Just a chime....or??

[144man]

Sorry I missed your conversation on tinnitus. Mine manifested itself several years ago predominantly in my left ear with the "bang, bang, bang" sound of a pile driver, and it was sometimes so bad it used to wake me up at night. At other times it was like a cross between a whistle and a hum. My doctor prescribed me some pills, but when they didn't work he sent me to see a consultant for tests. Strangely enough my hearing in both ears was good, but better in the affected one. I was told to come back a month later so the condition could be monitored, and when I returned the diagnosis of tinnitus was confirmed. I was informed that I would have the condition for life, yet over the next few months it gradually faded away, never to return.

[westgrandboulevard]

Jerry....

No, they're not threatening actions at all. [[at least, not in my own experience). They are simply repetitive, little 'sense of self' mannerisms, done for reassurance.

They [[well, we, when becoming older..!) all have these subconcious little tics to some degree, especially when our mind is elsewhere.

Little coughs or sniffs that don't really mean much, or maybe a loud clearing of the throat. I remember my grandmother had a strange sound she made with her throat when it was a little sensitive! And then there may be an involuntary gasp or grunt when bending down to pick up something [[that's a really hard one to avoid, past a certain age....!).

To compensate, most older people have a more relaxed sense of humour, and accept these little 'isms' as a badge of honour, in recognition of their years. Which is just as it should be!

[westgrandboulevard]

144man....

On the subject of tinnitus, you will have the sympathy of both Jerry and myself.

I've had a hearing test, and the results were very good - especially [[and here comes the increasingly heard phrase) for my age....

You didn't happen to be on any medication when the tinnitus was noticeable?

[144man]

This was about five years ago and I was on no new medication. I was told my hearing showed no age impairment and my range was excellent.

[Jerry Oz]

I hate hearing tests. I keep hoping against hope that it will miraculously get better... The last couple confirm that it is not. If anything, I'm trying harder to hear but those higher pitches require more effort. I don't suppose a hearing aid or two would actually help for the long term, but I know they would improve my quality of life. I'm too stubborn to do it, though.

[westgrandboulevard]

144man....

Jerry [[over 10 years younger than us) says his hearing has changed much more than mine over the years, yet both he and I currently have tinnitus.

Like yours, my own hearing still seems quite acute. Odd.....


Jerry....

I was rather like that with glasses. If I'm wearing them, I still remove them for any photos, as I'm shorter-sighted, so can see around me quite well [[I'm typing this without glasses)....but probably do need the help with the longer distance vision, to comply with legal sight requirement for drivers.

[Jerry Oz]

I'm kind of scared by the fact that my hearing is extremely sensitive. If anything is too loud, it's irritating and if it's not quite loud enough, I struggle to hear certain high pitches. Curiously, I sometimes with I could have sub-titles when I go to the movies. The volume is loud enough to make my ears bleed, but I can't hear quiet [[loud) conversations between the players. I swear I don't know how that's possible but that is one of the most frustrating things. I know that hearing aids would make it easier to hear quiet conversation, but I'm afraid it will turn up some sounds to the point that I'll just take them out and take my chances without them. That is a lot of uncertainty to have before investing $3,000 into purchasing them.

[westgrandboulevard]

I'm 100% with you in not wishing to use hearing aids.

It probably has much to do with a conflict between how you see and have seen yourself for half a century of life - and how you really are, and are becoming.

Best to step forward. It's in your interests. Plan the hearing aids for introduction in 'the near future' Not to do so could become dangerous. You don't need to use them all the time, just at home, for tests, until you are more confident.

It might sound strange, but being concerned about having to use hearing aids [[i.e. perhaps seeing yourself as 'getting older') could be affecting your perception in many other ways, but not be aware of it.

