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  1. #1

  2. #2
    The same thing happened to Diana Ross at the AIR Jamaica Jazz Festival in 2008. People booed her and stormed out of the stadium because Ross turned of the jumbo tron projection screens so that they would not show that she was lip syncing, but those up front saw her doing it.

    http://exclaim.ca/music/article/dian..._jamaican_fans

    https://www.tmz.com/2008/01/28/miss-...n-jamaica-mon/
    Last edited by marv2; 11-17-2019 at 10:35 AM.

  3. #3
    Well sadly it's not the first time a singer has been caught lip singing,folks pay all that money at least the artist could put forth the effort!

  4. #4
    Janet has always had a backing vocal track before shows. I think the reason she didn't get called out before then is because when she exploded to the scene in the late 1980s, she had the moves and her shows were very elaborate from 1990 until roughly 2002 (she did sing live more though, like check out her Rhythm Nation World Tour, I think besides from Rhythm Nation, the other songs were performed live, least on that tour; of course she always did her ballads live). But now Janet is in her early 50s and the moves are not as spry as they once was. Her dancing is or was her bread and butter and when you start to lose that, your audience leaves.

    The Black Eyed Peas got the same treatment (I don't know if they lipped or not but fans walked out on them too) lol

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by arr&bee View Post
    Well sadly it's not the first time a singer has been caught lip singing,folks pay all that money at least the artist could put forth the effort!
    Exactly. Diana Ross thought she could get away with it by turning off the screens so you couldn't see her do it! LOL!!!

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by arr&bee View Post
    Well sadly it's not the first time a singer has been caught lip singing,folks pay all that money at least the artist could put forth the effort!
    To make matters worse, Janet was part of what is called RNB Fridays. Guess when folks pay tickets, they did expect her to sing just based on the title.

    What makes it tough for someone like Janet is she does have a very pretty soulful voice in the studio but it never went above the studio so she knew her limitations. She herself would say "I'm no Whitney Houston". She's gonna have her defenders though.

  7. #7
    Janet, like Michael, had the good fortune to work with some of the finest producers in the business. People who could get a hit off a chicken, as Norman used to say. That said, people donít pay to hear her sing. They come to see a full fledged stage show. Janet canít move all that good anymore.

  8. #8
    Whereas when I saw Gladys Knight 6 years ago, she didn't have no pyrotechnics, fancy light show or scantily clad backing dancers... her voice and her presence did all the work.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by alexstassi View Post
    Whereas when I saw Gladys Knight 6 years ago, she didn't have no pyrotechnics, fancy light show or scantily clad backing dancers... her voice and her presence did all the work.
    I'd surmise Gladys and Janet are appealing to two different audiences... Janet's followers are younger and more MTV generation and beyond...Gladys was and is more of a standup singer appealing to a largely older audience without the expectation of a lot of slick moves and high tech production...

  10. #10
    I'm not on board with lip syncing. I won't attend a show by a performer known to do so. Wasn't there a ruling a while back that a performance had to give notice if there would be pre-recorded anything? Anywhonipplegatescandal, an audience are customers and customers are entitled to have opinions and ask for money back. And so it should be.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by StuBass1 View Post
    I'd surmise Gladys and Janet are appealing to two different audiences... Janet's followers are younger and more MTV generation and beyond...Gladys was and is more of a standup singer appealing to a largely older audience without the expectation of a lot of slick moves and high tech production...
    Well, on her farewell tour Tina did lots of slick moves and high tech production AND managed to sing like the legend she is! I'll open the bowels of hell with this comment but just perhaps Janet is an r&b version of Britney Spears, an attractive performer with far more flash and personality than talent. YES! WENT THERE!!

