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  1. #1
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    Gladys and wanda friction in the marvelettes

    It is well known there was friction in the marvelettes camp between both lead singers well before gladys exited t group in 67 as mentioned by Catherine in the marvelettes book and on tvone and i imagine it ran deeper when smokey stopped working with Gladys or stopped releasing a sides with her as lead. Are there any motown insiders who care to share.

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    I don’t know personally if Gladys was upset that she wasn’t getting the A side singles. She was still recording quite a bit of tracks and they were on the albums. Frankly they weren’t doing all that much recording and so I’d assume they were thankful for just not being dropped from the label.

    According to the book Gladys was more put off by Wanda’s attitude that their early stuff wasn’t good. That change of heart and Wanda’s decline seem to have more to do w the problems. The two of them had always been sharing leads so I guess that area was less of a sore spot

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    The marvelettes were doing quite well during the time wanda took over. As lead. Dont mess w bill. Hunter gets captured young and in love. I doubt motown would have dropped the marvelettes especially w smokey writing for them Theres s story around on fb that wanda devalued gladys contributions as lead singer and there were argments over wanda beig more significant to the group in which catherie did not agree. Things got worse after gladys left as catherne documents on tvone

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    The marvelettes were doing quite well during the time wanda took over. As lead. Dont mess w bill. Hunter gets captured young and in love. I doubt motown would have dropped the marvelettes especially w smokey writing for them Theres s story around on fb that wanda devalued gladys contributions as lead singer and there were argments over wanda beig more significant to the group in which catherie did not agree. Things got worse after gladys left as catherne documents on tvone
    Things really started to get worse when Smokey took over as their producer. He would not allow Gladys to sing lead on the singles, only Wanda.

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    Well on Unsung, Wanda was pegged as the troublemaker in the group.

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    That probably sums it up. Gladys was very significant to t marvelettes and t originator of t sound no matter how small.

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    That probably sums it up. Gladys was very significant to t marvelettes and t originator of t sound no matter how small.
    Gladys was significant and essential to the group. To me all of them were.

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    Every business has frictions; more seems to be made of them in a book or documentary and that’s in order to sell the product

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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Every business has frictions; more seems to be made of them in a book or documentary and that’s in order to sell the product
    No that's not true. They didn't even tell where source of the "frictions" came from in any book. So it was not used to sell the product. In fact, in most books about Motown [[save for Miss Ray's book), they were all pretty tame and did not tell all the uglies that really went on at Motown in Detroit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    No that's not true. They didn't even tell where source of the "frictions" came from in any book. So it was not used to sell the product. In fact, in most books about Motown [[save for Miss Ray's book), they were all pretty tame and did not tell all the uglies that really went on at Motown in Detroit.
    Ain't that the truth Marv. I doubt it will ever be told; let's hope not.

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    Both lead singers gave the marvelettes a beautiful body of work and neither can be devalued. I love gladys early work in particular

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    I agree. Gladys had a soulful intensity and passion that was somewhat unusual at Motown and she really “sold” the songs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luke View Post
    I agree. Gladys had a soulful intensity and passion that was somewhat unusual at Motown and she really “sold” the songs.
    Gladys was the sound of the Marvelettes, along with Kat, Wanda and Georgianna up to and around the mid 60s. Some of the producers did not take her seriously because she was so young and it did not help that she/they were from the burbs.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    It is well known there was friction in the marvelettes camp between both lead singers well before gladys exited t group in 67 as mentioned by Catherine in the marvelettes book and on tvone and i imagine it ran deeper when smokey stopped working with Gladys or stopped releasing a sides with her as lead. Are there any motown insiders who care to share.
    Yeah! Smokey took the lead from Gladys and gave it to Wanda when he started writing and producing for them. He said some truly rude and unmentionable things right to Gladys' face and she never got over it and I don't think she ever forgave him. In a few words....It was awful! LOL!
    Last edited by marv2; 04-16-2018 at 05:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Yeah! Smokey took the lead from Gladys and gave it to Wanda when he started writing and producing for them. He said some truly rude and unmentionable things right to Gladys' face and she never got over it and I don't think she ever forgave him. In a few words....It was awful! LOL!
    This is total garbage as usual, another desperate attempt for attention and credibility. Smokey Robinson is a gentleman, and would never have been rude to Gladys. I spoke with Gladys at length in 2002 when we did Mysteries and Scandals Florence Ballard. I have also spoken with Kat Schaffner for that show and other times through the years. And Joe Schaffner and the late Joe Shillair as well.

