What Is Left In The Vaults For Diana Ross / Supremes ?

[mpn1jco]

What possible expanded editions can be released at this point ? From reading the threads I know that Take Me Higher, Force Behind The Power, and A Go Go are possible candidates. I would appreciate it if someone would post in response to this post a realistic wish list.

[Bluebrock]

What possible expanded editions can be released at this point ? From reading the threads I know that Take Me Higher, Force Behind The Power, and A Go Go are possible candidates. I would appreciate it if someone would post in response to this post a realistic wish list.
Literally dozens of live shows were recorded so technically there could be expanded versions of all the DRATS albums along with what few alternate takes are still gathering dust in the vaults. However i don't see that happening. Maybe we shall get the disney album soon , but otherwise not much more than your suggestions.

[mpn1jco]

Literally dozens of live shows were recorded so technically there could be expanded versions of all the DRATS albums along with what few alternate takes are still gathering dust in the vaults. However i don't see that happening. Maybe we shall get the disney album soon , but otherwise not much more than your suggestions.
Thanks for the response. Here is my wishlist:
1. Ross 78
2. A Go A Go
3. Disney Album
4. Live At Caesar's Palace
5. Force Behind The Power
6. Take Me Higher

I think the expanded editions have slowed down because the well has almost run dry.
“I actually know what’s in store, but I can’t share,” Taraborrelli teased. “But I can say this: there’s a lot of stuff! There are Diana Ross & the Supremes [[http://www.rollingstone.com/music/artists/diana-ross-and-the-supremes/biography) songs in the vaults that fans have not heard yet, and the same holds true for pretty much all of the artists at Motown. If the fans continue to demand the material, and be vocal about it, then it will surface.”
“Some Motown fans are against the notion of digital releases,” Taraborrelli continued. “They demand CD releases, and they’ve made an issue of this by saying that they’re not buying any product that’s not released on CD. That’s not the position to take. By not supporting this album, or any of the other digital releases that have come out of Motown, the message that’s being sent is that nobody wants this stuff.”
“Those of us of a certain age are going to just have to surrender to the fact that CDs are on the way out, and there’s nothing we can do about that,” Taraborrelli continued, “the same way we had to surrender to the fact that we weren’t going to be able to get our vinyl or our cassette tapes. If we draw a line in the sand and say we’re not buying digital releases, we’re not going to get ANY releases.”

[Motown Eddie]

Thanks for the response. Here is my wishlist:
1. Ross 78
2. A Go A Go
3. Disney Album
4. Live At Caesar's Palace
5. Force Behind The Power
6. Take Me Higher

I think the expanded editions have slowed down because the well has almost run dry.
“I actually know what’s in store, but I can’t share,” Taraborrelli teased. “But I can say this: there’s a lot of stuff! There are Diana Ross & the Supremes [[http://www.rollingstone.com/music/artists/diana-ross-and-the-supremes/biography) songs in the vaults that fans have not heard yet, and the same holds true for pretty much all of the artists at Motown. If the fans continue to demand the material, and be vocal about it, then it will surface.”
“Some Motown fans are against the notion of digital releases,” Taraborrelli continued. “They demand CD releases, and they’ve made an issue of this by saying that they’re not buying any product that’s not released on CD. That’s not the position to take. By not supporting this album, or any of the other digital releases that have come out of Motown, the message that’s being sent is that nobody wants this stuff.”
“Those of us of a certain age are going to just have to surrender to the fact that CDs are on the way out, and there’s nothing we can do about that,” Taraborrelli continued, “the same way we had to surrender to the fact that we weren’t going to be able to get our vinyl or our cassette tapes. If we draw a line in the sand and say we’re not buying digital releases, we’re not going to get ANY releases.”

Okay then, I'll be vocal and say that I'll support digital releases for any of the Classic Motown acts. One thing I'd like to see is with these would be a 'digital booklet' with notes and info about the songs [[like the one that was done the Deluxe Edition of 'Funny Girl').

[mpn1jco]

Okay then, I'll be vocal and say that I'll support digital releases for any of the Classic Motown acts. One thing I'd like to see is with these would be a 'digital booklet' with notes and info about the songs [[like the one that was done the Deluxe Edition of 'Funny Girl').

The music industry was very different the 10 - 15 years ago when Hip-O Select started. That was still the era of the deluxe box set.

The problem I have with digital downloads is that the booklets are not available. The audience that is supporting these releases is equally as interested in the booklets as the from the vault tracks. For those of us who missed the original expanded edition releases, access to those booklets is not possible with digital downloads. I think an effort should be made to meet the "niche" audience halfway.

Bluerock, I have enjoyed your posts. I have read all of the salacious books on Diana Ross, seeking information on her music, not her personal life. You have answered most of the questions I was seeking to be answered about her music.

[carlo]

It's a shame...I agree with the point made that the music industry has changed so much from a decade ago. I wonder how many original unreleased songs are left in the vault? It seems to be what many fans want the most [[ie. Diana Ross' Blue album, which sold very well). As much as I and others love the unreleased alternate tracks and mixes, as well as live recordings...they seem to have even less appeal with many fans unfortunately. I get the sense that's mostly what's left in the vaults in regards to the 60s Supremes, along with some not so good recordings, per Andy's remarks in the Let the Music Play liner notes. Although I also get the sense there isn't much left for Diana's Motown solo output as well, in terms of original material. I would love more Expanded Editions though!

[carlo]

I felt I should add there is still an active, passionate fan base out there for Diana Ross and The Supremes, solo and collectively. I see them and meet them at the concerts and many of them travel far and wide to see our favourite ladies. If only we could find a way to tap that passion and translate it into something that would get the music releases going again. These people exist...but I think part of it is that everyone is tired of fighting. I had a Supremes site for years and tried with various petitions and things and always seemed to get some kind of push back from Universal and other fans. Others have tried doing the same. Life goes on. Wish we could be getting more new music but...

[sup_fan]

i think everyone is over reacting a bit here. just last Nov we got the "Diana Ross Sings Songs from the Wiz" unreleased set and then in Deb we got an expanded Xmas set with the Sups which included alt versions of several of the tracks. and earlier in 2015 all of the RCA albums were released and expanded.

stop bitching and acting like it's been eons since anything was released. cuz it ain't true!

2001 - Diana Anthology
2002 - 70s Anthology
2002 - R&H complete recordings
2002 - Diana 70 expanded edition
2003 - #1's
2003 - Diana 1980 expanded
2003 - To Love Again expanded
2004 - There's a Place For Us released
2004 - Sups & Tempts complete duets
2004 - Where Did Our Love Go expanded
2006 - Blue
2006 - Reflections dvd set
2006 - Jean Terrell box set
2007 - Last Time I Saw Him expanded
2008 - Everything is Everything expanded
2008 - Surrender expanded
2008 - Lost & Found Sups
2009 - Magnificent duets
2009 - Touch Me in the AM expanded
2010 - meet Sups expanded set
2011 - Sups on Ed Sullivan dvd
2011 - Let Yourself Go set
2011 - 50th Anniver Singles set
2011 - More hits expanded
2012 - I Hear A Symphony expanded
2012 - Copa expanded
2012 - Ross expanded
2014 - rerelease of all Sups and Diana lps
2014 - Baby It's me expanded
2014 - Funny Girl
2015 - Diana RCA albums expanded editions
2015 - Diana Wiz
2015 - Sup Merry Xmas

[Bluebrock]

The music industry was very different the 10 - 15 years ago when Hip-O Select started. That was still the era of the deluxe box set.

The problem I have with digital downloads is that the booklets are not available. The audience that is supporting these releases is equally as interested in the booklets as the from the vault tracks. For those of us who missed the original expanded edition releases, access to those booklets is not possible with digital downloads. I think an effort should be made to meet the "niche" audience halfway.

Bluerock, I have enjoyed your posts. I have read all of the salacious books on Diana Ross, seeking information on her music, not her personal life. You have answered most of the questions I was seeking to be answered about her music.
Thank you for your kind comments which are greatly appreciated. I shall attempt to continue answering your questions to the best of my ability. Thank you again.

[carlo]

Quite an amazing list, thanks Sup_Fan. I didn't really realize how many releases we've been blessed to have, until seeing it all listed out. Years ago, as a young fan, I used to hope I could one day have everything on CD and that dream has almost been fulfilled. When you consider all of these releases, along with the invention of iTunes, Spotify and YouTube, we are truly blessed to have so much accessibility to a wealth of music and media.

[sup_fan]

now this isn't to say that i don't want them to continue reissues :) i'd like to have everything in the vault!

other than the live stuff and Disney, i wonder how much 60s material is really left. Since they've gone ahead and re-released the various studio albums, i wonder if there's a need for Expanded Editions of Reflections or Cream of the Crop. if there are just a handful of random tracks left, might make more sense to do another L&F. sort of a one and done

[bradsupremes]

Andy and George have said these gaps between releases have allowed them to mine the vault for more unreleased tracks. They have said they have found several unreleased recordings with vocals on them that originally were believed not to have them. Of course there are alternate vocals, alternate versions, different versions, etc. Those are sometimes more fun to hear.

Don't forget there are still 70's Supremes unreleased tracks with enough to fill a Lost & Found.

[greg jones]

Andy and George have said these gaps between releases have allowed them to mine the vault for more unreleased tracks. They have said they have found several unreleased recordings with vocals on them that originally were believed not to have them. Of course there are alternate vocals, alternate versions, different versions, etc. Those are sometimes more fun to hear.

Don't forget there are still 70's Supremes unreleased tracks with enough to fill a Lost & Found.

Everyone... also keep this in mind to complete the reissue series on the Supremes. We are rapidly coming to the end of the time where there were 2 mixes for every album. One stereo and One monaural. A Go Go had mono and Sing HDH had mono. Not sure if Reflections was true mono or just a fold down as was the promo of Love Child. With that in mind, there probably no need for the 1967 and on onward albums expanded editions to be 2 discs. 1 disc can still hold several alternate mixes and the few unreleased that are left.

As far as the booklets, yes i too love all the info and the pix, though when the cd's come, it is frustrating to have to get a magnifier out to read them. Andy & George have both expressed a continuing interest in writing about there and maybe the booklets will now have to take book form. I, for one, wouldn't mind shelling out a few bucks for nice several page books on each release, provided that I can buy the music from digital sources and in cd quality.

Additionally, I do have faith that Andy & George will be able to get some limited edition cd releases through other sources. One of their big obstacles at the moment is getting Universal to allow the studio time for remastering.

[Motown Eddie]

The music industry was very different the 10 - 15 years ago when Hip-O Select started. That was still the era of the deluxe box set.



And yet, there are still Deluxe CD [[and vinyl) Box Sets coming out [[there are box sets coming later this year from Otis Redding, Pink Floyd, The Rolling Stones, King Crimson, David Bowie). Also, Led Zeppelin has seen their entire catalog get 'the Deluxe Treatment'. I feel the real changes came when Universal acquired Capitol and they decided to go with either online downloads or vinyl re-releases of the Motown catalog.

