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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    I think so, because Diana Ross was scared to death that they were going to present some truths that she went around to some television at the time and pretend joke that she may go see the movie with her lawyers LOL! The movie was even about her and the Beyonce character looked like a saint compare to how Diana Ross is in reality.
    And Mary went on interviews playing the victim again on how she wasn't paid for the movie Dreamgirls. LOL!

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Berry and Diana made a bigger star out of Billie Holiday in death than she ever was in life and made money for her estate in a way that wouldn’t happen today

    Yuck - to feel forced to support wife beaters like Pedro and Louis!
    This is true. Pre-LSTB there were very few Holiday lps in print. Since the movie Lady's recordings have never been out of print.

  3. #53
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    It's unfortunate but the fact is if Wilson does not mention the words 'Supremes', 'Diana', or 'Ross' the press & the public have zero interest.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    This is true. Pre-LSTB there were very few Holiday lps in print. Since the movie Lady's recordings have never been out of print.
    Sorry, but that is simply not true. I have multiple Verve, Clef, Norgran, and Decca/MCA records from Billie Holiday in my collection, many that date from the period between her death and before Lady Sings the Blues. Decca aggressively re-released Billie’s catalog immediately after her death, as did Verve/MGM. The Billie Holiday Story was in print continuously between 1959 and 1985. I have every single print of TBHS and am happy to provide photos of the copyright dates when I get back to my collection.

    Nor is it true what Jobeterob wrote. Billie’s Carnegie Hall concert and book brought a very high level of notoriety to her work. Lady Sings the Blues was about making Diana Ross a star. It had little to no impact on Billie or her legacy. She stood on her own. And still does.

  5. #55
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    I don’t know much about Billie Holiday. Is the book you reference an autobiography? Thanks in advance.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by detmotownguy View Post
    I don’t know much about Billie Holiday. Is the book you reference an autobiography? Thanks in advance.
    https://www.amazon.com/Lady-Sings-Bl...s%2C203&sr=8-1

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by thanxal View Post
    Sorry, but that is simply not true. I have multiple Verve, Clef, Norgran, and Decca/MCA records from Billie Holiday in my collection, many that date from the period between her death and before Lady Sings the Blues. Decca aggressively re-released Billie’s catalog immediately after her death, as did Verve/MGM. The Billie Holiday Story was in print continuously between 1959 and 1985. I have every single print of TBHS and am happy to provide photos of the copyright dates when I get back to my collection.

    Nor is it true what Jobeterob wrote. Billie’s Carnegie Hall concert and book brought a very high level of notoriety to her work. Lady Sings the Blues was about making Diana Ross a star. It had little to no impact on Billie or her legacy. She stood on her own. And still does.
    Thanxal. This is what they do when they cannot refute the truth with facts...........they LIE! I'm mean just make stuff up!

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by bradsupremes View Post
    I used to really be about bio-pics, but over the years I’ve found most to be less and less enjoyable. I have a huge problem with most taking artistic liberties and making them historically inaccurate. More and more I find documentaries the proper route for this kind of subject matter. I’ve said for years that the Supremes story would be perfect for PBS’ American Masters. If done the right way they could pull off a stellar documentary, but it would have to be done without Wilson, Ross, Gordy, other Supremes or Motown having any say or control in how it’s written, presented, and edited. This would preserve their story without it being slanted to one’s perspective over the others.
    I'm with you Brad. The Dreamgirls movie really put the nail in the coffin for a Supremes movie IMO, because they even changed aspects of the play to become even more Supremes like. Also I think it would very difficult to get a film maker who would be willing to tell the girls' story without bias. Chances are we'd either get someone who was anti Ross or someone who is pro Ross [[cuz lets be real, Diana is the only reason anyone would jump at the chance to do this movie, motivated by love or hate) and neither type would bring justice to the story. A doc would allow for a more impartial story. Also there would be plenty of room to tell the whole story from beginning to end, including the 70s Supremes.

