A Bit Of Liverpool

[RanRan79]

I'm starting to appreciate this album as time goes on. I always thought the girls sound great, but the productions and even song selection doesn't really do it for me. I know it's not typically a fan favorite, but does anyone LOVE the album as is? For those who don't, what changes would you make? Any songs from British acts you would have loved for the girls to have covered at that point?

The biggest change I would make is replacing the LA musicians with the Funks. Why Motown wouldn't showcase the Funk Brothers on this, rather than the cheap imitation UK sound. Those artists would've loved the chance to have the Funks on their records. You have them and you replace them with someone else? Stupid.

[sup_fan]

there are big highs and big lows here. There's a considerable amount of 3-part harmony and that's always a welcomed thing with the girls.

i'm not as concerned with the musicians but more about the approach. When the girls later did R&H, there was clear love and appreciate for the music. Some of the tunes were done in a traditional style while others were given a Motown treatment. but you could still feel that everyone involved respected and cared about the tunes.

with Liverpool it was such as rushed job. Many of the British groups adored American r&b and when they covered our music, they treated it with the dignity it deserved. That's what's lacking here. a dignified approach.

[mowsville]

I would deffinately cut "Bits and Pieces" and "How Do You Do It" and the two Motown covers...would have loved to hear them do "Dont Let The Sun Catch You Crying" and "Little Children" also "Have I The Right" by The Honeycombs [[not a Liverpool band but neither were The Animals or The Dave Clark Five)...the two unreleased tracks should have stayed just that..They have got to be the worst recordings the girls ever put vocals to.

[reese]

I don't LOVE the album but it has its moments. My particular faves are THE HOUSE OF THE RISING SUN, BECAUSE, YOU CAN'T DO THAT, DO YOU LOVE ME, A HARD DAY'S NIGHT, and BITS AND PIECES. I like that each girl can be heard well and even though its a rush job, I think they did a great job [[aside from the flubbed ending to I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND).

As for what I would change, there is very little. It sort of is what it is. The instrumentation doesn't bother me. They were trying to emulate the Liverpool sound so having the Funks do it wouldn't work. I would probably swap I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND with NOT FADE AWAY. I think that song would have been a nice finale.

[gman]

It is a very good LP if you are a fan of the Harmonies....How Do You Do It? is cringe worthy….Minnie Mouse! my 2 other least favs are Cant Buy Me Love [[just don't like the song) and I Want To Hold Your Hand... I think its the pronunciation and singing of the word HAND that kills it for me. It is one of my fav Beatle songs
The rest of the LP is all highlights for me...esp. You Can't Do That, World Without Love...I like Bits and Pieces...it just stomps along nicely...I also like Hang On Sloopy from A' Go-Go and that one gets a lot of flack too

[SatansBlues]

I've never been a big fan of the British Invasion, and recording it in LA didn't do the album, like WRSC, should have been recorded in Detroit, if not by HDH, maybe C. Paul.

[TYK1986]

I actually like this album. I think Florence sounds really good on most of the songs. The group sound is nice too. One of the few album where I feel that the girls were working together as a group. I would get rid of You've really got a hold on me. Just don't like the song, the house of the rising sun and how do you do it too. I'd add the unreleased, I saw him standing there. They should have omitted the Motown covers. Always thought that was a bit odd.

[RanRan79]

there are big highs and big lows here. There's a considerable amount of 3-part harmony and that's always a welcomed thing with the girls.

i'm not as concerned with the musicians but more about the approach. When the girls later did R&H, there was clear love and appreciate for the music. Some of the tunes were done in a traditional style while others were given a Motown treatment. but you could still feel that everyone involved respected and cared about the tunes.

with Liverpool it was such as rushed job. Many of the British groups adored American r&b and when they covered our music, they treated it with the dignity it deserved. That's what's lacking here. a dignified approach.

But when the British acts covered r&b they did so in their own style. Sure, there was obvious respect for the artform, but they also made it their own. So I think it was dumb for Motown to not have the Supremes do the same thing. They could have approached those songs with a real Motown treatment. Respect the new sound, but stay true to you instead of attempting to imitate folks who were, in part, attempting to imitate you. Nuts.

[RanRan79]

I would deffinately cut "Bits and Pieces" and "How Do You Do It" and the two Motown covers...would have loved to hear them do "Dont Let The Sun Catch You Crying" and "Little Children" also "Have I The Right" by The Honeycombs [[not a Liverpool band but neither were The Animals or The Dave Clark Five)...the two unreleased tracks should have stayed just that..They have got to be the worst recordings the girls ever put vocals to.

I would cut "How Do You Do It", "I Want To Hold Your Hand", "Really Got A Hold On Me" and "Do You Love Me". I would replace two of them with the two tracks you think are the worst.:p I love both "I Saw Him Standing There" and "Not Fade Away". I might have the girls do "Wishin And Hopin", and maybe Chad and Jeremy's "A Summer Song".

[RanRan79]

I don't LOVE the album but it has its moments. My particular faves are THE HOUSE OF THE RISING SUN, BECAUSE, YOU CAN'T DO THAT, DO YOU LOVE ME, A HARD DAY'S NIGHT, and BITS AND PIECES. I like that each girl can be heard well and even though its a rush job, I think they did a great job [[aside from the flubbed ending to I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND).

As for what I would change, there is very little. It sort of is what it is. The instrumentation doesn't bother me. They were trying to emulate the Liverpool sound so having the Funks do it wouldn't work. I would probably swap I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND with NOT FADE AWAY. I think that song would have been a nice finale.

I also love "Rising Sun" and "Because". "Hard Days" is also very nice. Diana's vocal on "You Can't Do That" is a particular favorite of mine.

[RanRan79]

It is a very good LP if you are a fan of the Harmonies....How Do You Do It? is cringe worthy….Minnie Mouse! my 2 other least favs are Cant Buy Me Love [[just don't like the song) and I Want To Hold Your Hand... I think its the pronunciation and singing of the word HAND that kills it for me. It is one of my fav Beatle songs
The rest of the LP is all highlights for me...esp. You Can't Do That, World Without Love...I like Bits and Pieces...it just stomps along nicely...I also like Hang On Sloopy from A' Go-Go and that one gets a lot of flack too

Yeah, I'm not a fan of "Sloopy", although the version on the expanded edition breathed some new life into it for me.

[RanRan79]

I've never been a big fan of the British Invasion, and recording it in LA didn't do the album, like WRSC, should have been recorded in Detroit, if not by HDH, maybe C. Paul.

Both of whom were more likely to use the Funks than the LA musicians. I think the album would be considered a classic today if it weren't for that one fact.

[RanRan79]

I actually like this album. I think Florence sounds really good on most of the songs. The group sound is nice too. One of the few album where I feel that the girls were working together as a group. I would get rid of You've really got a hold on me. Just don't like the song, the house of the rising sun and how do you do it too. I'd add the unreleased, I saw him standing there. They should have omitted the Motown covers. Always thought that was a bit odd.

I thought it rather odd also. I suspect that the inclusion of two Jobete songs meant more money for Motown.

[reese]

I thought it rather odd also. I suspect that the inclusion of two Jobete songs meant more money for Motown.

In addition to the publishing money, including those songs was probably seen as attractive to those who didn't know the songs originated with Motown.

The Beatles had recently recorded YOU'VE REALLY GOT A HOLD ON ME and DO YOU LOVE ME had been recorded by a few British groups, one of whom [[I think the Tremoles [[sp)) had a big hit with it. Some fans might buy the album just because of those two tracks.

