tcb

[daviddh]

tcb was a beautiful tv special, I am thinking out loud...although I loved it I thought the Supremes segments were a bit weak at times. they had just released talk of the town and the same medleys were repeated again on TCB.
thought that was disappointing. would you guys make any changes. disagree? I would have liked more original songs from the Supremes and drop the afro dance routine and kept the Funny Girl segment

[reese]

I love the special as it is. But if it had been taped later, I would have removed the TASTE OF HONEY / ELEANOR RIGBY /SAN JOSE / MRS. ROBINSON / RESPECT medley and replaced it with a segment featuring of LOVE CHILD, CLOUD NINE, and I'M GONNA MAKE YOU LOVE ME.

[sup_fan]

obviously it's a shame the taping wasn't just a month or so later as those huge hits would have been included. or at least IGMYLM. and what a treat to see the two lineups sing that duet together!

I think the Sups segments were right in line with how they performed their hits during this time. Actually they hadn't done Symphony for a while. plus they did the full version and rather faithful to the original

This is probably one of the best and powerful Stop performances i've seen. Sure DMF will always be the classic lineup for this song. but the segue from TCB into Stop is brilliant and the image of DMC in those sensational gowns is stunning and iconic.

What did you find disappointing with the group songs?

[marybrewster]

With the huge catalog that each group had by this time, there was no reason for so much "filler". The Supremes alone had TEN #1 hits by 1968.

I'm assuming selections were picked for various reasons: to showcase Diana, to appeal to an older audience, etc. Regardless the soundtrack still went to #1.

[bradsupremes]

I love the TCB special. If I could change anything about it, I would have taken out the "Symphony Medley" and in its place added "When The Lovelight Shines Through His Eyes" which was cut from the special. Maybe add a full performance of "Reflections" or "Love Is Here And Now You're Gone." I would have cut "Respect" and in its place add in "Mas Que Nada." Also, on "Somewhere" you hear Mary & Cindy, but don't see them. Mary & Cindy should have been on stage with Diana.

It's GIT that needed a major overhaul. I would scrapped the whole Broadway concept and instead do a TCB Part II show this time focusing on their duets together - "I'm Gonna Make You Love Me" and "I'll Try Something New." They could do a medley of songs from their albums. "My Guy, My Girl" would be a great spotlight. Maybe a performance of "The Weight" could have boosted sales and bumped its charting. Plus they could perform their current hits - "Love Child," "I'm Living In Shame," "Cloud Nine," and "I Can't Get Next To You."

[biggestfourtops fan]

Not a good production. The bad sounds awful. So pop sounding. Needs actual soul songs like Tyrone Davis's CAN I CHANGE MY MIND. Cover that if you're gonna cover something.

[RanRan79]

TCB was very good IMO, but the Supremes didn't really wow like the Tempts. True, the Supremes were never that kind of group. From the very beginning they considered themselves pure singers. Give them a mic, let them harmonize, find the groove, and as Mary once said, they rarely had a hard time with an audience. Their strength was in singing. Their act didn't consist of electrifying dance routines the way the Marvelettes or the Temptations might have, especially since Flo was in the group and not particularly good at any complicated choreography. However, Cindy came into the group at the perfect time as DRATS was now starting to do many TV spots where they performed elaborate choreographed dance routines to the specialty numbers and Cindy was quite good at this, as was Mary and Diana. But on TCB when the Supremes performed the non hits, they reverted back to their earlier motto of just standing and singing, which is fine when you sound as good as they did, however it looks a bit boring when it follows the way the Tempts handled their segments. "Stop" and "Hangin" were definitely the exceptions. Maybe I would've had them open with the hits medley and save these two more fiery performances for later in the show, if I were going to make any changes.

[RanRan79]

There's no way I would've dropped the African routine from TCB, as it is a highlight.

[RanRan79]

It's GIT that needed a major overhaul. I would scrapped the whole Broadway concept and instead do a TCB Part II show this time focusing on their duets together - "I'm Gonna Make You Love Me" and "I'll Try Something New." They could do a medley of songs from their albums. "My Guy, My Girl" would be a great spotlight. Maybe a performance of "The Weight" could have boosted sales and bumped its charting. Plus they could perform their current hits - "Love Child," "I'm Living In Shame," "Cloud Nine," and "I Can't Get Next To You."

I agree. I mentioned this the last time the subject of GIT came up. I would've never paired these two groups for a special of Broadway tunes, not after the success of the first two duet singles. I would've done Still Takin Care of Business and had the two groups doing their duet hits, selected songs from their two studio albums, a few of the new crop of hits from them individually, and some other selected covers from the day. I think a medley of late 50s/early 60s songs that might have been in their repertoires during the Primettes/Primes/Distants days could've also been a treat, paying homage to their intersecting pre-fame histories.

[sup_fan]

^interesting idea of doing a bit of a historical homage. that might have worked quite nicely

I don't think the idea of Broadway and non-Motown fare was necessarily a bad idea. but the execution was pretty terrible. the two highlights for me are the Leading Lady Medley and Porgy and Bess. the first - well that's obvious. it's a stunning medley and amazing costumes. the later - damn!! to hear the funky bass intro and watch the girls STRUT!! M and C work that ramp lol. plus the medley and harmonies are tight.

