"band of gold"

jeez, i am loving all of this who sang what, all of the "what ifs", ect. i get the feeling it may not be everyone's cup of tea, but the beauty of this site is one only has to participate in the categories that they find interesting.

so here is my latest question ... did holland/dozier/holland already write "band of gold" before they left in 1968? it seems like a possibility because they never really wrote anything that sounded so much like a Motown song after they left the company. if they did write it, then who woulda recorded it? the lyrics seem too cheesy for a supremes single, though the melody is certainly right up the supremes alley. freda payne thought the words were too silly for her. but i bet you the supremes would have been have been happy to take it rather than "i'm living in shame" or "no matter what sign", or even h/d/h's "in and out of love" or smokey's "the composer".

do you think h/d/h stashed this one away? weird how everybody that left Motown never matched there motion heights. i think they all really needed each other to make that Motown magic! kinda sad they didn't stick it out. everybody

It might have been a project from before they left Motown ,but If you have a chance to hear the original unedited version it seems to be more of a stretching out of the restrictions that HDH had at Motown. The unedited version gives you a perspective of the subject matter that is not as clear as the edited released version. The reason for it's editing is not clear if it was for timing reasons or its contriversial content. The track has a combination of the Detroit style basic track of HDH productions but the strings have an L.A. flavor as opposed to the Detroit strins sound. IMO.

interesting. and no i have never heard a longer cut, but how much more explicit could it be than the released version!? HA! not sure i would need to hear more sordid details of a woman marrying a guy who is living another life on the down low! but just so my prurient tastes are fulfilled, i'll try and find it on YouTube!

still wondering what, if anything, h/d/h left motown with in their back pockets. doesn't seem like much to me!

Thisoldheart ..

The extended version of "Band Of Gold" actually got released as a 45 in Britain in 1979 on Neil Rushton's "Inferno" label.

http://www.45cat.com/record/heat17

Neil occasionally posts on this forum so maybe he will see this thread and comment.

The extended version also got a C.D. release by the U.K. Deep Beats label in 1997 on the C.D. "Invictus Unconquered - The Best of invictus Volume 1".

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Invictus-Unc.../dp/B00000B5V9

For those who havn't heard the extended version of the song it clears up the ambiguity about what the song is actually about. The singer is still a virgin on her wedding night and rejects the advances of her husband, he storms out and leaves her alone with just a "band of gold" to remind her she is married. Maybe she has "married a guy who is living another life on the down low" but the song doesn't mention this, that is just in the imagination of the listener. When the song came out [[it was #1 in Britain for SIX WEEKS in 1970) many people I knew thought that the non-consummation of the marriage was due to failure on the grooms part!!

The main differences between the two versions are that in the extended version the opening verse has the line ....

"the memories of our wedding day and the night I turned you away"

and in the long version there is a bridge where she sings ..

"Each night I lay awake and tell myself, the vows we made gave you the the right to have my love each night".

I think that the reason why the song was edited for eventual release was primarily for musical reasons as the bridges, although keeping up the tempo of the music, break up the song's structure. Of course it did also amend the meaning of the lyrics and made the song more enigmatic. Mind you, I can't think that the original lyrics would go down too well now as they seem to condone what is now known as "marital rape".

As to whether the song was written prior to H-D-H leaving Motown, possibly it was but lips still seem sealed about this .. one I think probaby was was "Give Me Just A Little More Time" which would have been perfect for THE FOUR TOPS.

Roger

thanks roger! well, those added lyrics totally contradict what i thought was going on! without hearing the longer edit i think i may like the ambiguity of the shorter version. and yes, if h/d/h left with anything else i think it would have been "give me just a little more time", but having that follow "you keep running away" would have been a disappointment to me! i'm glad it went to the chairmen of the board [[i think??). now, i'm thinking that "band of gold" [[the short version) could have gone to martha & the vandellas. ms. reeves can usually punch a whole lotta pathos into a song. coulda been better than freda payne who doesn't put quite enough pain into her singing!

"Give Me Just A Little More Time" was also recorded by Wayne Fontana on Philips. It was released in Aug 1970 but withdrawn from sale, making it one of his hardest to find singles.

The Four Seasons recorded a couple of songs whilst at Motown but bought back the rights and had them issued afterwards - both went on to become monster hits - December 1963 [[Oh What A Night) being one of them.

Which leads me on to my next point in that I would disagree with the notion that folks who left Motown never reached the same heights again? In fact many of them went on to much greater things. The Four Seasons, The Isley Brothers, Detroit Spinners, Gladys Knight & The Pips, Michael Jackson, Meatloaf, and even Johnny Bristol. It's a matter of personal taste as to whether their later recordings were really better than their Motown ones.

the four seasons were huge before motown, and their appearance at motown was a short trip at trying to get back a following. the spinners did in fact do much better post motown. i much prefer the unappreciated motown isley's to their later work. same goes for the pips, but that is just my own personal prejudice. i am not sure how michael fits in because by the time he was mega-huge there really was no motown! certainly the singers i would have expected to do well - mary wells, kim weston and perhaps florence ballard really needed the writing and producing talent motown provided. i was truly shocked at h/d/h pitiful demise, especially when coming from such great hights!

Whilst there were highlights in their post Motown output, particularly for Mary Wells and Kim Weston, I would agree that their work could have been handled better perhaps, but who is to say that Motown would have served them any better given the concentration on Diana? HDH did some cracking stuff post Motown as did Lamont Dozier on his own but yes perhaps they needed that Motown machine and the competition there.

As for Band Of Gold and Freda Payne, I wonder whether there are any Freda tracks in the Motown vaults at all?

