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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim aka jtigre99 View Post
    I think that Bad Weather was a good song. Jean Terrell was certainly a soulful singer and Stevie Wonder was quoted as saying he wanted to develop her vocals where he felt she excelled. It was on the cusp of the disco era and you can hear it being a predecessor to the upcoming sound but it also had Jean's riffs and the Stevie Wonder sound which almost made it seem like they were working against each other and that it never really took off into the stratosphere like it should have. It certainly was more appealing to the younger record buying public than I Guess I'll Miss The Man. I don't think Bad Weather would have put them back on top but it surely should have been a top 40 pop hit, doing much better than the #83 or 85 that it did. When you listen to Jean's solo album you can hear the realization of what this song started as her sound. I have read a number of articles that list Bad Weather as an overlooked start to the disco era. That may be true. However, with Jean as lead vocalist the group's sound was more soulful and as the producers explored that I think Motown didn't support them as they used to and the general public was more used to a certain sound from them, the public didn't seem to want the group to evolve. Bad Weather was a good song, it did sometimes seem to stall in places and really didn't have a strong hook to pull you in. But I did like the song very much.
    Jim, that is something some don't understand. This was SOUL music, not the Pop type music Motown and the Supremes were producing back in the 60s. If you did not particularly care for Soul music, you would not like this new sound from the Supremes and Stevie, but you cannot say that it was a bad record/song. It was perfectly align with that sound that was popular with Soul music fans in 1973!

  2. #52
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    Bad Weather was a nice song just not a single-a shuffle plod with no excitement for radio

    At the time, the supremes lost their vision; their leadership was weak and directionless. Motown still bought the single full page ads in billboard and cashbox. But the group was beginning it’s death throes

    If it had Otis Williams style leadership, would it have survived?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jobeterob View Post
    Bad Weather was a nice song just not a single-a shuffle plod with no excitement for radio

    At the time, the supremes lost their vision; their leadership was weak and directionless. Motown still bought the single full page ads in billboard and cashbox. But the group was beginning it’s death throes

    If it had Otis Williams style leadership, would it have survived?
    That doesn't even make sense. Record buyers [[which were mostly teenagers and young adults at that time) did not read industry publications.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebrock View Post
    I don't think Mary was capable of singing this. Maybe Lynda could have made a decent job of it but i think it works just fine with Jean singing it.
    Mary shines on ballads, standards and jazz material. But on pop/funk/disco material, I think her voice is too, what's the word, sultry and sophisticated, for it? You can tell when she sings BW live. It never fits her like I Am Changing fits her for example.

    Here's the extended version btw:


    Notice Mary's laughter at the end of this.
    Last edited by midnightman; 01-27-2018 at 04:29 PM.

  5. #55
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    WOAH there are a lot of opinions on this song... and I’m still waiting for longtimefan to chip in with his

    Personally I looooooove it, and from my 40-odd-years-later-perspective it still [[lol, like I was there) sounds absolutely wonderful and joyous. It is, quite simply, a lot of fun. [[And damn I even love the whistles )

    It’s probably not the most sophisticated or elegant song in the Supremes catalog, but if you ever want any of that go and listen to "My World Is Empty Without You" and depress yourself the hell out instead

    I think it should have been a hit... why not? Fun, funky, danceable... what’s not to like?

    And I totally agree with Emile...

    Quote Originally Posted by DJMoch View Post
    I absolutely love Bad Weather, especially the version that appeared on the Supremes box set. But that version's fade-out and fade-in at the end irritates me no end -- I hate when songs do that! I would love a proper version of the song with no fade [[and maybe even made even longer, I'm one for extended versions, LOL). Hell, if I ever got my hands on the multitracks, I would definitely take a stab at that one!
    ... that extended mix is so excellent to have but I do kinda hate how it fades out and in again! I too would love another extended mix.

    And, interesting what Soto says...

    Quote Originally Posted by Sotosound View Post
    This was a big change for The Supremes. They went from old-style Smokey production to cutting edge Stevie production where double-tracked horns don’t even sound like horns.

