New Ways But Love Stays review - the Diana Ross Project

[sup_fan]

https://dianarossproject.wordpress.com/2017/06/16/new-ways-but-love-stays-1970/

great that they're adding in the 70s Sups albums. I realize they don't have anything to do with Diana except it's the group she left. but appreciate the info

Overall a pretty accurate review. Of course opinions can differ. I think the lp is a bit stronger than their score. It's a heavily produced set - there's a LOT going on in almost every song. But I think it's a very strong set that really gives the girls a chance to shine as a group.

Together, Stone and Time - I agree with their assessments that these are amazing tracks. All 3

Bridge - this one almost boarders on over production, IMO. But the girls sing beautifully and great hearing Cindy

Mirror - I think this is, while not the most impressive song on the album, still a good showing. But I pretty much agree with their assessment

Come Together - here I disagree with them. I like the highly unusual approach and think it's what helps set it apart. yes Diana does a typical "soul" version on Everything. Therefore I like the girls going for it and throwing caution to the wind. As for jean's singing being difficult to understand, the lyrics to this song already as weird as F lol. so it's not like there's ever a clear story with it anyway

Is There - nice smooth ballad

Na Na - this is my 1 major fault with the album. from a style and content perspective, this track just doesn't fit, IMO. Just seems like a random track added. If we had to have a cover, I think Mind Body and Soul would, at least thematically, fit with the lp. Life Beats would have been another good choice [[but that's not a Frank Wilson production). to me, the album was going through a beautiful series of intelligent, artistic songs often with the theme of love and humanity at their core. and then this. The girls sing fine on it. I just think it would have worked better on Right On than here

Shine - agree it's not as strong as Stoned but I like a lot and the vocals are strong. I think it's stronger than their assessment

Thank Him - love this track and an excellent closer. I think they should have added this to their shows when they did their O Happy Day/revival ending.

all in all, a fun and interesting review. I think i'd rate the lp a bit stronger

[PeaceNHarmony]

The DRP is a great source of information and bravo to it's creator for including post-Diana Supremes LPs. I think he does a great, great job. Personally I'd assign a 4 or 4.5 to the LP; some of the covers just suck and drag down the album; ANY of the unreleased original material would have been better. As for the low chart success of the LP, everyone and their mother has offered opinions that I agree with, but I'd also have to add that at the point in time the LP released the record buying public wasn't really looking for cover versions of 'Come Together' and 'Na Na ' - but great work by Frank Wilson and the three ladies.

[Bluebrock]

https://dianarossproject.wordpress.com/2017/06/16/new-ways-but-love-stays-1970/

great that they're adding in the 70s Sups albums. I realize they don't have anything to do with Diana except it's the group she left. but appreciate the info

Overall a pretty accurate review. Of course opinions can differ. I think the lp is a bit stronger than their score. It's a heavily produced set - there's a LOT going on in almost every song. But I think it's a very strong set that really gives the girls a chance to shine as a group.

Together, Stone and Time - I agree with their assessments that these are amazing tracks. All 3

Bridge - this one almost boarders on over production, IMO. But the girls sing beautifully and great hearing Cindy

Mirror - I think this is, while not the most impressive song on the album, still a good showing. But I pretty much agree with their assessment

Come Together - here I disagree with them. I like the highly unusual approach and think it's what helps set it apart. yes Diana does a typical "soul" version on Everything. Therefore I like the girls going for it and throwing caution to the wind. As for jean's singing being difficult to understand, the lyrics to this song already as weird as F lol. so it's not like there's ever a clear story with it anyway

Is There - nice smooth ballad

Na Na - this is my 1 major fault with the album. from a style and content perspective, this track just doesn't fit, IMO. Just seems like a random track added. If we had to have a cover, I think Mind Body and Soul would, at least thematically, fit with the lp. Life Beats would have been another good choice [[but that's not a Frank Wilson production). to me, the album was going through a beautiful series of intelligent, artistic songs often with the theme of love and humanity at their core. and then this. The girls sing fine on it. I just think it would have worked better on Right On than here

Shine - agree it's not as strong as Stoned but I like a lot and the vocals are strong. I think it's stronger than their assessment

Thank Him - love this track and an excellent closer. I think they should have added this to their shows when they did their O Happy Day/revival ending.

all in all, a fun and interesting review. I think i'd rate the lp a bit stronger
I think it was a good album rather than a great one. I would have dispensed with "na na" and "come together" which were quite frankly poorly done, but those songs apart it was a thoroughly decent effort and should have charted better. I would give it 3.5 out of 5.

