Love Hangover-Fifth Dimension

[luke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWF7FDLeuE4 I just heard this for the first time. Im surprised many posted they prefer it, I think Diana's is much more intense. Theirs sounds muddled tho I love the wailing at 1:35 ish and 2:50 ish--is that Flroence LaRue?

[marv2]

I remember first hearing this in late Fall 1975. I liked it. It did not sound like what I had come to expect from the 5th Dimension. Then several months later I heard Diane's version on the radio and it too was good. It also did not sound like what I had come to expect from her . It was easy to hear the Donna Summer influence on it [[read: sexy!).

[marv2]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWF7FDLeuE4 I just heard this for the first time. Im surprised many posted they prefer it, I think Diana's is much more intense. Theirs sounds muddled tho I love the wailing at 1:35 ish and 2:50 ish--is that Flroence LaRue?

Yes that is the very sexy and very talented Florence LaRue......

[soulster]

I heard this version on the radio in the spring of 1976 right before the Diana Ross Version ascended up the charts. I don't think it's very good, but then we also have the DR version to compare it to.

When I created my 1976 comp, I put them both on it back to back with the Fifth Dimension's version first for contrast.

[luke]

Yes the 5ths is a decent record. Florence should wail more!

[kenneth]

I like the 5th Dimension version, but I think Diane's has more tension and is more edgey. It builds better to the, ahem, climax of the song.

[Roberta75]

I like the 5th Dimension version, but I think Diane's has more tension and is more edgey. It builds better to the, ahem, climax of the song.

I agree Kenneth I like the 5th Dimension version but Diane's version is much better.

Yours, with every good wish.

Roberta

[midnightman]

I don't like this. Diana's still holds something special to me. I guess the Dimension had a hard time breaking out of their early sound...

[kenneth]

Well Roberta and Midnightman, great minds think alike!

[144man]

I like the Jr Walker version better than the 5th Dimension's and almost as much as Diana's.

[carole cucumber]

I remember first hearing this in late Fall 1975. I liked it. It did not sound like what I had come to expect from the 5th Dimension. Then several months later I heard Diane's version on the radio and it too was good. It also did not sound like what I had come to expect from her . It was easy to hear the Donna Summer influence on it [[read: sexy!).

Marv,
Our memories sometimes play tricks on us. This appears to be one of those times that your is a bit off target. We all have those moments.
Every copy of the 5th Dimension's single 'Love Hangover' that I have seen has a 1976 copyright as does the one in the video that Luke has so graciously posted. There is no way you could have heard it in the fall of 1975. And Diana's release did not come several months after the 5th Dimensions' version.

http://wcbsfm.cbslocal.com/2010/03/01/love-hangover-behind-the-hits-story/

[marv2]

Marv,
Our memories sometimes play tricks on us. This appears to be one of those times that your is a bit off target. We all have those moments.
Every copy of the 5th Dimension's single 'Love Hangover' that I have seen has a 1976 copyright as does the one in the video that Luke has so graciously posted. There is no way you could have heard it in the fall of 1975. And Diana's release did not come several months after the 5th Dimensions' version.

http://wcbsfm.cbslocal.com/2010/03/01/love-hangover-behind-the-hits-story/

Carole, unless you worked for WKLR as a disc jockey in late 1975, then you don't know what you are talking about again! There use to be a thing called white label promo copies that were distributed to radio stations back in the olden days. Go find another fight to pick.
You bore me.......

Oh and one more thang.......learn how to read! I said I heard Diane's version several months after I heard the version done by the 5th Dimension. Has nothing to do with release dates!

[Methuselah2]

Could someone please explain how the 5D were able to release a version of a Motown song--written by Motown's Marilyn McLeod & Pam Sawyer? Never understood how that was permitted to happen--or if it even was. Thanks.

P.S. I've heard that for Ross' recording of the tune, Producer Hal Davis had Engineer Russ Terrana set up a strobe light to help put Diana in a more disco mood since she wasn't keen on going disco. OK, Ralph--Anything you can tell us about this strobe story and your brother--Is it true? Did Ross like it? Thanks.

[reese]

Could someone please explain how the 5D were able to release a version of a Motown song--written by Motown's Marilyn McLeod & Pam Sawyer? Never understood how that was permitted to happen--or if it even was. Thanks.

P.S. I've heard that for Ross' recording of the tune, Producer Hal Davis had Engineer Russ Terrana set up a strobe light to help put Diana in a more disco mood since she wasn't keen on going disco. OK, Ralph--Anything you can tell us about this strobe story and brother--Is it true? Did Ross like it? Thanks.

