Jimi Hendrix was frustrated that he wasn't accepted by Black audiences

[soulster]

Here's a very interesting article from CNN about a side of Jimi Hendrix people didn't know or understand:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/18/showbi...html?hpt=hp_c2

A lot of this I didn't know, and now it makes sense of why he really got rid of Chaz Chandler and Noel Redding.

[Jerry Oz]

I heard that Band of Gypsies was formed as a result of his wanting to speak to Black audiences. I thought it was more with the criticism he received from Black critics than it was frustration over his music reaching White crowds almost exclusively.

[imnokid]

I know another black artist who is similarly frustrated.

[robb_k]

He shouldn't have taken it personally. It was just the sound of his music, and maybe the lyrics. I liked his guitar playing on his sessions with the Isley Brothers and the other pre-1966 recordings he made. I just didn't like his "psychadelic" style songs, music, screaming and heavy reverberation and loud, very electric sounding guitar playing in his solo career. It's a bunch of ear-splitting noise to me. And I don't like screaming. And, also, I don't really identify with the "psychadelic lyrics".

I can understand why The Black community didn't embrace his music. probably for many of the same reasons, and also because the themes of his songs were not really much a part of the Black Community's experience.

[marv2]

It wasn't him at all, it was the style of music he was playing at the height of his fame and popularity. He started off playing R&B as I recall.

[Jerry Oz]

It started as them not understanding the music, but when words like 'uncle Tom', 'Oreo', and 'wannabe' come into play, it's pure ignorance and unnecessarily personal. I became a fan more than 20 years after his death when my tastes matured and I started listening to a wide variety of music. I'm glad subsequent Black rock artists like Lenny Kravitz, Fishbone, and Living Colour have had to deal with less BS from their communities.

[thomas96]

It wasn't him at all, it was the style of music he was playing at the height of his fame and popularity. He started off playing R&B as I call.

He was in a band with Bobby Taylor as a teenager in the late 50s to early 60s but was kicked out because he solo'd too much and would show up late to gigs.

[robb_k]

He was in a band with Bobby Taylor as a teenager in the late 50s to early 60s but was kicked out because he solo'd too much and would show up late to gigs.

Yes, he played traditional R&B and even some Blues. He was a fine player. His new style was just something with which The Black community and some of us "Caucasians" couldn't identify or embrace.

[marv2]

He was in a band with Bobby Taylor as a teenager in the late 50s to early 60s but was kicked out because he solo'd too much and would show up late to gigs.

That's true. He also backed the Isley Brothers and Wilson Pickett at different times. Jimi 's "transformation" was similiar to that of Tina Turner's decades later.

[soulster]

He shouldn't have taken it personally. It was just the sound of his music, and maybe the lyrics. I liked his guitar playing on his sessions with the Isley Brothers and the other pre-1966 recordings he made. I just didn't like his "psychadelic" style songs, music, screaming and heavy reverberation and loud, very electric sounding guitar playing in his solo career. It's a bunch of ear-splitting noise to me. And I don't like screaming. And, also, I don't really identify with the "psychadelic lyrics".

I can understand why The Black community didn't embrace his music. probably for many of the same reasons, and also because the themes of his songs were not really much a part of the Black Community's experience.

Here's the interesting and sad part: Hendrix died before he could ever see the appreciation many of the younger Blacks had for him, especially the other musicians, most notably the younger three Isley brothers, Vernon Reid, Eddie Hazel, Rick James, Mother's Finest, tons of Black metal bands in the early 80s who were never recognized, or legions of the younger Black guys who bought the records. I was a little kid when Hendrix was enjoying his superstardom, but I imagine it was the older Blacks who rejected him.

After reading the article, I went through Hendrix's albums, and the writer of the article is dead on about Hendrix trying to remind people of his musical roots.

