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reese
01-17-2019, 12:59 PM
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2019-super-bowl-longtime-atlanta-star-gladys-knight-will-sing-the-national-anthem/

blkfrost
01-18-2019, 01:13 PM
I am sadden that she is singing the Nation Anthem at the Super Bowl, especially considering the way the NFL has treated Colin Kaepernick and other players taking the knee for justice in America. I would be okay if she sung some other song, such as America, the Beautiful or God, Bless America. I won't be going to another Gladys concert.

midnightman
01-18-2019, 02:48 PM
Gladys gave some shade to Colin Kaepernick in her latest statement where she was possibly criticized for agreeing to the gig:

Gladys Knight says she not only disagrees with Colin Kaepernick using the national anthem as a protest, but she also says she's been in the game a lot longer than him when it comes to the fight for social justice.

Gladys doubled down on her decision to sing the anthem at the upcoming Super Bowl, saying, "I have been in the forefront of this battle longer than most of those voicing their opinions to win the right to sing our country's Anthem on a stage as large as the Super Bowl LIII."

She goes on ... "It is unfortunate that our National Anthem has been dragged into this debate when the distinctive senses of the National Anthem and fighting for justice should each stand alone."

That said, Gladys does not doubt Colin's intentions ... "I understand that Mr. Kaepernick is protesting two things, and they are police violence and injustice," the 74-year-old legend said in a statement.

Of course, Knight is referencing Colin's decision to take a knee during the 'Star-Spangled Banner' during NFL games. Kap had said the demonstration is intended to put a spotlight on police violence against minorities.

Knight might agree with his message but clearly disagrees with his methods.

"I am here today and on Sunday, Feb. 3 to give the Anthem back its voice, to stand for that historic choice of words, the way it unites us when we hear it and to free it from the same prejudices and struggles I have fought long and hard for all my life."

"No matter who chooses to deflect with this narrative and continue to mix these two in the same message, it is not so and cannot be made so by anyone speaking it. I pray that this National Anthem will bring us all together in a way never before witnessed and we can move forward and untangle these truths which mean so much to all of us."

Kaepernick -- along with his girlfriend, close friends and celebrities -- have been agreed to perform at the Super Bowl. Rap star Common has even called for Travis Scott to pull out of the halftime show.

As for Colin's thoughts on Gladys -- so far, he has not issued a comment.

----
https://media1.giphy.com/media/xT1Ra1VRpsE6rYOa6k/giphy.gif

midnightman
01-18-2019, 03:07 PM
Gladys ain't been right since she became a Mormon [[which I think was due to her son or daughter being Mormons, I forget which).

marv2
01-18-2019, 03:28 PM
I can't count how many famous singers have sung the National Anthem before sporting events in this country. I do know that I wish that they were not arguing over this particular moment in the public media. I would have much more preferred that Ms. Knight and Mr. Kaepernick had met privately to discuss the matter. Gladys has fought for social and civil rights for decades. Her religious beliefs have nothing to do with anything in my opinion. I applaud her for acknowledging accurately that the protest is about police violence and injustice whereas the President and a certain segment of the population refuse to acknowledge that and try to deflect everything off as disrespecting the Veterans!

PeaceNHarmony
01-18-2019, 04:10 PM
I see that there's quite a bit of disagreement with Knight's decision to sing at the Super Bowl due to their anti-African American stances. I've not yet read a comment from her about it. It's not my right to make an assessment but I'm finding it interesting to read the opinions of those who do have the right to do so.

PeaceNHarmony
01-18-2019, 04:11 PM
I am sadden that she is singing the Nation Anthem at the Super Bowl, especially considering the way the NFL has treated Colin Kaepernick and other players taking the knee for justice in America. I would be okay if she sung some other song, such as America, the Beautiful or God, Bless America. I won't be going to another Gladys concert.
Understood. And supported.

jobeterob
01-18-2019, 04:39 PM
It’s a big chance for her

But I wish she had said no

And I don’t think her explanation is helpful

Jerry Oz
01-18-2019, 04:49 PM
I can't count how many famous singers have sung the National Anthem before sporting events in this country. I do know that I wish that they were not arguing over this particular moment in the public media. I would have much more preferred that Ms. Knight and Mr. Kaepernick had met privately to discuss the matter. Gladys has fought for social and civil rights for decades. Her religious beliefs have nothing to do with anything in my opinion. I applaud her for acknowledging accurately that the protest is about police violence and injustice whereas the President and a certain segment of the population refuse to acknowledge that and try to deflect everything off as disrespecting the Veterans!I'm done with her because of this. Done. Every confederate flag-toting Dixie-loving Deplorable who applauds when cops are acquitted for killing unarmed black people is pointing at her and saying "See. Gladys Knight is with us." I don't care what she said her reasons are, she's mucking up the next phase of the movement she wants to share credit for leading. Keep in mind that in spite of all of her pain [[which is appreciated), we are still nowhere near the finish line. To disparage Kaep and perform at the Super Bowl tells me more than I needed to know about one of my formerly favorite singers.

midnightman
01-18-2019, 05:59 PM
Her saying "I marched with King" does not help. Sorry Gladys, you're on your own...

https://media.tenor.com/images/2336628f8b7911a12a7eadc6d2bc4f84/tenor.gif

midnightman
01-18-2019, 06:00 PM
It’s a big chance for her

But I wish she had said no

And I don’t think her explanation is helpful

I don't mind her taking the gig but she should've not said anything. Now she's just adding extra ammo...

marv2
01-18-2019, 06:16 PM
It’s a big chance for her

But I wish she had said no

And I don’t think her explanation is helpful

This is not a "big chance" for Gladys Knight. She's been one of the biggest, most famous singers in the World for decades. She's sentimental about it being in Atlanta, her hometown.

marv2
01-18-2019, 06:19 PM
She shouldn't be doing this, but I have an idea that if you tell her that, she's going to do it!

Eargasm
01-18-2019, 06:56 PM
I can't wait to see the GREATEST female vocalist /performer on the planet singing the National Anthem !.... LOVE YOU GLADYS !!!

Levi Stubbs Tears
01-18-2019, 07:20 PM
Does Martha have to stop singing it every morning [[as she claimed in a book she did to exercise her voice)?

StuBass1
01-18-2019, 08:02 PM
I can't wait to see the GREATEST female vocalist /performer on the planet singing the National Anthem !.... LOVE YOU GLADYS !!!
Love Gladys standing far above all the petty B***S***… Stay strong Gladys...I'm sure your rendition will be right up there with Marvin, Whitney, and now the most soulful woman to ever come out of Motown...

PeaceNHarmony
01-18-2019, 08:28 PM
I'm done with her because of this. Done. Every confederate flag-toting Dixie-loving Deplorable who applauds when cops are acquitted for killing unarmed black people is pointing at her and saying "See. Gladys Knight is with us." I don't care what she said her reasons are, she's mucking up the next phase of the movement she wants to share credit for leading. Keep in mind that in spite of all of her pain [[which is appreciated), we are still nowhere near the finish line. To disparage Kaep and perform at the Super Bowl tells me more than I needed to know about one of my formerly favorite singers.
Well stated and I wish you the best.

Eargasm
01-18-2019, 08:51 PM
I'm done with her because of this. Done. Every confederate flag-toting Dixie-loving Deplorable who applauds when cops are acquitted for killing unarmed black people is pointing at her and saying "See. Gladys Knight is with us." I don't care what she said her reasons are, she's mucking up the next phase of the movement she wants to share credit for leading. Keep in mind that in spite of all of her pain [[which is appreciated), we are still nowhere near the finish line. To disparage Kaep and perform at the Super Bowl tells me more than I needed to know about one of my formerly favorite singers.
If you can't see what Gladys has done, achieved for the good over the last 60years, then I truly am sad for you !.....It's the EMPRESS of SOUL singing the National Anthem ! where's the problem ????

midnightman
01-18-2019, 08:59 PM
???

I don't see anything in Jerry's statement that took away from what she did?

Just that in his mind, it's not a good decision on her part.

But apparently a critical post is dismissing her legacy.

https://media.tenor.com/images/bf4a93f1f068aacbd7f0e47ad1b46214/tenor.gif

Eargasm
01-18-2019, 09:08 PM
???

I don't see anything in Jerry's statement that took away from what she did?

Just that in his mind, it's not a good decision on her part.

But apparently a critical post is dismissing her legacy.

https://media.tenor.com/images/bf4a93f1f068aacbd7f0e47ad1b46214/tenor.gif
If your post is aimed at me, then I have no need to relax !....[[ If not, then I apologise) seriously looking forward to seeing Gladys do what she does best next June in the UK, " Singing"... which is what she will be doing at the Super Bowl !.. It what she does !....

luke
01-18-2019, 09:34 PM
Gladys ‘ statement simply tries to justify her singing and gives no insight as to what started all of this and the respect that Mr Kaepernick and others deserve for their courage. I’m disappointed in her.

midnightman
01-18-2019, 10:50 PM
If your post is aimed at me, then I have no need to relax !....[[ If not, then I apologise) seriously looking forward to seeing Gladys do what she does best next June in the UK, " Singing"... which is what she will be doing at the Super Bowl !.. It what she does !....

Nah it's not to anyone. Just in general. Because if this was just about her singing the song, she shouldn't have made a statement. I mean I know I wouldn't. Why bring more attention to it? As Luke said, she wanted to justify why she was singing it and playing egalitarian about it considering the issues we have to why Colin Kaepernick did his protest in the first place.

I don't care if you're a music legend, that doesn't excuse that sometimes, legends can make bad decisions and this was a bad decision by Gladys. Simple as that.

midnightman
01-18-2019, 11:19 PM
Commenters on both Twitter and Instagram have been criticizing Gladys' decision to do the national anthem. Apparently the responses on IG had Gladys block everyone from commenting! Apparently #MAGATwitter is LOVING THIS... if Gladys thought she was uniting folks, she was sadly mistaken... CHILD...

StuBass1
01-19-2019, 12:16 AM
Gladys will just have to learn to live with the fact that her Super Bowl Anthem performance isn't playing well on Soulful Detroit and by some folks on Twitter...She'll just have to learn to live with it...somehow :confused:…LOL

snakepit
01-19-2019, 05:48 AM
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/jan/19/super-bowl-anthem-gladys-knight-defends-decision-kaepernick-protest

jobucats
01-19-2019, 09:07 AM
I love to hear the passion in Gladys voice. Being an old traditionalist as I am, I just hope she doesn't go all over the place with too many vocal acrobatics. I have so many opinions about the "performance" of the national anthem these days at events, but they are too many to name here. All of y'all complaining about "dem dare players not standing" during the anthem, be sure y'all get your butts off the recliner at home to do more than run to the refrigerator for more dip and chips as the anthem is being sung. Be sure you're standing in allegiance also instead of counting how many players are kneeling. I'm just sayin'. Note: My personal belief: it's everyone's right to stand or kneel.

midnightman
01-19-2019, 12:48 PM
^ Folks who complain about folks not standing up for the anthem don't care for this country either... some folks just don't feel this anthem is theirs... wasn't too long ago when an American anthem was played at the Olympics and the runners who protested used the Black Power symbol... please remember that as some of y'all defend Gladys' decision to sing it. She has that much right to sing it but we have much right not to stand for it or if we do stand for it, do our own salute for our people and not the flag or whatever.

StuBass1
01-19-2019, 02:14 PM
I love to hear the passion in Gladys voice. Being an old traditionalist as I am, I just hope she doesn't go all over the place with too many vocal acrobatics. I have so many opinions about the "performance" of the national anthem these days at events, but they are too many to name here. All of y'all complaining about "dem dare players not standing" during the anthem, be sure y'all get your butts off the recliner at home to do more than run to the refrigerator for more dip and chips as the anthem is being sung. Be sure you're standing in allegiance also instead of counting how many players are kneeling. I'm just sayin'. Note: My personal belief: it's everyone's right to stand or kneel.

Gladys is NOT Mariah Carey...Thankfully

nabob
01-19-2019, 02:41 PM
Didn't realize there were two threads.

I love Gladys Knight and the music she has given us for nearly 60 years, but like many entertainers [[not all) she is totally clueless on this political issue. It's not completely her fault that her hard work and devotion has allowed her to live in a different world from the people who love her. While she deserves the fruits of success she has earned, please don't come off apologizing for those of us who are rightfully angry about the injustice that exists in this country. Her privilege has shielded her from what many of us experience continuously.

Colin Kaepernick's protest was never about the flag or the national anthem until those symbols were dragged in with the intent to inflame, by those offended by him exercising his right to protest.

We still and always will love you, Miss Gladys, but learn to see things from perspectives other than the one right before your eyes. I say this as one who also has earned privileges most don't have. I know from whence I came and that everyone's life isn't as easy as mine became.

StuBass1
01-19-2019, 02:51 PM
WADR...In other words..."Gladys...see the world through my narrow lens or you are a traitor to [[fill in the blank)"...Gladys was significantly and positively impacting peoples rights and helping those in need while some of those criticizing her [[including Mr Kaepernick) were wearing Buster Browns, Oshkosh B'Gosh or just a glint in their daddys eye and is boldly rejecting the efforts at extortion. The fact that Gladys loves her country and agreed to honor it by performing the National Anthem at this years Super Bowl is refreshing in todays politically divisive environment. She owes nothing to nobody except herself and her lifelong body of excellence and efforts to make the world a better place. Gladys has spent her life making contribution after contribution and those unfamiliar with her struggles and accomplishments should take a few minutes to learn a bit about her...Gladys is gonna tear it up...Don't like it...don't have to watch it...:rolleyes:

jboy88
01-19-2019, 05:54 PM
It is what it is! As long as she doesn’t sport a MAGA baseball cap or something like that, I’m fine with it. Although she could have kept the comments about Kaepernick to herself.

midnightman
01-19-2019, 06:06 PM
It is what it is! As long as she doesn’t sport a MAGA baseball cap or something like that, I’m fine with it. Although she could have kept the comments about Kaepernick to herself.

I think that's why a lot of folks are now commenting. Before, it was just a few who were upset she was even doing it. The minute she said something, it only added fuel to the fire. Like I said, I don't mind her doing it, but don't explain, just say "no comment". It's not hard to do, really. I understand she wanted to clarify but "bringing back its voice" can mean many things to those who researched the history of the anthem. There's a reason everyone only sings just the two verses and it's not just because it was too long... I speak as someone who hasn't been a football fan in years and hasn't watched anything in the Super Bowl since Beyonce and Bruno Mars were on it [[and that was pre-kneeling before the anthem).

