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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    Does she have a responsibility, or is it the responsibility of the parents to teach their kids to have the smarts to see things for what they are? No, It is NOT the responsibility of an artist to set examples. That is like a sentence to being in a prison where one is not allowed to do what they want. Dammit! If an ADULT Miley wants to twerk Robin Thicke on a stage, so what! You don't think teens see worse on the internet? You think some 13-year old girl is going to twerk her biology teacher in class?



    That's on the parents.

    ,

    I'm done with the discussion with you. The second someone tries to bring in that very subjective argument of "moraltiy", it's all over. It always has religious overtones, and is the intellectually lazy way out of an argument.
    AMEN Soulster. You and I agree again. Im getting real worried that we are starting to agree on everything lol. Just kidding.

    Fondly,

    Roberta

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Miley Cyrus or any other young star or sports star does not have a responsibility to be a role model and shouldnt be role models imo. Parents have a responsibilitty to be the best role model to they children.
    Blaming celebrities is a real easy excuse if you ask me. Young people should be influence by people who are real involved in they day to day lives like parents and teachers and pastors and charity workers and missionaries. A teenager with with good parents or a good parent who has been brought up right and brought up to respect themselves and others and to have to have goals isnt likely to dress and dance like Miley Cyrus just because they see her "act" on a TV music award show.

    I bet some of those parents that are hollering at Miley and condemming Miley have no problem taking they kids to the shooting range or having guns in they homes which is much more harmful than Miley Cyrus twerking on a TV award show.


    If you raise your kids to have self respect and to have good values then nobody on TV or a sportsfield or a basketball court or a movie is going to force a child to act wild or go out and have unsafe sex.

    Roberta
    Thank you! Well stated!

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    AMEN Soulster. You and I agree again. Im getting real worried that we are starting to agree on everything lol. Just kidding.

    Fondly,

    Roberta
    It's true, though. Our minds are shaped in the home with our parents/guardians. If you don't have that foundation, then all else is probably lost. If you or I became famous, it would be one hell of a burden to try to be a role model. It would not be our responsibility to be anyone's role model. It's another thing if you opt to take on that role yourself, but it is not an obligation.

    Miley Cyrus is no longer a child actress. Teens do not look up to her anymore. That is how she wants it. She wants to be a free adult, free to do what she wants. She wants to be free of Hannah Montana. Let her go! Let her twerk. Let her be naked. I don't care. It's just showbiz!

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post

    I'm done with the discussion with you. The second someone tries to bring in that very subjective argument of "moraltiy", it's all over. It always has religious overtones, and is the intellectually lazy way out of an argument.
    Excuse me? Soulster, where did you get religion? Don't put words in my mouth. I'm not bringing religion into this. You can have good morals without being religious. No it does not always have to do with religion. I have plenty of atheist friends who have more morals than Miley appears to have. I never said religion anywhere. Now you're making assumptions and that's not fair. 'Morals' are the decisions and actions that decide what is right and wrong. That's what formal and informal rules and laws are based on. Morals are everywhere - so don't say that you can't have morals without religion. Society NEEDS morals. If we had no sense of what's right or wrong, our society would fall apart.

    And I do not appreciate you being so dismissive and assuming you know what I mean without asking.

    To you and Roberta, I'm not saying parents don't have responsibility, they do. I believe that wholeheartedly. But at some point, kids are going to be exposed to the media and celebrities. And at some point, teens are going to make the decision to do what they want, despite whatever upbringing their parents give them. Teenagers have a mind of their own, and they DO look up to celebrities, whether they realize it or not. Celebrities have a major impact on style, music, fashion, attitudes to an extent, etc. Obviously, we can't make celebrities set an example, but it would be wise for them to do so.

    And, no, age does not make you an adult. Making mature, responsible decisions makes you an adult, and so far, I haven't seen any maturity out of Miley. I'm offended by anyone doing that kind of stuff - be it Miley, Madonna, whoever.

    And you can raise your child with the best intentions and teach them right from wrong and everything, but at some point, they're going to think on their own and make their own decisions. At some point, the choices they make are their own responsibility, not the parents'. So Miley is free to make her own choices, but she is responsible for those choices, too. And as much as a parent can tell a child that what Miley did was wrong, teenagers don't always listen to their parents. So blaming parents entirely is not right either.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    Miley Cyrus is no longer a child actress. Teens do not look up to her anymore. That is how she wants it. She wants to be a free adult, free to do what she wants. She wants to be free of Hannah Montana. Let her go! Let her twerk. Let her be naked. I don't care. It's just showbiz!
    1) Teens DO still look up to her.
    2) It's not "just" showbiz. I see students coming into school who come in wearing long shorts or skirts, but will change into shorter skirts [[even though their parents don't approve). Where do they get these ideas that it's OK for a 14 year old to be wearing booty shorts? The media, and their friends [[who get those ideas from the media in the first place).

  6. #56
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    I will add that Sinead O'Conner has been the aggressor here. After her initial letter, Cyrus tweeted that they could "meet up" to discuss this. But, O'Connor decided to make another public message and used the f-word.