We didn't play any Hendrix on our house while I was growing up. I never ever heard of Hendrix until somewhere in the 80s! My older sister, who bought most of the records in the 60s, didn't like "all the White mess". It's not that she didn't like white people [[she was a bit of a bigot after she moved to Texas), she listened to them as long as they did soul music. But, my other sister and I loved rock music, and she likes Jimi Hendrix too. We're younger, so maybe that's part of it. I'm sure it is. We, who grew up in the late 60s and the 70s, and in integrated areas were exposed to The beatles, Rolling Stones, Yes, Led Zeppelin, and all the pop/rock on the radio.

[soulster]

I'm glad subsequent Black rock artists like Lenny Kravitz, Fishbone, and Living Colour have had to deal with less BS from their communities.

Not so fast! Vernon Reid started the Black Rock Coalition in the early 90s because he, and other Black rockers, even then, didn't get much respect because they were Black. Fishbone and Lenny Kravitz both have also expressed a certain frustration with either not being fully accepted by Whites, not being accepted at all by Blacks, and the record industry either ignoring them, or trying to make them do R&B. More than one Black rock artist have expressed frustration because their label, forced them into music they didn't want to do. Jayne Kennedy and Mother's Finest were notable in this. Fortunately, it took people like Prince, Rick James, and Ernie Isley to push the envelope. Too bad Rick James buckled from pressure to not have blistering guitar solos on his records. The album version of "Fool On The Street" is one of the best songs he's ever recorded.

Imagine my joy on hearing the guitar solo on the end of Earth, Wind & Fire's "Love's Holiday" when "All 'N All" came out. And, let's not forget albums and albums of P-Funk in the late 60s and the 70s. They, as well as tons of White rockers, owe it all to Jimi Hendrix.

But, the main thing we gather from the article is that Jimi wanted his race to be recognized. It was his heritage that forged all that talent. He never forgot where he came from, even though his audience didn't care.

[soulster]

Jimi 's "transformation" was similiar to that of Tina Turner's decades later.

Say what??? Ike & Tina were doing rock in the early 70s when Ike realized that was the way to go. Ike later said he didn't care for it.

[splanky]

I had some problems with the article but enjoyed the read. Much of it factual, some of it
too generalising. For one thing I don't like the term Heavy metal being used so much through it. There are differences between Metal and Hard Rock which is what a lot of Jimi's
work could be classified as. Another thing, I remember Harlem's rejection of Jimi, I grew up
in it but I also remember that I first heard Jimi's music at my cousin's house in Queens, NY
where he had a lot of black fans. Too bad they didn't have a venue to match the Apollo...
Anyway, I'm sure I wasn't the only black Harlem resident who dug him. But New York city
has always been a strange place when it comes to music. They were scared to death of the
blues, abandoned jazz radio and for the longest time if you wan't to hear and see funk you
had to go down south. Disco is the only black originated music genre NY has ever stood up
for and that crossover became it's primary objective probably has a lot to do with it....

[soulster]

That New York rejected jazz is very surprising to me, Splanky! And, I know you're right about Black fans liking Hendrix's music. I think that it was more of a generational thing than anything.

But, I don't understand who the term "heavy metal" bothers you. If Jimi was one of the architects of it, why protest his association with it? All heavy metal is is heavy blues. Look at all the big metal bands out there during his time: Led Zeppelin, Blue Cheer, Vanilla Fudge...they were all doing a heavy brand of blues: heavy metal.

[timmyfunk]

It's also unfortunate that he didn't live long enough to further what he started with the BOG. It's pretty clear that Hendrix would've dove head first into the Funk had he lived longer.

[Jerry Oz]

It's also unfortunate that he didn't live long enough to further what he started with the BOG. It's pretty clear that Hendrix would've dove head first into the Funk had he lived longer.

And it's a good chance that what we know of funk now would either have been different or a two-headed monster. Just like Sly Stone influenced a lot of P-Funk and James Brown influenced the entire genre, I can only imagine that Hendrix would have added to the fundamentals and foundations of funk.

[marv2]

Say what??? Ike & Tina were doing rock in the early 70s when Ike realized that was the way to go. Ike later said he didn't care for it.

