Why did Valerie Simpson Record Solo and Only Solo LPs at Motown? Why Did Nick Not?

[Boogiedown]

So they are this duo hired as a team at Motown in the sixties to write songs and produce. Yet when it comes time to record, Valerie puts out two LPs in her name only [Nick does not, nor do the two record any in tandem].
Then as soon as they leave Motown they are from then on a recording duo.

This strikes me as bizarre. Must be something to it.

Has Valerie Simpson ever written her memoirs [don't think so] ....and is there a chance for it to happen?

[kenneth]

Great questions all. I hope some of the experts on this site can give us some insight.

[reese]

So they are this duo hired as a team at Motown in the sixties to write songs and produce. Yet when it comes time to record, Valerie puts out two LPs in her name only [Nick does not, nor do the two record any in tandem].
Then as soon as they leave Motown they are from then on a recording duo.

This strikes me as bizarre. Must be something to it.

Has Valerie Simpson ever written her memoirs [don't think so] ....and is there a chance for it to happen?

The two actually did record an album for Motown but it was never released. I have no idea why but I wouldn't be surprised if the label wasn't really interested in Nick as a vocalist.

[Boogiedown]

The two actually did record an album for Motown but it was never released. I have no idea why but I wouldn't be surprised if the label wasn't really interested in Nick as a vocalist.

But are you saying that they were interested in Valerie as a vocalist? Two albums. Or, were there some negotiations going on here?

That duo's album must have really been terrible if they chose not to release it, preferring her solo ones that sank like rocks.


Kenneth: Great questions all. I hope some of the experts on this site can give us some insight.

Yes, let's see who here might know some things...:cool:

[Graham Jarvis]

Valerie had a few 45's for Motown but never issued all 5 of them, The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 11B: 1971 [Disc 2] & The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 12B: 1972

There was two other unissued songs [I have them both] One : You ain't livin' till your lovin' [I think they came out in 2019?]

Her two albums 1971 & 72 never issued either until 2015 from memory?

[jack020]

I know its not Motown but I just found out she released a third solo album in 2012:

https://www.discogs.com/release/5216455-Valerie-Simpson-Dinosaurs-Are-Coming-Back-Again

https://i.discogs.com/MKPeWRtshC8qENafR8a272u9cAuWx6hV9UDcNwFCZio/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:534/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTUyMTY0/NTUtMTUzNjkxNzc0/NS05NDYzLmpwZWc.jpeg
https://i.discogs.com/rxjkCf5Aqsa0jyEG6gNKYYt2GCAVeO5O6BgQEftQLk8/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:535/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTUyMTY0/NTUtMTUzNjkxNzc0/NS01MTY1LmpwZWc.jpeg

[mysterysinger]

Valerie had a few 45's for Motown but never issued all 5 of them, The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 11B: 1971 [Disc 2] & The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 12B: 1972

There was two other unissued songs [I have them both] One : You ain't livin' till your lovin' [I think they came out in 2019?]

Her two albums 1971 & 72 never issued either until 2015 from memory?


Hard to make sense of the above. Her two Tamla albums - "Exposed" from 1971 and "Valerie Simpson" from 1972 were definitely released at the time. All the tracks have also since been released on CD more than once.

The following Tamla singles are listed in 45Cat

Tamla T54204F
A: Can't It Wait Until Tomorrow
B: Back To Nowhere

Tamla T54224F
A: Silly Wasn't I
B: I Believe I'm Gonna Take This Ride

Tamla T54231F
A: Silly Wasn't I
B: I Believe I'm Gonna Take This Ride

[[There is also a bootleg 45 shown
T54231F
A: Sinner Man [[Don't Let Him Catch You)
B: I Just Wanna Be There)

Valerie also had at least 2 tracks in the Motown Unreleased series:
1967 "Love Woke Me Up This Morning [[First Version)"
1969 "You Ain't Livin' Till You're Lovin' "

Plus her demo of "Remember Me" which was on the Expanded Version of Diana's "Surrender".

As to why Motown refused to issue the Ashford and Simpson duet album - which seemed to be a collection of them singing their most famous songs recorded by other artists - I'm not sure either. They left Motown in 1973 - partly over none release of that album and poor promotion on Val's solo work. They certainly came into their own post Motown.

CDs of Val's solo Motown work -

THE BEST OF VALERIE SIMPSON
https://www.discogs.com/master/1203306-Valerie-Simpson-Best-Of-Valerie-Simpson

THE COLLECTION [[SPECTRUM)
https://www.discogs.com/release/3373994-Valerie-Simpson-The-Collection

EXPOSED / VALERIE SIMPSON [[CAROLINE)
https://www.discogs.com/release/7073373-Valerie-Simpson-Exposed-Valerie-Simpson

[reese]

But are you saying that they were interested in Valerie as a vocalist? Two albums. Or, were there some negotiations going on here?

That duo's album must have really been terrible if they chose not to release it, preferring her solo ones that sank like rocks.

Again, I'm only speculating. I assume there was some interest in Valerie because they actually released two albums on her. Plus Diana Ross even wrote the liner notes for the EXPOSED set.

[BayouMotownMan]

Nick and Val's plan was the launch Valerie as a soloist. If you look back to that period there just weren't that many successful "duo" acts. Sonny and Cher were probably the only ones. Also, Nick had taken on more of a business role working with other producers at Motown like Frank Wilson and he was more interested in behind the scenes activities. This was the opinion I had of why Val went solo, despite the fact that Nick was an outstanding singer in his own right. Perhaps after establishing Valerie they considered performing as a duo and as someone said an entire lp is in the vaults. Berry Gordy was fond of A&S but they were pissed that Val's career didn't take off. Gordy had gone hollywood, moving the company to LA and concentrating more on movies than music.

