Only Love Can Conquer All - Diana Ross

[captainjames]

One of the best songs she has ever recorded - I truly wish this would have been included in her shows.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWD8-1fptP0

[Bluebrock]

One of the best songs she has ever recorded - I truly wish this would have been included in her shows.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWD8-1fptP0
This was Diana's personal favourite song from TMH, and i can well understand why. She did perform it on one of her UK shows , but i do not recall her performing it live ever again.

[captainjames]

A big mistake from Motown not to release and move that song.

[Bluebrock]

A big mistake from Motown not to release and move that song.
We did consider it but i was overuled and we went with the beautiful but uncommercial "gone"

[reese]

When I saw her in 1995 and 1996, ONLY LOVE... was part of the set list. I think it is a great song [[that whole cd is full of great songs), but I don't think of it as a single. Perhaps if it was a bit faster.

[vgalindo]

When I saw her in 1995 and 1996, ONLY LOVE... was part of the set list. I think it is a great song [[that whole cd is full of great songs), but I don't think of it as a single. Perhaps if it was a bit faster.
Yes when I saw her at the Universal Amphitheater in 1995 she performed this song.

[dickiemint]

I think that Take me higher was one of Diana Ross strongest 90's releases. That along with Force behind the power were big hits in the UK along with her number one collection One Woman

[captainjames]

It amazing that even today the songs are still current. On this particular video Diana lets her background singer finish the song which brings it to a even better climax.

[reese]

It amazing that even today the songs are still current. On this particular video Diana lets her background singer finish the song which brings it to a even better climax.

Her name is Teresa Griffin. For quite a while, she sang background for Jerry Butler.

[midnightman]

Take Me Higher should've been a better seller here than it was. Motown really dropped the ball on its promotion. It's one of the label's - and Miss Ross' - finest efforts to date, especially in the '90s.

[Ollie9]

It's interesting how fans musical tastes differ. This was always my least favourite song on the album. I don't dislike it by any means, just enjoy the other songs more.. I could never imagine this being a hit single.
"Let Somebody Know" is a little gem to my ears and shouild never have been left off the UK version.
I never really understood why the rap was removed on"Dont Stop" for the USA version. It really adds to the song. As regards promoting Diana, Motown really were clueless at this point in time.

[JohnnyB]

When I saw her in 1995 and 1996, ONLY LOVE... was part of the set list. I think it is a great song [[that whole cd is full of great songs), but I don't think of it as a single. Perhaps if it was a bit faster.

In Detroit, she brought a local choir onstage to perform the song with her. It was the first encore of the show and the song lasted much longer than the length of the actual recording. The audience really responded to the lyric and it's message. The choir added to the overall emotion. A good concert memory. This was a month prior to the CD's release...

[reese]

In Detroit, she brought a local choir onstage to perform the song with her. It was the first encore of the show and the song lasted much longer than the length of the actual recording. The audience really responded to the lyric and it's message. The choir added to the overall emotion. A good concert memory. This was a month prior to the CD's release...

She did the same when I saw her in concert in 1995 and 1996. Both times, the set list was heavy on songs from TAKE ME HIGHER and they all got a great response.

In 1995, I saw Diana a month before the cd's release and loved all of the new songs she sang, particularly IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA LOVE ME RIGHT, VOICE OF THE HEART, and I THOUGHT THAT WE WERE STILL IN LOVE. But at the time, I thought it was a mistake to sing so many songs that the average concertgoer couldn't go right out and buy. I'm sure Diana tried to align touring dates with the release date from Motown, and commitments had to be made. But I think the cd might have done better if the tour dates had started a month or so later.

[sansradio]

She did the same when I saw her in concert in 1995 and 1996. Both times, the set list was heavy on songs from TAKE ME HIGHER and they all got a great response.

In 1995, I saw Diana a month before the cd's release and loved all of the new songs she sang, particularly IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA LOVE ME RIGHT, VOICE OF THE HEART, and I THOUGHT THAT WE WERE STILL IN LOVE. But at the time, I thought it was a mistake to sing so many songs that the average concertgoer couldn't go right out and buy. I'm sure Diana tried to align touring dates with the release date from Motown, and commitments had to be made. But I think the cd might have done better if the tour dates had started a month or so later.

I'm jealous; I had "Golden Circle" tickets to see her at The Meadows in Connecticut for this tour...and she cancelled. At least I got the money back. Those tickets were a pretty penny.

[reese]

I'm jealous; I had "Golden Circle" tickets to see her at The Meadows in Connecticut for this tour...and she cancelled. At least I got the money back. Those tickets were a pretty penny.

That's too bad. In 1995, Diana was scheduled for one night in my town and due to overwhelming response, a second night was added. Of course, I went to both. In 1996, she came back for one show, which I went to. The next day, one of my best friends called and asked did I want to see her that night. It turned out that Diana was doing a benefit that evening for the Anti-Defamation League and my friend was given a pair of tickets. She thought of me, and I got to see Diana again.

[JohnnyB]

She did the same when I saw her in concert in 1995 and 1996. Both times, the set list was heavy on songs from TAKE ME HIGHER and they all got a great response.

In 1995, I saw Diana a month before the cd's release and loved all of the new songs she sang, particularly IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA LOVE ME RIGHT, VOICE OF THE HEART, and I THOUGHT THAT WE WERE STILL IN LOVE. But at the time, I thought it was a mistake to sing so many songs that the average concertgoer couldn't go right out and buy. I'm sure Diana tried to align touring dates with the release date from Motown, and commitments had to be made. But I think the cd might have done better if the tour dates had started a month or so later.

Agreed! If the audience could have purchased the CD the day after the shows, while the songs were still in their minds, it may have done better. Only Love, Voice Of The Heart and I Thought We Were got such good responses, and I WIll Survive had the entire house dancing in the aisles.

[Albator]

I adore "only love" , one of her best "message song" like she says. the only problem is that it is rather similar in theme as "let somebody know", another great song.

[Bluebrock]

I adore "only love" , one of her best "message song" like she says. the only problem is that it is rather similar in theme as "let somebody know", another great song.
TMH had many wonderful outtakes and remixes. I reckon the expanded version will be a double cd if we are to do the album full justice.

[JohnnyB]

TMH had many wonderful outtakes and remixes. I reckon the expanded version will be a double cd if we are to do the album full justice.

Bluebrock, you've mentioned a potential expanded edition of TMH several times. Are you teasing us or throwing hints? You've piqued my curiosity...

[marv2]

Was that an actual release?

[Bluebrock]

Was that an actual release?
Yes . It was on TAKE ME HIGHER.

[Bluebrock]

Bluebrock, you've mentioned a potential expanded edition of TMH several times. Are you teasing us or throwing hints? You've piqued my curiosity...
All i shall say is watch this space, and make sure that space is sufficient for three other possible expanded editions.........

[captainjames]

Wow ............




all i shall say is watch this space, and make sure that space is sufficient for three other possible expanded editions.........

[vgalindo]

Wow ............

That would be awesome!!

[Bluebrock]

That would be awesome!!
Wouldn't it just?

[Ollie9]

You now have Diana fans chomping at the bit Bluebrock. ;)
If such a thing could, might or did happen, would you surmise that there could or perhaps be a physical release of these cd's or would it be download only.

[rovereab]

All i shall say is watch this space, and make sure that space is sufficient for three other possible expanded editions.........

Yes please!!

[florence]

It's interesting how fans musical tastes differ. This was always my least favourite song on the album. I don't dislike it by any means, just enjoy the other songs more.. I could never imagine this being a hit single.
"Let Somebody Know" is a little gem to my ears and shouild never have been left off the UK version.
I never really understood why the rap was removed on"Dont Stop" for the USA version. It really adds to the song. As regards promoting Diana, Motown really were clueless at this point in time.

I'd have to agree with everything Ollie says.

I can't see that Only Love Can Conquer All could have been a hit single.

Let Somebody know is better than most of the other tracks and it's somewhat puzzling why it was decided to leave it off the UK release.

There does seem to be a lot of love for this album amongst the fans here but it's not one of my favourites even though Diana is in good shape vocally. It's certainly not a bad album, solid and there's not a duff track on it but most of the songs - the ballads in particular - lack that killer punch.

Diana does a storming version of I Will Survive but unfortunately it's just a fact of life that the song will forever be associated with Gloria Gaynor. Familiarity plus a strategic plug on the UK's National Lottery Show gave the record a modicum of success.

To me the one chance of being a hit UK single was Voice Of The Heart.

Looking at the statistics you would think this was a big UK hit album reaching #10 in the charts but this rather misleading. It actually didn't sell that well. Most of Diana's fans went out and bought it in the first week of release which enabled the high position but it then dropped very quickly only charting for 3 weeks in total and is one of only a few of Diana's albums which didn't reach at least Silver status in the UK. It was outsold by To Love Again and did less than half of Baby It's Me which some how failed toeven make the top 50 Album Chart at all - go figure.

[wedgeville]

Have to say I loved "Gone", it really took me back to the "Touch Me In The Morning" years. I was pretty sure it would be massive in the UK.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAVkHXEBG7c

My partner loved "Only Love Can Conquer All" but it was definitely "Gone" for me. Although "Voice Of The Heart" was great too.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1735972560001093/

Wayne

PS - The expanded editions sound great...

[Albator]

Diana's fans say so that this album is great that in the end, they are convinced by that. In spite of a strong promo this album didn't do well in the USA, but also in UK and Japan. There must be something wrong with it. What ? I don't know.

[Bluebrock]

You now have Diana fans chomping at the bit Bluebrock. ;)
If such a thing could, might or did happen, would you surmise that there could or perhaps be a physical release of these cd's or would it be download only.
Most definately physical Ollie!

[Bluebrock]

Diana's fans say so that this album is great that in the end, they are convinced by that. In spite of a strong promo this album didn't do well in the USA, but also in UK and Japan. There must be something wrong with it. What ? I don't know.
Are you trying to say that if an album fails to sell then it must not be of a good quality? So many classic albums did not get the sales they warranted. DUSTY IN MEMPHIS immediately springs to mind, and on the other side of the coin look at [[or listen) to the quality of albums by the likes of Britney, Katy Perry. They sell by the bucketload, but are they good musically? Not to these ears the're not. TAKE ME HIGHER is one of Diana's best ever albums in my opinion. As to why it did not sell well we could speculate on all night, but it's not because of the lack of quality on display.