Yeah but they also played R&B/Soul music. Tina went further in the Rock area as her solo career progressed.

[soulster]

And it's a good chance that what we know of funk now would either have been different or a two-headed monster. Just like Sly Stone influenced a lot of P-Funk and James Brown influenced the entire genre, I can only imagine that Hendrix would have added to the fundamentals and foundations of funk.

That is an interesting thought: what direction he would have taken. He was trying desperately to gain credibility as a Black artist, but he also wanted a pop hit. It seems he was doing both of these things simultaneously.

I listened to "Band Of Gypsies" again the other night, and it really sounded no different than what he was doing with The Experience. His style was just too unique. It was him. Blues, rock, metal, soul, whatever you want to call it, it was all Jimi and his unique fusion of styles.

But, I understand where he was coming from. He lived in a time when it was important for Blacks to have an identity as a Black person. It was important to connect to your people. Most all Black artists did what they could to forge that connection. That all came apart in the the late era of disco, and in the 80s, when Black artists did all they could to crossover.

I think it's really unfortunate that he got rid of his White bandmates, because in a couple of years after his death, Black America embraced The Canadian band Skylark and their hit "Wildflower", and later, the Scottish Average White Band, and then Rufus from Chicago. But, in those cases, it was all about the music, not the racial makeup.

[Jerry Oz]

I wonder if the people who criticized him enjoyed early Funkadelic records, some of which were very hard-core? And if they did, I wonder if they did mainly because of the color of the musicians?

[roger]

For those who are interested ... this is JIMI HENDRIX's U.K. chart history ....

6 Jimi Hendrix Experience Hey Joe Jan 1967
3 Jimi Hendrix Experience Purple Haze Mar 1967
6 Jimi Hendrix Experience The Wind Cries Mary May 1967
18 Jimi Hendrix Experience Burning Of The Midnight Lamp Aug 1967
5 Jimi Hendrix Experience All Along The Watchtower Oct 1968
37 Jimi Hendrix Experience Crosstown Traffic Apr 1969
1 Jimi Hendrix Experience Voodoo Chile Nov 1970
35 Jimi Hendrix Experience Gypsy Eyes / Remember Oct 1971
35 Jimi Hendrix Experience Johnny B. Goode Feb 1972

As per ... http://www.everyhit.com/

From what I recall from 1967/8/9 his main fan-base in Britain was amongst the [[veering hippy) "Progressive Blues/Rock" mob, some people who preferred "Soul" liked him but some other "Soul" fans were very iffy. Personally I have the grand total of NO Jimi Hendrix recordings, and although I find some of those earlier recordings listenable I found his sole #1 U.K. hit "Voodoo Child" [[issued just after he died as some kind of "tribute") to be a total turn-off.

Certainly Mr Hendrix was very talented as a guitarist but as his music was radically different from what was happening in Soul/R&B at the time I don't find it at all peculiar that most Soul/R&B fans [[which I suppose in the U.S. would be synonymous with "The Black Audience") had little interest in him.

Roger

[soulster]

Certainly Mr Hendrix was very talented as a guitarist but as his music was radically different from what was happening in Soul/R&B at the time I don't find it at all peculiar that most Soul/R&B fans [[which I suppose in the U.S. would be synonymous with "The Black Audience") had little interest in him.

Roger

That is about the same here in the U.S.. But, like I mentioned before, there were obviously younger cats and musicians who dug Hendrix. The R&B establishment had no use for him.

[Jerry Oz]

That is about the same here in the U.S.. But, like I mentioned before, there were obviously younger cats and musicians who dug Hendrix. The R&B establishment had no use for him.

But there were some who picked up on the solos, if not the arrangements. Ernie Isley very clearly paid close attention when Hendrix played with his brothers. I wanted to do a thread about great electric guitar solos in funk and R&B, but thought that I'm in the minority for my appreciation of it.

[robb_k]

I wonder if the people who criticized him enjoyed early Funkadelic records, some of which were very hard-core? And if they did, I wonder if they did mainly because of the color of the musicians?