[sup_fan]

But when the British acts covered r&b they did so in their own style. Sure, there was obvious respect for the artform, but they also made it their own. So I think it was dumb for Motown to not have the Supremes do the same thing. They could have approached those songs with a real Motown treatment. Respect the new sound, but stay true to you instead of attempting to imitate folks who were, in part, attempting to imitate you. Nuts.

i completely agree. just like they did with the R&H sessions and even Funny Girl to a degree. Some of the songs could have been traditionally arranged. but then give a hard Motown driving beat to a few others. great way to reimagine the content

[sup_fan]

Yeah, I'm not a fan of "Sloopy", although the version on the expanded edition breathed some new life into it for me.

IMO the problem with Sloopy is the completely passionless and prim background vocals by M and F. To quote George Harrison "how could black girls from detroit be so square" lol Sloopy is meant to be a party song and you have some of the most bland vocalization by Flo and Mary. Imagine if during the bridge you had the girls actually start to break out a big, ad lib. and during the ending let the girls really go! then it would have worked.

it's as if they found Mrs Phyllis Weizmann and Mrs Harriett Ellis from the suburbs and had them come to the Motown studios to do guest vocals.

[TYK1986]

I was thinking about Wishin and Hopin too and I think they would have sounded great as a group. But realized the song was written by Burt Bacharach but a bit hit for Dusty then to realize she's from London �� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/)�� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/)�� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/). The album could have been a very good concept album if they just took a bit more time to choose the right song.

[RanRan79]

IMO the problem with Sloopy is the completely passionless and prim background vocals by M and F. To quote George Harrison "how could black girls from detroit be so square" lol Sloopy is meant to be a party song and you have some of the most bland vocalization by Flo and Mary. Imagine if during the bridge you had the girls actually start to break out a big, ad lib. and during the ending let the girls really go! then it would have worked.

it's as if they found Mrs Phyllis Weizmann and Mrs Harriett Ellis from the suburbs and had them come to the Motown studios to do guest vocals.

LOL Yeah, that's one problem with it. The A Go-Go sessions are so spotty for Flo and Mary. On some they seem to be firing on all cylinders, such as "Satisfaction", "Mother Dear 66", "This Old Heart Of Mine", and then phoning it in on cuts like "Sloopy", "Blowin In the Wind", and "Money". Even "Can I Get A Witness" they come across a bit "slowly", which is interesting considering how they ripped into the background behind Marvin, although there is something to be said about the sound the group achieved with the three of them singing together vs only two.

[RanRan79]

The album could have been a very good concept album if they just took a bit more time to choose the right song.

That's how I feel about the proposed "A Tribute To the Girls" album. It was pretty much going to be MOR and showtunes popularized by female singers, but I think it would've been a far more interesting concept if the album was comprised of songs popularized by the then current female acts. I would have had them covering stuff like "Chapel Of Love", "Be My Baby", "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow".

[TYK1986]

I hardly like any of them songs released from that project. I didn't even get that There's a place for us CD from a few years ago. I like the idea too of girl hits of that time. Martha did "Then he kissed me" and it sounds terrible. The lead and background.....don't even know what to say. Am I allowed to say it's a Travesty.

Maybe it would have been better if they called the bit of Liverpool lp, a bit of UK or something than they weren't so restricted to just songs from groups from Liverpool

[sup_fan]

That's how I feel about the proposed "A Tribute To the Girls" album. It was pretty much going to be MOR and showtunes popularized by female singers, but I think it would've been a far more interesting concept if the album was comprised of songs popularized by the then current female acts. I would have had them covering stuff like "Chapel Of Love", "Be My Baby", "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow".

yeah there's not much info on There's a Place For Us. My guess is they would have probably stuck with the more "adult" appreciated content like the Andrews Sisters and the McGuire sisters. older classics as the goal wasn't to associate the Supremes with the "girl group phenomenon" but to link them to the more MOR genre. Maybe some Connie Francis and other famous and popular solo female artists like Debbie Reynolds.

[sup_fan]

there's a bunch of tracks that were prepared for another potential Sup project. This was the "supremes around the world" idea and the tracks were:

La Bamba
Never on sunday
Jamaica farewell
C'est si bon
hava nagila
danke schoen
danny boy
hawaiian wedding song
tie me kangaroo down sport

[TheMotownManiac]

I'm starting to appreciate this album as time goes on. I always thought the girls sound great, but the productions and even song selection doesn't really do it for me. I know it's not typically a fan favorite, but does anyone LOVE the album as is? For those who don't, what changes would you make? Any songs from British acts you would have loved for the girls to have covered at that point?

The biggest change I would make is replacing the LA musicians with the Funks. Why Motown wouldn't showcase the Funk Brothers on this, rather than the cheap imitation UK sound. Those artists would've loved the chance to have the Funks on their records. You have them and you replace them with someone else? Stupid.

i bought the album new in ‘64 and loved most of it - not a hard days night - my fave Beatles song. Too many liberties with cadence annoyed me to pieces. I love ross on you can’t do that, house of the rising sun and bits and pieces. The great thing about this album, is that not long after where did our love go came out, they put out another album… And this was very very very unheard of. And for somebody who swooned every time they heard baby live, it helps cement the idea that maybe This group would be around a little longer than most… That had maybe a 1, or 2 year shelf life.

so, after playing where did our love go incessantly, all the sudden there’s a new supreme’s album to listen to and it was wonderful, even though it was far from ideal. There was enough there to love and it was popular - some people bought it instead of the word did our love go album because they already have the singles. I remember watching them on LLOYD Baxton and I just love them so much…… Especially Diana Who was trying so hard to put the group over, when I look back, I can see she was flying by the seat of her pants, And doing a pretty damn good job.

Today, I would make a bunch of changes. 56 years ago, it was a treat.

[mysterysinger]

I was thinking about Wishin and Hopin too and I think they would have sounded great as a group. But realized the song was written by Burt Bacharach but a bit hit for Dusty then to realize she's from London �� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/)�� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/)�� [[https://emojipedia.org/face-with-tears-of-joy/). The album could have been a very good concept album if they just took a bit more time to choose the right song.

"Wishin' and Hopin' " was a UK hit for Liverpool band The Merseybeats. A perfect fit for A Bit of Liverpool and perhaps a perfect fit for The Supremes harmonies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihe6IQ8QgUY

[lucky2012]

"Wishin' and Hopin' " was a UK hit for Liverpool band The Merseybeats. A perfect fit for A Bit of Liverpool and perhaps a perfect fit for The Supremes harmonies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihe6IQ8QgUY

I can totally hear the Supremes singing this! The harmonies and any or all three on the leads.

[gman]

Motown was still a small company, beginning to "burst" with success....the inclusion of 2 Motown copyright songs helped the bankroll....A Bit Of Liverpool was released in Oct. '64. It was the most recent group LP available for the busy holiday season and peaked at #21 on Billboard....it sold a respectable amount of copies.

[jack020]

Wishin' and Hopin' " was a UK hit for Liverpool band The Merseybeats
Correct me if i am wrong but was it not a big Dusty Springfield hit?

[TYK1986]

The Merseybeats' version hit number 13 here in the UK. Dusty's version didn't hit the charts here in the UK but it was number 6 in the States and number 2 in Canada and Australia.