    But, for me, that aspect was just about bringing The Supremes up to date.

    If I put my pop sensibility hat on then the difference between this track and, say, “Floy Joy” is that “Floy Joy” hits you with the hook straight away [[Bid o bebop Floy Floy Floy, Floy Joy) whereas “Bad Weather” takes you through an intro of interesting but not very poppy chord changes, then a verse wherein we have a few [[very few) notes under lots of words and some ordinary chord changes, finally followed by the chorus, which is the strongest part of the track. However, by then, non-Motown afficianados - pop fans in the UK - will have lost interest.

    Great track for me, and it was in stereo, but as a pop single it didn’t play well enough to its audience. I didn’t see that in 1973. Back then, it was just sad that it wasn’t a big hit. 45 years later I can see what happened. Shame that we don’t have time travel.
    ... because it was actually something of a hit here in the UK, making #37... which is not bad at all. I have actually heard it played on the radio recently too!

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    1973. "Bad Weather" had a similar groove to the Chi-Lites "Stone Out of My Mind". :

    that's a good comparison . The two would have sounded good back to back in a club.

  7. #57
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    Perhaps if it had some of Stevie's trademark Clavinet either in the beginning [[or one of the breaks) it would have been obvious he was involved, and got some immediate radio play it would have did better?

  8. #58
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    Am listening to the box set version now....great fidelity and doesn't it sound just a shade slower in the first part? I have that box set tucked away somewhere in protective plastic. I sold the necklace years ago on Ebay.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by gman View Post
    Perhaps if it had some of Stevie's trademark Clavinet either in the beginning [[or one of the breaks) it would have been obvious he was involved, and got some immediate radio play it would have did better?
    No, because many stations never received the record from Motown to play.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomatoTom123 View Post
    WOAH there are a lot of opinions on this song... and I’m still waiting for longtimefan to chip in with his

    Personally I looooooove it, and from my 40-odd-years-later-perspective it still [[lol, like I was there) sounds absolutely wonderful and joyous. It is, quite simply, a lot of fun. [[And damn I even love the whistles )

    It’s probably not the most sophisticated or elegant song in the Supremes catalog, but if you ever want any of that go and listen to "My World Is Empty Without You" and depress yourself the hell out instead

    I think it should have been a hit... why not? Fun, funky, danceable... what’s not to like?

    And I totally agree with Emile...



    ... that extended mix is so excellent to have but I do kinda hate how it fades out and in again! I too would love another extended mix.

    And, interesting what Soto says...



    ... because it was actually something of a hit here in the UK, making #37... which is not bad at all. I have actually heard it played on the radio recently too!
    Ken Bruce played it on his mid morning radio 2 show recently. He get 6-7 million listeners each day so it is good to know that people who were too young at the time can get to hear it on National Radio 45 years later!

  11. #61
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    I thought Up The Ladder , Stoned Love, Nathan and Floy Joy were good soulful yet pop sounding trax. Stoned Love just sparkled that Motown sound and was a tremendous return to form.
    although I like Bad Weather, I didn't love it. it did grow on me and I do like it now. but I still feel something was missing. I always wanted a remix of this song. Gonna Let My Heart was a great dance track but BW does not make me feel like I want to get up a boogie. it is classic Stevie and I like the lyrics and the vocals. it just seems to chug along. if we het another MOTOWN REMIXED collection this would be my choice for a remix

  12. #62
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    I tell you, I danced to it on its day, and it was a wonderful dance track, before Donna came up with her sighs and Travolta, with his choreography. It was pure tribal dance without rules or blocking the steps, lol, and if you danced to it following Jean's lead you'd simultaneously reach something like and orgasmic climax. I do not judge the track from the perspective of the "Supremes legacy" because that would mean adding some criteria [[the 60s, Diana Ross, the Ballard tragedy, all the #1s, etcetera) that have little to do with the production as it is, a funky, joyous, proto-disco song that delivered, at least, in the dance floor.
    Last edited by Edgar; 01-28-2018 at 05:55 PM.