I was always under the impression that Diana's version was released first, as an album track in 1976. I recall Florence LaRue saying as much in a Black Stars magazine interview. She thought their version could have been a big hit, which they could have really used as Marilyn and Billy had recently left.

Motown was going with Diana's single I THOUGHT IT TOOK A LITTLE TIME until the
5th Dimension's cover and the response to Diana's original from the discos forced them to rush out Diana's version on a single.

Re the different versions, I would think Motown were be glad to have multiple versions recorded as it increased their publishing revenue. Around the same time, both High Inergy and Millie Jackson released YOU CAN'T TURN ME OFF. But again, the Motown act was the winner.

[carole cucumber]

[QUOTE=marv2;158845]Carole, unless you worked for WKLR as a disc jockey in late 1975, then you don't know what you are talking about again! There use to be a thing called white label promo copies that were distributed to radio stations back in the olden days. Go find another fight to pick.

Here's what someone who was there, one of the arrangers, Clay Drayton , has stated:

"I was the arranger on the song and after Diana recorded it I was asked to gather the musicians together to play it again for the 5th to record it cause they knew Berry was NOT going to release it as a single on Diana. So we did it on the 5th...
THEN Berry found out and relased it as a single on Ms. Ross and the rest is history."
http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=6583

According to session notes in the expanded edition of Diana Ross [[1976) :
Love Hangover: Track recorded date unknown; lead vocal recorded December 18, 1975;
piano and handclaps overdubbed January 13, 1976; strings recorded January 17, 1976; guitar and conga, January 19, 1976; background vocals, January 20 and 23, 1976; all other dates unknown

The earliest date that Diana's recording could have been finished is late January, 1976 and even if Mr. Drayton had played the song for the 5th Dimension after Diana's lead vocals were recorded in mid -December, 1975, there is no way that any dj or radio station in the country could have been given a 5th Dimension promo that had not yet even been recorded in the fall of 1975

[BayouMotownMan]

Actually that is Marjorie Barnes doing the wailing on here. She was the second replacement for the wonderful Marilyn McCoo. First there was Eloise Laws who was replaced after I think one tv appearance.

The story goes like this. Diana Ross's self-titled lp was issued in March 1976. Motown issued I Thought It Took A Little Time as the follow up to the No. 1 Mahogany. Marc Gordon liked Love Hangover and thought it would launch his new 5th Dimension so they recorded and rush-released it. As soon as BG found this out he order Love Hangover issued and Took A Little Time pulled. Shades of Come See About Me with Nella Dodds. The 5th Dimension were on Bandstand and Soul Train, with Florence complaining about this to Don Cornelius, saying "it will be interesting to see which is gonna be the hit." Of course, Ross clobbered them and the 5th Dimension version sank. BG then signed the Dimension to Motown the following year and proceeded to sabotage any hopes of a comeback [[as he did with many of Ross's competitors) by issuing two lps and singles on the 5th Dimension that nobody ever heard much of.

No issue of this, white label or not, was done in the fall of 1975. The above chronology can be checked out

[carole cucumber]

Thank you, BayouMountainMan for also setting the record straight. And incidentally the Diana Ross album containing Love Hangover was issued on February 10, 1976.

[luke]

I just read in that great UK book that describes each Tamla Motown single relased that Motown issues a promo with Ross "lambasting" the 5th Dimension for releasing HER song! Has anyone seen this promo copy?

[carole cucumber]

Thank you, BayouMountainMan for also setting the record straight. And incidentally the Diana Ross album containing Love Hangover was issued on February 10, 1976.
The release dates of the singles in question substantiates what you have posted-

I Thought It Took A Little Time [[But Today I Fell In Love) Motown 1387 February 20, 1976


Love Hangover Motown 1392 March 16, 1976

[carole cucumber]

Luke,
I can't address the fact of whether or not there was such a promo. But I do know that I have a cassette of some of the remarks Diana made when the 5th Dimension issued Love Hangover. However I don't think that 'lambast' would describe what I heard. Her tone was quite calm throughout. She appears to be speaking her piece, wanting the facts to be known.
Diana explains that Motown had issued a similar style single [[I Thought It Took A Little Time) to follow Theme from Mahogany as was usually done. But then Motown got word of the 5th Dimension's rush-released version of Love Hangover. Diana says that they [[definitely the 5th Dimension; but was she also referring to the arrangers and the Motown musicians?) went into the studio and 'copied her version note for note'. She expressed that she viewed this as a form of 'cheating' and that when people heard both versions of Love Hangover they would hear and know that it was her song. She wished the 5th Dimension well and mentioned the fact that they had recently lost Marilyn McCoo & Billy Davis. She hoped that they would again be successful, but not with utilizing a song that was part of her recently-released album.