    Smokey took over main production of the group after Don't Mess With Bill. What Smokey DID tell Gladys was that he prefered Wanda's voice because it was softer, like Diana and Claudettes. Diana Ross was selling millions of records.

    Gladys didn't like it that much but she went along with it.

    The problem between Gladys and Wanda was minimal when compared to Diana and Flo or David Ruffin and Otis Williams. Wanda's ego became inflamed when the hits started to come back. Gladys was more even tempered but Kat would straighten you out. They knew Wanda was on a substance. They mostly tolerated her but the occasional outbursts did occur. Also during this period producers stopped using Gladys and Kat for backing vocals which enhanced Wanda's self-worth.

    Gladys Horton dropped out of the Marvelettes because she gave birth to a severely handicapped son. She was an orphan and had no one to help her with her baby. There is no other reason.

    There was no mistreatment of Smokey to Gladys Horton.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    This is total garbage as usual, another desperate attempt for attention and credibility. Smokey Robinson is a gentleman, and would never have been rude to Gladys. I spoke with Gladys at length in 2002 when we did Mysteries and Scandals Florence Ballard. I have also spoken with Kat Schaffner for that show and other times through the years. And Joe Schaffner and the late Joe Shillair as well.

    Smokey took over main production of the group after Don't Mess With Bill. What Smokey DID tell Gladys was that he prefered Wanda's voice because it was softer, like Diana and Claudettes. Diana Ross was selling millions of records.

    Gladys didn't like it that much but she went along with it.

    The problem between Gladys and Wanda was minimal when compared to Diana and Flo or David Ruffin and Otis Williams. Wanda's ego became inflamed when the hits started to come back. Gladys was more even tempered but Kat would straighten you out. They knew Wanda was on a substance. They mostly tolerated her but the occasional outbursts did occur. Also during this period producers stopped using Gladys and Kat for backing vocals which enhanced Wanda's self-worth.

    Gladys Horton dropped out of the Marvelettes because she gave birth to a severely handicapped son. She was an orphan and had no one to help her with her baby. There is no other reason.

    There was no mistreatment of Smokey to Gladys Horton.
    Once again I thank you for telling the truth and always being the voice of reason.

    Fondly,

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    This is total garbage as usual, another desperate attempt for attention and credibility. Smokey Robinson is a gentleman, and would never have been rude to Gladys. I spoke with Gladys at length in 2002 when we did Mysteries and Scandals Florence Ballard. I have also spoken with Kat Schaffner for that show and other times through the years. And Joe Schaffner and the late Joe Shillair as well.

    Smokey took over main production of the group after Don't Mess With Bill. What Smokey DID tell Gladys was that he prefered Wanda's voice because it was softer, like Diana and Claudettes. Diana Ross was selling millions of records.

    Gladys didn't like it that much but she went along with it.

    The problem between Gladys and Wanda was minimal when compared to Diana and Flo or David Ruffin and Otis Williams. Wanda's ego became inflamed when the hits started to come back. Gladys was more even tempered but Kat would straighten you out. They knew Wanda was on a substance. They mostly tolerated her but the occasional outbursts did occur. Also during this period producers stopped using Gladys and Kat for backing vocals which enhanced Wanda's self-worth.

    Gladys Horton dropped out of the Marvelettes because she gave birth to a severely handicapped son. She was an orphan and had no one to help her with her baby. There is no other reason.

    There was no mistreatment of Smokey to Gladys Horton.
    Facts.

    Also people got nerve to disrespect Smokey much like they disrespect Diana. Hell, they're disrespecting Gladys Horton's memory by bringing up some almost 30-year-old interview that was just nothing but hearsay. But I see how it is with some folks. They don't come here to celebrate music, they just do things to prove a point. What point? Who knows. It's childish and silly for folks WAY OLDER than me to still be acting like 1967 hasn't left them. 51 years have passed and stuff has CHANGED!
    Last edited by midnightman; 04-21-2018 at 03:59 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Facts.

    Also people got nerve to disrespect Smokey much like they disrespect Diana. Hell, they're disrespecting Gladys Horton's memory by bringing up some almost 30-year-old interview that was just nothing but hearsay. But I see how it is with some folks. They don't come here to celebrate music, they just do things to prove a point. What point? Who knows. It's childish and silly for folks WAY OLDER than me to still be acting like 1967 hasn't left them. 51 years have passed and stuff has CHANGED!
    Preach my dear, preach. You are another great voice of reason.

    fondly,

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Facts.