  13. #63
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    Radio went cold on this edition of the Supremes after "Automatically Sunshine" failed to make it past second base; everything thereafter went by the wayside: Top 40 radio is fickle like that..and after the death knell that was "I Guess I'll Miss The Man' [[should have been "Tossin And Turnin'") , nobody at radio was taking Supremes singles seriously, sad to report, and I was 'working overtime" [[to namedrop another Motown flop) to make these records happen, but they were non hit radio material.. and it's done, so what else is there to say..

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    I tell you, I danced to it on its day, and it was a wonderful dance track, before Donna came up with her sighs and Travolta, with his choreography. It was pure tribal dance without rules or blocking the steps, lol, and if you danced to it following Jean's lead you'd simultaneously reach something like and orgasmic climax. I do not judge the track from the perspective of the "Supremes legacy" because that would mean adding some criteria [[the 60s, Diana Ross, the Ballard tragedy, all the #1s, etcetera) that have little to do with the production as it is, a funky, joyous, proto-disco song that delivered, at least, in the dance floor.
    I really like your description of this record and it's affect on you. LOL!!!!

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    and if old man Gordy didn't want the record to happen it would have been shelved like so many tracks that are only now seeing the light of day: BG would not have wasted money on full page trade ads,manufacturing and shipping [[to warehouses like Sam Goody's in Maspeth Queens which shipped the record to all the Goody's stores, including the flagship Rock Plaza store in mid town Manhattan,and allowing a tarnish to show up on golden boy Stevie Wonder's track record at the time..and booking all those mentioned tv appearances, including Soul train.

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia View Post
    Radio went cold on this edition of the Supremes after "Automatically Sunshine" failed to make it past second base; everything thereafter went by the wayside: Top 40 radio is fickle like that..and after the death knell that was "I Guess I'll Miss The Man' [[should have been "Tossin And Turnin'") , nobody at radio was taking Supremes singles seriously, sad to report, and I was 'working overtime" [[to namedrop another Motown flop) to make these records happen, but they were non hit radio material.. and it's done, so what else is there to say..
    Well being that I was still in the Detroit area during that time, all the Supremes releases were still popular, although you had a hard time hearing them on radio. Whenever you called, they would tell you that they never received the single "Bad Weather". I only heard "I Guess I'll Miss the Man" on A/C or MOR radio a couple of times. Those were not the stations I listened to regularly back then. There is not much to say, it was now so very long ago.

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia View Post
    and if old man Gordy didn't want the record to happen it would have been shelved like so many tracks that are only now seeing the light of day: BG would not have wasted money on full page trade ads,manufacturing and shipping [[to warehouses like Sam Goody's in Maspeth Queens which shipped the record to all the Goody's stores, including the flagship Rock Plaza store in mid town Manhattan,and allowing a tarnish to show up on golden boy Stevie Wonder's track record at the time..and booking all those mentioned tv appearances, including Soul train.
    Maspeth Jimi? "Bad Weather" could have only been shipped from So. Jamaica, Queens! hehehehehehehehe!!!!

  18. #68
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    A few opinions are not related to the good music I enjoyed then and still do to this day whenever I listen to "BW" [[it's permanently in a couple of playlists in my car). So I prefer to keep alive the memory of how good those times were and how "Bad Weather" -in spite of its title- was a part of it.

  19. #69
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    bottom line if you enjoyed the record, God Bless, that's all that counts, but if you play it against the JMC hits,"Ladder" "Stoned", "River Deep" , "Nathan" or "Floy", the energy and the hooks are just not there..I wish it had been otherwise..

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia View Post
    and if old man Gordy didn't want the record to happen it would have been shelved like so many tracks that are only now seeing the light of day: BG would not have wasted money on full page trade ads,manufacturing and shipping [[to warehouses like Sam Goody's in Maspeth Queens which shipped the record to all the Goody's stores, including the flagship Rock Plaza store in mid town Manhattan,and allowing a tarnish to show up on golden boy Stevie Wonder's track record at the time..and booking all those mentioned tv appearances, including Soul train.
    Gordy was a businessman and if Bad Weather had any hope at being a hit hed have made sure it was in the stores. That old tired "Motown never promoted it" line was debunked when we everyone had gotten access to YouTube and saw the dozens and dozens of times the 70s Supremes was on the TV. If Gordy wanted to stop them he had the power to block them from apearing on television. The people werent that interested in buying they records anymore and it didnt help that they wore gowns from the DMC and DMF era in TV and stage imo.

