Floy joy - lp

[marybrewster]

By the time the FJ album hit the shelves, 2 singles had been released: FJ and Automatically Sunshine. Since neither tore up the charts, do you think the LP would have fared better if it had been named something to tie in Smokey's involvement? "Supremes by Smokey", or something along those lines?

[blackguy69]

Naw it’s fine the way it is
By the time the FJ album hit the shelves, 2 singles had been released: FJ and Automatically Sunshine. Since neither tore up the charts, do you think the LP would have fared better if it had been named something to tie in Smokey's involvement? "Supremes by Smokey", or something along those lines?

[TYK1986]

I wonder what cover they would have used if Cindy had stayed with them during her absence in 1972/73 [[made my own cover years ago). I don't think another title would have made any difference. The sorter the title to me the better. I do think with new ways that it might have made a small difference if they went along with Stoned Love/Stone Love.

[reese]

I remember seeing the FLOY JOY album in the window of my local record store and really wanting a copy. I was just a kid so it was years before I finally was able to buy one.

Now knowing release dates, I can only guess that the album might have done better if it had been released a few months earlier, closer to the release and charting of the title track.

[lucky2012]

"Produced and Arranged by Smokey Robinson", companion-piece to the Jimmy Webb album. Nah.
I loved the cover at first sight, but Cindy should have been on it instead of Lynda.

[RanRan79]

I definitely think the album would've done better with promoting the Smokey tie in. By the time of the album's release "Floy Joy" had already become a hit, so in the end I definitely understand why it was titled that.

[marv2]

I wonder what cover they would have used if Cindy had stayed with them during her absence in 1972/73 [[made my own cover years ago). I don't think another title would have made any difference. The sorter the title to me the better. I do think with new ways that it might have made a small difference if they went along with Stoned Love/Stone Love.

I agree regarding the length of the album's title.

[marv2]

"Produced and Arranged by Smokey Robinson", companion-piece to the Jimmy Webb album. Nah.
I loved the cover at first sight, but Cindy should have been on it instead of Lynda.

I agree. They could have camouflaged Cindy in a way similar to what they did for Mary Wilson on the 1975 "The Supremes" album.

[BobbyC]

I bought FJ a few years after it was originally out. I remember thinking there was nothing danceable on that record--it seemed like old people music. Same with the 5th Dimension's Living Together, Growing Together--the songs were just terrible, no energy at all. The drift towards MOR material was a death knell to both these groups. Old people don't buy records, kids my age did--we wanted danceable, funky records like the material EWF, Commodores, Rufus, Labelle and others were doing at the time.

[floyjoy678]

I agree. They could have camouflaged Cindy in a way similar to what they did for Mary Wilson on the 1975 "The Supremes" album.

I always wondered what was up with that myself. I'm not sure that I buy it was because Cindy was pregnant because I've seen pictures of her around that time and she really wasn't that noticeably pregnant.

[RanRan79]

I think it makes good business sense to go with Lynda on the cover. Cindy was on her way out and would not be promoting the album, Lynda would. I think this is probably how it would've gone for any group. However, Mary does say that it was Cindy's decision herself to decline the session. This doesn't surprise me either as Cindy was pregnant and may very well have been self conscious about her weight gain as a lot of expectant mothers are.

[Boogiedown]

https://i.ebayimg.com/thumbs/images/g/OY4AAOSwwJ5eKBXa/s-l225.webp

.... this didn't have much effect.....

[Sotosound]

I definitely think the album would've done better with promoting the Smokey tie in. By the time of the album's release "Floy Joy" had already become a hit, so in the end I definitely understand why it was titled that.
How many potential buyers would really have cared about who wrote and produced the songs?

I know that we care, but I’ve learned over the years that the majority of record buyers generally just bought what they liked the sound of.

My wife, for instance, likes a bit of soul music but couldn’t care less about who wrote or produced what. She just likes what she likes. Her friends are similarly motivated, and many of them call early to mid-70s soul “Motown” even though most of it isn’t.

So, if they liked the “Floy Joy” single by The Supremes then they might have bought the latest album by The Supremes, especially if it was clear that it included the hit single.

That’s why we saw stickers on LPs to point out that an album contained a hit song. That’s what would have caught the buyer’s eye.

That’s a view from the UK based upon disappointment that it isn’t otherwise.

[[As a mobile DJ in the late 70s and early-to-mid 80s, I had to accept, for instance, that when I was doing a 60s night I would get requests for The Pointer Sisters and ABBA. The average punter just wasn’t very discerning.)

Is it any different in the USA? Did the people who placed records high in the charts, as opposed to we specialists, go deeply into who wrote or produced what, or did they normally just buy an album because it contained some songs that they liked by an artist that they liked?

[sup_fan]

i think the title was fine - i do enjoy that on the back cover they have a great pic with Smokey. that does a nice job tying it in

the FJ album was released in May which was definitely after Cindy was gone. So i get the idea of their using a new pic of the new group. certainly there were ample pics of the MCJ lineup they could use but appreciate that they were focusing on the new lineup

I'd guess that was part of the delay with the release of the album. getting the new group together and the photo design. Had Cindy not been leaving the group, i think the album would have been released earlier and they could have had more tv promotion for it and Auto Sun

[RanRan79]

How many potential buyers would really have cared about who wrote and produced the songs?

