Mary on the right on lp

[franjoy56]

In supreme glamour which i love t death my supreme bible except f one or two errors. mary speaks of her joy and happiness over motown delivering t right on album w t flawless cover and gatefold poster. She says jean vocals on all t tracks was magical all t songs carried a universal theme she also states that even though other voices were used to fill out our sound we were still there. Which makes sense because t idea was to bring mary snd cindy back into t fold as singers unlike how they were not used or buried in t music from 67 through 69.

[marv2]

In supreme glamour which i love t death my supreme bible except f one or two errors. mary speaks of her joy and happiness over motown delivering t right on album w t flawless cover and gatefold poster. She says jean vocals on all t tracks was magical all t songs carried a universal theme she also states that even though other voices were used to fill out our sound we were still there. Which makes sense because t idea was to bring mary snd cindy back into t fold as singers unlike how they were not used or buried in t music from 67 through 69.

Fran that poster from "Right On" hung on the wall in our basement all throughout the 70s. My mom bought the album as soon as it came out.

[thanxal]

I love that cover, but it's not flawless. Once someone pointed out to me the row of missing beads, I can't help but see it every single time I look at the cover. I can't believe that slipped through quality control. But otherwise, it certainly struck the right look at the right time.

[kenneth]

I love that cover, but it's not flawless. Once someone pointed out to me the row of missing beads, I can't help but see it every single time I look at the cover. I can't believe that slipped through quality control. But otherwise, it certainly struck the right look at the right time.

What, pray tell, are you referring to? I'm looking at the photo and on Jean's arm it looks like some of the spangles are missing. Is that it?

Maybe you have to be OCD to notice! LOL

[franjoy56]

What, pray tell, are you referring to? I'm looking at the photo and on Jean's arm it looks like some of the spangles are missing. Is that it?

Maybe you have to be OCD to notice! LOL i never noticed that missing row of beads on jeans gown. How did that slip through did jean make a fuss about it. They should have had new gowns for t shot even t new red pant suits worn on t sullivan show would have sufficed.

[franjoy56]

I bought it t day after it came o ut and hung poster in my liviing room

[marv2]

i never noticed that missing row of beads on jeans gown. How did that slip through did jean make a fuss about it. They should have had new gowns for t shot even t new red pant suits worn on t sullivan show would have sufficed.

I think that cover is a classic! It gives the vibe of "The New Supremes", because they look like a group again and not some big, enlarged head up front and three much smaller figures standing way back behind it! LOL!

[franjoy56]

I think that cover is a classic! It gives the vibe of "The New Supremes", because they look like a group again and not some big, enlarged head up front and three much smaller figures standing way back behind it! LOL! marv i could not agree w u more thr gold gowns go great against t orange tone of t lp cover. I ju s t didnt notice t missing beads bfr but u have t look hard t notice. T makeup and hair are flawless hello

[johnjeb]

I love that cover, but it's not flawless. Once someone pointed out to me the row of missing beads, I can't help but see it every single time I look at the cover. I can't believe that slipped through quality control. But otherwise, it certainly struck the right look at the right time.

Well, I guess I'm embarrassed to admit that I noticed it back in the day and even more embarrassed to point out that if you look at the poster there are also beads missing from Mary's and Cindy's dresses. They do call them "uniforms" so maybe they are stripes to designate rank!

[marv2]

marv i could not agree w u more thr gold gowns go great against t orange tone of t lp cover. I ju s t didnt notice t missing beads bfr but u have t look hard t notice. T makeup and hair are flawless hello

It just looks like they've been spread out. Jean was not a tooth pick. She was a small,but average sized woman.

[marv2]

After not hearing this album for such a very long time, these sounds so brilliant!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewsiTkzASsU

[Bluebrock]

I never noticed the missing beads and cannot even be bothered to check my vinyl album. It is insignificant to me, but the music contained in the grooves was anything but insignificant. Right On is one of the most consistent Supremes of any era. Jean sounded fantastic, and there was not a weak track on the album. It was jam packed with potential hits and i don't think the 70's Supremes ever bettered it. Lovely album.

[thanxal]

It just looks like they've been spread out. Jean was not a tooth pick. She was a small,but average sized woman.
Oh Marv. You’re so deranged. Anything to bash Diana. Look at the second row of missing beads. You can see it starts 1/4 of the way across Jean’s arm. The point was a lack of quality control on the cover of the album and had nothing to do with “your precious”.

[marv2]

Oh Marv. You’re so deranged. Anything to bash Diana. Look at the second row of missing beads. You can see it starts 1/4 of the way across Jean’s arm. The point was a lack of quality control on the cover of the album and had nothing to do with “your precious”.

You're worried about a few beads on a woman's arm and I'm deranged? LOL!!!

[jobeterob]

The album is great but the question is how much Mary Wilson is on the abum

[sup_fan]

hmmmm i do love the cover but i think it could have been better ;) a while i noticed the missing beads, i'm thinking they could have done something a bit more modern


i think this should have been the back cover art. I guess we could still use the gold gowns for the front. they look so hip and modern. it would have also given them a new look. yes they still were in sequins but i think with the new member this more relevant 70s attire works great

16323


i prefer this image for the poster. just find it more captivating. in color of course

16324

[sup_fan]

The album is great but the question is how much Mary Wilson is on the abum

i believe mary is on most of the album tracks. some are just MJC, some are MJC plus andantes. and a couple might be just jean and andantes.

[kenneth]

Oh Marv. You’re so deranged. Anything to bash Diana. Look at the second row of missing beads. You can see it starts 1/4 of the way across Jean’s arm. The point was a lack of quality control on the cover of the album and had nothing to do with “your precious”.

Hey I know how Marv goes after Diana at times, but how does his criticism of Jean's weight go to bashing Ross? I'm missing something.

Oh I get it now...referring to the "toothpick" is a swipe at Diane's thinness. Well she was the "skinny one," after all.

[TheMotownManiac]

I loved this album from day one and still do. I don’t care who is on bg, the tracks are all solid and Jean totally nails every song. It was a relief and thrill to play a new Supremes album and not cringe at at least one cut. I bought it the day it came out and put the poster up on my door where the Greatest Hits paintings had been for three years. I hated that they wore the gold gowns, hated that they were in ill repair, hated that Jean’s was too small and hated she was wearing [[what I thought was) Diana’s old gown - I wanted a new identity for the group. Also, I agree the rust colored bg was an odd choice and Cindy’s hair looked like it just dropped out if the sky and landed on her head. With all of that, it’s the best set they did by far and I overlooked my annoyances with the cover.

[sup_fan]

lololol i'm getting visions of wild wigs flying through the air and dropping down lolol

[thanxal]

Hey I know how Marv goes after Diana at times, but how does his criticism of Jean's weight go to bashing Ross? I'm missing something.

Oh I get it now...referring to the "toothpick" is a swipe at Diane's thinness. Well she was the "skinny one," after all.
And completely and totally irrelevant to a conversation about 1.75 rows of missing beads, yet the opportunity to take a swipe is never left untaken. Therefore the assessment of "deranged". Maybe "obsessed" is a better word? Not sure.

[sup_fan]

the music on RO is amazingly solid. amazing because 1) it's motown and they were notorious for dumping at least 1 idiotic track onto an lp and 2) so many different producers worked on the 12 tracks

a year or so ago, George chimed in with an alt lineup. Everybody was recorded, literally, just days before the album release and so it was a very last minute addition. the alt lineup was:

Ladder
then we can try
the day will come between S and M
Wait a minute
You move me
but i love you more

I got hurt
Steppin on a dream
Take a closer look
Then i met u
life beats
loving country


there are a LOT of great songs prepared at this time. Steppin is wonderful, Life beats. Also from New Ways, Na Na, Thank Him for today, Is there a place, I wish i was ur mirror, Time to break down and come together.

frankly with the first 3 lps and the unreleased material PRIOR to the Promises Kept stuff, the only song i really don't care for is Time and Love. and one of my biggest issues is it being place on Touch. seems so out of place there. but perhaps on NW or RO.

anyway, this was a wildly prolific period for the Supremes!!

[Bluebrock]

i believe mary is on most of the album tracks. some are just MJC, some are MJC plus andantes. and a couple might be just jean and andantes.
Jean told me that she recorded many of the tracks for Right On without Mary and Cindy, and some of the songs on New Ways as well. She couldn't recall specific tracks. She said she recorded many songs that went unreleased. I guess George and Andy would be the best ones to ask regarding just how many Jean led tracks remain in the vaults.