[mysterysinger]

The obvious flaw in "Wishin' and Hopin' " is that it hit a bit late in the day to be recorded and included on ABOL. Similarly with any chance of Herman's Hermits covers.

[sup_fan]

Liverpool definitely sold well. It reached 21 on the US pop charts and, more importantly, was on the charts for a LONG time, 21 weeks. That's one of the longest runs for one of their concept albums.

[RanRan79]

there's a bunch of tracks that were prepared for another potential Sup project. This was the "supremes around the world" idea and the tracks were:

La Bamba
Never on sunday
Jamaica farewell
C'est si bon
hava nagila
danke schoen
danny boy
hawaiian wedding song
tie me kangaroo down sport

Yeah, but I think this might have been too much and over the top. "Hava Nagila"? Although I would love to hear them do "La Bamba" and "Danny Boy". Martha and the Vandellas have a great version of "Danke Schoen" so I would also have loved to hear what the Supremes might have done with it. No doubt, had it been completed [[or even started, my understanding is that none of these songs ended up with Supremes vocals, although there's always the chance that a vocal version is discovered...we seem to get these new discoveries right around the time fans start talk of there being nothing left in the vaults. Lol) this album would've probably been another harmony highlight for them.

[johnjeb]

They should have omitted the Motown covers. Always thought that was a bit odd.

No, not odd at all.

The Beatles covered three Motown songs, "Money", "Please Mr. Postman" and "You've Really Got A Hold On Me", on "The Beatles Second Album" which had a US release April 10, 1964. [[Those same three songs were on the UK release "With The Beatles" released 22 November 1963.)

The Dave Clark Five covered "Do You Love Me" in May 1964.

To many of us, at the time, those songs were considered Beatles and UK songs. Although, thanks to DJs on teenage radio stations, we soon learned they were American Oldies. As time progressed we later learned they were Motown songs.

So including the two Jobete songs, Hold On Me and Do You Love Me, on the Liverpool album was beneficial to Motown even if the record-buying public was unaware of the songs origins. I was surprised that Liverpool did not also include Money and Postman.

Check out Berry Gordy's autobiography "To Be Loved", pp 203-205, for an interesting story about The Beatles and the three Motown/Jobete songs they recorded.

[johnjeb]

...would have loved to hear them do "Don't Let The Sun Catch You Crying" and "Little Children" also "Have I The Right" by The Honeycombs [[not a Liverpool band but neither were The Animals or The Dave Clark Five)...

I like your selections.

Other Beatles songs I would have preferred would have been "All My Loving", "If I Fell", "And I Love Her", "P.S. I Love You" and "Love Me Do".

I like the same six songs now that I liked when I first got the Liverpool album in early 1966: "You Can't Do That", "Because", "World Without Love", "Rising Sun", "Do You Love Me", and "Hold On Me". The other songs are not great.

"How Do You Do" is just awful. I always wondered if the song was intentionally recorded like that or if there was a technical glitch with the tape when the record was pressed. It sounds like The Chipmunks. The Chipmunks' Beatles Tribute album charted higher and longer than Liverpool, so maybe BG thought having a Chipmunks sound would add to the appeal of the album!!!

[johnjeb]

I'm starting to appreciate this album as time goes on. I always thought the girls sound great, but the productions and even song selection doesn't really do it for me. I know it's not typically a fan favorite, but does anyone LOVE the album as is? For those who don't, what changes would you make? Any songs from British acts you would have loved for the girls to have covered at that point?

The biggest change I would make is replacing the LA musicians with the Funks. Why Motown wouldn't showcase the Funk Brothers on this, rather than the cheap imitation UK sound. Those artists would've loved the chance to have the Funks on their records. You have them and you replace them with someone else? Stupid.

I agree that having the Funk Brothers back The Supremes on Liverpool would have been beneficial, particularly on The Beatles songs of "Hand", "Hard Days Night" and "Can't Buy Me Love". They sound like they are yelling instead of singing. Maybe the Funks would have guided them into a softer approach. I am okay with 6 of the 11 songs as recorded by the LA musicians. Do we know if they are the Wrecking Crew or just random studio musicians?

I think what might have improved the album is to include the British bands original material on Side 1 - either as recorded for the Liverpool LP or with The Funk Brothers. The Motown and Soul influenced tracks [[recorded with The Funk Bros in Detroit) could be used for Side 2.

The Beatles recorded Money, Postman, Hold On Me and non-Motown R&B Isley Bros song Twist & Shout. And of course DC5 did Do You Love Me. The Stones as well as Dusty recorded Can I Get A Witness in 1964. All good songs for a soulful Motown-style Side 2 for Liverpool.

Liverpool Side 1: You Can't Do That, World Without Love, House Of The Rising Sun, Because, Can't Buy Me Love, Hard Day's Night
Liverpool Side 2: You've Really Got A Hold On Me, Do You Love Me, Money, Please Mr Postman, Can I Get A Witness, Twist & Shout

[sup_fan]

How Do You Do is definitely one of the weakest tracks on this album. if you listen to the version by Gerry and the Pacemakers, the lead singer does have a bit of a nasal tone to his voice. so i guess the girls were trying to replicate a nasal british accent?? lol

my guess is they're trying to be cute and playful. lol

[TYK1986]

Makes sense. I've never really though about that. A friend mine who's from the 50's always thought Please Mr Postman was a Beatles song. So guess most people wouldn't have been the wiser here if the added that song too.
I would still change You've really got a hold on me. I can't stand the song. The other is How do you do it. It's not good and especially for an opening song. What song would you guys have as the opening song if you could change it. I think Hard Day's Night would be my choice because of the opening chord.

[mysterysinger]

Their "You Can't Do That" and "Because" are really good - I'd buy the album just for those.

[gman]

Liverpool was also the newest LP available by the group for the all important sales wise holiday season....it sold relatively well. Motown was still a small company dealing with sudden big time success in the fall of '64 when Liverpool was released...having 2 in house copyrights on the LP most likely was a financial convenience owing to the Brits well known covers...when I became a fan in '68, none of my local shops or department stores stocked Meet, CW&P, Liverpool or Sam Cooke...the other earlier big selling LP's were everywhere [[WDOLG?, Copa, Symphony, A Go Go and of course, the 2 LP hits set) ...More Hits and HDH I saw, but less often locally....Rogers and Hart was all over too...but that was a fairly recent LP....by the time I became a fan there were already 3 1968 LPS available, and 3 more in rapid succession Love Child TCB and Join...that could be why the specialty slower sellers weren't kept in stock.

[lucky2012]

I never liked How Do You Do It. The Supremes' version was just odd! I have a short playlist for Bit of Liverpool, sort of a mini-album or EP version:
Side A:
1. You Can't Do That [[My favorite track by far)
2. World Without Love
3. Because

Side B:
4. You've Really Got a Hold On Me
5. House of the Rising Sun
6. Bits & Pieces

I think the Motown covers are very appropriate, since they were actually covers of British covers of original Motown songs. Perhaps album liner notes should have educated record-buyers about that. Instead of Do You Love Me, I would have preferred
Money [[That's What I Want) and Please! Mr. Postman.

Bits & Pieces is fun and the intro reminds me of Where Did Our Love Go [[a neat tie to that song and album, still on the charts at the time).

I would have liked Supremes versions of Wishin & Hopin' or Do Wah Diddy, though both of these are actually American girl-group originals [[not British).