[sup_fan]

i'm not aware of ANY musical group that has received over 30 expanded and re-released album sets. Yes Pink Floyd, the Stones, etc have receive the occasional CD set on some of their top and/or historic albums. But remember, those albums might have gone to #1 and been on the charts for weeks. The early Sups albums did very well and we've received those as sets. But later Sup albums and the 70s stuff didn't sell nearly as strongly

again, i'd love to get more things from the vault. but i'm not so foolish as to insist on a specific format. Frankly i'd rather have the unheard track or the interesting data points regardless of the format.

[daviddh]

If it happens.great.but want to know why the Supremes are such top secret.why not just say A Go Go coming fall 2016.simple

[marybrewster]

I can appreciate everyone's sentiments about digital-only releases. I personally am a physical-only kind of girl.

What I think some are forgetting is, not everyone is digital-only capable. I think of my parents, who were of the Supremes era. My Mom has a computer, and an Android phone. Outside of the ability to check Facebook and email, that's about where her ability lies. My Dad still has a flip-phone.

I work in an industry that is very "online". The majority of my customers are seniors. I feel safe saying that for every one that has the ability to go online, there's another that does not.

Now, clearly these "expanded editions" are for the super-fan. Your casual fan might buy a "Greatest Hits" collection, and be satisfied. HOWEVER, having just been at a Diana concert, I can GUARANTEE that if there had been a PHYSICAL copy of "A Go Go" for sale, they would have sold. You wouldn't believe the people standing in line just to buy a $30.00 tee shirt.

I also think that it hasn't been easy to find information on ANY of these releases; physical or not. The Hip-O Select website started out strong, but then died out. I personally know of LIFELONG Diana Ross/Supremes fans that had NO IDEA that ANY of these Expanded Editions even existed.

So I think while it's easy for someone like J. Randy [[no disrespect) to shake his finger and say "this is the way it's going to be", I also think everyone is only looking at one piece of the pie.

Everyone talks about how the 70's Supremes got "no promotion". Well, this is an orange to that apple.

[sup_fan]

I appreciate that fans of an older generation might be less familiar with digital formats. but the same was true back in the day with vinyl. People had huge collections of 45's and lps, only to have to transition to cd.

The record business is a business and they're focused on profits. with the advent of the digital, it was a major change for the music industry and it's not been a completely smooth road either. So yes we're now dealing with another format but it is the direction of the future for the music industry. They're focus on where they'll make the most money. That's why the Sups got more re-releases than other groups. There simply was more historic demand and name recognition.

The music industry isn't going to "go back" to former formats unless there's clear money to be made. sure they'll continue to crank out a handful of Greatest Hits cds just to keep something on the shelves at Walmart. but otherwise, it's digital or nothing.

What i'm concerned with is that people are going to forego the digital which will then lead to reduced output. if you prefer cd, nearly every computer today can burn a disc for you. If you want to read a physical booklet, pdfs can easily be printed

[marybrewster]

"It's a game of give and take".....

It's all about options. Clearly Universal isn't in the business to lose money. Neither is McDonald's. But how long do you think they'd stay in business if they said "from no on we're only serving hamburgers"?

The issue lies in two things: they hold all the cards, and WE as a consumer don't have options. We either eat the hamburger, or we go hungry. I'd like to be able to go to Burger King for a chicken sandwich.

If Universal doesn't want physical format, then lease to a company that does. ACE has found success. There are many others.

The other things is: once everything is remastered, all of the hard work is done. If it's ready to be sold digitally, how much, truthfully, does it cost to make a physical CD? $2.00? $5.00? Even at $5.00, if they sold it for $39.99, that's a pretty good profit margin.

If Mary Wilson herself can produce and execute an "Up Close" CD, then there is no reason why Universal can't make these titles available physically. Even if it's a run of 500 limited-edition copies.

The problem is there is someone at the top that is simply saying NO. Because they can.

[carlo]

Good point Mary Brewster. I can think of at least two fellow fan friends of mine who I run into at the various shows/travels and they don't know how to use iTunes or burn a CD. I told them both about the latest digital only expanded editions and not only did they not know about these releases, they didn't know how to go about obtaining them. I suppose it is partially their own fault for not changing with the times and learning the about the technologies available to them. However at the end of the day, it doesn't change the fact that there are many of these types of fans out there. Part of it has to do with the associated demographic. It's hard to tap into this market especially when things transition to an online only and/or digital only format. You're right that having these releases available in physical formats at the shows would be a great method to generate sells but then it introduces a number of issues. For instance, if they want to set up a UMG kiosk at Diana's shows or even the touring production of Motown the Musical [[Berry's project), it becomes a matter of how to compensate Miss Ross or Mr. Gordy for generating sales that they deserve a bigger cut from, since they're advertising and selling at their show. Then you factor in paying the salary of a full time merchandise manager, plus travel costs, which further cuts into any potential profit that may come from only selling 100 CD's at a show...and that's a generous estimate in my opinion. It is a bit complicated.

I've also wondered why ACE can't release the physical versions of some of these digital only titles. But then I suppose it again becomes a matter of how to split the profit when UMG has already invested the time and money in assembling this project and ACE is simply printing the CD's and would likely only make a marginal profit from such an arrangement. I also believe UMG is hesitant to outsource reissues for some of its bigger legacy artists like The Supremes because they don't want to relinquish their control of the goodwill and image associated with the brand. They still see huge value in the Supremes name...but perhaps only on a "hits catalogue" basis at this point in time.

[mpn1jco]

Searched the web and found the following:

From Diana!-
My Man
Reach Out
　
From Live At Ceasers Palace-
Sesame Street medley
Happy
　
From An Evening With-
One Love In My Lifetime

3 tracks with Kiss inc alt version of "Fool for Love".

Vanessa Mitchell of High energy said Ross recorded-
You Can't Turn me Off
Love Is all you Need
Let Me Get close To you

RCA tracks include-
Sleep With Me Tonight
Try a little Tenderness
　
"Satisfaction" produced by Smokey remains unreleased. I believe it was recorded in 73 or 74.

There was also-
Full Moon [['83 Ross LP)

From around Mar/April '70 live-
The Nitty Gritty
Rythmn Of Life
Is That all There is?

Love Is All that matters [[Duet with Brandy)

Any chance of elaborating on why Katz dislikes the stuff he did on Ross 83?

I was delighted to meet him, given how much I love Ross '83 and all things Steely Dan/Donald Fagen [[http://www.ebay.com/itm/STEELY-DAN-9-LP-LOT-w-CANT-BUY-A-THRILL-THE-ROYAL-SCAM-AJA-DONALD-FAGEN-LP/162143076151?_trksid=p5411.c100169.m2942&_trkparms=aid%3D555012%26algo%3DPW.MBE%26ao%3D1%26 asc%3D20140131123815%26meid%3D110f727e9ced483283d6 d3f8f0647b24%26pid%3D100169%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D5%26s d%3D252473040255). He's a very matter-of-fact person and was quite honest that he considers Ross to be his career nadir. He seemed genuinely surprised that it was my favourite Ross record. Essentially, his memories from the session are coloured by what he recalls as a disinterest and lack of preparation from Diana. She expected him to pick all the songs and musicians and she just turn up to sing. I felt that from his work with Steely, he was used to a much more collaborative process and found having to find the songs rather stressful. He didn't enjoy that model of working at all. He felt that Diana was pretty straight in the studio, and not really wanting to experiment or riff.

I was specifically interested in Pieces Of Ice, and how that came about, but his memory was sketchy. He thinks he put out requests to publishers for songs for the project and that was one that came back.

I asked if he'd done more than 5 songs, and he advised no, so that definitely helps put to rest the mystery of the missing Ross tracks to a large degree [[Maybe, Full Moon, Sleep With Me Tonight, although I had heard that Maybe was a Tom Dowd production of an old song, so "maybe" that exists).

The fact that it was a bit of a torturous experience perhaps explains why it was such a short album.

One other bit of trivia from this album came from Donald Fagen [[http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Donald-Fagen-Sunken-Condos-Clear-Vinyl-Record-2xLP-/322144760796). He was asked by Katz to write a track, and came up with Love Will Make It Right. Apparently he came up with a killer mix on an SSL desk, which then promptly crashed and the mix was lost. The version that was on the album was inferior he felt to the lost version, which wasn't backed up.
Alan1074 [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/members/alan1074.53207/), Jun 24, 2015 [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/threads/diana-ross-favourite-80s-singles-poll.444179/page-3/lpost-12542381)



Untitled Stevie Wonder Album, was a planned 1973 album to be written and produced by Stevie Wonder. Wonder wrote and produced their single "
Bad Weather [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Bad_Weather)" with hopes the song would return the group back to the top of the charts. However, the song failed to crack the Top 40 and peaked at number 87 on Billboard's Hot 100. With the song's poor charting the album was scrapped. Two tracks, "Soft Days" and "I'll Wait A Lifetime," were recorded for the album; however both tracks currently remain unreleased. Other songs rumored to have been planned or recorded for the album included "Superstition [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Superstition_[[song))" and "Until You Come Back to Me [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Until_You_Come_Back_to_Me_[[That%27s_What_I%27m_Gon na_Do))."

Some Things You Never Get Used To, was a planned 1968 album based around the single "
Some Things You Never Get Used To [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Some_Things_You_Never_Get_Used_To)." The album consisted of new recordings and outtakes from previous albums. Motown hoped the single would be a smash hit after their previous single "Forever Came Today [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Forever_Came_Today)" failed to crack Billboard Top 20. When the song only made it to number 30, their weakest showing since 1963, the album was scrapped. Several of the newer recordings as well as the single would later be placed on Love Child [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Love_Child_[[The_Supremes_album)).

Diana Ross & the Supremes Sing Disney Classics, featuring covers of songs from films produced by
Walt Disney Productions [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/The_Walt_Disney_Company), began in 1967 and was completed by early 1968. However, the album was never given an assigned catalog number and was shelved after 14 tracks were completed. Songs recorded for the album, including "When You Wish upon a Star [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/When_You_Wish_upon_a_Star)", "I've Got No Strings [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/I%27ve_Got_No_Strings)" and "Whistle While You Work [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Whistle_While_You_Work)", have appeared on several Supremes compilation albums. "Chim Chim Cher-ee [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Chim_Chim_Cher-ee)", "A Spoonful of Sugar [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/A_Spoonful_of_Sugar)", and "Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah [[http://soulfuldetroit.com/wiki/Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah)" still remain unreleased.

A Tribute to the Girls
, was an album Motown planned for the group to record featuring songs made famous by girl groups of the time; however it was never completed. Several tracks were featured on the expanded release of There's a Place for Us.

[sup_fan]

if you haven't already, grab a copy of Randy's latest Diana bio. in the appendix is a wonderful discography. actually it's more of a reference piece on her works than just a straight discography. lots of info about what went into the recording and development of all the Sup [[diana era) records and her solo stuff. by the RCA there seems to be less and less info about unreleased tracks. but it does list out much of what you have above.