[sup_fan]

well she would have recorded lead vocals without them. typically the schedules for lead recordings were totally different from backgrounds, rarely on the same day.

for instance, I Got Hurt Trying...

the dates we know include:
12/31 recording [[not sure what was recorded this day, perhaps instrumental)
1/15 lead vocals
1/16 additional lead vocals
1/21 backgrounds
1/25 backgrounds rerecorded

So were M and C on 21? or 25? or was it MJC? or only andantes?

then Loving Country was:
1/10 lead
1/18 additional lead
1/23 backgrounds
1/27 additional bg

so it's hard to tell exactly who was doing the singing

[thanxal]

well she would have recorded lead vocals without them. typically the schedules for lead recordings were totally different from backgrounds, rarely on the same day.

for instance, I Got Hurt Trying...

the dates we know include:
12/31 recording [[not sure what was recorded this day, perhaps instrumental)
1/15 lead vocals
1/16 additional lead vocals
1/21 backgrounds
1/25 backgrounds rerecorded

So were M and C on 21? or 25? or was it MJC? or only andantes?

then Loving Country was:
1/10 lead
1/18 additional lead
1/23 backgrounds
1/27 additional bg

so it's hard to tell exactly who was doing the singing

Exactly. The lead singer may not even know who sang backgrounds during the following recording session or may not have known if other voices were blended in after the backgrounds in follow up sessions. The best source is what's on the session cards, if they were kept or even existed in the first place.

[marv2]

Some people need pictures to understand a point being made. I never mentioned Diana Ross, but since you did:

16325

[luckyluckyme]

One interesting feature [[at least to me) of the photo shoot for the album's front/back cover and poster was the placement of each Supremes.
Although Jean was the new lead, Cindy seems to be the featured member: front= Cindy low center; back= Cindy high center; poster= Cindy front position.
In the case of Jean, she's in position 1, 3, 3; Mary -3, 1, 2. Perhaps, Cindy may have asked to be camouflaged slightly for the frontal poses, but was willing to be in the first position for the sideways shot.

[marv2]

What, pray tell, are you referring to? I'm looking at the photo and on Jean's arm it looks like some of the spangles are missing. Is that it?

Maybe you have to be OCD to notice! LOL

He's got something that makes him want to turn everything into and issue or some type of argument. All I can say is RELAX!

[sup_fan]

those DR pics were also taken with a wide-angle lens so it further distorted her already thin, angular frame.

but you are correct. Diana was a twig. was not the voluptuous body type or image.

and just like people fat-shame, we should not thin-shame. did Diana Ross have t&a? no but why should she? a different body type and she was also at times suffering through eating disorders which is nothing to shame or laugh at.

a person's struggles should not be used a weapon against them

[luckyluckyme]

Some people need pictures to understand a point being made. I never mentioned Diana Ross, but since you did:

16325

Thanks, Marv, for demonstrating that God makes people of different sizes and shapes. I don't know the size, shape, age, etc. of those who post here, but I'd bet my bottom dollar that we'd find considerable disparity were we each to post photos of ourselves old & current here.
And as we all know, what makes a person who and what she/he is so much more intricate and fascinating than the mere size and shape of their bodies,

[PeaceNHarmony]

those DR pics were also taken with a wide-angle lens so it further distorted her already thin, angular frame.

but you are correct. Diana was a twig. was not the voluptuous body type or image.

and just like people fat-shame, we should not thin-shame. did Diana Ross have t&a? no but why should she? a different body type and she was also at times suffering through eating disorders which is nothing to shame or laugh at.

a person's struggles should not be used a weapon against themMaybe because he's an a-hole?

[PeaceNHarmony]

Jean told me that she recorded many of the tracks for Right On without Mary and Cindy, and some of the songs on New Ways as well. She couldn't recall specific tracks. She said she recorded many songs that went unreleased. I guess George and Andy would be the best ones to ask regarding just how many Jean led tracks remain in the vaults.There's a great audio interview with Jean where the interviewer asks if Mary sang the high notes on TLC. Jean just busts out laughing. It's priceless.

[PeaceNHarmony]

Thanks, Marv, for demonstrating that God makes people of different sizes and shapes. I don't know the size, shape, age, etc. of those who post here, but I'd bet my bottom dollar that we'd find considerable disparity were we each to post photos of ourselves old & current here.
And as we all know, what makes a person who and what she/he is so much more intricate and fascinating than the mere size and shape of their bodies,I do like Freda, but if we're going full-on tit-for-tat, given the lifelong careers of the two I certainly far prefer Diana's tat [[as do the public, by a massive and exponential multiplier).

[sup_fan]

There's a great audio interview with Jean where the interviewer asks if Mary sang the high notes on TLC. Jean just busts out laughing. It's priceless.

another fan [[maybe Bayou?) mentioned that on many of the 70s songs Jean did join M and C doing backgrounds and she would often sing the 1st soprano line while Cindy did 2nd. and of course Mary was alto.

On loving country its POSSIBLE that's Cindy the high note in the intro section, it sort of sounds like her. obviously not mary lolol [[regardless of whatever jabs Midnight was poking at mary in the interview hehehe) It doesn't sound like an Andante to me.

On Stoned Love when the bgs do that marvelous woo-hooo after Jean sing "i pray peace and love Amen" that's Jean on the top note there.

the layered vocals that Frank did were stunning, although makes it impossible to replicate live. and it's super hard to tell if he used multiple tracks of MJC or if some are andantes or what. Like This Is The Story and Touch there are 3, 4 or even 5 lines going one. hard to identify for certain which is which

[thanxal]

He's got something that makes him want to turn everything into and issue or some type of argument. All I can say is RELAX!
That's funny, coming from you.

[PeaceNHarmony]

another fan [[maybe Bayou?) mentioned that on many of the 70s songs Jean did join M and C doing backgrounds and she would often sing the 1st soprano line while Cindy did 2nd. and of course Mary was alto.

On loving country its POSSIBLE that's Cindy the high note in the intro section, it sort of sounds like her. obviously not mary lolol [[regardless of whatever jabs Midnight was poking at mary in the interview hehehe) It doesn't sound like an Andante to me.

On Stoned Love when the bgs do that marvelous woo-hooo after Jean sing "i pray peace and love Amen" that's Jean on the top note there.

the layered vocals that Frank did were stunning, although makes it impossible to replicate live. and it's super hard to tell if he used multiple tracks of MJC or if some are andantes or what. Like This Is The Story and Touch there are 3, 4 or even 5 lines going one. hard to identify for certain which is whichAgreed all around; it was the interviewer's opinion that it was probably Cindy. Yes, those layered vocals are stunning and Frank Wilson does all the ladies proud. I've always wondered - was their a vocal arranger at Motown, or was that part of production also handled by the producer of note?

[sup_fan]

i'm thinking it was the producer. he [[or the occasional she) would teach the girls their parts, lead them through the recording sessions, push them to give a different approach or sound

in terms of arranging the actual harmony lines, that might be a combination of producers and arrangers. even composers.

if the producer had the song-writing abilities, they might do it. but they might ask an arranger to actually write out the 3-part harmony

[marv2]

That's funny, coming from you.

Good, that means you know how to laugh!

[marv2]

Thanks, Marv, for demonstrating that God makes people of different sizes and shapes. I don't know the size, shape, age, etc. of those who post here, but I'd bet my bottom dollar that we'd find considerable disparity were we each to post photos of ourselves old & current here.
And as we all know, what makes a person who and what she/he is so much more intricate and fascinating than the mere size and shape of their bodies,

No, the point I was making was this guy just jumped up and assumed I was jabbing at Diana Ross when I said "Jean was not a tooth pick" as if Diana Ross was not skinny. My eyes nor yours are lying....she was skinny. She's even poked fun at herself for being skinny. Why do some people worship this woman who is just a singer and cannot tell any truths , even those that are irrefutable about her? It's like they are looking for something, anything to jump on. It is ridiculous LOL!

[marv2]

I do like Freda, but if we're going full-on tit-for-tat, given the lifelong careers of the two I certainly far prefer Diana's tat [[as do the public, by a massive and exponential multiplier).

I'd rather have FREDA [[at that age).......than Diane's "career" hehehehehehehehe!

[kenneth]

Some people need pictures to understand a point being made. I never mentioned Diana Ross, but since you did:

16325

Okay, okay, but even though she was quite thin, I don't think it's fair to compare these two photos. After all, Ross was made up for the very unusual and striking album cover. So I say, this is comparing apples to oranges.

This is one of my favorite photos of Ross at her most glam, and a more fair comparison!

16326

In fact all three of the girls look fabulous in this photo, and I like the look, the way the dresses complement each other but are not identical. I think it gives them a more sophisticated, current image. I'm sure some would object to Diane's gown obviously being chosen so that she'll be the first one people will notice but she was the lead singer after all.

[marv2]

Okay, okay, but even though she was quite thin, I don't think it's fair to compare these two photos. After all, Ross was made up for the very unusual and striking album cover. So I say, this is comparing apples to oranges.

This is one of my favorite photos of Ross at her most glam, and a more fair comparison!

16326

In fact all three of the girls look fabulous in this photo, and I like the look, the way the dresses complement each other but are not identical. I think it gives them a more sophisticated, current image. I'm sure some would object to Diane's gown obviously being chosen so that she'll be the first one people will notice but she was the lead singer after all.

