hahaha - i thought yall were referring to Michael doing the moonwalk as the protege dancing on stage
now i get it. diana coming out and dancing with adam ant ;)
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hahaha - i thought yall were referring to Michael doing the moonwalk as the protege dancing on stage
now i get it. diana coming out and dancing with adam ant ;)
yes the older music was definitely aimed at the older demographic which covers the "yesterday" part of the theme. but having Michael, Adam ant, debarge, High Inergy, Lionel and then even Diana and Marvin were all to bring in the younger viewers and the "today" element.
where you're mistaken is in your thinking that the special was only about highlighting the past. if it was, none of these younger artists would have been included and it would have been more like Motown 40 where they do a long retrospective of the history of the company.
The subtitle of this program is clear - Yesterday, Today, Forever. they're trying to sprinkle some of the magic dust from the past onto the current and hopefully future.
Yeah the title should've been the sign there: "yesterday, TODAY, and forever"...
I don't know why folks are acting this clueless to why Adam Ant was there! LOL
This is where you take liberties with your own mind! LOL! Not once did I say that the special was only about highlighting the past. No, Diana and Marvin could not have been considered a part of Motown.."today" even in March 1983 when they taped the show. Both were no longer signed to the label by the time of the special. Their contributions were strictly "yesterday" relating to Motown and the music they recorded while there. I don't know anything about Adam Ant, but I do know that El DeBarge, Barbara Mitchell and I are all the same age. I was in my last year of college at that time so I guess we were the "today" demographic. Now, who represented Jr. High School aged children on the special?
You need to do some self inspection. Talk about revisionist, you are the one that said that High Inergy were not allowed to perform one of their own songs on the program. That is not true. The Motown 25 TV special I saw, they performed "He's A Pretender" from their latest album at that time. Soooooooo.................I guess us older heads have a better memory than you kid. LOL!
As Marv has said it was the Big Chill era then. Every book I have read about the event said that the Supremes reunion was what most excited people and we all know what happened there and of course Michael stole the show. The excitement that people had was to see The Supremes, the 4 Tops, Martha and Mary etc. All of my friends who were by no means Motown fanatics were looking forward to seeing the classic artists and were not pleased that especially the Marvelettes weren’t there. Suzanne De Passé was ignorant.
Oh yeah there was a lot of anticipation surrounding the Supremes reunion. Several times a day leading up to air time, NBC showed promos highlighting their reunion by showing a few moments of Mary, Diana and Cindy on stage together. The target audience was definitely Baby Boomers aka "The Bill Chill" generation. I can promise you that no one at Motown Productions were having meetings trying to decide how to get children to watch LOL!!!! If that were even remotely true, they would have gotten Big Bird to host and not Richard Pryor!
Mary and Diana were 38 years old at the time!
Mary's birthday is March 6th, Diana's is March 26th.
The show was taped on March 25th. Mary was already 39. Diana turned that age after taping.
Either way, they both were pushing 40. LOL
And they both got overshadowed by some 24-year-old kid with a glitter glove, fedora and moves of a ballerina mixed with James Brown-influenced swag.
It was all about Michael, baby. Not about a group that had ceased to exist for about six years. Lol
I know you meant 1983. ;)
And if anything, the Big Chill did more wonders for MARVIN [[and the Temptations) than Motown itself...
In fact, of the "legends" that performed that night, only Marvin and Michael had the biggest hits of the nation at the time. Diana who? Mary who? Spinners who? Martha who? LOL
Also, going back to Big Chill, I just checked the soundtrack listing. I see two of Marvin, two of the Tempts, one Marvelettes tune, two Miracles tunes, one Four Tops tune and one Martha & the Vandellas tune.
GUESS WHICH ACT WAS MISSING FROM THE SOUNDTRACK...
ANYWAYS... yeah, people are getting their timelines mixed up, I know some of y'all were there and you're getting old but you're not senile, guys, are you?