[jobeterob]

Liverpool definitely sold well. It reached 21 on the US pop charts and, more importantly, was on the charts for a LONG time, 21 weeks. That's one of the longest runs for one of their concept albums.

I think it’s listed at sales of 800,000 copies

[RanRan79]

Their "You Can't Do That" and "Because" are really good - I'd buy the album just for those.

Agreed.....

[gman]

Yeah, but I think this might have been too much and over the top. "Hava Nagila"? Although I would love to hear them do "La Bamba" and "Danny Boy". Martha and the Vandellas have a great version of "Danke Schoen" so I would also have loved to hear what the Supremes might have done with it. No doubt, had it been completed [[or even started, my understanding is that none of these songs ended up with Supremes vocals, although there's always the chance that a vocal version is discovered...we seem to get these new discoveries right around the time fans start talk of there being nothing left in the vaults. Lol) this album would've probably been another harmony highlight for them.

Love Martha's Danke Scheon…[[supposedly, Connie Francis passed on a Eng vers. and had reasonable sized hits with Italian, Spanish and Japanese versions) I like the Heat Wave LP....very similar to Liverpool, it was a rush job....but I love MR&TV Hello Stranger more than the original...I only have Compact Command Performances and 2 for 1 this LP and Dance Party CDs...I have Anthology 2 LP vinyl ...I did have the Heat Wave LP and the abridged Dance Party Pickwick LP...Dancin' Slow is one of my fav tracks...I also had the live Stereo LP...didn't care for that and traded it in shortly afterwards

[Jaap]

I just love the Supremes version of "A World Without Love," even better than the original version by Peter and Gordon of the same year. And interestingly, Peter [[Asher) would work with Ross decades later, on the 1991 Force Behind the Power album, and, more interestingly here, on the I Love You album, including "I Will," another song written by Paul McCartney.

[kenneth]

Yeah, but I think this might have been too much and over the top. "Hava Nagila"? Although I would love to hear them do "La Bamba" and "Danny Boy". Martha and the Vandellas have a great version of "Danke Schoen" so I would also have loved to hear what the Supremes might have done with it. No doubt, had it been completed [[or even started, my understanding is that none of these songs ended up with Supremes vocals, although there's always the chance that a vocal version is discovered...we seem to get these new discoveries right around the time fans start talk of there being nothing left in the vaults. Lol) this album would've probably been another harmony highlight for them.

Almost all of Connie Francis' concept LPs preceded those by the Supremes, and it seems that Berry Gordy was paying a lot of attention to Connie's forays into "Jewish Favorites," "Irish Favorites," "Italian Hits," and others that she released as early as 1960. Connie's "Jewish" album is really pretty great, and I think she wrings every emotion from songs like the Judy Garland-like "My Yiddishe Mama." And "Hava Nagila" is on it as well!

I've come to really appreciate the "Liverpool" album even though I agree it does have some low points and sounds like it was recorded very quickly. But I think Diane excels on "Rising Sun," "World Without Love," and "You've Really Got a Hold On Me," and it's great to hear Mary and Flo so prominent in the backgrounds.

[benross]

There are [[at least) two major problems with this album. One is the overall muddy quality of the production, as all the sounds, vocal and instrumental, seem merged into an indistinct blob, with no sharp punctuation. The other is the insistence that almost every song had to have all three vocalists singing, generally in unison. Since the group was known, principally, for Diana's distinctive voice, it would have made sense to follow that formula on this record. As a case in point, Diana's solo vocal on the first verse and a bit of the last verse of The House Of The Rising Sun seemed promising; in the last verse of that song, in particular, she was able to cut loose, a bit, to demonstrate her interpretive skills, but with all three singing the middle portion together, the narrative lost its punch, and it didn't have to be that way; The Animals' version, which supposedly was being replicated, did not have the whole group singing throughout. I did appreciate Mary's duet with Diana on Because, and I believe that if the harmonies had been limited, the concept could have worked. Also, I was not enamored of the group's efforts on I Want To Hold Your Hand and Can't Buy Me Love. Too, it seemed that Florence sounded less than disciplined [[and dare I say, "drunk") on several of the songs, especially the two outtakes. The arrangements seemed unplanned, and the overall effort seemed unfocused and rushed. The cover photo was superb, but the album, especially over time, sounds disappointing, particularly given the potential that the concept seemed to promise and given the general excellence that H-D-H created elsewhere that year, as illustrated in most of the Where Did Our Love Go album's glossy, polished-to-perfection production values.

[Ollie9]

There are [[at least) two major problems with this album. One is the overall muddy quality of the production, as all the sounds, vocal and instrumental, seem merged into an indistinct blob, with no sharp punctuation. The other is the insistence that almost every song had to have all three vocalists singing, generally in unison. Since the group was known, principally, for Diana's distinctive voice, it would have made sense to follow that formula on this record. As a case in point, Diana's solo vocal on the first verse and a bit of the last verse of The House Of The Rising Sun seemed promising; in the last verse of that song, in particular, she was able to cut loose, a bit, to demonstrate her interpretive skills, but with all three singing the middle portion together, the narrative lost its punch, and it didn't have to be that way; The Animals' version, which supposedly was being replicated, did not have the whole group singing throughout. I did appreciate Mary's duet with Diana on Because, and I believe that if the harmonies had been limited, the concept could have worked. Also, I was not enamored of the group's efforts on I Want To Hold Your Hand and Can't Buy Me Love. Too, it seemed that Florence sounded less than disciplined [[and dare I say, "drunk") on several of the songs, especially the two outtakes. The arrangements seemed unplanned, and the overall effort seemed unfocused and rushed. The cover photo was superb, but the album, especially over time, sounds disappointing, particularly given the potential that the concept seemed to promise and given the general excellence that H-D-H created elsewhere that year, as illustrated in most of the Where Did Our Love Go album's glossy, polished-to-perfection production values.

Not one of my favourite Supremes albums. I find the vocals a little to raw sounding and as you point out the production is less then good. A rather rushed job.
Totally disagree about Flo. She most certainly does not sound drunk to my ears. Many of the songs lend themselves to her vocal style, so if anything would have liked to have heard her featured a little more prominently.

[sup_fan]

i think Liverpool's problem is that 1) they used LA musicians so it lacks the soul of the funk bros and 2) it seems rushed and every song comes across as a 1 take track. they just stood by a mic and hit record. did 1 take of each song, waxed it and that was it.

agree that some of the singing is sloppy. some of the unison work isn't as sharp or aligned as it should be. and a little goes a long way of that. same with 3 part harmony. use it as an effect but not on every tune. it gets monotonous. also it requires strict attention to accuracy.

[RanRan79]

Totally disagree about Flo. She most certainly does not sound drunk to my ears. Many of the songs lend themselves to her vocal style, so if anything would have liked to have heard her featured a little more prominently.

Absolutely agree. And to add, "Because" isn't a duet between Diana and Mary, it is a group harmony throughout.

[marybrewster]

I wish they would have recorded EIGHT DAYS A WEEK, similar to SHINDIG where each Supreme got a line to sing. Cute!

[Jaap]

I wish they would have recorded EIGHT DAYS A WEEK, similar to SHINDIG where each Supreme got a line to sing. Cute!

That live performance is indeed wonderful and would have been a great fit. Interestingly, the Beatles recorded "Eight Days A Week" in the same week as A Bit of Liverpool was released [[16 October 1964).