It doesn't matter how they made her up, she would never, ever come to the level of the sexy,beautiful woman Freda Payne was and is! There is not enough make up and horse hair weaves in the World that can do that! I supposed they made her body up too? How about her big head?

[Bluebrock]

It doesn't matter how they made her up, she would never, ever come to the level of the sexy,beautiful woman Freda Payne was and is! There is not enough make up and horse hair weaves in the World that can do that! I supposed they made her body up too? How about her big head?
Do you ever stop bitching? You must be such a sad lonely wretched individual if this is the only way you can bring any "excitement" to your pathetic existence. Get a life you sad sad man.

[PeaceNHarmony]

Do you ever stop bitching? You must be such a sad lonely wretched individual if this is the only way you can bring any "excitement" to your pathetic existence. Get a life you sad sad man.With Wilson's insta-bomb from DWTS he/they are back into full djt 'fake news' mode.

[PeaceNHarmony]

Okay, okay, but even though she was quite thin, I don't think it's fair to compare these two photos. After all, Ross was made up for the very unusual and striking album cover. So I say, this is comparing apples to oranges.

This is one of my favorite photos of Ross at her most glam, and a more fair comparison!

16326

In fact all three of the girls look fabulous in this photo, and I like the look, the way the dresses complement each other but are not identical. I think it gives them a more sophisticated, current image. I'm sure some would object to Diane's gown obviously being chosen so that she'll be the first one people will notice but she was the lead singer after all.That is a great picture, Kenneth! I don't think I've seen it before. Yes, all 3 ladies look GORG!! Best to you -
T

[kenneth]

That is a great picture, Kenneth! I don't think I've seen it before. Yes, all 3 ladies look GORG!! Best to you -
T

Thanks P&H,

I like Marv and he has lots of valuable insights into topics on SDF, and what seems to be a huge storehouse of photos and other interesting memorabilia. I occasionally try to poke fun or tease him out of his terrible and negative obsession with Diane's celebrity status, but I guess it was a mistake this time. His response was very sad and disappointing. Her "big head?" In my experience, lots of celebrities seem to have big heads, probably because they're usually not very tall people and often thinner than the average person. I don't know, I'm no expert, but attacking someone on things they can't help is a sad way to behave and reminiscent of our Insulter-in-Chief.

Marv is of course entitled to his opinion, but I apologize for pushing him on this one. I should have known better! [[Hey, sounds like a good title for an unearthed Marvelettes track!)

K

[thanxal]

Thanks P&H,

I like Marv and he has lots of valuable insights into topics on SDF, and what seems to be a huge storehouse of photos and other interesting memorabilia. I occasionally try to poke fun or tease him out of his terrible and negative obsession with Diane's celebrity status, but I guess it was a mistake this time. His response was very sad and disappointing. Her "big head?" In my experience, lots of celebrities seem to have big heads, probably because they're usually not very tall people and often thinner than the average person. I don't know, I'm no expert, but attacking someone on things they can't help is a sad way to behave and reminiscent of our Insulter-in-Chief.

Marv is of course entitled to his opinion, but I apologize for pushing him on this one. I should have known better! [[Hey, sounds like a good title for an unearthed Marvelettes track!)

K
You have nothing to apologize for.

[jobeterob]

I recall an interview with Diana where she laughingly recalled getting big headed at some point in career; and of course she did! Who brings 700000 people to Central Park, has 18 Number 1 records and an Academy Award Nomination at 28?

Someone that talks like that doesn’t have a big head which might be what the reference is too.

Much better that than having and acting like a big butted Bertha!, like......,,fill in our blank

[captainjames]

That is a great picture, Kenneth! I don't think I've seen it before. Yes, all 3 ladies look GORG!! Best to you -
T

Yes I have this CD [[somewhere) and I remember the TV show that the Supremes were on when they did this. I believe it was Mary that said they had started to use their street clothes and the time was getting close to when Diana would leave. If I am not mistaken becasuse I am not that good at the same gowns, I think this was the same gown on the back cover of her first LP.

Or at least it looks like the same one.16332

[sup_fan]

this pic of DMC was from the opening number they performed on their final Hollywood Palace appearance. They're singing the medley from Hair which included Where Do I Go & Good Morning Starshine.

And yes, that's a solo gown for Diana. and yes again :) she wore on the back of her debut album art.

Later in the show they lip synced Someday while wearing the orange pantsuits.

[Bluebrock]

There's a great audio interview with Jean where the interviewer asks if Mary sang the high notes on TLC. Jean just busts out laughing. It's priceless.

Yes. I know a similar story. Jean really does not take any prisoners with her forthright opinions on Mary. I can better that one peace, but for now we will try and keep the err.. peace. Haha.

[daviddh]

Will we ever get an expanded version of this lp.time is ticking n universal is a sleep at the wheel

[Bluebrock]

Will we ever get an expanded version of this lp.time is ticking n universal is a sleep at the wheel
I very much doubt it.

[daviddh]

I think universal forgot about the fans.
With all the appearances by Mary n Diana and Motown 60th. Yet we got nothing.

[thanxal]

Does anyone have the Right On! album on CD? It took me years to find it and I think I bought it at a shop in Johannesburg in the early 2000s. None of the 70s Supremes CDs from the late 80s/early 90s release seem to be very common. I would love to know how they sold. I did get Mary to sign my copy of the Touch CD. She said she was surprised to see it. [[I also had the original LP and she chose to sign the CD). I had Right On! as well, but she seemed drawn to Touch.

[Bluebrock]

Does anyone have the Right On! album on CD? It took me years to find it and I think I bought it at a shop in Johannesburg in the early 2000s. None of the 70s Supremes CDs from the late 80s/early 90s release seem to be very common. I would love to know how they sold. I did get Mary to sign my copy of the Touch CD. She said she was surprised to see it. [[I also had the original LP and she chose to sign the CD). I had Right On! as well, but she seemed drawn to Touch.
Other than the Jean Terrell boxset the only 70's Supremes cd i own, and indeed have ever seen is Touch. They do not appear to have seen much action so far as reissues are concerned.

[reese]

Does anyone have the Right On! album on CD? It took me years to find it and I think I bought it at a shop in Johannesburg in the early 2000s. None of the 70s Supremes CDs from the late 80s/early 90s release seem to be very common. I would love to know how they sold. I did get Mary to sign my copy of the Touch CD. She said she was surprised to see it. [[I also had the original LP and she chose to sign the CD). I had Right On! as well, but she seemed drawn to Touch.

I do have the RIGHT ON cd, as well as the other 70s Supremes cds that were released. I was lucky enough to be around during the time that Motown was releasing a lot of classics on cd. Every time I went to Tower, it seemed that something that I wasn't expecting had been released, not only by the Supremes, but the Miracles, the Pips, Marvin Gaye, etc.

[kenneth]

Does anyone have the Right On! album on CD? It took me years to find it and I think I bought it at a shop in Johannesburg in the early 2000s. None of the 70s Supremes CDs from the late 80s/early 90s release seem to be very common. I would love to know how they sold. I did get Mary to sign my copy of the Touch CD. She said she was surprised to see it. [[I also had the original LP and she chose to sign the CD). I had Right On! as well, but she seemed drawn to Touch.

I think "Touch" always had special significance for Mary because it was the first single where she shared a lead vocal. I always thought it was a beautiful song and have never understood the controversy about it being issued as a single. [[I'm thinking of you, Jimi Lalumia.)

If anything, it looked forward to the kind of "slow jams" which became popular in the 80s.

I remember that Mary even had a dress with the word "Touch" all over it. I guess we wouldn't see a dress like that in the "Me, Too" movement! I remember seeing a photo of it in one of the R&B mags. Maybe Marv has a copy in his archives.

In the autographed photo I have of Mary, she also signs "Touch" before her name. For some reason, I couldn't get the photo to load vertically but here it is.

16418

[thanxal]

I do have the RIGHT ON cd, as well as the other 70s Supremes cds that were released. I was lucky enough to be around during the time that Motown was releasing a lot of classics on cd. Every time I went to Tower, it seemed that something that I wasn't expecting had been released, not only by the Supremes, but the Miracles, the Pips, Marvin Gaye, etc.
I remember those releases quite well. Sometime about 1992 or 1993, my local Camelot Records had a kiosk with a big Motown logo and seriously discounted CDs. Every week I got my meagre paycheck I would buy 1 or 2. I started with the Supremes and moved to whatever they had left. They didn't sell very well, so over the course of a few months I got many of them. A clerk at the store who knew me very well was kind enough to hold back Same Cooke, Liverpool, and Watchout for me, knowing how much I waited for them as they received inventory.

[captainjames]

I do have "Right On", "Touch", "70's", and "Floy Joy" on CD.

[RanRan79]

I think "Touch" always had special significance for Mary because it was the first single where she shared a lead vocal. I always thought it was a beautiful song and have never understood the controversy about it being issued as a single.

I've seen Mary's autograph with the word "touch" often but never thought about why. Good point about the significance of it to her career, which begs the question why doesn't she include the song in her live act?

