Diana Ross on Oprah

[floyjoy678]

There's an interview with Diana on Oprah on youtube and part of the conversation goes like this....

Diana: We never really considered Cindy a Supreme even though she was officially.
Oprah: Yeah I had trouble accepting Cindy myself...it was always Flo--
Diana: We were all waiting for Blondie to come back.

Did Diana really believe Florence was going to be back in the group after everything that had happened?

[marv2]

There's an interview with Diana on Oprah on youtube and part of the conversation goes like this....

Diana: We never really considered Cindy a Supreme even though she was officially.
Oprah: Yeah I had trouble accepting Cindy myself...it was always Flo--
Diana: We were all waiting for Blondie to come back.

Did Diana really believe Florence was going to be back in the group after everything that had happened?

She said that for PR reasons I am guessing. I hardly believe she believed that Florence would come back when she was bursting with glee that day at Berry Gordy's house when Florence was fired.

[Jimi LaLumia]

in various interviews, both Ross and Wilson had discounted Cindy as being a 'real' Supreme, I guess because they felt strongly about being in on the ground floor, the years of struggling, while Cindy came on board in the champaign/caviar era..they obviously felt she hadn't earned her Supremacy..

[stephanie]

Cindy earned her right as a Supreme IMO she filled Flos shoes well and continued into the seventies. I wish they would give Cindy more credit she may not have had the high soprano live on the early Supremes material but she more than earned her keep during the 70s and was there for Mary when she needed her. No offense to you Jimi and your statement. I wanted you to know this is not directed towards you I realize people have to be careful of how they say things on the net.

[Jimi LaLumia]

it's all good.. Ross and Wilson made their respective statements, I didn't..
I just put in my theory as to why they probably felt that way..

[ejluther]

Does someone have the link to the actual video of this exchange on Youtube/wherever? I've heard this quote for a long time but have never actually seen it for myself in context...thanks.

Also, speaking of Oprah, does anyone have a link to video of Diana singing "Only Love Can Conquer All" on Oprah?

[franjoy56]

Cindy is the most beloved of all the Supremes from her days when she replaced Flo through the 70's when she and Pedro bumped heads, and Pedro had her ousted. I wonder what would have happened had she quit the Supremes before Diana had left, and she had plenty reason to feel like nothing more than an ornament.

[carole cucumber]

She said that for PR reasons I am guessing. I hardly believe she believed that Florence would come back when she was bursting with glee that day at Berry Gordy's house when Florence was fired.

Marv is right. He is guessing.
None of us knows exactly what goes on within another person- where the heart stops and the mind takes over. Marv's opinion concerning pr may well have validity.
I was not present in the room on the day that Flo left the group/was fired. I did not see Diana's face or peer into her heart. And as far as I know, Marv was not there, either.
But my take on Diana's comment may also have validity.
I suppose that Diana was torn. Diana, sizing up the situation from a professional and [[limited) business sense, saw Flo's attitude and behavior as not only detrimental to Berry and herself personally but also as hurting Motown and the group.
On the other hand, Diana knew that she , Mary & Florence had shared so many things together and initially a common dream and purpose. Although they did not always see themselves as sisters, they had formed bonds of friendship and caring. Yet, at times, they competed and fought at the same level that sisters do. Diana might initially have had difficulty letting go of those emotional bonds, even as Flo both disappointed and angered her. She just may have hoped that after her dismissal from the group, Flo would get to the source of her problems, accept help, turn her life around, and then return to the Supremes.

[marv2]

Marv is right. He is guessing.
None of us knows exactly what goes on within another person- where the heart stops and the mind takes over. Marv's opinion concerning pr may well have validity.
I was not present in the room on the day that Flo left the group/was fired. I did not see Diana's face or peer into her heart. And as far as I know, Marv was not there, either.
But my take on Diana's comment may also have validity.
I suppose that Diana was torn. Diana, sizing up the situation from a professional and [[limited) business sense, saw Flo's attitude and behavior as not only detrimental to Berry and herself personally but also as hurting Motown and the group.
On the other hand, Diana knew that she , Mary & Florence had shared so many things together and initially a common dream and purpose. Although they did not always see themselves as sisters, they had formed bonds of friendship and caring. Yet, at times, they competed and fought at the same level that sisters do. Diana might initially have had difficulty letting go of those emotional bonds, even as Flo both disappointed and angered her. She just may have hoped that after her dismissal from the group, Flo would get to the source of her problems, accept help, turn her life around, and then return to the Supremes.