  21. #71
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    Bad Weather definitely was promoted everywhere. In 1973, Berry Gordy was still trying to get a hit from the Supremes. It was clear things had changed for the group. Explain how they went on a hit streak between 1970-1972 and then by the end of the latter year, it turned the opposite way? After a decade of hits, people had moved on. So yeah, that is a good point.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Bad Weather definitely was promoted everywhere. In 1973, Berry Gordy was still trying to get a hit from the Supremes. It was clear things had changed for the group. Explain how they went on a hit streak between 1970-1972 and then by the end of the latter year, it turned the opposite way? After a decade of hits, people had moved on. So yeah, that is a good point.
    It was definitely promoted everywhere? In what country? It was not promoted here in the U.S.

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    There was so much hype before the record came out, I couldn't wait to hear. When I finally did I was so disappointed. I still rarely listen to it.

    Jean didn't sound good on the recorded version. Live, she nailed it. For whatever reason Jean wasn't sounding good on her last recordings for Motown. The Jimmy Webb lp, BW, Soft Daze, Love Train, she just didn't have that warmth that was there for the Touch sessions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    It was definitely promoted everywhere? In what country? It was not promoted here in the U.S.
    Three National US TV shows = PROMOTION.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1qXCBlnoY8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9EwNHAHRq8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzZXYmSop5Q

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    We’ve covered this before. Yes we know they did it on tv 4 times but was it on dj’s playlist on local radio stations across the country. Tv appearances are great but if it ain’t being played on the radio it ain’t goin nowhere.

  26. #76
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    Radio stations had more autonomy than they do now. If they decided not to play a song back in the day, they just wouldn't.

    What went well on TV doesn't mean radio was gonna eat it up. TV was probably enough for the chart placement they did get but that's it.

    And it seems, as I said earlier, besides from the loyalists, not many jumped on this song.

  27. #77
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    Hit radio was not and is not obligated to play records just because they are released.. The Supremes singles, as previously stated, had already gone cold,same as Martha, The 4 Tops, Gladys just before she went to Buddah Records etc...if people who saw the song on those tv stations called radio to hear it, radio would have played it.. one or three die hard fans for any artist don't make a flop into a hit..Ross went through similar cold periods with single releases in the 70's,it was not exclusive to The Supremes
    Last edited by Jimi LaLumia; 01-29-2018 at 11:00 PM.

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    And now Ross going through another hot period 40 years after Bad Weather came to the Supremes

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackguy69 View Post
    We’ve covered this before. Yes we know they did it on tv 4 times but was it on dj’s playlist on local radio stations across the country. Tv appearances are great but if it ain’t being played on the radio it ain’t goin nowhere.
    if it had been a better song the TV appearances wouldve helped.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    if it had been a better song the TV appearances wouldve helped.
    And when an artist goes dead at radio nothing can help; in 1973, the Supremes died as Mary’s books said; they continued in death throes TIL they stopped when they went out with a whimper

    The truth is they all tried, but only Diana had a career that was successful

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    The Supremes had a chance to hit again in 1976 with "I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do The Walking." It was climbing the charts, but Motown stopped it from going higher. According to Scherrie Payne, a Motown executive asked top radio stations and DJs in the country to stop playing "Do The Walking" and insisted they push "Love Hangover" instead. After all, both songs were released the same day. With the 5th Dimension's "Love Hangover" on the charts, of course Motown would want to push Diana's version to reach the top, but it was at the expense of a Supremes single that was a clear number one hit.

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    Mary does a great job on this in concert and gets a rousing reception. I think Stevie should have moved Mary and Lynda more up front with their rauscous vocals and can’t you just hear Stevie singing this!

