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  1. #1
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    Prince’s Vault Has Been Drilled Open


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    And so the vultures will begin to circle.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by splanky View Post
    And so the vultures will begin to circle.....
    It is awful knowing how protective Prince was of this....stuff! He forbid his videos and music from being uploaded to Youtube. The day after his death hundreds were uploaded there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    It is awful knowing how protective Prince was of this....stuff! He forbid his videos and music from being uploaded to Youtube. The day after his death hundreds were uploaded there.
    And I am as guilty as others for watching them. ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by theboyfromxtown View Post
    And I am as guilty as others for watching them. ...
    You're not alone. How do you think I know there were so many uploaded? LOL! I did comment to the uploaders that it was against Prince's wishes when he was alive and should be respected in death.

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    I always thought Prince was excessive in his protection of his copyrights. There are ways to license your music to ensure your rights are protected but also making sure music is commercially available.

    I'm excited to hear what's in the vault. His 11 minute original version of "The Dance Electric" has surfaced and it is fantastic. I think he wanted us to have the stuff in the vault. If not, he would have destroyed it rather than building a big vault to preserve it.

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    What interests me is the proper handling of his catalog, from the mixing, mastering, and the marketing. Sheila E. has reportedly offered her services free of charge. I hope that whoever gets ultimate control over the recordings chooses engineers more than capable of handling the massive undertaking of identifying, cataloging, and baking of the tapes, and hard drive restoration, if need be.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    I think he wanted us to have the stuff in the vault. If not, he would have destroyed it rather than building a big vault to preserve it.
    That's not entirely true. The reason Prince wanted ownership of his masters is because he knows the value of them. Your recordings are your worth. This means the multitracks and the mixdowns. Only an idiot would destroy recordings.
    Last edited by soulster; 05-01-2016 at 01:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    I always thought Prince was excessive in his protection of his copyrights. There are ways to license your music to ensure your rights are protected but also making sure music is commercially available.
    I agree. I totally understand wanting to protect your art, but he became completely hellbent on anyone who even posted a picture of him. Frankly, if music isn't going to be shared, what's the point? I know it turned me off completely and I'm sure he alienated plenty of well-meaning fans as well, which is a real shame.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    That's not entirely true. The reason Prince wanted ownership of his masters is because he knows the value of them. Your recordings are your worth. This means the multitracks and the mixdowns. Only an idiot would destroy recordings.
    The recordings only have value if they are licensed for commercial use or made available for sale. Either way we would get them in some form or fashion. They are without worth sitting in a vault collecting dust or decomposing. If Prince did not want material that he created to be made available to the public he would have destroyed it rather than keep it around. It would not be 'idiotic' to destroy it if it is a considered decision made by an artist with high standards and an interest in shaping his musical legacy.

    It has happened. Allegedly, Curtis Mayfield destroyed the recorded masters he did with the cast of the film "Sparkle" because he only wanted the Aretha recordings to survive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    The recordings only have value if they are licensed for commercial use or made available for sale. Either way we would get them in some form or fashion. They are without worth sitting in a vault collecting dust or decomposing. If Prince did not want material that he created to be made available to the public he would have destroyed it rather than keep it around. It would not be 'idiotic' to destroy it if it is a considered decision made by an artist with high standards and an interest in shaping his musical legacy.

    It has happened. Allegedly, Curtis Mayfield destroyed the recorded masters he did with the cast of the film "Sparkle" because he only wanted the Aretha recordings to survive.
    Those Mayfield tracks would have been approx. 40 years old this month! I went to see the film in April 1976. No one at that time knew that it would become a huge cult movie hit!

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    Yes, if Prince didn't want these recordings to be released, ever - including after his death - he could have destroyed them to prevent it. But that doesn't logically imply that since he didn't destroy them, he must have wanted them to be released. There are reasons other than a future release to keep recordings.