I know that we care, but I’ve learned over the years that the majority of record buyers generally just bought what they liked the sound of.

My wife, for instance, likes a bit of soul music but couldn’t care less about who wrote or produced what. She just likes what she likes. Her friends are similarly motivated, and many of them call early to mid-70s soul “Motown” even though most of it isn’t.

So, if they liked the “Floy Joy” single by The Supremes then they might have bought the latest album by The Supremes, especially if it was clear that it included the hit single.

That’s why we saw stickers on LPs to point out that an album contained a hit song. That’s what would have caught the buyer’s eye.

That’s a view from the UK based upon disappointment that it isn’t otherwise.

[[As a mobile DJ in the late 70s and early-to-mid 80s, I had to accept, for instance, that when I was doing a 60s night I would get requests for The Pointer Sisters and ABBA. The average punter just wasn’t very discerning.)

Is it any different in the USA? Did the people who placed records high in the charts, as opposed to we specialists, go deeply into who wrote or produced what, or did they normally just buy an album because it contained some songs that they liked by an artist that they liked?

I'd say it's universal that people just like what they like, but the names of certain songwriters certainly carried weight. Burt Bachrach's name was as famous as the artists who recorded his music. The Supremes released two successful albums with tie ins to songwriters in Rodgers and Hart and HDH. Smokey Robinson was a household name for his singing, but I imagine there were a great many fans who noticed he was the writer of some fantastic stuff, so much so that the Temptations released an album, Sing Smokey, to help the promo tie in, and that was back in 1965. Even if it didn't work for the Supremes, his name carried weight. Tying the Supremes to him, or Stevie, or some such other household name arguably could only help sales.

[lucky2012]

How many potential buyers would really have cared about who wrote and produced the songs?

I know that we care, but I’ve learned over the years that the majority of record buyers generally just bought what they liked the sound of.

Is it any different in the USA? Did the people who placed records high in the charts, as opposed to we specialists, go deeply into who wrote or produced what, or did they normally just buy an album because it contained some songs that they liked by an artist that they liked?

In the U.S., in 1972, Smokey Robinson was just as well-known and respected as Jimmy Webb, if not more so. His legendary status might have interested as many American record buyers as an already-peaked top twenty hit single.

[[I see RanRan has already "beat me to the punch" on this. :p

[lucky2012]

I'd say it's universal that people just like what they like, but the names of certain songwriters certainly carried weight. Burt Bachrach's name was as famous as the artists who recorded his music. The Supremes released two successful albums with tie ins to songwriters in Rodgers and Hart and HDH. Smokey Robinson was a household name for his singing, but I imagine there were a great many fans who noticed he was the writer of some fantastic stuff, so much so that the Temptations released an album, Sing Smokey, to help the promo tie in, and that was back in 1965. Even if it didn't work for the Supremes, his name carried weight. Tying the Supremes to him, or Stevie, or some such other household name arguably could only help sales.

In junior high in 1967, I certainly knew who HDH were but I wasn't so sure most of the pop record market was that familiar. Which is why I was a little puzzled and worried about the title of The Supremes Sing Holland-Dozier-Holland. [[Lol, I only knew who Rogers & Hart were because of the TV special!)

Being even younger in 1965, and only knowing of the Supremes on Motown, I thought The Temptations Sing Smokey was an album of them singing variations of On Top of Old Smoky. I knew I wouldn't be spending my allowance money on THAT album!

[sup_fan]

i don't think naming the FJ album around Smokey would have made too big of a difference. maybe a little bit

but they definitely didn't promote the collaboration as loudly or as broadly as they should have through other channels like their live shows, tv and radio promo spots

[RanRan79]

Being even younger in 1965, and only knowing of the Supremes on Motown, I thought The Temptations Sing Smokey was an album of them singing variations of On Top of Old Smoky. I knew I wouldn't be spending my allowance money on THAT album!

LMAO! Now that would've been an album worth hearing!

[jim aka jtigre99]

Well, the Supremes were not on television as much as they were when they had the first 2 albums and singles-they were on a number of shows singing Up The Ladder, Everybody's Got The Right and Stoned Love. By the time of the Touch LP and Nathan Jones and Touch, they were far more scarce and did not sing them on television. When Floy Joy was released they were not on television promoting the first 2 singles , although this is when Cindy was leaving and Lynda was coming on board. By the time they were on shows promoting Your Wonderful Sweet, Sweet Love it was the third single and interest was going as they had been less in the spotlight on tv as they had initially. I am not sure if the Smokey connection in the title would have helped. The previous LP Touch did not fare as well on the charts although both initial singles-Nathan Jones and Floy Joy hit the same number on the charts-16. I also think that when Lynda joined, it started the general public to become unfamiliar with who was in the group. People knew Mary had been there as an original member and knew Cindy Birdsong as she had been there since 1967. They were starting to become familiar with the new lead singer Jean Terrell even if she did not have the impact of Diana Ross. But, when Lynda joined the dynamic was original Supreme Mary with a lead singer people were still becoming familiar with and another new girl. I think this grouping, even though they were on television and quite talented, made people look and feel unfamiliar with the group. In Mary's book she said they were grand marshalls at a Holiday parade and she heard a DJ say where have they been and who is in the group,they all seemed to be new faces. Mary called and said she was still in the group and asked them to play Jimmy Webb, which they said they either weren't sent it or couldn't find it. That was more of the mindset of the general public by this time-Diana Ross was becoming an Oscar nominated film star, with a television special of her own in 1971 while the Supremes were not on television like in the past promoting Nathan Jones, Touch, Floy Joy and Automatically Sunshine and by the time they were back on they were now with a brand new unknown group member, a newer lead singer who was still catching on and Mary Wilson, the original member. Smokey's name on the album would not have been that much of a difference.