I didn't like what Hendrix was doing, and neither did I like James Brown's Funk, nor early Funkadelic, despite liking Jimmy Hendrix's early '60s guitar playing, and James Brown's '50s and early '60s cuts, and The Parliament's pre-Parliament and Funkadelic cuts. It was the change in their music I didn't like, not the colour of their skin, nor the lyrics of their songs,

I don't think it's generational with me. It's the pure sound of the music. I've always hated loud noise, scratchy noises [[such as reverb), and always hated screaming. I've always been drawn to sweet sounds, and soft or medium sounds, as opposed to scratchy and loud. I probably never would have liked Funk, Hard Rock and Heavy Metal no matter when I would have been born. I never listened to the pop radio stations, and had very little exposure to most of the "Caucasian" artists. But I was not prejudiced. I did like some pop music after hearing it.

[Jerry Oz]

robb_k: You know I wasn't talking about you. I was talking about a lot of fans of the raw, metal iteration of Funkadelic who loved their sound but didn't sign on to Hendrix because of the loudness or distorted notes. I'm not suggesting that if you like one loud artist you should like all, but when I first listened to Funkadelic's 'Free Your Mind and Your Ass Will Follow', I struggled to hear melody or any conventions of what I considered 'good music'. I grew to appreciate it as well as most of Hendrix' output.

What I was suggesting is that many of Hendrix's Black critics were looking at the crowd around him than they were listening to his music. They saw a Black hippy with Caucasion bandmates and entourage and it became fashionable to put him down. They saw Clinton and the Funkadelic and they were more willing to accept the music.

Well, that's just my opinion anyway.

[robb_k]

robb_k: You know I wasn't talking about you. I was talking about a lot of fans of the raw, metal iteration of Funkadelic who loved their sound but didn't sign on to Hendrix because of the loudness or distorted notes. I'm not suggesting that if you like one loud artist you should like all, but when I first listened to Funkadelic's 'Free Your Mind and Your Ass Will Follow', I struggled to hear melody or any conventions of what I considered 'good music'. I grew to appreciate it as well as most of Hendrix' output.

What I was suggesting is that many of Hendrix's Black critics were looking at the crowd around him than they were listening to his music. They saw a Black hippy with Caucasion bandmates and entourage and it became fashionable to put him down. They saw Clinton and the Funkadelic and they were more willing to accept the music.

Well, that's just my opinion anyway.

I'm sure that was true of many of Hendrix's Black critics.

[splanky]

I didn't like what Hendrix was doing, and neither did I like James Brown's Funk, nor early Funkadelic, despite liking Jimmy Hendrix's early '60s guitar playing, and James Brown's '50s and early '60s cuts, and The Parliament's pre-Parliament and Funkadelic cuts. It was the change in their music I didn't like, not the colour of their skin, nor the lyrics of their songs,

I don't think it's generational with me. It's the pure sound of the music. I've always hated loud noise, scratchy noises [[such as reverb), and always hated screaming. I've always been drawn to sweet sounds, and soft or medium sounds, as opposed to scratchy and loud. I probably never would have liked Funk, Hard Rock and Heavy Metal no matter when I would have been born. I never listened to the pop radio stations, and had very little exposure to most of the "Caucasian" artists. But I was not prejudiced. I did like some pop music after hearing it.

A totally valid point of view, robb k and like everyone else you are entitled to your own opinions though I have to say one thing: it may indeed be partly generational as I think
that your tastes were marinated in the music of your time. As most of us are. So be it....

Oh, for the record Jimi did more than once say that funk, using the word "funk" specifically
was major element of the music he wanted to create but I think had he lived he would have
like Earth Wind And Fire, aspired to be something more than just another Funk artist. Still,
he and Eddie Hazel on the same stage trading licks would have been the ultimate sight!
Lordy!.....

[soulster]

I wanted to do a thread about great electric guitar solos in funk and R&B, but thought that I'm in the minority for my appreciation of it.

Just do it!

