Val Holiday and they both admitted they took advantage of the Supremes personnel issues and replaced them as the nations sweethearts. They would of course eventually have their own personnel problems, but they are still going strong to this very day and Val has just delivered a lovely solo album.

  3. #53
    I think EGTRTL got a full version over Ladder is that it was easier to vamp and Mary and Cindy got to do a few lines

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    Funnily enough I was thinking of The New Seekers when I posted.
    IMO, with the vast majority of joe public the name Supremes will always be associated with Diana Ross. That’s why a name change to The New Supremes would have declared to the world this was a new sound and identity, not a continuation of the Diana led years with a different lead singer.
    Other then mega stars, hit singles are of course the life blood for any group or solo act. Is it possible that had the group created a completely new identity form the off, some of those records might have sold better then they did.. “SL” alone should have gone mega.
    As it was, it seemed the group were often trying to live up to the expectations of their 60’s heyday, or attempting to breakaway from the long shadow that DR undoubtedly cast.
    Interesting....Back in Detroit I remember the ladies standing outside with the TV Guide that typically never ever left the house discussing the TV performance of The New Supremes on the Glen Campbell Show. I bel this was the first appearance of the JMC. Just saying.

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by sup_fan View Post
    that's sort of my overall point here. I'm not sure if it was the girls, the manager, motown overall. or all of the above. i've mentioned it on here a bunch and it still baffles me that there didn't seem to be more coordination between release schedule, tv dates and live shows. it's really almost as if the recording and releases were all in 1 corporate silo and the tour planning and all was a totally different silo.

    with NW, Touch, FJ, etc you could have easily revamped the show with new content from the singles and albums, new additional material that was appropriate for the tour and album, sets and costumes, etc.

    for instance, with Floy Joy you could have done a marvelous job of some new costumes that aligned with the album art. They often wore 2 or 3 in a show so if you had 6 or 7 sets, you'd be covered. white, reds, pinks. some matching some not.

    And what a perfect way to promote the album by incorporating a Smokey medley. I could see opening the show with YWSSL The band is on stage and jamming on the intro. there's a white set backdrop with a center panel with Floy Joy on it in red. Then the panel could open or rotate and there are the girls in white outfits and the white & red patio table set up. They descend a few stairs from that platform to start singing the opening number.
    One thing that's never really mentioned is album cuts in concert. These days, when you see an artist in concert, promoting a new "record", they'll perform the singles, but also throw in a few album tracks. I don't know if by the 70's, or ever, the Supremes performed these types of songs? Yes, there are a few examples, like "Tossin and Turnin". But what a treat it might have been to see "Thank Him For Today" as they exit the stage.....or "Here Comes the Sunrise" as an opener?

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by marybrewster View Post
    One thing that's never really mentioned is album cuts in concert. These days, when you see an artist in concert, promoting a new "record", they'll perform the singles, but also throw in a few album tracks. I don't know if by the 70's, or ever, the Supremes performed these types of songs? Yes, there are a few examples, like "Tossin and Turnin". But what a treat it might have been to see "Thank Him For Today" as they exit the stage.....or "Here Comes the Sunrise" as an opener?
    completely agree. they did it with the Symphony medley. but yes their 70s albums were rife with wonderful cuts that would have made excellent concert additions. other than singles, I think Diana was the same. until The Boss album at least

    The girls did cram Loving Country and Together We Can Make into a medley they did on Tom Jones and then used live.

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by sup_fan View Post
    actually the supremes did LOTS of shows and at venues that were readily accessible to the general public. Forrest Hills stadium, college dates, Steel Pier, the apollo, central park

    In 71 the girls played a range of dates and my list is quite incomplete - Blossom Music Center in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, Schafer Music Festival, Athletics and Convocation Center in South Bend, IN. Plus playing Palisades Amusement Park, Magic Mountain, Disney Resorts,

    yes the girls continued to play the bigger club rooms and all where the crowds were mostly older. But that's also part of my point of my complaint about motown's strategy for the group. I think they should have done more package revues again with Gladys Knight, Stevie, The Sups, etc. Those could have commanded the big convention centers and stadiums, playing for thousands of teens and college students.