I can't believe ANYONE allowed that hideous Fiddler medley - the temps are soooooo out of tune that it's a disgrace. they're far better singers and they sound horrid. plus the arrangement is very odd and depressing.

the intro was ok but a bit haphazard. plus it's Broadway - how could they NOT do this in front of an audience?!?!

I think they could revamped it considerably. Like the idea of a couple of sections - a duets part, a homage to doo wop and then an homage to Broadway. they could have kept GIT. just dropped the Broadway tag

and cut the skits

[sup_fan]

TCB was very good IMO, but the Supremes didn't really wow like the Tempts. True, the Supremes were never that kind of group. From the very beginning they considered themselves pure singers. Give them a mic, let them harmonize, find the groove, and as Mary once said, they rarely had a hard time with an audience. Their strength was in singing. Their act didn't consist of electrifying dance routines the way the Marvelettes or the Temptations might have, especially since Flo was in the group and not particularly good at any complicated choreography. However, Cindy came into the group at the perfect time as DRATS was now starting to do many TV spots where they performed elaborate choreographed dance routines to the specialty numbers and Cindy was quite good at this, as was Mary and Diana. But on TCB when the Supremes performed the non hits, they reverted back to their earlier motto of just standing and singing, which is fine when you sound as good as they did, however it looks a bit boring when it follows the way the Tempts handled their segments. "Stop" and "Hangin" were definitely the exceptions. Maybe I would've had them open with the hits medley and save these two more fiery performances for later in the show, if I were going to make any changes.

I think the fact that the Sups weren't huge dancers balanced the Temps nicely. The girls were glamour and they brought that. The Temps were dancers and brought that. so it made for fun counterpoints

overall i think the special works marvelously. i would have preferred the Funny Girl medley to Afro Vogue. and yes, M and C should have been on stage with Diana. But i believe the Somewhere segment is actually two tapings mashed together. most of it was taped [[i believe) in studio without the orchestra and audience. when it opens its totally pitch black EVERYWHERE but the stage and diana. but when she ends the song, it's still black but you can make out the lower levels of the orchestra pit. and then they slowly raise the lights and you see more of the studio.I think they used a tape of her lip syncing the majority of the song and then edited in the very end w a clip from the live taping. it's a great effect cuz it's amazingly stunning at beginning with the total blackness contrasting the amazing stage and her gorgeous gown

[RanRan79]

^interesting idea of doing a bit of a historical homage. that might have worked quite nicely

I don't think the idea of Broadway and non-Motown fare was necessarily a bad idea. but the execution was pretty terrible. the two highlights for me are the Leading Lady Medley and Porgy and Bess. the first - well that's obvious. it's a stunning medley and amazing costumes. the later - damn!! to hear the funky bass intro and watch the girls STRUT!! M and C work that ramp lol. plus the medley and harmonies are tight.

I can't believe ANYONE allowed that hideous Fiddler medley - the temps are soooooo out of tune that it's a disgrace. they're far better singers and they sound horrid. plus the arrangement is very odd and depressing.

the intro was ok but a bit haphazard. plus it's Broadway - how could they NOT do this in front of an audience?!?!

I think they could revamped it considerably. Like the idea of a couple of sections - a duets part, a homage to doo wop and then an homage to Broadway. they could have kept GIT. just dropped the Broadway tag

and cut the skits

I think I watched GIT once all the way through and it just didn't do anything for me, outside of the two highlights you mentioned: Leading Lady and Porgy and Bess. Leading Lady IMO is the moment where everyone watching should have said "Okay, we get it, the girl has outgrown the group, let her go do her own thing". Diana was fantastic.

[gman]

This is a great feed....I like all of the ideas....I bet once TCB pulled in the audience it did, they were kicking themselves for not stretching it to 90 minutes and a double LP. [[its been said that the odd pairing on the 2 for 1 CD of TCB and Liverpool was that Liverpool was the only complete LP short enough to fit with TCB...which was a long album) GIT was not a good idea....the skits were horrible...I would of course keep Lady medley....gotta give DR some room to showcase her soon to be solo talent, and the Finale was fine. [[I actually liked the Tempts Fiddler medley!)....and if the Supreme were on cam for Rhythm of Life....to kids like me [[I was 9) it was the first time we heard these snippets of B'way gems

[daviddh]

bradsupremes i agree with you. i just would have dropped Somewhere, and a few other broadway medleys that they have done. Talk Of The Town was released in August. then TCB in December. i would have prefered new material,like Funny Girl. cant believe they didnt record any songs from the lp JOIN. the tracks were recorded already. love the opening and the ending. yeah and Love Child.