[Jerry Oz]

I'm okay with wearing them because I've reconciled myself over the last 44 years that I might need to. I'm still debating how much they may help me. On one hand, I would love to hear the little sounds that I hear when I cup my hand around my ear. Normal people take those for granted but they are wonderful to me. But on the other hand, I don't want to be sensually bombarded with a lot of background noise that has me turning around every five seconds to see something that should rightfully be ignored. As I stated, my hearing is on a very fine line between what is comfortable and what is incredibly irritating. Modern hearing aids can amplify just the frequencies that you are missing, but I still suspect that I'll hear more overall volume than I'm comfortable with.

[westgrandboulevard]

I can understand that. You wouldn't want to be bombarded by 'natural sound' , even if it is only what many others hear, while you may have not. It could be that you're not noticing the loss of sounds which may not have been clear to you for many years.

This topic is making me think about my own hearing, as I have read that tinnitus can often lead to hearing problems later in life. I'm considering how I would feel if I found myself in your circumstances.

Presumably people can test hearing aids? And the volume can be adjusted? I'm aware they tend to whistle a little at times....

[Jerry Oz]

I'll look into whether I can test them or if I can bring them back if I'm not satisfied. I recall feeling jealous of a co-worker who got two of them a couple of years ago. That feeling alone should have prompted me to do it.

[westgrandboulevard]

Yes, a good way to perceive the 'problem' - i.e. going on as before, accepting less than good hearing, rather than consider help.

If many people have the same problem every day across the world, how are they dealing with it?

And if they can deal with it, so can you.

[Jerry Oz]

I guess we deal with it by dealing with it, for lack of a better phrase. Of course it's not fair to others when they have to repeat themselves because we didn't hear what they said the first time.

[westgrandboulevard]

Hmmm, I think I'd say it's what you may be missing that's most important, not how others may deal with it, or not..

[Jerry Oz]

Perhaps. I do feel bad when I see my wife's frustration, though. Oddly enough, the volume is not the problem so much as the pitch and tone. I sometimes have to think about the sounds I remember being spoken, put it into context of the conversation, and deduce what was said. This is when she's talking at a conversational level from 10-12 feet away, not when she's right beside me.

[westgrandboulevard]

Oh, now, I hadn't realised it was also a problem for your wife. When you said 'others', I magined it might be your colleagues at work. That hadn't quite clearly registered with me.

I guess that's why you listen to the TV using headphones, so that she's not disturbed by extra volume? - or perhaps its because she then doesn't disturb you?

May I say that she might be seeing the problem much clearer than you do....?

[Jerry Oz]

She is. However, there are two reasons for the headphones: 1. I hear the high sounds better when coming through headphones [[almost like cupping my ear with my hand) and 2. I don't disturb our neighbors; we have people on the opposite sides of two shared walls.

The problem with her talking from a distance is mainly because I tend to tightly focus on what I'm watching because I will miss something being said and by the time I know that she's talking, I've missed the first five words or so of what she said. I'm honestly not certain how loud my headphone volume is for a "normal" person, but sometimes the same volume affects me differently. It may be too loud as to irritate or not quite loud enough for me to be interested in what I'm listening to. I know that makes no sense.

[westgrandboulevard]

I must say that the first sentence of your second para is normal for everyone of middle years, and older, who is in a relationship. One of the most frequent conversational exchanges will be on the lines of "I know you're talking to me, but I can't/couldn't hear what you said..."

It happens here all the time, and I've had that confirmed from other people. We all have a habit of speaking when we're "concentrating on something else" - and then other people listen when they're "concentrating on something else"..

It sounds as though there may be some loss in hearing, but that there are also some issues with attention span? Is it possible that the two are not directly connected, just that the hearing issue is accentuating it?

[Jerry Oz]

I'm sorry, what?

j/k

I'll never buy it, though. For the most part, the only thing that would bring us closer [[in most regards) would be an umbilical cord.

[westgrandboulevard]

Not sure if the last sentence means good, or bad - but it probably is not so important

Time to bid farewell to Thursday May 8th. Tomorrow will be better and newer in ways which I had not planned today - so Friday, surprise me!

Speak again soon....