And while there could always be unknown or lost treasures in the vault, based on these various reliable sources, much of the Diana era Sup content is already out there. As stated, there are tons of live shows recorded. but i don't know how much difference there is from one show to another. they had a pretty general catalog of music they used. sure there are random songs here and there. but i think we'll find the much of the what we've already heard and received for live sets pretty well sums things up. it would probably just be more of the same

andy has also said that there are tracks where there was a mistake, problem or intonation issue. The You Can't Hurry Love one is sort of fun and humorous and so made a cute inclusion on Lost & Found. but they've been very clear that they have 0 intent of releasing anything that might make an artist appear in a poor light. frankly i'd be quite interested in these tracks. not because i want to find fault with Diana or mary or whomever. i find it to be an interesting part of the process. hearing the mistakes makes the finished product shine even more. but odds are these'll never be released.

[sansradio]

I don't think anyone's mentioned Diana's Harold Arlen set in this thread. Also, there's possibly a track from the mid-to-late '70s called "The Most Important Person," which I mentioned in this thread from yesteryear: http://soulfuldetroit.com/showthread.php?13437-Diana-Ross-anymore-Motown-UNRELEASED-songs-left

[waynesville]

I'm afraid I do think that demanding physical media is fighting technical progress. releasing digitally cuts the costs to the record company massively for one thing. I speak as someone who has a vast stack of soul LPs I can't bear to get rid of even though I don't own a record deck!!!! Memories of times hunting through secondhand record shops in London and feeling the thrill of finding something rare and usually unobtainable here. I suppose younger people can't understand that...want to hear a tune these days and its on YouTube!!!

[Glenpwood]

I certainly want all that we can get from the vaults and reissues but I think a lot of folks don't understand why a huge corporation like Universal [[not Andy, Harry, George, and Kevin) has little interest in niche product that seemingly moves only a few thousand copies at best. This isn't a case of walking into the vault, pulling a tape, slapping it onto disc and walking away. Here is what is typically involved in most reissue projects for any label...

These sets require hundreds of hour of care. Not even taking into consideration all the hours I'm sure are spent on listening to every tape searching for unreleased tracks or the many alternate takes of the songs involved in each album to find hidden gems worthy of release. Once that list is compiled, clearances for the unreleased material in a lot of cases have to be sought out which can be a pill to sort out. Then there's the hurdle of getting the blessings of the label itself, who may say no or not yet to some of it [[even at the last possible moment). Once that path clears, we get to the mastering process which can take days just to finish one song. The producers and engineer also get to hear a song so many times to get it remastered perfectly that I'm sure by the time they finish its probably one of the last tunes they want to hear for months to come afterwards. Multiply this by 30 tracks and you get the typical expanded edition sold to us at a bargain for the hours and effort even when they are $30-$50 bucks. Oh, and let's not forget the hours spent writing booklet essays and pouring over photographs to give us bonus and unseen shots. It really is a labor of love for very little profit when all this results in a max of 5,000 copies to a company that would rather put its marketing and money behind their big current sellers like Drake who move a million downloads.

I'm happy to get it via download, disc, or vinyl at this point. How many years did everyone spend not buying CD's when their vinyl originally disappeared? One has to move with the times and not get caught up in semantics about format. Computer and smart phone penetration is so large now that if these "friends" don't know how to download - help them out by setting it up on these devices for them! I agree that being vocal but respectful about getting them on CD's is okay but crossing your arms and thinking you are punishing the label by not buying isn't as effective as one thinks its actually is. All you are doing is showing there is no demand for these releases by not participating in some way and it becomes an even longer wait for the next reissue....

[ejluther]

3 tracks with Kiss inc alt version of "Fool for Love".
Are you saying Diana recorded songs with KISS or Gene Simmons?

[thommg]

Are you saying Diana recorded songs with KISS or Gene Simmons?

Wasn't she dating Gene Simmons around the time of the Silk Electric recordings? I did temp work in the mid-late 1980s and was working in an accounting office that handled Paul Stanley [[of Kiss). I had to bring a bunch of boxes of paperwork over to RTC Management Co. Evidently, they also handled her for a short period of time. No Diana sighting when I got there, though. I was brought in and immediately taken down to the lower level where I stacked the boxes and then was escorted out. Oh, well!

[Bluebrock]

Are you saying Diana recorded songs with KISS or Gene Simmons?
Yes she did, for a proposed "rock" album which thankfully never materialized. When this splendid idea fell through Diana was forced to use some of the many canned tracks from the WDFFIL sessions, but there are at least 1 further version of FFL lying in the vault which Diana will thankfully never allow anyone to hear. I did even hear the master tapes had been destroyed but my very well placed source tells me otherwise. This source tells me this version is even worse than the released version so we must hope and pray that the master tape is destroyed before anyone can release it in the sad event of Diana's passing.

[vgalindo]

Yes she did, for a proposed "rock" album which thankfully never materialized. When this splendid idea fell through Diana was forced to use some of the many canned tracks from the WDFFIL sessions, but there are at least 1 further version of FFL lying in the vault which Diana will thankfully never allow anyone to hear. I did even hear the master tapes had been destroyed but my very well placed source tells me otherwise. This source tells me this version is even worse than the released version so we must hope and pray that the master tape is destroyed before anyone can release it in the sad event of Diana's passing.
How funny Bluebrock. I thought Diana did a really good job on FFL. It really wasn't one of my favorites but she rocked it live. I will never forget when she did it at the Oakland Coliseum Arena. It was one of the many highlights of the concert!

[sup_fan]

i don't think FFYL is the worse thing Diana ever committed to vinyl. it's not stellar but not hideous.

and i'm not quite as negative as some about her RCA content. i do agree that there are a lot of "what ifs" in regards to this time. what if she'd stayed with motown? what if she's allowed other producers or people at RCA to have more input and collaboration with material? etc.

in my mind - WDFFIL is a pretty solid album. not her best but certainly more compelling that some of her motown sets. it sounded contemporary and strong.

Silk Electric, IMO, was a decent job at making something work. it's a potpourri album but i think a bit better than others. Ross 78 is worthless and the mixing of a few decent disco track, some crap disco tracks, some lush ballads and an Ain't No Mountain High Enough knock-off is worse. With SE it's more like "i'm doing 1 song of 6 or 7 difference genres." and because there's 0 attempt to unify them, it kinda worse. there's pop, reggae, hard rock, disco, ballad, 50's. I even sort of thought Turn Me Over was a cute play on the title and being the last track

I find the Eaten Alive set more annoying to the ears. i think Berry's falsetto and Diana's naturally nasal voice to be an ear-piercing combination. and the excess reverb and echo to diana vocals make it all the more exasperating. but again, these are all just opinions

[ejluther]

Yes she did, for a proposed "rock" album which thankfully never materialized. When this splendid idea fell through Diana was forced to use some of the many canned tracks from the WDFFIL sessions, but there are at least 1 further version of FFL lying in the vault which Diana will thankfully never allow anyone to hear. I did even hear the master tapes had been destroyed but my very well placed source tells me otherwise. This source tells me this version is even worse than the released version so we must hope and pray that the master tape is destroyed before anyone can release it in the sad event of Diana's passing.
I really like FFYL so I would love to hear those "rock" tracks and will be hoping and praying for the opposite result!

[luke]

http://www.superdeluxeedition.com/ Quite a few upcoming CDs and vinyl releases including Monkees, Steve Hackett, Aretha etc

[Jaap]

In his book Kiss and Sell, Chris Lendt devotes a chapter to the few years that Kiss's management also managed Ross, including the switch from Motown to RCA. Tellingly, in the liner notes of Why Do Fools, Ross first thanks Berry Gordy "for believing in me, and refusing to let me settle for mediocrity. And giving me the opportunity to 'sing and shine'." to be followed by "Also deserving my special gratitude is Gene for his his love and encouragement."

[Bluebrock]

I really like FFYL so I would love to hear those "rock" tracks and will be hoping and praying for the opposite result!
You will only hear it in the event of Diana's death so be careful what you wish for!

[Bluebrock]

i don't think FFYL is the worse thing Diana ever committed to vinyl. it's not stellar but not hideous.

and i'm not quite as negative as some about her RCA content. i do agree that there are a lot of "what ifs" in regards to this time. what if she'd stayed with motown? what if she's allowed other producers or people at RCA to have more input and collaboration with material? etc.

in my mind - WDFFIL is a pretty solid album. not her best but certainly more compelling that some of her motown sets. it sounded contemporary and strong.

Silk Electric, IMO, was a decent job at making something work. it's a potpourri album but i think a bit better than others. Ross 78 is worthless and the mixing of a few decent disco track, some crap disco tracks, some lush ballads and an Ain't No Mountain High Enough knock-off is worse. With SE it's more like "i'm doing 1 song of 6 or 7 difference genres." and because there's 0 attempt to unify them, it kinda worse. there's pop, reggae, hard rock, disco, ballad, 50's. I even sort of thought Turn Me Over was a cute play on the title and being the last track

I find the Eaten Alive set more annoying to the ears. i think Berry's falsetto and Diana's naturally nasal voice to be an ear-piercing combination. and the excess reverb and echo to diana vocals make it all the more exasperating. but again, these are all just opinions
It's all about personal preferences and it is interesting to hear your views on Diana's RCA career. No-one is right and no-one is wrong. It's all good.

[sup_fan]

Exactly Bluebrock - for the most part, this has been a great forum for sharing stories, theories, ideas and facts. it's fun to hear other's take on things and learn more.

I sort of like Ross 83 too. I think the tracks are great but am not overwhelmed with Diana's vocals. sometimes she's just not delivering like she really could have. I think Pieces of Ice could have been stronger if the lyrics weren't so odd. And I actually like Girls lolol. I realize I might be in the minority here lolol. But it's fun and kitschy. would have made an exciting video too.

[ejluther]

You will only hear it in the event of Diana's death so be careful what you wish for!
She hates them herself that much? I've always admired her willingness to try on different styles of music, almost like clothes...

[Bokiluis]

i'm not aware of ANY musical group that has received over 30 expanded and re-released album sets. Yes Pink Floyd, the Stones, etc have receive the occasional CD set on some of their top and/or historic albums. But remember, those albums might have gone to #1 and been on the charts for weeks. The early Sups albums did very well and we've received those as sets. But later Sup albums and the 70s stuff didn't sell nearly as well.

If the sales figures that have circulated for years are accurate, all of The Supremes [[60s)/Diana Ross & The Supremes' albums were either Gold [[500k +) or Platinum [[1 mil +) save for:

"Country, Western & Pop"
"We Remember Sam Cooke"
"sing and perform "Funny Girl"
"Live at London's Talk of the Town"
"Greatest Hits Vol. 3"
"Farewell"

Considering the number of times those albums were reissued, were those sales updated? How were the CD 2 fers counted?

