Diana Ross at the Radio City Music Hall '84

[Diana Ross Fan Club]

We're looking for Ms.Ross' concert at the Radio City Music Hall from 1984. We know that some fans have bootleg copies of the show on cassette/tape, but we look for a digital version. Please, if you have it and want to trade it for rare photographs or rare material, let us know in the comments or send us an email to dianarossofficialfanclub@gmail.com

The quality is not important since we have a a professional team of audio remastering.

Thanks!

[monicarivers]

We're looking for Ms.Ross' concert at the Radio City Music Hall from 1984. We know that some fans have bootleg copies of the show on cassette/tape, but we look for a digital version. Please, if you have it and want to trade it for rare photographs or rare material, let us know in the comments or send us an email to dianarossofficialfanclub@gmail.com

The quality is not important since we have a a professional team of audio remastering.

Thanks!

I’ve only heard her cover of “New York State of Mind”. Did she perform any other “surprises”?

[Diana Ross Fan Club]

I’ve only heard her cover of “New York State of Mind”. Did she perform any other “surprises”?

I think she also did 'Rescue Me', 'Forever Young', 'Touch By Touch' and 'Remember Me'. But I'm not sure. I know the concert was going to be released but it was cancelled so there's a professional recording out there, even on bootleg copies.

[monicarivers]

I think she also did 'Rescue Me', 'Forever Young', 'Touch By Touch' and 'Remember Me'. But I'm not sure. I know the concert was going to be released but it was cancelled so there's a professional recording out there, even on bootleg copies.

I’d be interested to know if there’s any video...

[Albator]

In her book, Diana writes she still regrets not cancelling this engagement.

From tv news


https://youtu.be/Qc4MiCjlDK0

[Albator]

POP: DIANA ROSS SHOW
By Stephen Holden
Sept. 21, 1984


GLAMOUR, the aura of sanctified narcissism exalted by 1950's movie magazines, has made a big comeback of late thanks to performers such as Diana Ross. The star, who opened an 11- show engagement at Radio City Music Hall on Wednesday, distills that elusive mixture of beauty and cultivated charm in its most concentrated form. In her new show, which features several stunning costume changes, music plays second fiddle to images of the star modeling various glittering gowns and jump suits.


Even before it opened, Miss Ross's show had become the Music Hall's top-grossing concert attraction ever, surpassing Liberace's record-breaking engagement last April. Where Liberace's 14-show engagement carried a top ticket price of $25, the best tickets for Diana Ross went for $30. And at the end of an opening-night performance that began with two variety acts and continued with the star singing for just an hour and 10 minutes, a sizable portion of the audience felt it had not gotten its money's worth and vociferously demanded ''more.'' Having prepared no second encore, the star offered a reprise of her newest hit, ''Swept Away.''


Miss Ross opened her set with a selection of songs [[''My Man,'' ''New York State of Mind,'' ''It's My Turn'') arranged cabaret-style for just voice and piano. Then, joined by 12 musicians and two backup singers, she continued with such old hits as ''Ain't No Mountain High Enough'' and ''Upside Down'' and the recent ''I'm Missing You,'' a new Lionel Richie ballad written in memory of of Marvin Gaye. The singer acknowledged her 50's doo-wop roots with a spirited ''Why Do Fools Fall in Love'' and commemorated her early Motown years with a three-song medley of Supremes hits. She performed ''Swept Away'' with a video of the song and ended her set with Bob Dylan's ''Forever Young,'' arranged as a saccharine gospel hymn.


Compared with the similarly priced Jacksons' show with its ''Star Wars'' pyrotechnics at Madison Square Garden and Liberace's Music Hall show, in which the pianist played in synch with dancing and rainbow-colored fountains, Miss Ross's show was skimpy, not only in length but in show-biz razzmatazz. At $30 ticket prices, 50's-style glamour is no substitute for 80's showmanship.

[monicarivers]

POP: DIANA ROSS SHOW
By Stephen Holden
Sept. 21, 1984


GLAMOUR, the aura of sanctified narcissism exalted by 1950's movie magazines, has made a big comeback of late thanks to performers such as Diana Ross. The star, who opened an 11- show engagement at Radio City Music Hall on Wednesday, distills that elusive mixture of beauty and cultivated charm in its most concentrated form. In her new show, which features several stunning costume changes, music plays second fiddle to images of the star modeling various glittering gowns and jump suits.


Even before it opened, Miss Ross's show had become the Music Hall's top-grossing concert attraction ever, surpassing Liberace's record-breaking engagement last April. Where Liberace's 14-show engagement carried a top ticket price of $25, the best tickets for Diana Ross went for $30. And at the end of an opening-night performance that began with two variety acts and continued with the star singing for just an hour and 10 minutes, a sizable portion of the audience felt it had not gotten its money's worth and vociferously demanded ''more.'' Having prepared no second encore, the star offered a reprise of her newest hit, ''Swept Away.''


Miss Ross opened her set with a selection of songs [[''My Man,'' ''New York State of Mind,'' ''It's My Turn'') arranged cabaret-style for just voice and piano. Then, joined by 12 musicians and two backup singers, she continued with such old hits as ''Ain't No Mountain High Enough'' and ''Upside Down'' and the recent ''I'm Missing You,'' a new Lionel Richie ballad written in memory of of Marvin Gaye. The singer acknowledged her 50's doo-wop roots with a spirited ''Why Do Fools Fall in Love'' and commemorated her early Motown years with a three-song medley of Supremes hits. She performed ''Swept Away'' with a video of the song and ended her set with Bob Dylan's ''Forever Young,'' arranged as a saccharine gospel hymn.


Compared with the similarly priced Jacksons' show with its ''Star Wars'' pyrotechnics at Madison Square Garden and Liberace's Music Hall show, in which the pianist played in synch with dancing and rainbow-colored fountains, Miss Ross's show was skimpy, not only in length but in show-biz razzmatazz. At $30 ticket prices, 50's-style glamour is no substitute for 80's showmanship.

$30! Those were the days!

[TNSUN]

This was the time that Ms. Ross was flying, between shows, to visit her sick mother in the hospital. Ms. Ross sang "Remember Me" and her performance is my fondest live concert experience.

[PeaceNHarmony]

This was the time that Ms. Ross was flying, between shows, to visit her sick mother in the hospital. Ms. Ross sang "Remember Me" and her performance is my fondest live concert experience.Nice that you were able to hear "Remember Me' live. Did Diana perform it with the gospel call-and-response ending?

[reese]

Nice that you were able to hear "Remember Me' live. Did Diana perform it with the gospel call-and-response ending?

I wasn't at Radio City but I saw Diana a week or two later at Boston Garden and she performed REMEMBER ME, with the call-and-response ending. But as I remember it, when she got to that section, she started calling out names of various Motown acts.

[TNSUN]

At Radio City Music Hall, she performed the song with the gospel call back and repeated the refrain several times with great instrumental breaks. Her band was superb! I wonder if there is a recording of Diana Ross' great performance of "Remember Me".

[reese]

At Radio City Music Hall, she performed the song with the gospel call back and repeated the refrain several times with great instrumental breaks. Her band was superb! I wonder if there is a recording of Diana Ross' great performance of "Remember Me".

The only live version I've seen a recording of is that from her 1979 HBO special.

I've seen her sing it in concert in 1979, 1982, and 1984. But in the many concerts I've seen since 1984, she's never performed out although I have read that she pulls it out every now and then.

[Bluebrock]

The only live version I've seen a recording of is that from her 1979 HBO special.

I've seen her sing it in concert in 1979, 1982, and 1984. But in the many concerts I've seen since 1984, she's never performed out although I have read that she pulls it out every now and then.

Yes she does "pull it out" every so often as you so delightfully describe it, but as far as i'm concerned she doesn't "pull it out" anywhere near as often as i would like her to do!

