Sequins and Stardom: Fashion Legacy of Supremes

[RanRan79]

Passing this along for those of you who are into the fashion element of the group, in case you haven't seen it.

Sequins and stardom: the fashion legacy of the Supremes | Fashion | The Guardian

[RanRan79]

Oh, now I see it's a few years old and I guess it was when Mary was promoting Supreme Glamour.

[Ollie9]

I think the fashion aspect of the Supremes/Diana is viewed almost as important as the music itself. It’s fun to watch how they evolved from that first tv appearance to their last.
Of the original trio, for me it was Mary who had the better sense of style, selecting simple chic for her day wear.
I think Diana came into her own during the mid 70’s onwards. It’s only the huge Glinda creations that i’m not terribly fond of which tend to make her look outdated.

[sup_fan]

the coffee table book is really excellent. the photography is stunning throughout, there's a nice balance of group history/information alongside the info on their fashion. i get it that they had to edit some material out. but Brad mentioned that many more outfits were prepared and i believe he mentioned even photographed on the mannequins. but they could only include so much. he said he and mary were working with the gowns in the storage place and tried to make heads or tails of the mega-uni gown MSS wore in Vegas at that disastrous Caesar's engagement. they couldn't figure it out! lol

[rod_rick]

the coffee table book is really excellent. the photography is stunning throughout, there's a nice balance of group history/information alongside the info on their fashion. i get it that they had to edit some material out. but Brad mentioned that many more outfits were prepared and i believe he mentioned even photographed on the mannequins. but they could only include so much. he said he and mary were working with the gowns in the storage place and tried to make heads or tails of the mega-uni gown MSS wore in Vegas at that disastrous Caesar's engagement. they couldn't figure it out! lol

Is there a picture of the ladies in that uni gown?

[daviddh]

So has the Motown museum ever disclosed what gowns they have??
Never understood the battle over ownership of the gowns but I will assume they claimed some sort of ownership as they were left there in a warehouse..

[bradsupremes]

Is there a picture of the ladies in that uni gown?

Not that I am aware of. I do have a photo of the uni gown by itself, but it's not the best quality and its laying on a table where you can't figure out what's the top, bottom, or what's what.

[bradsupremes]

So has the Motown museum ever disclosed what gowns they have??
Never understood the battle over ownership of the gowns but I will assume they claimed some sort of ownership as they were left there in a warehouse..

I am aware of about 10 sets in their collection and they do have more, but they're quite secretive. Mary really worked hard to find out what they had. Initially she wanted those gowns back in her collection, but when I was working with her she accepted this wasn't going to happen and wanted to know for peace of mind sake. Also she wanted to know so she could figure out what exactly was missing between the two collections. I prepared an inventory for her that she was going to pass along to Berry Gordy. She had asked if he could step in on her behalf to get some answers, but this was right as the pandemic started so it pretty much ended there.

[bradsupremes]

Yes, it is true that we did photograph more sets of gowns, but for reasons unknown to me they were not included. There were a few other sets that didn't get photographed at all. We were at the Grammy Museum in December 2017 and only had three days to photograph them. Two of those days we had to be done by 1pm because of evening programs in the theatre. As you can imagine we would have to open the crates, go through each box, figure out which gowns we needed to photograph, dress the mannequins and then properly position them for the camera. It was very time consuming and you quickly realized how little time you had to get things done.

I'm glad to hear many people enjoy the coffee table book, but it could have been so much better. I have to be honest that I'm still quite disappointed with how it turned out. Mary was originally told the book was to be the size of the Motown book by Adam White and Barney Ales, but the publishers kept cutting back on the pages. My vision was going to be only about the gowns, but the publishers wanted the Supremes story included - most of the text was composed by Mary and Mark Bego. The gown section in the middle is mostly my work along with great input from Keith Holman and Mary. There was more to that section too with facts about the gowns, but they got cut. There were things originally intended for the book that didn't make into the first draft including interviews with a few of the designers like Michael Travis, LaVetta, Dick Eckert [[Pat Campano's partner), and the ladies who actually beaded the gowns back in the 70s. We had a ton of gown sketches by Michael Travis we wanted to use including many designs that were never created, but the publishers only wanted six. I wanted a section on the fire that destroyed several sets back in 1974 which would have included their insurance form of the losses including several photos of the actual dressing room after the fire. There was the issue with the cover that none of us wanted. Mary fought hard to change it because of her fear that it would be perceived as a slight to Diana. She even emailed Diana to tell her. Mary wanted an outtake photo from the same session with all three of them looking at the camera. I wanted a photo from Flo's last studio photo session, but the publishers just wouldn't budge. By that point, I pretty much gave up on trying to make changes as the publishers weren't interested. Overall, Mary was satisfied with the final product. Unfortunately, it kills any chances of a true gown book to be published. I do have my 302 page inventory so I will just have to be happy with that as being what the book was suppose to be.