Unfortunately, despite the quality, The Supremes 70s album sales were disappointing. Their album sales were on the level of The Marvellettes and Martha Reeves and The Vandellas. Their single sales from 1970-72 were commendable. Even in the UK where they had several Top 10 singles [[Jean Terrell era), only "The Magnificent 7" hit the Top 10 [[#6) probably due to the popularity of The Four Tops in the UK and the success of "River Deep, Mountain High" that coupling was irresistible.

[Bokiluis]

now this isn't to say that i don't want them to continue reissues :) i'd like to have everything in the vault!

other than the live stuff and Disney, i wonder how much 60s material is really left. Since they've gone ahead and re-released the various studio albums, i wonder if there's a need for Expanded Editions of Reflections or Cream of the Crop. if there are just a handful of random tracks left, might make more sense to do another L&F. sort of a one and done

My biggest curiosity is the once proposed "Love Child" album with all songs having a social theme. Were the songs ever recorded? Was a song like "Shadows of Society" deemed for that album? Though "I'm Living in Shame" would have a perfect addition, that song was written in November 1968 after the album was relesed. If that indeed was the direction the album was headed, I would have delayed releasing it though it would miss the holiday selling season. It had the most positive reviews. It could have been an even bigger critical and commercial success than it was...surpassing lots of expectations.

[sup_fan]

unlike the unreleased Somethings You Never Get Used To lp, i'm not sure that there was a complete line up for the "original" Love Child lp. For all of the DRATS albums, i made up my own iTunes playlists. looking over their recording dates and the lp release dates, i've compiled and shuffled songs around to make, IMO, more compelling lp sets. i ended up using a lot of the actual released tracks but did also include more of the unreleased ones we've received over the years

here's my Love Child lp. The only track on here that wasn't recorded in time was Everyday People. but i needed a 12th song and so i added. Frankly if they used the full intro from the released version of Love Child and then the third verse recently discovered and the longer outtro, you might be able to complete the album with 11 tracks. 5 on side one and 6 on the flip

Side A
Love Child
Keep an Eye
How Long has That Evening Train Been Gone
Does your Mama Know About Me
Blowin' in the Wind
Beginning of the End of Love

Side B
Everyday People
In the Evening of our Love
If you Should Walk Away
Wish I Knew
Ain't No Sun Since You've Been Gone
MacArthur Park

[Bluebrock]

Exactly Bluebrock - for the most part, this has been a great forum for sharing stories, theories, ideas and facts. it's fun to hear other's take on things and learn more.

I sort of like Ross 83 too. I think the tracks are great but am not overwhelmed with Diana's vocals. sometimes she's just not delivering like she really could have. I think Pieces of Ice could have been stronger if the lyrics weren't so odd. And I actually like Girls lolol. I realize I might be in the minority here lolol. But it's fun and kitschy. would have made an exciting video too.
Ross83 could have been a good album, but Diana was never on board with this project. She was a a pain in the butt during the recording of it, and she was annoyed that a couple of strong tracks recorded for the project were taken off the tracklisting literally at the last minute but a couple of turkeys were left on there. The project was disjointed, Diana had little faith in it and this was the real start of the downward spiral with RCA. Musically it is probably a little stronger than the previous two efforts but without that killer track it had no real chance of being a monster hit. LETS GO UP should have been the first single. That is what Diana wanted but she was overruled , and that was basically the end of that.

[Bluebrock]

She hates them herself that much? I've always admired her willingness to try on different styles of music, almost like clothes...
Yes she does, but i am treading on egg shells here so i cannot say anymore.

[sup_fan]

Bluebrock - i'm surprised that she struggled so much with Ross. wasn't the whole point of leaving motown and going to RCA that she be in control of her career? she'd said that her approval was required for everything so how was she 'overruled'

[reese]

Ross83 could have been a good album, but Diana was never on board with this project. She was a a pain in the butt during the recording of it, and she was annoyed that a couple of strong tracks recorded for the project were taken off the tracklisting literally at the last minute but a couple of turkeys were left on there. The project was disjointed, Diana had little faith in it and this was the real start of the downward spiral with RCA. Musically it is probably a little stronger than the previous two efforts but without that killer track it had no real chance of being a monster hit. LETS GO UP should have been the first single. That is what Diana wanted but she was overruled , and that was basically the end of that.

I liked ROSS [[1983) much better than the album that preceded it, SILK ELECTRIC. But I thought ROSS might have been a bit rushed because she was trying to have new product out in time for the Central Park concert and subsequent tour. It was released not even a full year after SILK ELECTRIC.

I thought LET'S GO UP would have been a better choice for an initial single, even though I think it is a bit too slow. But Diana obviously liked it. It's the only song from the album that I've ever heard her sing in concert. It was still in the act when she did the SWEPT AWAY tour.

[Bluebrock]

Bluebrock - i'm surprised that she struggled so much with Ross. wasn't the whole point of leaving motown and going to RCA that she be in control of her career? she'd said that her approval was required for everything so how was she 'overruled'
The album was originally meant to have 10 tracks on it. 12 were recorded. 2 were canned, and then at the last minute 2 more were canned. Diana had creative control over what she recorded and whom she recorded it, but she could not compete with the executives at RCA who were growing tired of her by this point.

[mpn1jco]

I purchased Silk Electric on leave from boarding school. I was initially disappointed with the album. However, my best friend said the album was 'slick'. He went to her concert around the time and was not pleased with her performance. He had seen her when she was promoting 'The Boss" and 'An Evening With' and described these concerts as life altering events. This time around he said the set was threadbare and it seemed like she was not interested in what she doing and really wanted to get home. The crowd response, he said,was off, possibly fueled by her apparent indifference. The real highlights of the show, were "So Close" and "Fool For Your Love". which seemed to get the crowd going. He said these songs worked well live. People say 'Silk Electric' went gold because of 'Muscles'. Maybe, maybe not. It should be taken into consideration her live promotion of the album live. If you strip away all the guitars from "Fool For Your Love", it has the same basic beat of "Where Did Our Love Go".

[Bluebrock]

I liked ROSS [[1983) much better than the album that preceded it, SILK ELECTRIC. But I thought ROSS might have been a bit rushed because she was trying to have new product out in time for the Central Park concert and subsequent tour. It was released not even a full year after SILK ELECTRIC.

I thought LET'S GO UP would have been a better choice for an initial single, even though I think it is a bit too slow. But Diana obviously liked it. It's the only song from the album that I've ever heard her sing in concert. It was still in the act when she did the SWEPT AWAY tour.
Yes she loved that song. The problem with Diana was that she would have all these great ideas about what to record. She would record them but by the time it came to the mixing stage she would have fallen out with them and wanted to can them and record another batch of songs. This she duly did for the WDFFIL project, but RCA quickly tired of her behaviour. They had deadlines to adhere to, and did not take kindly to these sudden change of heart, pardon the pun! It all began to turn mighty sour. Diana lacked a strong person such as Berry who would stand up to her and guide her gently the way i attempted to do in the late 80's and 90's. The 80's could have been a glorious period for her with every man and his dog lining up to work with her. Instead she turned them away, went with her own instincts and look what happened there. She quickly disowned Ross83 the way she quickly disowned SE and of course WO later in the decade. If only, if only..........

[Ollie9]

Yes she loved that song. The problem with Diana was that she would have all these great ideas about what to record. She would record them but by the time it came to the mixing stage she would have fallen out with them and wanted to can them and record another batch of songs. This she duly did for the WDFFIL project, but RCA quickly tired of her behaviour. They had deadlines to adhere to, and did not take kindly to these sudden change of heart, pardon the pun! It all began to turn mighty sour. Diana lacked a strong person such as Berry who would stand up to her and guide her gently the way i attempted to do in the late 80's and 90's. The 80's could have been a glorious period for her with every man and his dog lining up to work with her. Instead she turned them away, went with her own instincts and look what happened there. She quickly disowned Ross83 the way she quickly disowned SE and of course WO later in the decade. If only, if only..........

Do you have any feedback Bluebrock of Diana's feelings as regards the "Eaten Alive" album. For me it was at least a return to some form after some real dodgy albums. This and RHR&B are the only two rca albums i ever listen to. I am sad to admit that i really do find most of her rca output glossy pap.

[Jaap]

“What if” are interesting games to play, and yes, with different choices, the RCA years of Ross could have been [[even) more successful. Yet, the post-disco 1980s were tough for all African American female "pop" singers of the same generation as Ross. Aretha and Donna both had some hits but many misses, like Ross struggling to find the right niche in a changing pop market. Tina Turner is one exception, but her success was partially based on her comeback narrative and the surprise hit of “What’s Love Got To Do With It.” And then there was of course Janet with Control and Whitney. Just imagine if Ross would have made those records [[which would have fitted her image), but they wouldn’t have had the extra narrative that made these records successful: Janet’s Control had the same surprise factor as the “diana” album six years earlier and the album also reinforced Janet’s personal story of wanting to get control over her own life away from her famous family, father, and brother. For Whitney, the big difference was her voice. The material on her debut album is actually rather formulaic [[as was recognized at the time) – her voice and her youth made the difference. Just imagine that Ross would have made the exact same album [[4 of the 10 songs were Michael Masser ballads); it would have been a nice album, but would not have had the same impact, as it probably wouldn’t have been a “surprise” record that stood out in the way “Whitney Houston” did. One of the biggest missed opportunities and “what if’s” of the 1980s is the fall-out that Michael Jackson had with Ross. She would have been perfect for the “I Just Can’t Stop Loving You” duet of 1987. I’m not a big fan of the song, but it would have been a match made in heaven. And of course, a full Luther Vandross produced album… that would have been nice.

[reese]

I purchased Silk Electric on leave from boarding school. I was initially disappointed with the album. However, my best friend said the album was 'slick'. He went to her concert around the time and was not pleased with her performance. He had seen her when she was promoting 'The Boss" and 'An Evening With' and described these concerts as life altering events. This time around he said the set was threadbare and it seemed like she was not interested in what she doing and really wanted to get home. The crowd response, he said,was off, possibly fueled by her apparent indifference. The real highlights of the show, were "So Close" and "Fool For Your Love". which seemed to get the crowd going. He said these songs worked well live. People say 'Silk Electric' went gold because of 'Muscles'. Maybe, maybe not. It should be taken into consideration her live promotion of the album live. If you strip away all the guitars from "Fool For Your Love", it has the same basic beat of "Where Did Our Love Go".

I remember when tickets went on sale for the SILK ELECTRIC concert in my state. The response was so strong that it actually made the evening news.

I missed that concert, but she came around again about five months later with the FOR ONE AND FOR ALL tour. I caught the second show of the tour, about two weeks after Central Park. Diana was good, but seemed to be working on low voltage. The set listwasn't quite together yet, and she didn't even sing PIECES OF ICE, which was her current single at the time. Plus the audience was rowdy. At one point, one female fan socked another fan who was blocking her view. Finally during ENDLESS LOVE, Diana left the stage and did not come back. I was so disappointed. But I saw her again the next year during the SWEPT AWAY tour, and she was great.