[Jerry Oz]

It was meant in a good way for me. She's a pain in my butt only because she's my most special joy. But let's keep that between you and me...

Good night, homeboy.

Good morning!

[westgrandboulevard]

And good morning, on Friday May 9th, from here in the UK.

Something to ponder. Sometimes, when people are very close, they don't always communicate fully with their nearest, in the same way they might with others who are less close.

For example, it's quite usual for someone to automatically assume their partner knows what they are thinking, but without expressing it quite clearly. It often manifests itself in throwaway lines like "Oh, you know...!!"

That could be a simple reason why there can be a 'dropout' in conversation and ,therefore, understanding - and which is not directly linked to hearing loss.

[Jerry Oz]

I'm afraid the "dropout" in my conversations with the Mrs. are literally dropouts. The only wrinkles that we run into are the few times when I want something that she is less inclined to want. It doesn't happen very often, but it always makes me pause because we are in synch 98% of the time. I suppose we should fight more often so that it won't disturb me when we disagree...

[westgrandboulevard]

Maybe not fight, but perhaps come out of the 'soft focus' mode sometimes?

If there are compromises being made, join the club [[it has a very large membership)....but that doesn't always make them fully appropriate.

It becomes a little like hearing hit medleys performed, when you want to hear the full versions!

[Jerry Oz]

I guess. If anything, we're a couple that should copyright the phrase "yes, dear". We have our differences but any deal breakers have long since been hammered out. Life is good.

[westgrandboulevard]

"Yes, dear" : that's a classic compromise...but when life is good, compromises are positive.

[Jerry Oz]

People sometimes become entrenched on worthless points. Evaluate the larger scheme and if it's that important, then don't bend. But if it's just a matter of wanting to be right, you should check yourself for why you feel that way. And if it leads to arguments, then realize that you aren't intended for each other.

That's the hard part for most. They don't want to let go but they don't have any logical reasons to hold on. Deal with it honestly if you're not compatible or you've grown apart.

[westgrandboulevard]

I'm always curious why some couples seem to thrive on arguments, but I suppose it's just their temperament, and is mutually understood.

[Jerry Oz]

It's that a case of opposites attracting or would that couple be more similar than opposite?

[westgrandboulevard]

Similar in temperament, I would think - otherwise, however would they cope with all that high-octane behaviour?

[Jerry Oz]

I'm a firm believer that humans only engage in behavior that is rewarding on some level. Even if that reward is illogical to others [[or sometimes themselves). Survival is the first law of nature, so for someone to stay in an abusive situation, there must be some consequence that outweighs it. It's confusing, but it's the only thing that makes sense. Again, since self actualization sits atop the pyramid of needs, there must be some validation felt by the person who is on either end of that equation. Sick.

[westgrandboulevard]

Can you expand a little on 'self actualisation' - ? Not totally clear what that involves. I may know it very well, just not by that description....but I'm well understanding your drift....

[Jerry Oz]

My interpretation is that we seek to become the best that we can be, but that relative phrase applies only to ourselves. Of course, we cannot optimize every facet of our beings, so one thing or another is dominant in our focus. It can be success as measured by income, sexual conquest, social standing, peer approval or any of thousands of things. In context of our discussion, it makes no sense to me for someone to "love" another who treats them in an ill manner, but there has to be something that is being satisfied by the other person. For lack of a better way to put it, it makes them feel better for the experience of feeling worse.

[westgrandboulevard]

I still think it is a 'two peas in a pod' concept. They recognise something of themself in each other, but it is negative - hence the abuse meted out, and the abuse taken. No, it doesn't make sense to a bystander, does it....

I'm not entirely sure that most people do seek to become the best that they can be. I'd say you are quoting an ideal situation, and having that as a target would be the exception, not the rule. To me, it seems that most people would say they are happy just as long as they are not feeling unhappy....[[?)