I first heard "Touch" when I acquired the 70's Greatest Hits and Rare Classics, which I was lucky enough to purchase within months of becoming a Supremes' album collector back in the 90s. "Touch" was a fast favorite of mine and I was surprised that it hadn't been a hit. At the time in the 90s a lot of us kids were getting into cuts- particularly slow jams- from the 70s thanks to the constant sampling that was taking place in current music, and I thought "Touch" was right in line with the sound. [[Surprised no one sampled it, as far as I know.) It was a gorgeous record IMO. Both Mary and Jean sound great and the track is beautiful.

In the years since, I have cooled off the song a bit, which I've chalked up to the mix that I truly love being the one on the GHRC, while the ones I ultimately ended up playing more often were the album version and the version on the 2000 boxset, which is a bit inferior in sound. I've also come to understand why the song probably didn't catch on the way that it should've. In no particular order:

Promotion...There's tons of audio and video of JMC performing all of their first few singles, but as far as I've seen and heard, JML did it once and SMC did it once, both long after the song had any chance of making waves. I think someone said in the forum that the girls did the song on Flip Wilson, but I've yet to see the clip. Obviously Motown thought the song had potential or it never would've been released in the first place, but it appears like Supremes publicity dropped off for this particular cut in comparison to what had been going on the previous year.

The mix...As I said, the mix on GHARC sounds to my ears to be the superior mix, all the others pale. Perhaps had a different mix been issued it may have gone further.

Mary and Jean...I never thought about it until someone mentioned it in the forum, but the song doesn't work as well with two females duetting. Perhaps the song would've been better had it been a duet with the Tops, but my money is on the song being better with Mary singing the lead alone. It was much more suited to her talents than Jean's, IMO.

[sup_fan]

I do have the RIGHT ON cd, as well as the other 70s Supremes cds that were released. I was lucky enough to be around during the time that Motown was releasing a lot of classics on cd. Every time I went to Tower, it seemed that something that I wasn't expecting had been released, not only by the Supremes, but the Miracles, the Pips, Marvin Gaye, etc.

I lived very close to The Ohio State Univ and i was VERY lucky to have a huge music store that stocked an excellent supply of these motown cds. i think i, literally, bought them all in 1 day. just had a feeling [[and rightfully so) that i'd never see them again. RO, T and FJ came out first. took a while to find NW and Mag7. but eventually did.

while i was thrilled at the time for them, i wouldn't be so concerned about not having them today. the Jean Terrell box set is so nicely remastered. the music is MUCH clearer, crisper.

[marv2]

I lived very close to The Ohio State Univ and i was VERY lucky to have a huge music store that stocked an excellent supply of these motown cds. i think i, literally, bought them all in 1 day. just had a feeling [[and rightfully so) that i'd never see them again. RO, T and FJ came out first. took a while to find NW and Mag7. but eventually did.

while i was thrilled at the time for them, i wouldn't be so concerned about not having them today. the Jean Terrell box set is so nicely remastered. the music is MUCH clearer, crisper.

I've been to those used record stores on High Street in Columbus near OSU back in the 80s.

[sansradio]

[[Surprised no one sampled it, as far as I know.)

Here you go, Ran...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1pXkk-X4I

[marv2]

Here you go, Ran...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1pXkk-X4I

Nice mix. "Touch" fits the flow of this like a glove. Thanks Sansradio.

[sup_fan]

oh those were the best! there were a bunch of little shops and the ideal time to go was right at the end of semester - when kids were selling things back. Magnolia Thunderpussy [[yes it's actual name lol) was a good one.

There was another one that opened for a brief period - i think it was CD Warehouse. it was on High Street right in the middle of campus. huge - like 3 stories or so.

[sansradio]

Nice mix. "Touch" fits the flow of this like a glove. Thanks Sansradio.

You got it, Marv.

[lakeside]

oh those were the best! there were a bunch of little shops and the ideal time to go was right at the end of semester - when kids were selling things back. Magnolia Thunderpussy [[yes it's actual name lol) was a good one.

There was another one that opened for a brief period - i think it was CD Warehouse. it was on High Street right in the middle of campus. huge - like 3 stories or so.

https://thunderpussy.com/
OMG...I used to go to Magnolia Thunderpussy all the time when I
was at OSU. It's still there! I bought Jean Terrell's solo LP at another
record store on N. High St., which is long gone. Lots of memories!

[marv2]

https://thunderpussy.com/
OMG...I used to go to Magnolia Thunderpussy all the time when I
was at OSU. It's still there! I bought Jean Terrell's solo LP at another
record store on N. High St., which is long gone. Lots of memories!
That's what I meant. The stores along High Street, not Broad Street which is in Philly. I've been so many places I'm starting to get them mixed up! LOL! I have been to the Magnolia Thunderpussy store too. There was another really popular used record store on High Street where I bought some 60s Motown albums in great condition there.

[sup_fan]

That's what I meant. The stores along High Street, not Broad Street which is in Philly. I've been so many places I'm starting to get them mixed up! LOL! I have been to the Magnolia Thunderpussy store too. There was another really popular used record store on High Street where I bought some 60s Motown albums in great condition there.

the section of High Street was amazing. such cool record stores, funky dive bars like Mean Mr Mustards, High Energy, North Hidelburg and S Hidelburg

i believe now the entire area has been sanitized and "gentrified"

[sup_fan]

I've seen Mary's autograph with the word "touch" often but never thought about why. Good point about the significance of it to her career, which begs the question why doesn't she include the song in her live act?

I first heard "Touch" when I acquired the 70's Greatest Hits and Rare Classics, which I was lucky enough to purchase within months of becoming a Supremes' album collector back in the 90s. "Touch" was a fast favorite of mine and I was surprised that it hadn't been a hit. At the time in the 90s a lot of us kids were getting into cuts- particularly slow jams- from the 70s thanks to the constant sampling that was taking place in current music, and I thought "Touch" was right in line with the sound. [[Surprised no one sampled it, as far as I know.) It was a gorgeous record IMO. Both Mary and Jean sound great and the track is beautiful.

In the years since, I have cooled off the song a bit, which I've chalked up to the mix that I truly love being the one on the GHRC, while the ones I ultimately ended up playing more often were the album version and the version on the 2000 boxset, which is a bit inferior in sound. I've also come to understand why the song probably didn't catch on the way that it should've. In no particular order:

Promotion...There's tons of audio and video of JMC performing all of their first few singles, but as far as I've seen and heard, JML did it once and SMC did it once, both long after the song had any chance of making waves. I think someone said in the forum that the girls did the song on Flip Wilson, but I've yet to see the clip. Obviously Motown thought the song had potential or it never would've been released in the first place, but it appears like Supremes publicity dropped off for this particular cut in comparison to what had been going on the previous year.

The mix...As I said, the mix on GHARC sounds to my ears to be the superior mix, all the others pale. Perhaps had a different mix been issued it may have gone further.

Mary and Jean...I never thought about it until someone mentioned it in the forum, but the song doesn't work as well with two females duetting. Perhaps the song would've been better had it been a duet with the Tops, but my money is on the song being better with Mary singing the lead alone. It was much more suited to her talents than Jean's, IMO.

i think Touch had a few problems going for it:

1. Mary's voice wasn't immediately familiar to the general public. other than Can't Take My Eyes duet on Together and a couple lines on Bridge Over Troubled Water, she hadn't fronted many recent album tracks. it might have been better to not give her verse 1 but perhaps a later verse
2. on this song, Jean's tone and Mary's tone are quite different. Jean is in her upper register and mary is low and silky. i don't think they pair all that well together
3. production - the track is just a bit odd to begin with. why is the intro so haunted-house creepy and eerie? with the militaristic snare drum and the strings playing harmonics??? eventually the song becomes incredibly lush and while i get the idea of building up to something, they could have started with a much more elegant sound
4. single mix - this is one where the single edit is a hot mess. so much less polished than the lp version
5. ballads - the sups weren't particularly known for ballads as singles. and they can be more hit or miss than an upbeat song
6. Cindy should have been given a lead line or two earlier in the song. make it a true group effort

[sup_fan]

I think "Touch" always had special significance for Mary because it was the first single where she shared a lead vocal. I always thought it was a beautiful song and have never understood the controversy about it being issued as a single. [[I'm thinking of you, Jimi Lalumia.)

If anything, it looked forward to the kind of "slow jams" which became popular in the 80s.

I remember that Mary even had a dress with the word "Touch" all over it. I guess we wouldn't see a dress like that in the "Me, Too" movement! I remember seeing a photo of it in one of the R&B mags. Maybe Marv has a copy in his archives.

In the autographed photo I have of Mary, she also signs "Touch" before her name. For some reason, I couldn't get the photo to load vertically but here it is.

16418

16420 here's the pic of the dress mary had commissioned

[kenneth]

16420 here's the pic of the dress mary had commissioned

That is the exact photograph that I remember! I knew someone must have it here. Thanks, sup_fan!