    Also people got nerve to disrespect Smokey much like they disrespect Diana. Hell, they're disrespecting Gladys Horton's memory by bringing up some almost 30-year-old interview that was just nothing but hearsay. But I see how it is with some folks. They don't come here to celebrate music, they just do things to prove a point. What point? Who knows. It's childish and silly for folks WAY OLDER than me to still be acting like 1967 hasn't left them. 51 years have passed and stuff has CHANGED!
    Excellent post.

    Of course there was drama at Motown, when is there not drama in the workplace. At a successful record company like Motown, there was a lot of creativity and ambition and with that comes strong emotions. But geez this stuff was half a century ago. Does Flo care about any of this stuff where she is? Does Gladys? They're in paradise, LET THEM ENJOY IT.

    I also maintain the person who constantly digs up this stuff in a desparate attempt for attention is only exposing himself as being incredibly lonely and unfulfilled. Most of us on here relish the legacy of Motown and we do enjoy the gossipy stuff occasionally. But when a person makes it up to try to pass himself off as a Motown "expert" it appears to be a mental disturbance.

    I don't come on SDF as much as I used to but, when I don't someone will alert me to this person's incoherent ramblings. Can I ask that I not be contacted about him any further? I am semi-retired, I am in the gym just about everyday and I am still rebuilding from the flood of August 2016 so my plate is full.

    To further prove my point, the BBC is doing a special on famous rock bands and they are featuring the Supremes. I was contacted in January and they were going to fly someone here to interview me. I declined. Instead I referred them to long time fan club president Carl Feuerbacher. Mary Wilson was of course interviewed.

    I cherish the legacy of all Motown acts. But when it's over, it's over.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    Excellent post.

    Of course there was drama at Motown, when is there not drama in the workplace. At a successful record company like Motown, there was a lot of creativity and ambition and with that comes strong emotions. But geez this stuff was half a century ago. Does Flo care about any of this stuff where she is? Does Gladys? They're in paradise, LET THEM ENJOY IT.

    I also maintain the person who constantly digs up this stuff in a desparate attempt for attention is only exposing himself as being incredibly lonely and unfulfilled. Most of us on here relish the legacy of Motown and we do enjoy the gossipy stuff occasionally. But when a person makes it up to try to pass himself off as a Motown "expert" it appears to be a mental disturbance.

    I don't come on SDF as much as I used to but, when I don't someone will alert me to this person's incoherent ramblings. Can I ask that I not be contacted about him any further? I am semi-retired, I am in the gym just about everyday and I am still rebuilding from the flood of August 2016 so my plate is full.

    To further prove my point, the BBC is doing a special on famous rock bands and they are featuring the Supremes. I was contacted in January and they were going to fly someone here to interview me. I declined. Instead I referred them to long time fan club president Carl Feuerbacher. Mary Wilson was of course interviewed.

    I cherish the legacy of all Motown acts. But when it's over, it's over.
    You really are the checks and balances person and the legitimate source we need. Ive seen you on TV discussing Motown and the Supremes and Florence Ballard and Miss Ross and I personaly feel we need you here to keep the fabricator in check.

    God bless you.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    Excellent post.

    Of course there was drama at Motown, when is there not drama in the workplace. At a successful record company like Motown, there was a lot of creativity and ambition and with that comes strong emotions. But geez this stuff was half a century ago. Does Flo care about any of this stuff where she is? Does Gladys? They're in paradise, LET THEM ENJOY IT.

    I also maintain the person who constantly digs up this stuff in a desparate attempt for attention is only exposing himself as being incredibly lonely and unfulfilled. Most of us on here relish the legacy of Motown and we do enjoy the gossipy stuff occasionally. But when a person makes it up to try to pass himself off as a Motown "expert" it appears to be a mental disturbance.

    I don't come on SDF as much as I used to but, when I don't someone will alert me to this person's incoherent ramblings. Can I ask that I not be contacted about him any further? I am semi-retired, I am in the gym just about everyday and I am still rebuilding from the flood of August 2016 so my plate is full.

    To further prove my point, the BBC is doing a special on famous rock bands and they are featuring the Supremes. I was contacted in January and they were going to fly someone here to interview me. I declined. Instead I referred them to long time fan club president Carl Feuerbacher. Mary Wilson was of course interviewed.

