Motown/Disco/Supremes

**aarondillon2011@gmail.com** · 06-11-2016, 07:16 PM

Anyone care to speculate what may have been if the Supremes had went full blown into Disco with their 1975 album? Any why didn't Motown pursue a more disco sound of the late 70's? Yes I know there are a few disco songs and albums during that period.

**marv2** · 06-11-2016, 07:44 PM

I don't know,but "He's My Man" was a U.S. Billboard Disco number 1 hit in 1975.

**aarondillon2011@gmail.com** · 06-11-2016, 07:51 PM

Not a bad song but I think it needed that typical disco instrumental break

**marv2** · 06-11-2016, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by aarondillon2011@gmail.com

Not a bad song but I think it needed that typical disco instrumental break

There is also an extended version.

**aarondillon2011@gmail.com** · 06-11-2016, 08:01 PM

I wonder if that version would have faired a little better

**marv2** · 06-11-2016, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by aarondillon2011@gmail.com

I wonder if that version would have faired a little better

Now I'm wondering that now. It was a true dance record and vocals were superb. Speaking of Disco, 40 years ago this week "Love Hangover" by Diana Ross was the number one record.

**Bluebrock** · 06-12-2016, 03:49 AM

Originally Posted by aarondillon2011@gmail.com

I wonder if that version would have faired a little better

They cut some magnificent uptempo stuff on those final three albums. Most of the material was strong enough, the girls were in fine voice and they looked sensational but they did not sound like the traditional Supremes from the Diana and Jean eras. They were in a catch 22 situation. Should they maintain their sound and be accused of not evolving , or should they attempt to update their sound and be accused of selling out? They couldn't win. Having said that it didn't really matter in the long run. Motown had lost interest in the Supremes and didn't promote them nearly enough.

**sup_fan** · 06-13-2016, 09:35 AM

IMO He's My Man is a nice song and kinda catchy. but i felt most of the Sup 75 songs were what i call "generic disco" meaning that they were songs anyone could sing. Love Hangover is totally Diana. it's hard to imagine anyone else. Same with the original I Will Survive and many other songs of the era.

when the girls did I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do the Walking, they seemed to be gathering speed. out of the sessions for Sup 75, i think the best track was I Could Never Recover. that's the one that seems to most of a new sound for the girls. a tougher, go-get-em mentality, great vocals, etc. IGLMHDTW really seems to establish a potential sound for the girls and if they'd both had the support of Motown and had some unity within the group, things might have been different.

this sound really was solidified with the MS&S lp and songs like Driving Wheel, Love I Never Knew and especially Let Yourself Go. again had they not been fighting internally, had Pedro not been involved, had motown supported them, things might have been different

also the issue of follow up single. while i like a lot of the tracks on HE, after the power of IGLMHDTW, they needed a great follow up. to me, none of the tracks on HE quite cut it. the vocals of the single, amazing production and track, the woo-hoo-woo-hoo backing vocals, nothing else quite sparkled like that. i think the title track is great but it's 180 degrees different. slower paced, more mysterious in tone and sound, lacks a catchy chorus. they should have gone directly to Let Yourself Go. both are in major keys, clear singable choruses. it's like how Baby Love and Come See About Me were patterned after WDOLG. Driving Wheel was the wrong follow up. perhaps has the follow up to Let Yourself it might have worked.

**Bluebrock** · 06-13-2016, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by sup_fan

IMO He's My Man is a nice song and kinda catchy. but i felt most of the Sup 75 songs were what i call "generic disco" meaning that they were songs anyone could sing. Love Hangover is totally Diana. it's hard to imagine anyone else. Same with the original I Will Survive and many other songs of the era.

when the girls did I'm Gonna Let My Heart Do the Walking, they seemed to be gathering speed. out of the sessions for Sup 75, i think the best track was I Could Never Recover. that's the one that seems to most of a new sound for the girls. a tougher, go-get-em mentality, great vocals, etc. IGLMHDTW really seems to establish a potential sound for the girls and if they'd both had the support of Motown and had some unity within the group, things might have been different.