[marv2]

the section of High Street was amazing. such cool record stores, funky dive bars like Mean Mr Mustards, High Energy, North Hidelburg and S Hidelburg

i believe now the entire area has been sanitized and "gentrified"

Just like they did to Times Square. It is nothing like it was in the 70s and 80s.

[sup_fan]

Times Sq is a chaotic tourist mess. as contrived as Vegas

[gman]

TOUCH is my all time fav Supremes LP [[hate Time and Love...by anyone other than Laura Nyro...and its rare that I like her singing) I pounced on all these CDS the moment they came out....some of the DRATS ones were getting hard to find, and I figured smartly the 70's LP CD's would be a much smaller distribution. I think Touch is only on the Cassette version of GHARC....the tracks and mixes vary from the CD/Cassette issue

[kenneth]

TOUCH is my all time fav Supremes LP [[hate Time and Love...by anyone other than Laura Nyro...and its rare that I like her singing) I pounced on all these CDS the moment they came out....some of the DRATS ones were getting hard to find, and I figured smartly the 70's LP CD's would be a much smaller distribution. I think Touch is only on the Cassette version of GHARC....the tracks and mixes vary from the CD/Cassette issue

It is my favorite as well from the Jean Terrell years. A very cohesive, interesting album. They were obviously reaching out more into the rock world, having Elton John pen the liner notes. It was also the first Supremes album to be reviewed by Rolling Stone, and they gave it an excellent write up.

I didn't always find Jean's voice to be that expressive, though she had an excellent voice. Though on tracks like "Here Comes the Sunshine," "Love It Came to Me This Time," and "It's So Hard to Say Goodbye," she really showed that she could emote vocally when she wanted to.

My all time favorite Jean led track, however, is still "5:30 Plane."

[Bluebrock]

i think Touch had a few problems going for it:

1. Mary's voice wasn't immediately familiar to the general public. other than Can't Take My Eyes duet on Together and a couple lines on Bridge Over Troubled Water, she hadn't fronted many recent album tracks. it might have been better to not give her verse 1 but perhaps a later verse
2. on this song, Jean's tone and Mary's tone are quite different. Jean is in her upper register and mary is low and silky. i don't think they pair all that well together
3. production - the track is just a bit odd to begin with. why is the intro so haunted-house creepy and eerie? with the militaristic snare drum and the strings playing harmonics??? eventually the song becomes incredibly lush and while i get the idea of building up to something, they could have started with a much more elegant sound
4. single mix - this is one where the single edit is a hot mess. so much less polished than the lp version
5. ballads - the sups weren't particularly known for ballads as singles. and they can be more hit or miss than an upbeat song
6. Cindy should have been given a lead line or two earlier in the song. make it a true group effort
I have always loved Touch but i think it was a dumb decision to have it as the follow up to Nathan Jones. It's a lovely album track but never in a million years was it a major hit single. The Touch album was not blessed with an abundance of potential hits but i do think at least two songs stood a better chance of succeeding.

[daviddh]

I loved Touch the album minus Time and love but I agree I would not have released the title track as a follow up.i remember a fan club newsletter stated Here Comes The Sunrise was going to be single but then it wasn't.

[daviddh]

PS the song was recorded with both Mary and Jean singing lead and later both vocals were edited together. Love to hear Mary's lead vocal one day. .....please Kevin reeves

[RanRan79]

Here you go, Ran...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1pXkk-X4I

Thanks Sans! Wow, I had no idea. I played A+'s "All I Need" OUT, but I never had his album. Very interesting use of the sample.

[RanRan79]

PS the song was recorded with both Mary and Jean singing lead and later both vocals were edited together. Love to hear Mary's lead vocal one day. .....please Kevin reeves

Good point. I wonder if Frank is on record explaining the decision to merge the two instead of using one or the other. I really want to hear Mary's version to see if it confirms my suspicions that the song worked better with her as it's lone lead.

[sup_fan]

i wonder if Motown was the one that wasn't wanting a full Mary lead on the lp and figured a duet would at least keep Jean's voice on it, which was familiar to the public.

[Bluebrock]

i wonder if Motown was the one that wasn't wanting a full Mary lead on the lp and figured a duet would at least keep Jean's voice on it, which was familiar to the public.

Quite possibly. I don't care for Mary's voice, but this song is quite well suited to her. Hearing full leads by Jean and Mary would be interesting, but i enjoy it just the way it is.

[RanRan79]

i wonder if Motown was the one that wasn't wanting a full Mary lead on the lp and figured a duet would at least keep Jean's voice on it, which was familiar to the public.

I think if Motown were so neg on Mary being on a single, either the Jean version would've been released as the single or the Mary version would've just ended up an album cut.

[Jimi LaLumia]

"Touch" was a horrific mess as a single; Top 40 radio at that moment in time had no place for such a track, it should have remained on the album; and for those who have followed me, I supported the post Ross Supremes and I heavily supported the solo Mary Wilson album, in print in the mags I was writing for, and at retail as I was a Sam Goody department management person when it was released.. all the 'uncivil war' stuff that followed was not to my liking,but it certainly fills the hours for many, I see. I happily support all Supremes and have kept my hand in the game [[who do you think mentioned that Supremes A Go Go was the first album on the Motown imprint label to go go to #1 on Billboard's main Albums chart and also the first album by a female vocal group to go to #1 on that same chart? that info was the lead off sentence on the expanded edition's booklet... so don't paint me with the uncivil war brush" touch' was a weak and harmful choice for a single at a moment when the group was struggling to keep their footing; it was all downhill after that..

[sansradio]

Thanks Sans! Wow, I had no idea. I played A+'s "All I Need" OUT, but I never had his album. Very interesting use of the sample.

My pleasure, my friend.

[gman]

I agree, it was not a great choice as a single....Have I Lost You? or Here Comes The Sunrise were more radio friendly. It would have been nice to have the song open the LP, and to have Cindy's roll expanded in lead chores.

[Jimi LaLumia]

all the 'hippie commune' , everyone gets to be the lead, never flew with the general public;the success of The Supremes was predicated on an identifiable lead vocal and when that vocal changed to Jean , the public followed until the tinkering around started, and it was then The Supremes in name only and the public said 'bye, baby'..everyone gets a trophy!! lol

[Bluebrock]

all the 'hippie commune' , everyone gets to be the lead, never flew with the general public;the success of The Supremes was predicated on an identifiable lead vocal and when that vocal changed to Jean , the public followed until the tinkering around started, and it was then The Supremes in name only and the public said 'bye, baby'..everyone gets a trophy!! lol

Totally agree Jimi. The public obviously loved Jean and had they not tinkered as you say with the winning formula they could have been successful for a few more years.

[mowsville]

Im a Supremes fan period...they all played a part in the biggest female group EVER and I will never understand all the bitchiness that goes with being a Supremes fan...anyway to the point I was going to say that I think "Touch" was on the wrong album...if it had been on NWBLS and either segued into "Bridge Over Troubled Water" or followed it then I think it would have found its niche...it just seems out of place as a single .

[sup_fan]

I think if Motown were so neg on Mary being on a single, either the Jean version would've been released as the single or the Mary version would've just ended up an album cut.

sorry - i might not have been clear on this. I don't think motown was "super duper neg" on Mary leads. But i think they did intend the Supremes to have 1 primary lead singer for the majority of the commercial releases. Now clearly and rightfully they were ok with M and C being highlighted on lines like in Ladder. or the shared leads on an album track like Bridge Over Troubled Water.

I think they could [[and should) have done more like Ladder. For Everybody's Got the Right, i love how [[live) they would get M and C, and later L, a chorus to sing solo. I think that could have worked beautifully on the recorded track too. You still had Jean as the primary lead, anchoring the song. but there's a stronger group presence

As for Touch, I think that same approach would have helped it, but not totally saved it. Jean should have done 80% of the song, especially the first verse or two. Then Mary would have some parts and a couple lines for Cindy.

But i've also listed out a whole slew of other problems with Touch besides simply lead singer.

[sup_fan]

Im a Supremes fan period...they all played a part in the biggest female group EVER and I will never understand all the bitchiness that goes with being a Supremes fan...anyway to the point I was going to say that I think "Touch" was on the wrong album...if it had been on NWBLS and either segued into "Bridge Over Troubled Water" or followed it then I think it would have found its niche...it just seems out of place as a single .

while i like you're idea of Touch segueing from Bridge, wanted to repost something from another Touch discussion

There's the Touch dj interview version of the LP and the girls discuss the overall process of working with Frank. They talk about how Frank was wanting to tell a full story with the songs and the sequencing. here's my take on that:

This is the story - the pain of heartbreak
Nathan jones - ok you d***, screw you and the horse your rode in on lol
Here comes the sunrise - starting over
love it came to me this time - thanking god for a new love entering your life
Johnny Raven - ok boy, are you a player too? but you're kind of fine so maybe i'll play along
Have I lost you - oh no, not heartbreak again
Time and love - even if it is heartbreak again, time and love will cure all
touch - ok you're bad and that was a HOT night last night. makeup sex can be amazing lol
Happy is a bumpy road - we're together but will this last?
It's so hard - it's not gonna last and i have to go

[RanRan79]

My pleasure, my friend.