[Albator]

She also sang briefly "I ain't been licked" around 2005

[PeaceNHarmony]

Yes she does "pull it out" every so often as you so delightfully describe it, but as far as i'm concerned she doesn't "pull it out" anywhere near as often as i would like her to do!I saw Nick Ashford pull it out once.

[Jaap]

She also sang briefly "I ain't been licked" around 2005

The LA Weekly review of a 2004 concert even uses Ain't Been Licked as a headline, calling it part of a "thematic thread of resilience" -- and of course it was fitting. This is when the Diana Ross "comeback" started after RTL and DUI. Good to remember that in 2004 she did two-hours concerts [[with intermission). Her 2004 concert in Rotterdam was the longest I ever attended.

https://www.laweekly.com/aint-been-licked/

[Bluebrock]

I saw Nick Ashford pull it out once.

Rather you than me my friend!

[kenneth]

What a very snarky review of this concert. I can’t believe they compare her one woman show to the Jacksons with pyrotechnics and other special effects. Who needs that? Maybe the fans of the Jacksons expect that but who goes to a Diana Ross concert expecting to see fireworks? And it seems to me that an hour and 10 minutes is a pretty good length for a concert. Would most people sing for more than that? I know Bruce Springsteen and some others are famous for giving super long shows but I don’t know that I’d expect to see more than an hour though I’ve never been an avid concertgoer.

still I think that reviewer had some thing else going on, some other ax to grind or hidden agenda about Ross to post such a mean spirited review.

[reese]

What a very snarky review of this concert. I can’t believe they compare her one woman show to the Jacksons with pyrotechnics and other special effects. Who needs that? Maybe the fans of the Jacksons expect that but who goes to a Diana Ross concert expecting to see fireworks? And it seems to me that an hour and 10 minutes is a pretty good length for a concert. Would most people sing for more than that? I know Bruce Springsteen and some others are famous for giving super long shows but I don’t know that I’d expect to see more than an hour though I’ve never been an avid concertgoer.

still I think that reviewer had some thing else going on, some other ax to grind or hidden agenda about Ross to post such a mean spirited review.

I'm still getting over the $30 top ticket price. LOL. Those really were the days.

I will say that 70 minutes does seem rather short for a Diana concert, at least back then. Nowadays this is about the norm. But I remember her performing for two hours when I saw her in 1983 at a $17.50 top ticket price.

I suspect the reviewer wasn't aware of what was happening in Diana's life at the time of the Radio City engagement. Her mother was dying from cancer and Diana was doing her show every night, flying back to Detroit to spend the day with her mom before flying back to NYC for the next night's show. This activity probably accounted for the show's shortened running time.

I saw Diana in concert a few weeks later and had no complaints at all. I don't think the news of her mother's death had yet been released.

The set list was [[from my best memory):

IT'S MY TURN
AIN'T NO MOUNTAIN HIGH ENOUGH
TOUCH ME IN THE MORNING
LET'S GO UP
YOU CAN'T HURRY LOVE
REACH OUT AND TOUCH
MISSING YOU
MIRROR, MIRROR

Intermission

I'M COMING OUT
UPSIDE DOWN
MUSCLES
HOME
50s MEDLEY: RESCUE ME/SO CLOSE/WHY DO FOOLS FALL IN LOVE
[[*Interesting note: only the last song was really from the 50s)
SUPREMES MEDLEY: REFLECTIONS/BABY LOVE/STOP!/ITCHING IN MY HEART
REMEMBER ME
SWEPT AWAY

Costume change

ENDLESS LOVE
FOREVER YOUNG

Costume change

SWEPT AWAY [[reprise)

[George Solomon]

I'm sure the Radio City 84 set list changed from night to night but this is the recording [[through the sound board) that circulated. She did the first 4 songs in a T-shirt and jeans.

Overture
Home
New York State Of Mind
It's My Turn
My Man
Ain't No Mountain High Enough
Upside Down
Missing You
Mirror Mirror
I'm Coming Out
Rescue Me/So Close/ Why Do Fools Fall In Love
Baby Love/Stop!/Love Is Like An Itching
You Can't Hurry Love
Swept Away
Reach Out And Touch
Endless Love
Forever Young
Swept Away Reprise

[PeaceNHarmony]

I'm still getting over the $30 top ticket price. LOL. Those really were the days.

I will say that 70 minutes does seem rather short for a Diana concert, at least back then. Nowadays this is about the norm. But I remember her performing for two hours when I saw her in 1983 at a $17.50 top ticket price.

I suspect the reviewer wasn't aware of what was happening in Diana's life at the time of the Radio City engagement. Her mother was dying from cancer and Diana was doing her show every night, flying back to Detroit to spend the day with her mom before flying back to NYC for the next night's show. This activity probably accounted for the show's shortened running time.

I saw Diana in concert a few weeks later and had no complaints at all. I don't think the news of her mother's death had yet been released.

The set list was [[from my best memory):

IT'S MY TURN
AIN'T NO MOUNTAIN HIGH ENOUGH
TOUCH ME IN THE MORNING
LET'S GO UP
YOU CAN'T HURRY LOVE
REACH OUT AND TOUCH
MISSING YOU
MIRROR, MIRROR

Intermission

I'M COMING OUT
UPSIDE DOWN
MUSCLES
HOME
50s MEDLEY: RESCUE ME/SO CLOSE/WHY DO FOOLS FALL IN LOVE
[[*Interesting note: only the last song was really from the 50s)
SUPREMES MEDLEY: REFLECTIONS/BABY LOVE/STOP!/ITCHING IN MY HEART
REMEMBER ME
SWEPT AWAY

Costume change

ENDLESS LOVE
FOREVER YOUNG

Costume change

SWEPT AWAY [[reprise)Holden has always been negative about Diana. Interestingly I recall him calling other performers' concerts at the time as overproduced!

[PeaceNHarmony]

I'm sure the Radio City 84 set list changed from night to night but this is the recording [[through the sound board) that circulated. She did the first 4 songs in a T-shirt and jeans.

Overture
Home
New York State Of Mind
It's My Turn
My Man
Ain't No Mountain High Enough
Upside Down
Missing You
Mirror Mirror
I'm Coming Out
Rescue Me/So Close/ Why Do Fools Fall In Love
Baby Love/Stop!/Love Is Like An Itching
You Can't Hurry Love
Swept Away
Reach Out And Touch
Endless Love
Forever Young
Swept Away RepriseThe 't-and-jeans' [[and, I believe, bare feet!) was legendary in the NYC area. As I recall this run of shows sold out before I could get a ticket.

[reese]

The 't-and-jeans' [[and, I believe, bare feet!) was legendary in the NYC area. As I recall this run of shows sold out before I could get a ticket.

There was a blurb in JET that said Diana's sell-outs made it impossible for Peter Allen to do his engagement. So Radio City booked Carnegie Hall for him instead.

[PeaceNHarmony]

There was a blurb in JET that said Diana's sell-outs made it impossible for Peter Allen to do his engagement. So Radio City booked Carnegie Hall for him instead.Interesting, Reese. Allen was a big draw in NYC at the time. I remember so well that for tour after tour in NYC Diana would be booked for a run of dates. Which would sell out in a few days. Then dates would be added. And added ...

[nomis]

you can see the sadness in Diana's face over her mothers illness in the picture from after one of these shows [[with her daughters and Bob) included in Taraborelli's "Call Her Miss Ross"

[Jaap]

Interesting that she apparently didn't sing "Do You Know Where You're Going To," as that seemed to be a fixed feature of the show since 1976.

[Albator]

I'm still getting over the $30 top ticket price. LOL. Those really were the days.

I saw Diana in concert a few weeks later and had no complaints at all. I don't think the news of her mother's death had yet been released.