[Jerry Oz]

I have to disagree with you on that one. I've met people who cannot stand the thought that something's not wrong. It dominates their lives and they become upset when it is suggested that they perhaps are reading too much into a given situation. They are perpetually unhappy and that is - per my understanding described in #2683 - their focus in life. Their pursuit of actualization can only be realized by being proven right, even if it is a miserable conclusion [[they do have cancer, he is cheating, there is a hair in their food). In my opinion, these people are unhappy unless they are unhappy.

[westgrandboulevard]

Sure, but that's not most people.....at least, not most of the time...

[Jerry Oz]

That is true. It also makes me think that "normal" it's so subjective. I shudder to consider how my behaviors would be perceived by someone who studies such things and its in position to evaluate me...

[westgrandboulevard]

You seem OK to me...but then, I'm thousands of miles away LOL

[Jerry Oz]

I'm typing this while wearing a purple and green spotted leather tutu, a fluorescent orange dress shirt, mismatched slippers, and there is a Canadian Goose nesting on my head. I have been typing with my nose because I don't want the government to find my fingerprints on the keyboard.

[westgrandboulevard]

Jerry, your secret is quite safe with me, - and, of course, all the others who have contributed over 54,000 views to this thread, many of whom may be viewing as I write.

Complete discretion is guaranteed.

[Jerry Oz]

"Secret"? I thought everyone did that... You are talking about the nose thing, right?

[westgrandboulevard]

If it makes you feel more comfortable, then yes I was....

[Jerry Oz]

Cool cool cool... You had me worried about you for a minute there.

[westgrandboulevard]

Oh, I'm fine. It's just all those others I worry about....!

[Jerry Oz]

Interesting... And how long have these "others" been worrying you? [[​Dr. Oz pulls out a pen and pad of paper to take notes...)

[westgrandboulevard]

Ha! But, you do have me wondering....as I don't know if my words in #2694 are a stock phrase that's as commonly used in the US, as it is here - ??

When asked how they are, some here [[generally from the older generation) will say brightly "Oh! I'm all right - it's just all the others...!!"

In other words, I'm OK, but I'm really not so sure about "all the others"....

I'm wondering if there may be a tendency in the US culture to take remarks logically and literally [[which is very understandable) - but there is more of a tendency with UK conversation to be dry and ironic. I can understand that could be confusing....!

[Jerry Oz]

I was just kidding... And I full well knew that you were kidding. I'm a fan of a lot of British humor [[not just English humor). The Simon Pegg/Nick Frost movies are about the only good comedy being filmed these days.

[westgrandboulevard]

Yes, of course, but different sense of humour between countries can be interesting, and also sometimes an obstacle.

It must have seemed very odd to the Americans to hear residents of London during the WW2 being interviewed on Pathe News. The place was being bombed, the population were surviving on rations, people were immediately running to shelter every time they heard air raid sirens, and sometimes sleeping in underground stations [['The Tube'). There were absolute disasters and many lives lost at these times, which were known throughout London but not published, to maintain morale.

Throughout all of that, still there was a tendency for the average Londoner [[especially the Cockneys) to respond to any interviewer asking after their welfare : "Oh, mustn't grumble!!"

Have you seen the 'Carry On' films? There is a classic send up of the absolutely barmy way the British appear to behave under threat, during the final scene of 'Carry On Up The Khyber'.....

[Jerry Oz]

I have not. I used to be a diligent watcher of "Monty Python's Flying Circus", though. Everything was played straight, even the over the top skits. Here, you have to convince people that you're trying to be funny or they won't know that there was a joke. That leads to more slapstick and obvious sight gags.

[westgrandboulevard]

I never really gelled with Monty Python. There were occasions when I felt uncomfortable, and that kills any ability to spontaneously find humour in the presentation.

Slapstick was popular here in the days of music hall, and films up until the middle of the last century [[say 1960s/1970s) but has yielded increasingly to more sophisticated humour - but which has reduced the innate warmth of the humour on show. It can be a bit too 'clever' sometimes.....