Like I mention, unfortunately, it's become political. You got the activists on one side and the #MAGA Trumpers on the other...

marv2
01-19-2019, 06:18 PM
WADR...In other words..."Gladys...see the world through my narrow lens or you are a traitor to [[fill in the blank)"...Gladys was significantly and positively impacting peoples rights and helping those in need while some of those criticizing her [[including Mr Kaepernick) were wearing Buster Browns, Oshkosh B'Gosh or just a glint in their daddys eye and is boldly rejecting the efforts at extortion. The fact that Gladys loves her country and agreed to honor it by performing the National Anthem at this years Super Bowl is refreshing in todays politically divisive environment. She owes nothing to nobody except herself and her lifelong body of excellence and efforts to make the world a better place. Gladys has spent her life making contribution after contribution and those unfamiliar with her struggles and accomplishments should take a few minutes to learn a bit about her...Gladys is gonna tear it up...Don't like it...don't have to watch it...:rolleyes:

This all reminds me of when celebrities went and played Sun City in the 70s. Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with Gladys Knight singing the National Anthem, she is a legend! She is already in the history books and this will not change much as it relates to the entirety of her career.

marv2
01-19-2019, 06:20 PM
I think that's why a lot of folks are now commenting. Before, it was just a few who were upset she was even doing it. The minute she said something, it only added fuel to the fire. Like I said, I don't mind her doing it, but don't explain, just say "no comment". It's not hard to do, really. I understand she wanted to clarify but "bringing back its voice" can mean many things to those who researched the history of the anthem. There's a reason everyone only sings just the two verses and it's not just because it was too long... I speak as someone who hasn't been a football fan in years and hasn't watched anything in the Super Bowl since Beyonce and Bruno Mars were on it [[and that was pre-kneeling before the anthem).

Like I mention, unfortunately, it's become political. You got the activists on one side and the #MAGA Trumpers on the other...

But don't you find this just a bit hypocritical of some folks? Everyone from Whitney Houston to Rosanne Barr has sang the National Anthem at sporting events. It had the same history and lyrics as it does now!

arr&bee
01-19-2019, 06:36 PM
Just a sidenote if i may...the anthem was not written aboard a ship in the baltimore harbour but in a tavern on 14th st in d.c.

midnightman
01-19-2019, 07:08 PM
But don't you find this just a bit hypocritical of some folks? Everyone from Whitney Houston to Rosanne Barr has sang the National Anthem at sporting events. It had the same history and lyrics as it does now!

They've skipped two verses in the song for a good reason though...

I think the point was, folks don't think this is their anthem so they'll give anyone a side eye who claims it is. Hence the Gladys issue.

I mean I get why it would be hypocritical but yeah...

marv2
01-19-2019, 07:13 PM
Just a sidenote if i may...the anthem was not written aboard a ship in the baltimore harbour but in a tavern on 14th st in d.c.

I didn't know that. Thanks JAI.

marv2
01-19-2019, 07:14 PM
They've skipped two verses in the song for a good reason though...

I think the point was, folks don't think this is their anthem so they'll give anyone a side eye who claims it is. Hence the Gladys issue.


I don't know what the two verses are. I do know that we sang it in school. We also said the Pledge of Allegiance every morning.

midnightman
01-19-2019, 07:15 PM
I don't know what the two verses are. I do know that we sang it in school. We also said the Pledge of Allegiance every morning.

Apparently one of the verses was about slavery. :/ It WAS written in 1814 after all.

StuBass1
01-19-2019, 08:40 PM
This all reminds me of when celebrities went and played Sun City in the 70s. Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with Gladys Knight singing the National Anthem, she is a legend! She is already in the history books and this will not change much as it relates to the entirety of her career.

Thank God the extortionists weren't around when THIS happened...https://youtu.be/5bW5Wf_dH7Q

Jerry Oz
01-19-2019, 08:48 PM
But don't you find this just a bit hypocritical of some folks? Everyone from Whitney Houston to Rosanne Barr has sang the National Anthem at sporting events. It had the same history and lyrics as it does now!The hypocrisy around the anthem is manifold, especially when it comes to it being sung before sporting events. I often ask the patriots who are enraged that Kaepernick chose to kneel if they stand when the anthem is sung at home. Most ignore the question and the others lie by saying that they do. I've grown up in a family full of veterans and I've never seen one of them stand when the anthem is sung before an NBA or NFL game. One guy on Facebook chose to lie and say that if he hears it played on the radio while he's driving his rig, he'll pull over and stand outside his truck in attention until it's over. BS for many obvious reasons, not the least that it takes five minutes to pull a semi over on the freeway and brake it down. So if you're such a patriot, why lie about it?

There were two easy ways to handle Kaepernick's protest, one hard one and one deceptive way to view it. The easy ways to handle it would be to look at something else in a stadium with 60 thousand people or simply ignore it. The hard way would be to acknowledge that we are far away from having a country where there is liberty and justice for all by working to change a system that shrugged this week when three cops who were proven guilty of conspiring to cover up the murder of LaQuan McDonald by a fellow cop were acquitted by a judge who acknowledged their conspiracy. And a day later, the pig who pumped 16 bullets into him was given six years for the murder.

God bless everybody who watches the Super Bowl this year, but I won't be one of them. And Gladys can choke on the anthem for all that I care. I wonder if she'd feel the same way if one of her sons was killed by a cop like my brother-in-law was?

And if anybody reading this wonders what the anthem has to do with any of this, I ask what the hell it has to do with football? It galls me to see thousands of people who watch black players compete for their favorite teams, rooting and cheering when they score. But if those players were killed in error or malice by cops the day after they quit, most of those fans would be fine with it. They don't mind black players. But they'll be damned if they care about black people.

"Land of the free" my ass. One day, look up the sentencing discrepancy rates of black people and white people who are convicted of the same crimes. In most cases, the same judge is much harsher about sending black people to prison in the exact same circumstances. This is America.

luke
01-19-2019, 09:11 PM
Well said Jerry!

sansradio
01-19-2019, 10:31 PM
Preach, Jerry. As much as it pains me to say this, Gladys got this one 50 kinds of wrong. If she had just taken the gig and eaten her food, it would have been bad enough. But to throw shade at Kaep and the other protesters is a bridge too far. Ultimately, I'm not shocked that she chose to kowtow to the NFL plantation; my shock over her judgment stopped the day she joined a religion that preached that Black folks were evil [[until their funding was threatened). And now--surprisibus surprisibus-- Fox News is lionizing her [[probably with a graphic of Patti LaBelle). Those kinda friends I don't need.

Roberta75
01-19-2019, 11:26 PM
The hypocrisy around the anthem is manifold, especially when it comes to it being sung before sporting events. I often ask the patriots who are enraged that Kaepernick chose to kneel if they stand when the anthem is sung at home. Most ignore the question and the others lie by saying that they do. I've grown up in a family full of veterans and I've never seen one of them stand when the anthem is sung before an NBA or NFL game. One guy on Facebook chose to lie and say that if he hears it played on the radio while he's driving his rig, he'll pull over and stand outside his truck in attention until it's over. BS for many obvious reasons, not the least that it takes five minutes to pull a semi over on the freeway and brake it down. So if you're such a patriot, why lie about it?

There were two easy ways to handle Kaepernick's protest, one hard one and one deceptive way to view it. The easy ways to handle it would be to look at something else in a stadium with 60 thousand people or simply ignore it. The hard way would be to acknowledge that we are far away from having a country where there is liberty and justice for all by working to change a system that shrugged this week when three cops who were proven guilty of conspiring to cover up the murder of LaQuan McDonald by a fellow cop were acquitted by a judge who acknowledged their conspiracy. And a day later, the pig who pumped 16 bullets into him was given six years for the murder.

God bless everybody who watches the Super Bowl this year, but I won't be one of them. And Gladys can choke on the anthem for all that I care. I wonder if she'd feel the same way if one of her sons was killed by a cop like my brother-in-law was?

And if anybody reading this wonders what the anthem has to do with any of this, I ask what the hell it has to do with football? It galls me to see thousands of people who watch black players compete for their favorite teams, rooting and cheering when they score. But if those players were killed in error or malice by cops the day after they quit, most of those fans would be fine with it. They don't mind black players. But they'll be damned if they care about black people.

"Land of the free" my ass. One day, look up the sentencing discrepancy rates of black people and white people who are convicted of the same crimes. In most cases, the same judge is much harsher about sending black people to prison in the exact same circumstances. This is America.


Well said Jerry. The little respect I had Gladys Knight went out the window when she played right into the hands of the MAGA bigots by trashing a true patriot like Colin Kaepernick. Ive always known she was phony but this is simply disgusting.

marv2
01-20-2019, 12:22 AM
Thank God the extortionists weren't around when THIS happened...https://youtu.be/5bW5Wf_dH7Q

Whitney shut it down for all times! hehehehehehe! There were grown men crying after that. For many years they played Whitney Houston's version everyday in New York at 12 noon on WCBS.

marv2
01-20-2019, 12:33 AM
The hypocrisy around the anthem is manifold, especially when it comes to it being sung before sporting events. I often ask the patriots who are enraged that Kaepernick chose to kneel if they stand when the anthem is sung at home. Most ignore the question and the others lie by saying that they do. I've grown up in a family full of veterans and I've never seen one of them stand when the anthem is sung before an NBA or NFL game. One guy on Facebook chose to lie and say that if he hears it played on the radio while he's driving his rig, he'll pull over and stand outside his truck in attention until it's over. BS for many obvious reasons, not the least that it takes five minutes to pull a semi over on the freeway and brake it down. So if you're such a patriot, why lie about it?

There were two easy ways to handle Kaepernick's protest, one hard one and one deceptive way to view it. The easy ways to handle it would be to look at something else in a stadium with 60 thousand people or simply ignore it. The hard way would be to acknowledge that we are far away from having a country where there is liberty and justice for all by working to change a system that shrugged this week when three cops who were proven guilty of conspiring to cover up the murder of LaQuan McDonald by a fellow cop were acquitted by a judge who acknowledged their conspiracy. And a day later, the pig who pumped 16 bullets into him was given six years for the murder.

God bless everybody who watches the Super Bowl this year, but I won't be one of them. And Gladys can choke on the anthem for all that I care. I wonder if she'd feel the same way if one of her sons was killed by a cop like my brother-in-law was?

And if anybody reading this wonders what the anthem has to do with any of this, I ask what the hell it has to do with football? It galls me to see thousands of people who watch black players compete for their favorite teams, rooting and cheering when they score. But if those players were killed in error or malice by cops the day after they quit, most of those fans would be fine with it. They don't mind black players. But they'll be damned if they care about black people.

"Land of the free" my ass. One day, look up the sentencing discrepancy rates of black people and white people who are convicted of the same crimes. In most cases, the same judge is much harsher about sending black people to prison in the exact same circumstances. This is America.

Jerry you made a lot of great points. It reminded me of Motown, it's music and the Motortown Revue tours of the South during the early 60's. You had die hard southern racists attending these shows that had segregated audiences. The performers were black, the music was black music, but yet they paid money to see the shows. They never gave a thought to the fact the black entertainers they were cheering could not sleep in the local hotels or eat at the local restaurants! They just disconnected from all of that when it came to the music. Hypocresy!

People lied when they claimed that the Veterans were offended by the NFL protest, but a large group of Veterans said publicly that they were not offended. They said the reason they went and fought was for Americans like me, you, Kaepernick and everyone to have the right to protest injustices. That truck driver you mentioned is lying. People in this country love to pick sides like life is a school yard game with shirts vs skins. They don't even know why they do it most of time. I support Colin Kaepernick and have since the very beginning. I have gotten into my share of arguments over it. I love Gladys Knight and have all of my life and will continue to love her. She's not perfect, but who is?

marv2
01-20-2019, 12:34 AM
Well said Jerry!

Yes he did!

luke
01-20-2019, 12:39 AM
Now Marv are you implying there is fake news?! Lol

Jerry Oz
01-20-2019, 01:00 AM
Jerry you made a lot of great points. It reminded me of Motown, it's music and the Motortown Revue tours of the South during the early 60's. You had die hard southern racists attending these shows that had segregated audiences. The performers were black, the music was black music, but yet they paid money to see the shows. They never gave a thought to the fact the black entertainers they were cheering could not sleep in the local hotels or eat at the local restaurants! They just disconnected from all of that when it came to the music. Hypocresy!

People lied when they claimed that the Veterans were offended by the NFL protest, but a large group of Veterans said publicly that they were not offended. They said the reason they went and fought was for Americans like me, you, Kaepernick and everyone to have the right to protest injustices. That truck driver you mentioned is lying. People in this country love to pick sides like life is a school yard game with shirts vs skins. They don't even know why they do it most of time. I support Colin Kaepernick and have since the very beginning. I have gotten into my share of arguments over it. I love Gladys Knight and have all of my life and will continue to love her. She's not perfect, but who is?That's cool, Marv. You will never hear me encourage anybody to accept my views on anything. I will argue about a lot but never to try to coerce someone to do something that they don't want to do. On one of the Clubhouse threads, Jai, moe, ms_m and I discuss football and basketball and I haven't watched a football game at home all year. But I love those three enough that I want them to enjoy it. I feel the same way with you and Gladys. Never ever let somebody twist how you feel about someone or something.

I'm a little special pissy with Ms. Knight because I'm pretty sure she appeared as the Bee on the "Masked Singer" a couple weeks ago and she knocked her song out of the park. I was happy to know that she still had pipes and looking forward to what she was going to do next. And then, she did this shit.:mad:

I don't hate her because I don't hate too many people. But I just don't like her anymore. And that's just too bad. If you didn't see the show, here she is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCoqQS7rSlY

marv2
01-20-2019, 01:14 AM
Now Marv are you implying there is fake news?! Lol

Luke, I said no such thing! LOL!

marv2
01-20-2019, 01:18 AM
That's cool, Marv. You will never hear me encourage anybody to accept my views on anything. I will argue about a lot but never to try to coerce someone to do something that they don't want to do. On one of the Clubhouse threads, Jai, moe, ms_m and I discuss football and basketball and I haven't watched a football game at home all year. But I love those three enough that I want them to enjoy it. I feel the same way with you and Gladys. Never ever let somebody twist how you feel about someone or something.

I'm a little special pissy with Ms. Knight because I'm pretty sure she appeared as the Bee on the "Masked Singer" a couple weeks ago and she knocked her song out of the park. I was happy to know that she still had pipes and looking forward to what she was going to do next. And then, she did this shit.:mad:

I don't hate her because I don't hate too many people. But I just don't like her anymore. And that's just too bad. If you didn't see the show, here she is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCoqQS7rSlY

Thanks Jerry. Yes, Gladys still has it. I last saw her in 2015 in Toledo, OH and she was awesome. After losing Aretha like we did, I just seem to appreciate people like Gladys that much more. Sometimes when people get to be her age, you come at them in a particular way especially if you are substantially younger. LOL! They ain't bugin' otherwise........

midnightman
01-20-2019, 01:21 AM
Here's the third and fourth verses of the Star-Spangled Banner for those who really wanna know but overlook because "BUT IT'S GLADYS KNIIIIIIGHT!?!":

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand
Between their lov’d home and the war’s desolation!
Blest with vict’ry and peace may the heav’n rescued land
Praise the power that hath made and preserv’d us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto – “In God is our trust,”
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

----

What makes me think the lyric in bold was attacking slaves [[black people who fought with the British) was also due to this fact that is left out when talking of Francis Scott Key:

The man was a slaveowner who thought black folks were "inferior" to him...