    You tell me who the sane, rational role model is here.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    I will add that Sinead O'Conner has been the aggressor here. After her initial letter, Cyrus tweeted that they could "meet up" to discuss this. But, O'Connor decided to make another public message and used the f-word.

    You tell me who the sane, rational role model is here.
    You're right, and I acknowledged in one of my posts above that Sinead also did not respond well [[her threats for legal actions were certainly just as unnecessary as Miley's F-bombs). And I know Sinead hasn't been the perfect role model, either, but I still think her letter contains some very valuable advice.

    But, of course, that's just my opinion, and Miley is able to make her own decisions.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    1) Teens DO still look up to her.
    2) It's not "just" showbiz. I see students coming into school who come in wearing long shorts or skirts, but will change into shorter skirts [[even though their parents don't approve). Where do they get these ideas that it's OK for a 14 year old to be wearing booty shorts? The media, and their friends [[who get those ideas from the media in the first place).
    Then the teachers need to call the parents or the parents need to chick they kids backpacks every morning imo.

    Roberta

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Then the teachers need to call the parents or the parents need to chick they kids backpacks every morning imo.

    Roberta
    They do. Believe me, being in the school system, they do. But violating a dress code [[at least in public schools) doesn't normally constitute any more extreme punishments. And telling a teeanger they can't wear certain clothes isn't going to stop them from wanting to, or even trying to, with a lot of kids. Just because a parent or teacher tells a kid what they're doing is wrong, doesn't mean they're going to listen. With a lot teenagers, their friends and the media are often prioritized higher than what their parents or teachers think. And yes, controlling [[or trying to control) what our kids have access to will help, but somehow kids are going to see what's out there, and, in a lot of cases, try to emulate or be just like that celebrity that happens to be hip and cool.

  10. #60
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    antceleb, I find your views carefully deliberated, astute and balanced. I entirely support your opinions. I do not want you to think you are in a minority of one. I believe you have a very informed view of the challenges children face today, and the influences [[outside of parental influence) which can take them in a certain direction. The fact that you are in the education system, and actively immersed in these challenges on a day to day basis, only makes my conviction in you stronger.

    If you were in the education system, yet advocated females take the money irrespective of their self- respect, the example they set others, or looked down on others who were just trying to get by doing unglamorous jobs, I would have been profoundly disappointed. However, that is clearly not the case, and I commend you for your character and for striving to do the best for those entrusted to your care.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    They do. Believe me, being in the school system, they do. But violating a dress code [[at least in public schools) doesn't normally constitute any more extreme punishments. And telling a teeanger they can't wear certain clothes isn't going to stop them from wanting to, or even trying to, with a lot of kids. Just because a parent or teacher tells a kid what they're doing is wrong, doesn't mean they're going to listen. With a lot teenagers, their friends and the media are often prioritized higher than what their parents or teachers think. And yes, controlling [[or trying to control) what our kids have access to will help, but somehow kids are going to see what's out there, and, in a lot of cases, try to emulate or be just like that celebrity that happens to be hip and cool.
    Kids need to be allowed to express themselves but also need to be supervised. My mom went balistic when my eldest sister dressed like Tina Turner in the late 60s with a mini skirt all the way up her butt but my sister turned out fine. My mom whupped me for coming home in the 70s in hotpants and white platform boots which i had obviously seen on the TV and I turned out fine. My neice came home in the early 80s with real spiky hair and chains and a pierced nose and she turn out fine. We all turned out fine because we had a great mom who taught us values and self respect but we had express ourselves and try to be real hot and fashionable. Blaming Miley Cyrus is like blaming race car divers because your teenager smash a car when driving real fast or blaming McDonalds because your kids got fat from eating big macs and supersize fries. The parents have a responsibility to teach they kids good eating habits and safe driving skills and monitor they online activity and not to be promiscous and to use protection when they start having sexual intercourse. Its called parenting and being real involved in your kids life. Blaming Miley Cyrus is just a cop-out imo.

    Roberta

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by MIKEW-UK View Post
    antceleb, I find your views carefully deliberated, astute and balanced. I entirely support your opinions. I do not want you to think you are in a minority of one. I believe you have a very informed view of the challenges children face today, and the influences [[outside of parental influence) which can take them in a certain direction. The fact that you are in the education system, and actively immersed in these challenges on a day to day basis, only makes my conviction in you stronger.

    If you were in the education system, yet advocated females take the money irrespective of their self- respect, the example they set others, or looked down on others who were just trying to get by doing unglamorous jobs, I would have been profoundly disappointed. However, that is clearly not the case, and I commend you for your character and for striving to do the best for those entrusted to your care.
    Thank you, Mike. That really means a lot!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Kids need to be allowed to express themselves but also need to be supervised. My mom went balistic when my eldest sister dressed like Tina Turner in the late 60s with a mini skirt all the way up her butt but my sister turned out fine. My mom whupped me for coming home in the 70s in hotpants and white platform boots which i had obviously seen on the TV and I turned out fine. My neice came home in the early 80s with real spiky hair and chains and a pierced nose and she turn out fine. We all turned out fine because we had a great mom who taught us values and self respect but we had express ourselves and try to be real hot and fashionable. Blaming Miley Cyrus is like blaming race car divers because your teenager smash a car when driving real fast or blaming McDonalds because your kids got fat from eating big macs and supersize fries. The parents have a responsibility to teach they kids good eating habits and safe driving skills and monitor they online activity and not to be promiscous and to use protection when they start having sexual intercourse. Its called parenting and being real involved in your kids life. Blaming Miley Cyrus is just a cop-out imo.