The set list was [[from my best memory):

IT'S MY TURN
AIN'T NO MOUNTAIN HIGH ENOUGH
TOUCH ME IN THE MORNING
LET'S GO UP
YOU CAN'T HURRY LOVE
REACH OUT AND TOUCH
MISSING YOU
MIRROR, MIRROR

Intermission

I'M COMING OUT
UPSIDE DOWN
MUSCLES
HOME
50s MEDLEY: RESCUE ME/SO CLOSE/WHY DO FOOLS FALL IN LOVE
[[*Interesting note: only the last song was really from the 50s)
SUPREMES MEDLEY: REFLECTIONS/BABY LOVE/STOP!/ITCHING IN MY HEART
REMEMBER ME
SWEPT AWAY

Costume change

ENDLESS LOVE
FOREVER YOUNG

Costume change

SWEPT AWAY [[reprise)

Great set list. I didn't know she disjointed "Moutain" from "do You Know" at least for a short time.

[reese]

Interesting that she apparently didn't sing "Do You Know Where You're Going To," as that seemed to be a fixed feature of the show since 1976.

And no songs from LADY as well.

[reese]

Great set list. I didn't know she disjointed "Moutain" from "do You Know" at least for a short time.

When I saw her in April 1979, she sang the THEME FROM MAHOGANY as a stand-alone. That was the only time I ever saw her perform it that way in concert.

[PeaceNHarmony]

And no songs from LADY as well.Seems to be a Diana-fan issue. If she sings familiar songs, SHE DOESN'T SING ANYTHING NEW!!! And if Diana chooses new material, WHERE ARE THE FAMILIAR SONGS??

[PeaceNHarmony]

you can see the sadness in Diana's face over her mothers illness in the picture from after one of these shows [[with her daughters and Bob) included in Taraborelli's "Call Her Miss Ross"A very emotional picture to view, nomis. Diana sure was experiencing some serious emotional stress. The lady kept going, that's for sure!

[whitesoxx]

Would love to hear a recording of the show as well!

[Jaap]

Seems to be a Diana-fan issue. If she sings familiar songs, SHE DOESN'T SING ANYTHING NEW!!! And if Diana chooses new material, WHERE ARE THE FAMILIAR SONGS??

Was not intended at criticism, more as a surprise as Do You Know was/is such a fixed feature, sequencing into Ain't No Mountain. I would guess that fans who go to multiple concerts over the years prefer to hear different songs -- I know I do. It was great to hear Ross sing You Are Not Alone in 1997 in Rotterdam; also seeing Ross in 1995 singing all those songs from Take Me Higher before the album was out was a memorable experience [[I was particularly surprised when she started singing "At first I was afraid..." -- obviously, that is no longer a surprise). Yet I understand that she must sing her signature songs for the majority of her audience that only go to see her perform one or two times in their life.

[PeaceNHarmony]

Was not intended at criticism, more as a surprise as Do You Know was/is such a fixed feature, sequencing into Ain't No Mountain. I would guess that fans who go to multiple concerts over the years prefer to hear different songs -- I know I do. It was great to hear Ross sing You Are Not Alone in 1997 in Rotterdam; also seeing Ross in 1995 singing all those songs from Take Me Higher before the album was out was a memorable experience [[I was particularly surprised when she started singing "At first I was afraid..." -- obviously, that is no longer a surprise). Yet I understand that she must sing her signature songs for the majority of her audience that only go to see her perform one or two times in their life.Understood. I did not mean to refer to you specifically. I also get the point about signature songs but it reaches the point that some performers are lucky to have SO many signature songs that a concert can become unwieldly! I remember back in Roberta Flack's glory years a talk show interviewer asked Roberta about how she chose songs for a concert; Flack replied that she did her best to select proven popular songs along with songs she loved to perform as well as an unexpected choice or two. I recall her laughingly saying that she had maybe 5 albums out and if she sang every song each concert attendee wanted to hear the concert would never end! As for this Radio City show, I would guess that the performance was tightened a bit due to the family health crisis Diana was dealing with -

[Jaap]

I like the idea of "The Anti Tour" that Kylie Minogue did in 2012. Not only did she tone down the show [[no dancers, smaller venues), but -- more importantly -- she mostly sang b-sides and non-single album tracks, leaving out the obvious hits. Always thought this would be a nice [[and commercial) option for Ross, a "Stolen Moments" kind of concert, but then "Hidden Gems," not focusing only on the LSTB and other jazz songs, but on her own rich catalogue of songs she never performs -- true hidden gems.

[Bluebrock]

I like the idea of "The Anti Tour" that Kylie Minogue did in 2012. Not only did she tone down the show [[no dancers, smaller venues), but -- more importantly -- she mostly sang b-sides and non-single album tracks, leaving out the obvious hits. Always thought this would be a nice [[and commercial) option for Ross, a "Stolen Moments" kind of concert, but then "Hidden Gems," not focusing only on the LSTB and other jazz songs, but on her own rich catalogue of songs she never performs -- true hidden gems.

She would never do that. It would be way too much time and effort for Ms Ross and her band to rehearse material they have not performed previously.
Nowadays it is a safe, tried tested and approved set. No risks will be taken. No real surprises will be unveiled. It may be boring for long term fans, but her set will be aimed firmly at the mainstream audience.
A good idea in theory, and maybe something she could have done 10-15 years ago, but not a hope in hell these days.

[sup_fan]

She would never do that. It would be way too much time and effort for Ms Ross and her band to rehearse material they have not performed previously.
Nowadays it is a safe, tried tested and approved set. No risks will be taken. No real surprises will be unveiled. It may be boring for long term fans, but her set will be aimed firmly at the mainstream audience.
A good idea in theory, and maybe something she could have done 10-15 years ago, but not a hope in hell these days.

what would be fun [[although i get it that it's probably just as unlikely) would be for Diana to better utilize social media. maybe the month of February she focuses on the DR 76 album. then the next month she's talking about The Wiz, or TCB or whatever. Or maybe she invites Valerie S and they discuss Mountain together, etc.

she could record 1x, her talking about the album. Playing a few tracks and maybe singing along, etc. Then the content could be sliced and diced into various segments for all of her social channels. Maybe several 45 sec clips on FB, some tweets, maybe an edited longer version as a podcast.

again i realize this is fantasy.

[reese]

what would be fun [[although i get it that it's probably just as unlikely) would be for Diana to better utilize social media. maybe the month of February she focuses on the DR 76 album. then the next month she's talking about The Wiz, or TCB or whatever. Or maybe she invites Valerie S and they discuss Mountain together, etc.

she could record 1x, her talking about the album. Playing a few tracks and maybe singing along, etc. Then the content could be sliced and diced into various segments for all of her social channels. Maybe several 45 sec clips on FB, some tweets, maybe an edited longer version as a podcast.

again i realize this is fantasy.

A nice fantasy though. :-)

The longer this pandemic lasts, I suspect we'll see some artists connecting with their fans in ways they wouldn't have even considered two years ago. Some more creative than others, probably. But still connecting. I mean, who knew Dionne would become the new queen of Twitter?

[TNSUN]

I'm sure the Radio City 84 set list changed from night to night but this is the recording [[through the sound board) that circulated. She did the first 4 songs in a T-shirt and jeans.

Overture
Home
New York State Of Mind
It's My Turn
My Man
Ain't No Mountain High Enough
Upside Down
Missing You
Mirror Mirror
I'm Coming Out
Rescue Me/So Close/ Why Do Fools Fall In Love
Baby Love/Stop!/Love Is Like An Itching
You Can't Hurry Love
Swept Away
Reach Out And Touch
Endless Love
Forever Young
Swept Away Reprise

Does anyone remember in what year Diana Ross sang "Remember Me" at Radio City Music Hall? I believe it was 1984. As it was not listed on the above setlist, could it have been during another year or an encore song during her 1984 concert run at Radio City Music Hall in NYC ?

[reese]

Does anyone remember in what year Diana Ross sang "Remember Me" at Radio City Music Hall? I believe it was 1984. As it was not listed on the above setlist, could it have been during another year or an encore song during her 1984 concert run at Radio City Music Hall in NYC ?

