Stop In The Name Of Love

[milven]

I just listened to the original mono 45 version of Stop In The Name Of Love that I bought in 1965. There have been a few threads here stating that no Supreme is on THAT released version except Diana Ross.

Today, we know that there are alternate takes, and re-mixes and erasing original vocals and replacing them with new. Of course I know Diana's and Mary's voice, but when they are all singing together, I wouldn't know if it were Supremes , Andantes, or what. [[And I profess to be a Supremes fan
;)) I always thought that the released hit version in 1965 was SUPREMES with Diana Flo and Mary singing the title in harmony, possibly augmented by other singers.

I don't want to start a new controversy here, but I was just wondering if any conclusion was reached in the various threads that it was indeed Mary and Flo with Diana on the original release.

Thanks

[jobeterob]

Of course there is a conclusion. It is just one that old time fans of the group and side takers in a purported war don't like.

The 50th Anniversary Singles Collection says that 4 days after DMF recorded the song, the Andantes redid it and got the release. And it also says this is revised from the Complete Motown Singles. And it does not say the Andantes were added, which it could have. And you have had George and Andy post on here saying no hurt was intended, no intent to downgrade some Supremes [[and who the hell would really care at this stage beyond 12 fans?), but it was simply a historical correction.

Mary has let all this go. So should the fans that can't accept it.

When I go listen to the song now, I hear it differently. I never would have imagined it was anyone other than Mary and Flo.

[milven]

Thanks . So with all the re-issues and alternate takes, is there a release of the original version with the actual Supremes now? if there is, I probably have it and would like to listen to it along side the released version. One more question. Why was it decided that the Supremes original recording was not good enough for release and had to be redone with Andantes singing along with the lead singer of Supremes?

Again, please know that I am not trying to create any controversy with these questions. I love all the Supremes and have seen all the configurations perform live. Whether they were on the recordings or not takes away nothing from them. I am curious why someone at Motown would release something other than the Supremes when it was already recorded

[ExGuyParis]

Of course there is a conclusion. It is just one that old time fans of the group and side takers in a purported war don't like.

The 50th Anniversary Singles Collection says that 4 days after DMF recorded the song, the Andantes redid it and got the release. And it also says this is revised from the Complete Motown Singles. And it does not say the Andantes were added, which it could have. And you have had George and Andy post on here saying no hurt was intended, no intent to downgrade some Supremes [[and who the hell would really care at this stage beyond 12 fans?), but it was simply a historical correction.

Mary has let all this go. So should the fans that can't accept it.

When I go listen to the song now, I hear it differently. I never would have imagined it was anyone other than Mary and Flo.


LOL @ "who the hell cares beyond 12 fans"!

The liner notes to the expanded "More Hits" CD says "January 5 1965: Stop! In the Name of Love" is cut by the Supremes. The girls dub in their vocals on January 7 and again on January 11 with help from the Andantes. The latter becomes the released version."

At least I can be certain of one thing. For the many times I saw F, M, & D perform, it was F, M, and D singing [[and later C, M, & D).

[jobeterob]

OK, well then 128 fans care.

But there is a version on the Supremes Boxset, the dark pink set, that very clearly has Florence in the background. The sound is much like the sound on Nothing But Heartaches, Manhattan, You Keep Me Hanging On etc.

And it is very clearly different than the single.

And to many people, perhaps better.

[franjoy56]

The difference is that on the relesased version their is another voice or two that is mixed in making it sound different than the 1st version. three or four vocals on the bkg of the released version as opposed to two voices on the demo version both versions have Mary & Flo one released version has the Andante [[s) added in.

[jobeterob]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNNxeovdN5U

[nathanj06]

Now that is funny jobeterob.

[marv2]

I like this one much better. Mary, Flo and Diane singing "Stop In the Name of Love"..........................from the record!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7t_l2rws-8

[jobeterob]

nathanj06

Posts:1,674Now that is funny jobeterob.

We all have to believe what we want to believe. It truly makes little difference but it is an interesting topic to Motown fans that know the history.

But we can't convince each other and we only believe whatever gets us through the night.

When you listen to Florence singing behind Diana on the version on the Pink Box Set, you know that the people singing behind Diana on the 45 do not include Florence Ballard.