[soulster]

What I was suggesting is that many of Hendrix's Black critics were looking at the crowd around him than they were listening to his music. They saw a Black hippy with Caucasion bandmates and entourage and it became fashionable to put him down. They saw Clinton and the Funkadelic and they were more willing to accept the music.

Well, that's just my opinion anyway.

I think you're getting to the truth. Guilt by association is what it largely was. Proof that Black can be just as bigoted as whites.

[timmyfunk]

I'm not sure if that's a credible comparison. The minute Hendrix formed the Band Of Gypsies, he encountered immediate resistance from his management, who insisted that he get back with the 'cute english guys'. The response from Black audiences did not hurt his sales one bit. By the time he formed the BOG, he was, at least from the perspective of the Black audiences, a property of the white rock establishment. Too little too late. And of course, that was the fault of his management, not Hendrix or the Black audience.

[marv2]

I was lucky enough to grow up listening to all types of music from artists of a variety of ethnic backgrounds. If it sounded good to me, I liked and many times bought it. In fact, today I was listening to the Guess Who Greatest Hits , followed up by Marvin Gayes Greatest Hits. Different artists, but great music, vocals from each!~ I liked Jimi Hendricks "All Along the Watchtower" and "Purple Haze" as a kid and thought nothing of it. I do know and understand that there are people out there that do not have an open mind to different types of music.

[soulster]

I was lucky enough to grow up listening to all types of music from artists of a variety of ethnic backgrounds. If it sounded good to me, I liked and many times bought it. In fact, today I was listening to the Guess Who Greatest Hits , followed up by Marvin Gayes Greatest Hits. Different artists, but great music, vocals from each!~ I liked Jimi Hendricks "All Along the Watchtower" and "Purple Haze" as a kid and thought nothing of it. I do know and understand that there are people out there that do not have an open mind to different types of music.

Thank god there's some people like us!

[Jerry Oz]

I remember my high school art class, the only class with a teacher cool enough to play a stereo set on FM. The white kids wanted to hear AOR and most of the Black kids wanted to hear R&B. Consequently, the teacher played the stations on alternating days. My pal Loren pissed me off by demanding that he play jazz [['mid-day Mellow Madness') on one of the R&B days. A few years later, I noticed that I was singing a lot of the songs from the rock station when they came on the radio and humming a lot of the jazz tunes.

Turns out they did me a favor because my collection [[while still heavy on R&B) is diverse and I can listen to any type of music, even country to which I had limited exposure. I freely admit that I didn't like Hendrix until I was an adult because I had limited exposure to his output. With that said, my appreciation for what he did is significant. If I have an attitude toward anything, it's toward modern music which I find to be overly produced and remarkably bland.

[marv2]

Thank god there's some people like us!

I do thank God, believe me!

[soulster]

In my school, you had kids who preferred one type of music or the other: pop/rock or R&B/funk, but all would be cool with either one. It didn't matter if you were Black or White. The Mexicans preferred R&B/funk, too.

In the band room, we played the top 40 FM station, or some jazz album one of the trumpet players were interested in. Again, in my marriage class, the teacher had a stereo in the room, and played the top 40 station, which all but the one or two country people were happy with, but still tolerated. The bottom line is that, no matter what music it was, except country, everyone was pretty happy with with either pop/rock or R&B/funk.

On the band buses for away games, guys brought their own huge boom-boxes and cassettes. The Black kids tended to segregate themselves on bus #2 and listened to funk like Bootsy, Bar-Kays, Brick, and Earth, Wind & Fire. The rowdy White kids on bus #3 listened to rock like Queen, Styx, and Foreigner, and the nerdy kids, or "band fags", as they were called, listened to the easy-listening stuff on the radio. Obviously, I was in high school in the late 70s.

At the Friday-night dances after the football and basketball games, it was R&B and funk all the way. No one tolerated disco. There was no way in hell you could ever play Donna Summer, Ami Stewart or Village People! Same with the adult nightclubs. It was R&B and funk all the way. You could never, ever...EVER play disco, unless it was something like "Push Push In The Bush" or "Shame"! And, for god's sake: NO Diana Ross! People would leave in anger.