That is not true at all but I am going to let you go on believing that.

[carole cucumber]

That is not true at all but I am going to let you go on believing that.

But it is true Marv.
You don't LET me go on believing anything. You have no control over me or any other person! I have been created in and for freedom and dignity as much as you or anyone else.
Neither you nor I were in Diana's heart, soul, or person [[nor are we ever in anyone else's). We cannot say that we know how Diana felt in the depth of her being or what she thought either on the day of Flo's dismissal or during the Oprah [[or any) interview. Only she can.
Even if , for a moment or a greater period of time, she may have felt as you suggest, it is clear that she did not allow that feeling to remain with her, to poison and guide her thoughts and words for the rest of her life.
The fact that she has been able to achieve so much personally and professionally speaks to this fact.
In interviews, such as the one floyjoy678 mentions, she demonstrates that human beings can move past past frailties and change their hearts and lives.
This is not an easy lesson to learn. But once learned and embraced, it gives one a greater sense of freedom. One then sees things in a new light and wishes that same gift for others- even those who have hurt them.
I pray that one day you may embrace that gift.

[carlo]

Marv is right. He is guessing.
None of us knows exactly what goes on within another person- where the heart stops and the mind takes over. Marv's opinion concerning pr may well have validity.
I was not present in the room on the day that Flo left the group/was fired. I did not see Diana's face or peer into her heart. And as far as I know, Marv was not there, either.
But my take on Diana's comment may also have validity.
I suppose that Diana was torn. Diana, sizing up the situation from a professional and [[limited) business sense, saw Flo's attitude and behavior as not only detrimental to Berry and herself personally but also as hurting Motown and the group.
On the other hand, Diana knew that she , Mary & Florence had shared so many things together and initially a common dream and purpose. Although they did not always see themselves as sisters, they had formed bonds of friendship and caring. Yet, at times, they competed and fought at the same level that sisters do. Diana might initially have had difficulty letting go of those emotional bonds, even as Flo both disappointed and angered her. She just may have hoped that after her dismissal from the group, Flo would get to the source of her problems, accept help, turn her life around, and then return to the Supremes.

I agree. Well said.

[REDHOT]

I'm sure no one was waiting for Florence to return to The Supremes,Berry Gordy,Diana,and even Mary wanted her out,and she gave them good reason to put her out,like not showing up ,dranking too much.The entertainment world is not for everybody,maybe it was not for Flo,Mary has said that Flo wanted out,don't get me wrong,i'm a big time Florence Ballard fan,it would have really been great to see Flo on those TV Spacials, like T.C.B or G.I.T,she really missed out on some of the big things, that was coming her way as a Supreme,Cindy Birdsong was a great replacement,Cindy didn't miss a beat,Love them all
Please stay positive

[Bokiluis]

But it is true Marv.
You don't LET me go on believing anything. You have no control over me or any other person! I have been created in and for freedom and dignity as much as you or anyone else.
Neither you nor I were in Diana's heart, soul, or person [[nor are we ever in anyone else's). We cannot say that we know how Diana felt in the depth of her being or what she thought either on the day of Flo's dismissal or during the Oprah [[or any) interview. Only she can.
Even if , for a moment or a greater period of time, she may have felt as you suggest, it is clear that she did not allow that feeling to remain with her, to poison and guide her thoughts and words for the rest of her life.
The fact that she has been able to achieve so much personally and professionally speaks to this fact.
In interviews, such as the one floyjoy678 mentions, she demonstrates that human beings can move past past frailties and change their hearts and lives.
This is not an easy lesson to learn. But once learned and embraced, it gives one a greater sense of freedom. One then sees things in a new light and wishes that same gift for others- even those who have hurt them.
I pray that one day you may embrace that gift.

Well stated!

[marv2]

I'm sure no one was waiting for Florence to return to The Supremes,Berry Gordy,Diana,and even Mary wanted her out,and she gave them good reason to put her out,like not showing up ,dranking too much.The entertainment world is not for everybody,maybe it was not for Flo,Mary has said that Flo wanted out,don't get me wrong,i'm a big time Florence Ballard fan,it would have really been great to see Flo on those TV Spacials, like T.C.B or G.I.T,she really missed out on some of the big things, that was coming her way as a Supreme,Cindy Birdsong was a great replacement,Cindy didn't miss a beat,Love them all
Please stay positive

You got that right! They were not waiting for Florence Ballard to come back to the group after she was fired. She made that up! About year after the "meeting" at Berry's house, Diane and Florence almost got into a fist fight again, at Berry's house! FACT!