So yeah, why should I claim this song as my own when we have our own [[which we don't sing enough):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMaMyVRB1cY

khansperac
01-20-2019, 01:22 AM
Gladys sure has been taking a lot of L’s lately. Her perceived lying at Aretha’s funeral, to dressing up as a bee 🐝 on a singing competition show, to now being called a sellout. She would have been better off not saying anything and just sang the song. This would have blown over. She made it worse.

midnightman
01-20-2019, 01:59 AM
Why I think Gladys should know better is because she was THERE. Just because we have no more segregation and we have more freedom than we had before the end of the '60s, does not mean we've reached full acceptance in a country that our ancestors were dragged to, to begin with. Gladys isn't stupid. She knows and understands what Colin is doing but is foolish to think singing this anthem, especially in the traditional sense [[*rolling my eyes right now*) will "unite us". No it wouldn't.

It'll be like when Sammy Davis Jr. [[and James Brown to some degree) thought it was a wise thing to think Nixon really cared about black issues only to get burned when they realized he didn't [[Brown later claimed Nixon put him on his enemies list because he actually helped a few of his band mates ditch the Vietnam War).

Looking at current news, you know we're still divided. And not more divided, but now with the internet, our division is, in the words of Marvin, "live, in living color".

And since some folks wanna give Gladys the benefit of the doubt... I'll break it down this way:

Yeah, Gladys definitely contributed to race relations with her music, but that was her and several others. Even then, she wasn't in the "forefront" like that. James Brown, for all of his faults, was. Sam Cooke was. MOTOWN was! People who are not deep into Motown like we are, forget that during the Motortown Revues of the early '60s, the color line started to drop. It was still heavy in some areas in the south but they eventually got tore down at the end of the decade. Motown had their touring bus shot at by racist whites assuming they were Freedom Riders. THEY WERE SHOT AT! [[Temptations, Supremes, Mary Wells, Marvin Gaye, Stevie Wonder, Miracles, etc.)

Gladys did suffer from those same fronts as did all black entertainers in those days. Tina Turner told some stories of confronting a white woman who called her a "black b***h" and almost punched her. I have googled Gladys' so-called civil rights contributions and the only thing I really found was her performing at a concert where Stevie Wonder and Gil-Scott Heron pushed for King Day to be a national holiday in 1982.

Other than that, what did she do? She didn't protest against segregated concerts like Sam and Aretha did in the early '60s, did she? Matter of fact, Aretha was the activist. Her contributions to civil rights are well known at this point. She was the only one that was willing to send money to Angela Davis when Angela was locked up on trumped up charges. Now you have the #MAGAts taking her word that she was an activist because she said so. None of her biographies ever mentioned anything groundbreaking she did except for winning Ted Mack's Amateur Hour on national TV in 1952, which got her in the NAACP at 8 [[this is according to one biography). But other than that, what else did she do? All she claimed in her statement that she was an activist. Did she ever mention her own activities?

I'm sure if she had had her way when she and the Pips signed to Motown in 1966, she would've been okay with a black audience only since that was the only audience she was singing for. Still stuck in the chitlin' circuit. Going to Motown would be her ticket out. Less than a year after signing, they released "I Heard It Through the Grapevine", which did help to do its job as they promised: it welcomed Gladys Knight and the Pips to a white audience. Now was some of their stuff not as easy to catch on with pop audiences? Yeah, but they also desired, least Gladys did, for a crossover sound and found it near the end of their Motown tenure with "Help Me Make It Through the Night" and "Neither One of Us" [[both songs written by white songwriters). After they began to perform regularly in Vegas following their signing to Buddah Records in 1973, this is when Gladys began to bitterly complain about Motown claiming they were treated like second class citizens there despite the fact that most of the Motown heavyweights were having some chart troubles at the same time GK&TP's found their breakthrough there. Their success at Buddah wouldn't have been POSSIBLE without them being on Motown and y'all know this. People still call her a MOTOWN LEGEND.

No one wants to ask why did she suddenly break from the Pips in 1989 when they were approaching 40 years together? It seems too simple than a simple "I want to go solo" thing. William Guest didn't wanna quit. Bubba didn't wanna quit. And Edward Patten didn't wanna quit. They had just come off of "Love Overboard" for chrissakes.

No one wants to ask why in 1997, this lifelong Baptist suddenly converted to Mormonism, which for years were convinced BLACK PEOPLE WERE THE DEVILS. The same religion that her two eldest children were in before her.

Why after Aretha's death, she suddenly claims she suffered the "same issues" as Aretha did and didn't correct folks quick enough to say she didn't have cancer?

Gladys has done some questionable stuff in her life. It doesn't take away from her legacy, but she is not immune to criticism. She KNEW the reaction this would get... and did it anyway and then to rub salt in the wounds of those who protested against violence by cops on us, say she marched with social workers and the like. It's like if you work with a president known for being a bigot [[because Trump is not the only one who holds such views) and when criticized, they'll say "hey I was doing demonstrations back when cops firehosed us."

OKAY but folks were getting firehosed in Ferguson, St. Louis and Baltimore when the Black Lives Matter demonstrations began and that wasn't in 1960s America but 2010s America... she knows what's going on but chose to stay quiet. Why suddenly is she so outspoken about THIS?

That's why I feel it's HER that's being the hypocritical one IMHO. Because for her to mention her activism means SHE KNOWS what's going on but is trying to be egalitarian about it. There are things to be egalitarian about, this is not one of them...

https://media.giphy.com/media/BvZ1s3EjXXzLq/giphy.gif

midnightman
01-20-2019, 02:02 AM
Gladys sure has been taking a lot of L’s lately. Her perceived lying at Aretha’s funeral, to dressing up as a bee �� on a singing competition show, to now being called a sellout. She would have been better off not saying anything and just sang the song. This would have blown over. She made it worse.

I'm still confused by that one.

Jerry Oz
01-20-2019, 05:53 PM
OKAY but folks were getting firehosed in Ferguson, St. Louis and Baltimore when the Black Lives Matter demonstrations began and that wasn't in 1960s America but 2010s America... she knows what's going on but chose to stay quiet. Why suddenly is she so outspoken about THIS?

That's why I feel it's HER that's being the hypocritical one IMHO. Because for her to mention her activism means SHE KNOWS what's going on but is trying to be egalitarian about it. There are things to be egalitarian about, this is not one of them...

https://media.giphy.com/media/BvZ1s3EjXXzLq/giphy.gifYou see, this is why I wish we had a "like" button on SDF. Gladys isn't stupid or unaware of what's going on. She knows the issue and took a side.

StuBass1
01-20-2019, 06:31 PM
If Cardi b can wax poetic on the state of the nation...surely Gladys has earned the right to do so as well...

midnightman
01-20-2019, 08:22 PM
You see, this is why I wish we had a "like" button on SDF. Gladys isn't stupid or unaware of what's going on. She knows the issue and took a side.

Exactly.

Stu, that's good and all, but she also earned the right to say "no comment" and keep it moving. Her trying to explain made it worse. Simple as that.

StuBass1
01-20-2019, 08:36 PM
Might have been discretion as the better part of valor...however, we tend to encourage those who agree with us in these types of situations and criticize those who don't... Maybe it's just human nature....

midnightman
01-20-2019, 11:09 PM
It's funny Cardi was mentioned here because this is one of the posts going around:

14957

Jerry Oz
01-21-2019, 01:03 AM
Might have been discretion as the better part of valor...however, we tend to encourage those who agree with us in these types of situations and criticize those who don't... Maybe it's just human nature....She's entitled to her opinion. I think the problem with this particular issue is so many have been impacted by it. She had the nerve to say she carried the flag so people who think she's wrong to sing can kiss her ass. Some of us have lost loved ones without answers and it's more than a typical political issue for us. People who think it can be broken down to a talking point about the patriotism of protesters rub salt into still festering wounds.

midnightman
01-21-2019, 01:20 AM
The few times I saw black artists use this song as some kind of protest [[in a sense) was Jimi Hendrix and Marvin Gaye [[probably accidental on Hendrix's part). Marvin did it in such a way that white folks got mad and threatened to blackball him [[according to Stevie Wonder) from performing because his version didn't evoke the "patriotism" they expected from it. But for those who watched him sing it in '83, it took the sting out of the nationalist, patriotic garbage we were fed. And some black b-ball players that participated in the game that day said "for the first time as a black man living in America, I was proud to be black and in America" because of Marvin's gospel version. Hendrix's version came in the middle of Americans being forced to go to a war most didn't wanna go because they saw war as unjust. Gladys takes it to the opposite direction when many of us who are in the "new generation" [[myself included) that claims she wants this song to "unite Americans". It's not gonna unite anyone. For her to say the issue with the song and the protests should be separate is taking away from the message. Do you think Stevie Wonder, who himself famously kneeled down onstage with his son as a means of supporting Colin, would agree with this? No. So why should we accept it because arguably the greatest female vocalist to record in Motown is doing it?

https://media1.tenor.com/images/41b579fdff23e8fe51284cbd3ebd6edf/tenor.gif?itemid=5584827

franjoy56
01-21-2019, 02:03 AM
Im sorry i agree w gladys let her sing her t stsr spangled banner she paid her dues why should she miss hrr chsnce t shine because someone has issues w police brutality and racism enough alrready. The trump shutdown is enough lets have something t sing about gladys wont disaapoint

arr&bee
01-21-2019, 02:43 PM
I've been reading this post,i'm asking did gladys make her statements about colin on her own or did someone ask her opinion?

midnightman
01-21-2019, 04:26 PM
I've been reading this post,i'm asking did gladys make her statements about colin on her own or did someone ask her opinion?

Someone at another forum suggested Gladys' people released the statement because of people bringing up Colin's name. Colin never said a word about it. Guess that didn't work since her official IG is locked from comments.

StuBass1
01-21-2019, 05:00 PM
Kaepernick is pulling down MILLIONS with his routine [[following his fall from grace as an NFL quarterback) and created his own money generating ATM which he can withdraw from for years to come which I admit was a smart financial move on his part, so I really don't think he gives a rats behind about Gladys or gives her a second thought...

Jerry Oz
01-21-2019, 05:28 PM
Im sorry i agree w gladys let her sing her t stsr spangled banner she paid her dues why should she miss hrr chsnce t shine because someone has issues w police brutality and racism enough alrready. The trump shutdown is enough lets have something t sing about gladys wont disaapointWhy are you sorry? You and she are entitled to your opinions. But if she was hoping to kick start a return to her career, she pretty much derailed it before it got out of the gate.

StuBass1
01-21-2019, 05:44 PM
Why are you sorry? You and she are entitled to your opinions. But if she was hoping to kick start a return to her career, she pretty much derailed it before it got out of the gate.

Gladys is a legend who as of this date is secure both financially and personally as she approaches her 75th birthday. I honestly don't think "kick starting" her career with the largely millennial crowd that may take issue with her message of what she views as "patriotism" is of prime importance to her... She is of the age and station in life where she can do pretty well what she pleases when she pleases...I look forward with her anthem rendition and hope it rises to the level of those great Anthem performances [[Whitney, Marvin, et al) before her...I still recall being present at Tiger Stadium in 68 at the World Series when Jose Feliciano gave the first public [[to my recollection) "non-traditional" version of the anthem...and was booed roundly for it... I expect Gladys will do a more traditional rendition, with perhaps one or two melismatic variances...

marv2
01-21-2019, 07:43 PM
Gladys is a legend who as of this date is secure both financially and personally as she approaches her 75th birthday. I honestly don't think "kick starting" her career with the largely millennial crowd that may take issue with her message of what she views as "patriotism" is of prime importance to her... She is of the age and station in life where she can do pretty well what she pleases when she pleases...I look forward with her anthem rendition and hope it rises to the level of those great Anthem performances [[Whitney, Marvin, et al) before her...I still recall being present at Tiger Stadium in 68 at the World Series when Jose Feliciano gave the first public [[to my recollection) "non-traditional" version of the anthem...and was booed roundly for it... I expect Gladys will do a more traditional rendition, with perhaps one or two melismatic variances...

You were at the Tigers game when Jose Feliciano did that? Wow! I remember watching it sitting on the floor in our new house. We just moved at the start of the World Series that year.

StuBass1
01-21-2019, 08:19 PM
You were at the Tigers game when Jose Feliciano did that? Wow! I remember watching it sitting on the floor in our new house. We just moved at the start of the World Series that year.

Yup...historic game 5 when Lou Brock forgot to slide into home plate and Willie Horton fired a strike from left field to home plate where Freehan tagged Brock out and changed the entire series outcome...I remember walking into the ballpark as Jose, seated on a stool in the outfield I think and was just starting singing and people started looking at each other like...WTF. The old Detroit sports announcer Van Patrick was in a box along the first baseline and held his nose... Jose's performance started a well publicized feud with Marvin Gaye who had performed a very traditional anthem [[Lord how things have changed LOL) at an earlier game and Marvin challenged Jose to a sing off calling the Puerto Rican Feliciano's version "unpatriotic"...https://youtu.be/aQkY2UFBUb4

franjoy56
01-21-2019, 09:10 PM
She does not need to restart her career she's already a legend

sansradio
01-21-2019, 09:50 PM
I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizens Councillor or the Ku Klux Klanner but the white moderate who is more devoted to order than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says, “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can’t agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically feels that he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by the myth of time; and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a “more convenient season.”

- The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. [from “Letter from a Birmingham Jail,” August 1963]

marv2
01-21-2019, 09:55 PM
Yup...historic game 5 when Lou Brock forgot to slide into home plate and Willie Horton fired a strike from left field to home plate where Freehan tagged Brock out and changed the entire series outcome...I remember walking into the ballpark as Jose, seated on a stool in the outfield I think and was just starting singing and people started looking at each other like...WTF. The old Detroit sports announcer Van Patrick was in a box along the first baseline and held his nose... Jose's performance started a well publicized feud with Marvin Gaye who had performed a very traditional anthem [[Lord how things have changed LOL) at an earlier game and Marvin challenged Jose to a sing off calling the Puerto Rican Feliciano's version "unpatriotic"...https://youtu.be/aQkY2UFBUb4

Stu, you really took me back to one of the happiest times in my life with this post. The only name that would have complete the picture would have been Ernie Harwell. Remember him? I don't know if he was calling the Tigers games on WWJ by the time of the '68 Series. Thank you.

marv2
01-21-2019, 09:56 PM
She does not need to restart her career she's already a legend

Fran, Gladys is like one of the all time greatest in music. This whole matter should have been discussed privately. Really there's been too many people that sung the National Anthem to just jump all over Gladys Knight now.

marv2
01-21-2019, 09:58 PM
I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizens Councillor or the Ku Klux Klanner but the white moderate who is more devoted to order than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says, “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can’t agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically feels that he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by the myth of time; and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a “more convenient season.”

- The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. [from “Letter from a Birmingham Jail,” August 1963]

Thank you for that Sansradio. Even Martin and Malcolm disagreed on the best way to achieve freedom and equality.

sansradio
01-21-2019, 10:11 PM
Thank you for that Sansradio. Even Martin and Malcolm disagreed on the best way to achieve freedom and equality.

Sure. But King was a lot more radical than he’s given lip service for. Same road, different vehicles.