And of course I meant "All I See". Must have been thinking about the Tempts.:rolleyes:

[RanRan79]

I agree, it was not a great choice as a single....Have I Lost You? or Here Comes The Sunrise were more radio friendly. It would have been nice to have the song open the LP, and to have Cindy's roll expanded in lead chores.

"Here Comes The Sunrise" would've been an excellent choice for a single.

[RanRan79]

sorry - i might not have been clear on this. I don't think motown was "super duper neg" on Mary leads. But i think they did intend the Supremes to have 1 primary lead singer for the majority of the commercial releases. Now clearly and rightfully they were ok with M and C being highlighted on lines like in Ladder. or the shared leads on an album track like Bridge Over Troubled Water.

I think they could [[and should) have done more like Ladder. For Everybody's Got the Right, i love how [[live) they would get M and C, and later L, a chorus to sing solo. I think that could have worked beautifully on the recorded track too. You still had Jean as the primary lead, anchoring the song. but there's a stronger group presence

As for Touch, I think that same approach would have helped it, but not totally saved it. Jean should have done 80% of the song, especially the first verse or two. Then Mary would have some parts and a couple lines for Cindy.

But i've also listed out a whole slew of other problems with Touch besides simply lead singer.

Motown may have intended the Supremes to have a main lead singer, but if that's the case then Motown would've passed on "Touch" and focused on a Jean led single. Whatever the reason behind "Touch" being a single, something happened from the producer's standpoint of why two leads became a duet. That's what I'm really interested in. What was the rationale from a production standpoint? Was the song always meant to be a duet but Frank wanted each girl to sing a separate lead so that he could get the best parts of both? Did Frank cut "Touch" with the intention of having only one girl lead it and then after hearing the playback decide that he wanted to go in a different direction and thus have another girl do the lead? And then if after all of that, did he suddenly figure neither girl had the clear cut better version but if he took the best of both parts he could create a perfect song?

I am really hoping someone, somewhere, picked Frank Wilson's brain on his work with the Supremes.

[danman869]

I lived very close to The Ohio State Univ and i was VERY lucky to have a huge music store that stocked an excellent supply of these motown cds. i think i, literally, bought them all in 1 day. just had a feeling [[and rightfully so) that i'd never see them again. RO, T and FJ came out first. took a while to find NW and Mag7. but eventually did.

while i was thrilled at the time for them, i wouldn't be so concerned about not having them today. the Jean Terrell box set is so nicely remastered. the music is MUCH clearer, crisper.

Sup_Fan, I totally get what you're saying about having a feeling [[and rightfully so) that you might never see [[CDs) again, so just buying all of them when you had the chance. That's basically how I've spent my entire 32 years of being a Supremes/Motown fan. If you see something and you want it, buy it. Unless the price is absolutely outrageous, you need to just get it. Every once in awhile, I'll see a poster here saying something to the effect of, "I wish I'd bought _____ when it first came out because now it's [[outrageously expensive)." There have been a few things along the way that I wish I'd bought when it first came out, but I've adjusted. I've filled in the collection with a few pricey purchases after-the-fact, but now? If you think you might want something, Supremes, Motown, or anything, just BUY IT. ;)

[danman869]

Mary and Jean...I never thought about it until someone mentioned it in the forum, but the song doesn't work as well with two females duetting. Perhaps the song would've been better had it been a duet with the Tops, but my money is on the song being better with Mary singing the lead alone. It was much more suited to her talents than Jean's, IMO.

That's a really good point, RanRan... Maybe "Touch" would've fared better as a love duet--between The Supremes and The Four Tops? It does make sense to either have one [[female) voice singing it [[to her intended) or a man and woman singing it back and forth to one another. I also agree that the song was more suited to Mary's smoky alto than Jean's soprano/her talents. Coulda-woulda-shoulda, but I almost wish Mary circa 1975, after she'd been taking vocal training and seemingly "came into her voice" a bit better, would've been able to sing the "Touch" single in 1971. It definitely needed an assertive delivery, but still sexy. Mary's voice in '71 was a tad thin. Don't get me wrong, though--I like Mary on "Touch"!

[RanRan79]

That's a really good point, RanRan... Maybe "Touch" would've fared better as a love duet--between The Supremes and The Four Tops? It does make sense to either have one [[female) voice singing it [[to her intended) or a man and woman singing it back and forth to one another. I also agree that the song was more suited to Mary's smoky alto than Jean's soprano/her talents. Coulda-woulda-shoulda, but I almost wish Mary circa 1975, after she'd been taking vocal training and seemingly "came into her voice" a bit better, would've been able to sing the "Touch" single in 1971. It definitely needed an assertive delivery, but still sexy. Mary's voice in '71 was a tad thin. Don't get me wrong, though--I like Mary on "Touch"!

Dan I gotta disagree on Mary's vocal approach. I think "Touch" needed a laidback, sexy, airy vocal, not an assertive one. She needed assertive when she sang "Come And Get These Memories", which I think is why I don't care for her lead on that. Mary was brilliant during the later years when she did "Don't Let My Teardrops Bother You" and "You Are the Heart Of Me", both of which needed just what she gave it. But I'm not sure "Touch" needed anything more [[vocally) than what Mary did.

[daviddh]

I think Mary did a fine job on Touch and would have preferred her solo version over the duet .imo. but I think Motown felt the public didn't know her and it was made a duet.

[sup_fan]

Motown may have intended the Supremes to have a main lead singer, but if that's the case then Motown would've passed on "Touch" and focused on a Jean led single. Whatever the reason behind "Touch" being a single, something happened from the producer's standpoint of why two leads became a duet. That's what I'm really interested in. What was the rationale from a production standpoint? Was the song always meant to be a duet but Frank wanted each girl to sing a separate lead so that he could get the best parts of both? Did Frank cut "Touch" with the intention of having only one girl lead it and then after hearing the playback decide that he wanted to go in a different direction and thus have another girl do the lead? And then if after all of that, did he suddenly figure neither girl had the clear cut better version but if he took the best of both parts he could create a perfect song?

I am really hoping someone, somewhere, picked Frank Wilson's brain on his work with the Supremes.

i think mary was pushing to establish a larger role for herself within the Supremes post-Diana. she was taking on more of the spokeperson role in interviews, more of the onstage dialog. a large featured solo spot. Then into 71, I think she was pushing for more lead material on lps. of course i'm just speculating here. but i would assume it was coming from mary and not motown.

So frank i think looked at a song like Touch and figured she could do a fine job with it. and i think she did. As they were assembling the lp, i'm assuming they consider both the M and the J solo lead versions of Touch and maybe Frank thought "hmmm perhaps this song is strong enough to be a single." Then since the idea of a full mary lead on a single was pretty remote, they decided to do the duet version.

As much as i love the Frank work, he did do Everybody's Got the Right. which IMO was a poor follow up to Ladder. so i don't think it's that far of a stretch to think he thought Touch would be a superstar. Especially after the Temps just had a huge hit with Just My Imagination which was released in Jan 71

[sup_fan]

That's a really good point, RanRan... Maybe "Touch" would've fared better as a love duet--between The Supremes and The Four Tops? It does make sense to either have one [[female) voice singing it [[to her intended) or a man and woman singing it back and forth to one another. I also agree that the song was more suited to Mary's smoky alto than Jean's soprano/her talents. Coulda-woulda-shoulda, but I almost wish Mary circa 1975, after she'd been taking vocal training and seemingly "came into her voice" a bit better, would've been able to sing the "Touch" single in 1971. It definitely needed an assertive delivery, but still sexy. Mary's voice in '71 was a tad thin. Don't get me wrong, though--I like Mary on "Touch"!

oh the duet idea with the Tops would have been a strong one! it could have easily been part of Return of Mag 7. Jean and Levi doing the bulk but maybe with small lines given out to the rest of them.

I don't know that i fully agree that in 75 mary was coming into her voice. I do agree she was improving but most of her leads on Sup 75 are rather uninspired IMO. Don't Let My Teardrops is a stunner - that's probably her most emotional and accomplished lead during the Sup years. Followed closely by We Should Be Closer.

Can We Love Again was IMO her strongest Sup 75 track. Where Is It I Belong is hideous in nearly every way lol - her lead is dull, the backing vocals are sung well but useless, inane lyrics. Turn Me Around is a strong one though.

[floyjoy678]

I agree sup_fan. I'm not a fan of Mary's voice but I absolutely love Teardrops. I think it's the best thing she ever did and I cant understand why she's never performed as a soloist.

[Bluebrock]

oh the duet idea with the Tops would have been a strong one! it could have easily been part of Return of Mag 7. Jean and Levi doing the bulk but maybe with small lines given out to the rest of them.