[Bluebrock]

I purchased Silk Electric on leave from boarding school. I was initially disappointed with the album. However, my best friend said the album was 'slick'. He went to her concert around the time and was not pleased with her performance. He had seen her when she was promoting 'The Boss" and 'An Evening With' and described these concerts as life altering events. This time around he said the set was threadbare and it seemed like she was not interested in what she doing and really wanted to get home. The crowd response, he said,was off, possibly fueled by her apparent indifference. The real highlights of the show, were "So Close" and "Fool For Your Love". which seemed to get the crowd going. He said these songs worked well live. People say 'Silk Electric' went gold because of 'Muscles'. Maybe, maybe not. It should be taken into consideration her live promotion of the album live. If you strip away all the guitars from "Fool For Your Love", it has the same basic beat of "Where Did Our Love Go".
Yeah, but those guitars....... Oh dear.

[JohnnyB]

I remember when tickets went on sale for the SILK ELECTRIC concert in my state. The response was so strong that it actually made the evening news.

I missed that concert, but she came around again about five months later with the FOR ONE AND FOR ALL tour. I caught the second show of the tour, about two weeks after Central Park. Diana was good, but seemed to be working on low voltage. The set listwasn't quite together yet, and she didn't even sing PIECES OF ICE, which was her current single at the time. Plus the audience was rowdy. At one point, one female fan socked another fan who was blocking her view. Finally during ENDLESS LOVE, Diana left the stage and did not come back. I was so disappointed. But I saw her again the next year during the SWEPT AWAY tour, and she was great.

I saw For One And For All in September of '83. It was a great show, but Pieces Of Ice wasn't included although it was still the current release, nor was Up Front. Let's Go Up was the only song from the Ross LP that was on the set list. I wonder if Pieces Of Ice was ever performed live...

[thommg]

Yeah, but those guitars....... Oh dear.

And, yet, that song probably embodies the title of the album more than some of the others - Silk being Diana's voice and electric being a more rock oriented sound. Perhaps Love Lies embodies the theme best [[and it's my favorite song on that LP).

[JohnnyB]

And, yet, that song probably embodies the title of the album more than some of the others - Silk being Diana's voice and electric being a more rock oriented sound. Perhaps Love Lies embodies the theme best [[and it's my favorite song on that LP).

I hated Love Lies and FFYL when the album was released. But now I hear Love Lies differently. I think it would have been a perfect choice for the second single release.

[Bluebrock]

Do you have any feedback Bluebrock of Diana's feelings as regards the "Eaten Alive" album. For me it was at least a return to some form after some real dodgy albums. This and RHR&B are the only two rca albums i ever listen to. I am sad to admit that i really do find most of her rca output glossy pap.
I agree with you Ollie. The first three RCA albums were workmanlike to say the very best. I thought things began to improve with "swept away" and then with "eaten alive" a project that should have happened three years earlier. I know Barry Gibb quite well and i got his thoughts on the project along with Diana's own. Barry originally wanted him and Diana to duet on "islands in the stream". Diana turned him down but Barry was not to be detered. After working with Streisand and Dionne his other ambition was to work with Diana and Dusty Springfield. Dusty was not at all interested but Diana finally saw the potential. Barry clinched the deal by involving Michael Jackson. Diana and Barry hit it off but Diana and Maurice Gibb clashed quite frequently. I will not go into that here. Chain Reaction was the last song to be recorded for the project and was included at the last minute whilst a ballad from the sessions was canned. Another song from the sessions also remains in the vault.
Diana is a fan of the Bee Gees and she liked the album. Barry was also pleased with the results and the pair decided to work together again, but the relative failure of the album in the States put that idea on the backburner. I think it remains one of her most consistent RCA efforts along with RHRAB. Sadly RCA had had their fill of Diana by this time and the album was not promoted property. Barry was pissed by this and made his feelings plain.
Years later Diana approached Barry to record another album together but Barry had more serious worries at this time and the plan never came to fruition.
Hope the above helps.

[Bluebrock]

“What if” are interesting games to play, and yes, with different choices, the RCA years of Ross could have been [[even) more successful. Yet, the post-disco 1980s were tough for all African American female "pop" singers of the same generation as Ross. Aretha and Donna both had some hits but many misses, like Ross struggling to find the right niche in a changing pop market. Tina Turner is one exception, but her success was partially based on her comeback narrative and the surprise hit of “What’s Love Got To Do With It.” And then there was of course Janet with Control and Whitney. Just imagine if Ross would have made those records [[which would have fitted her image), but they wouldn’t have had the extra narrative that made these records successful: Janet’s Control had the same surprise factor as the “diana” album six years earlier and the album also reinforced Janet’s personal story of wanting to get control over her own life away from her famous family, father, and brother. For Whitney, the big difference was her voice. The material on her debut album is actually rather formulaic [[as was recognized at the time) – her voice and her youth made the difference. Just imagine that Ross would have made the exact same album [[4 of the 10 songs were Michael Masser ballads); it would have been a nice album, but would not have had the same impact, as it probably wouldn’t have been a “surprise” record that stood out in the way “Whitney Houston” did. One of the biggest missed opportunities and “what if’s” of the 1980s is the fall-out that Michael Jackson had with Ross. She would have been perfect for the “I Just Can’t Stop Loving You” duet of 1987. I’m not a big fan of the song, but it would have been a match made in heaven. And of course, a full Luther Vandross produced album… that would have been nice.
Diana would have recorded IJCSLU with MJ but by this time they were not so close as they once were. MJ was upset when Diana chose Stevie over him to give her away at her wedding. He felt that he owed her no favours even though she needed a hit at this time. It would have been perfect for Diana . and i do like the song. The Luther album has been discussed many times here and was a real lost opportunity. Luther would have done two or three albums with Diana, but she was having none of it for reasons best known to herself.

[vgalindo]

I purchased Silk Electric on leave from boarding school. I was initially disappointed with the album. However, my best friend said the album was 'slick'. He went to her concert around the time and was not pleased with her performance. He had seen her when she was promoting 'The Boss" and 'An Evening With' and described these concerts as life altering events. This time around he said the set was threadbare and it seemed like she was not interested in what she doing and really wanted to get home. The crowd response, he said,was off, possibly fueled by her apparent indifference. The real highlights of the show, were "So Close" and "Fool For Your Love". which seemed to get the crowd going. He said these songs worked well live. People say 'Silk Electric' went gold because of 'Muscles'. Maybe, maybe not. It should be taken into consideration her live promotion of the album live. If you strip away all the guitars from "Fool For Your Love", it has the same basic beat of "Where Did Our Love Go".
Wow. I have seen Diana over 20 times and the "Silk Electric" tour was one of her most exciting for me.

[Bluebrock]

I hated Love Lies and FFYL when the album was released. But now I hear Love Lies differently. I think it would have been a perfect choice for the second single release.
Love lies could have been a potential single i agree, though i am not overly keen on it it is one of the better songs on the album.

[Bluebrock]

Wow. I have seen Diana over 20 times and the "Silk Electric" tour was one of her most exciting for me.
Good for you, but i cannot agree with you on that one. She was angry, distant and unfocused for various reasons , but i am glad you appreciated the tour.

[vgalindo]

Good for you, but i cannot agree with you on that one. She was angry, distant and unfocused for various reasons , but i am glad you appreciated the tour.
Well I sure didn't get that vibe at the Oakland Coliseum Arena. She was on fire. The show got great reviews. Over 20,000 fans were on their feet adoring her all night. Spoke to many people after the show and everyone loved the show. The Oakland news paper the next day said something like all other female singers need to watch and learn from Diana. They compared her show to Olivia Newton Johns show who was there the week before and favored Diana's show over Olivia's. I am not saying other shows were like this but the one I saw during this tour Diana was in all her glory!

[keith_hughes]

"It's a game of give and take".....

If Universal doesn't want physical format, then lease to a company that does. ACE has found success. There are many others.



Just noticed this reference to Ace, and thank you, Mary Brewster.

We hope to satisfy demand for unreleased Supremes tracks in a small way in the next volume of our "Motown Girls" series. [[We have George and Andy's blessing!)

Keith

[Bluebrock]

Well I sure didn't get that vibe at the Oakland Coliseum Arena. She was on fire. The show got great reviews. Over 20,000 fans were on their feet adoring her all night. Spoke to many people after the show and everyone loved the show. The Oakland news paper the next day said something like all other female singers need to watch and learn from Diana. They compared her show to Olivia Newton Johns show who was there the week before and favored Diana's show over Olivia's. I am not saying other shows were like this but the one I saw during this tour Diana was in all her glory!
That is fair enough vgalindo. Glad you loved the show. I have never seen Olivia in concert but in my opinion she lacks the charisma of Diana, and i would suspect lacks her stage presence too.

[Bokiluis]

How funny Bluebrock. I thought Diana did a really good job on FFL. It really wasn't one of my favorites but she rocked it live. I will never forget when she did it at the Oakland Coliseum Arena. It was one of the many highlights of the concert!

I was at that show. The live version of "Fool For Your Love" was much more soulful.

[Bokiluis]

I agree with you Ollie. The first three RCA albums were workmanlike to say the very best. I thought things began to improve with "swept away" and then with "eaten alive" a project that should have happened three years earlier. I know Barry Gibb quite well and i got his thoughts on the project along with Diana's own. Barry originally wanted him and Diana to duet on "islands in the stream". Diana turned him down but Barry was not to be detered. After working with Streisand and Dionne his other ambition was to work with Diana and Dusty Springfield. Dusty was not at all interested but Diana finally saw the potential. Barry clinched the deal by involving Michael Jackson. Diana and Barry hit it off but Diana and Maurice Gibb clashed quite frequently. I will not go into that here. Chain Reaction was the last song to be recorded for the project and was included at the last minute whilst a ballad from the sessions was canned. Another song from the sessions also remains in the vault.
Diana is a fan of the Bee Gees and she liked the album. Barry was also pleased with the results and the pair decided to work together again, but the relative failure of the album in the States put that idea on the backburner. I think it remains one of her most consistent RCA efforts along with RHRAB. Sadly RCA had had their fill of Diana by this time and the album was not promoted property. Barry was pissed by this and made his feelings plain.
Years later Diana approached Barry to record another album together but Barry had more serious worries at this time and the plan never came to fruition.
Hope the above helps.

i worked in the RCA Distribution office [[soon to be BMG). The weak ass RCA field staff may have been weary of having to work, but, the RCA brass wanted her to resign. She agreed to tour the BMG branches while on the "Red Hot Rhythm & Blues Tour". She stopped by the San Francisco office and that was the first time I met her and had a nearly 2 hour face to face conversation with her. She invited me to the listening party at the Beverly Hills Hotel. Believe me, if RCA was "tired of her", they would never had spend the money for an expensive event at the Beverly Hills Hotel. Unfortunately, well that's not unfortunate, but, she was pregnant with Ross and had to cancel the tour. Before she canceled the tour, she did a soldout date at the Shoreline Ampitheater.
i had an advance cassette of "Red Hot Rhythm and Blues". I kept yelling for her to sing "Cross My Heart" and "Tell Me Again". But even though their were "Red Hot Rhythm & Blues tee-shirts [[one is on sale at eBay now) and "Dirty Looks" sunglasses for promo use, even "Dirty Looks" wasn't included in the San Francisco date though it had been released and was already Top 10 @ KSOL and getting AirPlay on KMEL.