[captainjames]

"The Force Behind The Power" and "Take Me Higher" remains some of the best work performed by Diana. They always end up on my player.

[Albator]

Are you trying to say that if an album fails to sell then it must not be of a good quality? So many classic albums did not get the sales they warranted. DUSTY IN MEMPHIS immediately springs to mind, and on the other side of the coin look at [[or listen) to the quality of albums by the likes of Britney, Katy Perry. They sell by the bucketload, but are they good musically? Not to these ears the're not. TAKE ME HIGHER is one of Diana's best ever albums in my opinion. As to why it did not sell well we could speculate on all night, but it's not because of the lack of quality on display.
No ... But like Florence wrote :


There does seem to be a lot of love for this album amongst the fans here but it's not one of my favourites even though Diana is in good shape vocally. It's certainly not a bad album, solid and there's not a duff track on it but most of the songs - the ballads in particular - lack that killer punch.

I also think "take me higher " and "I will survive" are good but nothing more.

I also remember being unhappy with her appearance at that time. There was something wild or aggressive in her make up and hair but she didn't push the concept far enough. She did no "sequins tv" in the video and US promo and it worked very well. Then, very soon she went for her usual stage persona and glamour and something was wrong.

This is very subjective but this is what I remember thinking at that time.

[Bluebrock]

"The Force Behind The Power" and "Take Me Higher" remains some of the best work performed by Diana. They always end up on my player.
Spot on Captainjames. Two of her finest albums in my opinion. I know i am biased because i was working with her at the time and i got to see the lady from all angles, much of which i cannot share here. Diana herself believed in these albums , i believed in these albums , and the hardcore fans certainly did.
The expanded versions will be even better.

[Ollie9]

No ... But like Florence wrote :



I also think "take me higher " and "I will survive" are good but nothing more.

I also remember being unhappy with her appearance at that time. There was something wild or aggressive in her make up and hair but she didn't push the concept far enough. She did no "sequins tv" in the video and US promo and it worked very well. Then, very soon she went for her usual stage persona and glamour and something was wrong.

This is very subjective but this is what I remember thinking at that time.

Diana was sporting a much shorter hair style at the time, but i really don't think anyone would consider that aggressive hair styling :confused:. Makeup wise i thought she went for a slightly more au naturale look on tv appearances to promote the album.
I think the majority of fans see it as one of her better albums while reviews, at least in the UK were all positive As Bluebrock mentions, we could debate all day as to why it did not do better. It's just one of those things...One of those bells that now and then rings.

[Ollie9]

I'd have to agree with everything Ollie says.

I can't see that Only Love Can Conquer All could have been a hit single.

Let Somebody know is better than most of the other tracks and it's somewhat puzzling why it was decided to leave it off the UK release.

There does seem to be a lot of love for this album amongst the fans here but it's not one of my favourites even though Diana is in good shape vocally. It's certainly not a bad album, solid and there's not a duff track on it but most of the songs - the ballads in particular - lack that killer punch.

Diana does a storming version of I Will Survive but unfortunately it's just a fact of life that the song will forever be associated with Gloria Gaynor. Familiarity plus a strategic plug on the UK's National Lottery Show gave the record a modicum of success.

To me the one chance of being a hit UK single was Voice Of The Heart.

Looking at the statistics you would think this was a big UK hit album reaching #10 in the charts but this rather misleading. It actually didn't sell that well. Most of Diana's fans went out and bought it in the first week of release which enabled the high position but it then dropped very quickly only charting for 3 weeks in total and is one of only a few of Diana's albums which didn't reach at least Silver status in the UK. It was outsold by To Love Again and did less than half of Baby It's Me which some how failed toeven make the top 50 Album Chart at all - go figure.

Thanks for the stats Florence.... Interesting reading. I guess BIM has sold well over time.
I do think TMH did really well to reach such a high position on the UK charts even if did fall away quite quickly. I never thought VOTH a possible hit but then again i thought TMH [[single) would go big. As most of us do realise, hit singles do not necessarily make for quality music which i think TMH contains in abundance.

[Bluebrock]

Diana was sporting a much shorter hair style at the time, but i really don't think anyone would consider that aggressive hair styling :confused:. Makeup wise i thought she went for a slightly more au naturale look on tv appearances to promote the album.
I think the majority of fans see it as one of her better albums while reviews, at least in the UK were all positive As Bluebrock mentions, we could debate all day as to why it did not do better. It's just one of those things...One of those bells that now and then rings.
She looked stunning at this time. I was with her when she embarked upon a promotional tour of the USA. She performed the title track on Letterman, and IF YOUR NOT GONNA LOVE ME RIGHT on Jay Leno. She did great performances of both , and i cannot understand where the "aggressive hair styling" comment came from. Having just watched the performances again this comment mystifies me.

[Bluebrock]

Thanks for the stats Florence.... Interesting reading. I guess BIM has sold well over time.
I do think TMH did really well to reach such a high position on the UK charts even if did fall away quite quickly. I never thought VOTH a possible hit but then again i thought TMH [[single) would go big. As most of us do realise, hit singles do not necessarily make for quality music which i think TMH contains in abundance.
Ollie - I thought TMH the single would go top 10. I even considered releasing a slightly different mix as the follow up to I WILL SURVIVE in the hope we could finally get it into the top 10, but other commitments got in the way of that plan. It was a fine uplifting tune that deserved far better.

[mpn1jco]

Ollie - I thought TMH the single would go top 10. I even considered releasing a slightly different mix as the follow up to I WILL SURVIVE in the hope we could finally get it into the top 10, but other commitments got in the way of that plan. It was a fine uplifting tune that deserved far better.
There would be no airplay for Ross or hit albums in the US regardless of what she put out.

There was a very strong backlash against Diana Ross starting in the mid to late eighties in the US. When Red, Hot Rhythm and Blues was released a friend of mine said, "No one cares about Miss Ross anymore. There are love goddesses out there like Anita Baker, Sade, and Whitney Houston that the public wants to hear not Ross. Indeed - with them selling millions and Ross struggling to sell over 100, 000 copies. Then someone else said, she gave us Dirty Looks, and we gave them right back!

I've noticed that she is finally come out of this dark cloud. I knew this when she received a standing ovation at the Grammys. She will be remembered as an amazing legend.

[Ollie9]

It does rather seem it was a waste of Diana's time and energy trying to promote the album in the USA. They were never going to bite. I guess she longed for recognition from her homeland.
In hindsight [[which is easy) "I Will Survive" should have been the lead single on both sides of the pond to generate as much interest as possible. Having said, who would have thought TMH would fail as a single.
I like the idea of repromoting TMH with a different mix after the success of IWS. It just might have worked.
Perhaps the huge mistake in the UK was not airing the exciting promo video on TOTP. It's a video that lingers in the mind. Diana singing live from the motown museum or anywhere else would not have quite the same impact.

[mpn1jco]

It does rather seem it was a waste of Diana's time and energy trying to promote the album in the USA. They were never going to bite. I guess she longed for recognition from her homeland.
In hindsight [[which is easy) "I Will Survive" should have been the lead single on both sides of the pond to generate as much interest as possible. Having said, who would have thought TMH would fail as a single.
I like the idea of repromoting TMH with a different mix after the success of IWS. It just might have worked.
Perhaps the huge mistake in the UK was not airing the exciting promo video on TOTP. It's a video that lingers in the mind. Diana singing live from the motown museum or anywhere else would not have quite the same impact.

When Marvin Gaye, the Jacksons, and Stevie Wonder took creative control of their career they created masterpiece after masterpiece. When Ross took creative control of her career she trashed her recording career with mediocre and subpar product.

I remember reading that the ballads that Whitney Houston had success with in the eighties were meant for Diana Ross, but since Ross had to have control in the studio, Michael Masser would not work with her.

The planets were always aligned to get Ross back on track but she has proven herself to be her worst enemy. Luther wanted to produce RHRB but she refused. Clive Davis was the only one to bring her back to superstardom, but she had to have creative control, hence I Love You.
Tyler Perry had written a movie for her, and there would be an accompanying soundtrack album. Ross refuses to take his calls.
Ross said on the final Oprah show that she would like to be recording a new album but they won't let her. O.k, yeah.

[Albator]

There would be no airplay for Ross or hit albums in the US regardless of what she put out.

There was a very strong backlash against Diana Ross starting in the mid to late eighties in the US. When Red, Hot Rhythm and Blues was released a friend of mine said, "No one cares about Miss Ross anymore. There are love goddesses out there like Anita Baker, Sade, and Whitney Houston that the public wants to hear not Ross. Indeed - with them selling millions and Ross struggling to sell over 100, 000 copies. Then someone else said, she gave us Dirty Looks, and we gave them right back!

I've noticed that she is finally come out of this dark cloud. I knew this when she received a standing ovation at the Grammys. She will be remembered as an amazing legend.Cher said something about that. I can't quote but it was something like "there is a moment when, no matter what you do, how good you are, people don't want to hear from you anymore". You need time :[[

[mpn1jco]

Cher said something about that. I can't quote but it was something like "there is a moment when, no matter what you do, how good you are, people don't want to hear from you anymore". You need time :[[
In the US, when an artist is on the cusp of, or turns 40, they are put out to pasture. Ross turned 40 in 85. Eaten Alive was released in 85 when her time was up. Chain Reaction was not going to be a hit in the US. Whitney Houston was no exception to this rule. Starting with her greatest hits album in 2000, she would not reach the top 40 again [[ with the exception of a rerelease of the Star Spangled Banner ).
Here are the singles with chart pop chart placings:
52 "Could I Have This Kiss Forever [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Could_I_Have_This_Kiss_Forever)"[
70 "Same Script, Different Cast [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same_Script,_Different_Cast)"
96 "Whatchulookinat [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whatchulookinat)"
72 "One of Those Days [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_of_Those_Days)"
84 "Try It on My Own [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Try_It_on_My_Own)"
70 "I Look to You [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Look_to_You_[[song))"
100 "Million Dollar Bill [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Million_Dollar_Bill)"

Ross had a longer run as a hit maker than Whitney did. When that moment in time arrives, as Cher said, it is important to diversify.
Ross should have reinvented herself as an actress, but this was basically impossible because she has to have creative control. Ross' ego never ceases to amaze me. Without Berry Gordy to reign her, in she sabotages her career. At this point I expect nothing from her except some expanded editions, which she is apparently disinterested in anyway.