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Originally Posted by mysterysinger

As for Band Of Gold and Freda Payne, I wonder whether there are any Freda tracks in the Motown vaults at all?

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I read that Freda recorded a song called FATHER DEAR, but it wasn't released because she never signed a contract.

The Supremes & WDOLG was not promoted until it was a solid fact to the company that Mary Wells was no longer going to be a Motown artist.Motown attorneys kept Mary Wells tied up court from June - Oct 1964, her first release after My Guy, Ain't It The Truth didn't come out until end of Oct. a long time lapse in the Pop. Rock & Soul record world.Then Barney Ales with his connection with the distributors made sure her product didn't get exposure needed for success.This was a good business move on Motowns part because if she had been successful they would have had problems with some of their other artists.

Roger,

An excellent dance record, and for music lovers a killer track. The lyrics on the released version and especially the alternative version were in my humble opinion a little too much for 1970. Ms Payne does a very good job with her treatment. Motown even after Love Child-I'm Living In shame, IMO never would have put the song out, maybe it was presented and Motown rejected it.

would h/d/h and motown have been on soeaking terms in 1970? they had their own company then, correct?

Invictus/Hot Wax put out alot better product then Motown did during the same time period but they had a collection problem with distributors and Capital/Buddhah who distributed them, thus again, Barney Ales was very strong with distributors.

thisoldheart---- Will try to send you an mp3 of the unedited version.

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Originally Posted by mysterysinger

As for Band Of Gold and Freda Payne, I wonder whether there are any Freda tracks in the Motown vaults at all?

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Don't Forget the Motorcity shows an acetate of "Save Me A Star" in existence. I can also remember a track called "The Moon Rock" being mentioned in an interview.

I'd guess that the earliest Invictus compositions were Freda's "The Easiest Way to Fall" [compare the structure of the chorus to "Standing In the Shadows of Love"] and "Dangling On A String" which sounds perfect for the 4 Tops.

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Originally Posted by 144man

I'd guess that the earliest Invictus compositions were Freda's "The Easiest Way to Fall" [compare the structure of the chorus to "Standing In the Shadows of Love"] and "Dangling On A String" which sounds perfect for the 4 Tops.

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Well yes ..

And how about "While You're Out Looking For Sugar" .. which I could image being recorded by MARTHA REEVES & THE VANDELLAS .. melodically it seems to owe something to "Nowhere To Run"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJiTI...eature=related

Roger

to me, almost all the hot wax invictus stuff sounds cheesier than holland/dozier/holland's stint at motown. they seemed to have lost a lotta class with their new label. can't help thinking it is because of the loss of the funk bros and motown's stable of stellar singers.

You could still recognize an HDH melody on early Invctus no matter who was credited as composer on the label [[e.g. Edith Wayne) or how cheesy it sounded. The sleeve-notes to the Edsel Invictus reissues indicate that HDH wrote a pool of material before any recording took place.

Interestingly enough,if you compare Holland Brothers later Motown compositions such as "I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do the Walking" and "Come Get The Cream Off the Top" to Lamont Dozier's "Invisible" [Alison Moyet] or "Two Hearts" [Phil Collins], it's Lamont's tracks which sound more 60s Motownesque.

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Originally Posted by thisoldheart

would h/d/h and motown have been on soeaking terms in 1970? they had their own company then, correct?

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No and Yes! Where I was going is that HDH was perhaps evolving to a more topical tenor to the tunes than say Say Baby Love, and Motown which became very profitable with the Baby Loves et al, prefered that HDH not become the voice of contemporary issues via song, but instead continue with the same old song if you will.

Here is a bit of "Band Of Gold" trivia for you guys. The song was the first that HDH would record at Tera Shirma. The take that they wanted was absolutely KILLER. The Funks were hitting on all cylinders and everyone was grooving until it came time for the play-back. Some glitch in the board put a high frequency hum on to the track and it was necessary to record more takes to get what HDH was looking for. I was mortified, but it all worked out.

how did some of the funk bros come to play on "band of gold"? did barry gordy know? seems he would have been more than slightly miffed! i remember hearing he was very upset when they played on jackie wilson's "higher and higher". i guess i don't really understand the nuances of their work slow down and departure and how gordy and h/d/h felt toward each other!

wow, never heard the added lyrics and extra melody line. great, midnight johnny!

Other than a couple of the Funks, most of the guys were playing sessions all over Detroit.

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Originally Posted by ralpht

Here is a bit of "Band Of Gold" trivia for you guys. The song was the first that HDH would record at Tera Shirma. The take that they wanted was absolutely KILLER. The Funks were hitting on all cylinders and everyone was grooving until it came time for the play-back. Some glitch in the board put a high frequency hum on to the track and it was necessary to record more takes to get what HDH was looking for. I was mortified, but it all worked out.

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Ralph, this is why I enjoy this board so much, 99.9% of us can only speculate, you on the other hand can share with us what actually did happen.

Depending on my aging memory, Motown.

I've always enjoyed the Invictus/Hox Wax recordings from around this time frame because it gives us an insight into what HDH would have done had they stayed with Motown well into the late 60's and early 70's. Since a majority of the recordings have the Funk Brothers on them, it really is "Motown." One of my personal favorites is the Honey Cone's "Sunday Morning People." It sounds like it was literally recorded in Studio A. Even though it wasn't a single, I can only imagine what Berry Gordy must have thought upon hearing it. I've never heard a non-Motown production come that close to the Motown sound. It is straight up Studio A Motown!

Was Flo's Save Me a Star the same song as Freda's? I always thought Band of Gold was a bit too slow.