I believe she did a 1978 engagement at Radio City that featured the show with the movie screen. She probably sang REMEMBER ME then.

[Bluebrock]

what would be fun [[although i get it that it's probably just as unlikely) would be for Diana to better utilize social media. maybe the month of February she focuses on the DR 76 album. then the next month she's talking about The Wiz, or TCB or whatever. Or maybe she invites Valerie S and they discuss Mountain together, etc.

she could record 1x, her talking about the album. Playing a few tracks and maybe singing along, etc. Then the content could be sliced and diced into various segments for all of her social channels. Maybe several 45 sec clips on FB, some tweets, maybe an edited longer version as a podcast.

again i realize this is fantasy.

As you quite rightly say there is more chance of Elvis and Tupac being found alive and well on Fantasy Island whilst recording a duet of Love Twins.
These occasional bizarre tweets are the best we can hope for.

[PeaceNHarmony]

what would be fun [[although i get it that it's probably just as unlikely) would be for Diana to better utilize social media. maybe the month of February she focuses on the DR 76 album. then the next month she's talking about The Wiz, or TCB or whatever. Or maybe she invites Valerie S and they discuss Mountain together, etc.

she could record 1x, her talking about the album. Playing a few tracks and maybe singing along, etc. Then the content could be sliced and diced into various segments for all of her social channels. Maybe several 45 sec clips on FB, some tweets, maybe an edited longer version as a podcast.

again i realize this is fantasy.I truly mean no disrespect whatsoever, and proceed accordingly. I wonder if it's [[much!) younger fans who pose these sorts of propositions. As a 'vintage' fan I, for one, have heard well more than enough Motown recollections to last me a lifetime. Additionally any long-time Diana fan is highly cognizant of Diana not being a backwards-looking person, nor has she ever been particularly smitten with dishing dirt about her professional or personal life. After all, she loved singing The Lady Is A Tramp for years and I think the song's lyrics have several important parallels to her. Diana seems far more Jackie Kennedy than Wendy Williams. At this point all I want is for her to be happy; if she tours again, I'll probably be there. If she records again, I'll give it a try. Yappin' about 40 year old albums? I'll pass.

[thanxal]

As you quite rightly say there is more chance of Elvis and Tupac being found alive and well on Fantasy Island whilst recording a duet of Love Twins.

I can hear the Andantes on that track. I'm sure its not Flo or Mary.

[Jaap]

She would never do that. I know... I was just giving her free advise!

[daviddh]

Why was this cancelled.
This would be great to have or have on netflix

[Ollie9]

what would be fun [[although i get it that it's probably just as unlikely) would be for Diana to better utilize social media. maybe the month of February she focuses on the DR 76 album. then the next month she's talking about The Wiz, or TCB or whatever. Or maybe she invites Valerie S and they discuss Mountain together, etc.

she could record 1x, her talking about the album. Playing a few tracks and maybe singing along, etc. Then the content could be sliced and diced into various segments for all of her social channels. Maybe several 45 sec clips on FB, some tweets, maybe an edited longer version as a podcast.

again i realize this is fantasy.

We all know it’s never likely to happen sup, but it sure makes for a great fantasy.
I for one never tire of hearing personal recollections of how an album was put together and the recording process involved. Certainly the age of an album makes not the slightest difference. Perhaps it’s my inner child that prevents me from becoming jaded and always eager to learn more......Who knows?.
I’m hoping that if or when we ever get that final book, Diana will be more forthcoming in sharing her memories of the recording of some of those classic albums, not to mention her film outings. We can all but hope.

[lucky2012]

We all know it’s never likely to happen sup, but it sure makes for a great fantasy.
I for one never tire of hearing personal recollections of how an album was put together and the recording process involved. Certainly the age of an album makes not the slightest difference. Perhaps it’s my inner child that prevents me from becoming jaded and always eager to learn more......Who knows?.
I’m hoping that if or when we ever get that final book, Diana will be more forthcoming in sharing her memories of the recording of some of those classic albums, not to mention her film outings. We can all but hope.

Agree. Not likely, but a great wish. I would be happy if she'd sit and reminisce and discuss whatever she remembers of each of the landmark albums and songs [[to be chosen by me, of course :rolleyes:). Then she could also reveal her personal favorites and why.

[Ollie9]

The
Agree. Not likely, but a great wish. I would be happy if she'd sit and reminisce and discuss whatever she remembers of each of the landmark albums and songs [[to be chosen by me, of course :rolleyes:). Then she could also reveal her personal favorites and why.

Absolutely lucky. It would most certainly be interesting to here her take on things. Perhaps a book discussing her music career alone would be the way to go. The concepts for certain albums. Songs she likes or is not terribly fond of. The reason she was drawn to certain producers.....We can only dream. ;)

[Bluebrock]

The

Absolutely lucky. It would most certainly be interesting to here her take on things. Perhaps a book discussing her music career alone would be the way to go. The concepts for certain albums. Songs she likes or is not terribly fond of. The reason she was drawn to certain producers.....We can only dream. ;)

Yes you can dream Ollie because that is the nearest we shall get to it ever becoming a reality.
Such things have no interest to her whatsoever.

[Ollie9]

Yes you can dream Ollie because that is the nearest we shall get to it ever becoming a reality.
Such things have no interest to her whatsoever.

In the reality of day, i doubt she would have much to tell anyway. I think Diana is an artist that comes in, records her songs and goes home. I doubt there has been very much in depth discussion regarding album concepts over the years.

[nomis]

Diana had some interesting things to say about her musical career in billboard in 1993 for her anniversary she said she didn't like later Supremes hits like lovechild she also said she was told she couldn't include a live recording of her and marvin gaye on stage in 1983 for the forever box set by Motown because it wasn't up to standard but she really wanted to put it it was fascinating interview

[daviddh]

Strange since love child has been in her show for almost twenty years.
I thought it was living in shame she didn't like but seems like an interesting article to read

[Ollie9]

Diana had some interesting things to say about her musical career in billboard in 1993 for her anniversary she said she didn't like later Supremes hits like lovechild she also said she was told she couldn't include a live recording of her and marvin gaye on stage in 1983 for the forever box set by Motown because it wasn't up to standard but she really wanted to put it it was fascinating interview

Perhaps that’s the reason why ‘Secret’s Of A Sparrow’ was so scant on musical info. Her feelings on such like had all pretty much been revealed in that interview.
I didn’t know she hated “Love Child” and most probably “SDWBT”. From this revelation and from what Bluebrock has revealed, there appears to be rather a large proportion of her own recordings she doesn't much care for.
Love Child, all singles and probably albums released 68-69
Everything Is Everything
Last Time I Saw Him
Baby It’s Me
Ross 78
Why Do Fools
Silk Electric
ross 83
Workin’ Overtime.
I Love You.
And that’s just the ones we know of. I wonder if this is one of reasons she is reluctant to discuss her music in much depth?.

[nomis]

Strange since love child has been in her show for almost twenty years.
I thought it was living in shame she didn't like but seems like an interesting article to read I think your correct david and I got love child mixed up with shame I will try and dig out the article out I have it somewhere

[nomis]

From memory she is asked what she thinks of later singles love child and I'm livin in shame tackling social issues and she replies that she prefers the earlier hits and doesn't like the later release's something along those lines anyway

[nomis]

Perhaps that’s the reason why ‘Secret’s Of A Sparrow’ was so scant on musical info. Her feelings on such like had all pretty much been revealed in that interview.
I didn’t know she hated “Love Child” and most probably “SDWBT”. From this revelation and from what Bluebrock has revealed, there appears to be rather a large proportion of her own recordings she doesn't much care for.
Love Child, all singles and probably albums released 68-69
Everything Is Everything
Last Time I Saw Him
Baby It’s Me
Ross 78
Why Do Fools
Silk Electric
ross 83
Workin’ Overtime.
I Love You.
And that’s just the ones we know of. I wonder if this is one of reasons she is reluctant to discuss her music in much depth?.