    I cherish the legacy of all Motown acts. But when it's over, it's over.
    I definitely think there are some folks who are deeply unhappy and they take it out on others and when there are disagreements, it boils over so yeah I definitely see it here.

    So they build themselves to be someone they're not. So I definitely feel you there. It would be best to let them wallow in their own playground but one can get easily swept by someone's negativity.

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    Im sorry to hear about smokeys treatment of gladys what nerve. No wonder gladys was upset in a 1991 interview when she said that smokey robinson was t very one to sell the marvelettes name over a lost bet fot payment and at that time gladys was back on the road performing and t only marvelette on the road in america. Wanda was forced bsck on t recording scene in england with gladys on the ian levine deal with many other motown acts for a small pittence

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    I tend to prefer more of Gladys' vocals to wanda's. She was a warmth and sincerity and is quite versatile w her leads. really talented. makes you wonder how she would have done with more and broader material

    Not stunned to hear she and smokey didn't get along [[assuming that rumor is true). Not that I think Smokey is a bad guy but there are always people that just don't click. perhaps they just didn't get along. given the popularity of their two groups in the early years, I'd assume they were often sharing the bill or working together at the same locations. And given their age, they could have easily done some immature or adolescent things.

    Did smokey ever produce much on the girls prior to the mid-60s and Don't Mess With Bill? maybe part of the reason for that is he and Gladys didn't like each other. totally speculating

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    Smokey wrote & produced "As Long As I Know He's Mine" which featured both Gladys[[with most of the lead) and Wanda # 3 R&B 1963. It was the follow up to "Locking Up My Heart". Then Smokey wrote & produced "You're My Remedy" which Wanda sang lead, 1964.Wanda sang lead on both "I'll Keep Holding On" and "Danger,Heartbreak Dead Ahead" which Mickey Stevenson produced BEFORE "Don't Mess With Bill" . I don't think Gladys had a problem with Wanda being on those leads.

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    Quote Originally Posted by motony View Post
    Smokey wrote & produced "As Long As I Know He's Mine" which featured both Gladys[[with most of the lead) and Wanda # 3 R&B 1963. It was the follow up to "Locking Up My Heart". Then Smokey wrote & produced "You're My Remedy" which Wanda sang lead, 1964.Wanda sang lead on both "I'll Keep Holding On" and "Danger,Heartbreak Dead Ahead" which Mickey Stevenson produced BEFORE "Don't Mess With Bill" . I don't think Gladys had a problem with Wanda being on those leads.
    Smokey also wrote and produced HE'S A GOOD GUY [[YES HE IS) with Gladys on lead, which was the follow-up to AS LONG AS I KNOW HE'S MINE, and hit #18 R&B.

    He also wrote and produced the album track I THINK I CAN CHANGE YOU, with Gladys on lead.
    Last edited by reese; 04-16-2018 at 09:27 PM.

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    that's right!! I forgot about Remedy!

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    Wait, was Smoke's treatment of Gladys confirmed by any of the Marvelettes members???

    I'm sure Smoke produced songs featuring Gladys on lead so I don't think that's true at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Wait, was Smoke's treatment of Gladys confirmed by any of the Marvelettes members???

    I'm sure Smoke produced songs featuring Gladys on lead so I don't think that's true at all.
    Well that's too bad because it is true! At the time, everyone thought he was just showing favoritism towards Wanda because she was married to Bobby, his group mate and friend. That wasn't it. The stuff he said to Gladys would have gotten him put in the hospital under different circumstances and with a different type of person. Gladys just wanted to sing so she asked him why was he taking more leads from her and giving them to Wanda.

    Now if you think the folks in Detroit were going to write down everything they did and said on paper you're umm......mistaken LOL!!!!

    It really does not matter if you believe it or not because it is the truth and it did happen years ago. Fran is right about the interview in the 90s. There were other interviews Gladys did along with Miss Ray and I am not getting into all of that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Wait, was Smoke's treatment of Gladys confirmed by any of the Marvelettes members???