[BayouMotownMan]

This philosophy has been beaten to death on here and many other boards. The situation was what it was nearly 50 years ago. Diana nor Mary were truly involved in the business dealings at Motown and none were involved in the signing of future women to the group or the label. What I took from Diana's statement is that she was probably under the assumption that Cindy was a stand-in because Diana was scheduled to leave the group sooner than when she actually did. By the time Diana did leave Cindy was just out of her probationary period. In any event, no one can deny Cindy's appeal and her contribution to the legacy of the Supremes.

[RossHolloway]

Some people seem to forget that Diana and Florence remained friends up until Florence's death.

[BayouMotownMan]

Some people chose to remember it that way for the pure pleasure of stirring mess. They have nothing else to do with their time...

[RossHolloway]

Some people chose to remember it that way for the pure pleasure of stirring mess. They have nothing else to do with their time...

But here's the thing: Those people wern't there! They weren't in on the personal conversations between Diana, Mary and Florence, nor their dealing with Motown. They may assume to know some "details", but only those three ladies know the entire story.

[jobeterob]

But here's the thing: Those people wern't there! They weren't in on the personal conversations between Diana, Mary and Florence, nor their dealing with Motown. They may assume to know some "details", but only those three ladies know the entire story.

Ya, I think one got called a "hag" on here by somebody recently.

[jobeterob]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htlvHIEYZEI

Here is one Oprah appearance.

[marv2]

But it is true Marv.
You don't LET me go on believing anything. You have no control over me or any other person! I have been created in and for freedom and dignity as much as you or anyone else.
Neither you nor I were in Diana's heart, soul, or person [[nor are we ever in anyone else's). We cannot say that we know how Diana felt in the depth of her being or what she thought either on the day of Flo's dismissal or during the Oprah [[or any) interview. Only she can.
Even if , for a moment or a greater period of time, she may have felt as you suggest, it is clear that she did not allow that feeling to remain with her, to poison and guide her thoughts and words for the rest of her life.
The fact that she has been able to achieve so much personally and professionally speaks to this fact.
In interviews, such as the one floyjoy678 mentions, she demonstrates that human beings can move past past frailties and change their hearts and lives.
This is not an easy lesson to learn. But once learned and embraced, it gives one a greater sense of freedom. One then sees things in a new light and wishes that same gift for others- even those who have hurt them.
I pray that one day you may embrace that gift.

No it is not true! One more time, nothing you wrote in your posting was true other than my name. I don't mean to embarass you, but you are not even in the same city as the truth, let alone on the same block. You are writing fantasy. I wish I could tell how I know, but I do know! You are making shit up and trying to make it sound plausible to the unknowing, but I am one that knows..........

[Jimi LaLumia]

It was on the Oprah show about the pseudo-premes "Return to Love" Tour that Diana Ross stated that Cindy was never really a Supreme.. of course, Cindy had angered Miss Ross by siding with Mary in the Return To Love battle, and I'm sure that helped that comment slip through..in a different circumstance, Mary wilson said that the supremes were really over once Florence was gone, thereby also stating to Cindy wasn't really one of them

[Roberta75]

Some people chose to remember it that way for the pure pleasure of stirring mess. They have nothing else to do with their time...

Very true BayouMotownMan

One in particular makes a mess of every thread they post in.

Roberta

[David J]

It was on the Oprah show about the pseudo-premes "Return to Love" Tour that Diana Ross stated that Cindy was never really a Supreme.. of course, Cindy had angered Miss Ross by siding with Mary in the Return To Love battle, and I'm sure that helped that comment slip through..in a different circumstance, Mary wilson said that the supremes were really over once Florence was gone, thereby also stating to Cindy wasn't really one of them

You are wrong, Diana actually made that statement on her first appearance on Oprah in 1993 [[promoting Secrets of a Sparrow) when Oprah commented that she's never really connected with Cindy after Flo left the Supremes and that's when Diana said she felt that Cindy was never really a Supreme.
Diana never made sort comment during the "Return to Love" interview on Oprah, so it's got nothing to do whether she's got a grudge with Cindy or not.

[marv2]

You are wrong, Diana actually made that statement on her first appearance on Oprah in 1993 [[promoting Secrets of a Sparrow) when Oprah commented that she's never really connected with Cindy after Flo left the Supremes and that's when Diana said she felt that Cindy was never really a Supreme.
Diana never made sort comment during the "Return to Love" interview on Oprah, so it's got nothing to do whether she's got a grudge with Cindy or not.