The only reason this was ever raised by the producers of the newest singles set was to clarify the historical record for the fans.

And it is obvious that in some quarters, it wasn't welcome news.

Interesting that Mary Wilson doesn't appear to care and I'm sure she received the newest set.

[franjoy56]

Not. If that is not Flo and Mary with whoever is helping they must want to be Supremes very badly, I hear the Flo Ballard voice very clearly on this version Marv, just threw in from the acapella set,
Thank you very much. And both versions with Flo and Mary and whoever is helping gets me through the night. Why would they replace Flo and Mary when they sang on the other four numbers one from wdolg thru bimaa.

[marv2]

Not. If that is not Flo and Mary with whoever is helping they must want to be Supremes very badly, I hear the Flo Ballard voice very clearly on this version Marv, just threw in from the acapella set,
Thank you very much. And both versions with Flo and Mary and whoever is helping gets me through the night. Why would they replace Flo and Mary when they sang on the other four numbers one from wdolg thru bimaa.


That's the whole point. They would not replace them, the sound was still very critical at that point. Some people just want to be stupid.

[antceleb12]

Some people just want to be stupid.

That's uncalled for. I don't believe that it's just Mary and Flo on the released version, but that doesn't make me "stupid." And I don't think that you are stupid because you disagree. And that's all I'll say about that.

[marv2]

That's uncalled for. I don't believe that it's just Mary and Flo on the released version, but that doesn't make me "stupid." And I don't think that you are stupid because you disagree. And that's all I'll say about that.

I was not talking about you. That would be impossible since this is the first and only time you posted in this thread.

[smark21]

Not. If that is not Flo and Mary with whoever is helping they must want to be Supremes very badly, I hear the Flo Ballard voice very clearly on this version Marv, just threw in from the acapella set,
Thank you very much. And both versions with Flo and Mary and whoever is helping gets me through the night. Why would they replace Flo and Mary when they sang on the other four numbers one from wdolg thru bimaa.

Maybe because integrity was not a high priority at Motown?

[144man]

Not. If that is not Flo and Mary with whoever is helping they must want to be Supremes very badly, I hear the Flo Ballard voice very clearly on this version Marv, just threw in from the acapella set,
Thank you very much. And both versions with Flo and Mary and whoever is helping gets me through the night. Why would they replace Flo and Mary when they sang on the other four numbers one from wdolg thru bimaa.

Maybe the answer is simply that they did things like that then, and didn't think it was a big deal.

[luke]

Well Mary and Flo thought it was a big deal, as do many fans.

[jobeterob]

Well Mary and Flo thought it was a big deal, as do many fans.

I would not be so sure Mary thinks its a big deal or cares. She gets all the new releases sent to her by the producers and Motown. She knows what the liner notes say. She advertises many of these sets on her website. And she hasn't said she is angered by any of the revelations. Perhaps because it is no surprise to her anymore.

I notice she is advertising Motown the Musical too!

When you next go to Burger King, ask the person in line in front of you if they like Mary & Flo on Stop in the Name of Love or if they think it's the Andantes? They'll either look at you like your nuts or perhaps give you a bop on the nose.

[floyjoy678]

I'm a big Supremes fan especially of the original group but nowadays I really could care less who is on a song, I like all those songs regardless of who's singing in the background. I think when I first heard years ago that the Andantes did the backgrounds on the Xmas album instead of Mary and Flo I was disappointed yet deep down I always was kinda suspicious about those backgrounds. And the same goes for Stop in the name of love and in fact I asked one of the Andantes[[either Marlene or Louvaine I forget) myself about 7 or 8 years ago in a yahoo chat group if they were on the song and she said yes. I don't know how someone can listen to that acapella version and tell me that it's only 2 voices their hearing in the background. I find it very interesting the whole thing so I don't get mad or upset. What can you do? Have Mary go back into the studio and add her voice on those songs? What's done is done. I'm interested to see if the liner notes of the "I Hear A Symphony" album says anything about the Andantes on those songs, there's a few songs on that album that I'm pretty sure are not Mary and Flo.