    Roberta
    Roberta, I understand your view completely. But Miley is not an invalid. She is not crippled by her parents' upbringing. At some point, you can't make excuses for the children. If she wants to act like an adult, she has to assume the responsibilities of an adult.

    Secondly, children don't always turn out alright even if the parents instilled every value in them possible. And it's very presumptuous to say that if a grown child [[i.e. twenty years old, as is Miley's case) makes poor choices, it's automatically the parents' fault. My parents raised me and my siblings wonderfully and they have instilled in us respect, good values, and the consequences of our choices. They were certainly strict in punishing us whenever we made poor choices. Still, one of my siblings is dealing with some distressing issues and has not made some wise life decisions. However, I will knock out anyone who tries to blame my parents, because they did everything in their power to raise us with the best sense of what's right and what's wrong. You and your siblings might have turned out all right, but that's not always the case. If children don't turn out to be as pristine as parents try to raise them, well there are outside influences that affect growing children. The same goes with Miley Cyrus. Blaming her is not a cop-out because she is mentally cognizant enough to make her own decisions; to know what's right and what's wrong. In reality, blaming the parents is more of a cop-out because then every time a child does something wrong, they can just say "It's not my fault, my parents didn't tell me it was wrong." We need to draw the line. If you are able to live on your own and make your own decisions - as Miley is clearly capable of doing - she is responsible for her own actions.
    Last edited by antceleb12; 10-07-2013 at 03:27 PM.

  13. #63
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    Teenagers were twerking, masturbating, and having sex long before Miley Cyrus was born.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    Thank you, Mike. That really means a lot!!



    Roberta, I understand your view completely. But Miley is not an invalid. She is not crippled by her parents' upbringing. At some point, you can't make excuses for the children. If she wants to act like an adult, she has to assume the responsibilities of an adult.

    Secondly, children don't always turn out alright even if the parents instilled every value in them possible. And it's very presumptuous to say that if a grown child [[i.e. twenty years old, as is Miley's case) makes poor choices, it's automatically the parents' fault. My parents raised me and my siblings wonderfully and they have instilled in us respect, good values, and the consequences of our choices. They were certainly strict in punishing us whenever we made poor choices. Still, one of my siblings is dealing with some distressing issues and has not made some wise life decisions. However, I will knock out anyone who tries to blame my parents, because they did everything in their power to raise us with the best sense of what's right and what's wrong. You and your siblings might have turned out all right, but that's not always the case. If children don't turn out to be as pristine as parents try to raise them, well there are outside influences that affect growing children. The same goes with Miley Cyrus. Blaming her is not a cop-out because she is mentally cognizant enough to make her own decisions; to know what's right and what's wrong. In reality, blaming the parents is more of a cop-out because then every time a child does something wrong, they can just say "It's not my fault, my parents didn't tell me it was wrong." We need to draw the line. If you are able to live on your own and make your own decisions - as Miley is clearly capable of doing - she is responsible for her own actions.
    But whats Miley done? She twerked on TV so what? Ever looked at some of the video games kids play with people getting they heads blown off every 5 seconds. Thats way more dangerous than twerking on TV yet parents allow they kids to line up at video stores to buy these violent games. I didnt know what twerking was until Miley did it. maybe someone will open twerking excersice classes that will improve our health and make us lose weight. I may start twerking lol.

    There are no guarantee in life you do the best you can with your kids but trust me twerking aint gonna send them down the path to hell.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    But whats Miley done? She twerked on TV so what? Ever looked at some of the video games kids play with people getting they heads blown off every 5 seconds. Thats way more dangerous than twerking on TV yet parents allow they kids to line up at video stores to buy these violent games. I didnt know what twerking was until Miley did it. maybe someone will open twerking excersice classes that will improve our health and make us lose weight. I may start twerking lol.

    There are no guarantee in life you do the best you can with your kids but trust me twerking aint gonna send them down the path to hell.

    Roberta
    I have problems with those video games, too, but that's a separate issue.

    With Miley, it's more than her twerking. It's her outfit [[rather, her lack-thereof), her gyrating against a man's pelvis on national television, and the lyrics in her song. She talks about "dancing with molly" [[a street name for ecstasy), "doing lines in the bathroom," etc. The song glamorizes partying and doing drugs as the cool life, when it's not! And it's sad that songs like that are allowed on the airwaves. Her outfit is not respectful to herself and other women. It says that to be sexy and attractive, you should wear as little as possible. The industry wants you to believe that it's liberating. It's not. It's demeaning and sexist. On the male end, the industry says that you have to be smooth, handsome, "manly," and essentially pimp yourself out to lots of young, thin women in order to be desirable.