There's her revealing comment in boy george's autobiography .....when fan marilyn asks her about them she replies.."there just songs.."

[reese]

From memory she is asked what she thinks of later singles love child and I'm livin in shame tackling social issues and she replies that she prefers the earlier hits and doesn't like the later release's something along those lines anyway

In her book, Diana wrote that she enjoyed songs like LOVE CHILD and I'm LIVIN' IN SHAME but for her, they weren't as wonderful as the older HDH songs that were written especially for them, like BABY LOVE, COME SEE ABOUT ME, and STOP!

When she did LOVE CHILD and SHAME, she said they were about someone else's life. So when she did them, she likened it to doing a movie.

[Bluebrock]

Strange since love child has been in her show for almost twenty years.
I thought it was living in shame she didn't like but seems like an interesting article to read
I have no recollection of her disliking Love Child. She certainly did not mention that to me. She did especially like the early Supremes songs, but i find it highly unlikely she would include Love Child in recent sets if she disliked the song in any way.

[Ollie9]

There's her revealing comment in boy george's autobiography .....when fan marilyn asks her about them she replies.."there just songs.."

Her music has had such an impact on people’s lives that it’s hard to understand her indifference. She has mentioned she likes to hear how certain songs have helped people during difficult times in their lives, but that appears to be about it.
I think it’s performing live that is of most interest to her. roar of the greasepaint, smell of the crowd.
As a music buff i find it a little frustrating, but nothing that stops me being any less of a fan.

[Bluebrock]

Her music has had such an impact on people’s lives that it’s hard to understand her indifference. She has mentioned she likes to hear how certain songs have helped people during difficult times in their lives, but that appears to be about it.
I think it’s performing live that is of most interest to her. roar of the greasepaint, smell of the crowd.
As a music buff i find it a little frustrating, but nothing that stops me being any less of a fan.

I cannot put into words how frustrating i found her own indifference to her music.
It was even more frustrating to hear her recall her indifferent albums far better than the stronger one's. She could talk you through Everything is Everything, Last time i saw him and Diana and Marvin, but if you mention Diana Ross70, 76 or Surrender and you would be met with a wall of silence. It actually upset me initially, but i quickly got over it and i have laughed about it for the past 30 years.
This is the main reason why we will never ever get her to publicly discuss any individual albums in any detail.

[sup_fan]

I cannot put into words how frustrating i found her own indifference to her music.
It was even more frustrating to hear her recall her indifferent albums far better than the stronger one's. She could talk you through Everything is Everything, Last time i saw him and Diana and Marvin, but if you mention Diana Ross70, 76 or Surrender and you would be met with a wall of silence. It actually upset me initially, but i quickly got over it and i have laughed about it for the past 30 years.
This is the main reason why we will never ever get her to publicly discuss any individual albums in any detail.

i'm guessing here but i wonder if the reason she remembers the poor albums is because she had little to no involvement with ANY of the albums. she wasn't determining track listing, deciding on cover art or anything along those lines. just was just constantly recording and performing and motown pulled together whatever they wanted.

because Everything, Last Time and the duet album were such disappointments, perhaps they really stick out in her mind because of that fact. and while she still wasn't involved in these [[relative) duds, because they were such let downs, there was more attention from her regarding them

[lucky2012]

i'm guessing here but i wonder if the reason she remembers the poor albums is because she had little to no involvement with ANY of the albums. she wasn't determining track listing, deciding on cover art or anything along those lines. just was just constantly recording and performing and motown pulled together whatever they wanted.

because Everything, Last Time and the duet album were such disappointments, perhaps they really stick out in her mind because of that fact. and while she still wasn't involved in these [[relative) duds, because they were such let downs, there was more attention from her regarding them

Good point, sup_fan!

[Bluebrock]

Good point, sup_fan!

Totally agree. I think my old friend Sup Fan has hit the nail on the head with this one.
Now why the hell did i not think of that?
There is hope for you yet Sup fan. Lol.....

[sup_fan]

Totally agree. I think my old friend Sup Fan has hit the nail on the head with this one.
Now why the hell did i not think of that?
There is hope for you yet Sup fan. Lol.....

lolol Blue i am who i am today due to your tutelage. us younger fans absorbing the knowledge and insights from the elderly fans. oops i mean elder fan lolol

[Bluebrock]

lolol Blue i am who i am today due to your tutelage. us younger fans absorbing the knowledge and insights from the elderly fans. oops i mean elder fan lolol

A cheeky response but a damn funny one too!

[sup_fan]

A cheeky response but a damn funny one too!

;) lolol ya know i love ya Blue

[Bluebrock]

;) lolol ya know i love ya Blue

Coming right back at you!

[nomis]

I cannot put into words how frustrating i found her own indifference to her music.
It was even more frustrating to hear her recall her indifferent albums far better than the stronger one's. She could talk you through Everything is Everything, Last time i saw him and Diana and Marvin, but if you mention Diana Ross70, 76 or Surrender and you would be met with a wall of silence. It actually upset me initially, but i quickly got over it and i have laughed about it for the past 30 years.
This is the main reason why we will never ever get her to publicly discuss any individual albums in any detail.

It's wonderful to hear these memories bluebrock I was shocked when she mixed up a duet with the temptation's with marvin gaye on american idol

[Bluebrock]

It's wonderful to hear these memories bluebrock I was shocked when she mixed up a duet with the temptation's with marvin gaye on american idol
I don't recall that particular incident, but it does not surprise me in the slightest.

[nomis]

On memory she said ruffin was gaye I sat there stunned

[Ollie9]

On memory she said ruffin was gaye I sat there stunned

At least she didn’t think it was Julio Iglesias lol.

[Bluebrock]

On memory she said ruffin was gaye I sat there stunned

Oh no! I am so glad i did not witness that debacle.

[Bluebrock]

At least she didn’t think it was Julio Iglesias lol.

Every cloud Ollie. Every cloud.......

[reese]

I don't recall that particular incident, but it does not surprise me in the slightest.

One of the IDOL contestants, Phil Stacy, sang I'M GONNA MAKE YOU LOVE ME. During a taped interview after his rehearsal, Diana said it was a song she did with Marvin Gaye and it brought back a lot of memories.

Now I wouldn't want to correct The Boss either. But considering the interview was taped, it is telling that no one on the show bothered to look it up. They could have easily edited that comment out.

[Bluebrock]

One of the IDOL contestants, Phil Stacy, sang I'M GONNA MAKE YOU LOVE ME. During a taped interview after his rehearsal, Diana said it was a song she did with Marvin Gaye and it brought back a lot of memories.

Now I wouldn't want to correct The Boss either. But considering the interview was taped, it is telling that no one on the show bothered to look it up. They could have easily edited that comment out.

I wonder what those "fond memories" were! She either had a very vivid imagination or maybe she was going through a tough time.
There is no excusing such comments, but as you rightly point out production staff could have surely done some research and edited out the unfortunate comments.
That situation would never have occurred on my watch. Not sure who was taking care of her at that particular time but he/she was certainly not doing their job to an acceptable standard.

[TheMotownManiac]

I'm still getting over the $30 top ticket price. LOL. Those really were the days.

I will say that 70 minutes does seem rather short for a Diana concert, at least back then. Nowadays this is about the norm. But I remember her performing for two hours when I saw her in 1983 at a $17.50 top ticket price.

I suspect the reviewer wasn't aware of what was happening in Diana's life at the time of the Radio City engagement. Her mother was dying from cancer and Diana was doing her show every night, flying back to Detroit to spend the day with her mom before flying back to NYC for the next night's show. This activity probably accounted for the show's shortened running time.

I saw Diana in concert a few weeks later and had no complaints at all. I don't think the news of her mother's death had yet been released.