[Ozmo]

'New Ways But Love Stays' remains one of my all time favourite albums by any grouping of the Supremes. It still sounds to me like a cohesive album rather than a collection of songs as so many of their albums did and at the time represented a progression in their sound.

I liked the cover versions of 'Bridge', 'Na Na Na' and 'Come Together'. The latter blues/rock/soul version by the Supremes being much preferable than Diana Ross' version which to my ears sounded too much like a Las Vegas production number.

I thought that with this album The Supremes under the expert guidance of Frank Wilson went a long way to stepping out of the shadow of Diana Ross.

[daviddh]

i would have preferred more original material and done away with the covers. good album with some good vocals and tracks. I would have released as a single Time To Break Down or Shine On Me as a single
I heard there are out takes from this album.
anyone have any info on these out takes, Still Water Love would have fit this album

[dianarossproject]

Thanks for the kind words -- appreciate people reading the website and leaving comments! -Paul

[dianarossproject]

Thanks for sharing my review -- glad you enjoyed! Perhaps I was a little hard on the LP at times, but I wish there would have been more original material, particularly with so much strong, original material on RIGHT ON and TOUCH. -Paul

[rod_rick]

i would have preferred more original material and done away with the covers. good album with some good vocals and tracks. I would have released as a single Time To Break Down or Shine On Me as a single
I heard there are out takes from this album.
anyone have any info on these out takes, Still Water Love would have fit this album

Am I missing something, There were only 3 covers may 4 if you consider Together We Can Make Such Sweet Music. The only cover I didn't care for was Come Together.

[marv2]

Am I missing something, There were only 3 covers may 4 if you consider Together We Can Make Such Sweet Music. The only cover I didn't care for was Come Together.

I thought it was a great album, covers and all. Great Christmas gift in 1970 for me.

[marv2]

I just heard the long version of "Stoned Love" on the radio about an hour ago.

[daviddh]

Yeah I wasn't crazy about Come Together. Wasn't May His Live Shine recorded for this

[daviddh]

I just looked up May His Love Shine was recorded june 1971

[RanRan79]

Hated "Bridge" and "Come Together", but the rest of the album is great. My favs are "I Wish I Were Your Mirror" and "Is There a Place". I would still rank this album behind Touch and Floy Joy [[my two favorites) and Right On.

[jobeterob]

Back when it was released, I preferred this album to Right On. But over time, it clearly is inferior to Right On and Touch. It is more in the league of Floy Joy and I think they both suffer from over production. It's Time to Break Down and Bridge really could have any singer or singers in those songs - the emphasis is on the production. The best songs, to me, are I Wish I Were Your Mirror and Is There A Place. I think they should have emphasized Stoned Love more - in some fashion. I always wish we could have the sound from the "45" of Stoned Love - because it sure isn't what is on the album.

[PeaceNHarmony]

Back when it was released, I preferred this album to Right On. But over time, it clearly is inferior to Right On and Touch. It is more in the league of Floy Joy and I think they both suffer from over production. It's Time to Break Down and Bridge really could have any singer or singers in those songs - the emphasis is on the production. The best songs, to me, are I Wish I Were Your Mirror and Is There A Place. I think they should have emphasized Stoned Love more - in some fashion. I always wish we could have the sound from the "45" of Stoned Love - because it sure isn't what is on the album.
Interesting take, and now that you mention it I agree that I would have preferred more of the sparkle of 'SL'. That said many love this version of BOTW [[which, to me, is beautifully sung but boring, Aretha NAILED it as a cover version).

[RanRan79]

Back when it was released, I preferred this album to Right On. But over time, it clearly is inferior to Right On and Touch. It is more in the league of Floy Joy and I think they both suffer from over production. It's Time to Break Down and Bridge really could have any singer or singers in those songs - the emphasis is on the production. The best songs, to me, are I Wish I Were Your Mirror and Is There A Place. I think they should have emphasized Stoned Love more - in some fashion. I always wish we could have the sound from the "45" of Stoned Love - because it sure isn't what is on the album.

Other than the 45 itself, where can the 45 version be found? What sets it apart from the album version, other than, I'm sure, the album version is longer.

[RanRan79]

Interesting take, and now that you mention it I agree that I would have preferred more of the sparkle of 'SL'. That said many love this version of BOTW [[which, to me, is beautifully sung but boring, Aretha NAILED it as a cover version).

Really? People love their version of "Bridge"? You hit the nail on the head with "boring". That's exactly how I feel about it. And that damn foghorn is annoying as hell. The Queen killed her cover of the song, proving once again why she's the Queen.