I don't know that i fully agree that in 75 mary was coming into her voice. I do agree she was improving but most of her leads on Sup 75 are rather uninspired IMO. Don't Let My Teardrops is a stunner - that's probably her most emotional and accomplished lead during the Sup years. Followed closely by We Should Be Closer.

Can We Love Again was IMO her strongest Sup 75 track. Where Is It I Belong is hideous in nearly every way lol - her lead is dull, the backing vocals are sung well but useless, inane lyrics. Turn Me Around is a strong one though.
Have to agree with you here. Where is it i belong is just dreadful. Mary's delivery is dull, bland and quite frankly poor, but the song itself is awful and even a good vocalist would have trouble in making that song sound good.
By the time of the final pair of albums she was beginning to find her feet somewhat. Teardrops and you are the heart of me were perfect for her
and she grasped the opportunity. She should have progressed from here. Instead she performed ghastly versions of Supremes classics which were never going to find widespread favour. I am no fan of her vocal ability but i would much rather hear her sing those ballads than those Supremes songs .

[sup_fan]

I agree sup_fan. I'm not a fan of Mary's voice but I absolutely love Teardrops. I think it's the best thing she ever did and I cant understand why she's never performed as a soloist.

i agree. and her live performance on Mike Douglas is probably her best live singing i've seen. excellent

don't know if they ever really added Teardrops to their live material aside from that show. they most certainly should have. and dropped The Way We Were. would be much preferred to have her sing one of HER songs and sing it beautifully.

You Are Heart Of Me seems to only be done as a lip sync which is odd. they did it several times on tv so you would think they would have eventually done it live.

but again, their live work was so hit or miss during this time

[kenneth]

Sup_Fan, I totally get what you're saying about having a feeling [[and rightfully so) that you might never see [[CDs) again, so just buying all of them when you had the chance. That's basically how I've spent my entire 32 years of being a Supremes/Motown fan. If you see something and you want it, buy it. Unless the price is absolutely outrageous, you need to just get it. Every once in awhile, I'll see a poster here saying something to the effect of, "I wish I'd bought _____ when it first came out because now it's [[outrageously expensive)." There have been a few things along the way that I wish I'd bought when it first came out, but I've adjusted. I've filled in the collection with a few pricey purchases after-the-fact, but now? If you think you might want something, Supremes, Motown, or anything, just BUY IT. ;)

I agree with you, which is probably why I have a house full of stuff that I've hoarded over the years and now don't know what to do with!

Seriously, though, I never bought the "This is the Story" Jean Terrell Years Box Set when it first came out because it only had a few previously unreleased tracks on it [[the "Promises Kept" sessions). Later the box set was selling at huge prices on Amazon and even today I see it listed for $400. Luckily, thanks to the great groups of fans here and a very generous member, I was able to buy the box set from him and he didn't even charge me more than the original price.

That led me to buying the sets on Debarge and some others who I honestly never even listened to as a fan, and haven't even played since I bought them!

[marv2]

In supreme glamour which i love t death my supreme bible except f one or two errors. mary speaks of her joy and happiness over motown delivering t right on album w t flawless cover and gatefold poster. She says jean vocals on all t tracks was magical all t songs carried a universal theme she also states that even though other voices were used to fill out our sound we were still there. Which makes sense because t idea was to bring mary snd cindy back into t fold as singers unlike how they were not used or buried in t music from 67 through 69.

This was their best album in a very long time up to that point.

[luke]

Could it be their best ever?

[marv2]

Could it be their best ever?

I can agree with that. Every song on it was good to excellent. It flowed very well. It also does not sound real dated listening to it today.

[daviddh]

I think Motown delivered two great debited for Ross and the Supremes.
Both albums were flawless.
Would love an expanded version of Right On......Life Beats and That's How Much You Made me Love You were two classic out takes

[marv2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-PXSxH2eu4

[marv2]

This is an extended version of one of my favorite cuts from the album:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXZWPSU03rA&list=PLDGQvwJmd9vwCVv6ssZEVbqrY-w3Hl8Fm&index=19&t=0s

[luke]

The most underrated song from Right On IMO. I’m having trouble posting and deleting! It’s- You Move Me.

[marv2]

They sound like soulful angels....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttdqj3rGwy8&app=desktop

[RanRan79]

Could it be their best ever?

I don't know if I would award that, but definitely in the running. While I don't like every song on the album, I can say song for song the album is excellently executed. I feel the same about the Love Child album. I think care went into constructing the tracks for both albums. If it were not for the out of place "Time And Love", I would award Touch the best Supremes album. It's just that one song that throws me off.

[RanRan79]

The most underrated song from Right On IMO. I’m having trouble posting and deleting! It’s- You Move Me.

I love "You Move Me". It took a long time for it to grow on me but that intro has Jean sounding so flawless. Goodness that lady could sing!

[luke]

Thanks Marv. Perfect description!

[luke]

I love all the voices on that song. Jean is amazing. Music critics have not given her her due.

[sup_fan]

Right On is a superb album. and that's absolutely astounding given the number of producers involved.

I don't think it's the best album of the Supremes or even the best Jean album. I think Touch gets that's credit [[even with the dumb Time & Love). This is getting very nit-picky but by the time they did Touch, Jean was a MUCH more developed recording artist. Notice i'm not saying singer - she sang the hell out of tracks on RO. but she gives a much more varied performance with the Touch material. her anguish on This Is The Story, her sassiness on Nathan and Raven, her reverence on Love It Came To me, love and affection on Sunrise and Happy is bumpy. She digs deeper in the material, offers up more compelling vocal performances, experiments more with different tones and approaches.

[daviddh]

I love But I Love You More and Then I met You

[Bluebrock]

Right On is a superb album. and that's absolutely astounding given the number of producers involved.

I don't think it's the best album of the Supremes or even the best Jean album. I think Touch gets that's credit [[even with the dumb Time & Love). This is getting very nit-picky but by the time they did Touch, Jean was a MUCH more developed recording artist. Notice i'm not saying singer - she sang the hell out of tracks on RO. but she gives a much more varied performance with the Touch material. her anguish on This Is The Story, her sassiness on Nathan and Raven, her reverence on Love It Came To me, love and affection on Sunrise and Happy is bumpy. She digs deeper in the material, offers up more compelling vocal performances, experiments more with different tones and approaches.
It is my personal favorite 70's Supremes album. Not a weak song on there, and Jean sounded great. New Ways was also great but had a couple of weak covers on there. Touch was very good, but i think the quality level dipped thereafter with Floy Joy and of course Jimmy Webb.

[sup_fan]

It is my personal favorite 70's Supremes album. Not a weak song on there, and Jean sounded great. New Ways was also great but had a couple of weak covers on there. Touch was very good, but i think the quality level dipped thereafter with Floy Joy and of course Jimmy Webb.

i agree that all 12 tracks on RO are excellent and it's a great album to listen to.

T&L is a dud on Touch and mars the overall lp IMO. had that song been replaced with something else, then I'd probably say RO was stronger. Again, i say that jean's singing is even better on Touch than RO as she had more room to experiment and had grown as an artist by that point

NW had a lot of potential but i agree, the covers are too much. I like Bridge [[although wow, there's a lot going on) and Come Together is so weird it's interesting. Na Na is one too many and should have been swapped with another Sup track. perhaps life beats

[Bluebrock]

i agree that all 12 tracks on RO are excellent and it's a great album to listen to.

T&L is a dud on Touch and mars the overall lp IMO. had that song been replaced with something else, then I'd probably say RO was stronger. Again, i say that jean's singing is even better on Touch than RO as she had more room to experiment and had grown as an artist by that point

NW had a lot of potential but i agree, the covers are too much. I like Bridge [[although wow, there's a lot going on) and Come Together is so weird it's interesting. Na Na is one too many and should have been swapped with another Sup track. perhaps life beats
I don't know how Life Beats got canned. I listen to it regularly. I would have used it on New Ways to replace one of the covers. I do love their dramatic version of Bridge, but as for the other two.......

[RanRan79]

i agree that all 12 tracks on RO are excellent and it's a great album to listen to.

T&L is a dud on Touch and mars the overall lp IMO. had that song been replaced with something else, then I'd probably say RO was stronger. Again, i say that jean's singing is even better on Touch than RO as she had more room to experiment and had grown as an artist by that point

NW had a lot of potential but i agree, the covers are too much. I like Bridge [[although wow, there's a lot going on) and Come Together is so weird it's interesting. Na Na is one too many and should have been swapped with another Sup track. perhaps life beats

I agree about Jean's singing from RO to Touch, but I'm not convinced that it was so much growth rather than simply having more complex songs to sing. The material on Touch was IMO more advanced than most of that found on Right On. It may be my bias as a HUGE Jean fan, but I suspect that had Touch been the debut album in 1970, Jean would've sung those songs in much the same way as she did the following year.

Right On was excellently executed and definitely bridged the gap between who the Supremes were with Diana and who they would become with Jean.