[sup_fan]

70 tv appearances include:

Feb - Ed Sullivan
March - Barbara McNair show
Sept - Andy Williams
Oct - Glen Campbell
Nov - Merv Griffin
Nov - Tom Jones
Nov - Festival at Ford's Theater
Dec - Smokey special
Dec - Mike Douglas


early 71 still saw them on quite a few tv shows.

Jan - Flip Wilson
March - Pearl Baily
April - David Frost
May - Tonight Show

then there's sort of dry spell until Oct when they did Touch on Flip Wilson

But you're right. there's a real drop in appearances on TV

Nov was spent touring England

[sup_fan]

for some reason it seems that Summer of 71 is when the girls ran into headwinds. there was a lack of tv appearances, the Touch album and single bombed. Return of Mag 7 bombed.

And some irony there since they did that wonderful Central Park show in summer 71

As i've said a zillion times, the duets hampered them to some degree. But clearly something else was happening. it had been a year and a half since the lineup change. their new image at first of being these beautiful girls singing about peace and love had maybe run it's course. the public was ready for something new perhaps.

[lucky2012]

I remember seeing the Supremes in Disneyland sometime in the summer of '71. I thought Disneyland was an odd place for the Supremes but I was nevertheless excited to see them, especially to hear Jean Terrell [[the first and only time live for me). I was loving the Touch album but wasn't really aware that I hadn't seen them on television for a while.

[sup_fan]

Lucky - do any of these look familiar? these are pics of the girls onstage during that Disney performance

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[lucky2012]

Lucky - do any of these look familiar? these are pics of the girls onstage during that Disney performance



The first and last photos! I guess they were at Disneyland for a few days? [[ I don't remember any costume changes. [[I would think I'd remember the hot pants/short shorts!)

[blackguy69]

Summer 71 they were on tour plus most shows were on hiatus
70 tv appearances include:

Feb - Ed Sullivan
March - Barbara McNair show
Sept - Andy Williams
Oct - Glen Campbell
Nov - Merv Griffin
Nov - Tom Jones
Nov - Festival at Ford's Theater
Dec - Smokey special
Dec - Mike Douglas


early 71 still saw them on quite a few tv shows.

Jan - Flip Wilson
March - Pearl Baily
April - David Frost
May - Tonight Show

then there's sort of dry spell until Oct when they did Touch on Flip Wilson

But you're right. there's a real drop in appearances on TV

Nov was spent touring England

[sup_fan]

The first and last photos! I guess they were at Disneyland for a few days? [[ I don't remember any costume changes. [[I would think I'd remember the hot pants/short shorts!)

i know! that outfit is rather scandalous! in the intro to their fall 71 Flip wilson show, they come on during the opening skit in these. I know some fans are more traditional with the Sups' look - long designer sequin gowns. But i liked these outfits lol

[TYK1986]

A lot of girl groups wear even more scandalous clothing nowadays lol. The Supremes were innocent whatever they wore. I'm a fan of the photo session where they are wearing them blue lederhosen which is totally un supreme.

[sup_fan]

i agree. the concept of "the supremes" is more than just rows of sequins and bugle beads. It was elegant and stylish. and styles change. you're right that the girls were never crass in their outfits. sexy, yes of course. and tastes changes. So i was fine with the girls exploring new looks and outfits

the outfits on A Go Go weren't glitzy or elegant. but they were perfect for the time and place. The bib overalls outfit was fine, not my favorite but i'm certainly not going to have a heart attack about them

i liked most of the 70s outfits and appreciate them but i do think the style choices were wrong, in many cases, when Scherrie joined. mostly i say that the huge chiffon ballgown look was wrong - like the green dresses or the yellow/orange/white outfits from He's My Man on Tonight Show. The dresses and style don't fit disco music and don't work with the choreography.

[gordy_hunk]

Here, Floy Joy made the top ten, and the LP seemed naturally to be called 'Floy Joy' [[remember here the LP "The Supremes sing HDH" was called "The Supremes sing Motown" - as presumably people wouldn't have known who HDH were at that time).

I do remember looking at the LP, and being bitterly disappointed that it was so very short - and expensive. I recall playing it when I did eventually buy it, and thought "no, this is not a good LP". I did like the singles, including "Your wonderful sweet sweet love".

I'm not convinced that having the Supremes and Four Tops LP being released was too much for the market - the first LP here sold well, and the second LP [[which I thought was really good), did have the hit single "You gotta have love in your heart".