[sup_fan]

Yes, it is true that we did photograph more sets of gowns, but for reasons unknown to me they were not included. There were a few other sets that didn't get photographed at all. We were at the Grammy Museum in December 2017 and only had three days to photograph them. Two of those days we had to be done by 1pm because of evening programs in the theatre. As you can imagine we would have to open the crates, go through each box, figure out which gowns we needed to photograph, dress the mannequins and then properly position them for the camera. It was very time consuming and you quickly realized how little time you had to get things done.

I'm glad to hear many people enjoy the coffee table book, but it could have been so much better. I have to be honest that I'm still quite disappointed with how it turned out. Mary was originally told the book was to be the size of the Motown book by Adam White and Barney Ales, but the publishers kept cutting back on the pages. My vision was going to be only about the gowns, but the publishers wanted the Supremes story included - most of the text was composed by Mary and Mark Bego. The gown section in the middle is mostly my work along with great input from Keith Holman and Mary. There was more to that section too with facts about the gowns, but they got cut. There were things originally intended for the book that didn't make into the first draft including interviews with a few of the designers like Michael Travis, LaVetta, Dick Eckert [[Pat Campano's partner), and the ladies who actually beaded the gowns back in the 70s. We had a ton of gown sketches by Michael Travis we wanted to use including many designs that were never created, but the publishers only wanted six. I wanted a section on the fire that destroyed several sets back in 1974 which would have included their insurance form of the losses including several photos of the actual dressing room after the fire. There was the issue with the cover that none of us wanted. Mary fought hard to change it because of her fear that it would be perceived as a slight to Diana. She even emailed Diana to tell her. Mary wanted an outtake photo from the same session with all three of them looking at the camera. I wanted a photo from Flo's last studio photo session, but the publishers just wouldn't budge. By that point, I pretty much gave up on trying to make changes as the publishers weren't interested. Overall, Mary was satisfied with the final product. Unfortunately, it kills any chances of a true gown book to be published. I do have my 302 page inventory so I will just have to be happy with that as being what the book was suppose to be.

always really enjoy the incredibly rich history you have to share brad!

what about your publishing the full inventory via Amazon publishing? or uploading it online? would be fascinating to see all of it. and what a shame that all that info from the designs was mostly shelved. I did not on the queen mother gowns that there is a little bit of writing in the corner - it's very hard to read but looks like the original idea was to have each gown a different color.

[sup_fan]

I am aware of about 10 sets in their collection and they do have more, but they're quite secretive. Mary really worked hard to find out what they had. Initially she wanted those gowns back in her collection, but when I was working with her she accepted this wasn't going to happen and wanted to know for peace of mind sake. Also she wanted to know so she could figure out what exactly was missing between the two collections. I prepared an inventory for her that she was going to pass along to Berry Gordy. She had asked if he could step in on her behalf to get some answers, but this was right as the pandemic started so it pretty much ended there.

based on pics we've seen, don't they have the red R&H sequin ones and the blue Andy Williams sequins?

what about those hideous yellow gowns with the flowers on them? these were a pic that all of us denied were sups gowns but then someone verified them, i think. they're fabric [[maybe chiffon) but not overly flowing or wide. long sleeves, high neck.

And aren't the brown pinstripe Funny Girl dresses at a Hard Rock cafe somewhere? is that owned by the motown museum and lent out to them?

[bradsupremes]

There are various institutions that have Supremes gowns - Motown Museum has the most, but others include the Smithsonian, Hard Rock Cafe [[which purchased two sets in auction back in the early 90s), and a few in private collections.