I'm not sure if I agree with everything she said there, but that was her opinion, and likely that of Motown. Too often, the business world can be cut-throat.

[carole cucumber]

Luke,
I forgot to mention that on the cassette Diana is being interviewed and is answering a question posed to her concerning the 2 versions of Love Hangover.

[soulster]

Luke,
I can't address the fact of whether or not there was such a promo. But I do know that I have a cassette of some of the remarks Diana made when the 5th Dimension issued Love Hangover. However I don't think that 'lambast' would describe what I heard. Her tone was quite calm throughout. She appears to be speaking her piece, wanting the facts to be known.
Diana explains that Motown had issued a similar style single [[I Thought It Took A Little Time) to follow Theme from Mahogany as was usually done. But then Motown got word of the 5th Dimension's rush-released version of Love Hangover. Diana says that they [[definitely the 5th Dimension; but was she also referring to the arrangers and the Motown musicians?) went into the studio and 'copied her version note for note'. She expressed that she viewed this as a form of 'cheating' and that when people heard both versions of Love Hangover they would hear and know that it was her song. She wished the 5th Dimension well and mentioned the fact that they had recently lost Marilyn McCoo & Billy Davis. She hoped that they would again be successful, but not with utilizing a song that was part of her recently-released album.

I'm not sure if I agree with everything she said there, but that was her opinion, and likely that of Motown. Too often, the business world can be cut-throat.

That is pretty accurate. Thanks for confirming this.

[Rosa Refried]

[QUOTE=marv2;158845]Carole, unless you worked for WKLR as a disc jockey in late 1975, then you don't know what you are talking about again! There use to be a thing called white label promo copies that were distributed to radio stations back in the olden days. Go find another fight to pick.

Here's what someone who was there, one of the arrangers, Clay Drayton , has stated:

"I was the arranger on the song and after Diana recorded it I was asked to gather the musicians together to play it again for the 5th to record it cause they knew Berry was NOT going to release it as a single on Diana. So we did it on the 5th...
THEN Berry found out and relased it as a single on Ms. Ross and the rest is history."
http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=6583

According to session notes in the expanded edition of Diana Ross [[1976) :
Love Hangover: Track recorded date unknown; lead vocal recorded December 18, 1975;
piano and handclaps overdubbed January 13, 1976; strings recorded January 17, 1976; guitar and conga, January 19, 1976; background vocals, January 20 and 23, 1976; all other dates unknown

The earliest date that Diana's recording could have been finished is late January, 1976 and even if Mr. Drayton had played the song for the 5th Dimension after Diana's lead vocals were recorded in mid -December, 1975, there is no way that any dj or radio station in the country could have been given a 5th Dimension promo that had not yet even been recorded in the fall of 1975


SNAP! Go on girl!

[smark21]

I wonder if the writers of Dreamgirls used the competing versions of Love Hangover for the second act plot twist for the competing versions of “One Night Only” in the musical?

[milven]

6474
6475

I've been given many white label promo 45's during my career, but I never received one, or heard one played on the radio - or anywhere else , before it was actually made.

Marv, as Ricky Ricardo would say, .


http://1fc.4imgs.com/sid/748/516_F.jpg

[marv2]

What? You have got to be kidding!!!

[Roberta75]

6474
6475

I've been given many white label promo 45's during my career, but I never received one, or heard one played on the radio - or anywhere else , before it was actually made.

Marv, as Ricky Ricardo would say, .


http://1fc.4imgs.com/sid/748/516_F.jpg

lol i wouldnt hold your breath dear milven. lol

Roberta

[captainjames]

LOL that is too funny

[theboyfromxtown]

I have that UK promo where Diana talks about Love Hangover.

She talks about the 5th Dimension acting as a "cheat" and she also refers to the group having some problems with members.

[BayouMotownMan]

I have that as well, and Ross pulled no punches. She called them by name, said "they're a good great, but let them get their own material."

[luke]

Did she blast Nella Dodds too?