New Ways is overrated IMO. The ingredients were there for a concept album, but I think they played it safe by including the love songs [[as in "romantic") and the cover of "Na Na" and for me the album comes across a bit uneven. [[Not to mention how much I loath their version of "Bridge" and that damn foghorn.)

Touch would've been perfect if not for that damned "Time And Love".

Floy Joy also would've been perfect IMO if not for "Your Wonderful Sweet Love". Artistically speaking, it was a very nice vocal album. Jean and Mary were on it here.

Jimmy Webb just wasn't a well thought out project. The presence of additional vocalists made the record sound like something other than the Supremes. Of course the Andantes had been added to the backgrounds even on some cuts on Floy Joy, but it was done as enhancement, not as a choir. Jean's singing was superb on most of the cuts but the song selection just doesn't do it for me.

[sup_fan]

I can get over the foghorn today as i just play it off as something they were experimenting with at the time. i do agree it would have been better without. And i do think they had the makings of a strong concept album had they made just a few adjustments. Potentially as close as the Tops' Still Water album. again, with a few adjustments

i'm not aware of any other canned tracks between the release of NW and Touch that could have been a potential replacement for T&L. I'm sure there must be a couple. Or potentially one of the Frank tracks from Dynamite could have been done as just Sups.

I like the overall FJ set, YWSSL included. I don't think that track should have been a single. the live version is a bit more animated and faster, which helps it. but much of the rest of the lp is gorgeous IMO

[RanRan79]

"Time And Love" isn't a bad song, it's just on the wrong album. Actually if they had placed "T&L" on New Ways it would've been a better fit. Maybe put "Mirror" on Touch in "Time"'s place, since they're both uptempo songs.

I like "Sweet Love" also, but it sounds out of place on the Floy Joy album. If there was going to be a third single from the album, "Sweet" makes the most sense. And it did make some noise on release so it wasn't a total bust. I realize it's a Smokey tune, but "Sweet" might have sounded good in place of "Time" on Touch. I really wish Smokey had the group revisit "A Breath Taking Guy". I would've loved to hear what Jean would've done with it. Mary also for a nice change.

[sup_fan]

actually i think you're right. T&L could have worked on NW.

Other songs i think for New Ways could have been Life Beats, Mind Body & Soul. Or perhaps they could have held Everybody's Got The Right and given themselves more time to really do something with it. That would have fit thematically with the universal love/god/peace theme. I like Come Tog but i know others don't. Maybe it and Na Na come off of New Ways and you end up with:

Together We Can Make
Stone Love
Time to break down
Bridge
I wish i was your mirror

Time and love
is there a place
life beats
shine on me
thank him for today

In place of Everybody in RO, The Day Will Come Between Sunday and Monday would have been a good one. And in place of T&L on Touch, perhaps Steppin On A Dream

[sup_fan]

I like "Sweet Love" also, but it sounds out of place on the Floy Joy album. If there was going to be a third single from the album, "Sweet" makes the most sense. And it did make some noise on release so it wasn't a total bust. I realize it's a Smokey tune, but "Sweet" might have sounded good in place of "Time" on Touch. I really wish Smokey had the group revisit "A Breath Taking Guy". I would've loved to hear what Jean would've done with it. Mary also for a nice change.

I think Sweet works on the album and makes a decent opener. You needed something upbeat since so much of the lp is a slower groove. I just hate Smokey's voice on it. it's done so oddly - sounds weird. Either just go on out and do a duet or get rid of his voice.

[daviddh]

I remember a song called Remote Control that would have worked on Touch.
I liked YWSS Love on Floy Joy but not Smokey's voice.but it's ok...I think it drags a bit.the live version rocks.always hoped for a remix of this song.
Maybe one day...70s lost n found.
Life beats would have been great on RO

[daviddh]

Didn't Frank Wilson produce love train in 73.
Wonder what other songs he did with them. That would be a cool mine find

[kenneth]

I think Sweet works on the album and makes a decent opener. You needed something upbeat since so much of the lp is a slower groove. I just hate Smokey's voice on it. it's done so oddly - sounds weird. Either just go on out and do a duet or get rid of his voice.

I don't think I ever knew that was Smokey's voice, though I never really played that album much. I know a lot of fans like the album [[and I think it was Mary's favorite) but I found it dull and too much "sameness" in the song selection.

[sup_fan]

Didn't Frank Wilson produce love train in 73.
Wonder what other songs he did with them. That would be a cool mine find

yes Frank produced Love Train. I'm not sure what else was done. the girls frankly weren't recording much [[that we know of) during this time. after the Jimmy Webb sessions, there doesn't seem to be much studio activity until the Stevie material in early 73. Someone had speculated that Remote Control was MJL track. not sure as it's never been formally released and we don't have the session info.

[TomatoTom123]

OMG, can people stop the bitching about "Time And Love", one of my absolute SUPREME favourites! :p:p

P.S. I actually quite like the song, both versions in fact [[Diana / The Supremes)

[milven]

OMG, can people stop the bitching about "Time And Love", one of my absolute SUPREME favourites! :p:p

P.S. I actually quite like the song, both versions in fact [[Diana / The Supremes)

Have you ever heard this fantasy duet with Diana and Jean that Mosogotam put together?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzeouuSOcaY

[Bluebrock]

I don't think I ever knew that was Smokey's voice, though I never really played that album much. I know a lot of fans like the album [[and I think it was Mary's favorite) but I found it dull and too much "sameness" in the song selection.

Me too. I thought it was a bland and boring album. It was a substantial drop in quality afrer the general excellence of the previous three efforts.

[sup_fan]

Me too. I thought it was a bland and boring album. It was a substantial drop in quality afrer the general excellence of the previous three efforts.

see i see it as the opposite. i found the album clean, light and effervescent. an enjoyable switch after the large Frank productions. I also appreciated the more intricate vocal work. of course some of that is thanks to the Andantes. even though they were added, it does still sound like MJC did quite a bit of the harmonies and material. So from a "group" perspective, i think this is a solid album. the vocal interplay, shared leads, etc.

[RanRan79]

OMG, can people stop the bitching about "Time And Love", one of my absolute SUPREME favourites! :p:p

P.S. I actually quite like the song, both versions in fact [[Diana / The Supremes)

I actually don't hate it Tom. I just feel the cut is out of place on the Touch album. But it's never been a fav of mine even on it's own. Surprisingly, while I was so disappointed to see a version by Diana, and with the exact same backing track, as a bonus track on the debut cd [[I would've rather have had a song I had never heard before), I really enjoyed it. So if I were going to choose one version over the other, it would be Diana's.

[RanRan79]

see i see it as the opposite. i found the album clean, light and effervescent. an enjoyable switch after the large Frank productions. I also appreciated the more intricate vocal work. of course some of that is thanks to the Andantes. even though they were added, it does still sound like MJC did quite a bit of the harmonies and material. So from a "group" perspective, i think this is a solid album. the vocal interplay, shared leads, etc.

Agreed. It was a nice artistic change from what came before, without deviating radically from the blueprint, such as what happened with the JW album.

[sup_fan]

I actually don't hate it Tom. I just feel the cut is out of place on the Touch album. But it's never been a fav of mine even on it's own. Surprisingly, while I was so disappointed to see a version by Diana, and with the exact same backing track, as a bonus track on the debut cd [[I would've rather have had a song I had never heard before), I really enjoyed it. So if I were going to choose one version over the other, it would be Diana's.

T&L has never been a song i've found very enjoyable. again, i find the lyrics too hokey. but that's just my person opinion

i do agree that, from a sound and style standpoint, it's completely out of place on Touch. To do from the reverence and delicacy of Love It Came To Me This Time to the onslaught of Time And Love is glaring.

It might have fit better on New Ways. at least there the productions were massive

[sup_fan]

Agreed. It was a nice artistic change from what came before, without deviating radically from the blueprint, such as what happened with the JW album.

exactly. with the JW tapes, they might as well just handed them to jean saying "hey we know we've dicked around enough with this Supremes thing to pretty much ruin any major future success. and so you'll probably be leaving sooner rather than later, so take these as a parting gift and just use as part of your solo career"
lolol

[gman]

The WEBB LP could have been a masterpiece... but JW used the Supremes to showcase his less known compositions.....5.30 Plane is a Terrell masterpiece, although it seems she is backed by an entire choir...I don't mind I Guess I'll Miss The Man being on the LP...it was the latest single and should have been the final song, tagged as a bonus cut. The rest of he LP should have been all Webb compositions and included at least 5 or 6 of his more familiar songs...and he should have limited ALL vocals to just the group

[marv2]

The WEBB LP could have been a masterpiece... but JW used the Supremes to showcase his less known compositions.....5.30 Plane is a Terrell masterpiece, although it seems she is backed by an entire choir...I don't mind I Guess I'll Miss The Man being on the LP...it was the latest single and should have been the final song, tagged as a bonus cut. The rest of he LP should have been all Webb compositions and included at least 5 or 6 of his more familiar songs...and he should have limited ALL vocals to just the group

I agree. He really messed things up when he added all those background singers to some of the cuts.