[jobeterob]

Other than the 45 itself, where can the 45 version be found? What sets it apart from the album version, other than, I'm sure, the album version is longer.

As far as I know, nowhere.

Soundwise, it's much denser; of course, the beginning of the album version was edited out so it starts with Jean singing or saying "Stoned Love"; it sounds like it was recorded in a small room or a bit of an echo chamber; that's my version of what I hear; much prefer it.

[bradsupremes]

I always felt "New Ways" had the potential to be a great concept album if a little more work was put into it.

1.) The album title: Stone Love should have been the title. New Ways But Love Stays was more appropriate title for their first album with Jean. Not sure how the New Ways title reflects the album.

2.) Album cover: It's awful. The pink in contrast with serious and fun photos and the 70's font makes it pretty jarring. It looks like it was thrown together rather than any work on it. As Mary had said, a simple photo of them in their afros and black turtlenecks would have been much better.

3.) Tracklist: A few songs just don't gel with the other tracks. I would have kept off "Come Together," "Is There A Place," and "Na Na Kiss Him Goodbye." "Bridge Over Troubled Water" is overproduced but it's content flows with the other tracks. I would have held over "The Loving Country" for this album. It would have fit nicely with the concept.

If Motown put a little more effort in this album and released "Together We Can Make Such Sweet Music" as a second single, the album would have sold much better and probably would have charted higher on Billboard.

[johnny_raven]

Brad:

I agree with everything except ... the 2nd single should have been "It's Time To Break Down."

Regardless, there SHOULD have been a 2nd single period!

[jobeterob]

Brad:

I agree with everything except ... the 2nd single should have been "It's Time To Break Down."

Regardless, there SHOULD have been a 2nd single period!

I used to think that too - I waited for it to be the second release.

Now I'm just not sure it would have got a lot of airplay and think maybe Motown knew more than we sometimes think.

Also, some of the Motown decisions may already have been influenced by internal problems in the group by this time - problems we weren't aware of.

[reese]

I like the whole NEW WAYS... album, but my faves are STONED LOVE, ITS TIME TO BREAK DOWN, SHINE ON ME, NA NA HEY HEY KISS HIM GOODBYE and my absolute favorite, I WISH I WERE YOUR MIRROR.

I was a kid when I bought it, so marketing strategies meant nothing to me. The title, color scheme, or photos in stage attire didn't concern me at all. As long as it was by the Supremes, it was enough.

[daviddh]

agreed,..Brad. there should have beena single single. my vote Its Time To Break Down

[RanRan79]

As far as I know, nowhere.

Soundwise, it's much denser; of course, the beginning of the album version was edited out so it starts with Jean singing or saying "Stoned Love"; it sounds like it was recorded in a small room or a bit of an echo chamber; that's my version of what I hear; much prefer it.

Thanks Jobeterob. I wonder if the 45 version is on Greatest Hits and Rare Classics. That was my first in depth introduction to the 70s Supremes [[on a cassette no less) and I remember LOVING "Stoned Love" and "Touch". When I made a full transition to cds I found that I didn't love some of the songs as much as I once did, that they somehow sounded different. A few months back someone on SD commented that the version of "Touch" on GH&RC is a mix that isn't found anywhere else, which might explain my initial love of the song and then why it seemed to lose me a bit on various cd versions. I wonder now if that's the case with "Stoned Love". I keep saying I'm going to pull that old cassette out and give it a listen but I haven't done it yet.

[RanRan79]

I always felt "New Ways" had the potential to be a great concept album if a little more work was put into it.

1.) The album title: Stone Love should have been the title. New Ways But Love Stays was more appropriate title for their first album with Jean. Not sure how the New Ways title reflects the album.

2.) Album cover: It's awful. The pink in contrast with serious and fun photos and the 70's font makes it pretty jarring. It looks like it was thrown together rather than any work on it. As Mary had said, a simple photo of them in their afros and black turtlenecks would have been much better.

3.) Tracklist: A few songs just don't gel with the other tracks. I would have kept off "Come Together," "Is There A Place," and "Na Na Kiss Him Goodbye." "Bridge Over Troubled Water" is overproduced but it's content flows with the other tracks. I would have held over "The Loving Country" for this album. It would have fit nicely with the concept.

If Motown put a little more effort in this album and released "Together We Can Make Such Sweet Music" as a second single, the album would have sold much better and probably would have charted higher on Billboard.