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    Quote Originally Posted by luke View Post
    Mary does a great job on this in concert and gets a rousing reception. I think Stevie should have moved Mary and Lynda more up front with their rauscous vocals and can’t you just hear Stevie singing this!
    I would have love to hear Stevie sing this with them. Yes, I love Mary's performance of the song in concert now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bradsupremes View Post
    The Supremes had a chance to hit again in 1976 with "I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do The Walking." It was climbing the charts, but Motown stopped it from going higher. According to Scherrie Payne, a Motown executive asked top radio stations and DJs in the country to stop playing "Do The Walking" and insisted they push "Love Hangover" instead. After all, both songs were released the same day. With the 5th Dimension's "Love Hangover" on the charts, of course Motown would want to push Diana's version to reach the top, but it was at the expense of a Supremes single that was a clear number one hit.
    Brad, that is exactly what I heard. Scherrie Payne explained it herself in detail. "I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do the Walking" was far more interesting record vocally and instrumentally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackguy69 View Post
    We’ve covered this before. Yes we know they did it on tv 4 times but was it on dj’s playlist on local radio stations across the country. Tv appearances are great but if it ain’t being played on the radio it ain’t goin nowhere.
    Stations did not receive promo copies of the record, so it was not played or promoted on the radio. You may have noticed by now that no one responding to this thread has mentioned hearing "Bad Weather" on the radio. Hmmmm.......

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    It's interesting to point out here that the various Supremes fan clubs, all together there were thousands of members. Randy T assembled a list of radio stations coast to coast with mailing addresses and phone numbers. We bombarded these stations with letters and phone calls. Nothing helped. Looking back the radio programmers probably realized we were the same people writing the same letters over and over again. I was successful in getting the local AM station with the most power to at least audition the record again. And again it got vetoed. Bad Weather simply wasn't radio friendly. Even the soul stations down south didn't play it. It, like the Jimmy Webb lp, simply wasn't Supreme. It may as well have been a whole new group. Motown DID do some promotion on the song if only to appease Stevie who was their hottest artist now. It was mixed and issued a second time in May. A third extended mix was readied in June but Jean announced she was fed up. It was simply the wrong choice for a Supremes single.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    It's interesting to point out here that the various Supremes fan clubs, all together there were thousands of members. Randy T assembled a list of radio stations coast to coast with mailing addresses and phone numbers. We bombarded these stations with letters and phone calls. Nothing helped. Looking back the radio programmers probably realized we were the same people writing the same letters over and over again. I was successful in getting the local AM station with the most power to at least audition the record again. And again it got vetoed. Bad Weather simply wasn't radio friendly. Even the soul stations down south didn't play it. It, like the Jimmy Webb lp, simply wasn't Supreme. It may as well have been a whole new group. Motown DID do some promotion on the song if only to appease Stevie who was their hottest artist now. It was mixed and issued a second time in May. A third extended mix was readied in June but Jean announced she was fed up. It was simply the wrong choice for a Supremes single.
    Bayou - do you think if the Jimmy Webb lp hadn't been issued and they'd gone straight from Floy Joy to the Stevie project it would have helped? do you think the Webb project permanently damaged their recording reputation?

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    so we've all pretty much chimed in with our thoughts on the record. and most of us are in agreement that the Webb project was misguided.

    So what should the girls have looked into doing? if the Stevie project wasn't "supreme-sounding" what might have been an alternative concept, producer or sound that would have been better?

    Given all of the "promises kept" tracks, most of those don't strike me as groundbreaking. i'm surprised at the volume of covers too. After Frank left, at least the Smokey tracks were a different approach and sound. some have said they felt these were too light weight.

    So the question remains - who should the girls have worked with post-Frank and/or post-Smokey?

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    Maybe norm Whitfield or Willie hutch

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    Quote Originally Posted by sup_fan View Post
    Bayou - do you think if the Jimmy Webb lp hadn't been issued and they'd gone straight from Floy Joy to the Stevie project it would have helped? do you think the Webb project permanently damaged their recording reputation?
    Yes I think it did. They chose a time to experiment when they were in decline. You do this when you are hot. They had other choices. Thom Bell actually flew into LA to meet with Gordy about doing an lp on The Supremes. Also Frank Wilson wanted them back. I'd say any of these two possibilities would have been a better choice.

