Motown at 60

[johnny_raven]

At least it won't go totally unnoticed ...

14895

[johnjeb]

johnny_raven, you beat me to it. I was just reading my issue when I thought I would post a link.

Smokey:
https://www.aarp.org/entertainment/music/info-2018/smokey-robinson-motown-interview.html

The Andantes:
https://www.aarp.org/entertainment/music/info-2018/motown-girl-group-the-andantes.html?intcmp=AE-ENT-MUS-EOA1

...and at the end of each article are links to other articles and interviews [[Mary, Martha and Duke)

AARP monthly magazine always has interesting entertainment articles - well worth the $16 annual donation.

[Fourtopsbiggestfan]

We'll probably not get anything. No DVDs, or special CDs. We don't need the same old songs repacked. We need a book of unseen and rare photos.

[bradsupremes]

We'll get that Motown documentary sometime next year. And at least Motown Unreleased 1969 in December, but as for anything else...I'm not betting on it. Universal blew Motown 50. If they were smart they would have releases ready to go, but I'm afraid Universal has their priorities in other areas.

[arr&bee]

Aarp..yikes are we that old,hehehehehehe!!!

[marv2]

Aarp..yikes are we that old,hehehehehehe!!!

Yup! LOL! hehehehehehehe,.........!

[masterblaster]

I'll be celebrating 60 years of Motown by attending the opening night of Motown The Musical when it hits Manchester here in the UK in February.

[TomatoTom123]

I'll be celebrating 60 years of Motown by attending the opening night of Motown The Musical when it hits Manchester here in the UK in February.

How great! Enjoy masterblaster! :D

[snakepit]

With interviews like Smokey's, it's very frustrating . I suppose he wants an easy ride with these questions, but wouldn't it be nice to have some 'real' Motown followers interview him and get some in depth answers about the history, artists, recording, anecdotes etc.
Maybe he had forgotten the kind of detail us anaroks want?

[bradsupremes]

With interviews like Smokey's, it's very frustrating . I suppose he wants an easy ride with these questions, but wouldn't it be nice to have some 'real' Motown followers interview him and get some in depth answers about the history, artists, recording, anecdotes etc.
Maybe he had forgotten the kind of detail us anaroks want?

Diana is the same way. You could ask her something about the difficulty of constantly recording and touring at a young age and her answer would be "Well, it was hard, but we had the love and support of our family and that's why I support my children in all they do. It's important to support your children." They answer your question without answering it. I don't want to hear about your children or "the good times." I want to know how you were able to belt out new songs you just learned 20 minutes prior in a recording studio at 3am after coming back from a tour and getting ready to go out again at 10am the next morning.

I wish interviewers would ask about the actual recording process. Questions for Smokey such as "was it easier to write a song by yourself or with other people?" or "did you ever record a song that you thought was brilliant only to play it back and think it was awful?"

[snakepit]

Yes that's the kind of thing...
Linds Griner??
Carolyn Crawford?
Did you pick your own session men?
Favourite arranger?
Do you listen to the unissued stuff from recent CDs?
A&R sessions etc
Smokey et al trot out all the same bland answers and often the 'legend' trumps the truth...and these young reporters don't have the depth of knowledge to do anything different.

[marv2]

With interviews like Smokey's, it's very frustrating . I suppose he wants an easy ride with these questions, but wouldn't it be nice to have some 'real' Motown followers interview him and get some in depth answers about the history, artists, recording, anecdotes etc.
Maybe he had forgotten the kind of detail us anaroks want?

Uh, uh. He has not forgotten. He just stays on code and not get into the real nitty gritty, down and dirty things that went on. He is great at good Motown PR. LOL!

[marv2]

Diana is the same way. You could ask her something about the difficulty of constantly recording and touring at a young age and her answer would be "Well, it was hard, but we had the love and support of our family and that's why I support my children in all they do. It's important to support your children." They answer your question without answering it. I don't want to hear about your children or "the good times." I want to know how you were able to belt out new songs you just learned 20 minutes prior in a recording studio at 3am after coming back from a tour and getting ready to go out again at 10am the next morning.

I wish interviewers would ask about the actual recording process. Questions for Smokey such as "was it easier to write a song by yourself or with other people?" or "did you ever record a song that you thought was brilliant only to play it back and think it was awful?"

She is just not too heavy to begin with. She is also staying on code and committed to divulging as little as possible. Did you ever read her book, "Secrets of A Sparrow"? 299 pages of absolutely nothing!

[snakepit]

LOL at Berry's wish to make 'music for the world'...yeah right.
He was issuing anything and everything in a bid to get hit records...r&b, rock'n'roll, comedy , surf , blues. Nothing wrong with that...love the real story myself. But the misty eyed version is cute is it not.