I agree with almost everything Brad, except I would have kept "Is There a Place". I like "Kiss Him Goodbye", but I can understand kicking it off. The cover is awful, second only to the crap they threw on the front of the Jimmy Webb album. "Together" is a great song, but I don't think it would have ever gotten people to rush out and get it. "It's Time To Break Down" was the missed opportunity.

[Bluebrock]

Brad:

I agree with everything except ... the 2nd single should have been "It's Time To Break Down."

Regardless, there SHOULD have been a 2nd single period!
Totally agree. I have said this many times.

[marv2]

"It's Time To Break Down" was one of the best songs on the album. It was ahead of it's time. It was sexy, perhaps too sexy for American radio at the time. It was deep Soul and R&B. Not at all like the light bubblegum Pop songs the Supremes had been known for in the Sixties. It would have been well received if it had been given a chance. It would have scored big time later into the Seventies and even the Eighties as it fit the "Quiet Storm" radio format like a glove.....

[Bluebrock]

Totally agree. I have said this many times.
And didn't they perform at least part of it along with Stoned Love on the Tom Jones show which makes one think it was considered as a possible follow up single?

[marv2]

And didn't they perform at least part of it along with Stoned Love on the Tom Jones show which makes one think it was considered as a possible follow up single?

It was the Flip Wilson Show on NBC!

[RanRan79]

"It's Time To Break Down" was one of the best songs on the album. It was ahead of it's time. It was sexy, perhaps too sexy for American radio at the time. It was deep Soul and R&B. Not at all like the light bubblegum Pop songs the Supremes had been known for in the Sixties. It would have been well received if it had been given a chance. It would have scored big time later into the Seventies and even the Eighties as it fit the "Quiet Storm" radio format like a glove.....

I don't think there's anything "Quiet Storm" about it. But you're right about it having a sexiness to it. I don't think it was anymore sexy than anything else out at the time, so I don't think radio would have had a problem with it. If only we could go back and interfere with history, force Motown to release it and see what it would do. I have to figure "Break Down" would have been a much bigger hit than "Everybody's Got the Right to Love".

[RanRan79]

And didn't they perform at least part of it along with Stoned Love on the Tom Jones show which makes one think it was considered as a possible follow up single?

I think they did the whole song but inserted part of "Stoned Love" in the middle. Now that you bring it up, it makes perfect sense that Motown must have at least considered it as a possible single. The Supremes weren't typically artists who performed their album tracks on television, and it seems that when they did, like with "Mother Dear", it was because the song was being considered for single release.

Btw, I really wish Gordy had scrapped half of those standards and showtunes performances on TV and concert and let the girls do some of those album tracks instead.

[waynesville]

In many ways this is a great album, but it could have been so much greater and it spoke of a lack of aspiration by Motown.
1) When you have a track of the greatness of Stone Love - one of the culminating anthems of soul - that's your title track. [[is it just an urban myth that somehow an extra D crept in at the record plant forcing Motown to accept a title which hit airplay an forced an inappropriate name for the album? or it it just an urban myth?
2) Mary said it all about the pretty girly cover. They should have used one of Michael Och's devastating pics of the girls, one of which is my screensaver. They spoke of beautiful, proud, Black women with something to say
3) The album was edging towards being a real concept album, but that required original material and not covers. Motown seemed so reluctant to lets the girls escape from the MOR/Crossover styles which marked much of the Diana Ross era and be themselves. Again, where was the aspiration at corporate level?

[luke]

The Supremes were on a hot streak with Stone Love. If Together WCMSSM was released quickly too then top ten or #1 followed by another smash with Time TBD. I think Motown wanted to slow them down. They were too hot!

[bradsupremes]

1) When you have a track of the greatness of Stone Love - one of the culminating anthems of soul - that's your title track. [[is it just an urban myth that somehow an extra D crept in at the record plant forcing Motown to accept a title which hit airplay an forced an inappropriate name for the album? or it it just an urban myth?

The "D" was added somewhere after recording and before release. You can hear Jean and the ladies sing "Stone Love" and I believe the session logs and the tape box say "Stone Love."

[marv2]

I don't think there's anything "Quiet Storm" about it. But you're right about it having a sexiness to it. I don't think it was anymore sexy than anything else out at the time, so I don't think radio would have had a problem with it. If only we could go back and interfere with history, force Motown to release it and see what it would do. I have to figure "Break Down" would have been a much bigger hit than "Everybody's Got the Right to Love".

What was out in 1970 by a female artist or group that was sexier? Also, I listened to radio everyday in 1970 and they were playing shit like the Partridge Family, J-5, Bobby Sherman, Band of Gold, etc. They would not have played "It's Time to Breakdown" even if it were edited down to 2:30 minutes. FM was just coming into it's own, but Top 40 still ruled.