[Bokiluis]

Yes she loved that song. The problem with Diana was that she would have all these great ideas about what to record. She would record them but by the time it came to the mixing stage she would have fallen out with them and wanted to can them and record another batch of songs. This she duly did for the WDFFIL project, but RCA quickly tired of her behaviour. They had deadlines to adhere to, and did not take kindly to these sudden change of heart, pardon the pun! It all began to turn mighty sour. Diana lacked a strong person such as Berry who would stand up to her and guide her gently the way i attempted to do in the late 80's and 90's. The 80's could have been a glorious period for her with every man and his dog lining up to work with her. Instead she turned them away, went with her own instincts and look what happened there. She quickly disowned Ross83 the way she quickly disowned SE and of course WO later in the decade. If only, if only..........That's in total contradiction to what I heard and what she has said. She made a commitment to Robert Summers, former president of RCA, that the album would be ready for the holiday selling season. Personally, I think it was her wanting to keep her word, that made "Why Do Fools" such a disappointment following "diana". Though it was admirable that she wanted to keep her word, the artistic process cannot be held hostage to a deadline. I would have rather her wait until Nile & Bernard were available for round two or wait for Michael Gore who had produced "Flashdance". She still could've had creative input but not carry the burden of getting a new album out, setting up Mgmt offices, etc. amongst her other commitments.

[Bluebrock]

That's in total contradiction to what I heard and what she has said. She made a commitment to Robert Summers, former president of RCA, that the album would be ready for the holiday selling season. Personally, I think it was her wanting to keep her word, that made "Why Do Fools" such a disappointment following "diana". Though it was admirable that she wanted to keep her word, the artistic process cannot be held hostage to a deadline. I would have rather her wait until Nile & Bernard were available for round two or wait for Michael Gore who had produced "Flashdance". She still could've had creative input but not carry the burden of getting a new album out, setting up Mgmt offices, etc. amongst her other commitments.
I can only relay what i know and what i heard. Believe me, don't believe, it is all irrelevant now.

[vgalindo]

i worked in the RCA Distribution office [[soon to be BMG). The weak ass RCA field staff may have been weary of having to work, but, the RCA brass wanted her to resign. She agreed to tour the BMG branches while on the "Red Hot Rhythm & Blues Tour". She stopped by the San Francisco office and that was the first time I met her and had a nearly 2 hour face to face conversation with her. She invited me to the listening party at the Beverly Hills Hotel. Believe me, if RCA was "tired of her", they would never had spend the money for an expensive event at the Beverly Hills Hotel. Unfortunately, well that's not unfortunate, but, she was pregnant with Ross and had to cancel the tour. Before she canceled the tour, she did a soldout date at the Shoreline Ampitheater.
i had an advance cassette of "Red Hot Rhythm and Blues". I kept yelling for her to sing "Cross My Heart" and "Tell Me Again". But even though their were "Red Hot Rhythm & Blues tee-shirts [[one is on sale at eBay now) and "Dirty Looks" sunglasses for promo use, even "Dirty Looks" wasn't included in the San Francisco date though it had been released and was already Top 10 @ KSOL and getting AirPlay on KMEL.

I attended that show as well as the one at the Concord Pavilion and didn't understand why she didn't do anything from Red-hot rhythm and blues.

[Bokiluis]

I attended that show as well as the one at the Concord Pavilion and didn't understand why she didn't do anything from Red-hot rhythm and blues.

We can only speculate, but, I think her pregnancy was a wonderful new surprise for her. But that doesn't explain preparation. I do recall her looking puzzled in my direction as I yelled out song titles that audiences shouldn't have known. She didn't realize that advances were circulating on cassette. It was before CD advances had become the standard.
By the time of "The Force Behind the Power", she actually included 6-7 in that set before Motown got that album out.
so what is better, not including new unreleased material or practically doing an entire new album, as she did on the "Here and Now Tour".
i saw the opening dates on that tour up and down the east coast, and if Motown would have had "The Force Behind the Power" in stores beginning ith the opening date in Poughkeepsie, that album would have been Top 10 in all the tour markets. The tour began in June 1991 but Motown did not get the album in stores until September. In the U.K., they pre-released the album to compliment her appearance on the Queen's Variety special which set the album up to eventually go Double Platinum in the U.K.

[Bluebrock]

We can only speculate, but, I think her pregnancy was a wonderful new surprise for her. But that doesn't explain preparation. I do recall her looking puzzled in my direction as I yelled out song titles that audiences shouldn't have known. She didn't realize that advances were circulating on cassette. It was before CD advances had become the standard.
By the time of "The Force Behind the Power", she actually included 6-7 in that set before Motown got that album out.
so what is better, not including new unreleased material or practically doing an entire new album, as she did on the "Here and Now Tour".
i saw the opening dates on that tour up and down the east coast, and if Motown would have had "The Force Behind the Power" in stores beginning ith the opening date in Poughkeepsie, that album would have been Top 10 in all the tour markets. The tour began in June 1991 but Motown did not get the album in stores until September. In the U.K., they pre-released the album to compliment her appearance on the Queen's Variety special which set the album up to eventually go Double Platinum in the U.K.
Thats right. We scheduled the album in the UK around the time of the Royal Variety Performance knowing full well this show got audiences of around 15 million. We also booked a couple of other TV appearances as well, and got great support from Radio 1 and 2. We knew we had a winner here, Diana firmly believed in the album and was the ultimate professional. Great memories. Thank you for reminding me.

[Ollie9]

I believe "RHR&B also had huge potential that was thwarted by terrible single choices and no real promotion in Europe, Diana's best sales market. Had songs such as "It's Hard For Me To Say", "Shine" or "Cross My Heart" been released as singles and promoted on various UK and other european tv shows, much in the way FBTP was it's fate could have been very different indeed.

[Bluebrock]

I believe "RHR&B also had huge potential that was thwarted by terrible single choices and no real promotion in Europe, Diana's best sales market. Had songs such as "It's Hard For Me To Say", "Shine" or "Cross My Heart" been released as singles and promoted on various UK and other european tv shows, much in the way FBTP was it's fate could have been very different indeed.
Your probably right Ollie. That was just before I came on board. The album had potential hits, and indeed so did EATEN ALIVE which also suffered from a poor choice of singles CHAIN REACTION aside of course. What I could have done with those albums........

[Jaap]

The first song I heard from RHR&B was "It's Hard For Me To Say" which they played on the Dutch radio, even before the album was officially released. The same with "That's How You Start Over." In both cases, I was convinced that these songs would be released as singles! I guess "Shockwaves" was chosen in the aim to repeat the success of "Chain Reaction." I was hoping for "Shine" -- not a big fan of Simply Red but I loved that song and was hoping for a good 12 inch version.

[sup_fan]

Eaten Alive [[the song) was much better live than recorded. for whatever reason, the Jacksons love unintelligible, mushy vocals. Michael, Janet and the others consistently have recordings where you have to STRAIN to figure out what the heck they're singing. Enunciation is not their forte lol. And apparently/obviously it works for them. It wasn't a good idea though for Diana. her fans were used to decades of crystal clear songs and articulation.

I'm not saying EA would have been a #1 single. but the track isn't bad and the song could have at least charted respectably had people been able to understand it.

[sup_fan]

as for RHRB I think the released album, in the US, was very uneven.

[lakedistrictlad1]

I believe "RHR&B also had huge potential that was thwarted by terrible single choices

I have to agree. There were some gems on that album. I thought 'Shine' could have been a hit. I remember hearing 'Mr Lee' being played on Radio 1 when it was a single and the dj whipped the track off after about 30 seconds, saying it was rubbish. I had to agree with him. Whoever made the singles choices from that album, at least for the U.K, really messed up i.m.o.

[Ollie9]

"Thats How You Start Over" "Chain Reaction" and "Shine" were to my ears the obvious choice for lead single selection from their prospective albums. This is not said in hindsight, as this is what i believed when the albums were first released.
I think RHR&B would be better remembered today had it produced at least a couple of hits. It has a light/bright, summer feel to it which is appealing. "Dirty Looks" is an ok album track, while "Shockwaves" is in nowhere near the same league as "Chain Reaction". "Mr Lee" as a single leaves me speechless. Who made these decisions??.
The album garnered some very nice reviews in the UK, summer of 87 with one reviewer calling it timeless.

[144man]

Just noticed this reference to Ace, and thank you, Mary Brewster.

We hope to satisfy demand for unreleased Supremes tracks in a small way in the next volume of our "Motown Girls" series. [[We have George and Andy's blessing!)

Keith

It's strange how such an important post as this has been overlooked, especially as it's on-topic.

[JohnnyB]

It's strange how such an important post as this has been overlooked, especially as it's on-topic.

It definitely got my attention; I hope additional
Information is coming!

[carole cucumber]

Just noticed this reference to Ace, and thank you, Mary Brewster.

We hope to satisfy demand for unreleased Supremes tracks in a small way in the next volume of our "Motown Girls" series. [[We have George and Andy's blessing!)

Keith

As no one else has mentioned it, I did note that Mr. Hughes has not indicated whether the Supremes' track[[s) are Diana or post-Diana.

[keith_hughes]

Oh definitely pre, Miss Cucumber. Ace do put out 70s Motown material from time to time [[more of it in the planning stage right now), but that's not what I have in mind for the Supremes in Motown Girls 3.

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?

[marv2]

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?

So am I. I dare say it loud!!! Love Mary!

[carole cucumber]

Oh definitely pre, Miss Cucumber. Ace do put out 70s Motown material from time to time [[more of it in the planning stage right now), but that's not what I have in mind for the Supremes in Motown Girls 3.

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?

Who knows? Well you certainly know, Mr. Hughes..... but thank you for sending the clue and letting us in on the possibility!

[captainjames]

Interesting discussion
I would have picked stranger In Paradise and Tell Me Again.

[lakedistrictlad1]

Oh definitely pre, Miss Cucumber. Ace do put out 70s Motown material from time to time [[more of it in the planning stage right now), but that's not what I have in mind for the Supremes in Motown Girls 3.

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?

Ooooh Mr Hughes, you are such a tease!

[keith_hughes]

Who knows? Well you certainly know, Mr. Hughes..... but thank you for sending the clue and letting us in on the possibility!

You're unfair on me. I DON'T KNOW whether it will happen. We have to make a track list, get it approved by Ace, then get it cleared by Universal. I'm just saying there IS some stuff - i.e answering the thread question - and that I'd like to get it out there.

[carole cucumber]

Mr. Hughes,

I apologize for my remark. I thought that you were hinting that it was on the docket for next year. I had assumed that the Motown Guys/Girls series had sold well enough to continue. If it's meant to be, then it will happen. If Ace or Universal have reservations, it will not.