NO! She made worst![[comments) during RTL on TV. She said that Scherrie Payne and Lynda Laurence had been "Supremes" for over 30 years and that THEY were the ones keeping the legacy alive. She said that knowing that the group disbanded in 1977 and prohibited from continuing with Scherrie, Susaye Greene and Joyce Vincent. She also said it knowing that Mary Wilson was actually the one doing the most to keep the legacy alive. She even tried to lead the uninformed into believing that Scherrie and Lynda have been in the Supremes for 30 consecutive years even going as far as stating that Lynda joined the group in 1971!

[captainjames]

Yes, people would like to dismiss this or ignore it or say it isn't true but fact remains they did remain friends and did stay in touch with one another. Diana does not have to announce these things to the press because she knows in her heart how she felt about Florence and she has nothing to prove. However, I do know for a fact that once "a book" was written Diana did not get upset about what was said about her in the book but what was said about Florence and the secrets that were suppose to remain among them.


Some people seem to forget that Diana and Florence remained friends up until Florence's death.

[marv2]

Yes, people would like to dismiss this or ignore it or say it isn't true but fact remains they did remain friends and did stay in touch with one another. Diana does not have to announce these things to the press because she knows in her heart how she felt about Florence and she has nothing to prove. However, I do know for a fact that once "a book" was written Diana did not get upset about what was said about her in the book but what was said about Florence and the secrets that were suppose to remain among them.

But she said she never read "the book"! Now which is it?

[RossHolloway]

Yes, people would like to dismiss this or ignore it or say it isn't true but fact remains they did remain friends and did stay in touch with one another. Diana does not have to announce these things to the press because she knows in her heart how she felt about Florence and she has nothing to prove. However, I do know for a fact that once "a book" was written Diana did not get upset about what was said about her in the book but what was said about Florence and the secrets that were suppose to remain among them.

That's one of the things I've always loved about Diana Ross, she's always taken the high road. She's never had to trash talk anyone to get ahead or to get a headline.

[smark21]

Unfortunately most of Diana Ross’ interviews aren’t very interesting. I’m not saying she should trash people but she often speaks in clichés or gears the conversation to her children. She’s led an accomplished life and worked some great musicians and artists. I wish she would do an interview in which she could talk about the work in depth.

During her interview for Inside the Actor’s Studio, she did get a chance to talk about her acting roles and that was a good interview. But she also fell back into her Motown interview training when she said Flo left the group to raise her family. Let’s face it, in many respects she was the Motown grooming school’s star pupil and still retains the lessons she learned.

[marv2]

That's one of the things I've always loved about Diana Ross, she's always taken the high road. She's never had to trash talk anyone to get ahead or to get a headline.

She talked enough trash to Barbara Walters that night on ABC's "20/20" in 2000 to sink herself and her RTL tour. She is not immuned.

[ejluther]

She did her interview only in response to Mary's - hate her if you like, but Diana Ross didn't fire back publicly until she'd been hit hard [[and repeatedly) by Mary Wilson...

[jillfoster]

Perhaps one deserves to be hit hard after what she did. She might as well ahve called up Mary and said "Hi Mary!!! My husband just divorced me, and I haven't had a hit in 15 years, so I'm ready to revive my career. So let's get together again and have a Supremes' tour! I know you made 33% when we worked together before, but this time, I can only give you 10%. Are you down with it, old buddy, old pal?"

[marv2]

Perhaps one deserves to be hit hard after what she did. She might as well ahve called up Mary and said "Hi Mary!!! My husband just divorced me, and I haven't had a hit in 15 years, so I'm ready to revive my career. So let's get together again and have a Supremes' tour! I know you made 33% when we worked together before, but this time, I can only give you 10%. Are you down with it, old buddy, old pal?"

That's pretty much how it was in a nutshell. Diane sure has a lot of nerve.

[Jimi LaLumia]

well, in all honesty, Mary Wilson's book had already been around and done it's damage years earlier, so she should consider herself lucky that Miss Ross decided to call up one of her former back up singers at all!!!..LMFAO..if Ross had been smart, she would have had an honesty tour, and gone out on the road with The Andantes backing her up!!!..LOL..