[Albator]

It is also true for Olivia Newton John and Donna Summer at the same time. But it is also true that those ladies made disastrous artistic choices ruining their public images.

[midnightman]

For some reason, I couldn't see Diana doing Masser songs like "You're Still My Man", "Greatest Love of All" and/or "Saving All My Love"... I know of the Masser song both of them did under different titles tho: "Hold Me"/"In Your Arms".

[captainjames]

Thanks you guys for all your info - Diana did not do much to help her career by wanting creative control but a lot of times you have to do that in order to remain grounded and focus, otherwise you will become "eaten alive" [[no pun intended) or a puppet. I believe "Mirror Mirror", "Missing You", "Work That Body" and 'Muscles" were all 80's recordings and I think they did fairly well. She did a song from her "Its My Turn" which the title escapes me right now which I thought was beautifully done, recorded and produced by Michael Masser but, went no where. No one stays "Hot" forever but Diana has survived and I still think "Only Love Can Conquer All" was a hidden diamond.

[mpn1jco]

Thanks you guys for all your info - Diana did not do much to help her career by wanting creative control but a lot of times you have to do that in order to remain grounded and focus, otherwise you will become "eaten alive" [[no pun intended) or a puppet. I believe "Mirror Mirror", "Missing You", "Work That Body" and 'Muscles" were all 80's recordings and I think they did fairly well. She did a song from her "Its My Turn" which the title escapes me right now which I thought was beautifully done, recorded and produced by Michael Masser but, went no where. No one stays "Hot" forever but Diana has survived and I still think "Only Love Can Conquer All" was a hidden diamond.
Diana was still big in the early 80s. [[ all were top 10 except Work That Body which reached 44 )
Mirror Mirror 82
Work That Body 82
Muscles 82
Missing You 84 [[ her final top 10 and top 40 entry )

Age 40 and on chart placing in the US :
Eaten Alive 77
Chain Reaction 95
Chain Reaction Remix 66 [[ her final top 100 entry )

The follow up singles from It's My Turn produced by Michael Masser . They deserved their fate.
Just One More Chance #79 [[ 1981 )
Crying My Heart Over You 1981 [[ did not chart )

[Bluebrock]

When Marvin Gaye, the Jacksons, and Stevie Wonder took creative control of their career they created masterpiece after masterpiece. When Ross took creative control of her career she trashed her recording career with mediocre and subpar product.

I remember reading that the ballads that Whitney Houston had success with in the eighties were meant for Diana Ross, but since Ross had to have control in the studio, Michael Masser would not work with her.

The planets were always aligned to get Ross back on track but she has proven herself to be her worst enemy. Luther wanted to produce RHRB but she refused. Clive Davis was the only one to bring her back to superstardom, but she had to have creative control, hence I Love You.
Tyler Perry had written a movie for her, and there would be an accompanying soundtrack album. Ross refuses to take his calls.
Ross said on the final Oprah show that she would like to be recording a new album but they won't let her. O.k, yeah.

You make some very valid points here, and I agree with virtually all that you say. She shot herself in the foot on more than one occasion, and ultimately it killed her career in the USA.

[thommg]

Cher said something about that. I can't quote but it was something like "there is a moment when, no matter what you do, how good you are, people don't want to hear from you anymore". You need time :[[

Cher also went back into the studio to record an album that was created by someone else. She says she just went in and recorded what they gave her and it turned out to be Believe, one of her best recordings. Sometimes you have to let others have a bit of control as long as you trust them to begin with.

[mpn1jco]

Cher also went back into the studio to record an album that was created by someone else. She says she just went in and recorded what they gave her and it turned out to be Believe, one of her best recordings. Sometimes you have to let others have a bit of control as long as you trust them to begin with.

Cher's It's A Man's World was a hit overseas but a flop here. When a remix of the single One By One by Jr Vazquez exploded overseas the powers that be realized dance music was were her audience was. The Believe album was directly and consciously to be the type of album her gay audience wanted and the rest is history. Cher hated dance music and wanted to make a rock album but she went in and did the album.

Cher was in the same category as Ross, US radio was finished with her and initially refused to play Believe. There was an article in Billboard about this. It was only until she was number one in 27 countries that they relented. She became the oldest female to have a number on record on the pop charts.

When Not Over You Yet entered the UK charts at #9, it was not the mix on the EDIAND album, it was a Metro/Techno mix. If Ross made an album that was geared to her supportive European audiences, rather than chasing trends to get that elusive US airplay, she probably would have had similar success. Diana Ross would never go into the studio and record what was given to her, because "she must be in control in the studio". Cher's success as an actress were films were she was under a director and producer' s vision. Diana Ross won't do a movie unless she is Executive Producer and Director. Meanwhile, her loyal fans would like a new album or a movie, and nothing is forthcoming because apparently no one is giving into her demands. What you do have is an endless greatest hits tour with her combo [[ how long has this tour be on - ten years? )

[thommg]

When Not Over You Yet entered the UK charts at #9, it was not the mix on the EDIAND album, it was a Metro/Techno mix.

Is that mix of Not Over You Yet on a cd? I don't think I've ever heard anything but the US album version of that track.

[JohnnyB]

Is that mix of Not Over You Yet on a cd? I don't think I've ever heard anything but the US album version of that track.

It is only available on international collections and CD singles. The promotional video uses the UK remix; it should be available to view on YouTube. I think this mix could have returned Diana to the U.S. charts. I was shocked it wasn't promoted early in 2000 in the months leading to Divas Live and Return To Love. There was already a VH1 tie-in and this would have been a perfect time to introduce the song...

[sansradio]

Is that mix of Not Over You Yet on a cd? I don't think I've ever heard anything but the US album version of that track.

It is available on, for example, Love and Life, which, as thommg states, is import only. Love it:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=615kfF9myuE

[TheMotownManiac]

Well I disagree completely that Diana Ross's career when a wall because of her ego. She didn't have to have creative control of every movie she made she was all set to do witches of East wick until she and Arne decide to have children And her part went to Susan Sarandon at the last minute. She would've had no creative control in that. Her career went south because her records were no good: she had complete control over red hot rhythm and blues and it's the worst thing she ever did. She had very little control over working overtime and it was a worldwide flop. She had total control over force behind the power and although it did well overseas, there was nothing on it for the United States. She had no control over that yeah but llama sessions for take me higher, and from what I've read about working with Nick Martinelli she had very little to say With him as well, and, the most admit it's among the best thing she ever did there were no real hits on it. She had total creative control on every day is a new day and it was a disaster sales wise, however she never promoted it at all. She had total control over I love you but other than the initial launch never promoted it and never mentioned it in her concerts that I saw.

not every artist is like share who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not not every artist is like Cher who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not. I admire Miss Ross for not recording things that she doesn't want to sing, if it hits she would have to put it in her act and then Sing-a-Song she doesn't like. Why would she want to do that at this period of her alive? She needs no money, she's already a living legend She has nothing else to prove to anyone. Charlie Chaplin continue to make the kind of movies he wanted to make even though they weren't hitting anymore. He could've gone into a Preston foster film if he wanted to, but it he didn't . I personally think you're mixing artistic integrity with ego, and I do feel that they are mutually exclusive of each other. Diana Ross doesn't even try to have hit records – To my knowledge she never even promoted blue or mentioned it in her concerts and it got rave reviews.

And Michael master never refused to work with Diana Ross. Although I've heard that she did not approve of his heavy use of cocaine, The real reason is she wasn't liking the material he was giving her. She rejected rejected the greatest love of all nearly a decade before Whitney record of it. Yes she could I had a hit with it but what's the point if she doesn't like the song ? I think Diana Ross is probably the hardest working woman from her generation and a couple before and after as well she's probably spent more time in the studio than anyone, and certainly she has worked more internationally than any of her peers for many many many more years. I think she's tired, and is reaping the benefits of well raised children and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to ride ate at Taco Bell and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year the same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to right aid and Taco Bell. That's what she wants to do, she has earned the right to do it.

[Bluebrock]

Well I disagree completely that Diana Ross's career when a wall because of her ego. She didn't have to have creative control of every movie she made she was all set to do witches of East wick until she and Arne decide to have children And her part went to Susan Sarandon at the last minute. She would've had no creative control in that. Her career went south because her records were no good: she had complete control over red hot rhythm and blues and it's the worst thing she ever did. She had very little control over working overtime and it was a worldwide flop. She had total control over force behind the power and although it did well overseas, there was nothing on it for the United States. She had no control over that yeah but llama sessions for take me higher, and from what I've read about working with Nick Martinelli she had very little to say With him as well, and, the most admit it's among the best thing she ever did there were no real hits on it. She had total creative control on every day is a new day and it was a disaster sales wise, however she never promoted it at all. She had total control over I love you but other than the initial launch never promoted it and never mentioned it in her concerts that I saw.

not every artist is like share who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not not every artist is like Cher who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not. I admire Miss Ross for not recording things that she doesn't want to sing, if it hits she would have to put it in her act and then Sing-a-Song she doesn't like. Why would she want to do that at this period of her alive? She needs no money, she's already a living legend She has nothing else to prove to anyone. Charlie Chaplin continue to make the kind of movies he wanted to make even though they weren't hitting anymore. He could've gone into a Preston foster film if he wanted to, but it he didn't . I personally think you're mixing artistic integrity with ego, and I do feel that they are mutually exclusive of each other. Diana Ross doesn't even try to have hit records – To my knowledge she never even promoted blue or mentioned it in her concerts and it got rave reviews.