    There has been fan discussion over the years of the Sups on Jesse Jackson's Operation Push in 72. there's video footage of the J5 and GKATPs and their sets are wonderful. But supposedly the Supremes did that Cabaret medley like they did on their Japanese live album, other showtunes and stuff. and the crowd wasn't very receptive
    I'm aware of how much the group toured. They stayed busy. I'm arguing the point that most fans still didn't get to see them live and thus the live show had no effect on the general public. That's not to say that some live shows weren't as impactful as they were. Operation Push and the Madison Square Garden disasters certainly spring to mind. But the public can forgive a show that sucks as long as the hits are still rolling in.

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by marybrewster View Post
    Truth is, the Supremes should have focused less on the US and more on the UK. Mary herself said the UK fans embraced the Supremes in the 70s tenfold than in the US.

    The Three Degrees JUMPED on that bandwagon; had hits throughout the 70's overseas and are still to this day HUMONGOUS in Japan. They LOVE their ooohs and aaahs!
    As is, probably. But it's my understanding there was more money to be made in the States if they could just stay relevant.

  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by danman869 View Post
    Something I noticed in reading the '70s set lists [and it's definitely not some major revelation for most] is that Up The Ladder To The Roof didn't seem to get much full performance. Sure, it was included in their hit medley, but you see a full version of Everybody's Got The Right To Love included over and over again, but not Up. I don't get the reasoning behind marginalizing UTLTTR and pushing EGTRTL. The latter plods along where as the former is more of a 'get up and dance' track. Odd choices, IMO.
    I think "Everybody" showed the group's vocal chops off better than "Ladder" did. I suspect the group may have thought so as well. However, there is no way that I would've ever relegated one of the two major hits [[the other obviously being "Stoned Love") that the new Supremes had to a medley.

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by marybrewster View Post
    One thing that's never really mentioned is album cuts in concert. These days, when you see an artist in concert, promoting a new "record", they'll perform the singles, but also throw in a few album tracks. I don't know if by the 70's, or ever, the Supremes performed these types of songs? Yes, there are a few examples, like "Tossin and Turnin". But what a treat it might have been to see "Thank Him For Today" as they exit the stage.....or "Here Comes the Sunrise" as an opener?
    Where you been? We talk about how they should've done album cuts in the show forever. I think we're all in agreement on your sentiment though.

  11. #61
    The Supremes' show in the 70s would have greatly benefitted from the inclusion of album cuts to promote the current [[and past) albums, as well as pad the show out with songs original to them [[in most cases). But they needed hits to anchor the show, which is what most artists did. All the extras were built around the inclusion of the hits. Now the supper club/Vegas crowd was probably a little different. And to be honest, most of the stuff I've seen and heard from the Supremes in the 70s was probably good enough to allow them to get by with those audiences. I'm trying to think of a point when the 70s Supremes had a lot of down time and I'm hard pressed to come up with it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but they still managed to constantly work, didn't they?

    But if they really wanted to be relevant, they needed to play the stadiums and major theaters that the Arethas and the Spinners and the Gladys Pips and the Blue Notes, etc, were playing. And the only way to really get there was to have hit records. While I love a lot of the songs the Supremes released as singles in the 70s, if I play most of them in a set that includes the people I mention above, among others who were popular at the time, there is usually a clear difference in quality. Those other folks were releasing songs that the public couldn't wait to buy. There's very little in the 70s Supremes entire catalog that I honestly feel fit that mode.

    Now where album cuts go, IMO the Supremes had some of the best. And if they had been performed in front of large audiences, it may have garnered more album sales. But the all important hits alluded them. They were never going to rack up the stunning run that the Flo era Supremes achieved. There was a special connection between Flo, Diana and Mary, along with the Funks, along with HDH, that mesmerized the public. That was never going to happen again. Not for DRATS. Not for the New Supremes. Not even for Diana, solo star. But the 70s groupings should have all had at least one major hit single for every incarnation that existed. It didn't have to be a string of hits. Didn't even have to be back to back hits. But at least one major hit seller, one major "can't turn on the radio without hearing that song" hit for each grouping, from each album.

  12. #62
    Ran - yeah i completely agree that with a mega hit song, the group would drift. and i go back to my old argument of the disorganized strategic planning and management. after such a massive change as Diana leaving PLUS how significantly music had changed in the past couple years, the group needed to really focus and be very thoughtful with each and every activity.

    but what we got was flooding of the market with all sorts of albums, the duets, the aging image of giggling glamour girls in wigs and sequins, the corny jokes in the stage patter, etc.

    Had they really been thoughtful, Stoned Love should have been a mega hit and NW [[with revised title, song lineup and album art) could have been a massive smash lp.

    if SL and the album had been huge then the Touch lp would probably have been better received.

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