  12. #12
    Janet has always lipsynched. Before she does a tour, she goes and re-records her vocal tracks

    Plus it was a festival so people walking out is no surprise. As long as her fans loved it

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    Well, on her farewell tour Tina did lots of slick moves and high tech production AND managed to sing like the legend she is! I'll open the bowels of hell with this comment but just perhaps Janet is an r&b version of Britney Spears, an attractive performer with far more flash and personality than talent. YES! WENT THERE!!
    Yes, like Janet, Tina was an accomplished dancer as opposed to Gladys who was merely a songstress and a great one, but much different audience expectations and demographics than Tina or Janet... As for Tina...her audience was likely more a hybrid of Janet's and Gladys audience in that Tina had essentially two careers...the quasi West Coast rock-soul days with Ike, and her second career that took off in the 80's and exposed Tina to an entirely new (and younger) audience as opposed to Gladys whose audience is mostly made up of "old school" Soul music fans...

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    Well, on her farewell tour Tina did lots of slick moves and high tech production AND managed to sing like the legend she is! I'll open the bowels of hell with this comment but just perhaps Janet is an r&b version of Britney Spears, an attractive performer with far more flash and personality than talent. YES! WENT THERE!!
    I've always said the same thing. Janet was one hell of a dancer in her
    Rhythm Nation days, attractive and very photogenic. A singer only
    in the studio with a lot of help. Her little whisper of a voice doesn't
    do much live. Are the bowels of hell fully open, yet?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by StuBass1 View Post
    Yes, like Janet, Tina was an accomplished dancer as opposed to Gladys who was merely a songstress and a great one, but much different audience expectations and demographics than Tina or Janet... As for Tina...her audience was likely more a hybrid of Janet's and Gladys audience in that Tina had essentially two careers...the quasi West Coast rock-soul days with Ike, and her second career that took off in the 80's and exposed Tina to an entirely new (and younger) audience as opposed to Gladys whose audience is mostly made up of "old school" Soul music fans...
    Don't forget the St. Louis blues/early soul years of the early '60s prior to the official move to the West Coast. Tina actually had three different phases whereas Gladys and Janet were just on one (though musically Gladys transitioned more than say Janet).

    All three have their audiences.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by jaywonder View Post
    Janet has always lipsynched. Before she does a tour, she goes and re-records her vocal tracks

    Plus it was a festival so people walking out is no surprise. As long as her fans loved it
    Her fans did defend her performances in Australia basically saying Janet is in her early 50s and people should expect her to dance a little slower than she did 30 years ago. Guess as long as she can still be one hell of a mover, that's enough for them. And it's been that way for a long while. Her moves are expected to be less complicated than they were in her heyday (she can still do that complicated "If" choreography though!) but while she was at her prime, she definitely was one of the best female dancers in pop and rock music, probably second overall to Tina.
    Last edited by midnightman; 11-17-2019 at 08:58 PM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by lakeside View Post
    I've always said the same thing. Janet was one hell of a dancer in her
    Rhythm Nation days, attractive and very photogenic. A singer only
    in the studio with a lot of help. Her little whisper of a voice doesn't
    do much live. Are the bowels of hell fully open, yet?
    Thank you for understanding the spirit with which I made the comparison. No kiki intended. Whatsoever. Both ladies earned and deserve their loving audiences and I wish both well. I have sung and danced along to both their music. They both work like muthafudghas and deserve their careers. But singers ... We'll see how the boH 'thang works out!

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Her fans did defend her performances in Australia basically saying Janet is in her early 50s and people should expect her to dance a little slower than she did 30 years ago. Guess as long as she can still be one hell of a mover, that's enough for them. And it's been that way for a long while. Her moves are expected to be less complicated than they were in her heyday (she can still do that complicated "If" choreography though!) but while she was at her prime, she definitely was one of the best female dancers in pop and rock music, probably second overall to Tina.
    Second to Tina? Are you kidding? What about Paul Abdul that use to choreograph Janet's act? Tina Turner was never in those ladies league when it came to dancing. Tina was good at shaking with a little bump and grind here and there.

  19. #19
    I remember going to see Janet in concert at the height of Rhythm Nation. A coworker and a young lady I had the hots for had a great time. IIRC, Janet lip synced, at least in part, but I didn't much care. I LOVED Janet and just seeing her was more than enough for me.

    She did hit the stage late and that bothered me more than anything else.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Exactly. Diana Ross thought she could get away with it by turning off the screens so you couldn't see her do it! LOL!!!
    You never give up do you! This post is about Janet Jackson. Not your obsession with Diana Ross. And please stop the lies! Nobody said Diana Ross lip sync this performance. You Are are just speculating! Some say the reason she didnít want the monitors on, was she didnít want her set to be recorded through the video monitors. But we really donít know the real reason. So donít make things up!