    I'm sure Smoke produced songs featuring Gladys on lead so I don't think that's true at all.
    You have to ask for receipts around here. Some folks will tell you everybody at Motown greeted each other by sniffing each other's asses the way dogs do, and you're supposed to believe it because they said so. Bullshit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    You have to ask for receipts around here. Some folks will tell you everybody at Motown greeted each other by sniffing each other's asses the way dogs do, and you're supposed to believe it because they said so. Bullshit.
    Basically! I don't get how some folks claim they love Motown and then sh*t on the artists who helped to make Motown what it was!

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Basically! I don't get how some folks claim they love Motown and then sh*t on the artists who helped to make Motown what it was!
    Some folks get off on gossip. And that's not singling out anyone in this forum, that's life in the real world. The rumor mill really starts churning in middle school, it gets worse in high school, and then when folks are grown you expect it to subside but it seems to get even worse. I know some old 75, 80, 85 year old women who make Marv look like Little Orphan Annie. Them heifers can gos-sip!! Tell you all about who was doing what and when. They didn't see none of it, of course. Just what they heard. But they'll tell you what it was, just like if they saw it themselves...even though they didn't. Go figure.

    The history of Motown is important. And you can't tell it's history without sometimes getting into the personal conflicts that arise between the people involved, especially when it directly affects the Motown story. And surely any conflict between Smoke and Gladys could have had an effect on the music and the business. And as someone pointed out earlier, conflicts do happen. I'm seeing people repeating this Gladys vs Smokey anecdote from Gladys' perspective but not Smokey's. Lets say he did say something "rude and unmentionable". Did he wake up that morning and decide today is the day he's going to say something "rude and unmentionable" to Gladys Horton today? Or was he provoked? It's hard for me to imagine Gladys Horton provoking someone in that manner, of course, but she was human just like anyone else. She was young just like everyone else. When you're young you say stupid shit, you speak without thinking. Keeping it real can sometimes go real wrong.

    But until someone produces a source for Gladys' claim that Smokey was mean to her and bumped her from lead singer status, once again I'm filing this story under "rumor" and returning to the music.

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    As for the two women as lead singers, I prefer Gladys as lead until about 1965 when Wanda really found her footing as a vocalist. Still loved Gladys' voice, but I think I love Wanda's more at that point. Marketing wise, I think Wanda had the more ear catching voice at that point. And it had matured in a way that I don't think Gladys' had, and thus Wanda's voice was better suited for the more adult themed cuts that Smokey was crafting.

    I still think it's a shame that Gladys didn't pursue a solo career in the 70s. We really missed out on hearing more great music with her voice.

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    In a 1991 interview with bill randhl gladys said smokey sold the marvelettes name in a crap game as payment and that caused her problems when larry marshak tried to stop her from performing because he owned t name.

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    In a 1991 interview with bill randhl gladys said smokey sold the marvelettes name in a crap game as payment and that caused her problems when larry marshak tried to stop her from performing because he owned t name.
    Yep Fran! That also happened, but he's not going to believe you! LOL!!!

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    No singles featuring gladys wete released after too many fish in the sea that was her last a side. And i believe keep off no trespasing would made a great single with plenty of pop airplay

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    No singles featuring gladys wete released after too many fish in the sea that was her last a side. And i believe keep off no trespasing would made a great single with plenty of pop airplay
    They did not give that song a chance. Remember, Smokey was a Vice President at Motown at that time.

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    Check it out:


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    Thanks marv for posting and that track was recorded after too many fish. And that was a great track featured on t pink 1966 album

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    Thanks marv for posting and that track was recorded after too many fish. And that was a great track featured on t pink 1966 album
    You're most welcome Fran. I have the pink album in my collection, a great album. I wonder much it is worth now. LOL!

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    I had it once now i have both forever the compkete albums vol 1 and 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    I had it once now i have both forever the compkete albums vol 1 and 2
    I have to get back to my collecting. It's been a while

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    What was t a side of this. I love gladys range with wandas falsetto reminds me of going down for third time diana and flo

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    What was t a side of this. I love gladys range with wandas falsetto reminds me of going down for third time diana and flo
    I will try to find out for you.

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    Lol @ Marv...

    So defensive, chile.

    What was with that "it doesn't matter" situation? LOL

    But yeah, Smoke should've gave Gladys more leads on singles. It's what made the Marvelettes sizzle. And before you say "but not everyone appears the way they are" in regards to Smokey, yes I know that, but him dissing Gladys like he's a jock at high school just seems... out of character lol

    Like I've never seen any other Motown act being dragged by Smokey like that...