And Michael master never refused to work with Diana Ross. Although I've heard that she did not approve of his heavy use of cocaine, The real reason is she wasn't liking the material he was giving her. She rejected rejected the greatest love of all nearly a decade before Whitney record of it. Yes she could I had a hit with it but what's the point if she doesn't like the song ? I think Diana Ross is probably the hardest working woman from her generation and a couple before and after as well she's probably spent more time in the studio than anyone, and certainly she has worked more internationally than any of her peers for many many many more years. I think she's tired, and is reaping the benefits of well raised children and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to ride ate at Taco Bell and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year the same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to right aid and Taco Bell. That's what she wants to do, she has earned the right to do it.
Wow, what a great post. I do not agree with everything you say but i do respect your view point.
You are right about Michael Masser but i did not want to bring up all the unsavoury stuff here. He was a very talented individual but he did have his personal problems. I think we are best to leave it that.

[TheMotownManiac]

First of all please excuse the bad grammar and incorrect wording occasionally in my posts right now as my right hand is in a cast and I have to dictate everything and it hurts like hell to correct mistakes The translator makes. Now that Michael mass or is gone, I felt it was OK, in this discussion, to discuss a well-known problem that he had in the industry. He eventually cleaned up however in the 80s and 90s he was in terrible terrible trouble. I have a distant cousin who was a buddy of Michael masters up until he passed, and he has told me incredible stories of the cocaine use in the record seen in LA in the 80s and 90s. I had no idea it was so rampant and widespread. But that is how I know that Diana stopped working with him, Why she stopped working with him, and how supportive and caring she was of him when he sought help. He never stopped loving her.

And of course I was not saying that Diana Ross doesn't have an ego. However, I truly believe that she knows what she wants to do and he is willing to take the consequences, good or bad for her professional decisions. As you probably know she is sensitive about this because of the problems she had with Barry Gordy and the comments about her being his puppet. To be perfectly honest, after leaving Motown, although her career certainly went downhill, it was still quite a career that most of her Motown peers would've killed for and today, at the age of 72, she has all the work she wants, all the money she needs, and the vast majority of her wealth came after she left Motown.

[TheMotownManiac]

And also blue Brock, if I haven't said this before, please know how much I cherish your involvement in this group, respect everything you have to say, respect the fact that you are sometimes between a rock and a hard place between what you would like to say and what you feel you should not say, and I just want you to know I appreciate you very very very very much – as I'm sure everyone else here does! It's funny, I've gotten to know most of the Supremes fairly well – especially Mary and Cindy, yet although I do get an occasional wave or hello from Diana from the stage, I've never had a chance to really talk to her and for this reason I love your input all the more!

[Ollie9]

[QUOTE=mpn1jco;348851]When Marvin Gaye, the Jacksons, and Stevie Wonder took creative control of their career they created masterpiece after masterpiece. When Ross took creative control of her career she trashed her recording career with mediocre and subpar product.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In fairness to Diana, she is not a musician or a songwriter in the vein of Stevie and Marvin. Stevie Wonders brilliant creative period cooled after HTJ and i really don't think Marvin ever topped WGO or LGIO. Diana's extraodinary talents lay elsewhere.
After 2 awful albums and 1 weak one she began to find her feet and to my ears made some bloody good music. Whether they sold in bucketloads to a fickle record buying public or not is irrelevant. They are something she can feel proud of and in the end only add to her legacy
"I Love You was a misstep which i am sure she would be the first to admit. I for one am glad she never went down the songbook route, but do agree a dance album would have been a great idea.

[mpn1jco]

Well I disagree completely that Diana Ross's career when a wall because of her ego. She didn't have to have creative control of every movie she made she was all set to do witches of East wick until she and Arne decide to have children And her part went to Susan Sarandon at the last minute. She would've had no creative control in that. Her career went south because her records were no good: she had complete control over red hot rhythm and blues and it's the worst thing she ever did. She had very little control over working overtime and it was a worldwide flop. She had total control over force behind the power and although it did well overseas, there was nothing on it for the United States. She had no control over that yeah but llama sessions for take me higher, and from what I've read about working with Nick Martinelli she had very little to say With him as well, and, the most admit it's among the best thing she ever did there were no real hits on it. She had total creative control on every day is a new day and it was a disaster sales wise, however she never promoted it at all. She had total control over I love you but other than the initial launch never promoted it and never mentioned it in her concerts that I saw.

not every artist is like share who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not not every artist is like Cher who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not. I admire Miss Ross for not recording things that she doesn't want to sing, if it hits she would have to put it in her act and then Sing-a-Song she doesn't like. Why would she want to do that at this period of her alive? She needs no money, she's already a living legend She has nothing else to prove to anyone. Charlie Chaplin continue to make the kind of movies he wanted to make even though they weren't hitting anymore. He could've gone into a Preston foster film if he wanted to, but it he didn't . I personally think you're mixing artistic integrity with ego, and I do feel that they are mutually exclusive of each other. Diana Ross doesn't even try to have hit records – To my knowledge she never even promoted blue or mentioned it in her concerts and it got rave reviews.

And Michael master never refused to work with Diana Ross. Although I've heard that she did not approve of his heavy use of cocaine, The real reason is she wasn't liking the material he was giving her. She rejected rejected the greatest love of all nearly a decade before Whitney record of it. Yes she could I had a hit with it but what's the point if she doesn't like the song ? I think Diana Ross is probably the hardest working woman from her generation and a couple before and after as well she's probably spent more time in the studio than anyone, and certainly she has worked more internationally than any of her peers for many many many more years. I think she's tired, and is reaping the benefits of well raised children and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to ride ate at Taco Bell and, hopefully grandchildren, and she can go out and do your 50 shows a year the same show day in and day out and then spend the rest of the time hanging out with her family and friends going to right aid and Taco Bell. That's what she wants to do, she has earned the right to do it.
I contacted a friend of mine in the music industry. He is a Grammy award winner and I cannot mention his name. I stand corrected on the issue of Michael Masser. He wanted to work with Diana Ross in the eighties but she refused. The reason that circulated was because he was too precise and controlling in the studio. With a laugh, I was told that Diana could not have been too adverse to working with Cocaine addicts because Nile Rodgers was completely strung out when he produced Working Overtime.

Diana Ross had creative control over:

Why Do Fools Fall In Love
Silk Electric
Ross
Swept Away
Eaten Alive
Red Hot Rhythm and Blues
Every Day Is A New Day
I Love You

In the seventies, besides Ross, Masser only produced the The Greatest Soundtrack and Pipe Dreams Soundtrack for Gladys Knight., a song on Fifth Dimension, and a song on Thelma Houston album and that is it.

That Michael Masser was too precise and controlling in the studio maybe was just a smokescreen for Diana not liking his material and his cocaine use.

Interestingly, Michael Masser reached his commercial and artistic peak in the eighties, particularly during the time Ross was signed to RCA. Although Ross perhaps did not like his material, the following people did: Peabo Bryson, Roberta Flack, Whitney Houston, Glenn Medeiros, Natalie Cole, Jeffrey Osborne, Billy Preston and Syreeta Wright, Dionne Warwick, and Crystal Gayle all had hit singles under his direction. He contributed to hit albums by Neil Diamond, Thelma Houston, Dan Hill, Barry Manilow, Jane Oliver, Staci Lattisaw, Phyliss Hyman, Barbara Streisand, and Marily Mcoo and Billy Davis Jr. He also produced the soundtrack to the hit Gene Wilder/Richard Pryson film Stir Crazy in the eighties.


I admire Diana Ross over her artistic integrity over these albums. Rather than seeking hits to make her concerts a sing along , she recorded songs she wanted to sing regardless of their commercial potential. Look at the body of work she has amassed over 25 years ! Ross has been defending her artistic integrity for 25 years now - you go girl! A true inspiration. Where would I be without 'Girls' 'Shockwaves' 'Eaten Alive' 'We Are The Childeren of the World' 'Fool For You' 'Anywere I Run To' ' Goin Through The Motions' 'Take The Bitter With The Sweet' 'It's a A Wonderful Life' 'Back To The Future' 'This Magic Moment' and 'Sweet Nothings'.Hey this sounds like a great compilation album. It should simply be called Ross - Artist. I am sure nothing Masser had on his platter could replace those gems! These songs are like an audio valentine to her loyal fans, thanking them for the ongoing support.

[Bluebrock]

I contacted a friend of mine in the music industry. He is a Grammy award winner and I cannot mention his name. I stand corrected on the issue of Michael Masser. He wanted to work with Diana Ross in the eighties but she refused. The reason that circulated because he was too precise and controlling in the studio. With a laugh, I was told that Diana could not have been too adverse to working with Cocaine addicts because Nile Rodgers was strung out when he produced Working Overtime.

Diana Ross had creative control over:
Why Do Fools Fall In Love
Silk Electric
Ross
Swept Away
Eaten Alive
Red Hot Rhythm and Blues
Every Day Is A New Day
I Love You

I admire Diana Ross over her artistic integrity over these albums. Rather than seeking hits to make her concerts a sing along , she recorded songs she wanted sings regardless of their commercial potential. Look at the body of work she has amassed over 25 years ! Ross has been defending her artistic integrity for 25 years now - you go girl! A true inspiration.
We are treading on dodgy ground here. Masser had some allegedly strong songs for Diana but she wanted to produce them herself rather than by him. He quite understandably did not want that. It is not crystal clear to say that Diana refused to work with him. She wanted to, but she wanted to have creative control. She was too demanding, and she won't mind my saying that because she would agree. They could have made some classic songs in the 80's but alas it was not meant to be.
Nile was usually well behaved around Diana for the WO sessions, and she was happy to work with him in the hope that they could recreate the magic of the DIANA album. Alas we know only too well how that particular idea turned out........

[Ollie9]

I admire Diana Ross over her artistic integrity over these albums. Rather than seeking hits to make her concerts a sing along , she recorded songs she wanted to sing regardless of their commercial potential. Look at the body of work she has amassed over 25 years ! Ross has been defending her artistic integrity for 25 years now - you go girl! A true inspiration. Where would I be without 'Girls' 'Shockwaves' 'Eaten Alive' 'We Are The Childeren of the World' 'Fool For You' 'Anywere I Run To' ' Goin Through The Motions' 'Take The Bitter With The Sweet' 'It's a A Wonderful Life' 'Back To The Future' 'This Magic Moment' and 'Sweet Nothings'.Hey this sounds like a great compilation album. It should simply be called Ross - Artist. I am sure nothing Masser had on his platter could replace those gems! These songs are like an audio valentine to her loyal fans, thanking them for the ongoing support.