Roberta75
01-21-2019, 10:13 PM
Her being a legend has nothing to do with her and any entertainer's/public figure's complacency. In making her statement, she put herself in the position to be judged even if she feels her intention is good. And again, what did Colin say???

He said absolutely nothing about Gladys yet Ms. Knight jumped the gun to explain herself before she said anything. Colin only talked to Travis. Gladys wanted the headlines so that's why her people put out her statement.

I have no issue with her doing it but don't rub it in people's faces and then say the anthem, with its controversial past and how the versions by Jose Feliciano, Hendrix and Marvin Gaye caused some whites to feel some type of way because they didn't perform it the way it was expected, and the social ills currently affecting us, to "be separate". This is not Whitney Houston singing it in the middle of the Gulf War. This is the era of "Black Lives Matter" and calling out racism and police brutality.

And for Gladys doing it, why is anyone in this thread surprised at the reactions? Most of us in the black community are stuck mentally because we look at every opportunity offered to us as "progress" and sometimes it's actually regress. The reactions from prejudiced Trump voters speaks volumes that they can point to one of us and say "see, she ain't no uppity Negro" and say we should sit down and shut up and the black users just consigning it is making me sad.

I'm not watching, as I said, but let's not act like those of us addressing what's wrong with this are being oversensitive.

Perfectly stated midnightman. Im not watching her either. Its real cowardly of her to block posters on instagram who disagree with her. Shame on her for even bringing Colin Kaepernicks name into this. She knew exactly what she was doing. Maybe her concerts will now attract the MAGA bigots.

StuBass1
01-21-2019, 10:19 PM
Stu, you really took me back to one of the happiest times in my life with this post. The only name that would have complete the picture would have been Ernie Harwell. Remember him? I don't know if he was calling the Tigers games on WWJ by the time of the '68 Series. Thank you.

Of course Baseball Hall Of Famer Ernie Harwell was calling the 68 series. Ernie announced until 2002 when he finally retired at the age of 84...Tigers retired Harwell in 1991 amid a massive protest and Mike Illich purchased the team and brought Ernie back in 93 where he continued broadcasting for another 8 years...

marv2
01-21-2019, 10:25 PM
Of course Baseball Hall Of Famer Ernie Harwell was calling the 68 series. Ernie announced until 2002 when he finally retired at the age of 84...Tigers retired Harwell in 1991 amid a massive protest and Mike Illich purchased the team and brought Ernie back in 93 where he continued broadcasting for another 8 years...

I remember sitting out in the backyard on some summer nights and listening to Ernie over radio with my brother and Dad. I remember getting a Tigers Season calender from him for the 1974 season.

midnightman
01-21-2019, 10:47 PM
Yup...historic game 5 when Lou Brock forgot to slide into home plate and Willie Horton fired a strike from left field to home plate where Freehan tagged Brock out and changed the entire series outcome...I remember walking into the ballpark as Jose, seated on a stool in the outfield I think and was just starting singing and people started looking at each other like...WTF. The old Detroit sports announcer Van Patrick was in a box along the first baseline and held his nose... Jose's performance started a well publicized feud with Marvin Gaye who had performed a very traditional anthem [[Lord how things have changed LOL) at an earlier game and Marvin challenged Jose to a sing off calling the Puerto Rican Feliciano's version "unpatriotic"...https://youtu.be/aQkY2UFBUb4

Funny thing about that is 15 years later, Marvin had changed so much from the '60s Marvin that when he did the anthem again [[his fourth time), it changed the game far more than what even Jose did.

midnightman
01-21-2019, 10:51 PM
Thank you for that Sansradio. Even Martin and Malcolm disagreed on the best way to achieve freedom and equality.

You think King was docile in his day? He was a whole lot radical than you think!

midnightman
01-21-2019, 10:57 PM
Repeating what I said earlier because I accidentally deleted it while I was trying to edit through my phone:

Her being a legend has nothing to do with her and any entertainer's/public figure's complacency. In making her statement, she put herself in the position to be judged even if she feels her intention is good. And again, what did Colin say???

He said absolutely nothing about Gladys yet Ms. Knight jumped the gun to explain herself before he said anything. Colin only talked to Travis. Gladys wanted the headlines so that's why her people put out her statement.

I have no issue with her doing it but don't rub it in people's faces and then say the anthem, with its controversial past and how the versions by Jose Feliciano, Hendrix and Marvin Gaye caused some whites to feel some type of way because they didn't perform it the way it was expected, and the social ills currently affecting us, to "be separate". This is not Whitney Houston singing it in the middle of the Gulf War. This is the era of "Black Lives Matter" and calling out racism and police brutality.

And for Gladys doing it, why is anyone in this thread surprised at the reactions? Most of us in the black community are stuck mentally because we look at every opportunity offered to us as "progress" and sometimes it's actually regress. The reactions from prejudiced Trump voters speaks volumes that they can point to one of us and say "see, she ain't no uppity Negro" and say we should sit down and shut up and the black users just consigning it is making me sad.

I'm not watching, as I said, but let's not act like those of us addressing what's wrong with this are being oversensitive.

StuBass1
01-21-2019, 10:57 PM
Funny thing about that is 15 years later, Marvin had changed so much from the '60s Marvin that when he did the anthem again [[his fourth time), it changed the game far more than what even Jose did.

Quite true...Marvin was so traditional in 68, wearing a suit and tie looking so cool... He got PISSED at Jose, but don't forget, Berry Gordy would likely not have allowed Marvin back in 68 to do anything other than his traditional "acceptable" version. This was before What's Going On when Berry ultimately saw the commercial possibilities in going more non-traditional...

midnightman
01-21-2019, 10:59 PM
Perfectly stated midnightman. Im not watching her either. Its real cowardly of her to block posters on instagram who disagree with her. Shame on her for even bringing Colin Kaepernicks name into this. She knew exactly what she was doing. Maybe her concerts will now attract the MAGA bigots.

Thanks. Like I said, Colin didn't even say anything. Colin only talked to Travis Scott.

midnightman
01-21-2019, 11:00 PM
Quite true...Marvin was so traditional in 68, wearing a suit and tie looking so cool... He got PISSED at Jose, but don't forget, Berry Gordy would likely not have allowed Marvin back in 68 to do anything other than his traditional "acceptable" version. This was before What's Going On when Berry ultimately saw the commercial possibilities in going more non-traditional...

Marvin said something about how he hated "shucking and jiving" during his early Motown years...

Jerry Oz
01-21-2019, 11:01 PM
I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizens Councillor or the Ku Klux Klanner but the white moderate who is more devoted to order than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says, “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can’t agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically feels that he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by the myth of time; and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a “more convenient season.”

- The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. [from “Letter from a Birmingham Jail,” August 1963]I have pondered this quote for years. Never more than in the last 10, when the US became more and more intolerant toward peoples of color after Obama was elected. I honestly think people who don't want to get involved on either side of the social justice divide believe they aren't part of the problem if they aren't actively holding back minorities. Their silence is necessary for racism to succeed. "Not taking a side" is an active choice and it is absolutely taking the side of oppression.

Jerry Oz
01-21-2019, 11:06 PM
Repeating what I said earlier because I accidentally deleted it while I was trying to edit through my phone:

Her being a legend has nothing to do with her and any entertainer's/public figure's complacency. In making her statement, she put herself in the position to be judged even if she feels her intention is good. And again, what did Colin say???

He said absolutely nothing about Gladys yet Ms. Knight jumped the gun to explain herself before he said anything. Colin only talked to Travis. Gladys wanted the headlines so that's why her people put out her statement.

I have no issue with her doing it but don't rub it in people's faces and then say the anthem, with its controversial past and how the versions by Jose Feliciano, Hendrix and Marvin Gaye caused some whites to feel some type of way because they didn't perform it the way it was expected, and the social ills currently affecting us, to "be separate". This is not Whitney Houston singing it in the middle of the Gulf War. This is the era of "Black Lives Matter" and calling out racism and police brutality.

And for Gladys doing it, why is anyone in this thread surprised at the reactions? Most of us in the black community are stuck mentally because we look at every opportunity offered to us as "progress" and sometimes it's actually regress. The reactions from prejudiced Trump voters speaks volumes that they can point to one of us and say "see, she ain't no uppity Negro" and say we should sit down and shut up and the black users just consigning it is making me sad.

I'm not watching, as I said, but let's not act like those of us addressing what's wrong with this are being oversensitive.Thank you for this post. I co-sign to every word.

sansradio
01-21-2019, 11:09 PM
I have pondered this quote for years. Never more than in the last 10, when the US became more and more intolerant toward peoples of color after Obama was elected. I honestly think people who don't want to get involved on either side of the social justice divide believe they aren't part of the problem if they aren't actively holding back minorities. Their silence is necessary for racism to succeed. "Not taking a side" is an active choice and it is absolutely taking the side of oppression.

On the nose as usual, my friend.

jobeterob
01-21-2019, 11:43 PM
Thanks for these posts Midnight Sans and Jerry

sansradio
01-21-2019, 11:53 PM
Thanks for these posts Midnight Sans and Jerry

No worries, jr. Happy MLK Day from your friends in the States.

luke
01-22-2019, 12:27 AM
“All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for enough good men to do nothing.”

sansradio
01-22-2019, 12:53 AM
“All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for enough good men to do nothing.”

Tell it!!!

StuBass1
01-22-2019, 01:11 AM
C'mon Glady's... Here's some inspiration for ya...https://youtu.be/HU0SZXcNNbY

midnightman
01-22-2019, 01:26 AM
“All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for enough good men to do nothing.”

Amen, Luke.

marv2
01-22-2019, 09:53 AM
Charlie Wilson's version:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FlU9AjMvCM

StuBass1
01-22-2019, 09:37 PM
Uncle Charlie making a pitch for the NBA Championship series perhaps...Gets my vote...Wisely avoids the political discourse...Some friends of mine spent the entire day hanging and boating with Charlie at a lake up north where he lives and had never heard of Charlie or the Gap band. They say he was a great guy to hang out with...

RanRan79
01-23-2019, 11:42 AM
The hypocrisy around the anthem is manifold, especially when it comes to it being sung before sporting events. I often ask the patriots who are enraged that Kaepernick chose to kneel if they stand when the anthem is sung at home. Most ignore the question and the others lie by saying that they do. I've grown up in a family full of veterans and I've never seen one of them stand when the anthem is sung before an NBA or NFL game. One guy on Facebook chose to lie and say that if he hears it played on the radio while he's driving his rig, he'll pull over and stand outside his truck in attention until it's over. BS for many obvious reasons, not the least that it takes five minutes to pull a semi over on the freeway and brake it down. So if you're such a patriot, why lie about it?

There were two easy ways to handle Kaepernick's protest, one hard one and one deceptive way to view it. The easy ways to handle it would be to look at something else in a stadium with 60 thousand people or simply ignore it. The hard way would be to acknowledge that we are far away from having a country where there is liberty and justice for all by working to change a system that shrugged this week when three cops who were proven guilty of conspiring to cover up the murder of LaQuan McDonald by a fellow cop were acquitted by a judge who acknowledged their conspiracy. And a day later, the pig who pumped 16 bullets into him was given six years for the murder.

God bless everybody who watches the Super Bowl this year, but I won't be one of them. And Gladys can choke on the anthem for all that I care. I wonder if she'd feel the same way if one of her sons was killed by a cop like my brother-in-law was?

And if anybody reading this wonders what the anthem has to do with any of this, I ask what the hell it has to do with football? It galls me to see thousands of people who watch black players compete for their favorite teams, rooting and cheering when they score. But if those players were killed in error or malice by cops the day after they quit, most of those fans would be fine with it. They don't mind black players. But they'll be damned if they care about black people.

"Land of the free" my ass. One day, look up the sentencing discrepancy rates of black people and white people who are convicted of the same crimes. In most cases, the same judge is much harsher about sending black people to prison in the exact same circumstances. This is America.

You betta preach Jerry!!! I agree with this in it's entirety. I'll always love Gladys Knight for the impact her artistry has had on me for my entire lifetime thus far, but I don't respect her and she'll never get another dime from me. She's cooning for a position, and if Fox News is giving her airtime of praise, she can consider it a job well done. I'll await to hear of her "Knight At the White House: Gladys Performs For the President" Fox News special, presented by Sean Hannity, who accompanies Gladys on an emotional rendition of "Dixie". I'm done with her.

RanRan79
01-23-2019, 11:54 AM
I always thought "America the Beautiful" was a much more appropriate anthem than the piece of crap written by a piece of trash. As a nation we have to ask ourselves why would we want to be associated so fiercely with a song written by a slave owner? That crap should've been replaced with something else decades ago. Of course the obvious answer to why some don't mind associating with that song...

sansradio
01-23-2019, 01:17 PM
You betta preach Jerry!!! I agree with this in it's entirety. I'll always love Gladys Knight for the impact her artistry has had on me for my entire lifetime thus far, but I don't respect her and she'll never get another dime from me. She's cooning for a position, and if Fox News is giving her airtime of praise, she can consider it a job well done. I'll await to hear of her "Knight At the White House: Gladys Performs For the President" Fox News special, presented by Sean Hannity, who accompanies Gladys on an emotional rendition of "Dixie". I'm done with her.

"We must tell our white brothers that the few Uncle Toms who will sill their souls for a mess of economic pottage do not speak for the Negro."

The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
[Address at Public Meeting of the Southern Christian Ministers Conference of Mississippi; [[https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu/king-papers/documents/address-public-meeting-southern-christian-ministers-conference-mississippi) September 23, 1959]

RanRan79
01-23-2019, 04:06 PM
"We must tell our white brothers that the few Uncle Toms who will sill their souls for a mess of economic pottage do not speak for the Negro."

The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
[Address at Public Meeting of the Southern Christian Ministers Conference of Mississippi; [[https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu/king-papers/documents/address-public-meeting-southern-christian-ministers-conference-mississippi) September 23, 1959]

...Amen...

Roberta75
01-23-2019, 04:44 PM
You betta preach Jerry!!! I agree with this in it's entirety. I'll always love Gladys Knight for the impact her artistry has had on me for my entire lifetime thus far, but I don't respect her and she'll never get another dime from me. She's cooning for a position, and if Fox News is giving her airtime of praise, she can consider it a job well done. I'll await to hear of her "Knight At the White House: Gladys Performs For the President" Fox News special, presented by Sean Hannity, who accompanies Gladys on an emotional rendition of "Dixie". I'm done with her.

Shes now the darling of the far right. Shes going to be singing for President Pus*y Grabber real soon. SMH

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gladys-knight-a-freedom-loving-patriot-takes-a-stand-in-defense-of-the-national-anthem

https://www.newsmax.com/jameshirsen/levine-nfl-super-bowl/2019/01/22/id/899250/

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gutfeld-on-the-super-bowls-national-anthem-and-gladys-knight

midnightman
01-23-2019, 05:04 PM
"We must tell our white brothers that the few Uncle Toms who will sill their souls for a mess of economic pottage do not speak for the Negro."