    I was never a fan of Miley Cyrus, but she used to do what music is actually about - SING. Now, her songs are auto-tuned, and her performances are less based on the music, and more about how she looks and how much controversy she can stir up. Vocally, she has potential. But she's not using it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    Madonna is known [[inside the industry) for being very hands-on in the studio, and has been that way from day one. She is involved during every step of the process from hiring musicians to the mastering stage. But, all you ever hear about is adoptions and stuff. That's the public's and the media's fault.
    Every publicity stunt that Madonna has ever initiated [[yes, initiated) is what has kept her name in the press. It hasn't been anything she does in the studio. In fact, she hasn't made any kind of splash musically since at least 1999. She is the one that dangling the carrot in front of the horse, not the media. And that goes for any Britney, Miley, Christina A, and every other glorified mall rat that came after Madge. In fact her publicity stunts are what brings attention to her recordings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by timmyfunk View Post
    Every publicity stunt that Madonna has ever initiated [[yes, initiated) is what has kept her name in the press. It hasn't been anything she does in the studio. In fact, she hasn't made any kind of splash musically since at least 1999. She is the one that dangling the carrot in front of the horse, not the media. And that goes for any Britney, Miley, Christina A, and every other glorified mall rat that came after Madge. In fact her publicity stunts are what brings attention to her recordings.
    I'll totally agree with that. You know Mama Cass made it on voice and personality, not twerking or publicity stunts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jillfoster View Post
    I'll totally agree with that. You know Mama Cass made it on voice and personality, not twerking or publicity stunts.
    lol you just gave me a vision of Mama Cass twerking lolololololololol.

    Roberta

  19. #69
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    Miley must be doing something right if she’s irritating prissy authority figures who want performers to be positive role models. I hope she keeps up the good work. Most teenagers like to party, experiment with alcohol and/or drugs, have hangovers, and dressed to attract whomever they want to attract. Sometimes they have to go behind a parent’s back to do so, but that’s what they do. And for centuries there have been songs about drinking and drugging, getting high, partying, dancing, wearing scanty clothes and having sex. IT’s just people being people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smark21 View Post
    Miley must be doing something right if she’s irritating prissy authority figures who want performers to be positive role models. I hope she keeps up the good work. Most teenagers like to party, experiment with alcohol and/or drugs, have hangovers, and dressed to attract whomever they want to attract. Sometimes they have to go behind a parent’s back to do so, but that’s what they do. And for centuries there have been songs about drinking and drugging, getting high, partying, dancing, wearing scanty clothes and having sex. IT’s just people being people.
    What do you mean by she's doing something right by offending people? Is she doing good by being upsetting people? And are you saying that people who disapprove are "prissy?" That's quite arrogant to assume. Are people who are offended by nude twerking and songs about doing drugs terrible people? I'm sorry if being upset by ILLEGAL drugs and wearing underwear on stage is offensive to you. Just because it's been going on for years, doesn't mean it should be going on. Corruption in politics has been going on for thousands of years, and that's just people being people. Of course people are going to party and do drugs and whatever. But when you have 10-year-olds singing about "doing lines" and "dancing with molly" and twerking, that's not OK.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    What do you mean by she's doing something right by offending people? Is she doing good by being upsetting people? And are you saying that people who disapprove are "prissy?" That's quite arrogant to assume. Are people who are offended by nude twerking and songs about doing drugs terrible people? I'm sorry if being upset by ILLEGAL drugs and wearing underwear on stage is offensive to you. Just because it's been going on for years, doesn't mean it should be going on. Corruption in politics has been going on for thousands of years, and that's just people being people. Of course people are going to party and do drugs and whatever. But when you have 10-year-olds singing about "doing lines" and "dancing with molly" and twerking, that's not OK.
    If a ten year old know what doing lines means and dancing with Molly then the parents need to rethink they parenting skills. Im telling you twerking is gonna be the new rage for all ages and I may buy me some twerking lessons when they start offering them. It look like real good excersise lol.

    Lets stop bashing Miley. "Let he that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone"

    Roberta

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    Teens don't need Miley's song to know about doing drugs and having s-e-x. You can see fewer clothes on females on the beach and at the swimming pool.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smark21 View Post
    Miley must be doing something right if she’s irritating prissy authority figures who want performers to be positive role models. I hope she keeps up the good work. Most teenagers like to party, experiment with alcohol and/or drugs, have hangovers, and dressed to attract whomever they want to attract. Sometimes they have to go behind a parent’s back to do so, but that’s what they do. And for centuries there have been songs about drinking and drugging, getting high, partying, dancing, wearing scanty clothes and having sex. IT’s just people being people.
    There are people in Europe who are laughing at us over our obsession with this.

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    Sheesh. Miley is not the anti-Christ. The only thing she did that was foul was wearing an outfit that made her butt look like pancakes. Like someone mentioned, she doesn't have the equipment to twerk.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skooldem1 View Post
    Sheesh. Miley is not the anti-Christ. The only thing she did that was foul was wearing an outfit that made her butt look like pancakes. Like someone mentioned, she doesn't have the equipment to twerk.
    Someone needs to take her out to eat and put some junk in that trunk!