[Ollie9]

[QUOTE=RanRan79; Leading Lady IMO is the moment where everyone watching should have said "Okay, we get it, the girl has outgrown the group, let her go do her own thing". Diana was fantastic.[/QUOTE]

I quite agree lol. The point had been more then hammered home. For me TCB sparkles where as GIT sadly comes across as dull and uninspired, totally lacking in any originality or excitement

[TheMotownManiac]

I love the idea of GIT butthe execution is abysmal. I wish George Schlatter would have been served with a restraining order after the glorious TCB and never be allowed near Motown again. His trashy production style ruined GIT, Diana! And turned Ross’ Tony winning Broadway production into a hot mess TV special. Don’t get me started!

i think GIT would have been ideal as a June 1969 special, then airing TCB2 in December with:
Love CHild
Reflevtions
Someday
a torrid, rock arrangement of The Happening
YCHL
Cloud 9,
Runaway Child
I Can’t Get Next To You
OldvMan River
Beauty Is Only Skin Deep

Medly Of current non Motown hits
[[Everyday People, I Want To Take You Higher, River Deep/Mt High, Sugar Sugar, Proud Mary, Try A LittlevTenderness)



im Gonna Make You Love Me
Try It Baby
WhybMustvWevFall In Love
i’ll Try Something New

Finale: easy to Be Hard or Get Together

1) the only change I’d have made with TCB would gave been to reshoot the mistaken lip sync with Ross during the pant suit medley.

2) Afro Vogue - regardless of the perceived entertainment value of the whole, was a statement by Diana and Berry that I respect a thousand percent. “Yes, we wear Bob Mackie, but we can also just as easily wear Miriam Makeeba. We can be anything and succeed anywhere in anyone’s value system” don’t like it? Run to the loo during it. It was important.

3) while millions looked behind their TV sets during Somewhere hoping to find Mary and Cindy, another important statement was being made: Diana Ross is a solo star and this proves she needs no one on stage with her to sell a song. Any bg singers would suffice - only she was needed now. She not only nailed it, she reminded 30-40 million folks that Dr. King’s work lives on and always will. It was vitally important that months after his passing, the focus returned to his message and not his assasination - his murderers accomplished nothing.

[Jimi LaLumia]

so in this 60th anniversary year of Motown isn't there SOME way we can petition a TCB/GIT/DVD into existence as a legit release?

[sup_fan]

i agree that the MLK tribute in Somewhere was perfect and made an appropriate message for the show.

[sup_fan]

I quite agree lol. The point had been more then hammered home. For me TCB sparkles where as GIT sadly comes across as dull and uninspired, totally lacking in any originality or excitement

yes!! even the color pallet used for GIT is dull - those muted golds and black. the whole thing was so drag. and the irony is the girls' gowns were sensational when used outside of the special. but on the screen they just blend in like camouflage.

back to the idea of doing a historical retrospective - it could have been done amazingly with period costumes, some group numbers, some solo for diana, etc. The temps start off in 20s era outfits doing some early jazz, in comes Diana as an early Leno Horne or even Lady [[she'd done My Man on Bob Hope by this time). The sups join in and the three women do a brief medley of some of the early 50s black girl groups. in come the temps in 50s v-neck sweaters and smooth processed hair doing Frankie Lymon and the teenagers, then maybe they do a brief Primes/Primettes clip and then finally into I'm Gonna Make You Love Me.

[daviddh]

I liked the look of GIT glam wise. beautiful gowns but the only song I remember liking was Funky Broadway.
whos idea was it to do a broadway style show. I would have canned it,sorry,dismal.
I like TCB2 idea much better.

[jobucats]

As much as I am a Diana Ross fan, I felt that her peformances without Mary and Cindy should have been limited. Keep Somewhere but with Mary and Cindy. Too much camera work was focused on her throughout the show. Again, she has always been my favorite, however, TCB seemed to be overwhelmingly about her. Side note: Dennis Edwards outfront with the Temptations on “I’m Losing You” sealed the deal that he was indeed Temptation worthy.

[bradsupremes]

As much as I am a Diana Ross fan, I felt that her peformances without Mary and Cindy should have been limited. Keep Somewhere but with Mary and Cindy. Too much camera work was focused on her throughout the show. Again, she has always been my favorite, however, TCB seemed to be overwhelmingly about her. Side note: Dennis Edwards outfront with the Temptations on “I’m Losing You” sealed the deal that he was indeed Temptation worthy.

I was at an interview Dennis Edwards did with the Rock Hall where they discussed TCB and how they all knew it was primarily a focus on Diana. He called it her "coming out party." He by no means disrespected her or the special, but he knew Diana was the focus because of her relationship with Gordy. I agree though. I feel Gordy pushed her a little too much during those days. I understand appearances on Like Hep or Laugh-In, but on specials like TCB or GIT where the group is involved, to have multiple segments where it was just her solo or herself with the Temptations sans Mary & Cindy is somewhat disrespectful to their talent. At least they could have included something like 'Mas Que Nada' in place of something like "Do You Know The Way To San Jose" that was just Mary & Cindy with a few of the Temptations.

[daviddh]

i am really surprised this isn't on dvd yet. not sure what the deal is. I remember a few years back Diana live at the royal Hall was cancelled at the last minute.strange

[Jimi LaLumia]

supposed legal mumbo jumbo.. so ridiculous and so disgraceful..maybe in this 60th anniversary year a miracle will happen...or not

[PeaceNHarmony]

For its time and place I thought TCB was, and remains, perfect. That Ross girl - something else. I think she's gonna make it.