[ejluther]

I still find it amazing they actually split everything 3 ways all those years - did Cindy get an even third, too, or was she on a different pay scale? If it was even thirds, did that equal 3-way split continue after Diana left, too? Of course, as we all know, they were undoubtedly underpaid overall, no matter what share they got...

[RossHolloway]

And the haters are still pressed about Diana Ross after all these years lol. Priceless.

[jobeterob]

And the haters are still pressed about Diana Ross after all these years lol. Priceless.

Priceless, shrill and butt puckered.

[midnightman]

Mary hinted she and Cindy beefed a few times. She said in one recent interview that she "apologized" to Kelly Rowland because "she was caught in the middle" of something that might've had to do with Cindy and Mary. Rumors abound that Cindy Birdsong had called the Rock Hall of Fame and asked why she wasn't inducted with Mary, Florence and Diana when the Supremes were inducted in 1988 [[after Dennis Edwards was inducted with the Temptations in 1989) and it was told to her that Mary wouldn't accept the induction if anyone other than her, Florence and Diana were inducted... Mary herself had always contended that the only "real" Supremes were her, Diana and Florence. Diana in contrast said [[paraphrasingly I should say) "there were nine Supremes and I was one of them!"

[jobeterob]

In defence of Mary Wilson, the Supremes effectively ended when Florence Ballard left and Mary and Cindy became part of the band and background singers; the group didn't even travel together. They were missing from nearly every single.

While people feel for Cindy and think she was treated harshly, logic dictates that if the group "The Supremes" were being inducted into the Hall of Fame, it should be Diana, Mary and Florence.

The kind and generous thing to do would have been to induct all 4. But kindness does not go with the words Beach Boy, Temptations, Beatles or Supremes.

[revvy]

With Florence long gone, why not give the honor to Cindy who helped keep the group going by her unwavering dedication and professionalism?

[Methuselah2]

For the video of the Diana/Oprah interview that discusses the words in question about Florence and Cindy, see Luke's thread DIANA ASKED ABOUT M25. The link is right at the beginning.

[carole cucumber]

No it is not true! One more time, nothing you wrote in your posting was true other than my name. I don't mean to embarass you, but you are not even in the same city as the truth, let alone on the same block. You are writing fantasy. I wish I could tell how I know, but I do know! You are making shit up and trying to make it sound plausible to the unknowing, but I am one that knows..........

I just noticed that you replied to my post once again with some of your favorite colorful language. Forgive me if I choose not to sink to your level.
Obviously I struck a nerve to get that response. Perhaps you have difficulty grasping the concept that people are not one-dimensional , but multi-facted. No one can know another person so well as to claim that they know what is going on in another person's heart nor to comprehend all the surrounding factors and how they interplay in another's personal decisions and choices. I don't know what you CLAIM to know, but unless you CLAIM to be Almighty God Himself, who alone knows the heart, soul & spirit of all He has created, you do not know!
I'm always amazed at how people often utilize a phrase that those who work in fields and matters of national security employ. 'I know , but I can't tell you how I know'. I don't think that anyone reading or posting here would view the subject matter as one of national security.
Many who try to talk their way through a discussion or attempt to buffalo others throw this phrase around quite liberally. Until they back up their words with indisputable proof, they are merely blowing smoke.
And by the way, I am NEVER embarrassed to speak the truth.

[stephanie]

I dont know what the beef is about Marys book. I know she said "Diane had a plan" and little quotes like that but she also praised Diana for all of her hard work in the book AND talked about the beginnings of Motown and the Funk Brothers. I think the only thing the book did was to validate the rumors we heard for years that Flo and Diana were not getting along and that indeed Flo had become a problem [[for whatever reason). I have to give Mary credit a lot of people wouldnt say anything because they wanted to be in the good graces of Berry Gordy. Like someone said above Diana has never defended herself until Mary said certain things but its funny she waited this long. I can understand her not wanting to talk about certain things but she could have expounded on working with HDH in the studio, and the live appearances I was shocked she didnt have more to say about that. Its all about her family and positive thinking. Thats fine but most fans who read books like this want to hear about the early days, life on the road, chart positions and she really glossed over her RCA years that would have been very interesting to hear about. Both of Marys books were good in the sense that we got her point of view whether you agree or not.

[ejluther]

Also, speaking of Oprah, does anyone have a link to video of Diana singing "Only Love Can Conquer All" on Oprah?
Never mind - I found it myself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VN8BVItdNb8&feature=relmfu

[jobeterob]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV7Qcq0g6S8&feature=related