The song was basically about "giving it up!" It was time, she could no longer stand it! LOL! That WOULD HAVE NOT gotten played on hit radio in those days. If you think they ran into a problem with "Stoned Love", they would have ran into a brick wall with "It's Time to Break Down". Fast forward five and half years later and you even had controversy over Donna Summer's "Love to Love You Baby".

[marv2]

It's Time To Break Down
The Supremes

For your lovin', oh, oh, yeah
Oh, oh, yeah, when you touch me

I'm at the crossroads of life
And I don't know if I should go left or right
My mind is confused, my heart is, too
Why your voice is ringin', ringin' in my ear
It's time to break down, time to say yeah
Time to take time [[time to take time)
Give my heart a chance to breathe
Feel this fire inside of me

I'll never be free [[from wanting you)
My heart is your prisoner, yeah
You're like a light in my pathway
You're like a fire that gets higher day after day
I pretend I don't see this spell you cast over me
But the truth is you see all upon my face
It's time to break down, time to say yeah
Oh baby, time to take time [[time to take time)

Ooh, I'll never be free from wanting you
My heart is your prisoner, ooh-ooh

It's time to break down
Say yeah when you touch me, baby
Break down for your lovin'
Mm, say yeah, oh yeah
Oh yeah, ooh, yeah, yeah
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah, ooh, baby
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah when you touch me
Break down, break down
Say yeah when you touch me

Oh yeah, say yeah when you touch me
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah when you touch me, baby
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah when you touch me
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah!

Mm, your touch is inspirational
Ooh, for your lovin'
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah
Break down for your lovin'
Say yeah when you touch me, baby
Oh, yeah, ooh, say yeah when you touch me
Your touch inspirational
Oh, break down for your lovin'
Songwriters: ELLENORA HENDLEY, FRANK EDWARD WILSON
© Sony/ATV Music Publishing LLC
For non-commercial use only.
Data from: LyricFind

[marv2]

James Brown could have gotten away with singing "Sex Machine" in 1970, but women still had a hard time getting songs played that were even somewhat suggestive. Remember when in 1973 Sylvia Robinson put out "Pillow Talk" and even grown men blushed? Remember?

[RanRan79]

The Supremes were on a hot streak with Stone Love. If Together WCMSSM was released quickly too then top ten or #1 followed by another smash with Time TBD. I think Motown wanted to slow them down. They were too hot!

But does a hot streak guarantee a huge hit? I just don't have the faith in "Together" that I do in "Break Down". Top 20? Probably. Top 10? Maybe. Number one? No way. I just wouldn't have gone there, but it's interesting to think what if.

[RanRan79]

What was out in 1970 by a female artist or group that was sexier? Also, I listened to radio everyday in 1970 and they were playing shit like the Partridge Family, J-5, Bobby Sherman, Band of Gold, etc. They would not have played "It's Time to Breakdown" even if it were edited down to 2:30 minutes. FM was just coming into it's own, but Top 40 still ruled.

The song was basically about "giving it up!" It was time, she could no longer stand it! LOL! That WOULD HAVE NOT gotten played on hit radio in those days. If you think they ran into a problem with "Stoned Love", they would have ran into a brick wall with "It's Time to Break Down". Fast forward five and half years later and you even had controversy over Donna Summer's "Love to Love You Baby".

You might have a point. I wasn't thinking about sexy in regards to the lyrics but to the overall sound, especially their live performance. It oozed sex IMO. Lyrically is where it gets fuzzy because reading your opinion vs mine and I kind of see this as that point where art is interpreted by the individual. I never thought the lyrics were about her "giving it up". I always thought the lyrics were about her falling under some dude's spell. But you pointing out the words now without me being enraptured by Jean's vocal, yeah, I can see where the song is probably about sex. But is it so in your face that it would have had issues being played on radio? I guess that would be the question posed in this edition of Hindsight Motown Quality Control.;)

[RanRan79]

James Brown could have gotten away with singing "Sex Machine" in 1970, but women still had a hard time getting songs played that were even somewhat suggestive. Remember when in 1973 Sylvia Robinson put out "Pillow Talk" and even grown men blushed? Remember?

Marv if I have to tell yo ass again that the 70s were before my time...no I do not remember!! LOL But yeah, you're right, women would have had a tougher time with more suggestive lyrics than men. I discovered "Pillow Talk" as a teenager. By that time [[of my teens) there was a whole lot more than "suggestion" in the lyrics of songs. I can imagine "Pillow Talk" had folks, um, talking.