[jobeterob]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJKuudP6-rs

Here is the alternate version of Stop in the Name of Love from the 2000 Box Set with Florence Ballard so clearly in the background.

[luke]

And remember Flo got the Andantes kicked off of You Cant Hurry Love. Now lazy ol Mary and Flo showed up for that and did pretty good Id say lol.

[ivyfield]

Really... We were ALL duped! I always loved the Supremes but when Jean took over in 1970 I realised I truly LOVED the Supremes. Little did I know back then that most of 'Right On' and every other release until 'Jimmy Webb' [[Because Lynda and Mary are on every cut of that album) was just Jean and some terrific background vocalists with an occasional 'sprinkling' of M&C. Who cares? It all sounded Supreme to me. I think some things are better left unsaid.

[skooldem1]

Why is there so much controversy regarding "Stop in the name"? Hasn't it been established that there are a few recorded versions of this song? Some with Flo and Mary and at least one that is not? Also, I thought Flo wasn't on "You can't hurry love".

[floyjoy678]

And remember Flo got the Andantes kicked off of You Cant Hurry Love. Now lazy ol Mary and Flo showed up for that and did pretty good Id say lol.

Luke that was "The Happening" not "You Can't Hurry Love". And I assume maybe Flo had had enough by that point from "Stop!" and "You Can't Hurry Love" and finally decided to do something about it.

[marybrewster]

Can someone please simplify?

From what I am reading, the released version of "Stop!" [[the version that we hear on the radio, etc.) features Diana ONLY, no other Supremes?

Or is it that it features Diana, Flo, Mary and the Andantes?

[TYK1986]

I love the stop in the name of love medley with baby love and come see about me on the lost and found CD. That version has Flo and Mary for sure on the background. Only problem is that they dont sing the whole song but in my opinion it's better than the released version.

[jobeterob]

The released 45 is Diana and the Andantes.

[marv2]

Can someone please simplify?

From what I am reading, the released version of "Stop!" [[the version that we hear on the radio, etc.) features Diana ONLY, no other Supremes?

Or is it that it features Diana, Flo, Mary and the Andantes?

It features Diane, Mary and Flo. I don't know about the Andantes or one of them backing the Supremes.

[Motown4Ever518]

I would not be so sure Mary thinks its a big deal or cares. She gets all the new releases sent to her by the producers and Motown. She knows what the liner notes say. She advertises many of these sets on her website. And she hasn't said she is angered by any of the revelations. Perhaps because it is no surprise to her anymore.



I notice she is advertising Motown the Musical too!

When you next go to Burger King, ask the person in line in front of you if they like Mary & Flo on Stop in the Name of Love or if they think it's the Andantes? They'll either look at you like your nuts or perhaps give you a bop on the nose.

Jobeterob, I love the Burger King scenario. IMO I liked the songs, now that I know or think I know who was on what song or not on what song it does not take away from the fact that I like the songs. As a drummer, when I first started reading about Motown , perhaps in the mid to late 70's one would have you believe that Benny Benjaman was the primary drummer in the studio a la double J on bass. At one time that may have been the case, but the styles of Pistol and Uriel became apparent after really listening, and subsequently there are others who played on the tracks as well. I like Benny, but again , I like the songs.

[marv2]

Really... We were ALL duped! I always loved the Supremes but when Jean took over in 1970 I realised I truly LOVED the Supremes. Little did I know back then that most of 'Right On' and every other release until 'Jimmy Webb' [[Because Lynda and Mary are on every cut of that album) was just Jean and some terrific background vocalists with an occasional 'sprinkling' of M&C. Who cares? It all sounded Supreme to me. I think some things are better left unsaid.

That is not true. Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong are on every single that was released with Jean Terrell on lead. On classic hits such as "Up the Ladder to the Roof" and "Stoned Love" it is only those three on the recordings.