[marv2]

I remember my high school art class, the only class with a teacher cool enough to play a stereo set on FM. The white kids wanted to hear AOR and most of the Black kids wanted to hear R&B. Consequently, the teacher played the stations on alternating days. My pal Loren pissed me off by demanding that he play jazz [['mid-day Mellow Madness') on one of the R&B days. A few years later, I noticed that I was singing a lot of the songs from the rock station when they came on the radio and humming a lot of the jazz tunes.

Turns out they did me a favor because my collection [[while still heavy on R&B) is diverse and I can listen to any type of music, even country to which I had limited exposure. I freely admit that I didn't like Hendrix until I was an adult because I had limited exposure to his output. With that said, my appreciation for what he did is significant. If I have an attitude toward anything, it's toward modern music which I find to be overly produced and remarkably bland.

Jerry, gotcha. It was the same for me in a way. Most anyone that grew up in the Detroit-Windsor Canada - Toledo Great Lakes region in the late 60's - Mid 70's will tell you that they listened to the Big 8, CKLW out of Canada. They played the most variety [[including Canadian Content music) of any station in North America. I listen now to a modern day spin off of it called CKWW 580 -am. Some of the songs they play were by Canadian artist and were not heard in other areas of the U.S. When I hear these particular songs, I know all the words to them, but cannot discuss them with people who did not grow up in our region..............because they never heard of them or the artists!

Here's a good example. I bet you good money that you never heard of the group Toulouse and this popular hit they had in the late 70's. I heard it a lot on the radio at the time:

[marv2]

I could listen to songs like the one I posted above and then play my Bootsey and Parliament/Funkadeliac albums and enjoy the Hell out of them as well LOL!

In the early 80's , 1981 to be exact one of my favorite "radio" songs was "Step by Step" by Eddie Rabbitt! Strange huh? Nah, not to me. It was just good music!

[soulster]

In the early 80's , 1981 to be exact one of my favorite "radio" songs was "Step by Step" by Eddie Rabbitt! Strange huh? Nah, not to me. It was just good music!

Just recently, I decided I like "I Love A Rainy Night". I always thought of it as country because that's what he was billed as, but he really wasn't.

[marv2]

Just recently, I decided I like "I Love A Rainy Night". I always thought of it as country because that's what he was billed as, but he really wasn't.

Soulster you are right! They tried to lump Eddie Rabbitt under the "Country Music" banner, but he himself was from New Joisey! LOL!!!!

[Jerry Oz]

Speaking of country, does anyone remember when it was a dying format? Kenny and Dolly put too much pop into it and it kind of became a joke in a lot of areas. Then came 'Urban Cowboy' and 'real' country came back with a vengeance. I knew a girl who went head over heels when that soundtrack was released. She went from being somewhat rural to more country than anybody I knew with her fashion and dancing. Next thing I knew, lots of disco/R&B clubs throughout the city became country clubs; cowboy hats and boots became vogue.

Culture shifted almost as drastically as it did when 'Saturday Night Fever' broke and exposed the mass public to disco. I don't begrudge anyone who likes a limited range of music or artists, but I'm grateful my mind opened up enough that I can listen to almost anybody and enjoy it, regardless of the genre.

[marv2]

Speaking of country, does anyone remember when it was a dying format? Kenny and Dolly put too much pop into it and it kind of became a joke in a lot of areas. Then came 'Urban Cowboy' and 'real' country came back with a vengeance. I knew a girl who went head over heels when that soundtrack was released. She went from being somewhat rural to more country than anybody I knew with her fashion and dancing. Next thing I knew, lots of disco/R&B clubs throughout the city became country clubs; cowboy hats and boots became vogue.

Culture shifted almost as drastically as it did when 'Saturday Night Fever' broke and exposed the mass public to disco. I don't begrudge anyone who likes a limited range of music or artists, but I'm grateful my mind opened up enough that I can listen to almost anybody and enjoy it, regardless of the genre.