The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
[Address at Public Meeting of the Southern Christian Ministers Conference of Mississippi; [[https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu/king-papers/documents/address-public-meeting-southern-christian-ministers-conference-mississippi) September 23, 1959]

Revisionist history would have you believe Dr. King never uttered the word "Uncle Tom". Here we have it!

midnightman
01-23-2019, 05:05 PM
Shes now the darling of the far right. Shes going to be singing for President Pus*y Grabber real soon. SMH

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gladys-knight-a-freedom-loving-patriot-takes-a-stand-in-defense-of-the-national-anthem

https://www.newsmax.com/jameshirsen/levine-nfl-super-bowl/2019/01/22/id/899250/

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gutfeld-on-the-super-bowls-national-anthem-and-gladys-knight

And that's why I don't get defenses from the centrists about this. She's already a Mormon...

Roberta75
01-23-2019, 05:53 PM
And that's why I don't get defenses from the centrists about this. She's already a Mormon...

Exactly midnightman.

TomatoTom123
01-23-2019, 08:32 PM
Oh Gladys :[[

detmotownguy
01-25-2019, 01:28 AM
You betta preach Jerry!!! I agree with this in it's entirety. I'll always love Gladys Knight for the impact her artistry has had on me for my entire lifetime thus far, but I don't respect her and she'll never get another dime from me. She's cooning for a position, and if Fox News is giving her airtime of praise, she can consider it a job well done. I'll await to hear of her "Knight At the White House: Gladys Performs For the President" Fox News special, presented by Sean Hannity, who accompanies Gladys on an emotional rendition of "Dixie". I'm done with her.

All you people who are dissing Gladys Knight are most likely a bunch of hypocrites. The products you buy support child labor, much of the produce you eat is produced from abused workers and the executives of the organizations you work for could careless about equality as the majority of their programs are lip service. Kinda like the Kennedy’s early attitude abt civil rights until they realized there was political value in promoting civil rights. And you have the nerve to go pick the low hanging fruit abt her singing the national anthem.

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 02:00 AM
All you people who are dissing Gladys Knight are most likely a bunch of hypocrites. The products you buy support child labor, much of the produce you eat is produced from abused workers and the executives of the organizations you work for could careless about equality as the majority of their programs are lip service. Kinda like the Kennedy’s early attitude abt civil rights until they realized there was political value in promoting civil rights. And you have the nerve to go pick the low hanging fruit abt her singing the national anthem.This is the most out-of-left-field off post that I've ever read [[and that's saying something). What the hell are you even talking about? You know squat about anybody just like we know nothing [[nor care to know) about you. Some advice for discussing things in a public forum in the future:

1. Find rocks
2. Kick them

marv2
01-25-2019, 02:13 AM
This is the most out-of-left-field off post that I've ever read [[and that's saying something). What the hell are you even talking about? You know squat about anybody just like we know nothing [[nor care to know) about you. Some advice for discussing things in a public forum in the future:

1. Find rocks
2. Kick them

I think what he is saying boils down to simply "those without sin, cast the first stone" [[at least I think that's how it goes).

For me, I understand and support the Colin Kaepernick led protest. I have from the beginning and that will not change. I love Gladys Knight and that will not change. This is life, this is not a game like they play in places like Fox News. They don't give damn about the NFL protest, police brutality, racism or Gladys Knight! They do love to carry out their masters objectives of keeping people divided and fighting while they rank in all of the dough!

midnightman
01-25-2019, 06:27 AM
Now I see why I block some fools in this forum... if y'all wanna be self-hating kneegrows, fine, but spew that BS to Breitbart, not here.

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 10:50 AM
Now I see why I block some fools in this forum... if y'all wanna be self-hating kneegrows, fine, but spew that BS to Breitbart, not here.

I been blocked his/her ass a long time ago and if it hadn't been for Jerry quoting that nonsense, I wouldn't know what the hell was going on. Some folks get real defensive about Black people drawing a line in the sand. Everybody else can do it, but oh Lordy, don't let the nigras say enough is enough. GTFOH.

midnightman
01-25-2019, 11:49 AM
I been blocked his/her ass a long time ago and if it hadn't been for Jerry quoting that nonsense, I wouldn't know what the hell was going on. Some folks get real defensive about Black people drawing a line in the sand. Everybody else can do it, but oh Lordy, don't let the nigras say enough is enough. GTFOH.

And I always noticed it's always US. Imagine if we weren't so divided as a community and actually did come together. There's always gotta be a sell-out screaming that no one cares and we're "wasting our time". Like there weren't sell-outs during the civil rights era telling black activists at the time exactly that! I assume dmg is black anyway. It's bad enough when other races point fingers at us, it's horrible when it's your own people telling you "sit down" because their favorite Motown singer is doing it. I bet if it was Garth Brooks, they wouldn't be saying "shut up". They'd be like "what's wrong with him?" Just because I also think Gladys Knight was the greatest female vocalist Motown produced doesn't mean I'm gonna co-sign what she does because she became famous off of Motown. Hell SHE doesn't even wanna recognize/represent Motown HALF the time!

Roberta75
01-25-2019, 01:22 PM
Now I see why I block some fools in this forum... if y'all wanna be self-hating kneegrows, fine, but spew that BS to Breitbart, not here.

Who the heck is detmotown to tell us what to say or write or think. If it was another ex Motown superstar hed be blasting her along with his BFF.

Roberta75
01-25-2019, 01:27 PM
All you people who are dissing Gladys Knight are most likely a bunch of hypocrites. The products you buy support child labor, much of the produce you eat is produced from abused workers and the executives of the organizations you work for could careless about equality as the majority of their programs are lip service. Kinda like the Kennedy’s early attitude abt civil rights until they realized there was political value in promoting civil rights. And you have the nerve to go pick the low hanging fruit abt her singing the national anthem.

No sir/ma'am we are blasting Gladys knight for criticizing a REAL hero like Colin Kaepernick. Miss Gladys also recorded a right wing known bigots music so instead of telling us what we should be thinking or writing why dont you do a little research on Miss Mormon.

PeaceNHarmony
01-25-2019, 03:04 PM
Shes now the darling of the far right. Shes going to be singing for President Pus*y Grabber real soon. SMH

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gladys-knight-a-freedom-loving-patriot-takes-a-stand-in-defense-of-the-national-anthem

https://www.newsmax.com/jameshirsen/levine-nfl-super-bowl/2019/01/22/id/899250/

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/gutfeld-on-the-super-bowls-national-anthem-and-gladys-knightThat's another major issue with Gladys' decision to sing at the Superbowl. You just KNEW the GOP would adopt her as a poster-child.

midnightman
01-25-2019, 03:48 PM
I notice some folks hating on another Motown legend for not going to the White House for the signing of the Music Modernization Act despite her feverish campaigning but people who were complaining were the ones claiming they were her biggest fans but "disappointed" she didn't show up at the signing...

https://media1.tenor.com/images/8d52944d0e8a53c9299d4661d247b859/tenor.gif?itemid=10041226

Not naming names. Just using her as an example! So for those that go OT, I'll report you. Focus on the Empress of the Mormons lol

Eargasm
01-25-2019, 03:56 PM
A few words on the Super Bowl performance from Gladys Husband...…

Let it be clear Gladys isdoing the National anthem at the Super Bowl. And we are doing it not goingagainst Colin .Kaepernick, he’s protesting two subjects police violence andinjustice in the courts both we stand with. Gladys has walked through morebackdoors performed in the Jim Crow South marched with Martin Luther King andprotested apartheid. She did this so others who came after her could walkthrough the front door after her and others kicked it down. We’re doing the national anthem so that we canget rid of the lie that this is what Collin has been protesting against, alsoto let the country know that our black young men do not come from SOBs but theyare born of queens like Aretha and an empresses like my wife. We have manyblack men heroes that have died for this country and love this country evenwhen his country didn’t love them. So we sing the national anthem for a countrythat we have died and fought for. We are united against any injustice but I’masking you to not let anyone including the president. Take your mind off theprice
Atlanta your daughter is coming home and this timethey’re opening the door for her.
Any questions!?

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 04:16 PM
Sorry, but I'm not buying the "we stand with you but..." excuse. The reason I'm not believing it is because she has a microphone in her face right now and if she "stands" with BLM, she could prove it by voicing a call for change. In fact, she's in prime position to put the city of Atlanta on blast for many problems it's had with the police. But go ahead Gladys, you were saying...

And for the record: I still love Gladys' records and will dance [[and try to sing them) when they come on. But I don't have to respect her as a person who has a political expression that is diametrically opposite of my point of view. As I've stated before, I've lost a family member to police use of deadly force that was neither transparently investigated nor explained in any way that made sense. When I speak on this issue it's because I don't want to lose someone else. It's not "politics" to me.

I'm pretty sure Gladys' point of view would be closer to mine if one of her sons or brothers was shot to death because a cop "couldn't see his hands". As a matter of fact, everybody on that side of the issue would. So I'll listen to her sing but I don't want to hear her speak again. She's said plenty.

ralpht
01-25-2019, 05:05 PM
I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what this conversation is all about. Gladys is singing at the Super Bowl. Be happy for her. She will tear it up. What else do you guys want to complain about?

Eargasm
01-25-2019, 06:19 PM
I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what this conversation is all about. Gladys is singing at the Super Bowl. Be happy for her. She will tear it up. What else do you guys want to complain about?
At Last !.. A voice of common sense !...…. Thank You Ralpht !... I can't wait to see the EMPRESS !..... as you say, she'll tear it up !

StuBass1
01-25-2019, 06:30 PM
Perhaps folks can just sit back and reflect for a moment as has this [[non sellout) great American spokesperson on just what we ALL have to be grateful for and express it for 90 seconds, before a football game roar...https://youtu.be/iIkNsj6cDGc

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 07:10 PM
I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what this conversation is all about. Gladys is singing at the Super Bowl. Be happy for her. She will tear it up. What else do you guys want to complain about?I'll try to break it down for you, Ralph. The Civil Rights movement lay dormant for decades. People were foolish enough to believe that we were somehow moving toward a post-racial society where everybody actually did have a chance to succeed. Some of us didn't need a reminder that this foolish worldview was fallacious. We saw, spoke about and remembered incidents in our community where police abused suspects [[and sometimes, non-suspects) and there was never an accounting for it. Some were promoted to leadership later. That might not be your experience, but it's mine.

Flash forward to the 2000s. The advent of social media gave us a lot of things. Like Soulful Detroit. And Facebook. And Twitter. But the main thing it gave us [[along with people carrying cell phones that could video and snap photos of important events) was a news cycle that updated in real time. That's why I live 400 miles away from NYC but saw Eric Garner's life being choked out for selling loose cigarettes. And I'm 600 miles from Minneapolis but I saw the blood on Philando Castille's chest after he was killed for literally no reason. And Alton Sterling. And Sandra Bland. And dozens more.

This is not and will never be a concern for many, perhaps not even for you. But it has always been a concern for many, especially me. And when Kaepernick took a knee, he was representing people who had finally said "enough" and were glad to see someone take a stance. But the reaction was not to discuss police brutality, it was to call his patriotism and mine into question. What am I to garner from this reaction? Well, not only is America 100% fine with police abuse and corruption, America also was willing to make an example for any black man foolish enough to bring attention to it. That's why the NFL got "that son of a bitch off the field" to quote Donald Trump.

Do you think that makes it even more personal?

I doubt that you've had this discussion with your family and loved ones as you've gathered around the table for holiday dinners but I have. We talk about it frequently because I have nephews and nieces that I worry about. That's why a lot of black people have that other discussion with their kids that white parents would never need to have. The one where we tell them that if the cops stop you for no good reason and call you derogatory names and shout at you or tackle you from behind even before addressing you, you have to treat them with respect that they won't show you. You don't know how hard that is to either talk to your kids about it or to bite your tongue and put it in practice when it happens to you. Been there. Done that.

Gladys Knight knows about this issue. She's acknowledged it. If she was singing at the World Series or NBA Championship or Stanley Cup Finals, nobody would give two shits about it. But she's singing at the Super Bowl. As I said, she didn't make that decision in a vacuum, she did it with full knowledge of the issues surrounding that league and that political statement.

God bless her. And you. I hope you enjoy seeing her next time she comes to town but I won't. And I surely won't be happy for her and won't be rooting for her to tear it up.

Eargasm
01-25-2019, 07:30 PM
Jerry, I appreciate your point of view, although I fail to see how it can be OK to perform [[ as you say) at the World series, Stanley Cup etc... but not OK at the Super Bowl.... are people looking to deep into this performance ?... If the US is too unbearable for you, how about moving to the UK ?... we're far more civilised here anyway !

marv2
01-25-2019, 07:30 PM
Someone asked on another forum I saw today. What about the NFL players? Should the Black players boycott the Super Bowl or just Gladys Knight?

marv2
01-25-2019, 07:34 PM
I remember when Diana Ross sang the National Anthem for the Super Bowl in her hometown:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGAki6VTx1Y

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 07:56 PM
Jerry, I appreciate your point of view, although I fail to see how it can be OK to perform [[ as you say) at the World series, Stanley Cup etc... but not OK at the Super Bowl.... are people looking to deep into this performance ?... If the US is too unbearable for you, how about moving to the UK ?... we're far more civilised here anyway !I wouldn't do it at any public event. But the NFL sought this schism with its handling of the situation. The NBA is more progressive than the other venues so it's hard to see someone griping about it. And the people affected by the issue [[peoples of color, mostly) are a small minority of the fans or participants in MLB or NHL. People wouldn't be happy, but neither of the other leagues is the political hot potato that the NFL is right now. And if it was a practical time to leave, I would do it in a heartbeat. With that said, leaving the fight is not a way to win it.

The saddest part of this mess is that most black Americans don't hate this country. We hate that we're treated like black Americans in it. It's the privileged few [[like Gladys and her husband) who can pretend to relate to the problems and people they left behind.

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 08:05 PM
Someone asked on another forum I saw today. What about the NFL players? Should the Black players boycott the Super Bowl or just Gladys Knight?And that question has nothing to do with the issue at all. The answer it is that they shouldn't have to. The question is whether people should be forced to comply in someone else's idea of what is patriotic? I need nobody to tell me how I need to show respect for anything that refuses to respect me.

With that said, the players have a hell of an opportunity to say something right now. If they organized and made a joint statement, it would shake the world up. But I'm not asking anyone to give up millions, not even Gladys who is doing it for exposure that IMO she does not need.

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:07 PM
And I always noticed it's always US. Imagine if we weren't so divided as a community and actually did come together. There's always gotta be a sell-out screaming that no one cares and we're "wasting our time". Like there weren't sell-outs during the civil rights era telling black activists at the time exactly that! I assume dmg is black anyway. It's bad enough when other races point fingers at us, it's horrible when it's your own people telling you "sit down" because their favorite Motown singer is doing it. I bet if it was Garth Brooks, they wouldn't be saying "shut up". They'd be like "what's wrong with him?" Just because I also think Gladys Knight was the greatest female vocalist Motown produced doesn't mean I'm gonna co-sign what she does because she became famous off of Motown. Hell SHE doesn't even wanna recognize/represent Motown HALF the time!

Yeah, we've always had people in our community who would rather kowtow to the establishment as opposed to fighting it. And their gripe is always with Black people who have something to say rather than having a gripe with the people causing the issue that Black people are talking about. It's been an issue for a long time.