    I get so annoyed that the ladies' story has been reduced to the negative. Mary was so concerned with selling books that she relied heavily on the negative moments while Diana was so concerned with doing the opposite of Mary that, with the exception of her childhood, we really didn't get much substance. I still want to know more about their recording experiences and performance experiences. Mary wrote a quick little paragraph in her first book about the Supremes performing in Bermuda in early 1964. I wanted to know more about that, like why were the Supremes- who didn't yet have a hit- chosen for this engagement? Were they paired up with anyone? It's hard to believe they were the headliner at the place where they were booked. And how rich of an experience must it have been for Flo, who used to live in the projects, and Mary and Diana, who were still living in the projects, to be in a place like Bermuda? That's crazy to think about. But it's the kind of stuff I'd rather learn than to watch a reenactment of Florence telling Diana to go to hell or vice versa.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Thanxal. This is what they do when they cannot refute the truth with facts...........they LIE! I'm mean just make stuff up!
    Pots and kettles, Marv.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I'm with you Brad. The Dreamgirls movie really put the nail in the coffin for a Supremes movie IMO, because they even changed aspects of the play to become even more Supremes like. Also I think it would very difficult to get a film maker who would be willing to tell the girls' story without bias. Chances are we'd either get someone who was anti Ross or someone who is pro Ross [[cuz lets be real, Diana is the only reason anyone would jump at the chance to do this movie, motivated by love or hate) and neither type would bring justice to the story. A doc would allow for a more impartial story. Also there would be plenty of room to tell the whole story from beginning to end, including the 70s Supremes.

    I get so annoyed that the ladies' story has been reduced to the negative. Mary was so concerned with selling books that she relied heavily on the negative moments while Diana was so concerned with doing the opposite of Mary that, with the exception of her childhood, we really didn't get much substance. I still want to know more about their recording experiences and performance experiences. Mary wrote a quick little paragraph in her first book about the Supremes performing in Bermuda in early 1964. I wanted to know more about that, like why were the Supremes- who didn't yet have a hit- chosen for this engagement? Were they paired up with anyone? It's hard to believe they were the headliner at the place where they were booked. And how rich of an experience must it have been for Flo, who used to live in the projects, and Mary and Diana, who were still living in the projects, to be in a place like Bermuda? That's crazy to think about. But it's the kind of stuff I'd rather learn than to watch a reenactment of Florence telling Diana to go to hell or vice versa.
    Exactly. That should be the focus of a documentary - their career, their work. I would almost base a lot of it on the Expanded Edition timelines. Look at Ron Howard's Eight Days A Week documentary about the Beatles' last US tour. It received rave reviews. I know some people want the drama, but look at all those horrible music documentaries done in UK and here in the US that were all about Flo's firing and death. Enough of that stuff. No one comes out looking good. An honest documentary following their work and experiences would do wonders to a damaged image and may form a new found respect among the music industry.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by thanxal View Post
    Pots and kettles, Marv.

    Exactly! This is the World we live in today. If you do not like the truth, the real truth, you just make up your own "facts" and call everything else "fake news".

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Exactly! This is the World we live in today. If you do not like the truth, the real truth, you just make up your own "facts" and call everything else "fake news".
    And youve done a real fine job of making up your own facts. Congratulations my dear.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    And youve done a real fine job of making up your own facts. Congratulations my dear.
    That was the point. Pots should not be calling kettles black.

  14. #64
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    A documentary would be great. I loved Motown 40 as it was a documentary. The extended segments regarding the Supremes and Diana solo were so good. We always see Mary discuss Motown/ The Supremes, but to finally have Diana talk, added a whole new dimension.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Exactly! This is the World we live in today. If you do not like the truth, the real truth, you just make up your own "facts" and call everything else "fake news".
    And you can certainly speak from experience. You do this far better than anyone else. Well done on being honest for once.

  16. #66
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    What three young black girls achieved in a racially divided country, where racial slurs and ignorance abounded is nothing short of phenomenal. Their experiences going through that time is what i would like to be the focus of a Supremes docu/movie were it ever to be made. Enough of the gloom and doom, what about the great music and the role models they became.

  17. #67
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    Lady Sings the Blues brought Billie Holiday back with a vengeance; my memory is she might have ended up with 5 or 6 titles on the Billboard 200.

    It's not that she was a has been or a never was prior to Lady Sings the Blues, but it certainly caused her to trend in 1972, 73, 74 etc.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Lady Sings the Blues brought Billie Holiday back with a vengeance; my memory is she might have ended up with 5 or 6 titles on the Billboard 200.

    It's not that she was a has been or a never was prior to Lady Sings the Blues, but it certainly caused her to trend in 1972, 73, 74 etc.
    I agree. The movie brought a lot of attention to Billie Holliday. I know many people at the time looking to buy her records.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by vgalindo View Post
    I agree. The movie brought a lot of attention to Billie Holliday. I know many people at the time looking to buy her records.
    I was only a kid when LSB came out and had never even heard of Billie Holiday. I gather that might be true for many people. I remember standing in the record department at Lechmere's and overhearing the conversation between two teenagers next to me. One was debating whether she should buy a Billie album. Her friend said "Who's that?" The other one answered "You know the one who Diana Ross played in the movie."

