By Keith Rylattk (217.137.89.19) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 11:58 am:

I know the forum is R&B based but was Ska, Rock Steady & Blue Beat played along side R&B and Soul in the USA, in the 60s? Probably because of the UK/West Indies close ties, it was closely intertwined in Britain. `Carloina` by the Folks Brothers, `Phoenix City` Roland Alphonso & `Guns of Naverone` Skatalites etc. It also led to some UK Soul productions by Jackie Edwards, Julian Covay etc. Keith

By Tony Russi (68.210.9.227) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 12:13 pm:

I don't ever remember any Reggea,Ska, or any island music being played on Southern Soul stations except maybe "My Boy Lollipop" by Millie Small or Johnny Nash & some Jimmy Cliff around the very early 70's.In the 80's the former Orlando "Soul" station became an Island Music & News AM station.

By Keane Lipinski (209.87.128.124) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 11:52 pm:

What about the Israelites by Desmond Decker and the Aces? Didn't they play that?

By Ritchie (62.254.0.32) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 04:27 am:

The MCA subsidiary Uni experimented with a few Reggae releases in 1969-70, but there was little success apart from Desmond Dekker's "Israelites". They also issued Max Romeo's notorious UK chart hit, (which I won't name for fear of anyone taking offence.) For the US market, it was retitled "Dream". It bombed. Even Motown had a shot, issuing Bob & Marcia's "Young Gifted & Black" on the strength of its chart placing in the UK. After the record failed to sell, the planned Bob & Marcia album was cancelled.

There had been of course a minor flurry of US interest in Jamaican music around 1964 after Millie Small's hit, but this soon fizzled out. Incidentally, for anyone who doesn't know, Millie's "My Boy Lollipop" was recorded in London. While it's generally agreed that it was the first international hit for Jamaican-style music, it was not actually a Jamaican record.

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.48) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 06:33 am:

Keith,Ritchie,
so many great 45s as you both know that were spun on the scene by some great 'ragga'stars.

I love Jackie Edwards stuff
not just his 'feel so bad'
but the album he also did regards the original versions of stuff that spencer davis was doing.

And Jimmy Cliff
although for me not a patch on Bobby Blands version
but a superb cut no less
was the uk Fontana(I think,I have one upstairs but not sure if its Fontana)
of
'Call on me'
regards
ragga mel and da ska-na-nettes.

By TonyRussi (68.210.9.227) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 07:16 am:

Soul (R&B) Stations in the South did not play that "Israelites" record.Pop stations did.

By Keith Rylatt (217.137.89.19) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 09:19 am:

I note from Dub records that I bought in the 80's a lot of them were produced in NYC.
Ritchie, isn't there a vague claim that Rod Stewart played harmonica on `Lollipop`?
Skanking Mel, Joyce Bond also did some nice covers, eg Joe Tex's `Sugar`. I wonder how well Jackie Edwards' `I Feel So Bad` would have gone down stateside?? Is it known over there, USA friends?? Keith

By Bill (195.93.34.9) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 01:38 pm:

Mel,

Yes, you're right, it's on UK Fontana.

Cheers,

Bill.

By TonyRussi (68.210.9.227) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 01:47 pm:

Yes Keith, I heard that before about Rod Stewart playing harmonica on that Millie Small track.I personally never heard of Jackie Edwards is that the same "Feel So Bad" by Little Milton?

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.72) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 02:16 pm:

Thanks Bill
mel's(gun's dont Hargue)

By RODS (195.93.34.9) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 03:28 pm:

I've got Prince Buster "Ten Commandments" Lp on US rca and I remember coming across a 60's comp. on Epic[issued at the time] of ska/rocksteady. I think Curtis Mayfield had a credit on it and I dont mean as a song writer. Think a friend of mine may still have it. I'll look and see what's on it if anyone's interested and he still has it.
So ska and Northern passed those Americans by. Did they have any fun.

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.72) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 03:51 pm:

Rods
your better asking Keith and Ritchie
as I am but a mere pup.
regards
the-mel-ska
the turntable dub!
or aka
superape
but not in good shape.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.32) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 04:10 pm:

Hi guys

This whole thread feels like it should be on my forum on the Trojan site, not SD!

The Ten Commandments album was issued on US RCA ca. 1967. It's now a highly-collectible item. There were quite a few US-released Ska albums, though none were spectacular sellers. Producer Byron Lee had a licensing deal via Atlantic, and a couple of albums of his rather MOR band, the Dragonaires issued. Also, a number of US artists attempted to climb on the Ska bandwagon - the Chiffons, Steve Alaimo (a whole album), and the Fleetwoods, to name but three.

I'm not sure about the Curtis Mayfield reference. A couple of Jamaican artists cut some tunes in New York - the Blues Busters, and Derrick Harriott, but other than being a major influence on Jamaican artists (he's the most-covered American songwriter in Ja.), I'm not sure of any direct involvement with Curtis himself.

Incidentally, Sir Coxsone Dodd's Studio One label was the licensee for Motown in sixties Jamaica, which explains why there are many Ska cover versions of Motown tunes on Studio One. An early Bob Marley cut is a cover of the Marvelettes' Playboy, but with typical Jamaican nonchalance, the Wailers' cover version also incorporates part of the Contours' Do You Love Me (!)

By FrankM (81.152.61.62) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 05:27 pm:

The Impressions were a big influence on Jamaican vocal trios and I believe they toured the islands. I'm sure there was a recent CD of Impressions covers.

My Boy Lollipop was originally a hit for Barbie gaye. Millie's version sold seven million worldwide. Recorded in London, released in March 1964. Only two jamaican musicians were playing on the record, Ernest Ranglin - guitar & arrangement and Pete Peterson - trumpet. Backed by Jimmy Powell and the Dimension with Pete Hogman on harmonica. Produced by Chris Blackwell. definitely not Rod stewart on harp but maybe Bob Holness on sax

By Keith Rylatt (217.137.90.12) on Saturday, August 16, 2003 - 12:14 pm:

FranKM You are bang-on right about Pete Hogman, a friend called Ken White played in the Dimensions (and later the Score) and he told me of this false claim by Rod Stewart, who initially played in the Dimensions but his `personality` clashed with Jimmy Powell's and he soon split. Also `My Hearts Desire` by the Jiving Juniors on Blue Beat always has been a rare & sought after Group record in the US. had this been Soulful New Orleans.Com I'm sure there would be a lot of interaction. Keith

By Keith Rylatt (217.137.88.3) on Sunday, August 17, 2003 - 08:29 am:

TonyRussi No they are different, both great sides though. The Jackie Edwards has never been issued in the US, in fact it was probably exclusive to the UK. It was issued in 1966 on the Island label. It must be known in the states, as I've seen it on want lists. Keith

By Ritchie (62.254.0.32) on Sunday, August 17, 2003 - 08:48 am:

I'm wondering if "My Heart's Desire" was one of the sides Derrick Harriott cut in New York...?

By RODS (195.93.34.9) on Monday, August 18, 2003 - 04:45 pm:

TO Ritchie
Checked out that Epic LP. Produced by Curtis and Carl Davis with tracks by Techniques, Winston Samuels, J. Cliff, Charmers, and Lord Creator. Sleeve notes mention a recent concert at NY Worlds Fair. My mate says that the tracks sound different. Lord Creator [ Kentrick Patrick?] does "Man oh man" but he says it's different to UK release. He estimates '65 for recording. Maybe they're recordings done in US to appeal to Am. audience.
Title- "The real Ja. Ska"
ROD