As for publishing the inventory, it's still an evolving thing. It's by no means complete with information. Some sets have barely any info while others have quite of bit. There is also the issue of photos - I would need approval for rights which would be incredibly complicated.

I'll be happy to share as much as I can, but it has been over a decade of work for me so I do want to make sure what I'm sharing is correct.

Yes, several sketches from Michael Travis were marked with each girl getting a different color gown. Some were never created while others became well-known gowns. The pink pearl gowns worn during the Royal Command Performance initially had Diana's in light blue, Mary's in gold, and Cindy's in pink, but he decided all three would be pink. There's a few sketches from 1970-1971 that are quite stunning and make me wish they had been made.

[RanRan79]

Brad, I hope I haven't asked this already and forgot, so forgive me if I have, but what is the earliest Supremes wear that Mary had in her collection? And any idea of the earliest that exists anywhere, if not with Mary?

[sup_fan]

There are various institutions that have Supremes gowns - Motown Museum has the most, but others include the Smithsonian, Hard Rock Cafe [[which purchased two sets in auction back in the early 90s), and a few in private collections.

As for publishing the inventory, it's still an evolving thing. It's by no means complete with information. Some sets have barely any info while others have quite of bit. There is also the issue of photos - I would need approval for rights which would be incredibly complicated.

I'll be happy to share as much as I can, but it has been over a decade of work for me so I do want to make sure what I'm sharing is correct.

Yes, several sketches from Michael Travis were marked with each girl getting a different color gown. Some were never created while others became well-known gowns. The pink pearl gowns worn during the Royal Command Performance initially had Diana's in light blue, Mary's in gold, and Cindy's in pink, but he decided all three would be pink. There's a few sketches from 1970-1971 that are quite stunning and make me wish they had been made.

nice - thanks! my older eyes just couldn't quite make out what they different colors were! lol and i have to say i'm not sure i could quite see these in different colors. of course they're so iconic as is that it's hard to imagine anything else. any other bits of info from some of the other well known outfits?

[bradsupremes]

Brad, I hope I haven't asked this already and forgot, so forgive me if I have, but what is the earliest Supremes wear that Mary had in her collection? And any idea of the earliest that exists anywhere, if not with Mary?

The earliest set Mary had in her collection were the red floral/tropical print gowns with rhinestones from 1965. The ladies wore these on The Red Skelton Show performing "Mother Dear."

I have been told the Motown Museum has the blue, three tiered chiffon dresses from their Ed Sullivan Show debut in 1964 and that they offered them to be displayed on Diana's 1993 Oprah appearance but she declined. Not sure how true that is - I was told that by someone who was around at the time.

[RanRan79]

The earliest set Mary had in her collection were the red floral/tropical print gowns with rhinestones from 1965. The ladies wore these on The Red Skelton Show performing "Mother Dear."

I have been told the Motown Museum has the blue, three tiered chiffon dresses from their Ed Sullivan Show debut in 1964 and that they offered them to be displayed on Diana's 1993 Oprah appearance but she declined. Not sure how true that is - I was told that by someone who was around at the time.

Thanks Brad. While I'm not into the fashion aspect of the group, I was hoping Mary might have held on to one of those early outfits from like 62 or 63. Lol

I wonder what Diana has in her possession?

[bradsupremes]

Thanks Brad. While I'm not into the fashion aspect of the group, I was hoping Mary might have held on to one of those early outfits from like 62 or 63. Lol

I wonder what Diana has in her possession?

She didn't - at least when I asked her if she did, but then again she may have forgotten. I didn't see anything when going through the storage boxes she had.

I do want to add she did wear a Supremes gown from early 1964 and from the Dick Clark Caravan of Star tour in the early 70s so it was clear she held onto some of that early stuff for a time. I asked her if she still had it and she said she didn't.

[daviddh]

Brad, so does the gown stay at RRHoF??
Or does Mary's family have them.
Just curious as to what the future holds for them
I suspect ,possibly when the Motown museum opens ,they may put some on display.
Funny how they didn't want to help Mary but ,offered the blue chiffon dresses up to Diana. Maybe it's me on that.
Brad, I think putting the info up online is a good idea.

[sup_fan]

i'm assuming that, with Mary's passing, the gowns and her estate are now in the hands of Turkessa. unless mary made arrangements with a museum or organization to handle them.