this sound really was solidified with the MS&S lp and songs like Driving Wheel, Love I Never Knew and especially Let Yourself Go. again had they not been fighting internally, had Pedro not been involved, had motown supported them, things might have been different

also the issue of follow up single. while i like a lot of the tracks on HE, after the power of IGLMHDTW, they needed a great follow up. to me, none of the tracks on HE quite cut it. the vocals of the single, amazing production and track, the woo-hoo-woo-hoo backing vocals, nothing else quite sparkled like that. i think the title track is great but it's 180 degrees different. slower paced, more mysterious in tone and sound, lacks a catchy chorus. they should have gone directly to Let Yourself Go. both are in major keys, clear singable choruses. it's like how Baby Love and Come See About Me were patterned after WDOLG. Driving Wheel was the wrong follow up. perhaps has the follow up to Let Yourself it might have worked.

I think "your whats missing in my life" would have been a great follow up to "iglmhdtw". The whole album was strong from start to finish but perhaps devoid of many potential hits.

**daviddh** · 07-21-2016, 10:01 PM

Surprised what's missing in my life wasn't a single

**marybrewster** · 07-29-2016, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by daviddh

Surprised what's missing in my life wasn't a single

It was the B side of "You're My Driving Wheel".

**jobeterob** · 07-22-2016, 03:07 AM

I think it was. It was just a quick failure

**franjoy56** · 07-22-2016, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by jobeterob

I think it was. It was just a quick failure

this song was not releasd as a single

**franjoy56** · 07-22-2016, 12:41 PM

im referring to your whats missing in my life. It ws performed on soul train in 76

**daviddh** · 07-22-2016, 08:20 AM

Bend A Little was really good.my pick for single

**Motown Eddie** · 07-22-2016, 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by aarondillon2011@gmail.com

Anyone care to speculate what may have been if the Supremes had went full blown into Disco with their 1975 album? Any why didn't Motown pursue a more disco sound of the late 70's? Yes I know there are a few disco songs and albums during that period.

Perhaps it was because Mary Wilson didn't really care for Disco [[according to what she said about disco music in her second book). However, The Supremes might have been able to get back on top of the music world if they went head long into Disco [[with more songs like "Gonna Let My Heart Do The Walking") and if Motown had put a full blown marketing campaign behind them.

**franjoy56** · 07-22-2016, 12:48 PM

This group had great potential. Only you reworke w more of a disco flavor could have worked as a folow up t walking and released in sept of 76

**marv2** · 07-22-2016, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by franjoy56

This group had great potential. Only you reworke w more of a disco flavor could have worked as a folow up t walking and released in sept of 76

"Driving Wheel" was a fine record, but they were singing the chorus up front and Scherrie was leading from behind. They needed songs/recordings with more rhythm and percussion....heavy on the percussion at that time.

**daviddh** · 07-22-2016, 06:54 PM

the last three albums were good and No Andantess!!!! all vocals by Supremes. I think Its All Been Said B4 could have done something along with Sha La Bandit. I like the original version of High Energy as opposed to the released version.
MSS is filled with great high energy vocals.

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-22-2016, 08:45 PM

It's All Been Said Before was perfect for pop top 40 at that moment in time, whoever pulled that from being a single really f***ed up their chances to be re established at Top 40 radio, which they needed to do more than anything else

**Bluebrock** · 07-23-2016, 05:15 AM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

It's All Been Said Before was perfect for pop top 40 at that moment in time, whoever pulled that from being a single really f***ed up their chances to be re established at Top 40 radio, which they needed to do more than anything else

Totally agree Jimi. It was a mighty fine pop-disco song. It could have done with being a little longer but otherwise it was perfect for top 40 radio. He's my man could have done better had it followed IABSB

**greg jones** · 07-23-2016, 10:29 PM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

It's All Been Said Before was perfect for pop top 40 at that moment in time, whoever pulled that from being a single really f***ed up their chances to be re established at Top 40 radio, which they needed to do more than anything else

I've often wondered if the reason that it was cancelled was because of Mike Curb and Berry Gordy having some disagreements around this time, especially since he didn't use many Jobete published songs. Mike Curb was also trying to break his contract with Berry on his 1/2 ownership of the MC country label around this time and take TG Shepherd and Pat Boone with him to his Warner/Curb label. Plus, I think that Berry wasn't happy when Curb struck gold with The 4 Seasons on Who Loves You and December 1963 after they left Motown/MoWest. Curb, I know was jealous that Frankie Valli solo material had to go to Larry Uttal and Private Stock for that 3 year period and beat him to releasing My Eyes Adored You that the 4 Seasons recorded while at Motown/MoWest.