The set list was [[from my best memory):

IT'S MY TURN
AIN'T NO MOUNTAIN HIGH ENOUGH
TOUCH ME IN THE MORNING
LET'S GO UP
YOU CAN'T HURRY LOVE
REACH OUT AND TOUCH
MISSING YOU
MIRROR, MIRROR

Intermission

I'M COMING OUT
UPSIDE DOWN
MUSCLES
HOME
50s MEDLEY: RESCUE ME/SO CLOSE/WHY DO FOOLS FALL IN LOVE
[[*Interesting note: only the last song was really from the 50s)
SUPREMES MEDLEY: REFLECTIONS/BABY LOVE/STOP!/ITCHING IN MY HEART
REMEMBER ME
SWEPT AWAY

Costume change

ENDLESS LOVE
FOREVER YOUNG

Costume change

SWEPT AWAY [[reprise)

I’m completely sympathetic to the horror Miss Ross was going through at the time, however, it’s still no excuse for that short of a show – especially when you’re breaking records at radio city music Hall. Either do the show or don’t do the show, but don’t short change the people that came to see you do your best. I wasn’t there, but everyone I know who was there was not happy.

[Bluebrock]

I’m completely sympathetic to the horror Miss Ross was going through at the time, however, it’s still no excuse for that short of a show – especially when you’re breaking records at radio city music Hall. Either do the show or don’t do the show, but don’t short change the people that came to see you do your best. I wasn’t there, but everyone I know who was there was not happy.

It's difficult to cancel shows at short notice.
I can well understand why some fans would feel shortchanged, but i do believe most would have understood had they known what was going on in her personal life. Sadly they did not know.

[khansperac]

Wasn’t she performing 2 shows a night on some of those dates?

[TheMotownManiac]

It's difficult to cancel shows at short notice.
I can well understand why some fans would feel shortchanged, but i do believe most would have understood had they known what was going on in her personal life. Sadly they did not know.

‘you’re right - many fans would have understood, but I think the majority would still feel shortchanged. Another 15-20 minutes would have made all the difference - including A frank talk about her mom and flying back and forth would have made a warm moment no one would ever forget. Diana Ross Pouring her heart out to us sold out radio city music Hall…… I get chills just thinking about it.

[Bluebrock]

‘you’re right - many fans would have understood, but I think the majority would still feel shortchanged. Another 15-20 minutes would have made all the difference - including A frank talk about her mom and flying back and forth would have made a warm moment no one would ever forget. Diana Ross Pouring her heart out to us sold out radio city music Hall…… I get chills just thinking about it.
As we all know only too well Ms Ross is not someone prone to sharing her personal issues in public.
Piers Morgan has been trying to secure her as a guest on his UK Life Stories tv programme for many years to no avail. She would never agree to airing her linen dirty or otherwise in public.

[Ollie9]

I’m sure she did what she thought was best at the time. Perhaps she does harbour some regrets about not cancelling the concerts and spending more time with her mother, who knows.
Personally I would have cancelled. I seem to recall her cancelling shows when one of her dogs died after ingesting rat poison a stagehand had left out.

[reese]

I’m sure she did what she thought was best at the time. Perhaps she does harbour some regrets about not cancelling the concerts and spending more time with her mother, who knows.
Personally I would have cancelled. I seem to recall her cancelling shows when one of her dogs died after ingesting rat poison a stagehand had left out.

In her book, Diana did say that in retrospect she wished she had just cancelled the Radio City engagement. But keeping her word is very important and she has rarely cancelled an engagement once committed.

The incident re her dogs dying after ingesting rat poison happened at the Latin Casino in New Jersey in 1969. It happened on the evening of the first performance. Unfortunately that engagement was to last two weeks and was completely sold out. The cancellation led to a lawsuit that was settled years later.

[Bluebrock]

In her book, Diana did say that in retrospect she wished she had just cancelled the Radio City engagement. But keeping her word is very important and she has rarely cancelled an engagement once committed.

The incident re her dogs dying after ingesting rat poison happened at the Latin Casino in New Jersey in 1969. It happened on the evening of the first performance. Unfortunately that engagement was to last two weeks and was completely sold out. The cancellation led to a lawsuit that was settled years later.

I wasn't aware of that particular situation. It seems a little extreme to cancel for the loss of a dog however sad that may be.
She was only young at the time, but i am surprised Berry allowed her to cancel.

[RanRan79]

She should've cancelled and spent that precious time with her mother. On the other hand she may have felt that in such a trying time, spending some time in her second home- the stage- may have been what she needed to keep her sanity. I can understand fans griping because of the short show without knowing the reasons why, but find it cringy to criticize it after finding out why the show was short. 70 minutes has to be better than zero minutes. Any fan should've been grateful to get anything out of her during such a horrible time in her life.

[sup_fan]

I wasn't aware of that particular situation. It seems a little extreme to cancel for the loss of a dog however sad that may be.
She was only young at the time, but i am surprised Berry allowed her to cancel.

it was June of 69. they barely completed a third of the engagement. Booked June 2 - 15, cancelled on June 6.

i've always wondered if there was more to the cancellation than was made public. and i'm totally speculating here. the group had been touring constantly, they'd had a wildly successful fall and EOR 69 with Love Child, the temps duets, TCB. Diana was starting to do her solo gigs, such as Like Hep which aired in April. No Matter What Sign had just bombed and so her full solo career was still on hold.

Maybe this was a time of just total, utter exhaustion. Group morale was dropping to a new low. maybe Berry realized that she was at a breaking point again.

again, this is just speculation.

[sup_fan]

She should've cancelled and spent that precious time with her mother. On the other hand she may have felt that in such a trying time, spending some time in her second home- the stage- may have been what she needed to keep her sanity. I can understand fans griping because of the short show without knowing the reasons why, but find it cringy to criticize it after finding out why the show was short. 70 minutes has to be better than zero minutes. Any fan should've been grateful to get anything out of her during such a horrible time in her life.

agreed. i think if she had cancelled, refunded the tickets and made a simple public statement about it, the public would have easily supported her.

this is sort of one of those instances where even just a simple and small display of humbleness could have done wonders for her public persona. I realize it's wildly inappropriate to suggest using her lovely mothers terrible illness and death as a publicity ploy. just saying that it isn't necessary to forever keep up this wall of invincibility. people appreciate Diana's strength and work ethics. but they find her a "cold bitch" which is not really true. simply acknowledging she's human with normal emotions [[especially around such a touching situation) would not tarnish her overall image of strength

[RanRan79]

The crazy thing is that Florence was booked at the Latin Casino about nine or so months prior to DRATS and she also cancelled her gig. I don't remember a reason being given, but assume that so late in her pregnancy that probably had a lot to do with it. Anyway, I imagine after two failed "Supremes" engagements that the group's name had to be mud at the LC. Does anyone know if the group or it's singers as solos were ever booked there again?

[sup_fan]

The crazy thing is that Florence was booked at the Latin Casino about nine or so months prior to DRATS and she also cancelled her gig. I don't remember a reason being given, but assume that so late in her pregnancy that probably had a lot to do with it. Anyway, I imagine after two failed "Supremes" engagements that the group's name had to be mud at the LC. Does anyone know if the group or it's singers as solos were ever booked there again?

really?!?! i'd not heard that Flo was booked there. can someone confirm this?

the Latin Casino was a VERY big deal. maybe not quite Copa or the Flamingo. but i would think this was WAY out of Flo's league at the time

[reese]

The crazy thing is that Florence was booked at the Latin Casino about nine or so months prior to DRATS and she also cancelled her gig. I don't remember a reason being given, but assume that so late in her pregnancy that probably had a lot to do with it. Anyway, I imagine after two failed "Supremes" engagements that the group's name had to be mud at the LC. Does anyone know if the group or it's singers as solos were ever booked there again?