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    I was also thinking Ashford and Simpson

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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    Stations did not receive promo copies of the record, so it was not played or promoted on the radio. You may have noticed by now that no one responding to this thread has mentioned hearing "Bad Weather" on the radio. Hmmmm.......
    no one heard it because it stunk. Jeans vocal is so irrrrrritating that I can just imaging programming directors pulling the needle off 30 seconds into it and tossing it. Even The UK who made hits out of US flops like Surrender And Automatically Sunshine couldn’t save this Turkey. This BS about radio not getting it is fake news. Motown didn’t even control the promo launches - it was all done for them. WHY would Motown go to the trouble of issuing a single on a desperate group that it made money off of and then not send it to radio? THAT, is what releasing a single IS: sending it to radio. Why do I gave a red vinyl promo copy of BW with radio codes on it if it hadn’t gone to radio? This absurd BS has to be stopped in any serious discussion. In 3 years The Supremes had gone from being an A act to a B minus act. Motown had lost Gladys, Tops, Spinners, Martha with no replacements. They could ill afford to lose The Supremes. Stevie Wonder was no fool, he’d have known if it hadn’t been sent out. What he didn’t realize is that while HE could sell that record, Jeans great voice was not suited to it. For every few die hards on this list that likes it, there were millions plugging their ears at the noise. R&B radio couldn’t even move it and they had to play it because it got enough points to chart.

    It it just was a terrible record for radio back then, nice try, valiant, but terrible. In Mary‘s book, she complains to Diana that Motown is not promoting her singles. She states that bad weather has been out for months and not gotten any promotion. Oddly, almost 2 months after it’s release, it charts briefly for one week. That says to me that diana said something to Barry about getting that song played, and an effort was made, but you cannot expect radio stations to play a song they think is so terrible that it will make people turn off their channel. They just will not do that. Had. There been a good response to whatever play if Was getting, and people were running out and buying it and the manager from those record stores they didn’t have it, it would have made noise and got up the chart. That’s how records become hits. But everyone I know absolutely Hated it and wondered how it ever even got released because it was so terrible!

    This business of crying the lack of promotion every single time something associated with Mary doesn’t hit, is an old old old old joke that wasn’t very funny the first time. If it took you two years to find bad weather in a store, You should’ve come to Illinois or Ohio it was all the stores…… Collecting dust.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMotownManiac View Post
    no one heard it because it stunk. Jeans vocal is so irrrrrritating that I can just imaging programming directors pulling the needle off 30 seconds into it and tossing it. Even The UK who made hits out of US flops like Surrender And Automatically Sunshine couldn’t save this Turkey. This BS about radio not getting it is fake news. Motown didn’t even control the promo launches - it was all done for them. WHY would Motown go to the trouble of issuing a single on a desperate group that it made money off of and then not send it to radio? THAT, is what releasing a single IS: sending it to radio. Why do I gave a red vinyl promo copy of BW with radio codes on it if it hadn’t gone to radio? This absurd BS has to be stopped in any serious discussion. In 3 years The Supremes had gone from being an A act to a B minus act. Motown had lost Gladys, Tops, Spinners, Martha with no replacements. They could ill afford to lose The Supremes. Stevie Wonder was no fool, he’d have known if it hadn’t been sent out. What he didn’t realize is that while HE could sell that record, Jeans great voice was not suited to it. For every few die hards on this list that likes it, there were millions plugging their ears at the noise. R&B radio couldn’t even move it and they had to play it because it got enough points to chart.