I know the plans for a Supremes album being produced by Michael Lloyd and Mike Curb quickly came to end after It's All Been Said Before was cancelled. Michael and Mike wanted to sprinkle the album with some more '50's/ '60's remakes, similar to what they had done with other Curb artists and on The Shoop Shoop Song [[It's In His Kiss.)

**daviddh** · 07-23-2016, 09:23 AM

I heard a remix of Where Do I Go From here that was really good, so much better than the original. made it so much better and if that version was released in 75, think it could have been a hit

**daviddh** · 07-23-2016, 09:28 AM

Bluebrock, since I respect your opinion. what is your take on Bad Weather.
I never cared for it and it took a while for me to warm to it but now, I think the vocals are good and the lyrics but to me it sounds over produced. no real climax at all. I always thought this song needed a remix,.but the version on the pink box set was a bit better.;like how it fades and comes back in

**Bluebrock** · 07-23-2016, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by daviddh

Bluebrock, since I respect your opinion. what is your take on Bad Weather.
I never cared for it and it took a while for me to warm to it but now, I think the vocals are good and the lyrics but to me it sounds over produced. no real climax at all. I always thought this song needed a remix,.but the version on the pink box set was a bit better.;like how it fades and comes back in

I loved Bad Weather David, in fact it was one of my favourite Supremes songs of any era. I think it should have been a big hit but it followed the dismal Jimmy Webb album which all but killed off Jean's Supremes career. I would have loved a Stevie produced Supremes album but by this time the internal strife within the group was at an all time low and nothing could save them, but yes i adored Bad Weather,

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-23-2016, 11:53 AM

Bad weather is, in a word, clunky.. and the record felt like it was several minutes of waiting for it to really get started, but it never did.. I was rooting for the 70's Supremes [[and writing about them) every step of the way, but this was just Bad News..When I heard "The Day Will Come Between Sunday And Monday" i was like,'why wasn't THAT a single? why wasn't the cover version of "Bridge Over Troubled Waters" a single? even "Tossin And Turnin" but of course Motown didn't own the publishing which is where the money is, so there ya go

**Motown Eddie** · 07-23-2016, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

Bad weather is, in a word, clunky.. and the record felt like it was several minutes of waiting for it to really get started, but it never did.. I was rooting for the 70's Supremes [[and writing about them) every step of the way, but this was just Bad News..When I heard "The Day Will Come Between Sunday And Monday" i was like,'why wasn't THAT a single? why wasn't the cover version of "Bridge Over Troubled Waters" a single? even "Tossin And Turnin" but of course Motown didn't own the publishing which is where the money is, so there ya go

Not owning the publishing to a song [[like 'Tossin And Turning') hasn't stopped Motown from releasing a song as a single before. Some examples include Michael Jackson's 'Rockin' Robin'; The Supremes & Four Tops' 'River Deep Mountain High', Stevie Wonder's 'Blowing In The Wind' & DRATS & The Tempts' 'I'm Gonna Make You Love Me'.

**Bluebrock** · 07-23-2016, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

Bad weather is, in a word, clunky.. and the record felt like it was several minutes of waiting for it to really get started, but it never did.. I was rooting for the 70's Supremes [[and writing about them) every step of the way, but this was just Bad News..When I heard "The Day Will Come Between Sunday And Monday" i was like,'why wasn't THAT a single? why wasn't the cover version of "Bridge Over Troubled Waters" a single? even "Tossin And Turnin" but of course Motown didn't own the publishing which is where the money is, so there ya go

Jimi - i don't think BOTW could have been a success so soon after Simon and Garfunkel's smash hit version. Maybe a few years down the line but not just a year or two after the original had hit big

**johnny_raven** · 07-23-2016, 12:05 PM

"It's Time To Break Down" should have been the follow up single to "Stoned Love"!