I didn't particularly enjoy Floy Joy [[LP) and even less the Jimmy Webb LP. The 1975 Supremes LP was a fantastic welcome back to this super group, and even though there was a heavy radio airplay for 'He's my man', it just didn't enter the charts. I wonder if there had been too long between the Floy Joy LP singles, and 1975, and the public had moved on away from the Supremes [[even though Diana remained highly popular here - as she still is).

[sup_fan]

it's interesting that the first duets album did so well in UK. I think that's why they continued the projects. several songs were released internationally as singles in the hopes of landing another hit. although the singles only do so-so internationally. River hit #11 which is good but surprised it didn't go higher.

You Gotta Have love only hit 25

the other songs didn't chart

and the second and third duet albums also didn't chart

[gordy_hunk]

I seem to recall that there was a competition when 'The Magnificent 7' was released. It may have been Radio Luxembourg, and you had to count how many pictures of faces were on the cover of the LP. I can't remember what the prize was - needless to say, I didn't win!

[benross]

Cindy should have appeared on the cover of the Floy Joy album! In that the frequency of the group's appearances had dropped significantly [[and there was no Internet to spread the news, and there were few if any other media announcements of personnel changes), the photograph of Lynda Lawrence was puzzling, to say the least, for many long-term fans. I spent hours studying the pictures, saying to myself, "who is that, it can't be Cindy..."

Thus, the cover of this album, along with the desperate die-cut add-ons for several earlier inexpensive-looking covers [[New Ways But Love Stays and Magnificent Seven) and the junky "artwork" on the Touch album, signaled that someone wasn't paying attention to details any more. The production values remained high for a bit longer, but the sloppy covers were a harbinger of horrible times ahead.

Too, as for the outfits Sup_Fan shared [[above), when I attended a late-summer 1971 show after Jean joined the group, they wore the white dresses shown in the first and last photo, and those dresses looked cheap in each sense of the word.

For these and other reasons, Automatically Sunshine represented [[to me) one last hurrah. Then, there were occasional positives, still, but the excitement and immediate appeal of any new release by the group was gone.

[daviddh]

I liked the Floy Joy album. But I did think it was too much jean and would have preferred more Mary or Cindy on lead.
But overall good album .their second most successful album

[jim aka jtigre99]

I liked the Floy Joy album. But I did think it was too much jean and would have preferred more Mary or Cindy on lead.
But overall good album .their second most successful album
I would have to disagree on that one. Floy Joy featured both Jean and Mary singing shared leads on the title track and Automatically Sunshine, Mary had a featured lead on A Heart Like Mine and they all had lead lines on The Wisdom Of Time. I don't think it became too much Jean until Lynda joined. Jimmy Webb came after Floy Joy and like Mary said the harmony on Floy Joy and their sound was starting to gel and with Jimmy Webb it was different. The songs released then were all Jean with background singers. In fact the JML era reminded me of DRATS where Jean seemed to be pushed to the front and the rest of the group behind her instead of side by side. I even noticed in tv appearances Jean started to stand up front and away from Mary and Lynda. Floy Joy was a cohesive group effort.

[TYK1986]

I think Floy Joy was just right when it comes to sharing lead. Mary has more lead on this album then she had on any other album released before Floy Joy. Cindy also get a few add lib's and a spoken passage on wisdom of time which is also more then she would normally get [[except for thefour tops duet album and bridge over troubled water). More then they ever got before 1970.

Don't really care for the album covers either and find them a bit sloppy like benross mentioned. Although Touch is ok for me. The cover of Right on is not what I would have made for them. Should have tried to make a cover to show the direction they wanted to go to. And new ways should be re-released using just the main photo as cover :P. Floy Joy cover is ok and I think it suits the, kinda mellow, music that came with it but it's not a fave of mine.

[sup_fan]

I would have to disagree on that one. Floy Joy featured both Jean and Mary singing shared leads on the title track and Automatically Sunshine, Mary had a featured lead on A Heart Like Mine and they all had lead lines on The Wisdom Of Time. I don't think it became too much Jean until Lynda joined. Jimmy Webb came after Floy Joy and like Mary said the harmony on Floy Joy and their sound was starting to gel and with Jimmy Webb it was different. The songs released then were all Jean with background singers. In fact the JML era reminded me of DRATS where Jean seemed to be pushed to the front and the rest of the group behind her instead of side by side. I even noticed in tv appearances Jean started to stand up front and away from Mary and Lynda. Floy Joy was a cohesive group effort.

i agree i think the album is one of the more "group" ones. Cindy even gets the spotlight on the spoken passage in Wisdom. and lots of little one liners from M and C in the backgrounds - like Over and Over, Now the Bitter, etc. The album is very heavy with Andantes though. certainly not as bad as the Jimmy Webb set but i would have preferred more JMC and less A's

[sup_fan]

I think Floy Joy was just right when it comes to sharing lead. Mary has more lead on this album then she had on any other album released before Floy Joy. Cindy also get a few add lib's and a spoken passage on wisdom of time which is also more then she would normally get [[except for thefour tops duet album and bridge over troubled water). More then they ever got before 1970.