    It it just was a terrible record for radio back then, nice try, valiant, but terrible. In Mary‘s book, she complains to Diana that Motown is not promoting her singles. She states that bad weather has been out for months and not gotten any promotion. Oddly, almost 2 months after it’s release, it charts briefly for one week. That says to me that diana said something to Barry about getting that song played, and an effort was made, but you cannot expect radio stations to play a song they think is so terrible that it will make people turn off their channel. They just will not do that. Had. There been a good response to whatever play if Was getting, and people were running out and buying it and the manager from those record stores they didn’t have it, it would have made noise and got up the chart. That’s how records become hits. But everyone I know absolutely Hated it and wondered how it ever even got released because it was so terrible!

    This business of crying the lack of promotion every single time something associated with Mary doesn’t hit, is an old old old old joke that wasn’t very funny the first time. If it took you two years to find bad weather in a store, You should’ve come to Illinois or Ohio it was all the stores…… Collecting dust.

    I SERIOUSLY doubt that Diana said anything to Gordy about promoting a Supremes single. They were her toughest competitor at Motown and in the years prior to this were more successful than she.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    .......... They had other choices. Thom Bell actually flew into LA to meet with Gordy about doing an lp on The Supremes. Also Frank Wilson wanted them back. I'd say any of these two possibilities would have been a better choice.
    I'm curious. Perhaps this was addressed somewhere and I missed it. Just what happened between Frank Wilson & the Supremes after the Touch album?
    Mary Wilson wrote that he basically stopped coming around. I realize that his focus shifted to working on Eddie Kendricks solo career at that time. Frank's desire? Eddie's request? Motown directive?
    But you state that Frank Wilson wanted them back.
    I'm obviously missing something or am unable to read between the lines.
    Answer what you can, if you choose. Perhaps there are sensitive issues here best left unsaid.?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    I SERIOUSLY doubt that Diana said anything to Gordy about promoting a Supremes single. They were her toughest competitor at Motown and in the years prior to this were more successful than she.
    In March of ‘73, Diana had a smash movie, #1 album, Oscar nomination and sellout dates. The Supremes were coming off a flop album, no real top 40 action for over a year [[and Floy Joy was hardly a smash - it’s two years back to Nathan), had lost their gig in Vegas, were playing B venues and were no competition for anyone. At first, yes. But I’ve never bought into that Mary fable of JMC VS Diana and vice versa. I think Berry thought Diana could do no wrong and after the wow success of Lady, the last thing he or she was worried about was if The Supremes had a hit. Diana was a movie star. She had transcended the pop singer category - much to everyone’s surprise. I do not believe that Diana wished for the demise of The Supremes or bore them ill will. I know that Mary was quite competitive that way as she, often enough would mention what Diane was doing and did not expect Lady to be a success - if Anyone was worried about competition, after the Touch flop, Motown wouldn’t have asked Smokey to do an album and release it when nothing new was going out to radio on Diana for over two years. I think it’s all BS - Berry loved money. Period.