**Bluebrock** · 07-23-2016, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by johnny_raven

"It's Time To Break Down" should have been the follow up single to "Stoned Love"!

Agreed Johnny. They should have put this out to follow Stoned Love. It could have been a sizeable hit.

**thommg** · 07-23-2016, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by johnny_raven

"It's Time To Break Down" should have been the follow up single to "Stoned Love"!

I thought it would be as they performed it on The Flip Wilson Show. At least, I think it was Flip Wilson.

**Bluebrock** · 07-24-2016, 02:46 AM

Originally Posted by thommg

I thought it would be as they performed it on The Flip Wilson Show. At least, I think it was Flip Wilson.

There is certainly footage on youtube showing them performing it. One would assume it was at least considered as a possible single?

**daviddh** · 07-23-2016, 12:08 PM

Agreed.I liked Shine On Me as well. Think I read Together We Can Make Sweet Music was considered but then the Spinners released it in 71.

**daviddh** · 07-23-2016, 04:49 PM

I liked their original material like Time To Break Down.
agree, the Webb lp was a mess. I think I liked 2 tracks. Keep It Hid and Silent Voices.
also When Can Brown Begin was lovely but I would have preferred 3 part harmony ,not Blossoms.
I liked BW but ,to me it wasn't danceable like Gonna Let My Heart was in 76. it needed something .

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-23-2016, 08:44 PM

The Supremes R&B version of "Bridge" would have been recieved like Issac Hayes Top Twenty version of "Never Can Say Goodbye" in 1971, or Aretha's "Bridge Over Troubled Water' which went to #6 pop in 1971, just a year after The Supremes 1970 cover..there are numerous examples of r&b covers of white pop hits during the Jean Terrell era, which is why i think "Bridge' would have also been a great choice for a single.. Aretha was notorious in this regard; she went Top Ten with "I Say A Little Prayer" only one year after Dionne Warwick went Top Ten with that song.. as Tom Jones might say, back then it was "..Not Unusual"

**marv2** · 07-23-2016, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

The Supremes R&B version of "Bridge" would have been recieved like Issac Hayes Top Twenty version of "Never Can Say Goodbye" in 1971, or Aretha's "Bridge Over Troubled Water' which went to #6 pop in 1971, just a year after The Supremes 1970 cover..there are numerous examples of r&b covers of white pop hits during the Jean Terrell era, which is why i think "Bridge' would have also been a great choice for a single.. Aretha was notorious in this regard; she went Top Ten with "I Say A Little Prayer" only one year after Dionne Warwick went Top Ten with that song.. as Tom Jones might say, back then it was "..Not Unusual"

Their version of Steams' "Na Na Na Kiss Him Goodbye" was also a top track.

**Bluebrock** · 07-24-2016, 02:49 AM

Originally Posted by Jimi LaLumia

The Supremes R&B version of "Bridge" would have been recieved like Issac Hayes Top Twenty version of "Never Can Say Goodbye" in 1971, or Aretha's "Bridge Over Troubled Water' which went to #6 pop in 1971, just a year after The Supremes 1970 cover..there are numerous examples of r&b covers of white pop hits during the Jean Terrell era, which is why i think "Bridge' would have also been a great choice for a single.. Aretha was notorious in this regard; she went Top Ten with "I Say A Little Prayer" only one year after Dionne Warwick went Top Ten with that song.. as Tom Jones might say, back then it was "..Not Unusual"

Maybe, maybe not. Sadly we shall never know but i remain unconvinced, but it is great to discuss these subjects with you and the other guys on the forum.

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-23-2016, 09:18 PM

yes, that rocked, actually..

**marv2** · 07-23-2016, 09:23 PM

The rhythm track is kicking and the ladies singing in unison makes it rock for me.......

**rod_rick** · 07-23-2016, 09:48 PM

Originally Posted by marv2

The rhythm track is kicking and the ladies singing in unison makes it rock for me.......

This is one of my favorites and the breakdown was really funky, imo I enjoyed the entire album from start to finish except for Come Together.

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-23-2016, 11:20 PM

wow, I never heard any of this! Big news.. thanks Greg.. i thought it had something to do with publishing but it obviously went much deeper.. and helped keep the group underwater, sadly..