Don't really care for the album covers either and find them a bit sloppy like benross mentioned. Although Touch is ok for me. The cover of Right on is not what I would have made for them. Should have tried to make a cover to show the direction they wanted to go to. And new ways should be re-released using just the main photo as cover :P. Floy Joy cover is ok and I think it suits the, kinda mellow, music that came with it but it's not a fave of mine.

i agree with some of the comments on the album covers

RO is ok but frankly i think they could have done better. I do appreciate though that they added the tearaway poster. that would be a strong gimmick to help draw interest to it. i also like the title on this one. i guess i would have left the front image as is, it is a great pic although the old DRATS gowns. But i would have voted though for this for the back image:

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and then this would have been the poster image. again, a DRATS gown but i think this is a much more interesting pic for a poster

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for NW, we've talked tons about better options for the cover. as for the gatefold, i like that they used it here and on Mag 7. while sealed at the record store, you would have been able to feel the diecuts and know that there's "something inside." but imagine the disappointment when you opened both of them up! totally wasted space. They should have included pictures, stories, info, etc

I like the touch lp. wouldn't change it

I like the FJ lp cover too. glamorous but fresh and new. their outfits looked very contemporary. high end but a break from the matching sequins. and the all white with the pops of red is very eye catching. I think they should have revamped their show at the time to highlight their partnership with Smokey [[maybe do a medley of his songs), do more full versions of the album songs and tracks. maybe when the curtain of the show would open, the set would be the patio set up. with the girls posed. Their outfits could be different variations on red, white, pinks. Have a real theme carried through

[TYK1986]

Right On album cover just looks tooo boring to me. I wasn't around then but guess they wanted to continue the glamour image from Drats. But then Love child had a fantastic non glamour image as cover which I really like.

Would love to see New ways with a cover like Black Magic from Martha and the Vandellas. I think it's their most beautiful album cover especially with that light spot between Martha and Sandra and bright light which doesn't take over behind them.

[sup_fan]

Right On album cover just looks tooo boring to me. I wasn't around then but guess they wanted to continue the glamour image from Drats. But then Love child had a fantastic non glamour image as cover which I really like.

Would love to see New ways with a cover like Black Magic from Martha and the Vandellas. I think it's their most beautiful album cover especially with that light spot between Martha and Sandra and bright light which doesn't take over behind them.

Black Magic is a stunning album cover!! although Lois looks more prominent in the image and with the lighting than Martha.

[TYK1986]

I love album covers like the Four Tops Nature planned it. Probably not everyone's taste but it is mine. Touch cover always reminds me of the cover of the Many Grooves of Babara Lewis.

Floy Joy is probably the best album cover of the 70's supremes. The only weird thing is Mary's hand on the right chair. It looks really odd. Don't know if it's long fingernails or just her hand.

[sup_fan]

if i had to pick best 70s Sup album cover it's definitely MS&S. breathtaking. stunning. sexy and sophisticated

[Luciano]

i agree with some of the comments on the album covers

RO is ok but frankly i think they could have done better. I do appreciate though that they added the tearaway poster. that would be a strong gimmick to help draw interest to it. i also like the title on this one. i guess i would have left the front image as is, it is a great pic although the old DRATS gowns. But i would have voted though for this for the back image:

18018

and then this would have been the poster image. again, a DRATS gown but i think this is a much more interesting pic for a poster

18019

for NW, we've talked tons about better options for the cover. as for the gatefold, i like that they used it here and on Mag 7. while sealed at the record store, you would have been able to feel the diecuts and know that there's "something inside." but imagine the disappointment when you opened both of them up! totally wasted space. They should have included pictures, stories, info, etc

I like the touch lp. wouldn't change it

I like the FJ lp cover too. glamorous but fresh and new. their outfits looked very contemporary. high end but a break from the matching sequins. and the all white with the pops of red is very eye catching. I think they should have revamped their show at the time to highlight their partnership with Smokey [[maybe do a medley of his songs), do more full versions of the album songs and tracks. maybe when the curtain of the show would open, the set would be the patio set up. with the girls posed. Their outfits could be different variations on red, white, pinks. Have a real theme carried through

I agree with this and like your ideas and suggestions.

[RanRan79]

I can't argue against the Right On cover. It's not a fav, but I think it's contemporary. Definitely the best Supremes album cover since Love Child. I'm not sure I'd change it, although there are some pics I love more.

New Ways, I ride with the popular consensus about this being the Afro pic alone. Far more intriguing album cover.

Touch is perfect. It's simple yet eye catching. I also would love to see the cover photo in color. All I've ever seen are black and whites of the photo shoot. Was the whole thing shot in black and white?

Floy Joy, I think it's fine as is, but if I could change it, yeah I would have. The cover is too much white. Aside from their skin, the ladies blend in with the background and I personally don't find it overwhelmingly appealing. It's still a nice photo, but it could be better. My vote is for this as the cover:

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And I agree about Mary's hand. I always thought it looked odd.

Jimmy Webb, they ought to be ashamed of this. As previously stated, I personally think the entire project should have been shelved, if had to be recorded at all. But damn, the least they could have done was created a cover with the freakin Supremes on it.

Supremes 75 is nice, I can't argue against it. Probably a couple of other photos I would've used instead, but it's nice.

HE kind of works. I think I like it as is. MSS, same.

[RanRan79]

I think something like this would have been good on the Stevie produced album, in color, of course. Jean looks absolutely fantastic.

