“Bad Weather”

[Bluebrock]

another issue is that M and Pedro were determined to have her featured more heavily as the lead. so they wanted something like He's Me Man which showcased her more prominently as the single. Out of her dance leads on Sup 75, I think He's My Man is the strongest [[her ballads were excellent as usual) but I think there should have been more scherrie on the verses. Mary does an ok job but not an amazing job. when scherrie gets going towards the end, she blows it away. But you need something earlier in the piece to really grab listeners' attention. Mary just doesn't really do it. her leads on the verses are just too dull and low key. and this is a dance track - should be setting you on fire.

I agree. Scherrie should have done more of the vocals. She blows Mary away when she comes in. Mary's vocals on here are merely okay, nothing more. Maybe that was what held the song back. A stronger lead vocal could perhaps have lifted the whole song and given it even more commercial potential.

[Bluebrock]

"It's All Been Said.." was the perfect early 70's 'plastic pop' single in the vein of "Love Grows Where My RoseMary Goes", "My Baby Loves Lovin" etc it would have been the "Where Did Our Love Go" for the 3rd incarnation of The Supremes, who top 40 always considered a pop group..stupid move, one of many stupid moves...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyHxGhS9XqA

Totally agree Jimi. It's commercial potential was just amazing, but it was too short.

[Bluebrock]

i liked the Supremes 75 lp but still cant believe Bend A Little and Can WE Love Again were left off. I like Sha La Bandit as well.....Color My World Blue is a gem.love it

I loved this album but there were a couple of clunkers on there. The dreary "where is it i belong" has got to be the dullest and most lifeless song the Supremes ever recorded. It just goes nowhere. The chorus should have been better rather than just repeating the same few words. Awful song. I also thought This is why i believe in you was too fast and frantic. Great vocals by Scherrie but better songs were left off the album.

[sup_fan]

I loved this album but there were a couple of clunkers on there. The dreary "where is it i belong" has got to be the dullest and most lifeless song the Supremes ever recorded. It just goes nowhere. The chorus should have been better rather than just repeating the same few words. Awful song. I also thought This is why i believe in you was too fast and frantic. Great vocals by Scherrie but better songs were left off the album.

I like many of the tracks but many i find pretty useless. the Ivey Woodford tracks are among my favorites. most of the disco tracks [[he's my man, where do i go) are pretty generic to me. not bad songs but nothing special. could have been sung by any group and therefore the don't strike me as "supreme." And i agree about Where Is It I belong - horrible.

[midnightman]

The delay in releases further led to the Supremes' decline.

[daviddh]

totally agree, I liked that Mary was given more to do but Scherrie was a powerhouse. I think if she did the entire lead, maybe......wonder if there is a version with Scherrie singing the entire lead.

[gman]

The delay in releases further led to the Supremes' decline.

I agree! ...it's all been said before...LOL!

[TheMotownManiac]

After all this chat, I brought a 70s Supremes mix tape to play at aerobics this morning. From what I could tell, all had at least heard of the Supremes and more than half thought it was “Diana Ross’ first group”. Their fave tracks: River Deep, Floy Joy and Tossin and Turnin. They also liked He’s My Man [[but some didn’t like Mary’s voice) and It’s All Been Said Before - HOWEVER both latter songs were too hard to understand a lot of the words. Although How they passed over my faves like UpThe Ladder, Stoned Love and Nathan, I Don’t know. But everyone dug the sound of HMM and IABSB. No one said they hated or disliked any of the others except a few didn’t really like bad weather.

Im convinced that had they released IABSB that it might worked better than HMM because it had a great sound in the bars and got a lot of play. It might have broken through in car radios if it got play. It really elevated the mood at aerobics more than any other. The Supremes hadn’t been in the top ten for 4 years and were basically off the map for two - that’s had to come back from for anyone. Martha couldn’t score with Bless You.

Yes, it’s too short, but HDH could have made it longer for the single, but even as it is, it was fun and unique.

Maybe, after the poor showing of the album, Motown felt it wasn’t worth trying. With the limited TV exposure it had, it still charted much worse than Jimmy Webb - so it’s not like the world was dying for a new album from the girls. The Tonight Show and Soul Train were enough to boost a strong product but in this case, didn’t seem to. Motown was having a crappy year and needed to sell something.

[sup_fan]

the tonight show performed did NOTHING to help album sales. that ranks up there as one of the worst live performances i've ever seen of the group. the band [[which isn't really their fault of course) sounds hideous and too brassy, mary's vocals are weak, scherrie misses a note or two, the choreography is a mess and how the heck do they expect to do any sort of dance moves in those Scarlett O'Hara dresses? i don't dislike the dresses but they're totally out of place for a disco number. or at least for the intricate choreography they were trying to do

[gman]

the '75 LP did get to #25 on the RnB chart....but even Touch got to #6 on the same chart.