[marv2]

You might have a point. I wasn't thinking about sexy in regards to the lyrics but to the overall sound, especially their live performance. It oozed sex IMO. Lyrically is where it gets fuzzy because reading your opinion vs mine and I kind of see this as that point where art is interpreted by the individual. I never thought the lyrics were about her "giving it up". I always thought the lyrics were about her falling under some dude's spell. But you pointing out the words now without me being enraptured by Jean's vocal, yeah, I can see where the song is probably about sex. But is it so in your face that it would have had issues being played on radio? I guess that would be the question posed in this edition of Hindsight Motown Quality Control.;)

Again, I don't know how old you are, but I was old enough to buy records in the early 70s. There was this cute little song in 1971 by a singer called Melanie "Brand New Key" that was mildly controversial because kids picked up on the true meaning immediately and knew that the lyrics were "naughty". The following year Chuck Berry scored a hit with "My Ding A Ling". It too became immediately popular with kids because Ding A Ling was slang for a males private part. It may have went right over the heads of older people, but the kids knew that it was "naughty". That was in 1972.

[marv2]

Marv if I have to tell yo ass again that the 70s were before my time...no I do not remember!! LOL But yeah, you're right, women would have had a tougher time with more suggestive lyrics than men. I discovered "Pillow Talk" as a teenager. By that time [[of my teens) there was a whole lot more than "suggestion" in the lyrics of songs. I can imagine "Pillow Talk" had folks, um, talking.

Well then listen to your elders dammit and you will learn some things! Never argue with them either, that is being disobedient! LOL!!! Paul Williams told Otis Williams that as the Temptations, they were selling "sex". So were the Supremes but in a much more covert way. "Floy Joy" was a song about a Pimp/player set to a groovy ,bubblegum beat. if you just danced to it like we did and never paid attention to the lyrics you may not know it was about 3 gorgeous women pining over one slick player. They didn't even know his real name and didn't care as long as he came by to see them sometime........LOL!

[luke]

And you know what some people say Buttered Popcorn is about!!!lolol

[marv2]

You might have a point. I wasn't thinking about sexy in regards to the lyrics but to the overall sound, especially their live performance. It oozed sex IMO. Lyrically is where it gets fuzzy because reading your opinion vs mine and I kind of see this as that point where art is interpreted by the individual. I never thought the lyrics were about her "giving it up". I always thought the lyrics were about her falling under some dude's spell. But you pointing out the words now without me being enraptured by Jean's vocal, yeah, I can see where the song is probably about sex. But is it so in your face that it would have had issues being played on radio? I guess that would be the question posed in this edition of Hindsight Motown Quality Control.;)

It is totally about sex! What? She falls under some dude's spell and what do you think they are going to do? Play cards? LOL!!!

[marv2]

And you know what some people say Buttered Popcorn is about!!!lolol

Exactly and that was in 1962 right? Listening to that record as little kid, it didn't mean anything to me other than her boyfriend liked popcorn a lot. LOL!!!

[detmotownguy]

Good post Marv!

[marv2]

Good post Marv!

Thanks DET!

[Bluebrock]

It was the Flip Wilson Show on NBC!
Okay my mistake. I wasn't living in the States at the time of the broadcast and it is only the past few years that i saw the clip onyoutube, but my original point remains - they performed the song on a national TV show.

[marv2]

Okay my mistake. I wasn't living in the States at the time of the broadcast and it is only the past few years that i saw the clip onyoutube, but my original point remains - they performed the song on a national TV show.

They performed it on the show in January 1971. We all watched and that performance was talked about everywhere including radio stations. That particular performance was co-oped by the Original Broadway production of "Dreamgirls".

[luke]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VBLu64BVV-I

[luke]

This would have been a perfect time for the Supremes to have ditched the elaborate outfits, slow it down and take turns singing with feeling.

[Bluebrock]

I think they did the whole song but inserted part of "Stoned Love" in the middle. Now that you bring it up, it makes perfect sense that Motown must have at least considered it as a possible single. The Supremes weren't typically artists who performed their album tracks on television, and it seems that when they did, like with "Mother Dear", it was because the song was being considered for single release.

Btw, I really wish Gordy had scrapped half of those standards and showtunes performances on TV and concert and let the girls do some of those album tracks instead.
I agree. The standards worked perfectly in the 60's but by the 70's they seemed outdated and it would have made far more sense to perform their own material.