[franjoy56]

That is not true. Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong are on every single that was released with Jean Terrell on lead. On classic hits such as "Up the Ladder to the Roof" and "Stoned Love" it is only those three on the recordings.

and here are a few more Mary and Cindy tracks for the 70's Supremes
that we know they are on:

Together we can make such sweet music
Then I met you
It Time to break Down.
Everybodys got the right to love
The Lovin Country
But I love you more
Over and Over [[with the A's)
Now The Bitter Now the Sweet [[with the A's)
Love It Came to me this time.
Bridge over troubled Water.
Na Na Hey Kiss Him Goodbye.
Floy Joy.
Have I lost You. & Here Comes the Sunrise [[with Sherlie Matthews)
Nathan Jones. [[ooooh Nathan)
Come Together
Is there a place in his Heart for me.

[franjoy56]

and hear are some great tracks that we no are Mary & Flo backing Diana Ross from the 60's
"Long Gone Lover" [[with a Flo Ballard outro lead)
A Breath Taking Guy [[with Mary and Flo getting solo lines at the chorus
"He's My Honey Boy"
"Going Down for the Third Time"
Mother You Smother You
Nothing But Heartaches
Come See About Me,
Whisper You love me
Back In My Arms Again
The Only Time I'm Happy
Ask Any Girl
I'll turn to Stone
This Can't Be Love
Lover
Manhattan
My Heart Stood Still
A Lovers Concerto
He's All I got
The Man with the Rock and Roll Banjo Band [[Diana & Flo unison)
Sunset [[Diana & Mary leads) just to name a few.

[144man]

Well Mary and Flo thought it was a big deal, as do many fans.

Yes, but, as I've said before on this forum, the past is a different country and it's pointless trying to impose today's morality onto yesteryears.

[marybrewster]

Why is there so much controversy regarding "Stop in the name"? Hasn't it been established that there are a few recorded versions of this song? Some with Flo and Mary and at least one that is not? Also, I thought Flo wasn't on "You can't hurry love".

Cheers to that.

Where are the threads on "The Composer" and "No Matter What Sign You Are" and "I'm Living In Shame" and "Someday We'll Be Together"?

[stingbeelee]

Regarding Stop in the Name of Love:
Let's say that the recording is going into the Grammy hall of fame, the Smithsonian, or you are selling an original acetate to Pawn Stars. Both Jobeterob and I come in with our respective acetates or original copies. The first thing these people will ask us is DO WE HAVE PROOF THAT THIS IS THE ORIGINAL, AND WHO SANG ON IT.
Jobeterob then pulls out the Supremes 50th anniversary and points out that the compilers say that the Andantes are on the released version. I then present all of the logs, recording session notes, session logbooks, index cards, records from the Motown library and they all say the same thing about who was on all of the recordings: Diana, Mary, Flo and one of the Andantes.
Who do you think these people would believe? Of course, they would believe the 1965 documentation. THIS IS PROOF. THIS IS FACT.
Every time someone starts a forum on the Supremes background on any record, Jobeterob always inserts something to the effect that Mary and Flo didn't sing on Stop! and to Mary it doesn't matter. Jobeterobs consistent writing regarding Mary follows a pattern; it is underhanded in a sly sort of way.
Also, I believe that this is an underhanded way to take away the Supremes and Motown's legacy. You read reviews and articles and hear documentaries abouts 60's music and Motown is presented as almost throwaway records, as if African-Americans practically stumbled into making records, as if it is impossible for African Americans to do this, THEY HAD TO HAVE significant help from white people; the mafia, liberals, corporate backers [[take your pick).
Just saw a documentary on girl groups. It was stated that what swept all of the girl groups away was the British Invasion which was the "new sound". Motown wasn't even mentioned. I could go on and on, but this reply is already too long.
Until I see facts [[real facts, not opinions), then I am going with the Proof which was written by the people who were there in 1965: On Stop in the Name of Love, the singers are Flo, Mary, Diana and one of the Andantes [[either Marlene or Jackie).

[Methuselah2]

Perhaps some of you feel like me. Since 1964, I've loved The Supremes--Diana, Mary, & Florence--as a group and as individuals. Each, to me, was very important to their recordings. It saddens me that Motown may not have felt the same way. There's nothing to be done about it at this point, certainly. But the personnel on those recordings makes a difference. And that it didn't make a difference to some at Motown is painful to now learn--particularly, I would imagine, to group members who weren't always included. Was Motown's "Sound of Young America" really just a sound to be cranked out and marketed under any pretext?