  21. #21
    Maybe Diana could have have Marvís phone confiscated too

    Perhaps Janet should stop dancing all over and concentrate on singing like Diana Dionne Gladys Martha in their old age

  22. #22
    What I want to know is, why is this in the Motown Forum? Her brothers were on the label, not Janet.

  23. #23
    I briefly worked with Janet Jackson back in the late 80's. She was booked to perform Let's Wait Awhile on Top of The Pops. It is not a difficult song to sing so i naturally assumed she would be performing it live on the show. I was mistaken. She flatly refused to do a live vocal and we spent 3 frustrating hours as she repeatedly demanded retake after retake until she decided she was satisfied with her performance.
    A few years later she was booked to appear on The Jonathan Ross Show. She was all set to perform her latest single until she was told that performers on the show were expected to sing live. She immediately claimed she had a sore throat and would be unable to perform live. She still appeared on the show, but only as a talking guest.
    Vocally the woman is woeful. Anyone who goes to see her in concert should not expect to hear live vocals. At her recent Glastonbury set a critic said she lip synched but still managed to sound out of tune. Just imagine how bad she would sound if she did attempt to sing live?

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    I briefly worked with Janet Jackson back in the late 80's. She was booked to perform Let's Wait Awhile on Top of The Pops. It is not a difficult song to sing so i naturally assumed she would be performing it live on the show. I was mistaken. She flatly refused to do a live vocal and we spent 3 frustrating hours as she repeatedly demanded retake after retake until she decided she was satisfied with her performance.
    Top of The Pops performances were the artists sang live were rare if I recall. It was common to lip-synch on that show back in the day.

  25. #25
    Also part of the problem is that many events nowadays are festivals... with little or no sound checks between performances - it can take the artist 4 or 5 songs to perfect the sound... I've seen this many times at Glastonbury over the years (mantra - if you want the best sounding experience don't go to festivals!)

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    You never give up do you! This post is about Janet Jackson. Not your obsession with Diana Ross. And please stop the lies! Nobody said Diana Ross lip sync this performance. You Are are just speculating! Some say the reason she didn’t want the monitors on, was she didn’t want her set to be recorded through the video monitors. But we really don’t know the real reason. So don’t make things up!
    Remember when his favorite background singer lip synced to Diana's voice? HE HE HE HE!

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    ...Vocally the woman is woeful. Anyone who goes to see her in concert should not expect to hear live vocals. At her recent Glastonbury set a critic said she lip synched but still managed to sound out of tune. Just imagine how bad she would sound if she did attempt to sing live?
    I have seen Janet live nearly a dozen times since 1990 and I have always enjoyed Janet. Her live shows are amazing, and in her youth, her dancing was electrifying. She is not a singer. Even on recordings it is apparent she does not have the big, bellowing voice that SD-ers equate with being a great singer. No one in the Jackson family was a great vocalist. Jam & Lewis were masterful at recording her voice. Her lead vocal with those marvelous background vocal arrangements are some of the most lush and brilliant pop confections in popular music.

    I last saw her about 2 years ago at the Hollywood Bowl. It was a fantastic show. She hardly sang a note and it was still thrilling. It is the rare artist who can hit you with 2 1/2 hours of instantly recognizable songs that have been with you for 35 years. Credit where credit is due.

  28. #28
    I'm just an old fogey but nobody lip sang at live concerts back in my day,hehehe!!!

  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    Remember when his favorite background singer lip synced to Diana's voice? HE HE HE HE!
    Oh. Yes. I forgot about that. That was so embarrassing! Lol

  30. #30
    I was at an Electric Light Orchestra (ELO) show at the Silverdome in the 70's and they got accused after the show of using instrumental backing tracks to supplement their own instrumental performance(they were touted as a highly instrumental ensemble) and some fans even sued for refunds...This issue goes way back and will likely continue on into the future, especially as stage acts become more and more complex and more multi-technological in nature...