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[sup_fan]

I think something like this would have been good on the Stevie produced album, in color, of course. Jean looks absolutely fantastic.

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that's a good one for the Stevie album. maybe gatefold cover with the inside using lots of studio pics of them working together, maybe a little interview or a few quotes from Stevie

[TYK1986]

Thats a really nice photo! There are colour photo's of that session and the colours are stunning. Throw me out the window if you want but I'm very critical when it comes to photo's and art. Only problem with that shot is Lynda's cheeky eyes looking directly into the camera. Jean and Mary are just perfect. The Floy Joy Mock Up cover with the plant is also great. Just needs to be adjusted a bit so we can see all 3 of the completely, and the plant, without Lynda's too's and part of Jean's legs cut off. And Floy Joy at the top of the cover instead under their feet. It kinda disappears there. I'm an arse lol.

[jim aka jtigre99]

I always thought the Floy Joy cover was very nice and I felt it was more contemporary than say Right On or all the small pictures in New Ways. The only cover I didn't care for was Jimmy Webb, even the back photos just didn't seem to do much but a dead dandelion on the front? Nope. The "candid" shots were probably to make them seem more accessible. I like the Scherrie era covers. 75 was nice how they covered Mary's pregnancy without it being obvious, HE had the drawing which hearkened back to Stop! yet had a contemporary feel and MS&S was just a gorgeous cover. I did notice Mary's finger on Floy Joy, was that the finger that wouldn't straighten out after she had cut it accidentally? Still, that look maintained the glamour but also showed individual looks while retaining a similarity between all three. I think that was Jean's best look on an album cover. Mary always looked gorgeous. Lynda looked very good, as well.

[marybrewster]

I've always thought the titles of the first releases should have been switched; out of the gate "New Ways But Love Stays" would have made perfect sense. Then with the success of their first lp under their belts, "Right On" would have been fitting.

I like the cover of "Right On". Except maybe the rows of missing beads on Jean's dress. Sloppy. How was that not caught?

"New Ways" doesn't bother me either, except for the selection of dresses. By this time the wardrobe should have been revamped or updated.

[RanRan79]

I've always thought the titles of the first releases should have been switched; out of the gate "New Ways But Love Stays" would have made perfect sense. Then with the success of their first lp under their belts, "Right On" would have been fitting.


Absolutely agree. And I still maintain a song titled "New Ways But Love Stays" should have been written.

[sup_fan]

Right On was a hip phrase at the time to it made sense to use it with the girls. plus the double meaning of "moving right on" from the personnel change

I agree that NWBLS could have worked for the first LP. IMO RO is a bit more happy of phrase while NWBLS has a touch of melancholy in it. splitting hairs here.

[daviddh]

Love the Floy Joy cover art as well as touch.
Love the above photo of Floy Joy RanRan.thx for sharing.
PS.
There was another photo of Floy Joy with Cindy....I think wearing yellow dresses..I think it was a 45 photo sleeve

[TYK1986]

Those yellow dresses were stunning. I recall reading that Mary said they were too hot on stage.

18025

Photo's from this session are beautiful as well.

[sup_fan]

love this shot. but my OCD is flipping out!! heheheeh i want to go comb Mary's fringe lolol :p

[daviddh]

Another great shot....love this.thx for sharing

[franjoy56]

This is very true. The non promos of the singles nathan Jones floy joy which both should have charted higher in t states as they had in England, the chart failures and non promoti g of the album touch floy joy and t pictureless photo of t group on t Jimmy webb album and t failure of a sparkling lsst single bad weather put t nail in t coffin of t Jean Terrell led supremes

[franjoy56]

i agree. the concept of "the supremes" is more than just rows of sequins and bugle beads. It was elegant and stylish. and styles change. you're right that the girls were never crass in their outfits. sexy, yes of course. and tastes changes. So i was fine with the girls exploring new looks and outfits

the outfits on A Go Go weren't glitzy or elegant. but they were perfect for the time and place. The bib overalls outfit was fine, not my favorite but i'm certainly not going to have a heart attack about them

i liked most of the 70s outfits and appreciate them but i do think the style choices were wrong, in many cases, when Scherrie joined. mostly i say that the huge chiffon ballgown look was wrong - like the green dresses or the yellow/orange/white outfits from He's My Man on Tonight Show. The dresses and style don't fit disco music and don't work with the choreography. the other girl groups like labelle were far ahead with t futuristic look and other like t 3 degrees and 1st choice were letting it all hang out

[RanRan79]

18025



Replace Cindy with Lynda, and this would've been a nice shot for the Jimmy Webb album.

[TYK1986]

Never seen Lynda wearing this outfit. But t would have been nice indeed. Anything better than what they used. The theme of the music on the LP makes it very difficult to come up with an idea for the cover. A shot from the Lean on me performance would have worked but not sure if that was before or after the release of Jimmy Webb.

