First Band allowed to play on sessions?

[lockhartgary]

Does anyone know who the first band was that was allowed to play on sessions?

[Sotosound]

Earl Van Dyke and The Soul Brothers? Although they probably didn’t realise it when doing those sessions.

Junior Walker and The All Stars?

Just guessing and assuming that this is about Motown bands.

[soulwally]

If you’re talking Motown the very early session musicians included Joe Hunter [[before Earl Van Dyke came aboard), Benny Benjamin, James Jamerson, Robert White, Joe Messina, Thomas ‘Beans’ Bowles, Larry Veeder

[snakepit]

Popcorn Wylie was there with members of the funk bros

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

Does anyone know who the first band was that was allowed to play on sessions?
You nay have to clarify; I'm thinking you're talking about bands like Jr. Walker & The All Stars, The Underdogs, Bobby Taylor & The Vancouvers, The Mynah Birds. In that case, I'd go with Snakepit and say Popcorn & The Mohawks were the first self-contained band.

[lockhartgary]

You nay have to clarify; I'm thinking you're talking about bands like Jr. Walker & The All Stars, The Underdogs, Bobby Taylor & The Vancouvers, The Mynah Birds. In that case, I'd go with Snakepit and say Popcorn & The Mohawks were the first self-contained band.

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I am talking about self-contained bands.

[StuBass1]

Very few self contained bands were used exclusively on sessions...Even the guys known as The Funk Brothers weren't really a self contained band...Some of the guys worked club dates together, but others were brought in to work in Studio A with the others... Many of the musicians, like Otis Redding's band the Bar-kay's [[several of whom perished with him in the plane crash), were primarily touring bands...Same with Jr Walkers All Stars who ended up primarily a touring backup band which were generally recorded with The Funk Brothers, particularly Jamerson and Benny Benjamin... I think MFSB sort of self contained after coming together in the studio and recorded instrumentals in addition to backing the PIR vocal groups... Actually, the Los Angeles based band TOTO in the 70's with a lot of success started out as session players for Boz Skaggs, Seals & Crofts, and others, then formed their own band at that point... Also, Booker T & The MG's did a lot of the work at STAX as well as recording and touring on their own...The "Swampers" [[originally known as the "Second FAME Gang" [[later "The Muscle Shoals Rhythm Section") remained pretty self contained down in Muscle Shoals due to the high volume of work for a time...Otherwise, studio work is generally a matter of the producers using whatever preferred musicians worked best for various projects...

[Roger Polhill]

Would it be Nick & the Jaguars and "Ich-i-bon # 1""

[StuBass1]

Also remember in the 40's during the big band era, many bands like Glenn Miller recorded backing singers as did Duke Ellington and The Count Basie Band who did a lot of recording with artists like Joe Williams, Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughn, Nat Cole, Tony Bennett. and many many more...

[luke]

Rare Earth?

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

I'm wondering is if the question isn't about bands playing behind other artists but self contained bands being allowed to play on their own records and not being replaced by the Funk Brothers. The All Stars, The Underdogs and probably any other self contained band at Motown in the 60s usually were swapped out with Funk Brothers. If that's the case, Luke, Roger and Snakepit are on the right track.

[SatansBlues]

What artists toured with their own band of musicians?

[StuBass1]

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/101795081_10157543704819482_7190969589419737088_n. jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=110474&_nc_ohc=oYSuO_IvuZMAX--PRU-&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.xx&oh=3b2753ff68c4294d3f33c96046a4cd0c&oe=5EF99B79

[lockhartgary]

I'm wondering is if the question isn't about bands playing behind other artists but self contained bands being allowed to play on their own records and not being replaced by the Funk Brothers. The All Stars, The Underdogs and probably any other self contained band at Motown in the 60s usually were swapped out with Funk Brothers. If that's the case, Luke, Roger and Snakepit are on the right track.

The bold text contained in the quote is what I was looking for and I should have been more specific. All replies are great though.

[StuBass1]

The bold text contained in the quote is what I was looking for and I should have been more specific. All replies are great though.
If you're talking strictly Motown...most of their artists were singers and not instrumentalists but groups and solo artists... Motown's "sound" was heavily produced orchestrations...not keyboard, guitars, bass and drum type combos...Rare Earth being the only example that comes to mind... Booker T & The MG's in Memphis played on THEIR own hit records [[Green Onions, Hip Hug Her, Hang em High, etc), in addition to backing other artists in the studio...Even great bands like The Beatles augmented most of their later recordings with studio musicians... The Wrecking Crew musicians [[a loose conglomeration of studio aces) were the REAL musicians on recordings by popular bands like The Association, The Monkee's, The Grass Roots,Mamas & Papas, Gary Lewis & The Playboys, even The Beach Boys gave way to the Wrecking Crew" "pro's" once they hit the studio...