Was Flo really booked at the Latin Casino? That seems a rather prestigious gig for someone with no solo hits, especially a 1500 seat venue. I know she did a gig at the Wonder Garden in Atlantic City that didn't go well.

I read that Diana never appeared at the venue again but I don't know about the 70s Supremes. Although considering a lawsuit resulted from the 1969 cancellation, I suspect there were no more Supremes engagements either.

[RanRan79]

I thought it was in Flo's biography, but just checked and don't see it. However, that information came from Al Abrams whom I recall was talking about how frustrating it was to be in the Flo Ballard solo camp. She got the booking at the LC through the talent agency she was signed with. It was, obviously, considered a lucrative and high profile gig. At the very last minute Flo cancelled the gig. Abrams didn't give a reason for the cancellation, but expressed his frustration at the fact that Flo had at her feet what could have been a career elevator but failed to take advantage of it. I recall the time frame as being September 1968. This would have been a month to weeks before she gave birth prematurely.

[Bluebrock]

it was June of 69. they barely completed a third of the engagement. Booked June 2 - 15, cancelled on June 6.

i've always wondered if there was more to the cancellation than was made public. and i'm totally speculating here. the group had been touring constantly, they'd had a wildly successful fall and EOR 69 with Love Child, the temps duets, TCB. Diana was starting to do her solo gigs, such as Like Hep which aired in April. No Matter What Sign had just bombed and so her full solo career was still on hold.

Maybe this was a time of just total, utter exhaustion. Group morale was dropping to a new low. maybe Berry realized that she was at a breaking point again.

again, this is just speculation.

I think you may be on to something here.
It was almost 20 years before i worked with her but the Ms Ross i worked with would not cancel a string of shows due to the death of a pet. She quite simply would not have done that.
Looking at the dates you provided i strongly suspect the shows were cancelled for an altogether different reason.
End of discussion.

[sup_fan]

I thought it was in Flo's biography, but just checked and don't see it. However, that information came from Al Abrams whom I recall was talking about how frustrating it was to be in the Flo Ballard solo camp. She got the booking at the LC through the talent agency she was signed with. It was, obviously, considered a lucrative and high profile gig. At the very last minute Flo cancelled the gig. Abrams didn't give a reason for the cancellation, but expressed his frustration at the fact that Flo had at her feet what could have been a career elevator but failed to take advantage of it. I recall the time frame as being September 1968. This would have been a month to weeks before she gave birth prematurely.

wow - very interesting. i'd not heard this story. but had heard that Flo and Tommy were difficult to work with. what those "difficulties" were i don't know

Flo had been a star but was certainly starting over. the label would, naturally, be experimenting with different producers, styles and sounds. she would need to hone her craft as a solo star on stage and develop her abilities and confidence as a single entity. how to run an entire show and carry all of the material, how to engage throughout the whole show as the sole point of reference and interact with the audience

if people had been trying to help her re-establish herself and then were undermined like this story suggests, that's a very damaging situation

[RanRan79]

I imagine Tommy's difficulties stemmed from his inexperience. What made him think he could go from limo driver and lackey to managing a singing career will always be one of the million dollar questions. What made Flo go along with it probably lies in the ingredients of a great song, many great songs, where a woman stands by her man...even when he's driving them off the road.

In Stephanie Campbell's interview with George Kerr, he said that he and Flo butted heads in the studio because she would sometimes refuse to be directed. I'll never forget one of his quotes of her was "I'm Flo Ballard and I know what I'm talking about". He also said she'd come to the studio smelling of alcohol, leading to the conclusion that she wasn't always sober, which makes sense if she's making overly grandiose statements like "I'm Flo Ballard and...". On the other hand, Robert Bateman had no problem with Flo, so some of it may have been personality conflicts.

Yeah, Flo was starting over, almost from scratch. The frustrating thing- in post examination of it all- is the "what ifs" if certain factors had not been present. I still say that being pregnant and attempting a solo career was almost a sure sign that this wasn't going to work. Can you imagine the morning sickness and cravings and weight gain and strain of voice while trying to make a go of it? Yikes! What if she had waited until 1969 to make a go? What if she had told Tommy "hell no" to managing her? What if she had gone to another record label? I could go on and on. But clearly her development as a solo artist hinged on what she could do that first year and there was just too much going on for it to really work. I just hate that after ABC and all of that, that she got tied up in her legal battles and didn't focus on continuing the career somewhere else. She could've fought the lawyer and Motown and continued singing at the same time. But as was evidenced toward the end of her time with the Supremes, when Flo got locked in on her anger, she didn't always see the forest for the trees. I kind of know the feeling myself.

[sup_fan]

I imagine Tommy's difficulties stemmed from his inexperience. What made him think he could go from limo driver and lackey to managing a singing career will always be one of the million dollar questions. What made Flo go along with it probably lies in the ingredients of a great song, many great songs, where a woman stands by her man...even when he's driving them off the road.

In Stephanie Campbell's interview with George Kerr, he said that he and Flo butted heads in the studio because she would sometimes refuse to be directed. I'll never forget one of his quotes of her was "I'm Flo Ballard and I know what I'm talking about". He also said she'd come to the studio smelling of alcohol, leading to the conclusion that she wasn't always sober, which makes sense if she's making overly grandiose statements like "I'm Flo Ballard and...". On the other hand, Robert Bateman had no problem with Flo, so some of it may have been personality conflicts.

Yeah, Flo was starting over, almost from scratch. The frustrating thing- in post examination of it all- is the "what ifs" if certain factors had not been present. I still say that being pregnant and attempting a solo career was almost a sure sign that this wasn't going to work. Can you imagine the morning sickness and cravings and weight gain and strain of voice while trying to make a go of it? Yikes! What if she had waited until 1969 to make a go? What if she had told Tommy "hell no" to managing her? What if she had gone to another record label? I could go on and on. But clearly her development as a solo artist hinged on what she could do that first year and there was just too much going on for it to really work. I just hate that after ABC and all of that, that she got tied up in her legal battles and didn't focus on continuing the career somewhere else. She could've fought the lawyer and Motown and continued singing at the same time. But as was evidenced toward the end of her time with the Supremes, when Flo got locked in on her anger, she didn't always see the forest for the trees. I kind of know the feeling myself.

interesting. i hadn't heard specifics but had heard the general comment that Flo and Tommy were a bit too high on themselves.

i wonder if Flo's view of Tommy was similar to Mary's view of Pedro. when you feel totally alone and nearly abandoned by whatever system/group/people had been supporting you, when you find someone that you think is "on your side" or is capable of protecting you, then you might quickly elevate that person's capabilities.

[RanRan79]

interesting. i hadn't heard specifics but had heard the general comment that Flo and Tommy were a bit too high on themselves.

i wonder if Flo's view of Tommy was similar to Mary's view of Pedro. when you feel totally alone and nearly abandoned by whatever system/group/people had been supporting you, when you find someone that you think is "on your side" or is capable of protecting you, then you might quickly elevate that person's capabilities.

Possibly, but I think it was really just the age old tale of woman in love blinded by man's faults. That was a recurring theme in the music industry, at least back in that time. Diana was lucky in the fact that the man she fell for who controlled her career actually knew what he was doing and was as hell bent on success for her as he was for himself. Flo and Mary were unfortunate enough to fall for men who put themselves above their wives. And of course both men were batterers, although I don't know if Tommy was as volatile as Pedro. Saying "no" to a violent man can come with consequences. The ladies may have felt it was better to go along than to not.