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-24-2016, 08:44 AM

absolutely, you are a breath of fresh air here.. Salute!

**daviddh** · 07-24-2016, 10:52 AM

New Ways was really good except Come Together. They should have used something else but the LP was strong.alot of great tracks.think they should have dropped alot of the Broadway style songs and incorporated more of their LP cuts in to their live shows, perhaps it would have helped the album sales a bit. wasn't the track May His Love Shine On Me from this session and a few Mary led tracks, sorry I don't remember the titles as they were removed from You Tube very quickly. I think Motown was tryn to keep the 60s image or maybe Mary was and the producers were tryn to push the group forward. catch 22 maybe. but I do think the Jean led group had some good hits and lp tracks.
I really liked Now The Bitter from the FJ album .kinda funky

**daviddh** · 07-26-2016, 08:28 PM

It's all been said should have never been cancelled as a single or life beats

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-26-2016, 09:09 PM

well, it WAS a single in Australia..https://www.discogs.com/sell/release/5927644?ev=rb

**Ollie9** · 07-27-2016, 04:42 AM

As from the time of the High Energy album being released, a complete change of image was needed. I would have toned down some of the frantic dance choreography and had them wearing individually designed outfits as opposed to matching sparkly frocks. Show tunes would have been banished from live shows and replaced with some of the many great songs from their recent albums.
There was a lot competition from other girl groups at this time which is why i believe the group had to move a little away from their traditional glamour image to present themselves as something new. I think it might perhaps have been a good idea if they had named themselves the New Supremes from the offset to extinguish from the beginning the obligatory comparissons to Diana.
I never thought "Your My Driving Wheel" a great choice for a single. "I Dont Want To Be Tied Down" or the stunning "We Should Be CloserTogether" sound far more commercial to my ears.

**Bluebrock** · 07-27-2016, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by Ollie9

As from the time of the High Energy album being released, a complete change of image was needed. I would have toned down some of the frantic dance choreography and had them wearing individually designed outfits as opposed to matching sparkly frocks. Show tunes would have been banished from live shows and replaced with some of the many great songs from their recent albums.
There was a lot competition from other girl groups at this time which is why i believe the group had to move a little away from their traditional glamour image to present themselves as something new. I think it might perhaps have been a good idea if they had named themselves the New Supremes from the offset to extinguish from the beginning the obligatory comparissons to Diana.
I never thought "Your My Driving Wheel" a great choice for a single. "I Dont Want To Be Tied Down" or the stunning "We Should Be CloserTogether" sound far more commercial to my ears.

I agree Ollie, Driving Wheel was a poor choice for the 1st single. It's a decent enough song but not strong enough to be a major hit single. My heart sank when i heard it - not because i didn't like it but i kind of knew it all but signaled the end of the group. There were several other better potential hits on that album , even though as a whole it wasn't as strong as HIGH ENERGY.

**Ollie9** · 07-27-2016, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by Bluebrock

I agree Ollie, Driving Wheel was a poor choice for the 1st single. It's a decent enough song but not strong enough to be a major hit single. My heart sank when i heard it - not because i didn't like it but i kind of knew it all but signaled the end of the group. There were several other better potential hits on that album , even though as a whole it wasn't as strong as HIGH ENERGY.

It was indeed a very very poor choice for a lead single Bluebrock. As you say there were so many much stronger songs on the album. Bad single choices killed the album which is a great shame as there was potential there. It was great that the group had three lead singers. I wish they could have recorded a least one more album together.

**Bluebrock** · 07-27-2016, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Ollie9

It was indeed a very very poor choice for a lead single Bluebrock. As you say there were so many much stronger songs on the album. Bad single choices killed the album which is a great shame as there was potential there. It was great that the group had three lead singers. I wish they could have recorded a least one more album together.

Me too Ollie.

**Jimi LaLumia** · 07-27-2016, 06:02 AM

frantic dance is an understatement, the routines were ridiculous to watch and take seriously.. the name Supremes was associated with elegance and there was nothing elegant about those 'escaped from an institution ' speed freak a go go moves. they should have stuck to the stand there and sing program, even for the up tempo dance songs, we knew they were dance songs, we didn't need visual demonstrations.