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:12 PM
Who the heck is detmotown to tell us what to say or write or think. If it was another ex Motown superstar hed be blasting her along with his BFF.

I'm grown, so whoever he/she is can't dictate a damn thing to me, and thus can do what Jerry suggested and kick rocks. But you make an interesting point. I wonder how different the responses might be by some if it were a certain other Motown diva. Full disclosure, I even had to ask myself if I would feel any different if it were my favorite Motown diva, and I actually took a bit of time to ponder the answer. Ultimately I concluded that as hurt I would be, even she would have to end up in my "not another dime from me" category. I would lose all respect for her, as I have Gladys. It is what it is.

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:15 PM
A few words on the Super Bowl performance from Gladys Husband...…

Let it be clear Gladys isdoing the National anthem at the Super Bowl. And we are doing it not goingagainst Colin .Kaepernick, he’s protesting two subjects police violence andinjustice in the courts both we stand with. Gladys has walked through morebackdoors performed in the Jim Crow South marched with Martin Luther King andprotested apartheid. She did this so others who came after her could walkthrough the front door after her and others kicked it down. We’re doing the national anthem so that we canget rid of the lie that this is what Collin has been protesting against, alsoto let the country know that our black young men do not come from SOBs but theyare born of queens like Aretha and an empresses like my wife. We have manyblack men heroes that have died for this country and love this country evenwhen his country didn’t love them. So we sing the national anthem for a countrythat we have died and fought for. We are united against any injustice but I’masking you to not let anyone including the president. Take your mind off theprice
Atlanta your daughter is coming home and this timethey’re opening the door for her.
Any questions!?

Nope. Can't clean it up. Gladys has made her bed. Maybe she'll weather the storm with the public. I honestly don't care. She won't weather it with me. Case closed.

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 08:17 PM
And I always noticed it's always US. Imagine if we weren't so divided as a community and actually did come together. There's always gotta be a sell-out screaming that no one cares and we're "wasting our time". Like there weren't sell-outs during the civil rights era telling black activists at the time exactly that! I assume dmg is black anyway. It's bad enough when other races point fingers at us, it's horrible when it's your own people telling you "sit down" because their favorite Motown singer is doing it. I bet if it was Garth Brooks, they wouldn't be saying "shut up". They'd be like "what's wrong with him?" Just because I also think Gladys Knight was the greatest female vocalist Motown produced doesn't mean I'm gonna co-sign what she does because she became famous off of Motown. Hell SHE doesn't even wanna recognize/represent Motown HALF the time!Black America's combined economy would be that of a top 20 country if separated from the rest of the US. If we just determined to use our money [[and our votes) in a unified effort to effect change, we'd have full equality in every aspect of society in 10 years. That would mean not purchasing cars from companies that don't have fair diversity practices or paying to watch movies from studios that don't employ us in executive and creative positions. It would mean everybody voting for the same candidate and eating at the same restaurant and watching the same network, which might sound ridiculous to many. But if we showed that were ubiquitous in something like those, then politicians and businesses would break their necks trying to get a bloc of 16% of the country to favor them.

But as you've said, there's always going to be those "ain't nobody gonna tell me sh*t" people out there who would hold everybody back by doing what they want instead of what we'd need. People don't realize the magnitude of the loss we suffered when they took Dr. King. There's nobody close to being a leader and you can tell.

Eargasm
01-25-2019, 08:23 PM
Absolutely fascinating for me to read some of the responses on here !. you guys could start a argument in a empty room !....

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:25 PM
I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what this conversation is all about. Gladys is singing at the Super Bowl. Be happy for her. She will tear it up. What else do you guys want to complain about?

With all due respect, you're a white man in America. I don't expect you to get it. Not that your whiteness prevents you from understanding. There are millions of white Americans who get it. I just don't expect you to get it as the issues of Africa America do not effect you in a way where I feel like you should get it and then stand in solidarity. The fact that those of us who oppose Gladys' actions and words have been chalked up to complainers who apparently just want to complain for no good reason suggests to me that you do not have a full grasp of this entire conversation [[not the thread, but the issues behind the thread) and again, I don't expect you to. Hopefully our thoughts will cause you to look into the issues a little deeper. I'd rather you understand the whole story and come to your concluded opinion rather than come to your concluded opinion without any knowledge of the issues at the root.

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 08:30 PM
https://abc6onyourside.com/news/entertainment/entertainers-address-social-injustice-issues-at-super-bowl

Here's a great article about it. It might put things in perspective for some of you who wonder what the big deal is but I don't think it will change any minds about Gladys. It did have a tweet from Bernice King that sums up my point of view 100%.

Bernice King [[https://twitter.com/BerniceKing), the daughter of slain civil rights leader Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., declined an interview request but has spoken out on Twitter.

"Imagine #TrayvonMartin having a chance to tell his side of the story," she wrote this week.

"Imagine media searching for a better view on #MikeBrown's behalf. Imagine the Peace Warrior Organization, a group of youth in #Chicago working to stop violence, being invited to the White House this week."

marv2
01-25-2019, 08:35 PM
I wouldn't do it at any public event. But the NFL sought this schism with its handling of the situation. The NBA is more progressive than the other venues so it's hard to see someone griping about it. And the people affected by the issue [[peoples of color, mostly) are a small minority of the fans or participants in MLB or NHL. People wouldn't be happy, but neither of the other leagues is the political hot potato that the NFL is right now. And if it was a practical time to leave, I would do it in a heartbeat. With that said, leaving the fight is not a way to win it.

The saddest part of this mess is that most black Americans don't hate this country. We hate that we're treated like black Americans in it. It's the privileged few [[like Gladys and her husband) who can pretend to relate to the problems and people they left behind.

I don't think Gladys Knight or her husband have left people behind. From 2017:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-4281906/Gladys-Knight-fundraises-build-community-center.html

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:35 PM
Black America's combined economy would be that of a top 20 country if separated from the rest of the US. If we just determined to use our money [[and our votes) in a unified effort to effect change, we'd have full equality in every aspect of society in 10 years. That would mean not purchasing cars from companies that don't have fair diversity practices or paying to watch movies from studios that don't employ us in executive and creative positions. It would mean everybody voting for the same candidate and eating at the same restaurant and watching the same network, which might sound ridiculous to many. But if we showed that were ubiquitous in something like those, then politicians and businesses would break their necks trying to get a bloc of 16% of the country to favor them.

But as you've said, there's always going to be those "ain't nobody gonna tell me sh*t" people out there who would hold everybody back by doing what they want instead of what we'd need. People don't realize the magnitude of the loss we suffered when they took Dr. King. There's nobody close to being a leader and you can tell.

Preachin' again Rev Jerry, I see!!

RanRan79
01-25-2019, 08:39 PM
Absolutely fascinating for me to read some of the responses on here !. you guys could start a argument in a empty room !....

That's an interesting comment, as I seem to recall that the thread had people like myself voicing our opposition and disappointment to the actions of one Gladys Knight, while people like yourself seem to have taken our issue with Gladys Knightvery personal. I'd venture that the more likely suspects of starting arguments in empty rooms would be those commenters such as yourself who have taken to responding to the criticism of others as though that criticism was directed at you. Miss me with that. In fact, I know just how to deal with it...

TomatoTom123
01-25-2019, 09:28 PM
This is for anyone: why do you think Gladys has made this, IMO, bad decision?

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 10:40 PM
That's an interesting comment, as I seem to recall that the thread had people like myself voicing our opposition and disappointment to the actions of one Gladys Knight, while people like yourself seem to have taken our issue with Gladys Knightvery personal. I'd venture that the more likely suspects of starting arguments in empty rooms would be those commenters such as yourself who have taken to responding to the criticism of others as though that criticism was directed at you. Miss me with that. In fact, I know just how to deal with it...Bingo! Most of us have posted about our opinion but there's always going to be some who would rather post about other posters in a derogatory manner. It's like that old saying goes: Great minds talk about ideas. Average minds talk about events. But small minds talk about people.

Jerry Oz
01-25-2019, 10:44 PM
This is for anyone: why do you think Gladys has made this, IMO, bad decision?Not for her. She has a right to do whatever she wants to do. If that's what makes her happy, God bless her over there. But for me, it was an unfortunate decision and I'm sorry to read that one of my icons has a world view that is [[in my opinion) counter-productive toward resolving a 164 year old problem.

midnightman
01-26-2019, 12:17 AM
A few words on the Super Bowl performance from Gladys Husband...…

Let it be clear Gladys isdoing the National anthem at the Super Bowl. And we are doing it not goingagainst Colin .Kaepernick, he’s protesting two subjects police violence andinjustice in the courts both we stand with. Gladys has walked through morebackdoors performed in the Jim Crow South marched with Martin Luther King andprotested apartheid. She did this so others who came after her could walkthrough the front door after her and others kicked it down. We’re doing the national anthem so that we canget rid of the lie that this is what Collin has been protesting against, alsoto let the country know that our black young men do not come from SOBs but theyare born of queens like Aretha and an empresses like my wife. We have manyblack men heroes that have died for this country and love this country evenwhen his country didn’t love them. So we sing the national anthem for a countrythat we have died and fought for. We are united against any injustice but I’masking you to not let anyone including the president. Take your mind off theprice
Atlanta your daughter is coming home and this timethey’re opening the door for her.
Any questions!?

Child... if she didn't wanna go after Colin, why mention his name? Why make it about him? Instead of saying "I'm doing it because I love the NFL" and move on. For her to acknowledge what Colin, Marshawn Lynch [[another one who does his own protest and actually SITS DOWN during the anthem lol) and others are trying to accomplish and to rub it in, so to speak, doesn't sit well with me. Or rather than not say anything, just sit there and eat her food and enjoy the free promotion. For her making it more political than it already is and choosing to be a centrist about it instead of saying "I'm there for you, Mr. Kaepernick" just shows where she is. She USED to be an uplifting black woman and to see her do this is freaking sad. That's just my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

midnightman
01-26-2019, 12:24 AM
Absolutely fascinating for me to read some of the responses on here !. you guys could start a argument in a empty room !....

You take our complaints as "arguments". No, the point is it's not an argument unless you feel so upset that it is personally killing you that we're not showering Gladys Maria Knight with praise all the time. Every legend on here has the right to get criticized for the things they do and, yes, that, includes the "Supreme Diva". I love Marvin Gaye to death but if he had done the same thing in 1968 if he was still living, I'd be criticizing his actions too when he knows good well what has been going on [[and FTR, I doubt he would be happy with Gladys either, he'd be supporting Colin - openly, I might add. I know Janis has!).

But that's what separates Marvin and Stevie from everyone else as far the Motown legends in general, I suppose. They're the two Motown icons who were outspoken about social ills in their music and conversations. Stevie is a open supporter of Colin and his actions. I dare any of you who hate the fact we're criticizing Gladys to say that he's going too far or that he went too far last year [[or the year before last) when he and his son kneeled down in protest of the NFL's policies before a show.

Y'all took it to argue. We weren't arguing, we were simply airing our disappointments in her. But if you wanna claim that some of us are arguing, so be it. I can't speak for everyone else but I meant no harm... and I won't take back what I said. But I wish no ill will towards you. Maybe not clicking on this thread would help? Just a suggestion.

midnightman
01-26-2019, 12:27 AM
Black America's combined economy would be that of a top 20 country if separated from the rest of the US. If we just determined to use our money [[and our votes) in a unified effort to effect change, we'd have full equality in every aspect of society in 10 years. That would mean not purchasing cars from companies that don't have fair diversity practices or paying to watch movies from studios that don't employ us in executive and creative positions. It would mean everybody voting for the same candidate and eating at the same restaurant and watching the same network, which might sound ridiculous to many. But if we showed that were ubiquitous in something like those, then politicians and businesses would break their necks trying to get a bloc of 16% of the country to favor them.

But as you've said, there's always going to be those "ain't nobody gonna tell me sh*t" people out there who would hold everybody back by doing what they want instead of what we'd need. People don't realize the magnitude of the loss we suffered when they took Dr. King. There's nobody close to being a leader and you can tell.

Yep. Ever since 1968, we've been a community without much of a voice and some leave with the false belief that all the advancements King and Malcolm X fought for were all accomplished. Judging from what led to the start of Black Lives Matter, that has proven not to be the case. And yet people are steaming mad about it because "a Motown singer is singing the national anthem, shut up". It's like REALLY?

midnightman
01-26-2019, 12:32 AM
This is for anyone: why do you think Gladys has made this, IMO, bad decision?

Free exposure. She's in the autumn of her years. I don't know, but right after Aretha's death, she has seem to wanna pop up in the public recently. I mean if she wanna keep her name in the public eye [[as opposed to simply performing at venues here and there), why not do it like Patti LaBelle, who has basically spent the last 20 years or so becoming one of the smartest businesswomen and entrepreneurs of her time selling her favorite brands of cakes and pies as well as acting in well promoted TV shows and Broadway plays? How does Gladys get into the headlines? Doing the "any publicity is good publicity" thing. The Aretha funeral is still etched in my mind how badly she handled it to the point when I saw her singing at the funeral, it wasn't her voice I was focused on. And now this.

Least whoever works for Little Richard had the smarts to whisk Richard away when he said hurtful things about the LGBT community in his weak attempt to "save souls to Christ" so people would still remember him as "the Georgia Peach" and not some bitter 86-year-old man.

midnightman
01-26-2019, 12:38 AM
I'm grown, so whoever he/she is can't dictate a damn thing to me, and thus can do what Jerry suggested and kick rocks. But you make an interesting point. I wonder how different the responses might be by some if it were a certain other Motown diva. Full disclosure, I even had to ask myself if I would feel any different if it were my favorite Motown diva, and I actually took a bit of time to ponder the answer. Ultimately I concluded that as hurt I would be, even she would have to end up in my "not another dime from me" category. I would lose all respect for her, as I have Gladys. It is what it is.

I'll just keep it real: if Patti had done it, I wouldn't play her songs again. Same with...that other Motown diva. It would be case closed and I wouldn't venture into that sub-section of the forum because it would hurt me that bad. Because those other two have a deeper effect on me than Gladys ever did. With Gladys, I just roll my eyes and shake my head. Except for Friendship Train, I haven't seen her be outspoken about social ills in her music, yet folks wanna compare her to Aretha, who had far more credentials as an actual civil rights activist than any diva in her time [[with the obvious exception of Mavis Staples, another civil rights activist who won't be caught dead doing this).

jobeterob
01-26-2019, 12:44 AM
This is for anyone: why do you think Gladys has made this, IMO, bad decision?

Money and ego

ralpht
01-26-2019, 08:44 AM
Has everyone had their say here?

RanRan79
01-26-2019, 11:55 AM
This is for anyone: why do you think Gladys has made this, IMO, bad decision?

Publicity. I think potential dollar signs have become more important to Gladys than taking a stand. Maybe it will work out for her.