[Bluebrock]

So am I. I dare say it loud!!! Love Mary!

I am more of a Jean fan than both Diana and Mary so I hope that means we have a 70's Supremes lost and found on the way!!

[RossHolloway]

Oh definitely pre, Miss Cucumber. Ace do put out 70s Motown material from time to time [[more of it in the planning stage right now), but that's not what I have in mind for the Supremes in Motown Girls 3.

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?
I'm going to guess an Expanded Edition of Red Hot, Mary's first solo album.

[marv2]

I'm going to guess an Expanded Edition of Red Hot, Mary's first solo album.

Mary Wilson's first solo album was titled "Mary Wilson".

[keith_hughes]

Mr. Hughes,

I apologize for my remark. I thought that you were hinting that it was on the docket for next year. I had assumed that the Motown Guys/Girls series had sold well enough to continue. If it's meant to be, then it will happen. If Ace or Universal have reservations, it will not.

Well of course we want to do another Motown Girls, ma'am, and indeed the series sells well. I'm just saying there are some steps between wanting and getting. We [[I) don't tell you when we have an idea, and it gets turned down somewhere along the line. The reasons why that happens are many and various. We roll with it, and if a proposal fails, we try to come up with something different - which might include the same tracks we previously proposed, under a different project title!

When I write my autobiography, I'll list all the projects I've proposed that have been turned down, and why. I hope you hope, as I do, that I'll have better things than that to do for a long time to come ...

[Bokiluis]

Thats right. We scheduled the album in the UK around the time of the Royal Variety Performance knowing full well this show got audiences of around 15 million. We also booked a couple of other TV appearances as well, and got great support from Radio 1 and 2. We knew we had a winner here, Diana firmly believed in the album and was the ultimate professional. Great memories. Thank you for reminding me.

You're welcome. It also gave me the benefit of having the import CD months before the U.S. release. EMI International even made singles boxes to house the CD/cassette single of "When You Tell Me That You Love Me" cross promoting the Royal Variety Performance including a great appearance on Des O'Connor. Diana believed she had a hit, but, more importantly...so did EMI and they treated the album accordingly for an entire year. As Motown stumbled at every turn. I often felt like the Motown staff might as well been given a classical record to work, they were that clueless.

[Bokiluis]

I'm going to guess an Expanded Edition of Red Hot, Mary's first solo album.

An expanded edition of an album that reportedly sold less than 7,000 copies? On new release day/week, I couldn't even find a "new" copy to buy. I ended up buying a promo copy in Kenmore Square/Boston.
I did like the instrumental of "Red Hot". But the rest of the album sounded like Hal Davis only recorded the first take with little to no eq-ing.
it would be interesting to hear what Gus Dudgeon [[Elton John) had recorded on her since I really like the first "Elton John", "Madman Across the Water", etc. He was an interesting choice as a producer to go from a generic disco album to a rock/pop direction.
Frank Wilson would have also been an interesting choice as a producer since he honed her vocals on the early Supremes 70s albums.
But I certainly wouldn't be too excited about more tracks from the "Mary Wilson" Mary Wilson debut. [[Mary Hartmann, Mary Hartmann).

[Thornton]

Thanks to everyone who's contributed info about Diana Ross' RCA years. I've wrongly overlooked them for many years. I even forgot I had a copy of "Why Do Fools Fall in Love" and have been listening to the album for the past few days. If you put it up against "diana" 1980 it doesn't sound as strong, but on it's own I think it's a fun album, and shows Ross trying something new. I've also added the rest of her RCA albums to my too long "To Buy" list.

[Bluebrock]

An expanded edition of an album that reportedly sold less than 7,000 copies? On new release day/week, I couldn't even find a "new" copy to buy. I ended up buying a promo copy in Kenmore Square/Boston.
I did like the instrumental of "Red Hot". But the rest of the album sounded like Hal Davis only recorded the first take with little to no eq-ing.
it would be interesting to hear what Gus Dudgeon [[Elton John) had recorded on her since I really like the first "Elton John", "Madman Across the Water", etc. He was an interesting choice as a producer to go from a generic disco album to a rock/pop direction.
Frank Wilson would have also been an interesting choice as a producer since he honed her vocals on the early Supremes 70s albums.
But I certainly wouldn't be too excited about more tracks from the "Mary Wilson" Mary Wilson debut. [[Mary Hartmann, Mary Hartmann).
I also share your fears. It was a very poor album and i can think of far more worthy efforts to concentrate on , but it would be interesting to hear any unreleased tracks which could hardly be worse than some of the stuff on that ill conceived album. I would probably buy the damn thing out of respect for Mary , but i would much prefer to hear some Jean Terrell led vaulted songs.

[Bluebrock]

You're welcome. It also gave me the benefit of having the import CD months before the U.S. release. EMI International even made singles boxes to house the CD/cassette single of "When You Tell Me That You Love Me" cross promoting the Royal Variety Performance including a great appearance on Des O'Connor. Diana believed she had a hit, but, more importantly...so did EMI and they treated the album accordingly for an entire year. As Motown stumbled at every turn. I often felt like the Motown staff might as well been given a classical record to work, they were that clueless.
Yes we were very creative with those cd singles. We were given a large budget to work on, and Diana could not do enough to help us. I spent many happy hours discussing cd cover designs and future single choices. Wonderful happy memories.

[marv2]

Oh definitely pre, Miss Cucumber. Ace do put out 70s Motown material from time to time [[more of it in the planning stage right now), but that's not what I have in mind for the Supremes in Motown Girls 3.

Do I dare to tell you, publicly, that I'm more of a Mary fan than a Diana fan? No, I think better not. Too big a clue. Plus who knows whether MG3 will ever happen?

I do hope it is an expanded version of the lp "Mary Wilson". Since she is the only one of the Supremes to have a hit recently, it makes sense. Besides there's been enough released on Diana Ross to fill up 3 garbage cans!

[bradsupremes]

An expanded edition of an album that reportedly sold less than 7,000 copies? On new release day/week, I couldn't even find a "new" copy to buy. I ended up buying a promo copy in Kenmore Square/Boston.
I did like the instrumental of "Red Hot". But the rest of the album sounded like Hal Davis only recorded the first take with little to no eq-ing.
it would be interesting to hear what Gus Dudgeon [[Elton John) had recorded on her since I really like the first "Elton John", "Madman Across the Water", etc. He was an interesting choice as a producer to go from a generic disco album to a rock/pop direction.
Frank Wilson would have also been an interesting choice as a producer since he honed her vocals on the early Supremes 70s albums.
But I certainly wouldn't be too excited about more tracks from the "Mary Wilson" Mary Wilson debut. [[Mary Hartmann, Mary Hartmann).

Mary's debut album deserved better. Better material, better producer, etc. No offense to Hal David, but she needed someone like the Holland Brothers. They should have guided her in the direction of those brilliant ballads she did on the final Supremes albums. With that being said, those 4 Gus Dudgeon tracks deserve to see the light of day. Those should have been her debut album. The style was different for her, but it fit. She excels on them. "Save Me" and "Love Talk" should have been singles. I think "Save Me" could have been a hit if given the right promotion. It's a shame Motown dropped her because those 4 tracks with Gus had so much potential to become something great.

I'd love to see what more Ace has in store for other deserving Motown artists who haven't had the releases yet. Gladys Knight & the Pips especially.

[Bluebrock]

Mary's debut album deserved better. Better material, better producer, etc. No offense to Hal David, but she needed someone like the Holland Brothers. They should have guided her in the direction of those brilliant ballads she did on the final Supremes albums. With that being said, those 4 Gus Dudgeon tracks deserve to see the light of day. Those should have been her debut album. The style was different for her, but it fit. She excels on them. "Save Me" and "Love Talk" should have been singles. I think "Save Me" could have been a hit if given the right promotion. It's a shame Motown dropped her because those 4 tracks with Gus had so much potential to become something great.

I'd love to see what more Ace has in store for other deserving Motown artists who haven't had the releases yet. Gladys Knight & the Pips especially.
I have said that so many times. Mary deserved better material than she was given, but we all know it was just a ploy by Motown to get rid of her.
As regards Gladys and the Pips - oh yes indeed my friend!

[RossHolloway]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't George Solomon do a remix of Mary's single RedHot and it was played on Midnight Johnny's show? And if I recall correctly the remix was excellent!

[Bokiluis]

I do hope it is an expanded version of the lp "Mary Wilson". Since she is the only one of the Supremes to have a hit recently, it makes sense. Besides there's been enough released on Diana Ross to fill up 3 garbage cans!
The more things change......

[daviddh]

I think there were only two songs on her first solo that I liked Pick Up The Pieces and Warm Summer Nights.....I think were the titles

[Bluebrock]

I think there were only two songs on her first solo that I liked Pick Up The Pieces and Warm Summer Nights.....I think were the titles

I didn't mind THE LIGHT THAT GUIDES MY WAY but there was little else of quality on display i'm afraid.

[Bokiluis]

Yes we were very creative with those cd singles. We were given a large budget to work on, and Diana could not do enough to help us. I spent many happy hours discussing cd cover designs and future single choices. Wonderful happy memories.

Then you must have known her product mgr. I believe his name was Jonathan Green. He ended up going to Polydor. He wasn't a natural Diana fan...more of a rocker. We traded promos for years and he gave me my cherished copy of the customized Guinness book. He always did a great job. I remember stopping by the offices when "One Shining Moment" came on BBC 1. It seemed that everyone had turned their radios on. [[Kinda like we all did when the infamous Whitney/Wendy interview surprisingly aired on 'BLS).
EMI did a commendable job for Diana throughout the 90s. The crowning achievement was "One Woman" led by a brilliant television campaign. As a fan, thanks so much for your contribution to that success. The 90s were great internationally as I witnessed first hand great marketing from Singapore and across the European continent and the Anglosphere.

[Bluebrock]

Then you must have known her product mgr. I believe his name was Jonathan Green. He ended up going to Polydor. He wasn't a natural Diana fan...more of a rocker. We traded promos for years and he gave me my cherished copy of the customized Guinness book. He always did a great job. I remember stopping by the offices when "One Shining Moment" came on BBC 1. It seemed that everyone had turned their radios on. [[Kinda like we all did when the infamous Whitney/Wendy interview surprisingly aired on 'BLS).
EMI did a commendable job for Diana throughout the 90s. The crowning achievement was "One Woman" led by a brilliant television campaign. As a fan, thanks so much for your contribution to that success. The 90s were great internationally as I witnessed first hand great marketing from Singapore and across the European continent and the Anglosphere.
Much respect heading from me to you.

[sup_fan]

started going through this string and the Where Ross Lead Single string to get a listing of canned/alt tracks for the various lps of Ross since 1981. for the RCA albums i not listing everything from the 2015 re-releases with single vs lp versions and 12" versions.