Virtually every artist has recorded some duff songs at various points in their career. It's not a hard thing to compile a worst of list, especially when that singer has been recording for 5 decades.
Call me old fashioned but i have an inkling you are not so keen on our Diana.....Tell truths now.

[mpn1jco]

[ QUOTE\]
not every artist is like Shere who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not not every artist is like Cher who will record something she hates just for the sake of getting a hit. Barbra Streisand wouldn't, Ross wouldn't many would not. I admire Miss Ross for not recording things that she doesn't want to sing, if it hits she would have to put it in her act and then Sing-a-Song she doesn't like.
[/QUOTE]
Streisand rejected Enough Is Enough and the theme for Main Event because she disliked them. A lot of work by the record company was needed to get her in the studio with Paul Jabara, with cajoling by her son being the icing on the cake. The incentive was these were going to be major hits that she would be a fool to pass up. If Streisand had her way she never would have made soft rock albums from 70 to 85. Clive Davis had to convince her that the commercial appeal for albums of standards were over, and if she intended to have a viable recording career she would have to make the switch. Also Streisand did not like the 7 minute opus 'Left In the Dark' but agreed to record it because the label felt the album Emotions [[ 1984) was lacking a monster it. After Steinman had struck platinum with Bonnie Tyler's Total Eclipse of the Heart and Making Love Out of Nothing At All - Air Supply, Streisand went along with the plan. After the relative failure of the album and single, she reevaluated her artistic integrity and went back to her roots with the Broadway Album.

I stand corrected on my Cher comments.
My friend in the industry told me that Cher was not a puppet with the Believe album. The original tracks were rock oriented and the complete album was released as a dance remix. However, she did participate in the remixes, particularly Believe. To say Cher did what she was told doesn't fully represent the situation. Cher surrounded herself with experts, and is able to take and apply constructive criticism.

Ross was not able to get the Josephine Baker project off the ground because she wanted to be the executive producer and executive director and all of the major studios refused her. It is interesting that Ross was going to relent control for the Witches of Eastwick, she wouldn't for any other offers in the eighties or any films since the Witches of Eastwick.

[mpn1jco]

Virtually every artist has recorded some duff songs at various points in their career. It's not a hard thing to compile a worst of list, especially when that singer has been recording for 5 decades.
Call me old fashioned but i have an inkling you are not so keen on our Diana.....Tell truths now.

I am not wolf in the forum. I have supported her all of my life. When all of my friends said they were through with her, I religiously purchased each of her albums the first day of release up and until I Love You. I avoided all the trash/crap books and refused to believe the bad publicity. However, last year I told a friend of mine that I loved Diana Ross. He told me he despised her and that she was a washed up has been, touring with her greatest hits. He told me he loved Streisand. I asked him why. He told me that he was age twelve and saved money from his paper route to go to the Boss tour. In appreciation, he purchased expensive flowers. When he tried to give them to her, her management threw them in the trash in front of him and said "Miss Ross does not accept flowers'. His best friend was working in an agency and they were all given instructions to not look at Miss Ross when she glided through the building . Unfortunately this woman looked up and said hello. She was fired. No one, and I mean no on is that fierce he told me.
My friend in the industry told me he had a friend who worked for her and when she was fired, Ross sent out hundreds of letters to blackball her.

There was a International Ross Website or whatever and the blogger stopped after Ross refused to allow herself to be filmed and simulcast for some international event whereas every artist before or since allowed it. He was sick of her at this point and stopped the site and his support.

At this point, after researching her and looking at her career choices and the outcomes, regardless of being made from artistic integrity , ego, or sheer stupidity [[ I firmly believe the latter is the all encompassing justification ) Enough is enough. I will listen and cherish parts, and I underscore parts, of her recording career and that is all. The sad reality in the US is that most of her fans are dead or jumped ship after the Motown years. I cannot imagine her selling more than 40 to 70,000 units at this point and it would take an act of God to reverse this trend.

No I am not a Ross hater sneaking into the forum to ignite emotions amongst her loyal fans with subversive comments. I feel I have a right, due to buying everything this woman has recorded to finally say enough is enough, and to air my complaints about this woman. I have had it with her . I have nothing else to say. I was looking at this forum seeking information on a possible new release or movie or whatever. I don't care anymore. She is too much of a fierce diva to return Tyler Perry's phone calls after he wrote a movie for her and masterminded what would have been an amazing soundtrack - the hell with you. You could have said thanks but no thanks. He reduced himself to airing his concern to the press. " I wish she would just do it" he said. All of her fans wish "she would just do it." After reading about all of the talented people who wanted to work with her but couldn't because of Miss Ross' terms or whatever disgusts me. Her legend is for the Motown years, not the post Motown years - let's keep it real folks. In sum, I firmly believe Ross has an ego the size of a football stadium and I am not supporting this anymore. I will buy expanded editions of old material but nothing new. You waited too long. I will not go to a Ross concert even if the tickets are free. Nor am I going to talk about albums 25 plus years old anymore, I have better things to do with my time. I am taking Ross' advice .....Then just walk away.

[TheMotownManiac]

I couldn't agree with you more about the apparent size of Miss Ross' ego. And it's been obvious from most of your musings that you have a fair amount of disdain for Diana, and you have absolutely every right to state how you feel as you did it in our respectful manner. I don't concur with many of the things that you said including the hit records the Dionne Warwick had with Michael Masser however, perhaps I missed that. My point is that if Diana wanted to give a creative control, in order to have bigger hit records, she would have. However, she chose to make the record she want to make and if that means she has a gigantic ego, so be it. If she made the worst records in the world, but those of the record she wanted to make, I feel she has every right to make those records, and I don't see it as a question of ego at all. In my opinion, after he began making hits with Whitney, and Diana wanted hits because her ego required hits, She would've worked with him. We can just disagree on this matter. The fact that you have just placed a lengthy list of many he said she said type of rumors, and suggested With quite a bit of sarcasm a collection of her worst, in my opinion, tracks that she produced, speaks volumes. If she's mean, horrible, voting for Trump and poisoning Halloween candy, She still has enough of the following to allow her to work when and how she pleases, and her fans continue to attend her shows. Even I Who vows never To attend her show again until she changes it, I find myself going to one or two every six months or so, because I still, enjoy her.

[mpn1jco]

I couldn't agree with you more about the apparent size of Miss Ross' ego. And it's been obvious from most of your musings that you have a fair amount of disdain for Diana, and you have absolutely every right to state how you feel as you did it in our respectful manner. I don't concur with many of the things that you said including the hit records the Dionne Warwick had with Michael Masser however, perhaps I missed that. My point is that if Diana wanted to give a creative control, in order to have bigger hit records, she would have. However, she chose to make the record she want to make and if that means she has a gigantic ego, so be it. If she made the worst records in the world, but those of the record she wanted to make, I feel she has every right to make those records, and I don't see it as a question of ego at all. In my opinion, after he began making hits with Whitney, and Diana wanted hits because her ego required hits, She would've worked with him. We can just disagree on this matter. The fact that you have just placed a lengthy list of many he said she said type of rumors, and suggested With quite a bit of sarcasm a collection of her worst, in my opinion, tracks that she produced, speaks volumes. If she's mean, horrible, voting for Trump and poisoning Halloween candy, She still has enough of the following to allow her to work when and how she pleases, and her fans continue to attend her shows. Even I Who vows never To attend her show again until she changes it, I find myself going to one or two every six months or so, because I still, enjoy her.


Michael Masser produced the studio tracks for Dionne's 1981 album Hot Live and Otherwise. The album reached number 72 pop and number 35 R & B. The first single was Some Changes Are For Good which went to 65 pop billboard, 43 R & B, and 23 Adult Contemporary. The second single, Theres A Long Road Ahead of Us did not chart at all. However, whenever Dionne performed this song live it received a standing ovation. She had a bitter feud with Clive Davis over it not being released as the first single and took to the media about it. I disagree with 95% of your posts, respectfully that is.

Diana has carved a career for herself incessantly playing small venues performing her hit singles, which I have no intention whatsoever of attending. Sadly, she can no longer do a tour playing large venues like Cher or Madonna anymore.

For all who responded to this negative turn in this thread I have the utmost respect for all you for handling this in a civil manner. This could have turned ugly but everyone acted like an adult. I have to work my way through this. Basically for the past twenty years I have received one crap album, no new movies, just these tours with the same set list since 1985. I have played all of the expanded editions and her body of work so much I can't do it anymore. The well has run dry. I've exhausted her body of work, nothing new is forthcoming except for a few more expanded editions [[ which i will buy ), no projects of new music in the horizon.For me, I need to move on. A friend of mine said Diana Ross is an addiction. I feel as though I have to break this habit. After supporting her faithfully I have earned the right to be candid, frank, and forthright about what I think about Ross. Ross enjoy your semi retirement and forum members who enjoy discussing her, as Ross said "Carry ON"

[Albator]

In 1989 Masser also produced two Streisand's recording. “Someone That I Used to Love,” and "Halfway through the night". Barbra was very unhappy with both and "halfway" is still unreleased.

[Ollie9]

I am not wolf in the forum. I have supported her all of my life. When all of my friends said they were through with her, I religiously purchased each of her albums the first day of release up and until I Love You. I avoided all the trash/crap books and refused to believe the bad publicity. However, last year I told a friend of mine that I loved Diana Ross. He told me he despised her and that she was a washed up has been, touring with her greatest hits. He told me he loved Streisand. I asked him why. He told me that he was age twelve and saved money from his paper route to go to the Boss tour. In appreciation, he purchased expensive flowers. When he tried to give them to her, her management threw them in the trash in front of him and said "Miss Ross does not accept flowers'. His best friend was working in an agency and they were all given instructions to not look at Miss Ross when she glided through the building . Unfortunately this woman looked up and said hello. She was fired. No one, and I mean no on is that fierce he told me.
My friend in the industry told me he had a friend who worked for her and when she was fired, Ross sent out hundreds of letters to blackball her.