    Let's see what some other female singers have to say about this:
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/m...ars-think.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by skooldem1 View Post
    Sheesh. Miley is not the anti-Christ. The only thing she did that was foul was wearing an outfit that made her butt look like pancakes. Like someone mentioned, she doesn't have the equipment to twerk.
    Now THAT was funny! LIOL

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    Twerking is basically mostly butt shaking and women have been shaking their asses to whatever music they enjoy since Queen Sheba dropped it like it was hot on the Pharoah.
    They just a twerk a thon in New York a couple of weeks ago to try to make it mainstream
    and get in the Guiness Book and though I have some mixed feelings about some aspects
    of all that I know it's not gonna disappear anytime soon. Remember when people said hip hop was a fad that wouldn't last? In the Congo the dance is called Mapouka [[check youtube)
    and in Brazil they call it doing Funk. Some even claim it's not sexual at all but I personally
    think those folks are kidding themselves. Anyway Miley recently stated she was going to give it up because now that white people are doing it , it's become lame. I disagree with
    that statement because I've seen white women on the web who DO have the equipment,
    doing it WELL....

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    Quote Originally Posted by splanky View Post
    Anyway Miley recently stated she was going to give it up because now that white people are doing it , it's become lame. I disagree with
    that statement because I've seen white women on the web who DO have the equipment,
    doing it WELL....
    I think that was supposed to be a joke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    I think that was supposed to be a joke.
    Maybe so but compared to the chick who calls herself virgoperidot Miley's twerking is
    a frigging joke! With no punchline I might add.....Mercy!...

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    I'm not bashing Miley, or saying she's the anti-Christ. Like I previously stated, she's got a lot of talent. I'm critical of her recent career choice and reasons to do so.

    Roberta, I don't want to say it again. Just because a 10 year old knows about drugs, doesn't mean their parents are doing a bad job raising them. That's an inaccurate generalization. Kids these days are so susceptible to the influences of the world around them that it's impossible to totally shelter them from the world, unless you belong to some cult out in the middle of nowhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    I'm not bashing Miley, or saying she's the anti-Christ. Like I previously stated, she's got a lot of talent. I'm critical of her recent career choice and reasons to do so.

    Roberta, I don't want to say it again. Just because a 10 year old knows about drugs, doesn't mean their parents are doing a bad job raising them. That's an inaccurate generalization. Kids these days are so susceptible to the influences of the world around them that it's impossible to totally shelter them from the world, unless you belong to some cult out in the middle of nowhere.
    Theres a difference between a 10 year old knowing about drugs and understanding the phrase or lyric "doing lines" antceleb12. Every Kids should be taught about the downfalls of doing drugs and that should be taught in the home and the school but i doubt the phrase "doing lines" registers with 10 year old. Kids have always been suseptable to the world arounfd them from Zoot suits to gangster movies to guns to jitterbuging and showing your panties in the 1940s to wearing hotpants in the 1970's and sequined boob tubes in the 1980s which i wore lol. You cant shelter your kids but you can sure teach them right from wrong and instill real fine values and respect in them. Your kids my dabble in stuff they shouldnt and do drugs and have sex with numerouss partners before they hopefully settle down. Its called life my dear and Miley Cyrus twerking isnt going to send kids down the wrong path imo.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Theres a difference between a 10 year old knowing about drugs and understanding the phrase or lyric "doing lines" antceleb12. Every Kids should be taught about the downfalls of doing drugs and that should be taught in the home and the school but i doubt the phrase "doing lines" registers with 10 year old. Kids have always been suseptable to the world arounfd them from Zoot suits to gangster movies to guns to jitterbuging and showing your panties in the 1940s to wearing hotpants in the 1970's and sequined boob tubes in the 1980s which i wore lol. You cant shelter your kids but you can sure teach them right from wrong and instill real fine values and respect in them. Your kids my dabble in stuff they shouldnt and do drugs and have sex with numerouss partners before they hopefully settle down. Its called life my dear and Miley Cyrus twerking isnt going to send kids down the wrong path imo.

    Roberta
    Roberta, I like you more all the time.

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    I agree with your post 100%, Roberta. However, Miley Cyrus is very capable of influencing teen culture and I'll bet my next paycheck that there will be young women experiencing peer pressure to behave in that manner when they go to parties or other social gatherings. Of course "if you raise them right", they'll have the capacity to walk away, but you and I both know that at that age kids' choices are based upon social acceptance, not common sense. Ask all of the kids caught up in the Steubenville rape case about that. Not one of those kids would behave in that manner except they were all hanging with each other one Friday night, so what the hell?

    I will not blame Cyrus for her influence on teens, but I recognize that the teenage brain is wired in a manner that peer pressure is as influential as parental teaching. With that said, the nastiest thing walking is a teenage boy and there are always going to be enough girls willing to give them what they want. Even the "good girls" will be behaving in that manner for fear of falling out of favor.

    Nope, she's not the anti-Christ, but the opinion of some that don't like her behavior is no less legitimate than the opinion of those who rallied around her.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    Roberta, I like you more all the time.
    Flattery will get you everywhere my dear lolololol.