[midnightman]

Luke,
I can't address the fact of whether or not there was such a promo. But I do know that I have a cassette of some of the remarks Diana made when the 5th Dimension issued Love Hangover. However I don't think that 'lambast' would describe what I heard. Her tone was quite calm throughout. She appears to be speaking her piece, wanting the facts to be known.
Diana explains that Motown had issued a similar style single [[I Thought It Took A Little Time) to follow Theme from Mahogany as was usually done. But then Motown got word of the 5th Dimension's rush-released version of Love Hangover. Diana says that they [[definitely the 5th Dimension; but was she also referring to the arrangers and the Motown musicians?) went into the studio and 'copied her version note for note'. She expressed that she viewed this as a form of 'cheating' and that when people heard both versions of Love Hangover they would hear and know that it was her song. She wished the 5th Dimension well and mentioned the fact that they had recently lost Marilyn McCoo & Billy Davis. She hoped that they would again be successful, but not with utilizing a song that was part of her recently-released album.

I'm not sure if I agree with everything she said there, but that was her opinion, and likely that of Motown. Too often, the business world can be cut-throat.

Well I'll be blessed. Thank you for this info!

[Boogiedown]

As I remember it, the discos jumped on Diana's seven minute LP version the day it came out and Motown realized that if they were to capitalize on this immediate momentum thanks to the clubs, they needed to rush release the single.
The 3:48 version by the Fifth Dimension didn't get that same club respect when it was released because of the length [[and on a 45) , and it was, after all, vs. Diana Ross !!, and finally it was just a cheesier rendition starting with a vocal group interpreting this very personal love hangover experience of which was now being played out over cheap synthetic strings .

[Jaap]

I agree. Love Hangover works so well because it's Diana Ross's voice... Tom Moulton did a version on Pauline Henry, actually using a remix of the original instrumental [[the same of the 1993 mix he did on Diana Ross), and Henry is a great singer but does not add that "extra" to the track that Ross does.

[SupremeBoy]

Someone *coughmarv2cough* got seriously shut down on this thread. ROFLMAO!!!

[BayouMotownMan]

As I recall, Florence LaRue re-recorded this for Ian Levine's MotorCity label around 1990. Am I correct on this one?

[milven]

As I recall, Florence LaRue re-recorded this for Ian Levine's MotorCity label around 1990. Am I correct on this one?

Yes you are. Was it the whole existing group or just Florence? It's on Best of Motorcity.

I guess Marv will say that he heard it in 1989, a year before it was re-recorded. :rolleyes:

[BayouMotownMan]

LOL Wouldn't surprise me milven.

[milven]

The 5th Dimension also shared another song with Diana,
SURRENDER
http://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/126s/32928513.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qL36M9kjPm4

[soulster]

As I remember it, the discos jumped on Diana's seven minute LP version the day it came out and Motown realized that if they were to capitalize on this immediate momentum thanks to the clubs, they needed to rush release the single.
The 3:48 version by the Fifth Dimension didn't get that same club respect when it was released because of the length [[and on a 45) , and it was, after all, vs. Diana Ross !!, and finally it was just a cheesier rendition starting with a vocal group interpreting this very personal love hangover experience of which was now being played out over cheap synthetic strings .
^This! It sounds like they called it in. But, then, Ross had to get drunk to record it.

[milven]

Here is an almost seven minute re-mix of the 5th Dimension's Hangover


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xsgdfp_fifth-dimension-love-hangover-1976-remix_music

[Roberta75]

^This! It sounds like they called it in. But, then, Ross had to get drunk to record it.

Is there any need to bring that RUMOR up? Just askin.

[supremester]

Carole, unless you worked for WKLR as a disc jockey in late 1975, then you don't know what you are talking about again! There use to be a thing called white label promo copies that were distributed to radio stations back in the olden days. Go find another fight to pick.
You bore me.......

Oh and one more thang.......learn how to read! I said I heard Diane's version several months after I heard the version done by the 5th Dimension. Has nothing to do with release dates!
Um, you know I hate contradict anyone, but Diana's version was recorded in January and was a last minute add to the LP. I don't even think it was mastered until a week or two before it's release. Of course, where you live they may not have been playing Diana's version, but they both entered The Hot 100 on the same day.
I Thought It Took A Little Time was already scheduled to be the follow-up and it was the top add of the week, but Motown was pulling it from Top 40 stations in order to get a foothold agasinst The 5th's low-ball, cheezy tactic. They did a good job though!

[milven]

Yeah, but Marv has the unique ability to hear songs on the radio before they are even recorded so I wouldn't dispute what he says. Especially when he says that what he states is indisputable and that we don't know what we are talking about

[alexgarret]

You know he reads these threads - question is will he respond or just be to much of a weenie - you all know him better than I do. Questions need to be answered & apologies need to be made. Does he just show up in other threads ignoring this?