Why Do Fools & Silk Electric - other than Muscles, seems like these to lps were recorded through 81 and then made into 2 lps. Anyone know how much sits in the vaults in terms of other versions? there were unreleased versions of Fool For Your Love including an extended mix for single use.

Ross 83 - Bluebrock mentions 4 unreleased tracks. Another person listed Full Moon as a canned track.

Swept Away - what's still in vault?

Eaten Alive - Bluebrock mentions 2 canned tracks, one of which was a ballad

Red Hot R&B - unfinished track Try A Little Tenderness. Europe lp also had Mr Lee, Tell mama and Sweet soul music

then there are 2 projects/albums from the RCA era that were either not completed or canned. A "rock" lp from the time of Silk Electric that was recorded with some of the Kiss/Gene Simmons people and then a Harold Allen lp of standards

Working Overtime -

Force behind The Power

Take Me Higher - lots here
Change of Heart
When You Tell Me That you Love Me
Battlefield
Blame it on the Sun
Heavy Weather
Force Behind the Power
Heart Don't Change my Mind
Waiting in the wings - cassette single version in US
One Shining Moment
You're Gonna Love It - multiple remixes and edits on singles
If We Hold On Together
No Matter What you Do [[duet - on Europe version)
you and I [[on Europe version)

Take Me Higher
Take me Higher - multiple single remixes, cassette single version
If you're not gonna love me right - Crenshaw remix
voice of the heart - US and europe album mixes
let somebody know - US album
keep it right there - US and europe album mixes
don't stop
gone
only love can conquer all
i never loved a man before - Europe and US album mixes, unreleased mix, cassette single version
i thought that we were still in love
i will survive - "disco" version in motown vaults, In and Out movie version, various dance remixes
swing it - europe album
Soul Kiss - canadian single
Too Many Nights - international B-side single
I'm So Happy - international b-side single

Everyday is a New Day
He Lives in You
Love is all that Matters - brandy duet version and album version
Until we meet again - album and Hex Hector mix, various other remixes
got to be free
not over you yet
So they say
every day is a new day
sugarfree
someone that you loved before
hope is an open window
carry on
drop the mask - international single only
free i'm gone - international single only

[daviddh]

I did think that perhaps Fight For It was an out take from Ross 83 but I showed up as a B side.
Full Moon, Maybe , Sleep With Me Tonight were the other 3 tracks that I am aware of.
not sure who or why the other songs were changed out , but probably bot a good idea ,imo.
I wasn't a fan of most of side 2

[mpn1jco]

Then you must have known her product mgr. I believe his name was Jonathan Green. He ended up going to Polydor. He wasn't a natural Diana fan...more of a rocker. We traded promos for years and he gave me my cherished copy of the customized Guinness book. He always did a great job. I remember stopping by the offices when "One Shining Moment" came on BBC 1. It seemed that everyone had turned their radios on. [[Kinda like we all did when the infamous Whitney/Wendy interview surprisingly aired on 'BLS).
EMI did a commendable job for Diana throughout the 90s. The crowning achievement was "One Woman" led by a brilliant television campaign. As a fan, thanks so much for your contribution to that success. The 90s were great internationally as I witnessed first hand great marketing from Singapore and across the European continent and the Anglosphere.

The first single from EDIAND was "Not Over You Yet", which debuted in the top ten in the UK. Although personal problems prevailed by the time of the second release, preventing live appearances to promote it - could she have just done a promo clip and your team take it from there ? I think Until We Meet Again could have been a hit just from airplay, if you could get the DJs to play it.

[Bluebrock]

The first single from EDIAND was "Not Over You Yet", which debuted in the top ten in the UK. Although personal problems prevailed by the time of the second release, preventing live appearances to promote it - could she have just done a promo clip and your team take it from there ? I think Until We Meet Again could have been a hit just from airplay, if you could get the DJs to play it.
In the 70's and 80's that would have worked just fine, but by the 90's the singles market had changed dramatically. By this time singles were airplayed weeks before they were available to buy, whereas in the past new singles would rarely be played before they were commercially available. Appearing on a TV show was initially more important than hearing the song on the radio. With NOYY Diana performed it on TOTP, THE LOTTERY SHOW and did interviews for radios 1 and 2 and Smooth radio as well as press interviews. UWMA was earmarked to be the 2nd single but Diana's problems put paid to another promotional visit. It was a lost opportunity i agree, but by this time she had left Motown USA and we didn't know if she would sign a new contract with another Company so the Record Company were reluctant to release it without Diana here to promote it.

[mwmr]

I'm going to guess an Expanded Edition of Red Hot, Mary's first solo album.

I'd love a reissue of Mary's debut or at least some of the tracks like lead single Red Hot

Yes the material could have been stronger but hey ho.

anyway we've had Scherrie & Susayes [[dire IMHO) Partners reissued on cd, Florence has seen her album released on cd, Jean's has been issued on cd , as has Diana's solo debut.. all the 70s Supremes have been out on cd on the Let Yourself Go set so for completions sake Mary deserves her album reissuing on cd

[Bluebrock]

I'd love a reissue of Mary's debut or at least some of the tracks like lead single Red Hot

Yes the material could have been stronger but hey ho.

anyway we've had Scherrie & Susayes [[dire IMHO) Partners reissued on cd, Florence has seen her album released on cd, Jean's has been issued on cd , as has Diana's solo debut.. all the 70s Supremes have been out on cd on the Let Yourself Go set so for completions sake Mary deserves her album reissuing on cd
Much as i personally dislike the album i agree it should be reissued for completions sake. There have got to be some stronger tracks in the vault. We will know the answer to that question by early 2017 hopefully.

[Albator]

I find the Eaten Alive set more annoying to the ears. i think Berry's falsetto and Diana's naturally nasal voice to be an ear-piercing combination. and the excess reverb and echo to diana vocals make it all the more exasperating. but again, these are all just opinionsThat's funny how people, fans, are compartmented in their opinion. As for "eaten alive", I'm with you. From the moment I heard the flip side "I'm watching you" , I thought something was wrong. This was so unreal ... I also thought that she could never sing so high live. In fact, I saw her in Paris, the month the record came, and she only performed material from Swept away.
By the way, she also had trouble singing live Telephone and Swept away.

[Bluebrock]

That's funny how people, fans, are compartmented in their opinion. As for "eaten alive", I'm with you. From the moment I heard the flip side "I'm watching you" , I thought something was wrong. This was so unreal ... I also thought that she could never sing so high live. In fact, I saw her in Paris, the month the record came, and she only performed material from Swept away.
By the way, she also had trouble singing live Telephone and Swept away.
As you say it is each to their own. I personally liked much of EATEN ALIVE but i am a big Bee Gees fan from way back. Diana was also a fan and after turning down ISLANDS IN THE STREAM she realised her mistake and was determined to work with them, A proposed 2nd album never materialised even though both parties expressed an interest in working with each other. Barry Gibb told me that CHAIN REACTION is his all time favourite production on another artist.

[Ollie9]

That's funny how people, fans, are compartmented in their opinion. As for "eaten alive", I'm with you. From the moment I heard the flip side "I'm watching you" , I thought something was wrong. This was so unreal ... I also thought that she could never sing so high live. In fact, I saw her in Paris, the month the record came, and she only performed material from Swept away.
By the way, she also had trouble singing live Telephone and Swept away.

I think Eaten Alive a so so album. Not terrific, but not bad. I do think "Crime Of Passion" should have been the first song on side two of the album. The lyrics to "I'm Watching You" are just so wet and not a way to kick off.
I heard Diana sing "Telphone" in concert 85. She did a fantastic job, hitting all those high notes. It was one of the highlights of the evening and was mentioned in some of the reviews of the concert.

[Albator]

As you say it is each to their own. I personally liked much of EATEN ALIVE but i am a big Bee Gees fan from way back. Diana was also a fan and after turning down ISLANDS IN THE STREAM she realised her mistake and was determined to work with them, A proposed 2nd album never materialised even though both parties expressed an interest in working with each other. Barry Gibb told me that CHAIN REACTION is his all time favourite production on another artist.
I like the Bee Gees to, but I'm not a fan. They wrote fantastic enduring hits during the seventies and the songs penned for Samantha Sang, Yvonne, Frankie Valli are equally great.

From the eighties, I know most of their work for Streisand, Dionne Warwick, Kenny Roger and Barry.
The Streisand LP was a total success, maybe it has more to do with Barbra than with the songs. The Dionne LP was the same vein, so if you prefer Dionne, you prefer Heartbreaker and if you prefer Barbra, you go with Guilty.
But after those two, they lost the hit formula for Now Voyager and After Dark .

[Albator]

I think Eaten Alive a so so album. Not terrific, but not bad. I do think "Crime Of Passion" should have been the first song on side two of the album. The lyrics to "I'm Watching You" are just so wet and not a way to kick off.
I heard Diana sing "Telphone" in concert 85. She did a fantastic job, hitting all those high notes. It was one of the highlights of the evening and was mentioned in some of the reviews of the concert.
If you talk about the bootleg record, "Swept away" is slower and personally , I don't hear the same vocal pitch on her live "telephone"compared to the studio take. But it's good anyway, it's soulful . To bad she repeated the same verse twice.

[mpn1jco]

I think Eaten Alive a so so album. Not terrific, but not bad. I do think "Crime Of Passion" should have been the first song on side two of the album. The lyrics to "I'm Watching You" are just so wet and not a way to kick off.
I heard Diana sing "Telphone" in concert 85. She did a fantastic job, hitting all those high notes. It was one of the highlights of the evening and was mentioned in some of the reviews of the concert.

Swept Away sounded horrible live, but I liked the way she worked the stage with the song.

Eaten Alive is not a bad album. However, the engineering on the Eaten Alive album was atrocious. It features her worse vocalizing, and her voice is buried in the mix. The Bee Gees usually sing distinct background harmony on their productions [[ Dionne, Streisand, Kenny Rogers ) . These vocals were present but not consistent on the Eaten Alive, and Diana certainly needed them to flesh out her featherweight, breathy and trembly vocals. With Whitney Houston breaking big at the time, and the inevitable comparisons raging - I didn't think it was wise for Diana to do a lot of whispering and 'aaahhs' all over an album. Red Hot Rhythm and Blues had Ross in fine voice and production.

[Albator]

Discutions on this board are really great 😉

[daviddh]

I think with the last release of Baby Its Me , tracks were found that Diana had recorded with Bonnie Pointers former husband and producer , I think his name is Jeff Bowen.

[Bluebrock]

I think with the last release of Baby Its Me , tracks were found that Diana had recorded with Bonnie Pointers former husband and producer , I think his name is Jeff Bowen.
Hopefully they will surface on Ross78.

[mpn1jco]

Hopefully they will surface on Ross78.With Ross 78 expanded, A Go Go, and the final 4 Motown albums expanded coming in the next one to two years there will be much for Ross fans to look forward to. Most of the legends are not releasing new product and I do not expect Ross to make a final comeback.
I would like to see Ross, out of nowhere, appear on the Tonight show and sing a medley of songs from shows currently playing on Broadway.