There was a International Ross Website or whatever and the blogger stopped after Ross refused to allow herself to be filmed and simulcast for some international event whereas every artist before or since allowed it. He was sick of her at this point and stopped the site and his support.

At this point, after researching her and looking at her career choices and the outcomes, regardless of being made from artistic integrity , ego, or sheer stupidity [[ I firmly believe the latter is the all encompassing justification ) Enough is enough. I will listen and cherish parts, and I underscore parts, of her recording career and that is all. The sad reality in the US is that most of her fans are dead or jumped ship after the Motown years. I cannot imagine her selling more than 40 to 70,000 units at this point and it would take an act of God to reverse this trend.

No I am not a Ross hater sneaking into the forum to ignite emotions amongst her loyal fans with subversive comments. I feel I have a right, due to buying everything this woman has recorded to finally say enough is enough, and to air my complaints about this woman. I have had it with her . I have nothing else to say. I was looking at this forum seeking information on a possible new release or movie or whatever. I don't care anymore. She is too much of a fierce diva to return Tyler Perry's phone calls after he wrote a movie for her and masterminded what would have been an amazing soundtrack - the hell with you. You could have said thanks but no thanks. He reduced himself to airing his concern to the press. " I wish she would just do it" he said. All of her fans wish "she would just do it." After reading about all of the talented people who wanted to work with her but couldn't because of Miss Ross' terms or whatever disgusts me. Her legend is for the Motown years, not the post Motown years - let's keep it real folks. In sum, I firmly believe Ross has an ego the size of a football stadium and I am not supporting this anymore. I will buy expanded editions of old material but nothing new. You waited too long. I will not go to a Ross concert even if the tickets are free. Nor am I going to talk about albums 25 plus years old anymore, I have better things to do with my time. I am taking Ross' advice .....Then just walk away.

I think this post answers my question in full.
You do seem to have an awful lot of friends connected to M's Ross... Well lets say more then the average person might have. All thats missing from your account is the letter to her employees from 83 and we have a complete picture of how awful Diana Ross is, was and has been.
I agree with your wise sounding friend..... Perhaps it is time to move on.

Regards, Ollie.

[Albator]

Why complain or having resentment for things that you do not witnessed or don't personally suffer ?

[vgalindo]

I don't know why people are always complaining about how Diana Ross handles her career. I too would love new movies and new music but Diana Ross has given me so much in her career I can not complain. There are not many other artists that have such an abundance of albums that Diana has. And all the different types of music she has recorded. POP, R&B, Disco, Rock, Soul, Country, Jazz, Standards, Easy Listening, etc. What other artist has covered this many styles? I will love and support her forever. My life would not be the same without Diana Ross!

[midnightman]

I don't know why it seems when Diana is "bossy", it's her fault but Cher, Madonna and Barbra Streisand can be the same type of "bossy" and no one dares say it's their fault? Same with Aretha. It's only bad when the R&B-esque divas wanna run and call their own shots but others can be in control and it's quite alright. I don't get that. I do agree that if Diana had done a Euro dance-ish album like Cher, her career would've seen a revival. As it stood, Cher's Believe had a good mix of Euro dance, R&B, Latin-esque pop and adult contemporary. Diana's album was similar but the Euro dance featured on that album was bonus tracks as opposed to regular tracks on Cher's. Plus Motown wasn't putting their full support behind her though overseas she did real well up until Every Day is a New Day and even then NOYY went top ten in England mainly because of the Hex Hector mix.

[mpn1jco]

I think this post answers my question in full.
You do seem to have an awful lot of friends connected to M's Ross... Well lets say more then the average person might have. All thats missing from your account is the letter to her employees from 83 and we have a complete picture of how awful Diana Ross is, was and has been.
I agree with your wise sounding friend..... Perhaps it is time to move on.

Regards, Ollie.
2 friends that I mentioned in the post. I know you meant that sarcastically about knowing people who know Ross but I actually have more, which I will outline in the following:
The person who was fired for looking at her was a friend of a friend. I have a friend who is a Grammy award winner [[ Opera ) and have met many people in the industry through him. We have been best friends since 1984. When we met in a gay bar, he had just come from Europe for the video shoot of Eartha Kitt's I Love Men Video.
I was immediately invited to NYC, he said so he could show off this handsome stud. Although I was young and considered hot, I was well educated and had been accepted to an IVY League school. Therefore I was not treated like a trick and he could take me anywhere. The first day in NYC I had lunch with Randy Jones of the Village People. That evening I went to a party hosted by a stylist or whatever for EMI/ Capitol records. She talked about being in the studio and working with Sheena Easton for the 85 album produced by NILE RODGERS. She said Sheena looked better in the studio than she did on the cover album. I told her the album was awful and she explained in explicit detail why. I talked to her most of the evening and she constantly asked my friend when was I coming back to NYC. My friends ex - lover was at the party. He picked a piece of lint off my sweater and asked, "Is this Ivy League lint?" I was playing the New Ways But Love Stays album because I never heard it. He said I am controlling the music from herein and this crap is going off.
Now, the first questions I always asked were about Diana Ross whenever I met anyone connected with her. The kindest thing I will say is most people liked the Boss.

My friend was very, very, very close to Ashford Simpson and remains friends with Valerie Simpson. His best friend is one of the most celebrated opera divas ever. One hint is that she is attractive. This individual also owns two very popular restaurants in NYC. I have been a guest at his parties and have met quite a few celebrities in my day. A little research might indicate who this is. He had a best selling Martha Stewart style book. Another hint is the intro was written by one of the most celebrated jazz musicians alive today. His opinion of her is unprintable. However, he does like 'The Boss'. I also have a record company that specializes in reissues of vintage music, only big band, jazz, and singers of the great American Songbook. In addition I am a singer. My voice has been described as Barry White meets Frank Sinatra meets Billy Eckstine. If you like obscure, obscure jazz you might know who I am. It was through the encouragement and support of my friend that I started this company and it is successful.
I also know someone who was part of the stage crew for the Take Me Higher Tour.
Does, " I do not exist to you." ring a bell to anyone?

You never know who is in and is viewing these forums. At this point Ross has about 100,000 fans left in the States and God bless her and them all. The quote..then just walk away... is from Diana Ross' Touch Me In The Morning, and she is not my friend. Imagine that, sneaking into a gay bar on leave from a military academy, underage at that, and next thing I am in New York associating with Grammy Award Winners.

One thing I can be grateful for through the years is all the inside gossip that I have received - eat your heart out Ollie. Ollie I actually have more anecdotes about people I have met connected to Ross. Ollie, I know you're green with envy. Your post was almost viridescent.
Take this advice, my friend, from Summers Over by Sheena Easton:

"She waits for the sunand the people who comewith the hot summer dayseasy to rememberin a late septemberbut nobody told herthat the summer's over"

Cheers!

[Bluebrock]

2 friends that I mentioned in the post. I know you meant that sarcastically about knowing people who know Ross but I actually have more, which I will outline in the following:
The person who was fired for looking at her was a friend of a friend. I have a friend who is a Grammy award winner [[ Opera ) and have met many people in the industry through him. We have been best friends since 1984. When we met in a gay bar, he had just come from Europe for the video shoot of Eartha Kitt's I Love Men Video.
I was immediately invited to NYC, he said so he could show off this handsome stud. Although I was young and considered hot, I was well educated and had been accepted to an IVY League school. Therefore I was not treated like a trick and he could take me anywhere. The first day in NYC I had lunch with Randy Jones of the Village People. That evening I went to a party hosted by a stylist or whatever for EMI/ Capitol records. She talked about being in the studio and working with Sheena Easton for the 85 album produced by NILE RODGERS. She said Sheena looked better in the studio than she did on the cover album. I told her the album was awful and she explained in explicit detail why. I talked to her most of the evening and she constantly asked my friend when was I coming back to NYC. My friends ex - lover was at the party. He picked a piece of lint off my sweater and asked, "Is this Ivy League lint?" I was playing the New Ways But Love Stays album because I never heard it. He said I am controlling the music from herein and this crap is going off.
Now, the first questions I always asked were about Diana Ross whenever I met anyone connected with her. The kindest thing I will say is most people liked the Boss.

My friend was very, very, very close to Ashford Simpson and remains friends with Valerie Simpson. His best friend is one of the most celebrated opera divas ever. One hint is that she is attractive. This individual also owns two very popular restaurants in NYC. I have been a guest at his parties and have met quite a few celebrities in my day. A little research might indicate who this is. He had a best selling Martha Stewart style book. Another hint is the intro was written by one of the most celebrated jazz musicians alive today. His opinion of her is unprintable. However, he does like 'The Boss'. I also have a record company that specializes in reissues of vintage music, only big band, jazz, and singers of the great American Songbook. In addition I am a singer. My voice has been described as Barry White meets Frank Sinatra meets Billy Eckstine. If you like obscure, obscure jazz you might know who I am. It was through the encouragement and support of my friend that I started this company and it is successful.
I also know someone who was part of the stage crew for the Take Me Higher Tour.
Does, " I do not exist to you." ring a bell to anyone?

You never know who is in and is viewing these forums. At this point Ross has about 100,000 fans left in the States and God bless her and them all. The quote..then just walk away... is from Diana Ross' Touch Me In The Morning, and she is not my friend. Imagine that, sneaking into a gay bar on leave from a military academy, underage at that, and next thing I am in New York associating with Grammy Award Winners.

One thing I can be grateful for through the years is all the inside gossip that I have received - eat your heart out Ollie. Ollie I actually have more anecdotes about people I have met connected to Ross. Ollie, I know you're green with envy. Your post was almost viridescent.
Take this advice, my friend, from Summers Over by Sheena Easton:

"She waits for the sunand the people who comewith the hot summer dayseasy to rememberin a late septemberbut nobody told herthat the summer's over"

Cheers!
It is just possible we may have come across each other at some point. I am not going to criticise your post. You have your contacts. I have mine. I can name numerous celebrities who treated me far far worse than Diana Ross ever did. She was an absolute pussycat in comparison to certain divas whom i shall refrain from naming at the moment, but i do not see that you have any reason to lie so i shall not accuse you of doing so . Your posts are certainly not dull and it is good to hear other peoples experiences and points of view.
More revelations would be welcome.