    ‘’However, WTF do I know? Maybe it was just a coincidence that two months after the release of bad weather, and shortly after mary spoke to Diana about it, that it chartered. The bottom line is, it still stunk. And went to nowhere. Seeing the girls doing it on television could have, like in the case of missing you, sparked interest in sales and made climb up the chart. It didn’t. I know that there are some people here that like the song, and 45 years later it’s much easier on that years then it was what it was first assaulting your drums. However just because some people like a song doesn’t make it radio friendly. I like the song Sleepin- I think she does a great vocal on it, it’s very well produced and an interesting and original concept…… But I also think it was insane to release it as a single…….Who would want to hear that while they’re driving in their car? No one, it seems. Do you think Motown promoted it? Is that what kept it from going to number one? Hardly. Although some radio stations obviously gave it a shot, the dismal response made them bail on it quickly…… There’s nothing to do with the quality of the track like it or not… It was just a stupid thing to release to the radio. A program director’s job is to decide what songs the public is going to want to hear when they’re listening to that station, and conversely, what song is the public will change stations if they hear a song they don’t like. Sleeping and bad weather belong in that category…… Ridiculous shots for radio. I actually love Stevie‘s track, I think the lyric is mundane in there’s nothing really good or bad about it in my Pinyan, but jeans vocal is absolutely horrendous. She did it well live, however. I heard it several times in addition to TV.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    Yes I think it did. They chose a time to experiment when they were in decline. You do this when you are hot. They had other choices. Thom Bell actually flew into LA to meet with Gordy about doing an lp on The Supremes. Also Frank Wilson wanted them back. I'd say any of these two possibilities would have been a better choice.
    i had no idea Thom Bell was interested - that would have been my choice in a heartbeat. Wow, why didn’t I think of that???? Frank Wilson was good, but, he was hardly hitting it out if the park on the girls. They needed a number one smash, Stoned Love was big - but not enough to sustain a career on. Look at the mileage Diana got off ANMHE - one giant hit in 3 years sustained her. When Jean was keeping it simple, she was perfect for radio. Her oversinging and endless riffs were not for radio. She could out sing Roberta Flack by a mile, but Roberta had the vocal style Jean lacked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayouMotownMan View Post
    Yes I think it did. They chose a time to experiment when they were in decline. You do this when you are hot. They had other choices. Thom Bell actually flew into LA to meet with Gordy about doing an lp on The Supremes. Also Frank Wilson wanted them back. I'd say any of these two possibilities would have been a better choice.
    wow! that would have been very interested to have Thom and the girls! and too back Frank didn't get back with them sooner than when they did Love Train. were there any other Frank productions with the MLJ lineup? i do think he was the best producer to work with Jean. they really seemed to click

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    one thing that's puzzled me [[and maybe i'm taking to modern of an outlook on it) is that why in the 70s the supremes didn't have more voice in what they would record or what they would release. Sure i get it during the 60s - they were young AND berry was managing every step of Diana's career. but by the 70s i would have thought Mary at least would have had a bit more voice in the direction of things. maybe not releases but certainly of their concert material. which by late 72 was questionable at best. Seems like she really took things over post Jean and Lynda. wonder what might have happened had they done this together while Jean was in the group

    or maybe that was part of the problem - with the conflicts between M and J, maybe they just couldn't take a unified direction on the group. I do also wonder if Mary wasn't instrumental in the lack of updating of their style and approach. She's said herself that she loved the glamour and glitz. maybe she was a significant part of the reluctance to become more in tune with the times

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    Maybe Mary was still stuck in the '60s and was wishing Berry do more. I think Jean was more advanced and progressive in her thoughts and wanted to confront Motown about getting them better material [[and more financial stability) and that led to a lot of her and Mary getting into conflict because Mary was more old-school in her handling of Motown but before had to be the middle piece of the originals so she was comfortable in that spot but once other members replaced them, she no longer had that comfort zone and probably was uncomfortable talking with Berry. Remember, the Temptations by comparison were more independent in how they handled Berry and sometimes did their own thing in spite of Berry whereas the Supremes basically looked to Berry to handle everything.

    It sucks that Mary and Jean weren't more united and unified because if they were, the Supremes could've lasted longer than 1977...

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    Quote Originally Posted by midnightman View Post
    Maybe Mary was still stuck in the '60s and was wishing Berry do more. I think Jean was more advanced and progressive in her thoughts and wanted to confront Motown about getting them better material [[and more financial stability) and that led to a lot of her and Mary getting into conflict because Mary was more old-school in her handling of Motown but before had to be the middle piece of the originals so she was comfortable in that spot but once other members replaced them, she no longer had that comfort zone and probably was uncomfortable talking with Berry. Remember, the Temptations by comparison were more independent in how they handled Berry and sometimes did their own thing in spite of Berry whereas the Supremes basically looked to Berry to handle everything.

    It sucks that Mary and Jean weren't more united and unified because if they were, the Supremes could've lasted longer than 1977...
    That would be all well and good, but Berry was not running the show at that time. Ewart Abner was the President of Motown's Record Division when all of this was going on. It was on his watch that several of Motown's most established acts left the label. Oh sure, some, like Mary Wilson could have gone directly to Mr. Gordy, but all he would have done was tell them to talk with Mr. Abner. That is how it was.
    Last edited by marv2; 01-30-2018 at 11:10 PM.

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