Like Motown 25 was taped in EARLY '83. Had it not been for Rick James and DeBarge, Motown would've had to be forced to file for bankruptcy. As explained in Diana's E! True Hollywood Story profile, Motown was swallowing in a sea of red ink by 1983. To make matters worse for the label, Marvin Gaye had the biggest international hit of his career with "Sexual Healing" and his album had broke ground for a smoother funk/techno sound that later created new jack swing and Michael Jackson's Thriller was selling like hot cakes.
Meanwhile, Motown tried to revamp the Temptations with the 1982 reunion with Eddie and David and we all know how that turned out. The Rick James duet helped them find new R&B and dance fans but many tuned the entire album out because Rick was only on one track.
Jermaine Jackson had "Let Me Tickle Your Fancy" [[the collaboration with DEVO) but it stopped short of reaching the top ten because Motown's promotional skills were falling apart.
Teena Marie had left Motown in 1982 and later sued them to get out of her contract when they tried to tell her she had more albums to put out. She created the Brockert Initiative and she was free to sign with Epic Records. Switch, the act that some say preceded self-contained bands like Tony, Toni, Tone and Mint Condition was kicked out of Motown after Bobby and Tommy DeBarge abruptly left the band to produce their younger siblings, DeBarge.
I think of all the songs released on Motown in 1982, only Charlene's "Never Been to Me", Stevie's "That Girl" and the Dazz Band's "Let's Whip It" were top ten hits, a downgrade from a label that at one point had at least ten or more top ten records alone in 1965.
Rick James had released Throwin' Down but it wasn't as much an immediate success as Street Songs was and he was still riding high on that. Motown was not having it well in 1982-83.
So Berry doing Motown 25 was a financial move to stabilize the company and give it new energy, hence the title: "Yesterday, today and forever". It was a calculating move: Motown didn't form until 1959. For goodness knows, why have a 25th anniversary when Motown was founded in January of '59?
It was smart on his part to do this. So it's easy to see why non-Motown acts made the show [[Adam Ant, Linda Ronstadt, etc.). In retrospect, yeah, Mary Wells and Martha Reeves deserved more time but they didn't get it. The Marvelettes [[the stars of EARLY Motown) were the only group that was never asked [[not counting the Contours; no casual music listener knew they were a Motown act until after Dirty Dancing). None of the Funk Brothers were asked [[wasn't just Jamerson). But the public didn't know that, they saw the stars in front of them. It would be silly to ask why didn't they include them? "It's business".
The one artist who rejoined his old Motown buddies that took advantage of Berry's gamble was Michael Joe Jackson. Marvin, upon hearing that MJ was gonna do Billie Jean, was steaming that he couldn't convince anyone to let him do Sexual Healing [[which was then a controversial record so that may have played a part in why he couldn't do it; nonetheless, he decided to perform "What's Going On" so it was a good choice on his part). Remember, also, that the big highlight was supposed to be the reunion of some little group from the Brewster Projects and they made headlines about the drama.
BUT by the time it aired on May 16th, no one was thinking of the group from the Brewster Projects, all eyes were on that kid from Gary, Indiana.
And one wonders why I said Michael helped Motown that night indirectly?!
well said midnight :)
it's amazing how blinded some people on there get with sentimentality. they easily forget that this is business and that decisions are made nearly 100% around profit and driving revenue. Anyone who thinks Suzanne or Berry put on this production for the warm fuzzies of hanging with their good ole friends and reminiscing in an idiot.
sure we'd have loved to see the marvelettes on here and i do agree it was a shame they weren't even invited. But since when had motown ever [[for right or wrong) cared about that group??? if nothing else, at least motown is consistent.
the fans often get too wrapped up in the dream and the myth of the motown family. that sentiment might have existed between the artists during the early days and into the mid 60s. but don't fool yourself to think the "family sentiment" ever was allowed to cloud berry's judgement.
I absolutely agree that Motown 25 was purely about promotion and business. I'll have to watch it again [[not a totally pleasurable prospect) in case there was even a precious few seconds of recognition of the Funk Brothers. That James Jamerson had to buy a ticket is still beyond belief. Postman was as iconic as Heat Wave, My Guy and Shotgun and also merited a few seconds.Quote:
The Funk Brothers should have been there, spotlighted and honored.