RanRan79
01-26-2019, 11:58 AM
Child... if she didn't wanna go after Colin, why mention his name? Why make it about him? Instead of saying "I'm doing it because I love the NFL" and move on. For her to acknowledge what Colin, Marshawn Lynch [[another one who does his own protest and actually SITS DOWN during the anthem lol) and others are trying to accomplish and to rub it in, so to speak, doesn't sit well with me. Or rather than not say anything, just sit there and eat her food and enjoy the free promotion. For her making it more political than it already is and choosing to be a centrist about it instead of saying "I'm there for you, Mr. Kaepernick" just shows where she is. She USED to be an uplifting black woman and to see her do this is freaking sad. That's just my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

And that's it. I would've "side eyed" Gladys for doing the song at all, but I could've gotten past it. But when she brought Kaep into it, and the way she did it, that's what had me messed up. And it's also exactly why she's now the darling of the Faux News crowd. She sold us out and for that she will not sell me another musical product.

RanRan79
01-26-2019, 12:04 PM
Has everyone had their say here?

Meaning what exactly Ralph? Will this thread be shut down? And if so, would you allow us a reason for it [[aside from this is your forum and you are certainly entitled to shut down any topic you want just because you can)? This definitely isn't a thread that has gone off the rails like some others in the past, so I'm trying to understand the question.

jobeterob
01-26-2019, 12:56 PM
Gladys got shit all over, here and many places except Fox

Goes with the territory these days; everyone gets crapped on; but she did make choices here

marv2
01-26-2019, 01:27 PM
Has everyone had their say here?

Yes Ralph, thank you.

midnightman
01-26-2019, 01:43 PM
Amanda Seales advises Gladys to perform "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" instead:
https://www.ajc.com/entertainment/actress-comedian-says-she-has-solution-gladys-knight-singing-super-bowl/R2D4qVvALVv2H53bCBQpXL/

Interesting because she sang it with BeBe Winans a few years back:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HweqkrvI6Z0

But that whole "tap dancing" thing is confusing. :confused:

Boogiedown
01-26-2019, 01:46 PM
Gladys got shit all over, here and many places except Fox

Goes with the territory these days; everyone gets crapped on; but she did make choices here


I don't believe Gladys got "sh*t all over" here , except by a few very vocal members who are dominating the thread , making it appear that way.

I suspect most forum members are thrilled that one of Motown's most treasured alumni has been chosen for this honor especially at this point in her career and look forward to hearing her "tear it up" as Ralph says. :cool::cool:

Jerry Oz
01-26-2019, 03:47 PM
Gladys got shit all over, here and many places except Fox

Goes with the territory these days; everyone gets crapped on; but she did make choices hereNo she has not. She is an entertainer and she made a political statement. That's bound to have people agree or disagree with her. Disagreeing with her or questioning her motivations is not crapping on her. In fact, most people who lament her choice stated that they still like her music even if they detest her decision. And if the only outlet that embraced her decision is Fox News, that only validates the opinions of those who oppose her.

Jerry Oz
01-26-2019, 03:51 PM
I don't believe Gladys got "sh*t all over" here , except by a few very vocal members who are dominating the thread , making it appear that way.

I suspect most forum members are thrilled that one of Motown's most treasured alumni has been chosen for this honor especially at this point in her career and look forward to hearing her "tear it up" as Ralph says. :cool::cool:I'm one of the most vocal members on this thread against her decision and I haven't crapped on anyone. If I'm "dominating" it, so be it. But I doubt most forum members are even watching the Super Bowl, let alone waiting with bated breath to hear her sing the anthem. I couldn't care less if she tears it up or chokes in the middle of it, because I won't be watching.

marv2
01-26-2019, 04:06 PM
I'm one of the most vocal members on this thread against her decision and I haven't crapped on anyone. If I'm "dominating" it, so be it. But I doubt most forum members are even watching the Super Bowl, let alone waiting with bated breath to hear her sing the anthem. I couldn't care less if she tears it up or chokes in the middle of it, because I won't be watching.

I think that is the part we play in the protest. Boycott watching the NFL [[and their sponsors). If you don't buy from the sponsors, they cannot continue to produce it for television.

Eargasm
01-26-2019, 04:23 PM
You take our complaints as "arguments". No, the point is it's not an argument unless you feel so upset that it is personally killing you that we're not showering Gladys Maria Knight with praise all the time. Every legend on here has the right to get criticized for the things they do and, yes, that, includes the "Supreme Diva". I love Marvin Gaye to death but if he had done the same thing in 1968 if he was still living, I'd be criticizing his actions too when he knows good well what has been going on [[and FTR, I doubt he would be happy with Gladys either, he'd be supporting Colin - openly, I might add. I know Janis has!).

But that's what separates Marvin and Stevie from everyone else as far the Motown legends in general, I suppose. They're the two Motown icons who were outspoken about social ills in their music and conversations. Stevie is a open supporter of Colin and his actions. I dare any of you who hate the fact we're criticizing Gladys to say that he's going too far or that he went too far last year [[or the year before last) when he and his son kneeled down in protest of the NFL's policies before a show.

Y'all took it to argue. We weren't arguing, we were simply airing our disappointments in her. But if you wanna claim that some of us are arguing, so be it. I can't speak for everyone else but I meant no harm... and I won't take back what I said. But I wish no ill will towards you. Maybe not clicking on this thread would help? Just a suggestion.

Nope, I ain't upset at all, and it's certainly not killing me, my apologies to all for my point of view, I initially joined this site to learn more about the fantastic music that has been released throughout the years, and read the fabulous comments from people far more knowledgeable than me. As for the Super Bowl, nothing anyone says will change my opinion on it, as mine will not change anyone else's...I can't wait to see Gladys perform !... looks like we will have to agree to disagree !...

midnightman
01-26-2019, 08:48 PM
No she has not. She is an entertainer and she made a political statement. That's bound to have people agree or disagree with her. Disagreeing with her or questioning her motivations is not crapping on her. In fact, most people who lament her choice stated that they still like her music even if they detest her decision. And if the only outlet that embraced her decision is Fox News, that only validates the opinions of those who oppose her.

It's funny because Gladys and her husband were trying to make it appear as if their decision was APOLITICAL. But it still became a political statement regardless. She could've made it apolitical by just not saying anything and doing it. *shrug* Making statements sometimes don't help your cause.

Jerry Oz
01-26-2019, 10:32 PM
I think that is the part we play in the protest. Boycott watching the NFL [[and their sponsors). If you don't buy from the sponsors, they cannot continue to produce it for television.Yeah. People [[and sadly, especially black people) don't understand the power of strategically spending their money or casting their votes. There is strength in numbers.

Jerry Oz
01-26-2019, 10:41 PM
It's funny because Gladys and her husband were trying to make it appear as if their decision was APOLITICAL. But it still became a political statement regardless. She could've made it apolitical by just not saying anything and doing it. *shrug* Making statements sometimes don't help your cause.I agree 100%, midnightman. If a statement needs to be made, the words need to be parsed very carefully. Presenting your case as if you're butt hurt that someone would assail your blackness doesn't help. Simply stating "I understand the concerns of those who prefer that I not sing. I am not singing the anthem to make a political statement contrary to that of those calling for social justice and I have and will continue to join all who call for social change and justice reform." would have squashed it for 90% of us. Don't say anything beyond that. Don't react to criticism and don't answer any more questions.

Saying "I did my part already and if you don't like it, you can kiss my ***" [[not what she said, but it's what I heard) is guaranteed to make things worse.

Jerry Oz
01-26-2019, 10:47 PM
Nope, I ain't upset at all, and it's certainly not killing me, my apologies to all for my point of view, I initially joined this site to learn more about the fantastic music that has been released throughout the years, and read the fabulous comments from people far more knowledgeable than me. As for the Super Bowl, nothing anyone says will change my opinion on it, as mine will not change anyone else's...I can't wait to see Gladys perform !... looks like we will have to agree to disagree !...You're entitled to your opinion and should only change it if you feel compelled, not because someone feels differently. Some of us have stated that we lost respect for Gladys but that is not to suggest that you need to. Enjoy the game.

midnightman
01-27-2019, 01:13 AM
I agree 100%, midnightman. If a statement needs to be made, the words need to be parsed very carefully. Presenting your case as if you're butt hurt that someone would assail your blackness doesn't help. Simply stating "I understand the concerns of those who prefer that I not sing. I am not singing the anthem to make a political statement contrary to that of those calling for social justice and I have and will continue to join all who call for social change and justice reform." would have squashed it for 90% of us. Don't say anything beyond that. Don't react to criticism and don't answer any more questions.

Saying "I did my part already and if you don't like it, you can kiss my ***" [[not what she said, but it's what I heard) is guaranteed to make things worse.

Right. That whole "I protested too, big deal" statement was just heartless, man.

Cincinnati_Kid
01-27-2019, 01:56 PM
I'm one of the most vocal members on this thread against her decision and I haven't crapped on anyone. If I'm "dominating" it, so be it. But I doubt most forum members are even watching the Super Bowl, let alone waiting with bated breath to hear her sing the anthem. I couldn't care less if she tears it up or chokes in the middle of it, because I won't be watching.

I agree with most of what you said in your other posts, but disagree that most won't be watching the SB. It will still be that $$ maker for the NFL. The anthem protest controversy, has disappeared, and it's business as usual in this country.

midnightman
01-27-2019, 02:21 PM
I agree with most of what you said in your other posts, but disagree that most won't be watching the SB. It will still be that $$ maker for the NFL. The anthem protest controversy, has disappeared, and it's business as usual in this country.

I think he meant this forum, not America in general, CK.

Jerry Oz
01-27-2019, 03:29 PM
I agree with most of what you said in your other posts, but disagree that most won't be watching the SB. It will still be that $$ maker for the NFL. The anthem protest controversy, has disappeared, and it's business as usual in this country.The Super Bowl will have great ratings like it always does. I just don't take the average Soulful Detroit user to be an NFL fan. Many aren't even from the States. That's who I was referring to.

Cincinnati_Kid
01-28-2019, 02:53 AM
The Super Bowl will have great ratings like it always does. I just don't take the average Soulful Detroit user to be an NFL fan. Many aren't even from the States. That's who I was referring to.


Gotcha, Fair enough...

Bluebrock
01-28-2019, 04:04 AM
The Super Bowl will have great ratings like it always does. I just don't take the average Soulful Detroit user to be an NFL fan. Many aren't even from the States. That's who I was referring to.
It is people such as myself who has no interest whatsoever in The Super Bowl, and who does not live in the States whom i presume you were referring to Jerry, and to that end you were correct my friend. Respect to you.

midnightman
01-28-2019, 09:38 PM
I think that is the part we play in the protest. Boycott watching the NFL [[and their sponsors). If you don't buy from the sponsors, they cannot continue to produce it for television.

Some of us have done that but you have some who can't depart from not watching the NFL because they're so used to their favorite teams. They just don't care... well they probably act like they would because of who is in the SB... but yeah the whole league needs a huge boycott. No one will do it though. We're stuck in our ways.

marv2
01-28-2019, 10:55 PM
Some of us have done that but you have some who can't depart from not watching the NFL because they're so used to their favorite teams. They just don't care... well they probably act like they would because of who is in the SB... but yeah the whole league needs a huge boycott. No one will do it though. We're stuck in our ways.

More importantly is to understand that the NFL does not enact laws or enable police brutality and racial injustice in the greater society. Judges, elected officials, police depts etc should the targets of protest and change.

jobeterob
01-28-2019, 11:20 PM
This is the most publicity Gladys Knight has had in years and I bet you get sales are up for what value that is these days

Not sure what this will do to future bookings though

Jerry Oz
01-29-2019, 12:45 AM
Some of us have done that but you have some who can't depart from not watching the NFL because they're so used to their favorite teams. They just don't care... well they probably act like they would because of who is in the SB... but yeah the whole league needs a huge boycott. No one will do it though. We're stuck in our ways.I was a huge fan [[with two teams, no less). I didn't watch this year [[except for when I was over my Dad's house) and I'm not watching this weekend. I'm not trying to get others to stop but I think it's going to be much easier for me to ignore it next season and beyond.

arr&bee
01-29-2019, 05:28 PM
The thing that scares me is this[legalized gambling]thing,yes i know that games have always been bet on,but since vegas is getting teams,and let's not pretend that we don't know who owns vegas and controls all gambling in this country,i just see a pattern and it's scary..coincidence maybe???-2009[harricain hits n.o.,they get to superbowl..flood hits houston,they win world series,labron goes back to cleveland they over come 3-1 deficit to win nba title,rams go back to l.a. New stadium and superbowl,and let's not forget about the expansion golden knights getting to the nhl finals..oh and if you really wanna go back how bout-superbowl iii-jets-colts,who won that one and where was the nfl at that time?...can anyone say-merger!and i'll bet my dog's butt that in less than three years after the raiders move to vegas they get to the superbowl..stay tuned!!

marv2
01-29-2019, 05:51 PM
The thing that scares me is this[legalized gambling]thing,yes i know that games have always been bet on,but since vegas is getting teams,and let's not pretend that we don't know who owns vegas and controls all gambling in this country,i just see a pattern and it's scary..coincidence maybe???-2009[harricain hits n.o.,they get to superbowl..flood hits houston,they win world series,labron goes back to cleveland they over come 3-1 deficit to win nba title,rams go back to l.a. New stadium and superbowl,and let's not forget about the expansion golden knights getting to the nhl finals..oh and if you really wanna go back how bout-superbowl iii-jets-colts,who won that one and where was the nfl at that time?...can anyone say-merger!and i'll bet my dog's butt that in less than three years after the raiders move to vegas they get to the superbowl..stay tuned!!

Excellent observations JA!, wow!

TheMotownManiac
01-30-2019, 08:59 PM
If Gladys was unaware, or career desperate or had some other overriding reason, maybe it could be overlooked, but, choosing to do this makes me scratch my head. No way would Queen Ree, Ross, Tina, Beyoncé or Patti take this gig, and you can be sure Gladdy wasn’t their first choice. The players are under contract and this is their gig and can make their stand, Gladdy? ANYTHING to get attention. I’m so disappointed in her. None of us are free until we all are, and she’s not helping.

sansradio
01-30-2019, 09:05 PM
As a wag on another site's comment section cracked, "leave it to Gladys to gamble away her legacy."

PeaceNHarmony
01-30-2019, 10:15 PM
As a wag on another site's comment section cracked, "leave it to Gladys to gamble away her legacy."I GASP at the shade while fanning myself with this week's In Touch magazine. Howevs, said wag is not incorrect.

Jerry Oz
01-30-2019, 11:04 PM
As a wag on another site's comment section cracked, "leave it to Gladys to gamble away her legacy."Gladys' legacy is secure. I love her music and always will. Heard "On and On" on the radio twice in the last week and enjoyed hearing them. She gambled away what future she might have had, although she may not care at this point.

jobeterob
01-31-2019, 01:46 AM
Rihanna was one of at least 3 people that said no before they got to Gladys

midnightman
01-31-2019, 02:00 AM
As a wag on another site's comment section cracked, "leave it to Gladys to gamble away her legacy."

I don't know about all of that. Gladys is one of the "lifetime" artists. Doubt she's "gambling" it away but it definitely will have some marks on it. I agree with Jerry basically.

sansradio
01-31-2019, 04:25 AM
I GASP at the shade while fanning myself with this week's In Touch magazine. Howevs, said wag is not incorrect.