[Bluebrock]

They performed it on the show in January 1971. We all watched and that performance was talked about everywhere including radio stations. That particular performance was co-oped by the Original Broadway production of "Dreamgirls".
It was a great performance and the girls really made a statement of intent here. All this talk has made me dig out The Jean Terrell Years cds, and most of the songs sound as fresh and relevant as they did back then. If the Supremes ever recorded a finer tune than "stoned love" i have yet to hear it. Such a timeless classic. They really don't make them like that anymore.

[RanRan79]

Again, I don't know how old you are, but I was old enough to buy records in the early 70s. There was this cute little song in 1971 by a singer called Melanie "Brand New Key" that was mildly controversial because kids picked up on the true meaning immediately and knew that the lyrics were "naughty". The following year Chuck Berry scored a hit with "My Ding A Ling". It too became immediately popular with kids because Ding A Ling was slang for a males private part. It may have went right over the heads of older people, but the kids knew that it was "naughty". That was in 1972.

In the case of "Brand New Key", when you read what the author has to say about what inspired the song and the way she views the controversy over the lyrics, you come to understand how certain songs are interpreted based on the person doing the interpreting. As for "Ding A Ling", only an idiot wouldn't know what was going on there. I was about 7 or 8 the first time I remember hearing it and I knew immediately what his ding a ling was. LOL

[RanRan79]

It is totally about sex! What? She falls under some dude's spell and what do you think they are going to do? Play cards? LOL!!!

Didn't matter what they were going to do. In my mind it was about the moment and the way I interpreted the lyrics was that this guy was breaking down whatever wall she had up. She was trying to figure out if stepping back into the game is a good idea or not. But as I said, when you posted the lyrics I can definitely see where the song might be about sex.

Even so, I still maintain that the song wasn't so over the top that radio wouldn't have played it like crazy. I certainly can't believe that Motown didn't release it as a single because they feared backlash, after all they let the girls do the song on prime time television. And then the question has to be asked: if "Time to Break Down" was such a problem, what changed in the year between that and "Touch", which I think is a much more sexually suggestive song. Now THAT song is clearly about sex. Lol

[RanRan79]

I agree. The standards worked perfectly in the 60's but by the 70's they seemed outdated and it would have made far more sense to perform their own material.

But even the 60s Supremes should have cut back on some of that stuff. We know why and we know what it did for them at the time, and they were so great at it, but I think looking back it was that aspect of the group that has hurt their musical legacy.

[marv2]

In the case of "Brand New Key", when you read what the author has to say about what inspired the song and the way she views the controversy over the lyrics, you come to understand how certain songs are interpreted based on the person doing the interpreting. As for "Ding A Ling", only an idiot wouldn't know what was going on there. I was about 7 or 8 the first time I remember hearing it and I knew immediately what his ding a ling was. LOL

I guess we were bad little kids. I was in the sixth grade when "Brand New Key" came out and right away we assumed it was about sex. LOL!

[marv2]

Didn't matter what they were going to do. In my mind it was about the moment and the way I interpreted the lyrics was that this guy was breaking down whatever wall she had up. She was trying to figure out if stepping back into the game is a good idea or not. But as I said, when you posted the lyrics I can definitely see where the song might be about sex.

Even so, I still maintain that the song wasn't so over the top that radio wouldn't have played it like crazy. I certainly can't believe that Motown didn't release it as a single because they feared backlash, after all they let the girls do the song on prime time television. And then the question has to be asked: if "Time to Break Down" was such a problem, what changed in the year between that and "Touch", which I think is a much more sexually suggestive song. Now THAT song is clearly about sex. Lol

"Touch" hardly got played on the radio back then either. In "It's Time to Break Down" she says touch me a lot of times vs Mary saying it in "Touch" 3-4 times. Oh sure was a very sexually suggestive song and a good one too, but the times just did not accept a woman singing about sex or wanting it on the radio. If you think back to all of the early Rock and Roll songs like "Work With Me Annie" , "Roll With Me Henry" there were always hidden sexually suggestive lyrics/meanings in those songs.

[Bluebrock]

But even the 60s Supremes should have cut back on some of that stuff. We know why and we know what it did for them at the time, and they were so great at it, but I think looking back it was that aspect of the group that has hurt their musical legacy.
As the years roll by i realise just how good the Supremes were at doing the old standards. We know Berry had them do it to broaden their appeal and boy did it work. Even in the late 60's when some of the Supremes singles lacked the quality of the earlier ones and were not selling very well they remained a huge draw on the concert/cabaret circuit, and this was due in no small way to their ability to impress audiences with their versatility . As the 70's dawned it began to look "old hat" and the era of the variety show was beginning to recede somewhat. This is when the 70's Supremes live act should have been updated and moved on with the times.