[snakepit]

I'd love to hear Smokey's or Berry's take on just how close Motown [[ Tamla actually) came to almost crashing down before they saw an improvement in their hard work.
I wondered that because I've been plaving TCMS 1959..first couple of cds.
I had not noticed before, but after the first 2 45s were leased.to UA, it was a fair few months before they were issuing any more records.
The recent Marv Johnson thread tells us that Berry was getting moderate hits at UA on him. Also I assume that ad MJ's manager, Berry/Tamla were making money on public appearances of MJ.
Also, the purchase and conversion of Hitsville must have taken up a lot of time.
But Tamla wasn't cranking out lots of hit 45s in the first year.
Was it touch ang go, or were Tamla and Berry making a good return?

[marv2]

LOL at Berry's wish to make 'music for the world'...yeah right.
He was issuing anything and everything in a bid to get hit records...r&b, rock'n'roll, comedy , surf , blues. Nothing wrong with that...love the real story myself. But the misty eyed version is cute is it not.

Berry use to gamble.....so I hear [[hehehehehehe!). That can get expensive. They had to throw a lot against the wall to get hits in the beginning to cover expenses, etc. You ever noticed that once a record became a hit that they would wear that formula before looking for something new?

[marv2]

I'd love to hear Smokey's or Berry's take on just how close Motown [[ Tamla actually) came to almost crashing down before they saw an improvement in their hard work.
I wondered that because I've been plaving TCMS 1959..first couple of cds.
I had not noticed before, but after the first 2 45s were leased.to UA, it was a fair few months before they were issuing any more records.
The recent Marv Johnson thread tells us that Berry was getting moderate hits at UA on him. Also I assume that ad MJ's manager, Berry/Tamla were making money on public appearances of MJ.
Also, the purchase and conversion of Hitsville must have taken up a lot of time.
But Tamla wasn't cranking out lots of hit 45s in the first year.
Was it touch ang go, or were Tamla and Berry making a good return?

It was touch and go.

[snakepit]

Yes I tend to think it was...that's why it would be good to hear the story from Smokey.
Is there no Magazine capable of sending a ' historian' to record all this during the 60th? There are not many Motown staff left from the formation days.

[marv2]

Yes I tend to think it was...that's why it would be good to hear the story from Smokey.
Is there no Magazine capable of sending a ' historian' to record all this during the 60th? There are not many Motown staff left from the formation days.

If you want to hear Smokey's "story".....all of it, your best bet is to talk to Claudette. She will only go so far as well. Magazines and the media in general in America tend to ignore historical achievements, stories etc. and stick more to current events. Specialty magazines like the Smithsonian and channel [[cable TV) are more incline to do something on Motown, but it would only be the same, safe information we've heard a million times!

[marv2]

The people that would have told more details of the Motown story are now gone. People like Raynoma Liles- Gordy, Gladys Horton, Florence Ballard, Marv Johnson, Bobby Taylor etc,etc.

[johnjeb]

Yes I tend to think it was...that's why it would be good to hear the story from Smokey.
Is there no Magazine capable of sending a ' historian' to record all this during the 60th? There are not many Motown staff left from the formation days.

Most mainstream periodicals usually do superficial interviews. I get AARP every month and I usually just scan most articles.

I think Goldmine Magazine, which caters to collectors, does more in depth interviews of the type we may want. I remember reading the article about Jimmy Webb where he mentioned his song on The Supremes Christmas Album and also his comments about The Supremes' Jimmy Webb album.

Maybe Goldmine has plans for Motown 60. Or maybe they can be encouraged to do something. Hopefully the right interviewer can get Smokey or someone to talk about the music and try not to pry about the personalities. However, I bet a lot of details are just lost in the countless memories.

[arr&bee]

And speaking of smokey,how's the movie coming along? And i hope it's gonna be more indept then the temps movie was.

[midnightman]

One of them, I don't know if it was Berry or Smokey or whoever, but they brought out the REAL reason Berry created Motown: to stop getting ripped off from Jackie Wilson's manager for writing his hits. In other words, he wanted MONEY, baby!

It's a nice PR sentiment to say they wanted to make music for everybody but EARLY Motown was just like any other independent black label at the time: R&B and doo-wop aimed at teens and adults [[mainly BLACK). That's why when Marvin Gaye signed in 1961, he decided he didn't wanna just sing for the black audience, he wanted the crossover success and Motown was not that sophisticated of a label yet to fool around with pop standards. But the very early hits of Motown, from your Marv Johnsons to your Miracles to your Mabel Johns, were aimed at the R&B market. Wasn't until the Marvelettes and Mary Wells' crossover success in 1961-62 that they started to change direction. Mary Wells' first hits were strictly R&B though as was Marvin's first group of hits once he decided to record R&B. But it really wasn't until the Supremes that Motown decided to cross over for good.

