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  1. #1

    Motown.. the move from Detroit to LA.

    Is there any books ...forum threads which document it....who moved..who stayed..how it was organised...which output continued to be recorded in Detroit...how some Jobete tunes got released on small LA labels etc....

  2. #2
    http://www.amazon.com/Marvin-Gaye-Wh...gaye+last+days

    The best one I've read. If there is another I would gladly read it.

  3. #3
    That is indeed a great read. I was lucky enough to buy a hard cover when it was first released. If I remember correctly, this is the book where Brenda Holloway kinda hinted or suggested that there may have been more to Marvin's and Tammi's relationship than just singing partners.

  4. #4
    Can't agree more, Ross. And if you enjoy the Originals (or, of course, Marvin Gaye), you'll enjoy it even more. Very, very well researched and written.

  5. #5
    Platter,
    If I can promote my book "The Road Through Motown", I go into some detail regarding the move.

  6. #6
    I've been told by the tour guide my trip to the Motown Museum, that the last recording made on the hallowed walls of the old Hitsville USA building, was the Commodores' "Machine Gun".

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by ralpht View Post
    Platter,
    If I can promote my book "The Road Through Motown", I go into some detail regarding the move.
    I have to agree. You should really read Ralph's book. It is an eye opener and explains very well about Motown's move out West.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Ngroove View Post
    I've been told by the tour guide my trip to the Motown Museum, that the last recording made on the hallowed walls of the old Hitsville USA building, was the Commodores' "Machine Gun".
    That's interesting only because I was told something different and "Machine Gun" was released in 1974. I am pretty sure they were gone by '73.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by marv2 View Post
    That's interesting only because I was told something different and "Machine Gun" was released in 1974. I am pretty sure they were gone by '73.
    There was a discussion on this forum several years ago as to the final session at Studio A. I recall that someone (I believe it was Harry W) stated that the last session was for bluesman Luther Allison.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by RossHolloway View Post
    That is indeed a great read. I was lucky enough to buy a hard cover when it was first released. If I remember correctly, this is the book where Brenda Holloway kinda hinted or suggested that there may have been more to Marvin's and Tammi's relationship than just singing partners.
    She simply said that the only two people who knew for sure were Marvin & Tammi.

    Quote Originally Posted by ralpht View Post
    Platter,
    If I can promote my book "The Road Through Motown", I go into some detail regarding the move.
    Ralph... I have to pick up your book. How did I not know about it? You need to toot your own horn a bit more!

  11. #11
    Nothing But Soul,
    I doubt that Luther Allison was the last to record at Studio A. Those sessions, with Joe Peraino producing, were done when things were still pretty lively in Detroit.

    JTF,
    I guess I have assumed that all members of this forum were aware of my books. Guess I was wrong.

  12. #12
    [QUOTE=ralpht;119770]Nothing But Soul,
    I doubt that Luther Allison was the last to record at Studio A. Those sessions, with Joe Peraino producing, were done when things were still pretty lively in Detroit.

    According to the cd booklet notes for "Bad News Coming", those sessions were recorded Feb-Aug 1972. For "Luther's Blues", the liner notes state ' Largely recorded in a three-week
    blast in October 1973, it was one of the last albums recorded in the Hitsville 'Snakepit' with some tracks cut at Golden World , aka 'Studio B'

  13. #13
    In "Road Through Motown" I have a couple of pics of those sessions at Studio B.

  14. #14

    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by ralpht View Post
    In "Road Through Motown" I have a couple of pics of those sessions at Studio B.
    Please post a link to your book dear Ralph. You must promote yourself more.

    Yours, with every good wish.

    Roberta

  15. #15
    I knew nothing of Ralph's book, and would love to review in in NY's GOOD TIMES Magazine,where I have a regular column(through which I started The Marvelettes campaign for "UnSung" about a year ago, which seemed to have snowballed)..
    let me know how to get a copy of the book, Ralph..

  16. #16
    Jimi you can get Ralph`s book through Amazon for $25 and also get Russ` for $16. Both are must reads. Regards Roger.

  17. #17
    Roberta,
    I guess I take too much for granted regarding self promo. I hope you enjoy the book.

  18. #18
    Thanks all for the replys...i will be buying both of Ralphs books and the Marvin one...

  19. #19
    the brilliant Don't Forget The Motor City website has this:

    Let's Have A Little Talk (Luther Allison) publ. Jobete

    Luther Allison; recorded Hitsville-GW, completed 16/11/1973 ; produced by Joe Peraino

    Mar-74; LP (S): Gordy GS967 Luther's Blues

    06-Feb-96; CD (S): Motown 530 612 2 The Motown Years 1972-1976

    27-Feb-01; CD (S): Motown 013 409 2 Luther's Blues

    And here's a link to the site itself, if anybody on here doesn't know...

    http://www.dftmc.info/home.html

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by ralpht View Post
    Roberta,
    I guess I take too much for granted regarding self promo. I hope you enjoy the book.
    I did not know about this book. I just went over to Amazon.com and ordered a copy.

    Ralph, I agree with Roberta, you need to promote yourself a bit more. You are a legend and helped create the sound that we all came to love.

    Thank you for letting this worn out AVON lady know about this.