    Best to you.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Theres a difference between a 10 year old knowing about drugs and understanding the phrase or lyric "doing lines" antceleb12. Every Kids should be taught about the downfalls of doing drugs and that should be taught in the home and the school but i doubt the phrase "doing lines" registers with 10 year old. Kids have always been suseptable to the world arounfd them from Zoot suits to gangster movies to guns to jitterbuging and showing your panties in the 1940s to wearing hotpants in the 1970's and sequined boob tubes in the 1980s which i wore lol. You cant shelter your kids but you can sure teach them right from wrong and instill real fine values and respect in them. Your kids my dabble in stuff they shouldnt and do drugs and have sex with numerouss partners before they hopefully settle down. Its called life my dear and Miley Cyrus twerking isnt going to send kids down the wrong path imo.

    Roberta
    I understand your point, and I agree to an extent. Yes, kids should DEFINITELY be taught about drugs and sex - by both parents and the school - so they can avoid dangerous situations. But there are kids out there who DO know what "doing lines" means to a T. I have come across such kids. Before you assume it's the parents' sole fault for this exposure, consider this kid's environment. Consider what other influences are out there. I knew a kid once who witnessed drug exchanges and found drugs on the street and knew all the lingo from the kids in school. Not his parents' fault. Yes, parents are the main socialization factor in a child's life, but to say that they are his or her ONLY influence is inaccurate.

    And once again I will say that it is not necessarily the twerking that upsets me. It's what she was wearing, what she was doing with Robin Thicke, the lyrics in her song, the Wrecking Ball video.

    And I understand that teenagers need to express themselves and find themselves, but drugs and anonymous sex is not a safe route. Some people start doing it because they want to see what it's like but they end up staying on that road for a long time, or don't come back at all. Some people try E [[Molly) for the first time and end up dying. Too many kids drink and drive WITH the knowledge that it's not OK to do so. Pot, in heavy doses, destroys brain cells. Sex with strangers or lots of people can lead to STD's [[even with a condom). Personally, I don't see the positive side in all of this. I don't see how doing E, in any amount, or engaging in sex with a lot of partners, can be done responsibly in any way.

    You are entitled to your own opinion. And I see where you and soulster are coming from. But try to look at it from another perspective. My concerns are not "prissy," nor do they make me stuck-up, irrelevant, whatever. I am concerned about how the values of our youth, who are very impressionable, are being shaped or changed by the media's glorification of drugs and sex.

    Try to understand it from that perspective. You don't have to agree with me, but at least be open enough to understand WHY so many people are concerned.

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    Not everyone lives in a world with children.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    I understand your point, and I agree to an extent. Yes, kids should DEFINITELY be taught about drugs and sex - by both parents and the school - so they can avoid dangerous situations. But there are kids out there who DO know what "doing lines" means to a T. I have come across such kids. Before you assume it's the parents' sole fault for this exposure, consider this kid's environment. Consider what other influences are out there. I knew a kid once who witnessed drug exchanges and found drugs on the street and knew all the lingo from the kids in school. Not his parents' fault. Yes, parents are the main socialization factor in a child's life, but to say that they are his or her ONLY influence is inaccurate.

    And once again I will say that it is not necessarily the twerking that upsets me. It's what she was wearing, what she was doing with Robin Thicke, the lyrics in her song, the Wrecking Ball video.

    And I understand that teenagers need to express themselves and find themselves, but drugs and anonymous sex is not a safe route. Some people start doing it because they want to see what it's like but they end up staying on that road for a long time, or don't come back at all. Some people try E [[Molly) for the first time and end up dying. Too many kids drink and drive WITH the knowledge that it's not OK to do so. Pot, in heavy doses, destroys brain cells. Sex with strangers or lots of people can lead to STD's [[even with a condom). Personally, I don't see the positive side in all of this. I don't see how doing E, in any amount, or engaging in sex with a lot of partners, can be done responsibly in any way.

    You are entitled to your own opinion. And I see where you and soulster are coming from. But try to look at it from another perspective. My concerns are not "prissy," nor do they make me stuck-up, irrelevant, whatever. I am concerned about how the values of our youth, who are very impressionable, are being shaped or changed by the media's glorification of drugs and sex.

    Try to understand it from that perspective. You don't have to agree with me, but at least be open enough to understand WHY so many people are concerned.
    But Elvis Presley and Mick Jagger and Tina Turner outfits and shaking which was really twerking shock parents all over the country and Ozzy Ozbourne biting the head of a bat sent shockwaves all over the country but how many kids bite the head of a bat? I recall family members being real horriffied and saying the world was going to hell in a handbasket when the Sex Pistols and and Alice Cooper hit the airwaves and then Britney spears shaved her head and I doubt many kids follow her and shave they heads. The point is sex and drugs and rock and roll have been around forever and every generations parents say the media have glorified it. Mileys twerking and skimpy outfit may have shocked folks but im sure responsible parents told they kids theyd get they butt whupped if they got caught wearing something like that. As for the twerking well it aint all that and suggesttive dancings been around for darn near 100 years.