[sup_fan]

That live performance is indeed wonderful and would have been a great fit. Interestingly, the Beatles recorded "Eight Days A Week" in the same week as A Bit of Liverpool was released [[16 October 1964).

and didn't the girls each trade off a lead verse? that was a good one! especially if they used that same approach for the recording

[Ollie9]

and didn't the girls each trade off a lead verse? that was a good one! especially if they used that same approach for the recording

Eight Days A Week really showcases the fact that when given the right song, Mary and Florence were more then capable of singing lead. Had more of the songs on that album featured shared leads it would have made for a considerably more interesting listening experience.

[sup_fan]

absolutely. all three girls were talented. M and F definitely had the goods. unfortunately they didn't get the opportunity to test, learn and experiment in the studio as Diana did. While i agree that D was the best commercial voice and prefer her being primary lead singer, M and F should definitely have had more sharing of things in album tracks and live.

I find it so odd that in Enjoy Yourself on the Copa EE that Flo didn't sing her solo verse. While Mary is doing hers, if you listen closely you can hear Diana in the back asking Flo if she's singing. then as they approach verse 3 she says that line about Flo being shy. You'd think Flo would want to sing at every moment possible. Especially since those opportunities were becoming rare.

[marybrewster]

absolutely. all three girls were talented. M and F definitely had the goods. unfortunately they didn't get the opportunity to test, learn and experiment in the studio as Diana did. While i agree that D was the best commercial voice and prefer her being primary lead singer, M and F should definitely have had more sharing of things in album tracks and live.

I find it so odd that in Enjoy Yourself on the Copa EE that Flo didn't sing her solo verse. While Mary is doing hers, if you listen closely you can hear Diana in the back asking Flo if she's singing. then as they approach verse 3 she says that line about Flo being shy. You'd think Flo would want to sing at every moment possible. Especially since those opportunities were becoming rare.

That's what I never understood. It's been said that Mary and Flo wanted to be showcased more, but yet when an opportunity presented itself, it wasn't taken.

[reese]

absolutely. all three girls were talented. M and F definitely had the goods. unfortunately they didn't get the opportunity to test, learn and experiment in the studio as Diana did. While i agree that D was the best commercial voice and prefer her being primary lead singer, M and F should definitely have had more sharing of things in album tracks and live.

I find it so odd that in Enjoy Yourself on the Copa EE that Flo didn't sing her solo verse. While Mary is doing hers, if you listen closely you can hear Diana in the back asking Flo if she's singing. then as they approach verse 3 she says that line about Flo being shy. You'd think Flo would want to sing at every moment possible. Especially since those opportunities were becoming rare.

Someone guessed that this recorded when Flo was still hoarse from the flu and that was why she declined. But yeah, if it was one of my only spots, I probably would have went for it nonetheless.

[floyjoy678]

absolutely. all three girls were talented. M and F definitely had the goods. unfortunately they didn't get the opportunity to test, learn and experiment in the studio as Diana did. While i agree that D was the best commercial voice and prefer her being primary lead singer, M and F should definitely have had more sharing of things in album tracks and live.

I find it so odd that in Enjoy Yourself on the Copa EE that Flo didn't sing her solo verse. While Mary is doing hers, if you listen closely you can hear Diana in the back asking Flo if she's singing. then as they approach verse 3 she says that line about Flo being shy. You'd think Flo would want to sing at every moment possible. Especially since those opportunities were becoming rare.

I always noticed that Mary is much more audible on a lot of the Copa tracks and Flo is unusually quiet. I always thought maybe they turned her mic down lower but maybe she was having issues with her voice at this time?

[sup_fan]

i think part of it might also be physical distance to the mic. In those videos from the DRATS european tours, Mary is right at the mic and therefore she's coming through clearly.

Also the mics were being fed into the recording system in the club, which was sketchy at best. But that sound quality is not what the audience members would necessarily have heard. sitting in the club you'd hear the girls actual voices and the club's sound system. So audience members probably heard DMF as a unit better than we're hearing them on the lp

[sup_fan]

Someone guessed that this recorded when Flo was still hoarse from the flu and that was why she declined. But yeah, if it was one of my only spots, I probably would have went for it nonetheless.

agreed. she might have been slightly hoarse but still. it's not like she was going to sing a complex Puccini aria lol. she was going to sing about 12 measures in 1 song.

i'm going to speculate here but i would think that would have been part of the brewing frustration with Florence. not trying to get in a D vs F battle. But all three girls were working CRAZY hard and to be onstage at the Copa and Flo can't/won't sing her verse just interrupts the flow of things. Will she, won't she be on tonight? can she pull her weight?

again, there could be a lot of reasons for her doing this but i could see this being part of the problem. So if she's going to be undependable, why bother to incorporate solo material or solo lines in subsequent songs in the show?

[floyjoy678]

agreed. she might have been slightly hoarse but still. it's not like she was going to sing a complex Puccini aria lol. she was going to sing about 12 measures in 1 song.

i'm going to speculate here but i would think that would have been part of the brewing frustration with Florence. not trying to get in a D vs F battle. But all three girls were working CRAZY hard and to be onstage at the Copa and Flo can't/won't sing her verse just interrupts the flow of things. Will she, won't she be on tonight? can she pull her weight?

again, there could be a lot of reasons for her doing this but i could see this being part of the problem. So if she's going to be undependable, why bother to incorporate solo material or solo lines in subsequent songs in the show?

And I think you hit the nail on the head as to why the group became geared more towards Diana, especially after the Copa. It really seemed like Motown was trying to showcase each girl individually right before the Copa: the name dropping in Back In My Arms Again, the three separate photos with signatures on the latest album, etc but I think Flo's unreliability before and during the Copa put a stop to all of that.

[sup_fan]

Berry also has made the comment that Diana was willing to work for it AND sacrifice for it, to reach her star potential. Again, not that M and F didn't work very, very hard. they did. Diana was just compulsive.

I agree that through 65, it was still relatively inclusive. You had the individual pics and autographs on the album cover, the girls did a lot more 3-part harmony work on the concept albums recorded and released around this time, M and F often had solo numbers in these albums too, they created the initial comedy routine in You're Nobody with Flo's lines during the Paris shows, People was still in the act, etc. A while Diana was the centerpiece, the structure of the group made her shine because M and F were sooooo very good.

some time in 66 or so, perhaps earlier, things started to slip. Flo was missing from that debutante party performance in Detroit. not sure of the date of that but i believe it was early spring 66. then supposedly she missed some dates prior to the spring 66 Copa gig.

in the studios, there's the story of her not showing up for the He session in Feb 66. then in July we know she didn't show up to the recording sessions for You Can't Hurry Love and others.

So things were staring to crack in early 66.

[reese]

agreed. she might have been slightly hoarse but still. it's not like she was going to sing a complex Puccini aria lol. she was going to sing about 12 measures in 1 song.

i'm going to speculate here but i would think that would have been part of the brewing frustration with Florence. not trying to get in a D vs F battle. But all three girls were working CRAZY hard and to be onstage at the Copa and Flo can't/won't sing her verse just interrupts the flow of things. Will she, won't she be on tonight? can she pull her weight?

again, there could be a lot of reasons for her doing this but i could see this being part of the problem. So if she's going to be undependable, why bother to incorporate solo material or solo lines in subsequent songs in the show?

I agree. And its actually rather sad. Because instead of trying to find the reason behind the undependability, some probably just focused on the undependability. In the last Taraborrelli book, Gil Askey said that PEOPLE was taken out of the show one night because Flo said she was too hoarse to do it. When he told her that she had to always be ready, she didn't respond well. Diana overheard the conversation and suggested replacing PEOPLE with the SYMPHONY Medley. After that, Gil said that he doesn't recall them doing PEOPLE again.