[TheMotownManiac]

You’re 100% spot on - but at least millions knew there was a new Supremes album and didn’t seem to care. This is one major reason why they failed: many of their tv appearances were more of a hinderance than a help. It seems the more tv they did, the more they slipped. I loved those tonight show gowns, but how ludicrous to To a dance song in them LOL... They were clueless obviously as to how to present themselves and Mary, hogging the spotlight without singing lead, is incorrigible. I don’t buy Mary’s lack of confidence thing at all, I never heard a bad vocal from her live from 1966 People to 2017. She always handled the songs well, it’s her voice that a lot of folks don’t relate to. As a stylist, I’ve liked just about everything she’s ever, ever done.

[TheMotownManiac]

the '75 LP did get to #25 on the RnB chart....but even Touch got to #6 on the same chart.

25 is a disgrace for The Supremes on R&B chart, but ANOTHER new face and a returning face just made the identity of the group less familiar. They were now The Supremes in name only and it was just too late to put a group of strangers on TV or on album covers and expect the public to relate to them at all. They so needed a knock out record or TV appearance, they had the talent, but so did a thousand other groups.

[gman]

just a side note..MSS also did the Wanderama kids TV show on a Sunday morning. I believe it was a regional show, I saw it in '77 NY and I think thy lipsynched Driving Wheel, Let Yourself Go and Come Into My Life.

[TheMotownManiac]

I love this forum! Thank you! I’ve never heard of the show, but will put feelers out. Was it a local show or network or syndicated do you know?

[Jimi LaLumia]

wonderrama[[ not wander..lol)was on Channel 5 in NY then Metromedia before it became part of the Fox entertainmnt network

[sup_fan]

just a side note..MSS also did the Wanderama kids TV show on a Sunday morning. I believe it was a regional show, I saw it in '77 NY and I think thy lipsynched Driving Wheel, Let Yourself Go and Come Into My Life.

Wow!! That’s a new one. Wish more of these rare clips would come forward

[gman]

thanks Jim! I was trying to think of the host earlier but couldn't...now, hours later without even trying I'm sure the first was Sonny Fox and the 2nd was Bob McAllister. [[they used to sing "Doe's anybody here have an Artvok?") LOL!

[marv2]

just a side note..MSS also did the Wanderama kids TV show on a Sunday morning. I believe it was a regional show, I saw it in '77 NY and I think thy lipsynched Driving Wheel, Let Yourself Go and Come Into My Life.

MSS also appeared on Detroit's "The Scene" dance show in 1976. They were in Detroit celebrating the Supremes 15th Anniversary. They performed "I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do the Walking" and "You're What's Missing In My Life" along with being interviewed by Nat Morris.

[daviddh]

just a point, the Supremes had been off the charts for almost 2 years and were now back with a new lead singer.they had a new sound.
the younger fans didn't really know them that well. they knew the 60s supremes more or less, they needed to reach out to the younger record buying kids to get airplay. the older fans were still around but now split with the group and Diana solo.
what people also fail to realize is that Diana struggled in the 70s as well. it wasn't until Lady Sings that she began to really gain ground but then even she was off the charts again for almost 2 years, until Theme from Mahogany.
I do recall that Scherrie was under contract with another label and had to wait 1 year to record with the Supremes and a contract with the Supremes had expired and they had to wait until the new contracts were signed to record a new album. I think Motown was hoping Mary would give up.
also Berry offered to manage the group twice, once with Jean in the group and then again with Scherrie , Mary Wilson turned him down both times, but yet complained Motown didn't do enough for them. strange to me ,..and this seems to be a pattern that would repeat it self later.
I think Its All Been Said should have been the first single in 1974.totally agree
Color My World Blue is the highlight of the album.
Hes My Man should have had more Scherrie on lead but we all know how it turned out.
now I am not attacking Mary, I like her on the ballads, but not the disco leads as much but as an original I was glad to see her do more ,but not at the groups expense. I think her leads on Floy Joy were right and gave a nice edge to the songs as there were times , just to much Jean.....
bottom line ,I think some forget how Diana had songs and albums that failed or didn't do as well.

[blackguy69]

just a point, the Supremes had been off the charts for almost 2 years and were now back with a new lead singer.they had a new sound.
the younger fans didn't really know them that well. they knew the 60s supremes more or less, they needed to reach out to the younger record buying kids to get airplay. the older fans were still around but now split with the group and Diana solo.
what people also fail to realize is that Diana struggled in the 70s as well. it wasn't until Lady Sings that she began to really gain ground but then even she was off the charts again for almost 2 years, until Theme from Mahogany.
I do recall that Scherrie was under contract with another label and had to wait 1 year to record with the Supremes and a contract with the Supremes had expired and they had to wait until the new contracts were signed to record a new album. I think Motown was hoping Mary would give up.
also Berry offered to manage the group twice, once with Jean in the group and then again with Scherrie , Mary Wilson turned him down both times, but yet complained Motown didn't do enough for them. strange to me ,..and this seems to be a pattern that would repeat it self later.
I think Its All Been Said should have been the first single in 1974.totally agree
Color My World Blue is the highlight of the album.
Hes My Man should have had more Scherrie on lead but we all know how it turned out.
now I am not attacking Mary, I like her on the ballads, but not the disco leads as much but as an original I was glad to see her do more ,but not at the groups expense. I think her leads on Floy Joy were right and gave a nice edge to the songs as there were times , just to much Jean.....
bottom line ,I think some forget how Diana had songs and albums that failed or didn't do as well.