Yeah, but Marv has the unique ability to hear songs on the radio before they are even recorded so I wouldn't dispute what he says. Especially when he says that what he states is indisputable and that we don't know what we are talking about

[soulster]

Marv, is it possible you got your time line confused a bit? It can happen to anyone.

[milven]

You know he reads these threads - question is will he respond or just be to much of a weenie - you all know him better than I do. Questions need to be answered & apologies need to be made. Does he just show up in other threads ignoring this?

Yes, he will show up in other threads and ignore this. That's what he does.
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRT8_fxzfUnSCbpLgAdcBP_EqCR3vJd2 3w9iK71tWhNDz5QEJKcLQ


Marv, is it possible you got your time line confused a bit? It can happen to anyone.

That is what what Carol very politely asked him too when he said that he first heard Love Hangover by 5th Dimension in the fall of 1975.


Marv,
Our memories sometimes play tricks on us. This appears to be one of those times that your is a bit off target. We all have those moments.
Every copy of the 5th Dimension's single 'Love Hangover' that I have seen has a 1976 copyright as does the one in the video that Luke has so graciously posted. There is no way you could have heard it in the fall of 1975. ...http://wcbsfm.cbslocal.com/2010/03/01/love-hangover-behind-the-hits-story/

But instead of checking his memory or facts, he dug in his heels and insisted he was right and told her that she did not know what she was talking about. That is why many members are not letting this go. She was very polite and he came back and insulted her intelligence. He has done it to many of us and that may be why many members take a bit of pleasure in watching him back himself into a corner



Carole, unless you worked for WKLR as a disc jockey in late 1975, then you don't know what you are talking about again! There use to be a thing called white label promo copies that were distributed to radio stations back in the olden days. Go find another fight to pick.
You bore me.......


With the help of other members, it was proven that Love Hangover by the 5th Dimension could not have been played by a disc jockey at WKLR in the fall of 1975 - even on a white label promo 45 - simply because it had not yet been recorded .



6474
6475

I've been given many white label promo 45's during my career, but I never received one, or heard one played on the radio - or anywhere else , before it was actually made.

Marv, as Ricky Ricardo would say, .


http://1fc.4imgs.com/sid/748/516_F.jpg

When called out on it, instead of saying something like "Ooops people, you're right, I think I had a senior moment and got my dates wrong", he told Carol she did not know what she was talking about and told me that I've got to be kidding. We got off easy this time. He's called me stupid on occasion.



What? You have got to be kidding!!!

[BayouMotownMan]

Is that anything new? His "insider Motown knowledge" is rarely accurate

[Roberta75]

Is that anything new? His "insider Motown knowledge" is rarely accurate

And when challenged he get real nasty and attacks people. SMH.

Roberta

[Kamasu_Jr]

Anybody seen that pic of Diana Ross giving the 5th Dimension a kiss after shebeat them with Love Hangover?

[BobC]

[QUOTE=BayouMotownMan;158857]Actually that is Marjorie Barnes doing the wailing on here. She was the second replacement for the wonderful Marilyn McCoo. First there was Eloise Laws who was replaced after I think one tv appearance.

I can't believe I actually caught Bayou with inaccurate information! No that isn't Marjorie Barnes--it is Danny Beard. In fact, when the group performed this on Merv Griffin, Merv remarked that it was Danny doing that high wail, and Marjorie laughed and said Danny could hit higher notes than she could!

[midnightman]

Lol I see this topic has been bumped up for some reason... my thoughts still remain, it's Diana's song. And her song only. The album version and the alternate original take of it are fascinating, the latter funks it up even more with the way the background vocalists keep scatting it up. LOVE IT!!!

[REDHOT]

Will i liked both versions of Love Hangover,i don't know who did what first,and don't care,again i like them both,as fare as the time,they recorded Love Hangover,i'm sure if you ask The 5th or Diana,they wouldn't be able to tell,the date and time they recorded it lol,it's no big deal.

[BobbyC]

Bayou that is not Marjorie, It is Danny Beard. LaMonte confirms this in his book and the group said so on Mike Douglas.

[PeaceNHarmony]

I wonder if the Left Banke were embittered when the Four Tops ... 'stole' ... Walk Away Renee' ?

[BayouMotownMan]

Bayou that is not Marjorie, It is Danny Beard. LaMonte confirms this in his book and the group said so on Mike Douglas.

I stand corrected. I never bought this record or seen it performed, I listened to it on YouTube