[marv2]

[QUOTE=stingbeelee;125652] Jobeterobs consistent writing regarding Mary follows a pattern; it is underhanded in a sly sort of way.
QUOTE]

I am glad that someone else figured this out. Jobeterob always does this. I recognize this years ago about him.

[RossHolloway]

Hasn't this dead horse been beaten enough?

[carole cucumber]

[QUOTE=stingbeelee;125652]Regarding Stop in the Name of Love:
Let's say that the recording is going into the Grammy hall of fame, the Smithsonian, or you are selling an original acetate to Pawn Stars. Both Jobeterob and I come in with our respective acetates or original copies. The first thing these people will ask us is DO WE HAVE PROOF THAT THIS IS THE ORIGINAL, AND WHO SANG ON IT.
Jobeterob then pulls out the Supremes 50th anniversary and points out that the compilers say that the Andantes are on the released version. I then present all of the logs, recording session notes, session logbooks, index cards, records from the Motown library and they all say the same thing about who was on all of the recordings: Diana, Mary, Flo and one of the Andantes.
Who do you think these people would believe? Of course, they would believe the 1965 documentation. THIS IS PROOF. THIS IS FACT.

People might believe, but that wouldn't necessarily be fact or proof of who's on which recording. You DON'T have ALL of the logs, recording session notes, session logbooks, index cards from the Motown library to be able to say that they all say the same thing. You also don't have access to the original master tapes to play them back and to isolate the various tracks of each version to take a closer listen. People such as Harry Weinger, Andy Skurow, and George Solomon do.
My bet is that the logs/session notes, don't say 'and one of the Andantes'. I wouldn't be surprised if neither version that has been debated several times lists the Andantes. I suspect that in playing back the master tape to both versions and isolating the background vocals , one could hear an immediate difference. I've played the cd versions in question back to back and hear a tremendous difference in the background voices in the Jan 7 and Jan 11 recordings. [[And remember it had been reported that on hearing 'Forever Came Today' Flo believed that she was in the background. Obviously one of the Andantes was able to imitate her tones enough that Flo was fooled)
Songs that we used to believe featured the actual Supremes in the background from 'Forever Came Today' through 'Someday We'll Be Together' may not even list the names of the background singers in the logs.
Back then we had no reason not to believe that the names on the label were the voices we were hearing. Revelation came when people such as Mary Wilson and Cindy Birdsong decided to speak out decades later. That's why there's still discussion over who the actual voices are with Diana are on 'Someday We'll Be Together'. Maxine & Julia Waters have been officially listed but some others have also claimed to be in the background .

[marv2]

stingbeelee you nailed it! I am in 100% agreement! I believe my ears and those people that were actually there at those sessions. That is why I know that on "Stop In the Name of Love" [[the hit version) it is Diana Ross on lead, strongly supported by Florence Ballard, Mary Wilson and perhaps some other girl backing the Supremes for a fuller sound. Anything else or any other "theories" is just wasting my time.

[carole cucumber]

[QUOTE=marv2;125695] I believe my ears and those people that were actually there at those sessions.

I'm curious... who do you know that was actually at the Jan. 5, Jan. 7 & Jan. 11 sessions? Have they put their recollections on paper or on the internet? I'm sure that I'm not the only one at SDF who'd like to read them.
I was surprised to see that even Mary Wilson makes no mention in "Dreamgirl" of any recording date for 'Stop In The Name Of Love' other than Jan. 5, the date the band track was recorded. Session logs obviously show vocals recorded at the subsequent 2 sessions. I can't recall ever reading or hearing that Flo mentioned any specifics for the vocal recording dates of 'Stop In the Name Of Love' either
Wouldn't it be wild if Berry Gordy who mixed both versions [[even though Brian Holland and Lamont Dozier produced both) decided to give Diana Ross an extra-special [and somewhat secretive] 21st birthday present. A single on which Diana was the sole Supreme and to which the background vocals of Supreme-sound-alikes [[the Andantes) were added. The single did hit #1 on the pop chart very near March 26, 1965- Diana's 21st birthday.
If that was the case, only Berry & Diana would have known at the time. As we've come to find out over the years, with Motown anything was possible.