[sup_fan]

supposedly the original idea for the cover was to use a sepia toned version of this picture of MJL



18053

[sup_fan]

the other girl groups like labelle were far ahead with t futuristic look and other like t 3 degrees and 1st choice were letting it all hang out

yes the other groups definitely had fresher looks and approaches to their music. I think this was part of the reason for the conflict within the group. lynda and especially Jean wanted to evolve into something new and different. Mary didn't

but then again, we've criticized the girls for trying to update their look. the outfits they added to their wardrobe in late 72 and into 73 were definitely not the ultra glam look

they debuted these gowns with the Temps tour at The Grove in LA
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these are from Flip Wilson in that short clip of them doing Lean On Me
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and then these chiffon outfits from Kate Smith and Model of the Year
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[TYK1986]

Am definitely not a fan of any of those dresses. Am not so interested in fashion, I love work trousers and a simple blue jumper or t-shirt. But the flowery dresses look like they were cut from my nan's curtains. I do like the middle pic [[lean on me). That was the one I mentioned they should have used for the Jimmy Webb album.

[sup_fan]

lolol - yes i didn't say that i thought they were moving in the RIGHT direction lolol

my guess is they were trying to go into a bit more of mature, earthy look. a little less over-the-top Vegas sparkle.

[TYK1986]

Haha I know what you mean no worries. Just think the dresses don't do them any favours. The last photo looks like a group who hasn't been on the scene for years and recently were asked to do a performance. They don't look glamorous nor down to earth. I'm harsh and do apologize lol.

[TYK1986]

18060

Always think these looked good. Especially the photo session of Scherrie, Cindy and Mary wearing these. One of them photo's, the one with the Aztec temple in the background, would have made a great album cover for the 75 album.

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[sup_fan]

yes the brown feather and sequin outfits were cool. I was only including the outfits specifically made for MJL. lots of the other earlier 70s outfits still worked.

I think MJL looked good in the pink jumpsuits on Soul Train. Liked the patchwork jacket jean wore. And the white poncho jumpsuits from Soul Train too.

Some people didn't like the red and blue hot pants and halter top outfits. but i think they're fierce!!

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and the white fringe mini dresses from Flip Wilson and YWSSL

People talk about the 3 Degrees and other girl groups looking more modern at this time. any pics that represent this? i'm frankly not all that familiar with these other groups so don't really know their look

[TYK1986]

I'm not even sure when them brown feather outfits were made. I've never seen any photo's of Cindy, Mary and Jean wear them so assumed they were made for Lynda, Mary and Jean.

Not so sure about them red and mini shorts outfit lol. Nice in summer though! Three Degrees wore them grey mini trousers for some performances. They had some very showy costumes. The 3 degrees, to me, often looked stunning and their dance routines were often very well executed and in sync.

[sup_fan]

the brown feathers came about later with MJC. they wore them on Flip Wilson when they did a skit and then i believe they wore them when they did floy joy on Merv griffin?

[luckyluckyme]

Haha I know what you mean no worries. Just think the dresses don't do them any favours. The last photo looks like a group who hasn't been on the scene for years and recently were asked to do a performance. They don't look glamorous nor down to earth. I'm harsh and do apologize lol.

Differences of opinion are part of what makes the world go round.
I think that the dresses in the last photo fit the theme of the Model Of the Year quite well. Jean, Mary & Lynda look supreme to me and each models her outfit with class. I only wish there were a clearer copy of the performance of 'Touch' from which the photo is taken, rather than the blurry one that is currently available.

[luckyluckyme]

the brown feathers came about later with MJC. they wore them on Flip Wilson when they did a skit and then i believe they wore them when they did floy joy on Merv griffin?


And here they are:

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[RanRan79]

While the flowery dresses are so out of character for the image of the group, I think the ladies look absolutely beautiful in them and come across as more earthy Supremes than the usual look. The original trio looked like the girls next door, even in gowns, up until about early 1966. At that point they started wearing a lot more sequins and beads and coming across like the stars they were. DRATS period stepped it up even more. JMC sort of rode the wave of DRATS leftover image with a mix of something new and hip. The flowery dresses to me signify exactly the way the Supremes should've been coming across at that point. The glamour thing was super old, unless you were Diana Ross. And I suspect that, for the public, had Diana remained with the Supremes as late as the JML period, the public would've tired of the look still. That age of the female group was old hat. JML could rely on their vocals without any need to continue the old image. I don't believe I've ever seen the flower dresses photo before, but it's instantly a fav of mine.

The "Lean On Me" shot is another great one. And I have to vehemently disagree with TYK about the look on Model Of the Year. That's the perfect glam image for that period in time, if the group was going to "glam" it up. It's not over the top and it's not homely. They look beautiful.

[RanRan79]

18060

Always think these looked good. Especially the photo session of Scherrie, Cindy and Mary wearing these. One of them photo's, the one with the Aztec temple in the background, would have made a great album cover for the 75 album.

18061

Agree with both statements. The shot with Scherrie is screaming album cover!

[RanRan79]

Differences of opinion are part of what makes the world go round.
I think that the dresses in the last photo fit the theme of the Model Of the Year quite well. Jean, Mary & Lynda look supreme to me and each models her outfit with class. I only wish there were a clearer copy of the performance of 'Touch' from which the photo is taken, rather than the blurry one that is currently available.

I love the way so many of us see these things differently.

I do agree with you on the Model dresses and the clear copy of "Touch". It's said that the ladies performed the song on Flip Wilson but I have yet to come across this performance.