It was in the Fall of 1980! I bought me a pair of $ 125 cowboy boots! LOL! That was a big deal for a poor college student but that is when the trend really began to catch on. We use to go to a popular club in Colorado called Bobby McGee's. They even played the "Cotton -Eyed Gin" at times during the night.

[Jerry Oz]

We had a club called East Dallas that went from playing pop and dance [[no disco there) to being completely country. It had a huge dance floor and was filled to capacity many nights. Later on, I'd go there to watch a 'Battle of the Bands' when they loosened up the playlist a little bit. I think it's still open.

[marv2]

We had a club called East Dallas that went from playing pop and dance [[no disco there) to being completely country. It had a huge dance floor and was filled to capacity many nights. Later on, I'd go there to watch a 'Battle of the Bands' when they loosened up the playlist a little bit. I think it's still open.

It is great to know we all sometimes had similiar experiences. I am very happy to have been born in the time that I was. So much better than being 20 years old today. LOL

[Jerry Oz]

Consider if you were born 20 years earlier you would have had to take part in the civil rights movement or suck on abuse while others fought. If you were born 20 years later you would have dealt with a lot of what's still going on in the streets today. I personally believe that I was born just in time. I never conked my hair and I know how to properly use a belt.

[marv2]

Consider if you were born 20 years earlier you would have had to take part in the civil rights movement or suck on abuse while others fought. If you were born 20 years later you would have dealt with a lot of what's still going on in the streets today. I personally believe that I was born just in time. I never conked my hair and I know how to properly use a belt.

I was born just in time to remember watching the older "cool dudes" getting a conk at the barber shop! It's strange now when I think back. Back then 1963-64 etc, we did not think it was strange at all for all the dudes getting Conks.

[Jerry Oz]

It wasn't at all. Now, my Pops constantly complains about kids' hair and clothes today but I have to remind him that his generation had conks and zoot suits. He gives me a dirty look before going on about how 'ugly' today's kids are. It's the same song every week when I visit him. I don't remind him that he had his hair jheri curled once and also had it braided [[he insists he never did).

And if you want to talk about the music today being raunchy or silly, I can bring up the Dominoes [[Sixty Minute Man), Hank Ballard [[Work With Me Annie), or the Coasters [[everything was silly). All three of those were among his favorite bands. When he gripes about rap, I could bring up 'Shopping For Clothes' but that would make him upset. So I just sit there and listen to it over and over...

[robb_k]

I remember my high school art class, the only class with a teacher cool enough to play a stereo set on FM. The white kids wanted to hear AOR and most of the Black kids wanted to hear R&B. Consequently, the teacher played the stations on alternating days. My pal Loren pissed me off by demanding that he play jazz [['mid-day Mellow Madness') on one of the R&B days. A few years later, I noticed that I was singing a lot of the songs from the rock station when they came on the radio and humming a lot of the jazz tunes.

Turns out they did me a favor because my collection [[while still heavy on R&B) is diverse and I can listen to any type of music, even country to which I had limited exposure. I freely admit that I didn't like Hendrix until I was an adult because I had limited exposure to his output. With that said, my appreciation for what he did is significant. If I have an attitude toward anything, it's toward modern music which I find to be overly produced and remarkably bland.

At my high school, Bowen High, in South Chicago, in the early '60s, we had one of the very best music departments, which really helped the talented students move forward into music careers. We had several groups which had musical careers, and were already professionals, with regional and national records, while still attending school. During my time, it was about half Caucasian and half African-American. But the kids' musical taste was much more heavy on the R&B and early Soul side, as opposed to so-called "Pop" music, due to our local talent in those musical styles. I wonder how the musical taste changed there in the late '60s, after I was at University in British Columbia and L.A. I suppose there would have been Hendrix fans, and fans of all types of music. I assume that the types of music that were the most popular would have branched out, expanding into more different forms, through the '70s.