[luke]

Well said stingbeelee. It is quite obvious what some peoples' intentions are. And to dismiss Cindy and Mary from much of the 70s recordings flies in the face of reality. Frank WIlson loved their voices and Smokey put Mary more out in front in the 70s. The BLOSSOMS are all over Jimmy Webb.

[marv2]

[QUOTE=marv2;125695] I believe my ears and those people that were actually there at those sessions.

I'm curious... who do you know that was actually at the Jan. 5, Jan. 7 & Jan. 11 sessions? Have they put their recollections on paper or on the internet? I'm sure that I'm not the only one at SDF who'd like to read them.
I was surprised to see that even Mary Wilson makes no mention in "Dreamgirl" of any recording date for 'Stop In The Name Of Love' other than Jan. 5, the date the band track was recorded. Session logs obviously show vocals recorded at the subsequent 2 sessions. I can't recall ever reading or hearing that Flo mentioned any specifics for the vocal recording dates of 'Stop In the Name Of Love' either
Wouldn't it be wild if Berry Gordy who mixed both versions [[even though Brian Holland and Lamont Dozier produced both) decided to give Diana Ross an extra-special [and somewhat secretive] 21st birthday present. A single on which Diana was the sole Supreme and to which the background vocals of Supreme-sound-alikes [[the Andantes) were added. The single did hit #1 on the pop chart very near March 26, 1965- Diana's 21st birthday.
If that was the case, only Berry & Diana would have known at the time. As we've come to find out over the years, with Motown anything was possible.

As I said just above, any other "theories" are just a waste of my time! Next.......
It was Diane Mary and Flo on that and most of all the other records put out by "The Supremes" accept it and move on.

[carole cucumber]

[QUOTE=carole cucumber;125700]

As I said just above, any other "theories" are just a waste of my time! Next.......
It was Diane Mary and Flo on that and most of all the other records put out by "The Supremes" accept it and move on.

I'm always amazed at how people contradict themselves with statements like 'It's a waste
of my time' only to not only take the time to read a post but then respond to it- proving that it obviously wasn't a waste of time after all.

[franjoy56]

[QUOTE=marv2;125713]

I'm always amazed at how people contradict themselves with statements like 'It's a waste
of my time' only to not only take the time to read a post but then respond to it- proving that it obviously wasn't a waste of time after all.

stingbeebee said it best, and what you are saying is going through my one ear and out the other, Stop In The Name of Love belongs to Diana, Mary, Flo, and whoever claims to have been added to the track, that song is one of the most sung by the trio on stage as well I don't think that song was ever left out of the act when it was performed on stage by all Supremes through their demise.

[TheMotownManiac]

yes
it was often in

[jobeterob]

Excellent research and post Carole Cucumber.

It is interesting to research this and read the debate although most is just emotional talk.

In the end, the girls still made it a good show when they did Stop.

I notice the sound on Any Girl In Love is very similar to the sound on Stop in the Name of Love and not like the sound of Florence Ballard on the Box Set when she participates on Stop in the Name of Love.

[floyjoy678]

Excellent research and post Carole Cucumber.

It is interesting to research this and read the debate although most is just emotional talk.

In the end, the girls still made it a good show when they did Stop.

I notice the sound on Any Girl In Love is very similar to the sound on Stop in the Name of Love and not like the sound of Florence Ballard on the Box Set when she participates on Stop in the Name of Love.

So in conclusion is it: Diana and the Andantes....Diana, Mary and Flo....Diana, Mary, Flo and an Andante....or [[my opinion) Diana, Mary, Flo and the Andantes?

[stingbeelee]

Hi to Carole Cucumber; thanks for your well-thought-out and thoughful rebuttal to me regarding Stop! In the name of Love. This is what I like about this forum, people can debate about subjects in a spirited and analytical way without name calling and bashing each other. I looked back to the past forums about this subject and came upon Andy's and George's entries on past forums. Andy stated on 12/27/11:

" Stop! In The Name Of Love is the latest hot topic, so I’ll acknowledge it here. Listen to the alternate from disc 2 of More Hits, also in a different mix on the box set. Now listen to the live versions on At The Copa, or the video from the Hollywood Palace. They are all consistent. Now listen to the released “hit” version. The voice you are hearing, is Jackie Hicks. Go back to McNair’s Fancy Passes, you’ll hear Jackie there. You’ll hear her on Run Run Run. But you’ll also hear her clearly on Ask The Lonely by the Four Tops, I Heard It Through The Grapevine by Marvin Gaye and dozens of other non-Supremes songs"

I guess this means that Jackie was on Stop! by herself, or that she is singing with Mary and Flo, or that you can distinguish her voice from Marlene's and Louvains? To me, the statement is inconclusive.