[nomis]

Like many things about flos post Supremes career the details of the domestic violence she endured are murky it's alluded to in several biographies but short on specific details... for flo and Mary sadly domestic violence was very much accepted in that time period... Mary is more forthcoming about her abuse from pedro in supreme faith his rages where usually triggered by paranoia of Mary's relationships with other men

[sup_fan]

yeah i'm not sure about the domestic violence against flo. other than tony's books, are there any other sources? and frankly any trustworthy sources? it certainly could have happened - i wasn't there. but didn't want to assume Tony was accurate

[reese]

yeah i'm not sure about the domestic violence against flo. other than tony's books, are there any other sources? and frankly any trustworthy sources? it certainly could have happened - i wasn't there. but didn't want to assume Tony was accurate

Maxine Ballard's book mentioned Tommy's violence towards Flo. It was also referred to in the AUTOPSY episode dedicated to Flo.

[nomis]

Maxine Ballard's book mentioned Tommy's violence towards Flo. It was also referred to in the AUTOPSY episode dedicated to Flo.

I think it's mentioned in benjamin's book as well

[Ollie9]

Behind the feisty personality Flo presented to the world, she was a sensitive and vulnerable adult.

[Deepdishus2001]

I saw her on September 19, 1984. Still have the ticket stub and it was $30. I remember the opening and she did not come out in a t-shirt and jeans but a beautiful white or pink gown. Could not tell if it was the lighting or not. I distinctly remember Home and New York State of Mind and It's My Turn. Beautiful performances.

The story of her mother being ill was in the NY papers. I recall reading about it. At the end of the show, I remember her coming out in a black and gold robe/wrap and talking with the audience. Honestly can not remember if she talked about her mother or not.

[Albator]

She is very open here too


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc4MiCjlDK0

[jobeterob]

Diana's mother must have passed away relatively young; does anyone know how old she was?

[reese]

Diana's mother must have passed away relatively young; does anyone know how old she was?

She was 68.

[nomis]

the 11 sold out shows grossed $1,772,505,00

[JohnnyB]

the 11 sold out shows grossed $1,772,505,00

I remember reading about the demand for these shows and additional dates being added. If I’m not mistaken, a Sunday afternoon performance was added as well.

For the fans that were there, what was it that created the demand for these shows? Was it due to these being Diana’s first post-Central Park NY shows? Excitement over the new Swept Away LP and it’s single releases? Had it been several years since Diana’s last traditional NY concerts?

What created the frenzy for these shows?

[Albator]

I remember reading about the demand for these shows and additional dates being added. If I’m not mistaken, a Sunday afternoon performance was added as well.

For the fans that were there, what was it that created the demand for these shows? Was it due to these being Diana’s first post-Central Park NY shows? Excitement over the new Swept Away LP and it’s single releases? Had it been several years since Diana’s last traditional NY concerts?

What created the frenzy for these shows? first engagement in NY since 1979.
1984 at Radio City Music Hall september 19, 20,21, 22, 23, at 8 pm and midnight
1984 at Radio City Music Hall september 24 at 8 pm

[PeaceNHarmony]

I remember reading about the demand for these shows and additional dates being added. If I’m not mistaken, a Sunday afternoon performance was added as well.

For the fans that were there, what was it that created the demand for these shows? Was it due to these being Diana’s first post-Central Park NY shows? Excitement over the new Swept Away LP and it’s single releases? Had it been several years since Diana’s last traditional NY concerts?

What created the frenzy for these shows?Actually, quite simple: a beloved singer and entertainer on her [[nearly) annual visit to a city with great taste in performers!

[JohnnyB]

first engagement in NY since 1979.
1984 at Radio City Music Hall september 19, 20,21, 22, 23, at 8 pm and midnight
1984 at Radio City Music Hall september 24 at 8 pm

Thank you! I didn’t realize there had been such a long gap in engagements.

[khansperac]

Although technically New Jersey, she did perform at Giant Stadium. New Yorkers consider that a NY show/appearance.

[jobeterob]

She was 68.

Thanks

Pretty darn young

[PeaceNHarmony]

Although technically New Jersey, she did perform at Giant Stadium. New Yorkers consider that a NY show/appearance.Correct. And Diana had several extended runs at the Westbury Music Theater on Long Island as well, which NYers considered NY shows.

[midnightman]

you can see the sadness in Diana's face over her mothers illness in the picture from after one of these shows [[with her daughters and Bob) included in Taraborelli's "Call Her Miss Ross"

Very telling photo. Bob and Diana's kids all trying to present some semblance of happiness but Diana's anguish is very visible... think her mother died during the middle of these shows too if I'm not mistaken. Devastating to lose your mother no matter how old.

[midnightman]

Thanks

Pretty darn young

Well she had suffered from health problems her whole life.

Remember, the Rosses relocated to Bessemer, Alabama while she was recovering from tuberculosis in the early '50s until she got well.

[benross]

Johnny B, I'll concur with you; there was a Sunday afternoon show, and I saw it.

That day, Diana seemed to have a cold and runny nose and was not as engaged or engaging as usual. There were more young children running up and down the aisle. Too, the sound system may have been amped up too much; I recall having a very bad headache during and after the show.

Radio City's famous gold curtain was mainly closed, with just a small arc, slightly to the left of stage center, open to reveal Diana at or near the end of the show. I think she wore a gown with a strapless top, maybe in blue, and a full skirt of white. She stood absolutely still as she sang Forever Young and as always sang the wrong lyric [["the highest road") but was mesmerizing in part because the lower part of the skirt was lit to look like a rainbow.

The show did seem too short, but truly, I did not mind because the experience was disappointing due to the noise, the kids and Diana's disengagement. And for me, nothing afterward measured up to her 1970 initial solo tour or her 1976/1977 "evening with..." program. Each of those was so perfect, and the later shows from the 1980s and 1990s were less than perfect in so many ways.

[Ollie9]

Johnny B, I'll concur with you; there was a Sunday afternoon show, and I saw it.

That day, Diana seemed to have a cold and runny nose and was not as engaged or engaging as usual. There were more young children running up and down the aisle. Too, the sound system may have been amped up too much; I recall having a very bad headache during and after the show.

Radio City's famous gold curtain was mainly closed, with just a small arc, slightly to the left of stage center, open to reveal Diana at or near the end of the show. I think she wore a gown with a strapless top, maybe in blue, and a full skirt of white. She stood absolutely still as she sang Forever Young and as always sang the wrong lyric [["the highest road") but was mesmerizing in part because the lower part of the skirt was lit to look like a rainbow.

The show did seem too short, but truly, I did not mind because the experience was disappointing due to the noise, the kids and Diana's disengagement. And for me, nothing afterward measured up to her 1970 initial solo tour or her 1976/1977 "evening with..." program. Each of those was so perfect, and the later shows from the 1980s and 1990s were less than perfect in so many ways.

Does not sound like it was a very enjoyable or entertaining evening Ben.
Regarding Diana's 80’s and 90’s concerts, what do you find less perfect when compared to her 70’s performances?.

[nomis]

regarding the less elaborate production and staging in her concerts post Motown split -it all comes down to cost - she became locked in a much simpler show because she wanted less overheads and more profit - the same principle was applied to production costs on her RCA albums [[discussed recently in threads) - she wanted to save. she wanted the least recoupable margin taken from the gross of recording and stage work..thats not to say the concerts from the 80s onwards are not good she just wasnt prepared to absorb the costs Motown had..also music video production was now an integral part of her budget less money went to staging of shows and the money went on glossy video promos to try and sell the songs

[Ollie9]

regarding the less elaborate production and staging in her concerts post Motown split -it all comes down to cost - she became locked in a much simpler show because she wanted less overheads and more profit - the same principle was applied to production costs on her RCA albums [[discussed recently in threads) - she wanted to save. she wanted the least recoupable margin taken from the gross of recording and stage work..thats not to say the concerts from the 80s onwards are not good she just wasnt prepared to absorb the costs Motown had..also music video production was now an integral part of her budget less money went to staging of shows and the money went on glossy video promos to try and sell the songs

I agree, although I don’t think Diana’s 80’s/90’s concerts particularly needed elaborate staging. I certainly wish she would spend a little more on her present shows then she currently does. She sounds so much better when performing with a fuller band/orchestra.