    Most kids who have been raised right turn out right and a few dont and all we can do is pray for them that take the wrong road that they eventually end up back on Gods glorious highway.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    Not everyone lives in a world with children.
    I don't understand what you mean.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    But Elvis Presley and Mick Jagger and Tina Turner outfits and shaking which was really twerking shock parents all over the country and Ozzy Ozbourne biting the head of a bat sent shockwaves all over the country but how many kids bite the head of a bat?
    1 - Ozzy is a loon. He's got so many issues. Of course I don't think he's a role model.
    2 - Elvis and Tina Turner never advocated drug use in their music, nor did they wear underwear, and only underwear, on stage.

    I've heard this all a million times. You and soulster are not the first ones to give me these arguments. I stand firmly with what I have said. It is clear none of us are going to change our stances.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    I don't understand what you mean.



    1 - Ozzy is a loon. He's got so many issues. Of course I don't think he's a role model.
    2 - Elvis and Tina Turner never advocated drug use in their music, nor did they wear underwear, and only underwear, on stage.

    I've heard this all a million times. You and soulster are not the first ones to give me these arguments. I stand firmly with what I have said. It is clear none of us are going to change our stances.
    Elvis shaking his pelvis was just as shocking back then as Mileys underwear twerking is to some folks. My mom wouldnt let my sister watch Tina Turner on TV cause she thought her outfits were terrible. My aunt Idella thought Barbara Streisand apperaing at the Oscars in a see through sheer pantsuit was a disgrace. Its happened in every decade and throughout every gennerations.

    I think we need to respectfully differ my dear.

    Yours, with every good wish.

    Roberta

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberta75 View Post
    Elvis shaking his pelvis was just as shocking back then as Mileys underwear twerking is to some folks. My mom wouldnt let my sister watch Tina Turner on TV cause she thought her outfits were terrible. My aunt Idella thought Barbara Streisand apperaing at the Oscars in a see through sheer pantsuit was a disgrace. Its happened in every decade and throughout every gennerations.

    I think we need to respectfully differ my dear.

    Yours, with every good wish.

    Roberta
    Roberta,

    One last point, to summarize. Again, it's not the twerking that bothers me so much. It's all those other things I mentioned. Yeah, I don't consider Babs in a see-through outfit is appropriate, even if it is Babs. I realize Miley is not the first case of controversy to come along. That doesn't mean, to me, it's any less concerning.

    That's all.

  41. #91
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    Antceleb, I’m wondering what you would advocate as a solution to the music of the Mileys of the world. You seem to think that artists should set a positive example for children. Do you think that because there is always a risk a child might hear or see something objectionable that artists should cater their acts to be child friendly at all times? That would make for a very boring and soporific pop culture landscape and frankly children, once they get old enough, will rebel against it. Kind of like what Miley is doing now as she’s trying to shed her wholesome Hannah Montana image, to much success I might add.

    BTW, Tina Turner has had drug references in her music. She played The Acid Queen in the film version of The Who’s Rock Opera Tommy.

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    Not only that, but Tina sang a song with her breast exposed, and fondled her microphone like it was Ike's c*ck and she was getting ready to perform oral sex.

    Last edited by skooldem1; 10-08-2013 at 08:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skooldem1 View Post
    Not only that, but Tina sang a song with her breast exposed, and fondled her microphone like it was Ike's c*ck and she was getting ready to perform oral sex.

    Was that on live TV?

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    Quote Originally Posted by antceleb12 View Post
    Roberta,

    One last point, to summarize. Again, it's not the twerking that bothers me so much. It's all those other things I mentioned. Yeah, I don't consider Babs in a see-through outfit is appropriate, even if it is Babs. I realize Miley is not the first case of controversy to come along. That doesn't mean, to me, it's any less concerning.

    That's all.
    But, Miley's an adult and entertains for adults. She's should be able to do what ever she wants.

    Right now, any kid can get on the computer and pull up the most vile porn or violence with two clicks.

    Children masturbate before they learn to speak.

    They can go to a party where they will have various stages of sexual activity.

    They can see their dad beating up on mom. They can see their siblings or friends doing hard drugs or copious amounts of alcohol.

    They can go to a shooting range or go hunting and and fire all manner of weapons.

    They can go to the beach or to the pool, or even the local mall, and see women in thongs and tops that leave little to the imagination.

    And, finally, humans have sex.

    When you consider all of that, Miley twerking Robin Thicke's junk doesn't seem so bad after all, does it?

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    Soulster, what do you make of someone who flashes himself in front of strangers? Chances are, that person being confronted has seen a dick before, so why is there a law against it? What if he flashed you? I'm taking your argument to the extreme on purpose because I can see a violator evoking it to defend himself in a court of law. Regardless of whether my daughter knows what a penis looks like, if you flash her, I'm going to introduce you to the business end of a baseball bat, but I guess that would make me seem like a prude...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Oz View Post
    Soulster, what do you make of someone who flashes himself in front of strangers? Chances are, that person being confronted has seen a dick before, so why is there a law against it? What if he flashed you? I'm taking your argument to the extreme on purpose because I can see a violator evoking it to defend himself in a court of law. Regardless of whether my daughter knows what a penis looks like, if you flash her, I'm going to introduce you to the business end of a baseball bat, but I guess that would make me seem like a prude...
    One problem here: Miley Cyrus and Robin Thicke were clothed. No one saw any penises or booty. No one engaged in any sexual activity. There were children in that audience, but they were the children of the artists in that audience, who no doubt, have seen stuff like that before, having grown up in and around the entertainment business. Also, the parents know that anything can happen at these shows.