Also, George stated on 02/24/12:
There was no reason to pull the multitrack tapes for The Complete Motown Singles or Diana Ross & The Supremes Singles Collection. We used only original mixes and the multitracks are only necessary for remixing a song. We were working on More Hits By The Supremes and The Singles Collection at the same time and were doing new mixes of several songs for More Hits. That is when we discovered some new information about back up vocals and after much deliberation adjusted the liner notes to both collections.

I am not sure, but I think the original mix was 3 track? If so, then isn't it much more difficult to isolate the background vocals, especially if they are tracked with the lead, one clue to this is the Motown Kareoke version of Stop!; apparently not all of the background vocals could be extracted; as the backing vocals during the lead part are not there.

Also, there must be notes, indexs and session logs somewhere; didn't the union keep close tabs on Motown to make sure they wrote down all of the personnel on the sessions?

In conclusion Carole, I believe, thru my hearing, that it is Flo, Mary and Jackie singing on the released version of Stop! It is, to me, a fasinating debate.

[RossHolloway]

Maybe we should be asking these questions to HDH. I bet they could shed some light on this dead horse.

[marv2]

I would not be so sure Mary thinks its a big deal or cares. She gets all the new releases sent to her by the producers and Motown. She knows what the liner notes say. She advertises many of these sets on her website. And she hasn't said she is angered by any of the revelations. Perhaps because it is no surprise to her anymore.

I notice she is advertising Motown the Musical too!

When you next go to Burger King, ask the person in line in front of you if they like Mary & Flo on Stop in the Name of Love or if they think it's the Andantes? They'll either look at you like your nuts or perhaps give you a bop on the nose.

No! I am looking at your post like you're nuts. Why would anyone ask a 16 or 17 year old kid working at Burger King in 2012 about a 47 year old record? Geez! LOL!

[jobeterob]

Exactly Marv! Yet this is the kind of tripe and deranged logic that you spout at posts by all of us in support of some line to the effect that Mary Wilson had as many hits as Aretha and Diana, that she sold as many records, that her voice was as well known bla bla bla.

And while many of us like Mary as we like all the Supremes, we dont do it at the expense and the constant picking at other former Supremes; for you, it is the constant Dianapic and Lyndapic which has turned you into a Marvharp! And we are also pleased to hear other opinions which are not.

[midnightman]

Brian, Eddie and Lamont should be asked this question. When I hear it, I hear three voices: Mary, Flo and ONE of the Andantes. Motown had a habit of adding another background singer if they felt the original version lacked something in the background, HDH probably thought the song was lacking something so they added either Jackie, Marlene or Louvain. I don't know who was the strongest vocalist in the Andantes so I'm gonna have to go with Jackie being on there with Mary and Flo while Diana carried it. The original version had extra vocals from Diana that was recut too. This was a Motown pattern. The Supremes weren't special snowflakes in this.

[jobeterob]

Good question for HDH.

I noticed they did lengthy interviews for the Invictus Story on Youtube.

I also notice they had Mary Wilson on one of the parts of the Invictus story and she was analyzing why the Supremes were successful and she says something like "and Diane's voice".

[jobeterob]

One of the Andantes sounded an awful lot like Florence Ballard; songs like Any Girl In Love and Stop in the Name of Love, for me, would have always been Supremes because of that similarity in sound. I would never have questioned it.

[BayouMotownMan]

One of the Andantes sounded an awful lot like Florence Ballard; songs like Any Girl In Love and Stop in the Name of Love, for me, would have always been Supremes because of that similarity in sound. I would never have questioned it.