    Penny

  21. #21
    Thank you for ordering my book, Penny. Enjoy.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by platters81 View Post
    Is there any books ...forum threads which document it....who moved..who stayed..how it was organised...which output continued to be recorded in Detroit...how some Jobete tunes got released on small LA labels etc....
    Our good friend Rob has detailed previously how many LA tunes ended up on small LA labels....I'm sure he'll update if he reads this thread. (I think, simply put, Motown had options on the tracks, but if not taken up, they reverted to the LA staffers)

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by snakepit View Post
    Our good friend Robb has detailed previously how many LA tunes ended up on small LA labels....I'm sure he'll update if he reads this thread. (I think, simply put, Motown had options on the tracks, but if not taken up, they reverted to the LA staffers)
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    That's it, exactly. Almost all Jobete Music published songs that weren't just remakes of a Motown-released hit, were songs written by producer/writers working in the Jobete Music L.A. office (1963-66) and New York office (1963-64), Those songs were sold to Jobete Music, and published by them. Motown Record Corp. Had the first option on recording artists singing them, and releasing those recordings on their various record labels. If a certain amount of time passed (possibly 6 months?) and they hadn't scheduled a release on the given song, the original producers then had the option to record it by one of their own artists and release it (either on a label of their own, or to lease the songs to some other label for release). That is how so many Jobete songs, with no Motown label releases, appeared on small L.A. labels like Power, Joker, Magnum, Dee Gee, Champion and small New York labels like Marton and Maltese, and national labels such as WB, RCA, Modern, and Tangerine.

    Songs written by these contracted producer's writing staffs, while working for Jobete Music, but were "rejected" by them (e.g. not bought/paid for) were then, therefore, published by the following private publishing companies owned by the producers:

    Finesse Music-Hal Davis/Marc Gordon
    Jan Cris Music-Herman Griffith/Vince Love/Freeman King (Joker Records)
    Power Music-Frank Wilson
    Equinox Music-Ed Cobb
    Wright Music-Charles Wright
    House of Fortune Music-John Marascalco
    Par-Lar/Parlar/Parlor Music-George Clinton
    Maltese Music-George Kerr/Don McLeod
    ElSid Music-Sidney Barnes
    Zira Music-George Kerr
    Stephanye Music-Gene Redd Jr.
    Last edited by robb_k; 08-13-2012 at 05:56 PM.

  24. #24
    Great info Robb..im interested in the RPR release of Jimmy McFarland of "Lonely Lover" in 69 (recorded some years earlier..but not released by Marvin Gaye/Four Tops)..HDH were involved in a messy divorce from Motown at the time...im surprised this got released.

  25. #25
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    Jimmy McFarland singing "Lonely Lover" was just a case of a local L.A. producer wanting his artist to sing a Motown song he liked, that, just by coincidence, was never issued on vinyl by Motown, until the 1980s.That song was written by Holland-Dozier-Holland, who produced the Marvin Gaye cuts on it.

    So, the McFarland record had NOTHING to do with an L.A. Jobete/Motown Office producer releasing his version on a small L.A. label. The RPR producer and record company owner just decided to use that Motown song because Motown clearly had no intentions of using it (3 years after it was written), AND he thought McFarland could do a good job singing it, and he would make up the loss of not owning the publishing rights by having a LOT more sales revenue from selling a LOT more records using a great HDH song, than they would using a run-of-the-mill RPR-published song. Getting a % royalty for every later use of a song that sells so little that no one ever hears it to want to pay the fees to use it, is worthless.

    One might ask the question: "How did RPR's A & R man , McFarland's producer, or McFarland, himself, find out about that unused Motown song? I would bet that some Soul producers, who didn't have great in-house songwriters for their own publishing, regularly scanned the BMI publishing lists for songs written by prolific, hit-making songwriters, who had songs they seem to have forgotten, not having their artists release a version. Then, they'd have their arrangers look at the sheet music. If it looked good to them, they'd have them buy the sheet music, and record their artist on that song.

    In this case, they saw a nice HDH song that hadn't been used by Motown for 3 years after its publication (so, no competition from Motown), and an average HDH
    song would be 10-20 times better than anything their (RPR's) stable of writers, or McFarland, could come up with. So they gave it a try.

    A similar situation existed with a Stevie Wonder song from 1964, written by Stevie, Clarence Paul and Luvel Broadnax ("I Prayed For a Girl/Boy Like You". In 1967, Ted Cooper at Clumbia Records chose it for his Epic Records artist, Patty Michaels, thinking that his artist could get more sales than by using a song by someone else (there was no Columbia/Okeh/Epic writing staff (once Carl Davis left. So, they wouldn't get publishing royalties in any case. There were almost no sales, anyway. So, in the end it didn't matter. But one can't blame them for trying.

  26. #26
    I find it curious that Berry moved not only the business part of the company to L.A. ,but also the foundation of the company which was the musicians and tech staff. Just 10 years or so prior he was keeping his house band under cover by not listing them and crediting them on the covers ,and holding them to exclusive recording for him by first fining them for moonlighting and finally putting them under contract. Also to move from the location that made MOTOWN , MOTOWN. DETROIT. That's so like Gamble and Huff moving PIR to N.Y. or Memphis!!! Or say CURTOM moving to Ohio or down south. Salt water fish can't florish in fresh water , they would thrash around and die and thats just what happened ,slowly to MOTOWN.

  27. #27
    Hi Robb...its so refreshing to log on and read your posts....so informative.

  28. #28
    Man I'll say. That was fascinating to read even though I didn't understand all of it...lol. Robb knows his stuff. And to think my sister said me knowing Motown record numbers was worthless information. I beg to differ. All these years later finding people who are just as interested, if not more about Motown. I read most everything I could get my hands on. Great posts Robb.

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