    There are laws against flashing in this country because religious prudes created our laws, and we do have to protect women and children from the possibility of being sexually violated, which is somewhat assumed will happen if they are flashed.

    I would never flash anyone, but if you did decide to use that bat on someone, you'd be in jail on assault and battery, and possibly attempted murder charges. Then you would be on the business end of cell mate's baseball bat, if you know what I mean.
    Last edited by soulster; 10-09-2013 at 11:34 AM.

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    Sinead O'Connor needs some serious professional therapy. She has escalated this once again. She apparently doesn't know when to stop.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/09/sinead-oconnor-miley-cyrus-open-letter-suicide_n_4069397.html


    Before you all go blaming Ms. Cyrus for this, remember who started it. No one asked for O'Connor's advice, and O'Connor should have kept quiet. Of course, she couldn't because she needs mental help.

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    You didn't answer my question pertaining to whether someone flashed you. And if I used that baseball bat, the charge against me would be murder. Furthermore, you make the assumption that I'm either attractive enough to warrant a cell mate's baseball bat, or unable to either defend myself [[or play ball myself if I was so inclined), if you know what I mean.

    The laws against flashing have less to do with religious prudes than they do with the fact that your right of self-expression does not supercede my right to be left alone and not have someone determine what I should be exposed to [[pardon the pun). Regardless, there are limits to any behavior. Whereas I find this whole controversy ridiculous, she calculated this response before engaging in it. She's neither to be praised or vilified so far as I'm concerned, and she deserves any positive or negative consequences as a result of it.

  49. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Oz View Post
    You didn't answer my question pertaining to whether someone flashed you.
    I think I did. I would simply report it if I felt threatened. But, me being a guy, I would probably laugh it off if it were a dude, and I might smile if it were a woman. Violence would get me in trouble.

    And if I used that baseball bat, the charge against me would be murder. Furthermore, you make the assumption that I'm either attractive enough to warrant a cell mate's baseball bat, or unable to either defend myself [[or play ball myself if I was so inclined), if you know what I mean.
    I would think it wouldn't matter how you looked to a hostile cell mate. Remember, rape isn't about sex, it's about violence, dominance/control. And, all the better if you can take care of the situation yourself.

    The laws against flashing have less to do with religious prudes than they do with the fact that your right of self-expression does not supercede my right to be left alone and not have someone determine what I should be exposed to [[pardon the pun).
    I'm talking about why the laws were created in the first place. It's because some people don't dig seeing the naked human body, or are offended by seeing genitals. And, again, it is usually assumed that any man who exposes himself to a female or child means to do more.

    Regardless, there are limits to any behavior.
    Depending on the setting and the permissions of the people involved...

    Whereas I find this whole controversy ridiculous, she calculated this response before engaging in it. She's neither to be praised or vilified so far as I'm concerned, and she deserves any positive or negative consequences as a result of it.
    I don't know if anyone deserves anything, but this is basically one thing we can agree on: the whole thing is ridiculous, and probably would have faded into history along Mariah Carey's and Britney Spears' pussy flashing, and Janet Jackson's "nipplegate", if Sinead O'Conner hadn't inserted herself into it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soulster View Post
    But, Miley's an adult and entertains for adults. She's should be able to do what ever she wants.

    Right now, any kid can get on the computer and pull up the most vile porn or violence with two clicks.

    Children masturbate before they learn to speak.

    They can go to a party where they will have various stages of sexual activity.

    They can see their dad beating up on mom. They can see their siblings or friends doing hard drugs or copious amounts of alcohol.

    They can go to a shooting range or go hunting and and fire all manner of weapons.

    They can go to the beach or to the pool, or even the local mall, and see women in thongs and tops that leave little to the imagination.

    And, finally, humans have sex.

    When you consider all of that, Miley twerking Robin Thicke's junk doesn't seem so bad after all, does it?
    For the umpteenth time, it's not the twerking that's most problematic to me. I've stated my concerns quite clearly multiple times in previous replies.

    Of course I'm aware about porn, abuse, thong-clothed women, parties, etc. etc. But that's not what this post is about and I don't need to air every concern I have. And yeah, I'm not trying to equate Miley with abuse.

    And yes, people have sex. And people are gonna have sex out of marriage, I know. There are also ways to teach people how to do it responsibly. And while health classes and parents are going to teach that, teens will see what's on TV and think, "I want that" [[which is why the media is such a powerful outlet). Don't confuse my conservative opinions for naivety. I am very aware of what kind of things young people do. I'm fresh out of college, so I have seen a lot of what's out there now. Which is why I don't agree with a lot of it.

    From a feminist perspective, Miley at the VMA's is particularly frustrating. I don't want to repeat myself, as I've made those concerns clear above. But if anything, it doesn't help at all the sexualization and misogynistic attitudes that run rampant in the music business.

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