Motown has such a rich history that's being avoided and it sucks that most of Motown's early founding fathers and mothers are dead. I mean, can you imagine if Marvin was alive today, he blew off that PR nonsense about what Berry's intention was.

I can imagine:

*2009 interview with a still bearded [[but gray-ish) 70-year-old Marvin*


Interviewer: Smokey has said that when Motown started, Berry wanted to make music for everyone, do you think that's true?

Marvin: [[laughing heartily) Oh man... I'm sorry, I'm laughing because, I love Smokey and Berry to death, but that wasn't the reason. Berry told me he started Motown so he could become a millionaire. [[laughing heartily)

He wrote all those hits for Jackie and didn't see a dime! He was broke writing all those hits, I mean, can you blame him?

So he figured "if I can start my own label, I can get all the money and the publishing and I won't have to starve no more".

Also, Motown was just a black label when it started. Its intention was to become a black label. None of that crossover sh*t. I was the artist that wanted to do the pop crossover. I feel had I not been dating Anna, he wouldn't have let me do it. Being the prince had its advantages. [[chuckling)

Went and put out the first album, a pop album, it only sold 5 copies, I think. So once I saw what Mary was doing, what the Marvelettes were doing and what Smokey and them were doing, I said "I need to get on the ball" and that's what I did, and that's how I came up with "Stubborn Kind of Fellow". That's the honest to God truth.

----

I mean I can see him explaining it much better than Smokey.

That's what I would imagine Marvin would say because that was the truth.

Besides Marv and Barrett, there were only three "star" acts of Motown by 1962, all with M's [[Marvelettes, Mary, Miracles) and Marvin finally added to their hit roster as the fourth "M". But Motown was not the pop crossover label when it started. Took years before that happened and it did with y'all-know-who.

[marv2]

One of them, I don't know if it was Berry or Smokey or whoever, but they brought out the REAL reason Berry created Motown: to stop getting ripped off from Jackie Wilson's manager for writing his hits. In other words, he wanted MONEY, baby!

It's a nice PR sentiment to say they wanted to make music for everybody but EARLY Motown was just like any other independent black label at the time: R&B and doo-wop aimed at teens and adults [[mainly BLACK). That's why when Marvin Gaye signed in 1961, he decided he didn't wanna just sing for the black audience, he wanted the crossover success and Motown was not that sophisticated of a label yet to fool around with pop standards. But the very early hits of Motown, from your Marv Johnsons to your Miracles to your Mabel Johns, were aimed at the R&B market. Wasn't until the Marvelettes and Mary Wells' crossover success in 1961-62 that they started to change direction. Mary Wells' first hits were strictly R&B though as was Marvin's first group of hits once he decided to record R&B. But it really wasn't until the Supremes that Motown decided to cross over for good.

Motown has such a rich history that's being avoided and it sucks that most of Motown's early founding fathers and mothers are dead. I mean, can you imagine if Marvin was alive today, he blew off that PR nonsense about what Berry's intention was.

I can imagine:

*2009 interview with a still bearded [[but gray-ish) 70-year-old Marvin*


Interviewer: Smokey has said that when Motown started, Berry wanted to make music for everyone, do you think that's true?

Marvin: [[laughing heartily) Oh man... I'm sorry, I'm laughing because, I love Smokey and Berry to death, but that wasn't the reason. Berry told me he started Motown so he could become a millionaire. [[laughing heartily)

He wrote all those hits for Jackie and didn't see a dime! He was broke writing all those hits, I mean, can you blame him?

So he figured "if I can start my own label, I can get all the money and the publishing and I won't have to starve no more".

Also, Motown was just a black label when it started. Its intention was to become a black label. None of that crossover sh*t. I was the artist that wanted to do the pop crossover. I feel had I not been dating Anna, he wouldn't have let me do it. Being the prince had its advantages. [[chuckling)

Went and put out the first album, a pop album, it only sold 5 copies, I think. So once I saw what Mary was doing, what the Marvelettes were doing and what Smokey and them were doing, I said "I need to get on the ball" and that's what I did, and that's how I came up with "Stubborn Kind of Fellow". That's the honest to God truth.

----

I mean I can see him explaining it much better than Smokey.

That's what I would imagine Marvin would say because that was the truth.

Besides Marv and Barrett, there were only three "star" acts of Motown by 1962, all with M's [[Marvelettes, Mary, Miracles) and Marvin finally added to their hit roster as the fourth "M". But Motown was not the pop crossover label when it started. Took years before that happened and it did with y'all-know-who.

All true and valid points. It is a shame that some choose to believe "Motown the Musical's" version of things. LOL!!!!