Actually Motown managed them til 75

[marv2]

The Supremes were an expensive act to present to the public. They required songwriters, producers, musicians, dress designers, choreographers, hair and make-up people, publicists, booking agents, stage managers, etc, etc.

Consider another group that had become very popular at that time in the mid-70s, Rufus. Just as an example. They wrote some, if not most of their own material, they wore their own clothes on stage and television. They played their own music and there was no real choreography to deal with. There were many more "self contained groups" coming onto the music scene in the 70s that did not require so much manpower to get to them in front of the public.

[gman]

And all of it was billed against the groups royalty roll....maybe we should consider that when we think of the old gowns issue. I am also guessing that there were at least 2 changes...perhaps one "classic" gown and one new one per performance?

[kenneth]

I was too young when the Supremes were in their heyday with Diane, though I bought most of their albums as oldies. I started really listening to and buying records in the early 70s. I heard and loved the Jean Terrell led tracks but didn't buy the albums when they were first out. I was only about 10-12 at that time. The first Supremes album I bought when it first came out was "Supremes [['75)" and I really liked it.

I was aware that there was a new lead singer but really didn't care much about the comings and goings. I just liked "He's My Man," and pretty much the entire album. I think I've also mentioned before that I actually thought the album cover pictured 2 different lineups. To me, Cindy is easily recognizable on the cover but the back photo looks nothing like her. I was convinced at the time it was a different singer. Cindy is so distinctive looking, especially around the eyes, that for some reason the back cover photo looks retouched or something; I just don't see Cindy when I look at that photo!

To me this version of the group, this lineup, just seemed younger and hipper than even the Terrell led version. They dressed younger. They weren't as often seen [[at least on TV) in the gowns but sometimes appeared in slacks or pant suits. To me the old clips of Diane and the others in their gowns just seemed kind of quaint and matronly, at least to my young eyes.

I did love the '75 album, but I guess by then the group had pretty much run its course. I think Suzanne de Passe said it best in an article or perhaps one of Mary's books, when she said, as with any group, they eventually run out of steam and it's seldom to do with lack of talent or musicality. The Supremes certainly had a great run, and while after Diane there may have been no standout superstar, in my opinion adding the 3 singers together the M-S-S lineup had the most talent of all the lineups but ultimately [[and ironically) were the least successful. This seems to kind of bear out what de Passe had stated.

But they had a great run and how fortunate that they left behind so much great music.

[midnightman]

I guess I'd be playing against the two sides of the coin when I mention that not that many of Motown's "legacy" acts [[as Diana/The Supremes were starting to be in 1970) could survive the Jackson 5's onslaught on the charts? And that they had to make adjustments to continue to compete during the early to mid-70s?

[gman]

Plus, in addition to the '69- '72 period being the era of the songwriter performer, there were a superfluous amount of one hit wonders who had very very big hits. Between the first issue of Time Life's "Sounds of the 70's" and Rhino's "Have A Nice Day" series I was able to toss over 200 well played singles.

[Bluebrock]

totally agree, I liked that Mary was given more to do but Scherrie was a powerhouse. I think if she did the entire lead, maybe......wonder if there is a version with Scherrie singing the entire lead.

David - you need to clear some of your inbox. I couldn't reply to your recent message buddy.

[marv2]

Plus, in addition to the '69- '72 period being the era of the songwriter performer, there were a superfluous amount of one hit wonders who had very very big hits. Between the first issue of Time Life's "Sounds of the 70's" and Rhino's "Have A Nice Day" series I was able to toss over 200 well played singles.

There was a LOT of music out there in the 70s. I listen to the radio all the time. So many acts ,so many good songs. It was not at all like today.

[kenneth]

Plus, in addition to the '69- '72 period being the era of the songwriter performer, there were a superfluous amount of one hit wonders who had very very big hits. Between the first issue of Time Life's "Sounds of the 70's" and Rhino's "Have A Nice Day" series I was able to toss over 200 well played singles.

I love the "Have a Nice Day" series, all 26 [[?) volumes of it. What a fun set that is. Every once in a while I work my way through all the volumes. Lots of great songs and yes, many one hit wonders!

I don't have the Time Life series you mention but I have another one which is "Love in the 70s" or something like that, also a fun set.

At the time a lot of the music was too "mild" for me - I was probably only listening to disco [[!) at the time - but I love it all now. That's happened to me so often. Groups like the Carpenters, Debby Boone, all these singers I considered too "unhip," now I love them. Go figure!

[midnightman]

Yeah the singer-songwriter era was in full swing so songs that were cultivated by writers and producers to non-songwriting acts lost its luster for a time [[at least until disco arrived).