[[Gladys Horton should also have been on stage with Martha Reeves, Mary Wells and Jr. Walker, singing Postman).
Yes, that statement surprised me too. Marv stated it as fact, not opinion. I have read a lot of Motown books and never heard of Berry barring Diana from the after party – or any party. I even did a search, but could not find any info. I am curious to know if it is true and would love it if Marv replied to your request, but Marv is omnipotent here and does not have to back up the statements that he posts as facts. So don't expect a repy
Oh Im not Milven. Many people have asked him for years to provide credible links to many things hes posted like the tall tale about Diana Ross losing all her money to Bernie Madoff. Not one link was ever sent and if you serach google NOTHING comes up. But hey, its all part of his fantasy to to trash the legacy of Miss Diana Ross which is going to impossible given the honors and awards shes picked up over the decades.
To name a few:
Presidential Medal of Freedom
2016
Kennedy Center Honors
2007
Grammy Lifetime Achievement Award
2012
Honorary César
1976
American Music Award for Favorite Pop/Rock Album
1974 · Lady Sings the Blues
Golden Globe Award for Best New Star of the Year – Actress
1973 · Lady Sings the Blues
BET Lifetime Achievement Award
2007
American Music Award for Favorite Soul/R&B Female Artist
1983, 1981, 1975
Special Tony Award
1977
American Music Award for Favorite Soul/R&B Single
1981 · Upside Down
Soul Train Music Award for Heritage Award – Career Achievement
1995
NAACP Image Award for Outstanding Actress in a Motion Picture
1972 · Lady Sings the Blues
World Music Legend Award for Outstanding Contribution To The Music Industry
1996
TV Land Television's Greatest Music Moment Award
2006 · Diana Ross Live from Central Park
NME Award for World Female Singer
1974, 1973, 1972, ...
American Music Award for Lifetime Achievement Award
2017
Mary wasn't the only one who took an advance and didn't follow it through.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHfD1101_uo
Well, to read that Berry banned Diana from anything sounded very odd. If true, Marv will answer. If not, he will ignore the question. In this era of fake news and alternative facts, we should be used to this type of info, but in any case, Marv is allowed to post whatever he wants here without consequences.
Getting back on topic, I know it is all about the ratings, and perhaps some of the early acts would not have been ratings getters , but there were some huge acts in the early days of Motown, such as Martha and the Vandellas, Mary Wells, Marvellettes, Miracles. Martha, Mary and Marvellettes should have been there prominantly.
Yeah but they were almost non-existent in 1983, which was the point. By 1990, there were more interest in them because Motown's classic brand was starting to make money from CDs off their songs. But in March 1983, when Motown 25 was taped, most of these acts were either retired or had played at low-rent bars to make ends meet. I think of this bunch, only Martha and Mary was making some coins off of playing classic oldies in decent venues.
Yes, you told me. And if I told you something a lttle off , like James Brown was banned from the Apollo Theatre , wouldn't you ask me to explain or where I heard this info?
That's what I am asking. And you know that. But of course, you do not have to answer as you are omnipotent on this board so you can get by with just anwering "I already told you"
Ok....fact is, there was a lot to be squeezed into one evening, let alone one TV special.
Ideally, the Motown 25th Salute..it would have been better to do summer replacement or multiple 2 hour specials over the course of a few weeks...Grand Debut/ Ending week shows..Split the headliners....only one non label guest star/newer act per show....Mary Martha and Jr could have been given deserved more time. And everyone that should have been included [[Marvelettes, Kim, Brenda, Rare Earth, RD Taylor, Gladys Knight, Jimmy Ruffin, Barrett Strong, Edwin Starr) could have been featured performing their key contributions. The problem was there was way too much talent and successful, influential material to include in 1 shot....and Tony Bennett should have performed For Once In My Life....that is IMHO the Quessential non label treatment of any Motown song.