    Then again, the Marvelettes always thought Motown dissed them as outsiders because they weren't from the streets of Detroit, but in some "country" town like Inkster.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Lol @ Marv...

    So defensive, chile.

    What was with that "it doesn't matter" situation? LOL

    But yeah, Smoke should've gave Gladys more leads on singles. It's what made the Marvelettes sizzle. And before you say "but not everyone appears the way they are" in regards to Smokey, yes I know that, but him dissing Gladys like he's a jock at high school just seems... out of character lol

    Like I've never seen any other Motown act being dragged by Smokey like that...

    Then again, the Marvelettes always thought Motown dissed them as outsiders because they weren't from the streets of Detroit, but in some "country" town like Inkster.
    I'm reminded of some very wise words that it seems like so many people refuse to hold their hands up and receive: believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. This story of Smokey gambling the name away is untrue. Marshak was a dirty, lowdown piece of trash in the industry who managed to steal what he wanted. The reason Kat and Gladys' estate were able to retain the right to the name is because Motown never surrendered the name. It was always legally Motown's and the surviving members of the Marvelettes. Marshak was arguing that because there was a period of time in which the Marvelettes were no longer a group, that he could trademark the name and put together his own Marvelettes. The law said "no way Jose" and that's why his ass lost the case. Had Smokey or anyone else signed the name over to Marshak, he would have had a legal right to the name. Motown nor it's representatives- including Smokey- ever did such a thing. Again, that's why Larry Marshak lost his suit.
    Last edited by RanRan79; 04-17-2018 at 01:43 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RanRan79 View Post
    I'm reminded of some very wise words that it seems like so many people refuse to hold their hands up and receive: believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. This story of Smokey gambling the name away is untrue. Marshak was a dirty, lowdown piece of trash in the industry who managed to steal what he wanted. The reason Kat and Gladys' estate were able to retain the right to the name is because Motown never surrendered the name. It was always legally Motown's and the surviving members of the Marvelettes. Marshak was arguing that because there was a period of time in which the Marvelettes were no longer a group, that he could trademark the name and put together his own Marvelettes. The law said "no way Jose" and that's why his ass lost the case. Had Smokey or anyone else signed the name over to Marshak, he would have had a legal right to the name. Motown nor it's representatives- including Smokey- ever did such a thing. Again, that's why Larry Marshak lost his suit.
    I knew it. Shame on Marv shaming Smokey this way...

    I can't believe I used to believe the story about Smokey. Glad to know he wasn't that sh***y.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    I knew it. Shame on Marv shaming Smokey this way...

    I can't believe I used to believe the story about Smokey. Glad to know he wasn't that sh***y.
    And I always thought it was Gordy who supposedly gambled the name away, which would make more sense considering that [[a) he was a notorious gambler, and [[b) only he would have had any power to give the name away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Lol @ Marv...

    So defensive, chile.

    What was with that "it doesn't matter" situation? LOL

    But yeah, Smoke should've gave Gladys more leads on singles. It's what made the Marvelettes sizzle. And before you say "but not everyone appears the way they are" in regards to Smokey, yes I know that, but him dissing Gladys like he's a jock at high school just seems... out of character lol

    Like I've never seen any other Motown act being dragged by Smokey like that...

    Then again, the Marvelettes always thought Motown dissed them as outsiders because they weren't from the streets of Detroit, but in some "country" town like Inkster.
    Be honest with yourself and admit you don't know Smokey's character. I just post facts and if you choose to not believe the truth, that is your business.

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    I know what i heard from gladys voice and when i get time i am going to post word for word what she had to say about smokey robinson. I dont make up gossip. And gladys horton did not deserve the garbage she had to deal with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by franjoy56 View Post
    I know what i heard from gladys voice and when i get time i am going to post word for word what she had to say about smokey robinson. I dont make up gossip. And gladys horton did not deserve the garbage she had to deal with.
    When you repeat something that you weren't present for and present it as fact, it's gossip. And while I will certainly appreciate you posting word for word what Gladys supposedly said, I'd much rather have you source where this information is coming from. Is this a television program? A written article perhaps? Who, what and where would be greatly appreciated.

    With you even saying Gladys "did not deserve the garbage she had to deal with", it tells me that your entire opinion about the subject is operating from a place where only Gladys' side of things matter. You claim to have Gladys' side, but how can you make an informed opinion about the situation if you don't also have Smokey's side? This I don't understand.

    The verdict in this case still stands: rumor.

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