[Boogiedown]

Again, I'm only speculating. I assume there was some interest in Valerie because they actually released two albums on her. Plus Diana Ross even wrote the liner notes for the EXPOSED set.

That's why I'm wondering was there real interest in her work by Motown? Or were they just obliging them to keep them happy and in the fold.
So wow, Diana Ross writes the liner notes [or at the very least is credited :p] *Had she ever done that before [or since?] ....maybe for the J5?
My guess would be Valerie asked it of her ....based on nothing though.

I'll seek out those liner notes.

Added:
OK Diana's handwritten note [Ross experts: Is that her actual writing?] is most prominent on the back cover , bigger than the rest of the info there. Beautiful handwriting, but I can't make out what it says reading it at discogs.

The poster there has gone out of the way to point out a symbol etched in the record's run-out grooves. Anyone know what it is??

[jsmith]

There were very many successful male / female duet soul tracks released in the 60's & 70's. Marvin & all his ladies; Jerry Butler & Brenda Lee Eager; Roberta Flack & Donny Hathaway; Etta & Harvey, Inez & Charlie Foxx, all the Stax couplings -- Otis & Carla, William Bell & Judy Clay, Eddie Floyd & Mavis Staples; Ike & Tina, Peaches & Herbs ... I COULD GO ON but what's the point.

[Sotosound]

There were very many successful male / female duet soul tracks released in the 60's & 70's. Marvin & all his ladies; Jerry Butler & Brenda Lee Eager; Roberta Flack & Donny Hathaway; Etta & Harvey, Inez & Charlie Foxx, all the Stax couplings -- Otis & Carla, William Bell & Judy Clay, Eddie Floyd & Mavis Staples; Ike & Tina, Peaches & Herbs ... I COULD GO ON but what's the point.
But very few that had more than one or two hits.

TBH, I'm not a big fan of Nick Ashford's singing voice. To my ears, it's ok but not outstanding.

IMO Valerie Simpson, however, is a classy and hugely underrated singer, as well as a consummate composer and musician. Her talent and passion ooze out of the music that she creates.

[bradsupremes]

TBH, I'm not a big fan of Nick Ashford's singing voice. To my ears, it's ok but not outstanding.

I agree - Nick was a decent singer, but he was no way outstanding. I think that's part of the reason why their Nick & Val album wasn't released. It just didn't cut it.

[gman]

Diana wrote the notes on the rear panel of the Reflections LP....says she "never dreamed when she was 22" but at the time I believe she was 25....

[Boogiedown]

Nick and Val's plan was the launch Valerie as a soloist. If you look back to that period there just weren't that many successful "duo" acts. Sonny and Cher were probably the only ones. Also, Nick had taken on more of a business role working with other producers at Motown like Frank Wilson and he was more interested in behind the scenes activities. This was the opinion I had of why Val went solo, despite the fact that Nick was an outstanding singer in his own right. Perhaps after establishing Valerie they considered performing as a duo and as someone said an entire lp is in the vaults. Berry Gordy was fond of A&S but they were pissed that Val's career didn't take off. Gordy had gone hollywood, moving the company to LA and concentrating more on movies than music.
aha. but then if that were their plan and they felt it was all Motown's fault that Val's career didn't take off .....what was it that shifted their thinking when going to Warners?
Why was the Val as solo star concept hung out to dry forever thereafter .... and the duo idea now thought to be a good one especially if duos didn't fare so well, as you say?

I'm also wondering which came first : the rejected duet project ...or Valerie's solo ones?

[BayouMotownMan]

I have to respectfully disagree on the assessment that Nick Ashford is not a good singer. Listen to his vocal on Is It Still Good To Ya. He hits a high note toward the end that could have shattered glass. Valerie too is a gifted vocalist and pianist.

Diana Ross befriended the pair in the early 70s while recording their material and she championed Valerie's solo aspirations even thought the company had no real interest in another female vocalist. If I remember correctly it was Diana's idea to reunite with the pair for The Boss.

[nabob]

There has been no mention of Valerie's work with Quincy Jones from the early 70s that included Summer in the City, First Time Ever I Saw Your Face, Bridge Over Troubled Waters and Gula Matari. She later did Stuff Like That with Chaka Khan for Quincy Jones.

[Boogiedown]

Nick did early on have an interest in being a solo singer.... an aspiration he apparently got over ....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeD1cy7N4Bg

[nabob]

Nick did early on have an interest in being a solo singer.... an aspiration he apparently got over ....

Ray Charles recorded this A&S song.

[Graham Jarvis]

Nick Ashford With Valerie was issued in1969, as a Demo, not the best of sound quality but a great song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALnK1RL1RIs

Note the "Jobete" song!

[jsmith]

A male / female pairing that should have recorded together ...
21258

[Boogiedown]

Nick Ashford With Valerie was issued in1969, as a Demo, not the best of sound quality but a great song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALnK1RL1RIs

Note the "Jobete" song!


what a thoroughly enjoyable song .....:p:p:p

Strong/Whitfield they weren't:rolleyes:
Between this and Florence Ballard, I'm surprised ABC went anywhere near The Four Tops.


thanks for sharing!