  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by StuBass1 View Post
    I was at an Electric Light Orchestra (ELO) show at the Silverdome in the 70's and they got accused after the show of using instrumental backing tracks to supplement their own instrumental performance(they were touted as a highly instrumental ensemble) and some fans even sued for refunds...This issue goes way back and will likely continue on into the future, especially as stage acts become more and more complex and more multi-technological in nature...
    I loved ELO. Their records were heavy on instrumentation. I wonder if they chose to use tracks for economic and logistics reasons. I mean, the Motown acts did not travel with the DSO when they did concerts. If ELO did not make up the difference in sound, there were have also been complaints!

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    I loved ELO. Their records were heavy on instrumentation. I wonder if they chose to use tracks for economic and logistics reasons. I mean, the Motown acts did not travel with the DSO when they did concerts. If ELO did not make up the difference in sound, there were have also been complaints!
    I'd assume they used the tracks due to the size of the venues they were performing at like the vast Silverdome...I recall enjoying the concert and even as a musician, didn't notice the backing tracks during the performance, or maybe I was just too messed up...

  33. #33
    Jeff & ELO have done some fine shows in the past couple of decades - including at Glastonbury, but Jeff has been quoted as saying that's because of the technology available today and wished it had been around in his heyday when they weren't able to replicate the studio sounds as easily.

    It's sad that even with today's technology, some artists can make a mess of things. Maybe they should give up touring. I do expect live vocals at a concert or a festival.

  34. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by StuBass1 View Post
    I'd assume they used the tracks due to the size of the venues they were performing at like the vast Silverdome...I recall enjoying the concert and even as a musician, didn't notice the backing tracks during the performance, or maybe I was just too messed up...
    I saw Marvin Gaye at the Silverdome in 1979. I also use to go to Lions games there. It was not idea for music concerts.

  35. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Levi Stubbs Tears View Post
    Jeff & ELO have done some fine shows in the past couple of decades - including at Glastonbury, but Jeff has been quoted as saying that's because of the technology available today and wished it had been around in his heyday when they weren't able to replicate the studio sounds as easily.

    It's sad that even with today's technology, some artists can make a mess of things. Maybe they should give up touring. I do expect live vocals at a concert or a festival.
    They don't make nearly what they use to on recordings, so touring is where the money is.

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by jaywonder View Post
    Top of The Pops performances were the artists sang live were rare if I recall. It was common to lip-synch on that show back in the day.
    It was usually at the artists discretion. The genuinely talented ones usually performed live.

  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    It was usually at the artists discretion. The genuinely talented ones usually performed live.
    Lol I remember out of protest, when Nirvana were told to mine on TOTP and they refused to do so, Kurt Cobain sang the whole of "smells like teen spirit" a whole octave lower....

    And I cant remember which band it was but they mimed using baby toy instruments which they smashed at the end of the song.

  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by alexstassi View Post
    Lol I remember out of protest, when Nirvana were told to mine on TOTP and they refused to do so, Kurt Cobain sang the whole of "smells like teen spirit" a whole octave lower....

    And I cant remember which band it was but they mimed using baby toy instruments which they smashed at the end of the song.
    I recall that too, but cannot remember who it was!

  39. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    It was usually at the artists discretion. The genuinely talented ones usually performed live.
    I recalled watching a few who sung it live. I think Whitney Houston sung live when she performed on it. So yeah it's not a requirement, some just chose to lip it.

  40. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    I saw Marvin Gaye at the Silverdome in 1979. I also use to go to Lions games there. It was not idea for music concerts.
    man marv remember how bad the sound was at the dome!

  41. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by detmotownguy View Post
    man marv remember how bad the sound was at the dome!
    It was pretty awful. It was also always a long walk to car after shows and games there.

  42. #42
    And that long assed drive out there grrrrr!

  43. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    I recalled watching a few who sung it live. I think Whitney Houston sung live when she performed on it. So yeah it's not a requirement, some just chose to lip it.
    Yes she did. Diana did a few live vocal performances, and i recall Thelma Houston doing a superb rendition of Don't leave me this way. There were lots of top notch live vocal performances from the artists who could genuinely sing.

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