Of course, if all of this was happening now, there might have been a different outcome. But back then, they worked those girls to death. Now artists may take two or three years between albums and tours. The Supremes released records year round and were on the road all the time. There probably wasn't a lot of time to just sit and think. Not to say that things with Flo couldn't have been handled much better but a lot was happening in a short period of time.

[RanRan79]

The Supremes' shows, especially the first Copa gig, were rehearsed down to the letter. I don't buy that Florence was ever to take the lead on "Enjoy Yourself". If there was an issue with Flo's voice, and from the harmony I'm not hearing any hoarseness, this would have been worked out before the show even began. Had Flo had trepidation about singing the lead after being sick, Gordy would've either replaced the song with a Diana lead [[as would happen per Gil's anecdote regarding "People" the following year) or told Diana to do Flo's part, at which point I'm sure Diana would have had to go into some "extensive" rehearsing to get down a verse of a song she previously didn't have to do. Since the Supremes have become synonymous with controversy as opposed to singing, we fans have a tendency to read entirely too much into what is probably something very simple. My money is on this being a stage bit to back up the moniker of "the quiet one". Nothing about Flo says she was so unprofessional- especially at this stage of the game, 1965- that she would wait until the very moment she is to open her mouth to sing and then go, "Nah, I'm good". Now if a version of "Enjoy Yourself" surfaces where Flo is singing the part supposedly assigned to her, I'll revisit my thoughts. Until then, this sounds a whole lot like "And for our next number, we'll do a sweet, heartwarming ballad..." before the opening to something like "Hangin On" or "The Happening". Again, I feel like there's nothing to see here.

[RanRan79]

The debutante ball performance was in 1965 and apparently Florence was missing. Florence's grandmother also died that year, so it's entirely possible that Flo was at home with family during that difficult time, as she should have been.

JRT wrote about Flo missing the "He" recording session, but I question the source. Doesn't make sense. As far as I can tell, none of the groups were used on the tracks for the In Loving Memory album, only the lead singers. Seems like this one was a dramatic purposes story since it doesn't jive with what we know about the actual sessions.

[SatansBlues]

Let's just call this entire project what it really was: a money grab. This album was probably not meant to be some great artistic masterpiece. It was just a simple nod to the popular music of the British Invasion and a money grab. And at 850,000 copies sold, wasn't it also the SECOND BEST selling album for Motown in 64'?

[sup_fan]

The debutante ball performance was in 1965 and apparently Florence was missing. Florence's grandmother also died that year, so it's entirely possible that Flo was at home with family during that difficult time, as she should have been.

JRT wrote about Flo missing the "He" recording session, but I question the source. Doesn't make sense. As far as I can tell, none of the groups were used on the tracks for the In Loving Memory album, only the lead singers. Seems like this one was a dramatic purposes story since it doesn't jive with what we know about the actual sessions.

all very possible. Some of the stories have turned out to be either false or mistaken. And good point about the funeral. not sure of the date and timing but that could certainly be it.

[sup_fan]

I do agree about the He session. the entire album uses a bigger, choral sound. so wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't the session she skipped. the July 4 and 5 one, definitely was one. and based on the data we have, it doesn't appear at though people were anticipating her not being there. with D and M doing the backgrounds on What Becomes and then Marlene coming in the next day. Mary and several other sources do say that Flo did miss shows and studio time. the reason, frequency and exact dates are not mentioned. Was it 2x or 20x? don't know

As for the Copa instance, i hear you about how tightly controlled and prepared the show was. It is really odd though how the song plays out. Mary does a verse but no flo? and there is the background dialog going on behind Mary while she sings. that's weird. And even weirder is your point - on such an important stage and gig Flo is gonna bail right there on stage? clearly i think that's why the song didn't appear on the lp. seemed like a fun song but they already had Queen of the House. two comedy bits might have been too much.

[George Solomon]

Sorry that I'm keeping this straying from the Liverpool subject. But here are a few fun facts about the Copa only Supremes fans would care about. There did seem to be something askew in "Enjoy Yourself." We edited a big chunk out where there seemed to be confusion as to what was going on. With the edit the song is 4:39. Unedited it's 5:29. We did the same edit that Motown did in 1966 when they were going to use it on the live Roostertail album that got canned. As many of you know that album was going to use 4 tracks that were actually recorded at the Copa in 65. The "Tonight" Medley, Where Did Our Love Go, Nothing But Heartaches and Enjoy Yourself. Kind of surprising considering how wonderful the whole actual concert is from the Roostertail 66. [[In case anyone is in the dark, it's on the I Hear A Symphony Expanded). Also of all of the shows recorded for the Copa [[and I think there were 6) none of the others include "Enjoy Yourself."

[TheMotownManiac]

The Supremes' shows, especially the first Copa gig, were rehearsed down to the letter. I don't buy that Florence was ever to take the lead on "Enjoy Yourself". If there was an issue with Flo's voice, and from the harmony I'm not hearing any hoarseness, this would have been worked out before the show even began. Had Flo had trepidation about singing the lead after being sick, Gordy would've either replaced the song with a Diana lead [[as would happen per Gil's anecdote regarding "People" the following year) or told Diana to do Flo's part, at which point I'm sure Diana would have had to go into some "extensive" rehearsing to get down a verse of a song she previously didn't have to do. Since the Supremes have become synonymous with controversy as opposed to singing, we fans have a tendency to read entirely too much into what is probably something very simple. My money is on this being a stage bit to back up the moniker of "the quiet one". Nothing about Flo says she was so unprofessional- especially at this stage of the game, 1965- that she would wait until the very moment she is to open her mouth to sing and then go, "Nah, I'm good". Now if a version of "Enjoy Yourself" surfaces where Flo is singing the part supposedly assigned to her, I'll revisit my thoughts. Until then, this sounds a whole lot like "And for our next number, we'll do a sweet, heartwarming ballad..." before the opening to something like "Hangin On" or "The Happening". Again, I feel like there's nothing to see here.

that’s quite an interesting axiom, one possibility that I never considered. That being said, I think it might very well be another reason. Florence had missed quite a bit of COPA rehearsal, And when she came back to New York, she really worked like a dog to catch up. This song seems to me, like some thing that might’ve been introduced perhaps somewhat later than other possibilities for the show. I think this because I don’t think diana or mary do a very good job on their solos, musically they are fine, but the delivery is hardly deft. Flo might have not been down on it enough. I don’t know how much it was in the act after the Copa, but they never did it when I saw them and I, personally, I don’t think it belonged in the act at all. They already had the somewhat sophomoric harmonies of people, and now you have this front porch sing-along frankly I think is beneath the New York sophisticates I would be attending the show. Perhaps it did get into the act, and they learned to perform it in a more seasoned manner, but I wouldn’t be at all surprised to find out that took it out or rarely performed it.

also, maybe I’m losing it, but considering the fact that Florence was already smarting about the amount of solo material she was doing, I don’t think that she would have gone along with pretending like she was too shy to sing the only solo she was given. It may have struck too close to home.