At my middle school in Manitoba, the kids liked "White Rock & Roll", MOR "Pop" and commercial C&W. But, from my parents. I had grown up with Jazz, Blues and R&B, and I didn't really like what the kid's listened to, and what was played on Winnipeg radio.

[soulster]

Speaking of country, does anyone remember when it was a dying format? Kenny and Dolly put too much pop into it and it kind of became a joke in a lot of areas. Then came 'Urban Cowboy' and 'real' country came back with a vengeance. I knew a girl who went head over heels when that soundtrack was released. She went from being somewhat rural to more country than anybody I knew with her fashion and dancing. Next thing I knew, lots of disco/R&B clubs throughout the city became country clubs; cowboy hats and boots became vogue.

Culture shifted almost as drastically as it did when 'Saturday Night Fever' broke and exposed the mass public to disco. I don't begrudge anyone who likes a limited range of music or artists, but I'm grateful my mind opened up enough that I can listen to almost anybody and enjoy it, regardless of the genre.

Just like with the change of Ronald Reagan as the president, so did the entertainment. We went from disco dancing and dressing up to mechanical bull-riding and cheap Datsun mini- trucks.

I liked the film "Urban Cowboy" and the music, though. I couldn't relate to anything in the movie, but the music really wasn't that country. I mean...Boz Scaggs, a bluesman-turned blue-eyed soul singer, got a major hit out of it. I don't know how many Black folk got into that stuff. I don't even recall seeing any Black faces in that film, but I know some likes some of the music.

[soulster]

It wasn't at all. Now, my Pops constantly complains about kids' hair and clothes today but I have to remind him that his generation had conks and zoot suits. He gives me a dirty look before going on about how 'ugly' today's kids are. It's the same song every week when I visit him. I don't remind him that he had his hair jheri curled once and also had it braided [[he insists he never did).

And if you want to talk about the music today being raunchy or silly, I can bring up the Dominoes [[Sixty Minute Man), Hank Ballard [[Work With Me Annie), or the Coasters [[everything was silly). All three of those were among his favorite bands. When he gripes about rap, I could bring up 'Shopping For Clothes' but that would make him upset. So I just sit there and listen to it over and over...

And, remember in the late 70s and 80s, Black men got perms and wore Jheri-curls, just a variation of the conk. The hip-hop popularity took care of that by the mid-80s.

Even on this forum, there are people who will bash today's music left and right as being x-rated, but, remind them of how it was back in the 30s, 40s, and 50s with all the dirty blues men and women in the speakeasies, and they get defensive. You remind them of what era Nipsy Russell, Moms Mabley, Redd Foxx, and even Richard Pryor came out of, and they have nothing to say.

[soulster]

Consider if you were born 20 years earlier you would have had to take part in the civil rights movement or suck on abuse while others fought. If you were born 20 years later you would have dealt with a lot of what's still going on in the streets today. I personally believe that I was born just in time. I never conked my hair and I know how to properly use a belt.

I'm at the tail-end of the baby-boom generation, but I was still born too early. I would have done much better if I had been even ten years younger. But, I have an activist mind [[even my personality profile shows that), and if I were older, I could have taken part in the civil rights struggle, even if my parents would have never allowed it.

[Jerry Oz]

And, remember in the late 70s and 80s, Black men cot perms and wore Jheri-curls, just a variation of the conk. The hip-hop popularity took care of that by the mis-80s.

Even on this forum, there are people who will bash today's music left and right as being x-rated, but, remind them of how it was back in the 30s, 40s, and 50s with all the dirty blues men and women in the speakeasies, and they get defensive. You remind them of what era Nipsy Russell, Moms Mabley, Redd Foxx, and even Richard Pryor came out of, and they have nothing to say.

Yeah, my brother found Dad's album by Doug Clark and the Hot Nuts. The name of the band should give you an idea of their mindset and general theme of their music. And I'll never forget moving down to Memphis in the mid-90s and seeing the southern bruhs rocking jheri curls [[still). They looked like they just stepped away from Boyz N Da Hood and apparently had the same idea about respect and how to make money as some of the characters in that film.