[Jimi LaLumia]

the key to hit singles on the radio are 'hooks';
catchy chorus, catchy melody, instantly familiar;
I knew "Touch' would fail because it had none of the above, and the same reasons apply to the bad news that was 'Bad Weather' which sort of just sauntered along to its doom.

[sup_fan]

Excellent point Jimi. Neither touch or bad weather are hummable or singable. What I mean is when your driving your car and singing along. Perhaps BW would have been if Jean sang it straight and stuck to a simple melody. But all of her riffs and ad libs make it so the avg person can't sing along. Therefore they tend to not buy the single

[daviddh]

This would have been a perfect time for the Supremes to have ditched the elaborate outfits, slow it down and take turns singing with feeling.
totally agree. the albums would have done better as well as the group

[daviddh]

the key to hit singles on the radio are 'hooks';
catchy chorus, catchy melody, instantly familiar;
I knew "Touch' would fail because it had none of the above, and the same reasons apply to the bad news that was 'Bad Weather' which sort of just sauntered along to its doom.
have to agree, I think both needed remixes but I am not sure that would have worked. I never felt that BW ever got off the ground. never made me want to dance to it.

[daviddh]

As the years roll by i realise just how good the Supremes were at doing the old standards. We know Berry had them do it to broaden their appeal and boy did it work. Even in the late 60's when some of the Supremes singles lacked the quality of the earlier ones and were not selling very well they remained a huge draw on the concert/cabaret circuit, and this was due in no small way to their ability to impress audiences with their versatility . As the 70's dawned it began to look "old hat" and the era of the variety show was beginning to recede somewhat. This is when the 70's Supremes live act should have been updated and moved on with the times.
I am not sure whos idea it was to keep these songs in the acts. the old saying is if it isn't broke don't fix it.., but it was broke and needed fixing asap.

[blackguy69]

I am not sure whos idea it was to keep these songs in the acts. the old saying is if it isn't broke don't fix it.., but it was broke and needed fixing asap.


Actually if you listen to the 70-71 shows, they were updated . But for some reason they reverted back to the old drats shows around the fall of 72. I should say it was a combo of the drats shows with some updated covers.

[Jimi LaLumia]

while we're on the subject of 'suicide' singles.."I Guess I'll Miss The Man"??? really.. on what planet? great ALBUM TRACK, but a lead off single?? people needed to lay down the crack pipe, unless these were willful 'assisted suicide' choices!!

[marv2]

while we're on the subject of 'suicide' singles.."I Guess I'll Miss The Man"??? really.. on what planet? great ALBUM TRACK, but a lead off single?? people needed to lay down the crack pipe, unless these were willful 'assisted suicide' choices!!
Crack had not been invented yet in 1972. You must mean the hash pipes! LOL!

[Jimi LaLumia]

yes, Marv! lol..the equivalent thereof! and it's a shame that so many singles that should have been, right up to and including Mary's "I Love A Warm Summer Night" which I thought radio would have loved [[especially if it had been released in late spring!) never got out of the gate..

[marv2]

yes, Marv! lol..the equivalent thereof! and it's a shame that so many singles that should have been, right up to and including Mary's "I Love A Warm Summer Night" which I thought radio would have loved [[especially if it had been released in late spring!) never got out of the gate..

Doesn't some of the decisions these record companies made just make you crazy? The best recording Bonnie Pointer ever made was "Deep Inside My Soul" but it was never released as a single and is now such an obscure track you cannot even find it on the internet!

[detmotownguy]

This would have been a perfect time for the Supremes to have ditched the elaborate outfits, slow it down and take turns singing with feeling. It worked for LaBelle. The whole gown thing made them look "old". MSS sure had the skills. I wished they had a chance at one more album to reinvent themselves.

[Bluebrock]

while we're on the subject of 'suicide' singles.."I Guess I'll Miss The Man"??? really.. on what planet? great ALBUM TRACK, but a lead off single?? people needed to lay down the crack pipe, unless these were willful 'assisted suicide' choices!!
The whole album was a disaster from the choice of songs to the dreadful cover. I remember speaking to a former employee of Motown UK who took a listen to the album and turned to his colleague and said "how the f*ck are we expected to find a hit single on this pile of sh*t". No truer words were ever spoken. Whoever came up with this lame idea needed relieving of their duties.

[daviddh]

the only song that should have been considered for a single was WHEN CAN BROWN BEGIN.
i thought the album was to laid back and would have preferred Promises Kept instead.
i also have been enjoying This Is The Story.