[snakepit]

I think it is type of garage bands like The Underdogs or The Headliners you're looking for . But even their tracks will have Funk Bros included I think.

[StuBass1]

I think it is type of garage bands like The Underdogs or The Headliners you're looking for . But even their tracks will have Funk Bros included I think.

Not looking to pull rank my friend snakepit...but as The Funk Brothers official sponsor and spokesperson, I can tell you with great certainty that I can think of no Funk Brothers that played on any garage bands, grunge bands, progressive bands, or hard rock bands... Maybe the closest was a couple of the guys played on a Bob Seger project or two...

[StuBass1]

The entry for The Underdogs in The Complete Motown Singles 1967 states the Funk Brothers filled out the session for Love's Gone Bad [[and I'd imagine Mojo Hannah as well). Group member Tony Roumell [[guitar) recalled "They wanted that Motown energy on the record, so Earl Van Dyke played the Hammond B3 and James Jamerson played bass. When we started to record, I just couldn't believe how great these guys were. They elevated my level of playing." Tony also recalled he believed he was the only Underdog on the record besides [lead] singer Dave Whitehouse.

Yes...they were a Motown group and also closely associated with the Bob Seger Detroit contingent I mentioned and were managed by Segers manager, Punch Andrews... Certainly the guys did moonlighting on other projects as for hire musicians and pick up some extra cash...Lucky to get a Funk or two on your track...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Underdogs_[[American_band)

[snakepit]

The entry for The Underdogs in The Complete Motown Singles 1967 states the Funk Brothers filled out the session for Love's Gone Bad [[and I'd imagine Mojo Hannah as well). Group member Tony Roumell [[guitar) recalled "They wanted that Motown energy on the record, so Earl Van Dyke played the Hammond B3 and James Jamerson played bass. When we started to record, I just couldn't believe how great these guys were. They elevated my level of playing." Tony also recalled he believed he was the only Underdog on the record besides [lead] singer Dave Whitehouse.

So I was correct in stating that some Funk Bros were playing on tracks by Underdogs, probably Headliners.

[ralpht]

Stu has it correct. The Funks were not really into Rock & Roll. Motown brought Jeff Beck in from England to do some experimental sessions with the Brothers. First time together did not go well and Harry Balk called me into a meeting with Jeff and him to see what might be done to solve the problem. I suggested we bring in Babbitt and Andrew Smith to work with Jeff. Harry liked the idea and that is what we did. I stopped into the studio that night to check on things and all was going well.

[ralpht]

As an after thought: I would suggest it was Mike Valvano with Mike and the Modifiers that was Motown's first self recording band.

[SatansBlues]

Stu has it correct. The Funks were not really into Rock & Roll. Motown brought Jeff Beck in from England to do some experimental sessions with the Brothers. First time together did not go well and Harry Balk called me into a meeting with Jeff and him to see what might be done to solve the problem. I suggested we bring in Babbitt and Andrew Smith to work with Jeff. Harry liked the idea and that is what we did. I stopped into the studio that night to check on things and all was going well.
Hey Ralph- Any idea what happened to or became of those recordings?

[ralpht]

SB, Good question. I never did hear any completed songs. Not exactly sure what happened with the experiment.

[calvin]

Jeff Beck said he took the tapes with him - and he still has them [[as of this article in 2010):

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/jeff-beck-on-his-legendary-unreleased-1970-motown-album-111450/

[SatansBlues]

Jeff Beck said he took the tapes with him - and he still has them [[as of this article in 2010):

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/jeff-beck-on-his-legendary-unreleased-1970-motown-album-111450/
Thanks for posting that Calvin. Interesting read, I would be interested in hearing those tapes.

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

Stu has it correct. The Funks were not really into Rock & Roll. Motown brought Jeff Beck in from England to do some experimental sessions with the Brothers. First time together did not go well and Harry Balk called me into a meeting with Jeff and him to see what might be done to solve the problem. I suggested we bring in Babbitt and Andrew Smith to work with Jeff. Harry liked the idea and that is what we did. I stopped into the studio that night to check on things and all was going well.
So now I'm confused. Were the two members of the Funk Brothers on those Underdog tunes or am I off base?