[Ollie9]

2 friends that I mentioned in the post. I know you meant that sarcastically about knowing people who know Ross but I actually have more, which I will outline in the following:
The person who was fired for looking at her was a friend of a friend. I have a friend who is a Grammy award winner [[ Opera ) and have met many people in the industry through him. We have been best friends since 1984. When we met in a gay bar, he had just come from Europe for the video shoot of Eartha Kitt's I Love Men Video.
I was immediately invited to NYC, he said so he could show off this handsome stud. Although I was young and considered hot, I was well educated and had been accepted to an IVY League school. Therefore I was not treated like a trick and he could take me anywhere. The first day in NYC I had lunch with Randy Jones of the Village People. That evening I went to a party hosted by a stylist or whatever for EMI/ Capitol records. She talked about being in the studio and working with Sheena Easton for the 85 album produced by NILE RODGERS. She said Sheena looked better in the studio than she did on the cover album. I told her the album was awful and she explained in explicit detail why. I talked to her most of the evening and she constantly asked my friend when was I coming back to NYC. My friends ex - lover was at the party. He picked a piece of lint off my sweater and asked, "Is this Ivy League lint?" I was playing the New Ways But Love Stays album because I never heard it. He said I am controlling the music from herein and this crap is going off.
Now, the first questions I always asked were about Diana Ross whenever I met anyone connected with her. The kindest thing I will say is most people liked the Boss.

My friend was very, very, very close to Ashford Simpson and remains friends with Valerie Simpson. His best friend is one of the most celebrated opera divas ever. One hint is that she is attractive. This individual also owns two very popular restaurants in NYC. I have been a guest at his parties and have met quite a few celebrities in my day. A little research might indicate who this is. He had a best selling Martha Stewart style book. Another hint is the intro was written by one of the most celebrated jazz musicians alive today. His opinion of her is unprintable. However, he does like 'The Boss'. I also have a record company that specializes in reissues of vintage music, only big band, jazz, and singers of the great American Songbook. In addition I am a singer. My voice has been described as Barry White meets Frank Sinatra meets Billy Eckstine. If you like obscure, obscure jazz you might know who I am. It was through the encouragement and support of my friend that I started this company and it is successful.
I also know someone who was part of the stage crew for the Take Me Higher Tour.
Does, " I do not exist to you." ring a bell to anyone?

You never know who is in and is viewing these forums. At this point Ross has about 100,000 fans left in the States and God bless her and them all. The quote..then just walk away... is from Diana Ross' Touch Me In The Morning, and she is not my friend. Imagine that, sneaking into a gay bar on leave from a military academy, underage at that, and next thing I am in New York associating with Grammy Award Winners.

One thing I can be grateful for through the years is all the inside gossip that I have received - eat your heart out Ollie. Ollie I actually have more anecdotes about people I have met connected to Ross. Ollie, I know you're green with envy. Your post was almost viridescent.
Take this advice, my friend, from Summers Over by Sheena Easton:

"She waits for the sunand the people who comewith the hot summer dayseasy to rememberin a late septemberbut nobody told herthat the summer's over"

Cheers!

And you accuse Diana of having an inflated ego!!!!! How good looking are you now on a scale of 1 to 10????. I'm sure every Ross fan is dying to know.
Your right, I'm so green with envy i can hardly contain myself.........Yawn.
In your previous messages you state that as a fan you are through with Diana. If that is so why take the time to keep posting sarcastic comments about her, telling us how folk in the industry think she is awful??. I would really love to know.

[mpn1jco]

And you accuse Diana of having an inflated ego!!!!! How good looking are you now on a scale of 1 to 10????. I'm sure every Ross fan is dying to know.
Your right, I'm so green with envy i can hardly contain myself.........Yawn.
In your previous messages you state that as a fan you are through with Diana. If that is so why take the time to keep posting sarcastic comments about her, telling us how folk in the industry think she is awful??. I would really love to know.
Ollie, apparently I touched a nerve. I am only stating what was said about me at age 19 regarding an invitation to NYC from a second, and influential party. I didn't say that I looked good, that was the consensus of my influential friend. That was stated only to illustrate how being at the right place at the right time can open doors for you, not talent. Since you posted your comments sarcastically inferring I was lying about my connections in the music industry, and my response, I have not posted any comments about how industry folk think she is awful. I made a post that a team should revisit why America fell in love with her and fell out of love with her as the key for her having a successful album. They were gentle compared to your recent posts on how awful some of her albums are.

My recent comments were directed to BlueRock and not you, Ollie. Diana's greatest hit albums were when someone wrote and composed an album about what is going on with her life. In her most successful years, she incorporated recent Broadway songs in her act. Maybe someone needs to write for her. Maybe a team needs to create a new show for her. These were just food for thought on what has worked in the past. I deliberately refrained from sarcasm.

You have vividly illustrated my points directed to you. Ollie, leave it alone and move on. You are making yourself look silly at this point. I don't respond to your posts - you don't respond to mine from herein. When you become angry your judgement and insight are clearly impaired. Take the high road on this one and in the future don't let your colors show - it isn't flattering. Ollie, that is Diva 101! You need to make Miss Ross proud on this one.

'telling US" "I'm sure EVERY Ross fan wants to know"

Although you are purporting to be a collectve spokesperson for the forum, I have received messages from members encouraging me to continue to post, so I have. A red flag should be raised for anyone who takes a forum and acts as though it is their territory or it is their clique or that they represent the collective opinion of the members or that an opinionated poster is an 'outsider' . The fact that you acted in this manner speaks volumes about you. I will not discuss the implications this behavior represents because Ollie, that is Psych 101!

Answering your vulgar question that "EVERY ROSS FAN WANTS TO KNOW" , I went out with a friend of mine last week. He told me at least three people told him your friend is hot. I said really? He said you need to pull your head out of the sand.

Cheers!

[captainjames]

I think Diana Ross will always be known as the QUEEN of Motown. There are people who dislike her and there are people who love her.

[mpn1jco]

I think Diana Ross will always be known as the QUEEN of Motown. There are people who dislike her and there are people who love her.

There are fans like myself who have a love / hate relationship with the Queen of Motown. We have purchased everything she has ever recorded and/ or seen her every chance they can get and get upset with her at times with her career choices. I am not the only fan who wished Ross would have accepted the OWN/Tyler Perry project. I am not the only fan who wished Ross would have worked with Masser and Vandross. Perhaps I am the only one who talked about it in such a passionate manner in this forum.

We complain at times but still regard her as the QUEEN. With that, I think I'll go listen to my favorite Ross songs
To Love Again, Ask Any Girl, After You, Sparkle, Didn't You Know You Have To Cry Sometime, I Won't Last A Day Without You, All For One, and That's How You Start Over.

[vgalindo]

I think Diana Ross will always be known as the QUEEN of Motown. There are people who dislike her and there are people who love her.
Yes. And I am the fan that loves her. I have spend tons of money on Diana Ross. Been buying her tickets since 1980 and have seen her live more times than I can count. I have every album, CD, dolls, posters, 45s, books, videos, laserdisc, DVDs, tee shirts, magazines, etc. And I probably have multiple copies of most. And I don't feel she owes me a thing. She has given me so much. I really can't complain!!

[mpn1jco]

Yes. And I am the fan that loves her. I have spend tons of money on Diana Ross. Been buying her tickets since 1980 and have seen her live more times than I can count. I have every album, CD, dolls, posters, 45s, books, videos, laserdisc, DVDs, tee shirts, magazines, etc. And I probably have multiple copies of most. And I don't feel she owes me a thing. She has given me so much. I really can't complain!!
With all of the expanded editions, it is clear that she has spent more time in the studio than most. She has given us a lot, more than most. Maybe the fans in the middle are selfish and want MORE AND MORE AND MORE. I think I'll go listen to SELFISH ONE.

[Albator]

Answering your vulgar question that "EVERY ROSS FAN WANTS TO KNOW" , I went out with a friend of mine last week. He told me at least three people told him your friend is hot. I said really? He said you need to pull your head out of the sand.

Cheers!A picture of you would be welcome at this point :rolleyes:

[Bluebrock]

Ollie, apparently I touched a nerve. I am only stating what was said about me at age 19 regarding an invitation to NYC from a second, and influential party. I didn't say that I looked good, that was the consensus of my influential friend. That was stated only to illustrate how being at the right place at the right time can open doors for you, not talent. Since you posted your comments sarcastically inferring I was lying about my connections in the music industry, and my response, I have not posted any comments about how industry folk think she is awful. I made a post that a team should revisit why America fell in love with her and fell out of love with her as the key for her having a successful album. They were gentle compared to your recent posts on how awful some of her albums are.

My recent comments were directed to BlueRock and not you, Ollie. Diana's greatest hit albums were when someone wrote and composed an album about what is going on with her life. In her most successful years, she incorporated recent Broadway songs in her act. Maybe someone needs to write for her. Maybe a team needs to create a new show for her. These were just food for thought on what has worked in the past. I deliberately refrained from sarcasm.

You have vividly illustrated my points directed to you. Ollie, leave it alone and move on. You are making yourself look silly at this point. I don't respond to your posts - you don't respond to mine from herein. When you become angry your judgement and insight are clearly impaired. Take the high road on this one and in the future don't let your colors show - it isn't flattering. Ollie, that is Diva 101! You need to make Miss Ross proud on this one.

'telling US" "I'm sure EVERY Ross fan wants to know"

Although you are purporting to be a collectve spokesperson for the forum, I have received messages from members encouraging me to continue to post, so I have. A red flag should be raised for anyone who takes a forum and acts as though it is their territory or it is their clique or that they represent the collective opinion of the members or that an opinionated poster is an 'outsider' . The fact that you acted in this manner speaks volumes about you. I will not discuss the implications this behavior represents because Ollie, that is Psych 101!