    It took a few years before I actually heard a Billie recording. To be honest, I wasn't all that impressed. But after reading her book and seeing some documentaries, I slowly began to appreciate her. Now LADY IN SATIN is one of my favorite albums.

  20. #70
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    I was only 9 when the movie came out so have no memory of it. I'm sure there are vast numbers of D.R and music fans who prior to the film had never heard of Billie so were curious as to what she sounded like. For some reason as a kid i expected her to sound like Diana Ross lol. It was a huge shock when as a teenager i first bought a Billie Holiday album to play in my bedroom. Like reece i have since come to appreciate Lady Days music.
    I think the LSTB soundtrack is the best singing of Diana's career. She certainly silenced those film and music critics who did not think she had it in her.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    What three young black girls achieved in a racially divided country, where racial slurs and ignorance abounded is nothing short of phenomenal. Their experiences going through that time is what i would like to be the focus of a Supremes docu/movie were it ever to be made. Enough of the gloom and doom, what about the great music and the role models they became.
    Exactly. The Supremes became pioneers and trailblazers during a very turbulent era in American history. People who say times are tough now don't have any idea how tough it was in 1960s America and three young black women accomplished the "impossible dream". That would be a great thing and I like to see Diana, Mary, the estate of Florence Ballard [[mainly her daughters) and Berry Gordy come together for that if just for that part. When it comes to black music films, the drama gets more focused than the accomplishments.

    Ask the Temptations.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Exactly. The Supremes became pioneers and trailblazers during a very turbulent era in American history. People who say times are tough now don't have any idea how tough it was in 1960s America and three young black women accomplished the "impossible dream". That would be a great thing and I like to see Diana, Mary, the estate of Florence Ballard [[mainly her daughters) and Berry Gordy come together for that if just for that part. When it comes to black music films, the drama gets more focused than the accomplishments.

    Ask the Temptations.
    Superemes Movie here we go! Lights, Camera, Mary, Diana, Flo!

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Lady Sings the Blues brought Billie Holiday back with a vengeance; my memory is she might have ended up with 5 or 6 titles on the Billboard 200.

    It's not that she was a has been or a never was prior to Lady Sings the Blues, but it certainly caused her to trend in 1972, 73, 74 etc.
    Right. It's more than a bit ... disingenuous ... to presume that LSTB had no positive effect on public awareness and sales-interest in Billie.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceNHarmony View Post
    Right. It's more than a bit ... disingenuous ... to presume that LSTB had no positive effect on public awareness and sales-interest in Billie.
    Yeah, but honestly, isn’t it also a bit disingenuous to assert that Billie wasn’t anything until LSTB?
    Just trying to have a respectful disagreement...

  25. #75
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    Hi Thanxal, I read the Billie Holliday book u referred to me. With three Carnegie Hall sell outs, I’d have to say she certainly had the extra special something. A bit painful reading about her struggles. When I was a kid I remember my relatives discussing her music. She wasn’t just a corner bar lounge singer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollie9 View Post
    What three young black girls achieved in a racially divided country, where racial slurs and ignorance abounded is nothing short of phenomenal. Their experiences going through that time is what i would like to be the focus of a Supremes docu/movie were it ever to be made. Enough of the gloom and doom, what about the great music and the role models they became.
    Gloom and doom and drama sell movie tickets. Even I wouldn't want to pay money to sit through a two hour dramatized movie of the Supremes' accomplishments. But a doc presents the opportunity for the full picture to be seen with a high degree of accuracy. And we the fans and the media I believe have played up the drama. Obviously there was some nasty stuff occurring, especially in 1967. Diana downplays it and even Florence was saying that much of the fighting was sisterly. That says to me that even when they hit lows, they had the ability to rebound with highs. But it's the lows in the relationship that 90 percent of people want to focus on for some reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thanxal View Post
    Yeah, but honestly, isn’t it also a bit disingenuous to assert that Billie wasn’t anything until LSTB?
    Yes, yes it is.

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    Hope I didn't suggest Billie Holiday was nothing until LSTB; doubt she'd have had a film made about her if she was nothing.

    If I said that, it was just inappropriate phrasing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Hope I didn't suggest Billie Holiday was nothing until LSTB; doubt she'd have had a film made about her if she was nothing.

    If I said that, it was just inappropriate phrasing.
    maybe I misinterpreted

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    Absolutely not. I think this would be a terrible idea. The Supremes' story does not need to be fictionalized and exploited any more than it has already. How do you even get a truthful story out? Everyone has a different twist on their story, everyone has a motive, and some people aren't alive anymore to make sure their side gets told correctly.

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