[floyjoy678]

that’s quite an interesting axiom, one possibility that I never considered. That being said, I think it might very well be another reason. Florence had missed quite a bit of COPA rehearsal, And when she came back to New York, she really worked like a dog to catch up. This song seems to me, like some thing that might’ve been introduced perhaps somewhat later than other possibilities for the show. I think this because I don’t think diana or mary do a very good job on their solos, musically they are fine, but the delivery is hardly deft. Flo might have not been down on it enough. I don’t know how much it was in the act after the Copa, but they never did it when I saw them and I, personally, I don’t think it belonged in the act at all. They already had the somewhat sophomoric harmonies of people, and now you have this front porch sing-along frankly I think is beneath the New York sophisticates I would be attending the show. Perhaps it did get into the act, and they learned to perform it in a more seasoned manner, but I wouldn’t be at all surprised to find out that took it out or rarely performed it.

also, maybe I’m losing it, but considering the fact that Florence was already smarting about the amount of solo material she was doing, I don’t think that she would have gone along with pretending like she was too shy to sing the only solo she was given. It may have struck too close to home.

That makes sense that maybe she didn't have time to learn the song. I know they did shows prior to the Copa where Marlene subbed for Flo, one of them being a show in Wildwood NJ. Flo was missing from a press conference a month later in August and that may have been when her grandmother passed because I remember Diana saying Flo was in Detroit for the day.

[thommg]

Sorry that I'm keeping this straying from the Liverpool subject. But here are a few fun facts about the Copa only Supremes fans would care about. There did seem to be something askew in "Enjoy Yourself." We edited a big chunk out where there seemed to be confusion as to what was going on. With the edit the song is 4:39. Unedited it's 5:29. We did the same edit that Motown did in 1966 when they were going to use it on the live Roostertail album that got canned. As many of you know that album was going to use 4 tracks that were actually recorded at the Copa in 65. The "Tonight" Medley, Where Did Our Love Go, Nothing But Heartaches and Enjoy Yourself. Kind of surprising considering how wonderful the whole actual concert is from the Roostertail 66. [[In case anyone is in the dark, it's on the I Hear A Symphony Expanded). Also of all of the shows recorded for the Copa [[and I think there were 6) none of the others include "Enjoy Yourself."

Thanks for this info, George. I wonder what the issues were with Enjoy Yourself that they didn't do it in any of the other recorded shows. Of course, that doesn't mean they didn't do it in the unrecorded shows, but it seems like the kind of song you would do most often in a supper club setting. I wish we had more information behind the thought processes from back then. Why add Copa songs to the Roostertail when it stands on it's own? And what was the reasoning behind the rundown of each show? I love that kind of detailed thought process. I used to run a cabaret room in the summers and had my own reasons for the song lineup of all the artists. I wish Gil Askey or someone had run through the thought process of The Supremes shows.

And, to keep this on topic, I enjoy the Liverpool album but so many of the tracks feel rushed. One of my favorites was House Of The Rising Sun because it was so unexpected! Also, World Without Love was pretty good. I agree with one of the posters above that having it played by the Funk Brothers might have given it a bit more weight and flow. The team in LA just seemed to knock it out without much flair. And by flair, I mean Motown sound.

[sup_fan]

Thanks for this info, George. I wonder what the issues were with Enjoy Yourself that they didn't do it in any of the other recorded shows. Of course, that doesn't mean they didn't do it in the unrecorded shows, but it seems like the kind of song you would do most often in a supper club setting. I wish we had more information behind the thought processes from back then. Why add Copa songs to the Roostertail when it stands on it's own? And what was the reasoning behind the rundown of each show? I love that kind of detailed thought process. I used to run a cabaret room in the summers and had my own reasons for the song lineup of all the artists. I wish Gil Askey or someone had run through the thought process of The Supremes shows.

And, to keep this on topic, I enjoy the Liverpool album but so many of the tracks feel rushed. One of my favorites was House Of The Rising Sun because it was so unexpected! Also, World Without Love was pretty good. I agree with one of the posters above that having it played by the Funk Brothers might have given it a bit more weight and flow. The team in LA just seemed to knock it out without much flair. And by flair, I mean Motown sound.

i think in Randy's book or somewhere it's mentioned that Motown wanted to have the live albums avoid duplicating tracks from previous live albums. similar to how You're Nobody is cut from TOTT

George - on the night they did Enjoy Yourself did they also do Queen of the House? Was Queen a new song for them with the Copa shows [[or at least in the shows leading up to Copa)?

[George Solomon]

I believe Queen Of The House was in all the recorded shows. I can only assume that it was added to the act while preparing for the Copa since [[unless someone knows otherwise) the song was first recorded in 1965 as a parody to King Of The Road also 1965. Also of note is that Where Did Our Love Go, Nothing But Heartaches and I Am Woman were also only in one of the recorded shows. And yes, I think they were trying to avoid repeating tracks that were already on the Copa LP with the 1966 unreleased Roostertail album.
About Liverpool. I really like it and each time I play it I enjoy it. But I'm a pretty easy audience when it comes to The Supremes! "How Do You Do It" is obviously tongue in cheek and I think it's cute. Might have been better as the last track on the album rather than the opener. We'd love to expand those early specialty albums. Let's hope someday!

[luckyluckyme]

Ah... I can just hear George, Andy & Kevin singing "Someday They'll Be Expanded" in reference to the specialty albums. And when these albums finally are, I hope that George, Andy & Kevin will sing a parody of the 1969 hit [[who here wants to write the verses?) in the promo video for the collection.

[George Solomon]

Ah... I can just hear George, Andy & Kevin singing "Someday They'll Be Expanded" in reference to the specialty albums. And when these albums finally are, I hope that George, Andy & Kevin will sing a parody of the 1969 hit [[who here wants to write the verses?) in the promo video for the collection.

That's pretty funny!

[sup_fan]

I believe Queen Of The House was in all the recorded shows. I can only assume that it was added to the act while preparing for the Copa since [[unless someone knows otherwise) the song was first recorded in 1965 as a parody to King Of The Road also 1965. Also of note is that Where Did Our Love Go, Nothing But Heartaches and I Am Woman were also only in one of the recorded shows. And yes, I think they were trying to avoid repeating tracks that were already on the Copa LP with the 1966 unreleased Roostertail album.
About Liverpool. I really like it and each time I play it I enjoy it. But I'm a pretty easy audience when it comes to The Supremes! "How Do You Do It" is obviously tongue in cheek and I think it's cute. Might have been better as the last track on the album rather than the opener. We'd love to expand those early specialty albums. Let's hope someday!

thanks George! love hearing your insights

now i'm gonna scold you on something lolol When Randy's latest Diana book came you, we all loved your annotations on the discography section. But it [[understandably) doesn't include the 70s Sups albums. At one point you said you thought about doing a rundown of those for us fans. I'm Still Waiting

:p

[SatansBlues]

I believe Queen Of The House was in all the recorded shows. I can only assume that it was added to the act while preparing for the Copa since [[unless someone knows otherwise) the song was first recorded in 1965 as a parody to King Of The Road also 1965. Also of note is that Where Did Our Love Go, Nothing But Heartaches and I Am Woman were also only in one of the recorded shows. And yes, I think they were trying to avoid repeating tracks that were already on the Copa LP with the 1966 unreleased Roostertail album.
About Liverpool. I really like it and each time I play it I enjoy it. But I'm a pretty easy audience when it comes to The Supremes! "How Do You Do It" is obviously tongue in cheek and I think it's cute. Might have been better as the last track on the album rather than the opener. We'd love to expand those early specialty albums. Let's hope someday!
The Supremes didn't perform QOTH in Paris of that year. So maybe it was added for the Copa.