[calvin]

Thanks for posting that Calvin. Interesting read, I would be interested in hearing those tapes.

There are a few comments about it from Bob Olhsson here:

http://repforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php?topic=32612.0

[snakepit]

So now I'm confused. Were the two members of the Funk Brothers on those Underdog tunes or am I off base?

I think you can take it as read that the Underdog's 45s had some Funk Bros additions.

[snakepit]

The Underdogs 45...with, as they admit, Funk Bros assisting.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n8irfmn4iec

[snakepit]

This is the Headliners.
Motown Junkies suggest no Funk Bros involvement

https://motownjunkies.co.uk/artists/h/headliners/

[Roger Polhill]

"Nick and the Jaguars were the first white act to appear on a Motown label.The rocking trio hailed from Pontiac, Michigan, and included lead guitarist Marvin Weyer, whose rapid-fire fretwork presages the pick- melting antics of Dick Dale, and drummer Nick Ferro, who`s father, Gus Ferro introduced them to Berry" from Complete Motown Singles vol. 1. This was August 1959. I rest my case!

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

"Nick and the Jaguars were the first white act to appear on a Motown label.The rocking trio hailed from Pontiac, Michigan, and included lead guitarist Marvin Weyer, whose rapid-fire fretwork presages the pick- melting antics of Dick Dale, and drummer Nick Ferro, who`s father, Gus Ferro introduced them to Berry" from Complete Motown Singles vol. 1. This was August 1959. I rest my case!

Which case is being rested? About the first white band signed to Motown?

[ralpht]

Mike and the Modifiers.

[Roger Polhill]

The question was "First band to play on sessions?" clarified later as "Self contained band" so how come Nick & the Jaguars miss out, as Mike & the Modifiers wasn`t until April 1962.

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

Mike and the Modifiers.

But that wasn't even near what the original question was... That's why I asked what case was being rested. That was a HUGE leap...

[ralpht]

Mike Valvano and I were production partners on a couple of albums and he would often tell me stories of his early days at Motown.

[SatansBlues]

Mike Valvano and I were production partners on a couple of albums and he would often tell me stories of his early days at Motown.
Please share Ralph!

[ralpht]

Wow, so many years have past to remember very much.I do remember it was Mike who schooled me on how to survive at Motown. Motown was a tough act based on competition. Berry set it up that way. Competition bred excellence. Not much of anything else I can remember. Mike did confirm that the Modifiers were Motown's first contained band.

[Roger Polhill]

Oh alright then! :cool: Ralph is there much work still left of Mike And the Modifiers.As we have only 8 sides so far - would there have been enough for an album?

[mysterysinger]

There's a lot more to Mike Valvano than immediately hits the eye - very often I come across his name in relation to one thing or other. He deserves a heck of a lot of respect for his contributions to Motown. Also, I really like "I Found Myself A Brand New Baby" - has quite a husky voice on there. Love the style and feel of that track.

[robb_k]

As an after thought: I would suggest it was Mike Valvano with Mike and the Modifiers that was Motown's first self recording band.
17498
Did Berry add additional musicians to Nick and The Jaguars' cuts? If so, Mike and The Modifiers were first. But if he didn't, then Nick and The Jaguars were first for Tamla in 1959.

When Tamla was started, Berry signed Joe Hunter and his band to be Tamla's house band. They were a self-contained band that played gigs in Eastern Michigan, and probably Toledo, too, and previous to that had hired themselves out to work on many record sessions, including some for Berry Gordy produced sessions, and sessions he didn't produce, but wrote the songs. The Funk Brothers started from that band, and adding a few other Detroit musicians Berry signed afterwards.

[WaitingWatchingLookingForAChance]

17498
Did Berry add additional musicians to Nick and The Jaguars' cuts? If so, Mike and The Modifiers were first. But if he didn't, then Nick and The Jaguars were first for Tamla in 1959.

When Tamla was started, Berry signed Joe Hunter and his band to be Tamla's house band. They were a self-contained band that played gigs in Eastern Michigan, and probably Toledo, too, and previous to that had hired themselves out to work on many record sessions, including some for Berry Gordy produced sessions, and sessions he didn't produce, but wrote the songs. The Funk Brothers started from that band, and adding a few other Detroit musicians Berry signed afterwards.

BINGO BINGO and BINGO!