[RanRan79]

People talk about the 3 Degrees and other girl groups looking more modern at this time. any pics that represent this? i'm frankly not all that familiar with these other groups so don't really know their look

The 3D are probably in my top 5 female groups of all time. One of my fav things for awhile some years back was when I discovered that Youtube had a ton of 3D performances on the site, and I fell in love with the group even more. [[I had collected their music since the 90s, but hadn't really seen any performances.) I think I brought this up recently in another thread, but personally I don't see the 3D as having any more of a hip image than the Supremes. Their live act was very Vegasy. In fact, I believe that the way they presented themselves is probably what a DRATS that existed well into the 70s would've looked like, minus the three lead singers and the better live song selections. They wore a lot of sequined gowns with big wigs, sang MOR and standards, the whole bit. And as I mentioned in the previous thread, I believe this is what largely hindered their popularity with the public here in the States. [[Overseas, they were HUGELY popular.) Song for song, the 70s Supremes had more hits than any other female group that decade, but I think a strong reason for this is name recognition and a huge fan base from the 60s. Even when the base shrunk, it still had to be a sizable population of people because SUPREMES was just so big and popular. The other female groups that decade, including the 3D, never had a base that huge from the jump.

[TYK1986]

Yes glad we all got our own opinion. Makes the world a less boring place. I was a bit harsh lol. That pic with Flip Wilson is beautiful. They just look stunning in them outfits. The model of the year dresses just don't grow on me. I do like their outfits on the Floy Joy album cover. But not sure what that would have looked like on stage.

[TYK1986]

Yes I always wondered why the 3degrees were so popular here in the UK. I love their songs and enjoy listening to their Live album but in the States they didn't do very well.

[RanRan79]

Yes glad we all got our own opinion. Makes the world a less boring place. I was a bit harsh lol. That pic with Flip Wilson is beautiful. They just look stunning in them outfits. The model of the year dresses just don't grow on me. I do like their outfits on the Floy Joy album cover. But not sure what that would have looked like on stage.

Interesting point about the Floy Joy outfits. I'm not one for getting all into the gowns and what not, but it never dawned on me to wonder if they ever wore these on stage.

[RanRan79]

Yes I always wondered why the 3degrees were so popular here in the UK. I love their songs and enjoy listening to their Live album but in the States they didn't do very well.

Honestly, my personal opinion is that the 3D's had better music than the Supremes did once they got to Philly International. I also find the 3D's to be a more interesting and exciting live act than what the 70s Supremes ever did. But for whatever reason, the 3Ds just didn't catch on with the fire I believe they deserved. I also think I once read that Kenny Gamble was a bit of sexist and so he pushed his male acts with a bit more fervor than he did his female acts. How true that is, I don't know.

[sup_fan]

While the flowery dresses are so out of character for the image of the group, I think the ladies look absolutely beautiful in them and come across as more earthy Supremes than the usual look. The original trio looked like the girls next door, even in gowns, up until about early 1966. At that point they started wearing a lot more sequins and beads and coming across like the stars they were. DRATS period stepped it up even more. JMC sort of rode the wave of DRATS leftover image with a mix of something new and hip. The flowery dresses to me signify exactly the way the Supremes should've been coming across at that point. The glamour thing was super old, unless you were Diana Ross. And I suspect that, for the public, had Diana remained with the Supremes as late as the JML period, the public would've tired of the look still. That age of the female group was old hat. JML could rely on their vocals without any need to continue the old image. I don't believe I've ever seen the flower dresses photo before, but it's instantly a fav of mine.

The "Lean On Me" shot is another great one. And I have to vehemently disagree with TYK about the look on Model Of the Year. That's the perfect glam image for that period in time, if the group was going to "glam" it up. It's not over the top and it's not homely. They look beautiful.

great points Ran. i too appreciate the look. would these ever be my favorite gowns and outfits - maybe not. but i do thing it was a fresh update. they were still wildly chic, which was the real point. think back to 66 and Diana really playing with the Vidal Sassoon and Rudy Gernreich looks with her wigs and personal clothing. so being willing to be ahead of the curve

with L and J, you really can see some of the opportunity to venture into more r&b. i've wondered if the girls couldn't have explored some glam hybrid of african gowns and robes. Diana did it with a sarong/mini dress in black red and green sequins and bugle beads. What if MJL had some fabulous gowns inspired by traditional african patterns and colors. they could have toys with some great headwear too besides just wigs. nothing costumey but venturing into new looks

[sup_fan]

Yes glad we all got our own opinion. Makes the world a less boring place. I was a bit harsh lol. That pic with Flip Wilson is beautiful. They just look stunning in them outfits. The model of the year dresses just don't grow on me. I do like their outfits on the Floy Joy album cover. But not sure what that would have looked like on stage.

i think if i had to review the Touch gowns, i'd skip the shawl wrap thing. they're just a bit too covered up. Lynda's has been pulled forward to cover her baby bump. frankly that's the more interesting of the 3! lolol with the wrap, they gowns are a bit matronly. a full voluminous skirt, not a ton of cleavage, arms and shoulders covered. perhaps have the wraps removable or incorporate a sexy slit in the skirt

in some of their outfits, they included coats and capes but they were removed at some point in the show which makes for an exciting reveal.

with