    One example - suppose he was unhappy with a song after recording it and thought it was not worthy of release. Why keep it? Well, perhaps he'd get an idea later [[even years later) as to how to improve that song, or maybe he'd incorporate part of it into a new song. The recording could serve as a way of refreshing his memory, a sort of "demo" for himself.

    The more general point is, it costs little to keep the recordings, and they might prove useful in the future [[even in some way that you can't imagine at the time), so why not? By keeping them, you leave the possibilities open.

    At the same time, putting a recording into the vault also doesn't mean that he never wanted it to be released.

    It won't hurt Prince to release some of this music.
    Last edited by calvin; 05-02-2016 at 09:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by calvin View Post
    Yes, if Prince didn't want these recordings to be released, ever - including after his death - he could have destroyed them to prevent it. But that doesn't logically imply that since he didn't destroy them, he wanted them to be released.

    One example - suppose he was unhappy with a song after recording it and thought it was not worthy of release. Why keep it? Well, perhaps he'd get an idea later [[even years later) as to how to improve that song, or maybe he'd incorporate part of it into a new song. The recording could serve as a way of refreshing his memory, a sort of "demo" for himself.

    The more general point is, it costs little to keep the recordings, and they might prove useful in the future [[even in some way that you can't imagine at the time), so why not? By keeping them, you leave the possibilities open.

    At the same time, putting a recording into the vault also doesn't mean that he never wanted it to be released.

    It won't hurt Prince to release some of this music.
    I believe may have also kept so many of his unreleased recordings in order to have other ,future artist record them. They may have also been a part of his "retirement" plan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    The recordings only have value if they are licensed for commercial use or made available for sale. Either way we would get them in some form or fashion. They are without worth sitting in a vault collecting dust or decomposing.
    It doesn't matter if they are never released. They have value.

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    Well, to be clear, I was only referring to 'commercial' value. I don't disagree that there are other types of value [[i.e. sentimental).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    Well, to be clear, I was only referring to 'commercial' value. I don't disagree that there are other types of value [[i.e. sentimental).
    To be clear, I was talking about commercial value. You know, assets.

    A typical record company has millions of master recordings in its vault. That's their value. If they lose that, they have no value, no assets. That's not sentimental.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    To be clear, I was talking about commercial value. You know, assets.

    A typical record company has millions of master recordings in its vault. That's their value. If they lose that, they have no value, no assets. That's not sentimental.
    OK. But his catalog only has commercial value if the recordings have been, or are made, available for sale. If Prince regarded his unreleased catalog as a commercial asset he would necessarily have to contemplate its sale. His unreleased catalog is not currency, like gold, it is plastic, celluloid, digital or some other material that has little or no intrinsic value. It only has value if it can be sold or licensed for commercial use -- which is entirely foreseeable and highly likely because it's Prince. Again, I think he anticipated that the music would be released and he preserved it because he wanted us to have it in some form or fashion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy View Post
    OK. But his catalog only has commercial value if the recordings have been, or are made, available for sale. If Prince regarded his unreleased catalog as a commercial asset he would necessarily have to contemplate its sale. His unreleased catalog is not currency, like gold, it is plastic, celluloid, digital or some other material that has little or no intrinsic value. It only has value if it can be sold or licensed for commercial use -- which is entirely foreseeable and highly likely because it's Prince. Again, I think he anticipated that the music would be released and he preserved it because he wanted us to have it in some form or fashion.
    Well, Guy, this is the part where one of says that we'll agree to disagree.

    The one thing I think we can somewhat agree on is that, even though I don't think he wanted us to hear what's in the vault, he knew that it was going to happen...after he's gone, but, not while he's alive. Case in point:

    TOM TUCKER: We tried to talk him into archiving everything when he was still with Warners. We were going to buy a convection oven and bake all the analog tapes, and archive them to digital. But at the last minute he pulled the plug. He said he didn’t want anybody to hear all that music. Those old analog tapes are just gumming up down in his vault. And then what’s going to happen if it’s not in his will? What if it’s in his will to destroy that stuff? That would be like half the Beatles’ tunes being lost.

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