You're the only one who caught what I did there. ;D

PeaceNHarmony
01-31-2019, 06:55 AM
You're the only one who caught what I did there. ;D

I bet I am ! :rolleyes:

Roberta75
01-31-2019, 09:35 PM
Gladys' legacy is secure. I love her music and always will. Heard "On and On" on the radio twice in the last week and enjoyed hearing them. She gambled away what future she might have had, although she may not care at this point.

I agree. Maybe she will collaboratte with the racist and homophobic Orin Hatch again. Im sure Faux News will plug there music.

MIKEW-UK
02-01-2019, 09:19 AM
A little Knight music might be timely on the forum right now irrespective of where your own strongly held views may lie........ profound words which deserve very careful listening to.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RGn_VyfaCU

marv2
02-01-2019, 10:26 AM
A little Knight music might be timely on the forum right now irrespective of where your own strongly held views may lie........ profound words which deserve very careful listening to.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RGn_VyfaCU

I bought that CD back in the 90s just for Gladys version of this song. She is the greatest at what she does!

Optimal Saint
02-01-2019, 11:33 PM
Just a side question

Why is the National Anthem played before sporting events anyway?

And whatever the answer is why does it only apply to sporting events?

They don’t play the anthem at movie theaters or concerts or plays

Just sports

I’ve always thought it was odd

marv2
02-02-2019, 12:45 AM
Just a side question

Why is the National Anthem played before sporting events anyway?

And whatever the answer is why does it only apply to sporting events?

They don’t play the anthem at movie theaters or concerts or plays

Just sports

I’ve always thought it was odd

It is my understanding that they began doing that in order to boost recruitment efforts to the military services of the United States. They sing the Canadian National Anthem before sporting events there as well, but I don't think it is done with the same intentions.

jobeterob
02-02-2019, 03:09 AM
There was a fairly lengthy piece on Canadian TV tonight on how difficult it was to find participants for the half time show and national anthem

It concentrated on Maroon 5 and how they were way past their prime

They tried for Rhianna Jay Z and Carlie B or is that Cardie B and were declined by all

They believe the damage wasn’t sufficient to those that said yes to make them able to resist the exposure

midnightman
02-02-2019, 03:24 AM
Just a side question

Why is the National Anthem played before sporting events anyway?

And whatever the answer is why does it only apply to sporting events?

They don’t play the anthem at movie theaters or concerts or plays

Just sports

I’ve always thought it was odd

Army recruits.

milven
02-02-2019, 10:15 AM
Gladys was on THE TODAY SHOW explaining her decision

Gladys Knight says her singing the national anthem at the Super Bowl will bring people together.

NBC's "Today" show reported Friday that Knight wrestled with whether to join a boycott over the NFL's treatment of Colin Kaepernick, the former quarterback who protested racial injustice by kneeling during the national anthem.

Kaepernick attorney Mark Geragos said the performers are "crossing an intellectual picket line; they're saying to themselves, 'I care more about my career than whether what I'm doing is right.'"

Knight said she's been working for civil rights and singing the anthem since she was a little girl.
Knight says everyone has an opinion, "but once we get into that love thing, it all comes together and goes wherever and we end up clapping and having a good time."


https://www.nbcwashington.com/entertainment/entertainment-news/Gladys-Knight-on-why-Shell-sing-National-anthem-at-Super-Bowl-505194971.html

milven
02-02-2019, 10:17 AM
As a wag on another site's comment section cracked, "leave it to Gladys to gamble away her legacy."

I read that people are placing bets on how long it will take for Gladys to sing the anthem in in minutes and seconds.

IMissFlo93
02-02-2019, 11:03 AM
Just a side question

Why is the National Anthem played before sporting events anyway?

And whatever the answer is why does it only apply to sporting events?

They don’t play the anthem at movie theaters or concerts or plays

Just sports

I’ve always thought it was odd

https://www.history.com/news/why-the-star-spangled-banner-is-played-at-sporting-events

milven
02-02-2019, 11:27 AM
Thanks for the link . I learned something

sansradio
02-02-2019, 02:52 PM
I read that people are placing bets on how long it will take for Gladys to sing the anthem in in minutes and seconds.

Yep, folks bet on everything; some are betting on whether she'll have the mic in hand as she walks out to sing or if it'll be handed to her!

marv2
02-02-2019, 03:16 PM
Gladys was on THE TODAY SHOW explaining her decision

Gladys Knight says her singing the national anthem at the Super Bowl will bring people together.

NBC's "Today" show reported Friday that Knight wrestled with whether to join a boycott over the NFL's treatment of Colin Kaepernick, the former quarterback who protested racial injustice by kneeling during the national anthem.

Kaepernick attorney Mark Geragos said the performers are "crossing an intellectual picket line; they're saying to themselves, 'I care more about my career than whether what I'm doing is right.'"

Knight said she's been working for civil rights and singing the anthem since she was a little girl.
Knight says everyone has an opinion, "but once we get into that love thing, it all comes together and goes wherever and we end up clapping and having a good time."


https://www.nbcwashington.com/entertainment/entertainment-news/Gladys-Knight-on-why-Shell-sing-National-anthem-at-Super-Bowl-505194971.html

This is what Gladys and Motown were doing when they played before segregated audiences in the South in the 1960s. Smokey Robinson described situations where the rope dividing the races during their concerts would come down and everyone would end up dancing with everyone else. I don't know if we can come together today like that. There is too much hatred and hard feelings now.

arr&bee
02-02-2019, 07:15 PM
There was time when that racist song wasn't sung at sporting events..maybe they should go back to!!!

midnightman
02-02-2019, 08:54 PM
There was time when that racist song wasn't sung at sporting events..maybe they should go back to!!!

I wonder when that song was first played at sporting events in the first place.

midnightman
02-02-2019, 08:57 PM
I also don't like how some people are still making it like racism is dying because of what happened in Gladys' time 60 years ago. Notice her Motown buddies have not been asked about this? Surprised TMZ didn't find Stevie at an airport and put a camera to his face. They sure had time to find him during the Blurred Lines controversy...

midnightman
02-02-2019, 09:07 PM
Milven, is this what you were talking about earlier?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-super-bowls-best-matchup-is-gladys-knight-vs-the-clock/

marv2
02-02-2019, 09:38 PM
I also don't like how some people are still making it like racism is dying because of what happened in Gladys' time 60 years ago. Notice her Motown buddies have not been asked about this? Surprised TMZ didn't find Stevie at an airport and put a camera to his face. They sure had time to find him during the Blurred Lines controversy...

Most of her Motown buddies have sung the Star Spangled Banner at televised sporting events. Some have sung it at the Super Bowl. What are they going to say "Uh Gladys, well you know I've sung it, even more than once......but you shouldn't"?

jobeterob
02-02-2019, 09:44 PM
https://www.cbc.ca/news/entertainment/superbowl-halftime-debate-backlash-1.5002394

milven
02-02-2019, 09:48 PM
Milven, is this what you were talking about earlier?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-super-bowls-best-matchup-is-gladys-knight-vs-the-clock/

Yes. People are actually laying odds on how long it will take for Gladys to sing the Anthem.

Another interesting wager is on the length of Gladys Knight’s rendition of “The Star-Spangled Banner.” Several offshore books have set the total for the anthem at 1 minute 47 seconds, and the implied odds for both the under and the over were set at one book at -115 — a 53.5 percent implied probability — on both sides.

Roberta75
02-02-2019, 10:45 PM
Most of her Motown buddies have sung the Star Spangled Banner at televised sporting events. Some have sung it at the Super Bowl. What are they going to say "Uh Gladys, well you know I've sung it, even more than once......but you shouldn't"?


The difference is unlike Miss Gladys - NONE of her Motown buddies have criticized a real hero and patriot like Colin Kaepernick.

jobeterob
02-03-2019, 12:00 AM
Plus Rhonda and Tracee are vigorous and outspoken leaders for strong black womenswear and would never said yes; Gladys could have stood up and said no but she chose not to

midnightman
02-03-2019, 12:45 AM
Just gonna leave this here. :)

https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/article_main_image/public/media/stevie-wonder-global-citizen-fest-live-2017-billboard-1548.jpg

And he did it WHILE singing the anthem. THAT'S how you protest lol

Boogiedown
02-03-2019, 12:46 AM
Can you imagine what the reaction would've been fifty years ago from Gladys and her Motown buddies if they had been told that in the year 2019!! there'd be Americans who would openly oppose Gladys singing our national anthem because of the color of her skin.

Roberta75
02-03-2019, 10:02 AM
Just gonna leave this here. :)

https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/article_main_image/public/media/stevie-wonder-global-citizen-fest-live-2017-billboard-1548.jpg

And he did it WHILE singing the anthem. THAT'S how you protest lol

Yes yes yes.

midnightman
02-03-2019, 11:10 AM
Yes. People are actually laying odds on how long it will take for Gladys to sing the Anthem.

Another interesting wager is on the length of Gladys Knight’s rendition of “The Star-Spangled Banner.” Several offshore books have set the total for the anthem at 1 minute 47 seconds, and the implied odds for both the under and the over were set at one book at -115 — a 53.5 percent implied probability — on both sides.

That is really interesting...

milven
02-03-2019, 12:56 PM
That is really interesting...

There are all kinds of bets going on about Gladys and the anthem.

Will she kneel, will she wear a dress or pants, will she have a mike stand, will she omit a word from the anthem, etc?

I'm just hoping that she does not get heckled or booed during the anthem

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/2/3/18208528/super-bowl-53-prop-bets-national-anthem-gladys-knight

midnightman
02-03-2019, 02:43 PM
There are all kinds of bets going on about Gladys and the anthem.

Will she kneel, will she wear a dress or pants, will she have a mike stand, will she omit a word from the anthem, etc?

I'm just hoping that she does not get heckled or booed during the anthem

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/2/3/18208528/super-bowl-53-prop-bets-national-anthem-gladys-knight

I think she'll play it safe.

Jerry Oz
02-03-2019, 06:31 PM
There are all kinds of bets going on about Gladys and the anthem.

Will she kneel, will she wear a dress or pants, will she have a mike stand, will she omit a word from the anthem, etc?

I'm just hoping that she does not get heckled or booed during the anthem

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/2/3/18208528/super-bowl-53-prop-bets-national-anthem-gladys-knightShe's not going to do anything other than sing the song straight and without drama. If she gave a crap, she wouldn't be singing. And nobody will boo her or heckle her. The disrespect in this issue has consistently come from people on the anti-kneeling side of the divide. Folks didn't pay $1,500 for a ticket because they are anti-NFL.

And nobody booed anyone who sang the anthem this season or last. That's not even the point. People who are inclined to boo aren't going to be in attendance.

Jerry Oz
02-03-2019, 06:36 PM
Just gonna leave this here. :)

https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/article_main_image/public/media/stevie-wonder-global-citizen-fest-live-2017-billboard-1548.jpg

And he did it WHILE singing the anthem. THAT'S how you protest lolI'm not sure why "protest" in this sense is analogous with "disrespect". Kaep stopped sitting because a vet convinced him that kneeling is respectful, whereas sitting is not and he didn't want the message to be one of disrespect. People try to conflate the two because they prefer to avoid having a serious conversation on social justice.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKAwPA14Ni4

midnightman
02-03-2019, 06:46 PM
Because people are straight up weird. Some were bothered by Marvin's 1983 interpretation of it:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNydcwDriuU

jboy88
02-03-2019, 07:26 PM
Welp, she nailed it! Didn’t have on any Trump Apparel or anything! Just sang!

jboy88
02-03-2019, 07:31 PM
On a side note, they’re doing their darndest to win back the folks that cancelled the NFL! Dr. King’s youngest daughter did the coin toss.

midnightman
02-03-2019, 08:18 PM
On a side note, they’re doing their darndest to win back the folks that cancelled the NFL! Dr. King’s youngest daughter did the coin toss.

I read that they have had commercials aimed at social issues...

milven
02-04-2019, 01:27 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTuoq6TllaU&feature=player_embedded

edafan
02-04-2019, 11:31 AM
Gladys singing was the only time I had the speakers on during the Super Bowl.


edafan

edafan
02-04-2019, 11:33 AM
Because people are straight up weird. Some were bothered by Marvin's 1983 interpretation of it:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNydcwDriuU

I am now retired from 49 years teaching high school. But I used to play Marvin Gaye's version for my classes.

edafan

marv2
02-04-2019, 12:13 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTuoq6TllaU&feature=player_embedded

She sounded and looked great!

nysister
02-04-2019, 02:19 PM
I certainly agree!

ralpht
02-04-2019, 04:28 PM
This was a very thought provoking thread.Although I come down on the side of "let her sing,, she's an artist" I found the entire conversation interesting, both sides being respectful of each other, Well done guys.

midnightman
02-04-2019, 05:26 PM
Lowest Super Bowl ratings in 10 years.

https://deadline.com/2019/02/super-bowl-ratings-patriots-rams-marron-5-worlds-best-cbs-1202548893/amp/

midnightman
02-04-2019, 05:27 PM
This was a very thought provoking thread.Although I come down on the side of "let her sing,, she's an artist" I found the entire conversation interesting, both sides being respectful of each other, Well done guys.

Thanks, Ralph.

Boogiedown
02-04-2019, 05:37 PM
There's a consorted effort to generate interest with various story lines each year around the Superbowl. It's a shame one of those angles has become who would/shouldn't sing the national anthem . I'm glad it fizzled into nothing. I think there was a realization that you weren't going to win going after a legend like GLADYS KNIGHT. She was the perfect choice. She presented herself grandly and she represented well all that is good about being an American.

Jerry Oz
02-04-2019, 08:25 PM
Although I'm not "going after Gladys Knight", I'm no longer interested in her as a celebrity or American. As stated before, I'll still enjoy the music that I've enjoyed for decades but I won't click on any headlines about her or wish her good luck in her endeavors. And if she comes out with a new record, no way that I'm buying it.

And yeah, I agree that this has been a respectful thread, which is what can happen when we focus on the subject and not make personal attacks against those who disagree with us.

Roberta75
02-04-2019, 09:06 PM
Although I'm not "going after Gladys Knight", I'm no longer interested in her as a celebrity or American. As stated before, I'll still enjoy the music that I've enjoyed for decades but I won't click on any headlines about her or wish her good luck in her endeavors. And if she comes out with a new record, no way that I'm buying it.

And yeah, I agree that this has been a respectful thread, which is what can happen when we focus on the subject and not make personal attacks against those who disagree with us.

I couldnt agree with you more Jerry Oz.

jobeterob
02-04-2019, 10:09 PM
I noticed Maroon 5 took the biggest beating but their sales are way up into the Top 10

Gladys attracted less notoriety and she got a bump in sales as well, although lesser than Maroon 5

midnightman
02-04-2019, 11:29 PM
I noticed Maroon 5 took the biggest beating but their sales are way up into the Top 10

Gladys attracted less notoriety and she got a bump in sales as well, although lesser than Maroon 5

Any publicity is good publicity, I guess.