That would be Marlene Barrow. She and Flo sang in the same key, but Flo had a way of hitting her syllables that gave her voice a uniqueness. I don't know about the entire song but clearly Florence is on the opening verse of Stop

[bradsupremes]

That would be Marlene Barrow. She and Flo sang in the same key, but Flo had a way of hitting her syllables that gave her voice a uniqueness. I don't know about the entire song but clearly Florence is on the opening verse of Stop

I think lot of people get the Andantes' voices mixed up and confused. Louvain Demps was a first soprano. She's that beautiful voice that shines through on "Love Child" and most of the Four Tops' hits. Marlene Barrow was also a soprano, but sang in the middle during harmony. She's the one singing the intro on P.J.'s "T.L.C. [[Tender Lovin' Care)" and singing along with Mary on "You Can't Hurry Love" and "Misery Makes Its Home In My Heart." Jackie Hicks was the bottom of the harmony. Some say she was an alto, but I think she was a contralto because some people got her voice confused with a man's. I think she could sing deeper than most altos could sing.

The Andantes had a great blend so sometimes it's very hard to separate their voices and tell which individual lady's timbre and tone sounds like. When it comes to "Stop! In The Name of Love," I think people are mistaking the higher register voice [[Marlene/Louvain) for Florence, but are also mistaking the deeper voice [[Jackie) for Florence's deeper register as well. For the longest time people thought Marlene's timbre resembled that of Mary's. [[Example - Take a listen to the background vocals in "You Gave Me Love" especially when they sing "I'm like a child." There's one girl who sounds just like Mary.)

When it was first reported years ago that "Stop! In The Name of Love" featured Mary, Florence, and Marlene on background vocals, I wasn't so sure that was Marlene singing with the ladies. To me, there was a deep voice in there who was not Mary's or Florence's or Marlene's. I always assumed it was Jackie Hicks and my assumption was right. It's the Andantes in there, but I can see why some people feel they hear Mary and Florence. It certainly sounds like them, but remember that the Andantes would do their best to imitate Mary's and Florence's sound. I have been training my ears in determining the differences between the Andantes and Mary/Flo & Mary/Cindy and I can tell you those '64-'66 recordings can get VERY confusing.

[rod_rick]

I think lot of people get the Andantes' voices mixed up and confused. Louvain Demps was a first soprano. She's that beautiful voice that shines through on "Love Child" and most of the Four Tops' hits. Marlene Barrow was also a soprano, but sang in the middle during harmony. She's the one singing the intro on P.J.'s "T.L.C. [[Tender Lovin' Care)" and singing along with Mary on "You Can't Hurry Love" and "Misery Makes Its Home In My Heart." Jackie Hicks was the bottom of the harmony. Some say she was an alto, but I think she was a contralto because some people got her voice confused with a man's. I think she could sing deeper than most altos could sing.

The Andantes had a great blend so sometimes it's very hard to separate their voices and tell which individual lady's timbre and tone sounds like. When it comes to "Stop! In The Name of Love," I think people are mistaking the higher register voice [[Marlene/Louvain) for Florence, but are also mistaking the deeper voice [[Jackie) for Florence's deeper register as well. For the longest time people thought Marlene's timbre resembled that of Mary's. [[Example - Take a listen to the background vocals in "You Gave Me Love" especially when they sing "I'm like a child." There's one girl who sounds just like Mary.)

When it was first reported years ago that "Stop! In The Name of Love" featured Mary, Florence, and Marlene on background vocals, I wasn't so sure that was Marlene singing with the ladies. To me, there was a deep voice in there who was not Mary's or Florence's or Marlene's. I always assumed it was Jackie Hicks and my assumption was right. It's the Andantes in there, but I can see why some people feel they hear Mary and Florence. It certainly sounds like them, but remember that the Andantes would do their best to imitate Mary's and Florence's sound. I have been training my ears in determining the differences between the Andantes and Mary/Flo & Mary/Cindy and I can tell you those '64-'66 recordings can get VERY confusing.

Brad I know what you mean and after listening to the Live At The Roostertail, it's even worse because Florence voice was changing imo. She hit her high notes differently than she did on the At The Copa. In fact Flo and Cindy sound the same in portions of songs like More and I Hear A Symphony [[live version)