Answering your vulgar question that "EVERY ROSS FAN WANTS TO KNOW" , I went out with a friend of mine last week. He told me at least three people told him your friend is hot. I said really? He said you need to pull your head out of the sand.

Cheers!
This is a great thread and I for one am very interested in reading your thoughts and opinions. I don't think you are being disrespectful here. You are merely telling your side of the story, and whilst I might not agree with all that you say I respect your right to say it. I count myself fortunate to have been a friend of Diana Ross. So many of my idols have turned out to be huge disappointments and I was very reluctant to work with Diana having heard all the horror stories, and I did not want to tarnish my memories of a lady who had given me so much for the first 25 years of my life. My first couple of meetings with her were difficult. I was nervous and anxious, and it actually took one of her tantrums for us to really bond. We were promoting the WORKING OVERTIME album which I thought was a steaming pile of pig poo but I did not dare say anything bad about it. Diana was scheduled to perform the title track on the Terry Wogan UK chat show. She rehearsed the song several times before finally declaring there was no way she was going to sing this pile of sh*t on live TV. everyone panicked . We had less than 10 hours to go before the live show. It was up to me to attempt to calm her down. I asked her what was her favourite song on the album. She said she hated it all and asked me for my opinion on it. I told her I hated it too and after a worrying few seconds of silence we both burst into laughter. She agreed to perform THIS HOUSE , and thereafter we became great friends. Since then she has shown my family and myself great kindness, and we worked together on dozens of occasions both here in the UK and all around the world.
I am not saying what you say is untrue, but I just wanted to put my side of the story forward. Thank you for listening.

[Ollie9]

Ollie, apparently I touched a nerve. I am only stating what was said about me at age 19 regarding an invitation to NYC from a second, and influential party. I didn't say that I looked good, that was the consensus of my influential friend. That was stated only to illustrate how being at the right place at the right time can open doors for you, not talent. Since you posted your comments sarcastically inferring I was lying about my connections in the music industry, and my response, I have not posted any comments about how industry folk think she is awful. I made a post that a team should revisit why America fell in love with her and fell out of love with her as the key for her having a successful album. They were gentle compared to your recent posts on how awful some of her albums are.

My recent comments were directed to BlueRock and not you, Ollie. Diana's greatest hit albums were when someone wrote and composed an album about what is going on with her life. In her most successful years, she incorporated recent Broadway songs in her act. Maybe someone needs to write for her. Maybe a team needs to create a new show for her. These were just food for thought on what has worked in the past. I deliberately refrained from sarcasm.

You have vividly illustrated my points directed to you. Ollie, leave it alone and move on. You are making yourself look silly at this point. I don't respond to your posts - you don't respond to mine from herein. When you become angry your judgement and insight are clearly impaired. Take the high road on this one and in the future don't let your colors show - it isn't flattering. Ollie, that is Diva 101! You need to make Miss Ross proud on this one.

'telling US" "I'm sure EVERY Ross fan wants to know"

Although you are purporting to be a collectve spokesperson for the forum, I have received messages from members encouraging me to continue to post, so I have. A red flag should be raised for anyone who takes a forum and acts as though it is their territory or it is their clique or that they represent the collective opinion of the members or that an opinionated poster is an 'outsider' . The fact that you acted in this manner speaks volumes about you. I will not discuss the implications this behavior represents because Ollie, that is Psych 101!

Answering your vulgar question that "EVERY ROSS FAN WANTS TO KNOW" , I went out with a friend of mine last week. He told me at least three people told him your friend is hot. I said really? He said you need to pull your head out of the sand.

Cheers!

Ooops! I think i might be the one to have hit a nerve lol.

You are right of course, EVERYONE has the right to post their feelings and opinions. It is certainly no crime at all to dislike Diana Ross.
I was just really curious by the fact that you had previously posted that your "now done with Diana Ross" [[your words) yet continue to post avidly about her.......... Innocent enough question.
Regarding being green with envy of your glittering social life.... My ex is best friends with a very well known actor and costume designer. I have attended many a celeb party over the years, but was never really interested in listening to gossip and hearsay. Still it's a big world and we are all made different.
I agree, perhaps it is best we make a point of not to responding to each others posts anymore. After all, it should all be about the music.

Regards, Ollie.

P.S I'm sure you still look lovely.

[Albator]

I'm not the Diana Ross fan I use to be, but I appreciate very much reading a lot of forumers here.
I especially appreciate the fact that we'r able to say, "i like WO to the max" or "I hate this one" and all ...
I think Ollie is very interesting and her[[his?) posts give new lights on songs or albums. Well I still don't like WO at all, but it's not a problem.

[mpn1jco]

Ooops! I think i might be the one to have hit a nerve lol.

You are right of course, EVERYONE has the right to post their feelings and opinions. It is certainly no crime at all to dislike Diana Ross.
I was just really curious by the fact that you had previously posted that your "now done with Diana Ross" [[your words) yet continue to post avidly about her.......... Innocent enough question.
Regarding being green with envy of your glittering social life.... My ex is best friends with a very well known actor and costume designer. I have attended many a celeb party over the years, but was never really interested in listening to gossip and hearsay. Still it's a big world and we are all made different.
I agree, perhaps it is best we make a point of not to responding to each others posts anymore. After all, it should all be about the music.

Regards, Ollie.

P.S I'm sure you still look lovely.
LOL
Ollie, Are you retarded or what?
There should be an online campaign "Don't Post Drunk"

Cheers

[Roberta75]

LOL
Ollie, Are you retarded or what?
There should be an online campaign "Don't Post Drunk"

Cheers

Ollies been In this here forum for a long time and calling Ollie retarded is real rude and real offensive. The word retard and retarderd should be considered hate speech IMO. If youve got someone with learning disabilities it's very offensive. Your new here and im not sure that most folks here appreciate name calling.

Roberta

[mpn1jco]

Ollies been In this here forum for a long time and calling Ollie retarded is real rude and real offensive. The word retard and retarderd should be considered hate speech IMO. If youve got someone with learning disabilities it's very offensive. Your new here and im not sure that most folks here appreciate name calling.

Roberta
Again, I ask, Ollie - are you retarded or what? It's a question that WE ARE all questioning. Every Ross fan wants to know.

[Ollie9]

Thank you so much for your very kind words Albator and Roberta. They really do mean a lot to me.
I don't intend to reply to this person. He has now revealed what kind of a character he really is. Something i suspected from his first post.

[mpn1jco]

Thank you so much for your very kind words Albator and Roberta. They really do mean a lot to me.
I don't intend to reply to this person. He has now revealed what kind of a character he really is. Something i suspected from his first post.
Ollie,
This was an experiment. I imitated your character, turning up the flame a bit. So now I know how to cease troublemakers like you - imitate them. Sad that I had to resort to this to cease your behavior -- I had to sink to your level. I am deeply touched that this experiment was successful and your feedback lets me know this. Length of time in this forum does not mean much, because you have several senior members like Ollie who are completely out of control - starting feuds, posting sarcastic comments, and then posting under several avatars so they have 'alleged' support for their outrageous behavior. There is much lunacy in this forum. It is really pathetic.

[Bluebrock]

Ollie,
This was an experiment. I imitated your character, turning up the flame a bit. So now I know how to cease troublemakers like you - imitate them. Sad that I had to resort to this to cease your behavior -- I had to sink to your level. I am deeply touched that this experiment was successful and your feedback lets me know this. Length of time in this forum does not mean much, because you have several senior members like Ollie who are completely out of control - starting feuds, posting sarcastic comments, and then posting under several avatars so they have 'alleged' support for their outrageous behavior. There is much lunacy in this forum. It is really pathetic.
I think we all need to step back here and calm down. We should be able to get out opinions across without resorting to cheap insults. I have been guilty of it myself when a certain member has goaded me. It solves nothing, so let us please continue what is a fascinating discussion in a mature and dignified manner. We all have a right to express an opinion. Personally i am loving the diversity of this particular thread and want to hear more from Ollie, Mpn1jco, Albator, David etc etc. There is so much to discuss ,so let;s discuss, and many thanks to my very dear friend Roberta for as always being the voice of reason. Much love and respect coming your way as always.

[Albator]

yes, I agree.
By the way, on TMH, I regret "If you not love me" wasn't the lead single. I'm crazy about that one, like I am for "to many nights" and "only love".

[ChainReaction]

I am old school Diana Ross. I don't listen to anything after Endless Love and the last concert I went to is for the Boss. I can't contribute to the topic of this thread but I can comment on the turn of events. I am a member of forums of several DIVAS. The behavior in this thread is unique and widespread to Diana Ross fans. All over this forum are deleted threads and banned members because of bickering feuding and fightin. This is why Diana Ross fans are not respected. Same old story - someone criticizes Diana Ross and those fans are comin for ya! And don't mention Mary Wilson, honey we will have World War 3,4,5, and 6. I just say I am old school Diana Ross and keep it movin. When I launch my career and become the ultimate DIVA I want the loyal fans Diana Ross has, but I need enough of them to sell records.

[Bluebrock]

yes, I agree.
By the way, on TMH, I regret "If you not love me" wasn't the lead single. I'm crazy about that one, like I am for "to many nights" and "only love".
I loved it too. It should have followed the title track as the 2nd single. There are some fab mixes of it too that should hopefully appear on the expanded version.

[midnightman]

yes, I agree.
By the way, on TMH, I regret "If you not love me" wasn't the lead single. I'm crazy about that one, like I am for "to many nights" and "only love".

What? You mean "If You're Not Gonna Love Me Right"? Yeah, that song was strong as a single release IMHO... I love that song. It's probably my favorite of the post-Endless Love material DR put out...

[captainjames]

"If You Are Not Going To Love Me Right" was the jam.

[captainjames]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-nscg7L-ak

[midnightman]

^ Love that performance!

[Bluebrock]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-nscg7L-ak
Wonderful performance of an excellent song. I was with her when she did Jay Leno and Letterman within a week of each other. She was in great form on and off camera and we had some pretty memorable experiences during this period. I shall say no more............

[captainjames]

ahhhh I wish you would share but I understand you keeping them to yourself.