[Jaap]

i think in Randy's book or somewhere it's mentioned that Motown wanted to have the live albums avoid duplicating tracks from previous live albums. similar to how You're Nobody is cut from TOTT

Do you mean "Somewhere" instead of "You're Nobody..." as the latter IS included on TOTT? Although the Supremes' version of "Somewhere" is not my favorite [[I prefer Diana's solo rendition from the Live at The Royal Albert Hall concert), but it would have been good if it was included, as it includes the MLK monologue [[like on TCB), which makes it a historical relevant performance!

[sup_fan]

Do you mean "Somewhere" instead of "You're Nobody..." as the latter IS included on TOTT? Although the Supremes' version of "Somewhere" is not my favorite [[I prefer Diana's solo rendition from the Live at The Royal Albert Hall concert), but it would have been good if it was included, as it includes the MLK monologue [[like on TCB), which makes it a historical relevant performance!

sorry - my mistake. yes somewhere at TOTT and then You're Nobody was cut from Farewell

[franjoy56]

Eight Days A Week really showcases the fact that when given the right song, Mary and Florence were more then capable of singing lead. Had more of the songs on that album featured shared leads it would have made for a considerably more interesting listening experience. I loved t album it gave me a chance to hear Mary and flo however undisciplined many feel here I beg to differ it was recorded live, and as far as I'm concerned florence sounded fine they just let her cut loose especially on house of the rising sun and do u love me.. sounding drunk is putting over t top. Flo was a soul singer.

[Ollie9]

I loved t album it gave me a chance to hear Mary and flo however undisciplined many feel here I beg to differ it was recorded live, and as far as I'm concerned florence sounded fine they just let her cut loose especially on house of the rising sun and do u love me.. sounding drunk is putting over t top. Flo was a soul singer.

Out of all the Supremes albums, i so wish ABOL had contained more shared leads. As RanRan mentioned, Flo’s sassy vocal style would have been perfect for many of the songs. Their shared vocal version of “Eight Days A Week” is terrific.
Not absolutely certain Diana would have agreed with me, but perhaps she could have been talked around.......There again.

[sup_fan]

Out of all the Supremes albums, i so wish ABOL had contained more shared leads. As RanRan mentioned, Flo’s sassy vocal style would have been perfect for many of the songs. Their shared vocal version of “Eight Days A Week” is terrific.
Not absolutely certain Diana would have agreed with me, but perhaps she could have been talked around.......There again.

i agree although there is definitely more group interaction and unison leads than on later concept albums. R&H is obviously a much stronger set but i wish there was a bit more group work.

I guess with Liverpool, they were in a rush and so tried to keep it simple so they didn't need too many takes

[Ollie9]

i agree although there is definitely more group interaction and unison leads than on later concept albums. R&H is obviously a much stronger set but i wish there was a bit more group work.

I guess with Liverpool, they were in a rush and so tried to keep it simple so they didn't need too many takes

I agree in that the album was obviously a rush job. Time wise, i don't think Mary or Flo having leads would necessarily have made the recording more complicated.
Regardless of what we the fans might have wished for, Diana had been designated lead singer and that was that.
Had there been more shared leads, it might possibly have undermined the public’s perception of Dianas standing within the group. I don’t think it would have, but it is possible.
I think the album is fun. It’s just the tinny production that lets it down badly.

[sup_fan]

i agree Ollie - i think you could have given a few bits here and there to M and F and not diminished D's presence whatsoever. Like how they did in Breathtaking. or Long Gone Lover. or how they did later with M and C in Ladder. those are excellent ways to still highlight the group without taking any real shine off Diana

[gman]

I'm not a big fan of Florence's sound...being able to sing loud doesn't mean being able to sing good....but I think Do You Love Me? would have been an excellent choice for her....since Mary is so prominent on BECAUSE, I will count that as her solo here.
As far as quality goes World Without Love is the harmony winner here. You Can't Do That is a excellent Ross vocal, and there is a raw, garage rock band charm to the vocal arrangements for House of The Rising Sun and A Hard Days Night.

[RanRan79]

Ah, yes, because those of us who love Flo's voice love it because it's...loud.

[sup_fan]

i get what gman is saying. simply having a big full voice doesn't make you a great singer. there's a lot more to it than that. Mary sometimes compares Flo to Aretha and i'm like WTF?!?!? we have about 30 - 40 songs with Flo on lead and on only a handful does she really shine IMO. I think her Good News is amazing and hints at she COULD have been developed. But listening to some of her other tracks, it's just not there.

great singer can take a crap song and still make it sound good. or at least their voice still sounds good.

Flo leads suffered from intonation issues, vowel placement and phrasing.

Again, Good News shows what could happen. and had she had the studio time like Diana did, she could very well have honed her craft

As for Queen of Soul, i think she came out of the womb singing like that lolol.

[lucky2012]

i get what gman is saying. simply having a big full voice doesn't make you a great singer. there's a lot more to it than that. Mary sometimes compares Flo to Aretha and i'm like WTF?!?!? we have about 30 - 40 songs with Flo on lead and on only a handful does she really shine IMO. I think her Good News is amazing and hints at she COULD have been developed. But listening to some of her other tracks, it's just not there.

Flo leads suffered from intonation issues, vowel placement and phrasing.

Again, Good News shows what could happen. and had she had the studio time like Diana did, she could very well have honed her craft


Agree. I love Florence on Good News, Buttered Popcorn and Silent Night [[wish this had been worked on more).


As for Queen of Soul, i think she came out of the womb singing like that lolol.

LOL

[RanRan79]

i get what gman is saying. simply having a big full voice doesn't make you a great singer. there's a lot more to it than that. Mary sometimes compares Flo to Aretha and i'm like WTF?!?!? we have about 30 - 40 songs with Flo on lead and on only a handful does she really shine IMO. I think her Good News is amazing and hints at she COULD have been developed. But listening to some of her other tracks, it's just not there.

great singer can take a crap song and still make it sound good. or at least their voice still sounds good.

Flo leads suffered from intonation issues, vowel placement and phrasing.

Again, Good News shows what could happen. and had she had the studio time like Diana did, she could very well have honed her craft

As for Queen of Soul, i think she came out of the womb singing like that lolol.

No, it doesn't make one a great singer, but it's a bit condescending to suggest that is why someone like myself, a huge fan of Flo Ballard's voice, digs it, because it's loud. I love Flo's voice because I do. It's beautiful. It's soulful. I like her approach to some of her lead work. I enjoy her phrasing on certain songs. I enjoy her harmony work. In my book she's fantastic for all of these reasons, not because she's...loud. Is she everyone's cup of tea? Of course not. But then we largely have threads about a woman- Diana Ross- who might be one of the most legendary polarizing voices in the history of music. It may be hard to tell by a lot of our opinions in this forum, but there are people out there who hear Diana Ross and do not hear the greatness we do. That's life.

As for Flo and Aretha, I've only heard Mary compare Flo to Ree in the terms she did in Dreamgirl, where she says Flo's style was similar in the way they attacked a song and made it their own. Of course this would not be out of the ordinary for a Black female of the time, with origins in gospel and blues, and growing up with the emerging sound of R&B. A number of singers during that day could be compared to Aretha, although the Queen will always come out on top.

Because like you, I believe Aretha was born with that soulful crown. Her baby cries probably sent shivers down folks' spines. Lol